Template:Did you know nominations/Thomas Morstede

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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by Yoninah (talk) 13:35, 13 December 2019 (UTC)

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Thomas Morstede

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Created by ChocolateOrange1 (talk). Self-nominated at 17:32, 31 October 2019 (UTC).

  • Comment: Welcome to DYK, ChocolateOrange1! One of the rules for DYK hooks is that the fact has to be mentioned and cited in the article, so another hook will have to be proposed. For example, you could write a hook about his manuscript or about how he treated three kings. You can propose alternate hooks by putting ALT# in front of them, like this:
Hope this helps :) Note to reviewers: This article is 10 days old, but it's the first article the user has written, so I think we can WP:IAR. SpicyMilkBoy (talk) 18:08, 31 October 2019 (UTC)
SpicyMilkBoy Thank you for pointing this out to me! I have changed my entry accordingly.ChocolateOrange1 (talk) 01:45, 1 November 2019 (UTC)
Thanks - I shouldn't review this one because I'm involved, but someone will come along soon to review it. :) SpicyMilkBoy (talk) 09:35, 1 November 2019 (UTC)
Solid article, on good sources, subscription sources accepted AGF (assuming good faith). I am lenient about the few days late. In the article, please avoid paragraphs of only one sentence, and have a reference at the end of each paragraph. Did you know that you can give a ref a name, typing "ref name="XYZ" instead of "ref", and then (once defined) you can call it by name, "ref name="XYZ /"? You don't need any reference in the lead (introduction) as long as it's a summary of things referenced in the body. I think we should say "of England" in the hook, as we had kings named Henry in Germany also, for example. Please word an alternative (ALT2:) below. Nice to meet you, ChocolateOrange1! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:56, 1 November 2019 (UTC)
Gerda Arendt Thank you for your feedback! I have changed my entry to include "of England" now! ChocolateOrange1 (talk) 10:26, 2 November 2019 (UTC)
Thank you. Next time, please don't change what you worded before, because the conversation is hard to understand then. But fine for this time. Just two facts still need a citation, one of them his burial. Do you have this nomination on your watchlist, or should I ping you each time, ChocolateOrange1? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:06, 2 November 2019 (UTC)
The burial is noted in the ODNB entry already used as a reference in the article, so I've repeated that reference. Richard Nevell (talk) 10:19, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
Gerda Arendt I have this nomination on my watchlist so don't worry about pinging me each time:) Richard Nevell has kindly added the reference for the burial. Which was the other fact which still needs a citation? ChocolateOrange1 (talk) 14:42, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
The second paragraph of the Career section. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:15, 4 November 2019 (UTC)
ChocolateOrange1 Just pinging to make sure you've seen this. SpicyMilkBoy (talk) 07:38, 12 November 2019 (UTC)
Thank you, SpicyMilkBoy. I have seen this but just been quite busy at the moment. I will make sure to add a citation into the second paragraph of the Career Section within the next couple of days :) ChocolateOrange1 (talk) 13:48, 13 November 2019 (UTC)
Gerda Arendt I have now added the citation, thank you for your patience. ChocolateOrange1 (talk) 15:55, 19 November 2019 (UTC)
  • Comment: He was a royal surgeon, not the royal surgeon. Cannot otherwise access enough of the source to confirm the hook, sorry. ~ R.T.G 23:24, 28 November 2019 (UTC)
  • ALT1: ... that Thomas Morstede has been called the "most eminent English surgeon of the fifteenth century?" Beck, Theodore Richard (1974). Cutting Edge: Early History of the Surgeons of London. Lund Humphries Published ltd. pp. 79–80. ISBN 978-0853313663. --evrik (talk) 17:52, 3 December 2019 (UTC)
@SpicyMilkBoy: --evrik (talk) 17:36, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
Thank you for the refs. How about a slight rewording.
ALT0b*: ... that Thomas Morstede was royal surgeon to the three successive kings of England, Henry IV, Henry V and Henry VI of England?
I approve the original hook and ALT0b. Sorry, I don't care much for "most whatever" not for one person's pov while we can have solid facts. So, ALT1 would need a different reviewer. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:58, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
  • Looking to promote this, I don't think the hook facts for ALT0b are present. Morstede served all three kings, but the article does not state that he was a royal surgeon to each of them. Cwmhiraeth (talk) 07:02, 12 December 2019 (UTC)
May be my lack of English, - I rhought a royal surgeon is a physician who serves a king. I hope ChocolateOrange1 can help. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:28, 12 December 2019 (UTC)
  • Gerda Arendt, "royal surgeon" is typically a title or position of some kind; just because a surgeon has a monarch as a patient doesn't mean they can be described as a royal surgeon. In any event, the article lists Morstede as "King's Surgeon" to Henry IV, but for Henry V he was in charge of the company of surgeons supporting the French campaign, and there's no specifics about his duties to Henry VI. I hope the following will deal with these issues, and also smooth out the hook prose:
It would have been nice to know when he left Henry VI's service, because adding how many years could add more interest (it would have been 40 years if he was still serving at the time of his death), but I don't see anything in the article, and I can't access most of the sources. —BlueMoonset (talk) 17:30, 12 December 2019 (UTC)
Thank you for explaining, and the hook. I'd have thought that as a title it would be Royal Surgeon, no?
I approve the new hook, and if you, ChocolateOrange1, want something different please say so here. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:39, 12 December 2019 (UTC)
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