Template talk:STD and STI
|WikiProject Medicine / Reproductive medicine||(Rated Template-class)|
- 1 Hepatitis
- 2 Evidence on C
- 3 Evidence on D
- 4 Crabs
- 5 Transmitted through Blood / STD
- 6 UTIs
- 7 Segreagating
- 8 other sex topics
- 9 hep A
- 10 KIS
- 11 Trichomoniasis
- 12 Willy-nilly unnacceptable
- 13 Herpetic whitlow
- 14 EBV STD?
- 15 std
- 16 Pelvic inflammatory disease
- 17 Streptococcus
- 18 Giardiasis
- 19 Adenoviridae
- 20 Stop adding new diseases
- 21 Reworking
- 22 re CMV
- 23 STD/STI Template Criteria for inclusion
- 24 Parasitic
- 25 Candidiasis
- 26 Removed gay bowel syndrome
- 27 Article categorization
A, B, C, D are stds, even though some have vaccines and some are rarely gotten from intercourse, it can be fairly common from rimming (analingus)Qrc2006 04:40, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
- You CANNOT get Hepatitis C from rimming. There is no evidence on D -- Samir धर्म 04:08, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
Evidence on C
That Hepatitis C is an STD is disputed. Consensus is that Hepatitis C is very rarely sexually transmitted. There is a tonne of data on this. The CDC recommendations are outdated by several years, and were updated somewaht in a recent MMWR publication (Aug 2006). Here are the references: PMID 15128350, PMID 11721761. MMWR contains a revised CDC definition where they strongly question Hepatitis C transmission sexually PMID 16888612. It's a contentious topic and I strongly think it shouldn't be on the template. -- Samir धर्म 05:00, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
i disagree i think it should definatly be on the template, Hep C is only rare when transmitted thiorugh vaginal and anal intercourse but can be transmitted much more commonly thru analingus/rimming (oral-anal contact) the fact the hep c is transmitted sexually is undisputed even by Samir, it should definatly be on the template. The CDC and Kaiser agree. the article for hep c should mention this controversy. my uncle had hep C and my friend ahoo has it, they both got it sexually Qrc2006 05:07, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
many types of anal sex such as rimming, fisting, fingering, and anal intercourse / at high-risk of infection including men who have sex with men —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Qrc2006 (talk • contribs) 15:16, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
- This is not an adequate reference. Opinion has changed regarding transmission of Hepatitis C. You are incorrect about the CDC; please read the relevant MMWR recommnendation (the CDC publication): PMID 16888612 . What Kaiser has to say is irrelevant. It's also less than appropriate to put information about who has Hepatitis C on the internet -- Samir धर्म 06:09, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
- Qrc, that San Francisco Clinic article doesn't say that Hep C is classified as an STD. It says hepatitis viruses can be transmitted in various ways and that some may be transmitted sexually. I may well be missing something, but I don't think it says what you seem to think it does. I think maybe you don't understand that not every virus or disease that has a chance or being transmitted during sexual activity is classified as a sexually transmitted disease.
- In my experience, many (not all) people who claim to have contracted Hep C through sexual activity were also engaging in other high risk (blood-blood) activity. But honestly, Samir is the expert here and I defer to him. If he says, "this is how it is," I would accept that. Of course, doctors make mistakes just like anyone else, but to convince me (and probably most others here as well) that what Samir has said is incorrect, you would need to produce something more than anecdotal evidence (i.e. your uncle and friend); you need to find some significant scientific or medical studies or reports by reputable publications.
- Try not to dismiss expertise offered on Wiki; use it, exploit it. You and your WIki work will look much better and more professional for it. Sarah Ewart (Talk) 15:45, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
Can Hepatitis C be transmitted thought anal-oral contact? I very sure it can and is, and rimming is sex, doesnt that make it an STD? I would also like to say that how is what Kaiser Permanente says irrelevant?Qrc2006 02:27, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
- Hepatitis C is NOT SPREAD by anal-oral contact. It is spread by blood to blood contact. It is NOT AN STD. Read the above as opposed to arguing -- Samir धर्म 04:02, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
the CDC website warns about having risky sex and it being a facotr in getting Hep C
"These behaviors include substance abuse, sharing of injection drug use equipment, and high risk sexual practices" These settings include correctional institutions, drug treatment programs, programs for high risk youth, HIV counseling and testing sites, and STD clinics.
Persons infected with HCV because of medical risk factors (e.g., transfusion, hemophilia, chronic hemodialysis) should be identified by health care professionals and through educational efforts provided by patient organizations.
also taken from the CDC website, same link. if its not an STD why encourage its testing and outreach from STD clinics. And they state that a high risk group are hemphiliacs, hemophilia is a sexual practice where people ingest blood. furthermore during anal sex without a condom the recptive partner always bleeds that seems to me like a way of it being transmitted. even if its unlikely. just because its not always gotten through sex doesnt make it not an STD Qrc2006 02:37, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
individuals with high-risk sexual activity.if its not an STD then why are they doing preventative outreach geared towards people who pratice high risk sexual activity?Qrc2006 02:41, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
The link I provided above is CDC's update from the MMWR from a couple of weeks ago. The web site is not accurate. To argue that Hepatitis C is spread by sexual activity is spreading a fallacy, and not doing anyone a service. Read the actual CDC suggestions that I linked to above please -- Samir धर्म 04:07, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
Evidence on D
The evidence on D being an STD is also not concrete. There was one study done on a cohort of 55 asians that analyzed causes of transmission and linked to spouse-spouse contact (I'll look up the PMID. It is listed by CDC as being an STD, and I've left it on for now. Should C be reverted, an WP:RfC is on the way -- Samir धर्म 05:03, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
the wiki article on STDs categorizes D as an STD, im going to put it up for the time being, unless this can de disproven, if you disprove it please also make the change to the STD article so we dont send mixed messagesQrc2006 09:24, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
- I've changed the STD article on D, and removed it from the template -- Samir धर्म 01:01, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
Crabs are parasites. They belong to the Pediculus family, they nestel commonly in the sacred areas. In the past the infection with crabs was seen as a STD but this is an older statement and is untrue. Infection is mainly caused by intercourse, but also with shared towels, bedding like sheets and cushings,also seats and even carseats.
Transmitted through Blood / STD
It has been brought to my attention that UTI is a very broad term, therefore i suggest changing UTI from a link to UTI to just black in bold with no link and links to UTIs that are STDs and STIs Urethritis has been identified, can someone please add in this:
I think the template should categorize into by virus, and by bacteria, i think that might be a good idea, thoughts? Qrc2006 04:34, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
other sex topics
- This is inconsistent with the WP:MOS and should be avoided (linking to other templates is self-referential). JFW | T@lk 21:19, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
is hep A and STD or STI, i think it is after reading the Hep A article want to be sure thought Qrc2006 01:20, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
- If you have sex with a person who has the common cold, and afterwards you start getting a runny nose and sneeze, does that make the common cold a sexually transmissible disease? JFW | T@lk 21:15, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
i dont really care, and if i had sex with someone with a cold i probably would get it from breathing closely with them , i asked a simple question that patronization was unessisary.Qrc2006 09:26, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
- No one's patronising you, Qrc. People are trying to help you understand that the possibility of contracting a virus during sexual activity doesn't define it as a STD. If you don't care about the answer to Dr Wolff's question, then you shouldn't be editing any of these articles. You are arguing with people who are experts and know what they're talking about. And I really cannot understand why you have so much trouble accepting their information. Sarah Ewart (Talk) 11:03, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
Don't reference other templates in your templates. Keep it Simple. Atom 03:16, 11 September 2006 (UTC)
Trichomoniasis is the clinical illness and Trichomonas vaginalis is the pathogen. Probably not necessary to link to the pathogen on an illness template -- Samir धर्म 23:11, 12 September 2006 (UTC)
The list of diseases on this template, and where this template was spammed was massivly unnaceptable. I have moved to solve this problem, but adding an STD/STI template to an article requires a reputable source saying the disease is commonly sexually transmitted. JBKramer 12:38, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
it says its herpes, that its transmitted by skin to skin contact (like HPV, HSV1/HSV2, crabs) and that it affects the gential area, does this mean that it is an STD? Qrc2006 00:56, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
- NO - in children/adolescents likely primary is from lips, in adults may be from genital. However this suggests mostly self-infection of a person transfering from one site to another and whilst ultimate source can originate from a sexual transmission, this does not make this invariably or even mostly so (similarly skin staphlococcal infection spread, which whilst it can be transfered during sex, is not seen as a specifically Sexually Transmitted Infection) David Ruben Talk 01:36, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
That seems odd to me, do some consider it an STD? when u say ultimate source can originate from sexual transmission, that confuses me.Qrc2006 09:26, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
- Whitlow is not an STD -- Samir धर्म 00:17, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
is herpes zoster an STD? crabs and scabies and HPV can be transmitted skin to skin, which makes me think that this may also be an STD, if so i think it should be added to Template STD/STI Qrc2006 09:29, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
Pelvic inflammatory disease
i added PID since it says in the article that it is usually caused by STDs, i think ill add it in under other, any thoughts?Qrc2006 09:33, 22 September 2006 (UTC) i ended up naming it, condistions causes by STDs/STIs and putting in PID and AIDSs
can this be considered an STD?
i added Giardiasis back in, since the article on STDs says its an STD transmittable through rimming. and STD is a disease transmitted through vaginal anal or oral sex. oral sex is oral contact with the vagina/cervix anus/rectum and penis/testicles and pubic area. Qrc2006 09:46, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
- I think this navigation template should be about infections and disease primarily transmitted through sexual activity, rather than that have potential to be so transfered - else we can include all bacterial and viral causes of gastroenteritis via rimming . David Ruben Talk 13:25, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
Stop adding new diseases
Do not put this template anywhere without first determining it is appropriate for that article, using reliable sources. Do not add anything to this article without first finding reliable sources. This is getting outrageous. JBKramer 11:28, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
There are two main issues for the approach for this navigation template:
- What to list - is it for any infection that may be spread by sexual activity - I think not. Generally STD is taken to mean conditions & infections that are primarily spread only by sexual activities. Yes whilst having certain types of sex one can pass on almost all bacterial and viral causes of gastroenteritis, but that does not make them primarily classified as STDs. Likewise under "Conditions caused" was listed Death, but this is not primarily/exclusively caused by STDs - many other non-STD infections & other conditions may cause this - otherwise we might as well include pain, itch, rash, spot, discharge, discomfort, malaise, weakness etc etc
- Secondly is distinction or otherwise of the causative infection and the resulting disease. Listing in quite separate parts of the nav-temp Treponema pallidum and Syphilis is not helpful to the average reader who will be unable to link the two together (there is clearly less problem with Chlamydia and Chlamydia trachomatis).
I have therefore (see changes):
- Columnated the list so that class name is clearly shown on teh left and the list of members may wrap onto new lines neatly. This seemed to require a change in the template's initial markup code to allow multiple columns.
- Moved infections and diseases together where there is a 1-on-1 link.
- Left miscallaneous conditions in the separate section at the end (no need specify as being due to STD/STI as that should be presumed from this being nav.template about a specififc topic)
- Made the organisms italicised for clarity of distinction.
- Finally I placed the disease before the infection - afterall the template has in its title STD then STI. David Ruben Talk 14:25, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
I removed mention of Cytomegalovirus (CMV), as infectious mononucleosis (glandular fever) is not primarily a STD (close contact and kissing yes, but sex not required). It is true that severe infection may signal immunocommpromised states, i.e. HIV/AIDS, but this is as often as not in such patients reactivation of previously dormant infection acquired long before. Likewise whilst severe CMV may be hallmark of switch from HIV carrier to AIDs, this article also does not include Pneumocystis jiroveci pneumonia (formerly Pneumocystis carinii) which is almost exclusively an indirect result of HIV STD. David Ruben Talk 14:48, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
STD/STI Template Criteria for inclusion
I think it would cut out a lot of arguementing and confusion if we consense on a definition of an STD and/or STI for inclusion on this template, perhaps:
An infection including its acompanying disease that...
(A)...is primarily transmitted...
(B)...is only transmitted...
(C)...has a significant risk of being transmitted through...
(D)...has a possibility of being transmitted through...
...through anal, oral, or vaginal sex acts
Qrc2006 23:39, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
- Clearly B, and generally A, but not C - else every bacterial & viral cause of gastroenteritis woiuld also be included. David Ruben Talk 23:46, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
- i wrote significant, not "possible", significant as in theres a strong chance or is likely.Qrc2006 06:18, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
- If it is usually transmitted....it is an STD.
- If it is frequently transmitted....it is an STD.
- In this context, I would expect "frequently" to mean "not rarely".
- If it has a possibility of being transmitted....it is not an STD.
- Another standard would be: Would a physician, on seeing a disease, immediately question whether the transmission occurred sexually? Or would that be the last method considered, a remote possibility?
- Bottom line, the template should include what one would expect to be there. Don't over-analyze it.
- -THB 07:05, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
i think parasitic is a bad term, since all of these STDs are parasites, furthermore all the other ones are categorized by kingdom, HIV is under viral since its a virus, chlamydia bacteria, candiasis fungus, Scabies and Crabs are animals, so i think they should be labeled Animals or Animalistic or some other term other than parasite.Qrc2006 22:08, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
No not all infections are parasitic - read the article, and the comment "Especially in the field of medical parasitology, the term "parasite" has come to mean a eukaryotic pathogenic organism. Thus, protozoan and metazoan infectious agents are classified as parasites while bacteria and viruses are not."
Have a look at List of parasitic organisms for a selection of included organisms. Under Ectoparasites is mentioned the group Phthiraptera (Lice), which includes Crab louse (if i've got my classification understanding correct). Also scabies describes as being "transmissible ectoparasite skin infection...". Bacteria and viruses are not listed as being ectoparasites.
Animal/Animalistic are not a valid descriptive terms to classify Crab louse & scabies mites - no doctor would use such a term. My medical textbook: Duerden, Reid, Jewsbury & Turk (1987). A New Short Textbook of Microbial and Parasitic Infection. Hodder and Stoughton. ISBN 0-340-40178-8. - lists in chapter 20 The Genito-Urinary Tract under Genital Tract Infections (note UTI's not included in this list):
- Lymphogranuloma venereum (clamydia trachomatis)
- Granuloma venereum (calymmatobacterium granulomatis formerly donovanian granulomatis)
- Non-Gonococcal or 'Non-Specific' Urethritis (NGU, NSU)
- Clamydia cervicitis
- Anaerobic vaginosis (Non-specific vaginitis) - "It is not certain whetehr this is a sexually transmitted condition... It is likely that the introduction of alkaline seminal fluid into the vagina during intercourse is an important precipitating factor" - this makes it a genital tract infection but not a STD.
- Candidiasis (seems included in list as much as infection of Genital tract vs actually sexually transmissible in women, and also because infection of penis "commonest in male consorts of women with vaginal candidiasis")
- Genital herpes
- Genital warts
- Superficial parasites "Ectoparasites (e.g. scabies mites and lice) can seldom be said to cause infections of the genital tract, but they are spread from person to person by close contact and sexual intercourse produces particularly suitable conditions for this" ...."Of the various types of louse, the pubic ('crab') louse specifically infests hair of the genital region".
The correct term is I feel parasites, ectoparasites is more specific but will be less well understood. "Infestation" might seem an alternative choice of term, but this is what parasites do and we don't include bacteria and virus in the equivalent term of infection.David Ruben Talk 23:49, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
- Agreed. Parasites is a good umbrella term -- Samir धर्म 22:46, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
Removed gay bowel syndrome
There is longstanding precedent and reasoning (outlined at Wikipedia:Categorization#Categorization using templates) against categorizing articles via template substitution. Accordingly, I have removed the portion of this template's code that automatically added articles to Category:Sexually transmitted diseases and infections.
The template is used on (and therefore imparted Category:Sexually transmitted diseases and infections to) 38 articles.
- 23 of those articles were already manually included in the category, so no action there was necessary.
- I manually added the category to 6 articles where it seemed appropriate (Pelvic inflammatory disease, Cervicitis, Adult T-cell leukemia/lymphoma, Kaposi's sarcoma-associated herpesvirus, Subtypes of HIV, and Ureaplasma infection).
- I have not manually added the category to 9 articles where such categorization seemed inappropriate (List of infectious diseases, Safe sex, Ectopic pregnancy, Genitourinary medicine, ICD-10 Chapter I: Certain infectious and parasitic diseases, List of ICD-9 codes 001-139: infectious and parasitic diseases, Reproductive medicine, American Social Health Association, and Klebsiella granulomatis).