Template talk:Final Fantasy series

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Bravely Default/Second Removal[edit]

Bravely Default may have various similarities to certain Final Fantasy games, but it is very specifically NOT a part of the Final Fantasy series. It is considered a spiritual successor to Final Fantasy: The 4 Heroes of Light, but it isn't an actual sequel to it. It doesn't take place in any of the Final Fantasy worlds, nor does it carry the name, nor does it contain the iconic staples of the series. Please don't spread misinformation. Please remove it from the Final Fantasy template.

Thank you. 68.96.240.238 (talk) 12:42, 13 February 2014 (UTC)

Its related to it in some form and fashion and as a bonus for Bravely Default: For the Sequel, the game offers Final Fantasy: The 4 Heroes of Light bosses similar ot how Kingdom Hearts has Final Fantasy characters in it as cameos.Lucia Black (talk) 12:55, 13 February 2014 (UTC)
Now that Bravely Default is a series and not just a single game, it should probably be moved to the "Related series" line. UOSSReiska (talk) 04:56, 11 January 2016 (UTC)

What is this template about?[edit]

If the main series section of the template is about the MAIN series it has to contain just I to XV. Djsnake86 (talk) 17:47, 6 April 2015 (UTC)

I agree. If we're going to add follow ups to numbered games, then X-2 and XII Revenant Wings also should be added to the main series. -- ThiagoSimoes (talk) 19:32, 19 June 2015 (UTC)
Direct sequels to a main game should be added, as they're also main games. This means X-2, XIII-2 and Lightning Returns. Revenant Wings would be a spin-off.. -- DarkKyoushu (talk) 12:16, 1 September 2015 (GMT)

FFXIV or ARR on main line?[edit]

PresN just added a subgroup for FFXIV. That's cool, I mostly agree, especially because I'm hoping to spin Heavensward into its own article with Dev and Reception sections soon(ish) so the subgroup will be a little less lonely. My question is if we should link to Final Fantasy XIV or Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn in the "Main games" row of the template. I'm actually slightly leaning towards the latter because I think that would better serve the readers for navigation purposes. At 3 years and counting since the end of original FF14 service, links to said article are increasingly not what regular readers are looking for when they look up "Final Fantasy XIV". Thoughts? Axem Titanium (talk) 20:54, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

I really think it should be the original. I agree, ARR is certainly much more popular than the original game, but it's still a remake/reboot of that original game. It doesn't make much sense to me to have "FF1, FF2... FF12, FF13, the reboot of FF14, FF15" on the main line, any more than to have Final Fantasy IV (3D remake) instead of the original. And you'd have to specifically link it as something other than "XIV", since that's not actually its name. If readers accidentally go to the original when they meant the remake, there is a hatnote right up at the top.
Though, the thought occurs to me- the section below, the related games section, is just a pile of names. Japan-only GREE mobile games get the same prominence as FF Tactics. Is there a way we can split that up, somehow have a "main spinoffs and remakes" section (with a better name), so as to put ARR and some others in more prominence near the top, since as you say readers are likely to be looking for them? --PresN 21:16, 8 December 2015 (UTC)
I have a somewhat unauthodox suggestion: instead of the main section being linked to the main article, do not add a link. Instead, have the two versions in the template section. Something like: FF XIV (heading, unlinked), XIV (original, linked), XIV: ARR (linked, with suitable subsections for any future articles related to standalone expansions should they arise), Music of XIV. That's not a very clear representation, but I think it might be good enough. On a side-note, Axem Titanium, I would be happy to do some digging for sources regarding Heavensward if you like. Make the job a little easier on you. --ProtoDrake (talk) 21:21, 8 December 2015 (UTC)
I think it's a slightly different use case than FFIV 3D because ARR represents a continuing active service that has wholly eclipsed the original in terms of mindshare/notability/every other metric other than badness, whereas FFIV 3D is a singular rerelease which is definitely less notable than the original. I think the reason we kept "XIV (A Realm Reborn)" for so long in the main series line was being cognizant of that fact. If, in fact, we decide not to keep both links in that line, I would personally list it as "XII XIII XIV: A Realm Reborn XV", rather than simply "XIV". You lose a little parallelism and gain a lot of navigation benefit.
Re:ProtoDrake. Yeah, for sure! I haven't started a compendium of links to sources yet so go crazy. Axem Titanium (talk) 21:38, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

Oh right, context for why I made a subsection in the first place and pulled ARR out of the main line- Wikipedia:Featured topic candidates/Final Fantasy series/archive1, HurricaneHink commented on it in the FFseries FTC and I agreed that it was odd. --PresN 22:24, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

I agree that it is odd and unorthodox, but I think it's a net benefit to navigation to only include ARR, if you were forced to pick one. As time goes on, the "original" will only diminish in importance compared to ARR and I think ARR can be considered the "heir to the title of fourteenth main series Final Fantasy game". It potentially threatens the current FTC but I hope to have ARR as a GA soon as well. Axem Titanium (talk) 22:44, 8 December 2015 (UTC)
To be clear, this is what I'm proposing:

Axem Titanium (talk) 09:59, 3 January 2016 (UTC)

I agree with ProtoDrake's suggestion to link both, and would have made the same one myself: Something like ... XIIIXIV (original, A Realm Reborn) ● XV

The "problem" is that unlike, say, original FF1 NES, the "original" FF14 isn't available anymore and has been superseded / replaced by a "new" FF14. It's a unique situation that isn't exactly comparable to spin-offs, expansion packs, and so on; there really are "two" FF14s, confusing as that is. SnowFire (talk) 22:51, 3 January 2016 (UTC)

Yeah that's the rub, isn't it? Unlike any remakes like FFIVDS where the original still exists and is playable, the original FF14 no longer exists at all and can't be played by anyone. The original FF14 was in service for 774 days from its launch on 9/30/2010 to the end of service on 11/11/2012. As of today, ARR has been in service for 861 days since launch on 8/27/2013, so even if ARR ended service today (it's not), it would still have a longer period of active service functioning as "the fourteenth Final Fantasy game" from a historical standpoint than the original. Of course, we could always return to linking both in the main series line like we have for the past three years or so. This proposal assumes our goal is to only link one, with my argued preference for linking ARR. Axem Titanium (talk) 20:04, 4 January 2016 (UTC)
I'm not sure if this helps the discussion or not (it's certainly OR), but I can think of very few instances where when the term "FF14" is used without qualifiers in casual conversation, it isn't referring to ARR or Heavensward. (At least, among the group of friends I have who play the game, the common parlance is to refer to the current game as simply "FF14" or "14", and to use terms like "1.0" when referring to the pre-ARR game, or "2.0" when referring specifically to ARR pre-Heavensward.) Still, the original FF14 is absolutely historically significant as one of the only (if not the only?) extant example of a released MMO which was shut down, substantially redesigned, and relaunched. UOSSReiska (talk) 04:56, 11 January 2016 (UTC)

Listing the FF7 Remake under FF7[edit]

Just wondering if the FF7 Remake should be listed under FF7 in the main series, like A Realm Reborn currently is. I ask instead of doing this myself because FF7 is not the only game in the main series with a remake (FF4 had one for the DS, even though it wasn't as drastic), so I'm not sure what the best way to handle this is. ~ Dissident93 (talk) 02:57, 30 January 2016 (UTC)

So, ARR is only in the main series line (and after some debate, including just have FF14 and linking it to ARR) because it not only remade the game, it replaced it- you can't play the original FF14 anymore, and ARR is more popular by far than the original. When you say "Final Fantasy XIV", there's a very good chance that you actually mean the current incarnation of FFXIV (ARR), not the original. The same is not true of FF7R - you can buy and play the original FF7 today, doubly so on Steam, and the remake isn't likely to replace the original as the "definitive version" of FF7. If that changes, sure, but right now its just a remake. --PresN 03:27, 30 January 2016 (UTC)
Yeah, that's what I thought originally. ~ Dissident93 (talk) 04:57, 30 January 2016 (UTC)