User talk:Acroterion/Archive Q4 2010

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Regarding page named "Elendil band"


I'm sorry for writing, you have every reason to delete my page.

My band is called Elendil, and we want to create a wiki page for it, so we can link it in future to other pages. The reason i didn't fill it was because i didn't have time then. But i will fill it, i just have kind of a busy program. Please reserve the page named "Elendil band", so it won't be taken. We are just releasing an album so we have little time but shortly in the future we will make time for it's creation. Thank you for understanding.

With great admiration and respect to wiki and what you are doing,

Simon Örs. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Deathryx (talkcontribs) 06:11, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

There is no way to "reserve" a page on WIkipedia. You may write an article on the band at the appropriate time, bearing in mind that musical acts must meet the basic notability standards found at WP:BAND. If there happen to be two bands named "Elendil", they will have to be disambiguated in their titles, probably by geography. Simply releasing an album doesn't satisfy notability guidelines - charting, significant tours, mention in major press or the like are needed. Acroterion (talk) 11:49, 1 October 2010 (UTC)
Thank you for the update. I read the criteria and i was a little puzzled. So we must already be famous to create a page on wiki? The reason we want to create a page is that labels take us more seriously, since we want to advance fast. So until we reach a national chart or release gold or etc. we cannot create a page... That's kind of sad, since we want to use every little option we have to become more known, and this is one of the little stuff that can help. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Deathryx (talkcontribs) 07:55, 4 October 2010 (UTC)
You're correct: Wikipedia documents existing notability, and does not encourage the use of the encyclopedia to promote a band or organization. While your enthusiasm for your band is commendable, you can't use the encyclopedia for promotion. I look forward to the band's eventual inclusion when you've made the big time. Acroterion (talk) 11:31, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Tyler Clementi

Tyler Clementi (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) - I see that this has been deleted twice on 1E grounds, if there was no deletion discussion perhaps there should be? I put a version up for speedy myself (it was unsourced) but looking at the sources it appears to have grounds on the basis of significant impact. A deletion discussion may be useful to air the notability of this incident due, in particular, it being a highly visible case of invasion of privacy prosecution. Note that a version was recently created (not by me) at Tyler clementi. Thanks, (talk) 10:32, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

After leaving this note, I went on to put the new article up for deletion at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Tyler clementi though I have added a number of citations to the text. Your comments welcome. (talk) 11:01, 1 October 2010 (UTC)
The previous versions created were unsourced stubs that appeared to exist for the sake of being first. A more substantial article would be better suited for a deletion discussion. My personal feeling is that an article will be sustainable over the privacy issue rather than the individual, but a useful article should wait until the case develops. Given the tendency for people to jump on the subject as soon as they possibly can, that is a vain hope. Acroterion (talk) 11:44, 1 October 2010 (UTC)
After looking at the current version, it is far more advanced than what was previously deleted, and is certainly not speediable. Acroterion (talk) 11:46, 1 October 2010 (UTC)
Thanks for the clarification and your note at the deletion discussion. The obvious debate over what is BIO1E vs. a notable article is under-way, which I am pleased to see as it should nicely establish consensus either way. (talk) 15:01, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

Pen houses?

Front of the house

The National Register nomination form for the Blair-Dunning House in Bloomington, Indiana describes the original (central) portion of the house as a "four-pen structure". What's a pen in this context — a bay (architecture)? Here is a photo from a different angle. Nyttend (talk) 14:48, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

For clarification — the original portion is the two-story piece; the porches are attached to later additions. Nyttend (talk) 14:49, 1 October 2010 (UTC)
I've always taken a "pen" as analogous to a bay, the term arising from a log enclosure that becomes a room once it's roofed. That's my personal etymology, not something that's researched. I'm not sure how it applies to the illustrated house - I'll see what I can turn up. Acroterion (talk) 15:00, 1 October 2010 (UTC)
I just found more information on this subject, thanks to a book published by Indiana's state historic preservation office — a double pen house was basically a single-room log building that was augmented by the addition of a room to one side. Since both sides of the pictured house have been expanded in this manner, I'm guessing that a four-pen house is just a doubly-augmented two-pen house. Nyttend (talk) 22:07, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Why did you delete White Bread Fred. —Preceding unsigned comment added by TVmenace (talkcontribs) 05:12, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

You have deleted Intelligence, surveilance society

Intelligence surveilance society was a page in progress. It's references were going to be put on the page by the 7th October. Stephenj642 (talk) 15:48, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

The article did not provide any context or evidence that the organization (whatever it is) is notable. In writing an encyclopedia article, you need to provide enough context for a reader to know what you're talking about and why it's important. Acroterion (talk) 15:50, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

Thats the way it should be..

Interjection of commentary that does nothing to help improve an article should be removed on sight as you did here. It is nothing but disruption and trolling in my opinion and I think more of this needs to be done...probably 80% of the text in the 9/11 related articles talk archives is dealing with such gibberish.--MONGO 00:06, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Taken seriously, it amounts to an accusation of complicity in mass murder; taken not-so-seriously, it adds nothing. I find the meme about nothing like this happening due to fire interesting; apart from fire, no high-rise buildings have been hit by wide-body airplanes before either, but that gets glossed over. There is a willful misunderstanding of the performance of steel buildings in fires and the limitations of building and fireproofing technology. If you can't or don't fight a fire in a steel building aggressively, it will either burn out or the building will collapse. Until 2001 they'd either burned out or the firefighting efforts were successful. Acroterion (talk) 03:01, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

FashionABLE page

Hi I was just wondering why the fashionABLE page was deleted? I understand that it may come off as a promotion, but it really is more of an understanding of a movement that we are trying to make known. I saw that you can mark the page as a hangon if you want to dispute the delete, but I don't know where to do this. I'm hoping that there is a way to salvage the page that I put up, even if it is not published. It took me several hours to write, and I would like to use it as a template for a new page.

Please let me know,

Thanks Mochatern (talk) 19:27, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

The article read as a press release or promotion, rather than as an encyclopedia article. Wikipedia is not a means of promotion - it documents information neutrally, in a formal, encyclopedic tone. The article also did not indicate whether the subject was notable - whether the organization that supports the activity has received significant coverage in major independent news outlets. If you are "trying to make known" the movement, Wikipedia is not a good choice. Wikipedia documents pre-existing notability. I will be happy to place the deleted text in your userspace at User:Mochatern/sandbox so you can either address the issues above or so you can create other articles, subject to compliance with Wikipedia's rules concerning notability and encyclopedic content. Acroterion (talk) 20:27, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Mark Boler

Hey, I'm new to this, you just deleted a page I'm not even finished creating. This is the pages for a relevant person, he is a candidate for congress for the 26 district of Texas. I could use some help creating this page instead of road blocks. I love Wikipedia, I wouldn't want to add anything irrelevant or inaccurate, so please help me here. Thanks ;P —Preceding unsigned comment added by KanardAzul (talkcontribs) 21:26, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Replied on your talkpage. Acroterion (talk) 21:30, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Alpine Wall

Hi Acroterion, thank you for the congratulations, but honestly I don't think I have time to spend in both Wiki (italian and english). At the moment I'm translating the List of allied military operations of the Vietnam War (1966) and the Progetto Guerra "steals" me a lot of time!

Anyway, you may ask to Ellegimark (en-2, as me) or Llorenzi (en-3, better than me), two of the most active ad able users who joins the "vaglio" of the Alpine Wall. Good luck! ;)

P.s. sorry for my english and, if it's possible, answer me in my italian user talk! --Bonty90 (talk) 13:59, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Replied on your talk page. Acroterion (talk) 15:53, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Matt Nicholas Hines

Hi, you declined a speedy deletion from that article with the edit summary "apparently will be on Disney" did you have a more reliable source than his own web page for that information? I wasn't able to find anything myself. --D•g Talk to me/What I've done 03:51, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

I declined my own speedy deletion; he did after all make an assertion of notability, however weak, and I did find an independent source that indicates Disney - I didn't bother to look at his personal website. The article is problematic on several levels, but I decided it wasn't eligible for speedy deletion: AfD is probably the best place, but it was late and I didn't have time to do that. Acroterion (talk) 11:36, 6 October 2010 (UTC)
I agreed with the decline of speedy deletion, it seemed to assert its own notability to the point where it was no longer appropriate for speedy deletion. I was just wondering if you had found a reliable source that I hadn't before I took if to AfD. But it looks like someone else deleted it anyway so it no longer matters. --D•g Talk to me/What I've done 16:03, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

Rebecca Camhi Gallery

Good day,

This article is intended to educate readers on the growing cultural aspects of the area, and this gallery is one of the highlights of the area in terms of this culture.

Entrance is free of charge and we have no affiliation to this gallery whatsoever.

Please inform us of any information we have included that creates the impression that this article has been written for commercial purposes.

Kind regards,

Metaxourgeio (talk) 15:16, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

The article was promotion from beginning to end, and free admittance makes no difference at all. Please do not promote non-notable businesses on Wikipedia. Acroterion (talk) 15:21, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

Hi Acroterion

I have changed the page and put it in my namespace:

I added a section on how the buying process could be changed by upcoming constitutional reforms etc. I can also add a section on why Turkish property is currently more popular than pre-crunch, detailing the fading importance of contentitious EU membership owing to the sovereign debt crisis in the EU, and a host of other reasons, but I wanted to focus on the buying process.

Can you let me know if I am moving in the right direction please. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Michael Sutton WAP (talkcontribs) 17:16, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

Several problms come to mind:
    • The article is written in an informal tone inappropriate for an encyclopedia (you should avoid the use of the first and second person)
    • It reads as a how-to guide - Wikipedia isn't guide for those purchasing real estate, it is an encyclopedia of the issues surrounding Turkish real estate
    • It's a content fork of Foreign purchases of real estate in Turkey.
    • It still comes across as promotional - what encyclopedia would have a section titled "Choices, Choices, Choices?"
I'd advise you to propose changes on the existing article's talk page if you feel you have some relevant points to add to the existing article; those changes should be backed up by appropriate references and should be scrupulously non-promotional. Acroterion (talk) 17:23, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

The Real Nasty (musician page) deleted

Hi, This was my first attempt at creating a Wikipedia page (The_Real_Nasty) and I accidentally hit save at the first paragraph triggering a fast delete by you due to lack of content. I have since finished the article and feel like it has plenty of relevant content. Can I give it another shot?


Golden tooth (talk) 23:24, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

Sure. Just one thing - have you read WP:BAND and make sure that the band meets the notability guidelines? 'Cause otherwise it's likely to get deleted again. We get a lot of articles on bands, as you've probably noticed, and 90% don't meet the inclusion guidelines. Acroterion (talk) 01:34, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

Regarding deletion of Orkut PSPK page

May i know the reason behind deletion of my page please :(

Jstvicky (talk) 00:11, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

It was a contextless verse concerning someone whose significance was not indicated, and which bore no relation to the title. It was not appropriate for an encyclopedia, whose purpose is to provide clear, well-written information on encyclopedic subjects. Acroterion (talk) 01:32, 7 October 2010 (UTC)


If time were to allow, could you look at the actions of this user? Frankly I am confused by the 'edit history' page and it is not clear to me what exactly he is doing and if it might be called vandalism. He is a new and energetic user and would rather not rain on his parade at this point. Paul, in Saudi (talk) 11:27, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

He's characterizing things he doesn't agree with as vandalism, which is not acceptable. I left him a nudge on his talkpage and reverted the items he termed "vandalism", as I see a content dispute or a sourcing dispute, which is something else entirely. Those should be discussed, not summarily dismissed with an inappropriate edit summary. Acroterion (talk) 12:05, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

I have now added references to my new article, would you please have a look and let me know if everything is ok ?

Hi Acroterion,

Thank you for your comments - 'We only need one title, and given the prior existence of another Ted Elliott, Ted Elliott (voice over) is the appropriate format. You may wish to devote some time to finding and providing references and making sure that the article is in compliance with WP:BIO and the manual of style WP:MOS. Acroterion (talk) 14:00, 8 October 2010 (UTC)'

I have now added references to my new article, would you please have a look and let me know if everything is ok ?

Thank you,

Matthew Jones TPB 17:57, 8 October 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mljones001 (talkcontribs)

I think there's enough referencing there now, but it'll need some formatting. You might want to think about toning the article down - while it's not promotion, it has a promotional air to it and could be scaled back a little to be more suitable for an encyclopedia. I'll try to format references for you, at least a couple so you can see how it's done. Acroterion (talk) 18:05, 8 October 2010 (UTC)

That would be great - thank you for your time .... Matthew Jones TPB 18:22, 8 October 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mljones001 (talkcontribs)

First, thanks...

...for adding the comment about Oversight, it was an oversight on my part to exclude it. I usually use my (relatively newly minted) bit to close AfDs, so if I've mucked up anything with the blocking or revdels, feel free to drop me a note (or an email, link on my userpage), or slap me with a trout, as appropriate.  ;-) Thanks again! --je deckertalk 02:19, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

No problem, glad you were on it so quickly. I did mean to ask you about indeffing the IP - while I'd certainly hit that one with a significant block, indef isn't done for IPs unless it's clearly a static IP with a long history of problems. I'd suggest 3 months, to get past the election, so some future user of the dynamic IP doesn't get turned away. Acroterion (talk) 02:22, 9 October 2010 (UTC)
Awesome, I'll go get that changed. That was just inexperience and "block it now, fix the details later" speaking. Thanks! --je deckertalk 02:24, 9 October 2010 (UTC)
No problem, that one was a "burn with cleansing fire " set of libels. Also, when dealing with revdels, it's best to be vague about the log entry - "defamation" is fine, those who need to know and have the necessary permissions can figure out the rest for themselves. Acroterion (talk)
Thanks, will keep that in mind going forward. That makes a lot of sense. (And got the block length fixed) Thanks! --je deckertalk 02:29, 9 October 2010 (UTC)


It was a harmless mistake. I did not know that other english users spell offense "offence", i thought it was a careless spelling error, so i fixed it. A Word Of Advice From Beastly20: Don't Be Silly, Wrap Your Willy! 23:03, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

That's what I thought - now you know. You might find American and British English spelling differences interesting, as well as WP:ENGVAR. Acroterion (talk) 23:05, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

hello Am George Fotiadis and am a musician producer that wanted to set up few lines for my work in wikipedia

Hello and i hope i dont waste your time,,

am a music producer and i thought as ther is a report of my music on wikipedia thru NUFUNK to set up my bio,,

i didnt want to make any spam or something,,am an artist,,

i will appreciatee if you give me the right to write very few things about me,, is it possible?

thanks for your time,,

George Fotiadis —Preceding unsigned comment added by Georgios Fotiadis (talkcontribs) 04:00, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

Basement Freaks was blatant promotion and unsuitable as an encyclopedia article. You may not use Wikipedia to promote yourself or acts with which you are associated. For that reason, Wikipedia policy strongly discourages any conflict of interest - under this policy you are discouraged from writing about yourself, your business, or your music. Acroterion (talk) 04:05, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

why u deleting a page i am creating

i am creating it and its being removed before i can finish it i have pictures and audio and etc that all supports this nickname piggy james or is this some sorta censorship from the hole truth ?

Please stop creating hoax/nonsense articles. Acroterion (talk) 04:08, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
FYI: The page isn't a hoax (see Google news search); but it is poorly written, and nothing but a nickname for a person who already has an article on Wikipedia. At best, the new page could be a reasonable redirect ... but no reason for a full article under the nickname page name. --- Barek (talkcontribs) - 04:19, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
u must be kidding i went to this event the wwe wrestling took all videos and etc and its not a hoax there alot members of the wwe world that like the hole truth its a nickname for mickie james and i have about 2 pages of pictiures and video and etc to back it up here is one the images so far so u can see this is real and its all over and i beat there a hoax as well even tho there on tv every monday and friday —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dlshack2 (talkcontribs) 04:16, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
We only accept material from reliable sources (personal research is not an acceptable source, only material from previously published independent media are acceptable), about notable events, written in an understandable manner. Your article was not acceptable for an encyclopedia. While it may not be a hoax, it doesn't appear to be suitable for inclusion. As Barek points out, we already have an article on Mickie James. Acroterion (talk) 04:20, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
then remove the wiki i was adding mine too as it follows the guidelines you just gave to me as unacceptable —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dlshack2 (talkcontribs) 04:23, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
You'll have to express yourself more clearly - there's already an article on Mickie James. Acroterion (talk) 04:30, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

Need Some Help

I have seen the "Why was my article deleted?" question posed some many times, I have actually created a page (to be used as a template) about it. You can find it here. What I need, is I feel some examples are missing and the ones I have are lacking. Could you look it over and see what is missing? I don't want to add this to a person's page with missing information and not be able to answer their question. - NeutralhomerTalk • 05:00, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

Why do you always get all the complainers? I deleted dozens of articles and images yesterday, but except for one redirect deletion that was misinterpreted as an article deletion, all of the complaints I got (including someone who wants to speedy delete the article being discussed here) are from people who disagree with my decision not to delete. Nyttend (talk) 12:12, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
@Nyttend: I delete a lot of hoax and spam pages, it goes with the territory. Take a look at my deletion logs - there are some real gems in there. The hoaxers want to convince me that there really are some islands off Greenland called Baldinesea, and the spammers are convinced that their band or company meet the standards and if I just would pay more attention I'd know that, and that it's perfectly acceptable to write purple prose to describe how fabulous they are. The recent article The best mold(mould, tooling) in China and its variants are classics. I've done a lot of speedy deletions in the past few days. There have been a lot of very aggressive spammers, attack page artists, very young children putting up Too Much Information (one was six! Her writing and spelling were great, but that's far too young to be on the Internet). I've helped a couple of the people above write acceptable articles, or at least articles that can't be speedied, but they're depressingly rare. The person above wants to add a nickname for a professional wrestler, but has severe problems writing coherently, making them very difficult to understand, particularly past midnight local time.
@NH: That's a good start. A lot of admins have similar essays, or links, posted on their talkpages. I don't know how effective they are, since I try to explain deletions to everyone on their own talkpages through the Templates Nobody Reads, but it might be useful. Acroterion (talk) 13:50, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
Funny, I delete plenty of hoaxes and spam as well; you must get all of the hoaxers and spammers that pay attention to the pages that they wrote. Nyttend (talk) 18:19, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
Friday and Saturday nights seem to produce the most contention - I can't imagine why. Acroterion (talk) 19:30, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

Please click new message.

when you edited my Talk page last, you obviously did not click the "New Section" button next to the "Edit" button in the top-right of the page, and just edited the section before it. I had to manually make a new section for you. It makes it easier for everyone to click "New Message", unless you are purposely adding to an existing section. Thank you. A Word Of Advice From Beastly20: Don't Be Silly, Wrap Your Willy! 02:24, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

I didn't hand-write the edit. Replied at greater length on your talkpage. Acroterion (talk) 02:41, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

New NRHP Listing in Shenandoah County, VA

According to this story, there is a new historic place in Shenandoah County, Virginia. As of yet though, I can not find it on the county listing so I am not sure how you want to list that here on Wikipedia. Just a heads up. Take Care...NeutralhomerTalk • 20:20, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

Replied for you. Nyttend (talk) 18:04, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
Thanks, I was going to go look for the link to the new listings but hadn't gotten there yet. Acroterion (talk) 18:10, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

My User/Talk page

when you go to my userpage and talk page, does the message bar say your name or my name? I want to know from another user because i do not want to create another account to see this for myself, and that would be sockpuppetry. A Word Of Advice From A Beast: Don't Be Silly, Wrap Your Willy! 01:41, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

Saw your post ... the "REVISIONUSER" code that you used on the header displays the last user to have edited a page, not the current viewer of a page. So, I'm currently seeing your name in the header. --- Barek (talkcontribs) - 01:45, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
Then does anyone know the code that displays the current viewer of a page?A Word Of Advice From A Beast: Don't Be Silly, Wrap Your Willy! 01:46, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

(talk page stalker): It says your name, you can easily fix this by removing your name and adding the following code: {{{{{|safesubst:}}}BASEPAGENAME}} Also, your talk page link on your signature directs to Usertalk:Beastly20. Notice there is no space. - NeutralhomerTalk • 01:48, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, NeutralHomer. Does that code display the current user? A Word Of Advice From A Beast: Don't Be Silly, Wrap Your Willy! 01:51, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
I believe that the code from Neutralhomer would always display your name. To the best of my knowledge, there is no code that will display the user-ID of anyone who is currently viewing a page.
I use the "REVISIONUSER" code, but in my user page editnotice, so it only displays when someone is editing the page - that way, as the most current editor, it will show the viewer's name. --- Barek (talkcontribs) - 01:54, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
Link for how to create an editnotice subpage: Wikipedia:Editnotice#User_and_user_talk. --- Barek (talkcontribs) - 01:56, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
There is a code that does exactly that on the Call of Duty Wiki, and I use it on my User Page there. If someone could go to my userpage there, I use the same Username, and tell me the code that I use so i could try it out here, i would appreciate it. I am blocked by my dad from editing there( Parental Controls), so I cant do it myself. A Word Of Advice From A Beast: Don't Be Silly, Wrap Your Willy! 01:59, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────Barek is right, my goof. I am tired. Yeah, that would give just your name. Stand by, there is a code for people, let me find it. - NeutralhomerTalk • 02:02, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

Did all that looking and Barek had beaten me. Yup, he is correct, the code you want is {{REVISIONUSER}}. - NeutralhomerTalk • 02:13, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
I'm glad Barek and NH are helping Beastly out, because this kind of coding isn't my field. Acroterion (talk) 02:48, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

Deleting Templates

Can you please delete this page and all the subpages on it?? A Word Of Advice From A Beast: Don't Be Silly, Wrap Your Willy! 01:48, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

It appears that Gold and Magenta were the only subpages - let me know if that's not the case, or if you'd like them restored. Acroterion (talk) 02:52, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

Architecture categories

Asking you because, if I remember rightly, you're the only WP:ARCH member whom I know. Do you think that there'd be a benefit to subdividing the "[year] architecture" categories, similar to the way the "Built in [year]" categories are subdivided at Commons? For example, I think that Category:1919 architecture might be more useful if we had a subcategory of Category:1919 architecture in the United States and perhaps parallel categories for other countries. As always, talkback please. Nyttend (talk) 18:10, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

Yes, because design trends are different in time and geography: what was up-to-the-minute in most of the US in the1920s would have been considered dowdy in Germany or England at that time, when the International Style was just making waves in Europe. The Viennese Secession and De Stijl were highly localized and had little to do with other architecture of their time. In the US, the architecture of Wyoming in 1920 had little to do with the architecture of New York of the same time. Acroterion (talk) 18:18, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
Thanks. What would you think of filing a bot request to help with this? I'd suggest that the bot create a category for each year in 1776 and later (to avoid debates about whether an earlier building was built in the USA if there were no USA then), and then populate it by looking at every article that's (1) in Category:Buildings and structures in the United States or a subcategory thereof and (2) in a "[year] architecture" category. Therefore, my recently-expanded Blair House (Montgomery, Ohio) would be moved to "1875 architecture in the United States" because it's in Category:Houses on the National Register of Historic Places in Ohio and in Category:1875 architecture. I know that there are tons of subcategories of Buildings and structures in the United States, but I think that we can avoid false positives by requiring any articles that are moved to have the architecture year category. Nyttend (talk) 18:26, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
Yeah, I'd certainly rather see a bot do that than a human. I've never liked those catch-all year categories and have tended to ignore them, as they in their present form add little to an understanding of design. Acroterion (talk) 18:28, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
Sounds good; it's the "Subdivide architecture categories" section of Wikipedia:Bot requests. I've always thought of these categories as being similar to the "[year] births" and "[year] deaths" categories for biographies, with the major difference that those are needed for BLP reasons, and these obviously aren't. Nyttend (talk) 18:45, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
Although I posted the request four days ago, I've not gotten any replies; my own edits are the only ones in that thread. I'm hoping that it will be answered sooner or later; after all, I doubt that programming this bot would be as difficult as programming other bots that I've seen around. Just for kicks, I created Category:1920 architecture in the United States and manually moved all of the relevant articles; it took me 20 minutes just to do this one year (and it was less than half the size of categories such as 1929), so I share your hearty preference for bot help. Nyttend (talk) 23:56, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
It's best to not be in a hurry when posting a bot request. I saw y9ou moving categories - definitely a job for a program. Acroterion (talk) 01:06, 17 October 2010 (UTC)


An article I had created was speedily deleted under section A7 for failing to show significance. I am trying to create an article for a non-profit organization in Memphis that provides 24/7 telephone hotline support for people in crisis, under the name "Memphis Crisis Center."

I would appreciate help in overcoming these barriers.

Jessiemwalker (talk) 01:53, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

I'll reply on your talkpage. Acroterion (talk) 01:55, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Just a random comment

Hey, just saw your block on Poppy, I gotta say that was a pretty funny block, getting block in 2 days lol. Anyways just a random comment and props to you bro.--iGeMiNix/What's up?/My Stuff 01:57, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Any notion that they were naive newcomers to Wikipedia was dispelled by their behavior, so I made it a little harder for them to create their next account. Acroterion (talk) 02:03, 13 October 2010 (UTC)
Lol, nice nice. At least they aren't promoting anything. =P--iGeMiNix/What's up?/My Stuff 02:04, 13 October 2010 (UTC)
I learned everything I know about snappy block notices and declines from FisherQueen (talk · contribs). I've been deleting a lot of obvious vandalism on newpage patrol today - a couple of days ago it was aggressive spammers, and before that it was attack artists. These things seem to come in waves. Acroterion (talk) 02:08, 13 October 2010 (UTC)
Nice, yeah they do, and of course not all of us have the all the time in the world, especially when I am on Huggle or Igloo, I just tend to stay on for a bit and try hard to get off at times. lol--iGeMiNix/What's up?/My Stuff 02:12, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Talk:Arthur B. Robinson

Your thoughts on the kerfuffle developing on this page would be most welcome. I feel as if I had been attacked, but you know how I can get. I appreciate some wise words before I respond further. Paul, in Saudi (talk) 10:35, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

I've commented there - my position would be that you should start with a secondary source that deals with Robinson's personal positions on education (surely somebody's commented on them?), then support that by reference to Robinson's website, rather than starting there. One of 71's edit summaries implies that it shouldn't be included if it's not relevant to his candidacy, which, if they really mean that, would be an odd way to write a biography. NOR, like BLP, can be used to stifle a discussion, and 71's interpretation of NOR is not supported by the policy as I read it. One can, in fact, use primary sources, provided they are used as support for a basic premise derived from secondary sourcing - the writings of biographical subjects are routinely cited, but usually in a context set by another source. Acroterion (talk) 12:30, 13 October 2010 (UTC)
Allow me to chill before I post there again. Paul, in Saudi (talk) 13:22, 13 October 2010 (UTC)
There are no deadlines, and it's worth waiting to see what shakes out.Acroterion (talk) 13:38, 13 October 2010 (UTC)


Hi Is there any way I can create a Wikipedia page for my organization? Please let me know. If it is not allowed, then I won't make such promotional efforts. I apologize for the previous ones. Malikjuhi (talk) 16:47, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Replied on your talkpage. Acroterion (talk) 16:50, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

R.K. Lawton

Hi I don't understand what explanation is required. I felt the links speak for themselves. And if I understand correctly, he is also an administrator and a key member of the Wikipedia team, helping numerous users with his expertise and pictures. This is all I have to say and will not contest your authority. --Pablostende (talk) 16:54, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Assuming you're sincerely contributing, the article makes no encyclopedic contribution, nor does it indicate why he is significant. Links do not accomplish this. Wikipedia administrators are not notable. Acroterion (talk) 16:58, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

HTF Acronym

This is not made up. It actually happened. What else do I need to show aside from the references? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Motorheadno13 (talkcontribs) 18:44, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Wikipedia is not for things you've made up one day. It's also not a dictionary. Neologisms must have documented currency in the form of published articles specifically addressing the subject. Acroterion (talk) 19:04, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Putchy Style

Woah, G10? Admittedly I only had a quick look over it, but did I miss something obvious here? I don't recall seeing any living people mentioned, it seemed to be a rather strange made-up term. My apologies if I failed to tag a G10... GiftigerWunsch [TALK] 20:53, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

It made reference to a particular person, presumably the "little Putch" referred to in the article, in a derogatory manner. This is a fairly common way to make fun of people, and usually is meant to be teasing rather than a significant attack, but it's within the bounds of a G10. It wasn't really obvious, but it also meant that it could be summarily deleted. Acroterion (talk) 20:58, 13 October 2010 (UTC)
Hmm somewhat borderline then, and makes it possible to delete now without waiting for the prod. Alright, I'll spare myself the trout. Thanks for the explanation. GiftigerWunsch [TALK] 21:01, 13 October 2010 (UTC)
Please do spare yourself the trout. It's a useful excuse to speedy-delete an obviously inappropriate article rather than letting it sit for ten days - if had referred to the person in a positive way, the excuse wouldn't have been available and it would have had to go as a PROD. It could also have been termed vandalism/hoax as it sort of implied that it was a language. Acroterion (talk) 21:09, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Congressional Black Caucus

Vandalized by Bdel965 again. (I want to mention how much I admire your eagle-barnstar thing.) Paul, in Saudi (talk) 15:47, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

Blocked. Yeah, I like the inflatable eagle - with a different paintjob it could be an equally good penguin, for those whose national symbol is the penguin - I'm campaigning for adoption by Argentina in lieu of whatever they use. Acroterion (talk) 15:58, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

"lou leonardi"

Could you please undelete this article? We have received OTRS permission for it which I can add as soon as it is restored. VernoWhitney (talk) 22:08, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Done, needs a rewriting and a renaming. Acroterion (talk) 23:34, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
Thanks, I'll move it and tag it for permission and rewrite. Cheers! VernoWhitney (talk) 23:37, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Why did you delete the article "The Dubois Special"?

?? It was a work in progress! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Xsdeaf (talkcontribs) 00:07, 19 October 2010 (UTC)

Because it made no indication that it met the inclusion guidelines for bands - please review WP:BAND. Acroterion (talk) 00:33, 19 October 2010 (UTC)

Dark Umbra

Hi. I wonder if it's worth salting this? --Kudpung (talk) 04:52, 20 October 2010 (UTC)

They seem to have stopped for now and are in a discussion with Kinu on G11, A7 and so forth, so I'll leave it alone. If it shows up again without a good-faith attempt to meet inclusion guidelines, it could be salted. Acroterion (talk) 11:31, 20 October 2010 (UTC)

Good Country People - Deleted?

I was curious about why an entry for the Flanery O'Connor short story "Good Country People" was deleted. It remains (in my opinion, but also in those of various lit journals over the years) one of her finest and most ironic works, and even if it weren't, but just an example of her writing. If there is a Plaot, Storyline, Synopsis and List of Characters... well, what's the problem? (talk) 09:29, 21 October 2010 (UTC) Dario

Without going into too much detail, while the attempt at an article did make reference to the O'Connor story, it made a violent turn into pure vandalism. Looked like a high school kid who really didn't like their assignment. Until someone writes an appropriate article as you've described above, it's best left deleted. Acroterion (talk) 11:47, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter : LV (September 2010)

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The Military history WikiProject Newsletter: Issue LV (September 2010)
Front page
Project news
Project news

The results of September's coordinator elections, plus ongoing project discussions and proposals


A recap of the month's new Featured and A-Class articles


Our newest A-class medal recipients, this September's top contestants, plus the reviewers' Roll of Honour (Apr-Sep 2010)


In the final part of our series on copyright, Moonriddengirl describes how to deal with copyright infringements on Wikipedia

To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, please list yourself in the appropriate section here. To assist with preparing the newsletter, please visit the newsroom. BrownBot (talk) 20:58, 21 October 2010 (UTC)


why would you delete that —Preceding unsigned comment added by Catraa (talkcontribs) 21:40, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

Replied on your talkpage. Acroterion (talk) 21:42, 21 October 2010 (UTC)


Who are you to tell me what to do? I'm free of asking help and lead other people to see and act at the same issues. LoveActresses (talk) 15:57, 23 October 2010 (UTC) Do you even have the nerve of forbidding, as if..., people from acting as they want towards eachother? That's even worse than some rules of wikipedia!... No one asked you to middle in other people's issues anyway. LoveActresses (talk) 15:58, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

I've worked with Caponer on other matters and happened to notice your rather demanding note. He's indicated that he won't be participating as much as he used to, and you appear to be making inappropriate demands, characterizing content disputes as vandalism. I therefore felt it was appropriate to leave you a note on appropriate interaction with other editors. This is a wiki: everything is everybody else's business. Acroterion (talk) 16:02, 23 October 2010 (UTC)
Too bad. I can live with that, but not with destruction of articles. The end is what matters. If you knew anything about the talkings you meddle with, you'd know that I've tried to deal with the other editor but he keeps using his subjective and biased views as if they were wikipedia rules. LoveActresses (talk) 16:03, 23 October 2010 (UTC) You're not my business, and just because you're such an SOB that you say "everything is everybody else's business" I'll ignore you from now on, because you're not my business and I won't let you make mine yours. LoveActresses (talk) 16:05, 23 October 2010 (UTC)
If there's something specific that you can point to, (preferably with the relevant diffs or history), I'd be happy to take an independent look at it, remembering that my opinion might be to nobody's liking. In the meantime, I suggest that you moderate your tone in interacting with others. Civility is not an optional policy. Acroterion (talk) 16:08, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Fort des Ayvelles

RlevseTalk 18:03, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

I don't understand

Why would article about a guy who appeared on the largest and most watched TV stations in the World in just a few days and is among the youngest authors on the Globe be insignificant?! There are tens of thousands of people with Wikipedia articles which were never mentioned on BBC or ARD in the whole history of these channels. I demand un-deleting the article. --Nederlander1977 (talk) 18:53, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

See the article deletion discussion: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Rastko Pocesta and WP:ONEEVENT. He may become prominent in the future, but inclusion in Wikipedia is based on a continuum of notice. You may make a request at WP:DRV for reinstatement of the article if you wish. Acroterion (talk) 19:23, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

Name change

Yes :) I was just writing to you againg because i was now abel to logg on to my Concerphotos account. Ok, i will do that and thanks for your support and quick answers! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Concertphotos (talkcontribs) 13:42, 28 October 2010 (UTC)


Per your last warning here, user immediately recreated page (or some version of it; I'm not a sysop and can't see the deleted versions) as SmolerMan (Comics). Just FYI, your call. Best regards, TRANSPORTERMAN (TALK) 15:34, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

Deleted and indeffed. Thanks for letting me know. Acroterion (talk) 15:38, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

Midlands School District, Arkansas

Has been proposed for speedy deletion, and I value your comments, as always. Paul, in Saudi (talk) 10:10, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

If I was King of Wikipedia I'd delete every article on a school or school district, but community sentiment is against me. I'd view the article as something of a coatrack based on the 15-minute notability of a single board member, and so wouldn't want to retain it. Acroterion (talk) 17:28, 30 October 2010 (UTC)
Thank you. Paul, in Saudi (talk) 09:37, 31 October 2010 (UTC)

Thank you

I sincerely appreciate the warm hearted and well-thought out email regarding retirement. It wasn't just the failed RfA... I have became disillusioned by wikipedia due to a number of factors. I guess you could say it was initiated by RfA, because I have never felt so mercilessly ripped apart but then other things just piled on and now I just don't care, considering the fact that it's not paid yet this place is so stressful, and that's compared to a job that pays fairly well. Some points were valid in the rfa but some points were just sheerly hypocritical, and not just in mine. I guess I should admit, for whatever it's worth, I was trying to go for a more introspective approach re: the RfA, not someone who just wants the tools. I could go on and on about how this site could be taken more seriously but at least for me, I don't take WP seriously, considering we have a self-described "mature" 16 year old who needs to harass myself on sites like facebook, without provocation. Kind regards Tommy! 19:41, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

Free Classic architecture?

How would you suggest categorising buildings that are classified as "Free Classic"? Lots of houses in the Steele Dunning HD here in Bloomington are so classified on the district's list of contributing properties, but I don't know what to do with them: Free Classic architecture is a redlink, searching for "Free Classic architecture" or "Free Classic" brings up no relevant results, and Google yields lots of irrelevant results. Nyttend (talk) 00:41, 31 October 2010 (UTC)

Sounds like something somebody made up to sound like they knew what they were talking about. I'd guess that it means that they have a few Classical elements pasted on here and there.. The picture in the link is of a rather spare Queen Anne cottage. Acroterion (talk) 01:01, 31 October 2010 (UTC)
Okay; the pictured house is typical of such houses, so I'll classify them as Queen Anne. One other question: what is a "Carpenter-Builder" house? I've interpreted this designation, which is applied to houses such as this one, as being a notice that the carpenter was the one who designed it; accordingly, I've classed this image as simple vernacular architecture. Nyttend (talk) 01:06, 31 October 2010 (UTC)
Pretty much the same thing - a stripped-down kind of Queen Anne frame house. A more elaborate version would be Carpenter Gothic. Acroterion (talk) 01:17, 31 October 2010 (UTC)
Duly noted, and category has been changed; thanks for the help! Nyttend (talk) 01:20, 31 October 2010 (UTC)


Hi Acroterion...I haven't checked out your latest at Commons but was wondering if you have any pictures of McDonald is visible from near St Ignatius, MT.--MONGO 01:57, 31 October 2010 (UTC)

I don't have anything, it was nearly dark when we went through there. I haven't uploaded anything in a while, but have been working on images. As a matter of fact, I'm working on images from the day we went through St. Ignatius. I'll see if I can upload a few things you might find useful. Acroterion (talk) 02:04, 31 October 2010 (UTC)
Thats cool...I'll keep my eyes open at Commons for your stuff.--MONGO 02:13, 31 October 2010 (UTC)

Bukubku and the Racism article

User:Bukubku and I have ran into trouble while editing the article on racism. They have been adding content about Imperial Japan's "anti-discrimination" policies, which I find are dubious and do not fit into the article. The article is about racism, and I have not found any other examples of peoples not being racist within the article. My sentiment is, that the article should discuss racism and things directly related to it. Not figures about Imperial Japan taking in a few thousand Jewish refugees, or how they had a conference about Racism with their vassal states.

Instead of discussing the issue, he has been picking at a statement I made about the credibility of a Thai diplomat, and tells me I have to wait for his consensus to delete content from the article. The user seems heavily influenced by nationalism, and has tried to assert several false statements as fact. I would suggest reviewing the articles he is trying to link to, as they seem to incorporate a denialist theme. Can you please mediate? --IronMaidenRocks (talk) 11:05, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

This is, as you know, an outgrowth of Bukubku's similar edits to The Holocaust, which met a cool reception. I haven't gone back and reviewed the events there, but I believe his overstated emphasis on Japanese intervention in the Holocaust was overborne there by consensus. His "seek consensus" is probably learned from that, but transfer of POV from one article to another isn't a good way to work. I don't know if there's an article on Japanese intervention in the Holocaust, but much of what he's trying to do would be best put in such a place. I have serious doubts about my ability to knowledgeably mediate. I think the best way to go about it would be an RFC for the article (so the consensus Bukubku claims to desire is achieved), and an RFC/U on Bukubku might be warranted, since he is pushing a national POV and is effectively edit-warring over several articles to accomplish this. I'll have a word with him, though. Acroterion (talk) 12:12, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
I've looked at the article: removal of The Holocaust in favor of Racial Equality Proposal, 1919 would be an obvious red flag, so I've cautioned him there. An RFC/U is looking like a a good option. I did a quick check of some of his edits on other topics, which (to my eyes) looked OK, but while I am generally conversant on Imperial Japan, I am no expert. Acroterion (talk) 12:40, 1 November 2010 (UTC)


Why do you oppose to write Civil Rights Movements and Racial Equality Proposal? Do you really think no racism except for Holocaust in 20th?--Bukubku (talk) 14:29, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

No. Do you believe that the Japanese initiatives are so important in world history that they merit such extensive digressions? Acroterion (talk) 14:34, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
Are you serious? In 1919, most of the world were under the white rule. Only Japan could propose that. Japan is not important, the proposal is important. OK? After the world war2, African and Asian countries got independece, then they demand racial equality. So racial unequlity was disappeared for the public.--Bukubku (talk) 14:49, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
And what do you think about Civil Rights Movements?--Bukubku (talk) 14:53, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
You have not made your point clear; I'm not interested in a philosophical debate, this is about your placement of undue weight in a series of articles, not about racism, civil rights, or the Holocaust, per se. Let's keep the discussion in one place, about the topic at hand. I've replied on your talk page. Acroterion (talk) 14:58, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
My point is clear other events in 20th should be writen on the article Racism. Do you oppose or not? Holocaust is totally unrelated.--Bukubku (talk) 15:11, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
As to your comments, see my latest entry at Talk:Racism. --IronMaidenRocks (talk) 18:40, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Abby Vacheron

Why did you delete the page "Abby Vacheron" ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Aevach11 (talkcontribs) 19:03, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Hmm, sorry, I usually leave a note for that sort of thing. You (I assume it's you, given your username) are not notable according to the Wikipedia guidelines for biographies; generally people whose bios are on Wikipedia are in the history books or have had some significant media coverage, for better or worse. Also, Wikipedia discourages people from writing autobiographies in general. However, since you've had some practice at writing here, I encourage you to find an article that interests you and improve it. Acroterion (talk) 19:09, 1 November 2010 (UTC)


hi i have a question. Why did my friend User:XxAyaXx get a warning? and why did my article get deleted? do you know anything about it? If so, leave the answer on my discussion page ok? so yah XXXNXXXMXXX (talk) 00:24, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

The above person has been blocked for "disruptive editing" by OrangeMike. So you can disregard that message. - NeutralhomerTalk • 02:46, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
I'd left a note on her talkpage, just above your note, in any case. I think she and her friend are far too young to be editing here. Acroterion (talk) 02:53, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
Yeah, I seen alot of back and forth "Facebook-like" talk, so I do agree. They can always come back when they understand the concept better. - NeutralhomerTalk • 03:30, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

Acroterion Used

If you go here and scroll down midway and look in the middle column for the "Cherry on Top" story (second sentence), you will see the word "Acroterion" used in a news story. This is the first time I have seen that word used in anything but your username. Thought you would think it was neat. :) Take Care...NeutralhomerTalk • 05:09, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

Lighting this up again in case it was missed. - NeutralhomerTalk • 20:53, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
You can probably count all the acroteria in Alaska on two hands. While "cherry on top" is charming, I prefer to think of them as Greek gargoyles. Acroterion (talk) 21:34, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
I just thought it was neat to see your username on the article. :) Perhaps you can use that picture (with credit) on your userpage. :) - NeutralhomerTalk • 23:21, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Fort de Loncin

-- Cirt (talk) 06:02, 2 November 2010 (UTC)


Hi I was wondering if you could use AWB to change the word "Governo" in each article to Government of and the word "Composizione del governo" to Composition of the govenrment. This would make it a lot easier.♦ Dr. Blofeld 20:40, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

Unfortunately, I've never really used AWB, so I'd have to download and learn. Acroterion (talk) 20:43, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

OK, very surprised that's all!♦ Dr. Blofeld 20:56, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

I do have an old version at home (not used for a couple of years), but here at work I've chosen not to install it. Acroterion (talk) 20:59, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

Once they are cleaned up with some info added the Government articles need transferring like this. 60 in total.♦ Dr. Blofeld 21:26, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

Let me know and I'll do them a few at a time. Don't create target articles, as it gets messy, I'll move them from the Italian titles and leave redirects. What's the preferred generic title? Government of Foo II? Acroterion (talk) 21:31, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

Seems the naming convention is Leone II Cabinet.. See Category:Governments of Italy. Can you move the pages to .... Cabinet? If you could ensure you add this category to them this would be great.♦ Dr. Blofeld 12:12, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

Will do, once I get through my current edits. Acroterion (talk) 12:27, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

OK. If you could add Template:Italian Governments at the bottom too this would be great.♦ Dr. Blofeld 12:28, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

In progress, I'll resume in a little while. Acroterion (talk) 12:51, 3 November 2010 (UTC)


Hello, I added the notability and outside references. Thanks for the quick feedback. — Preceding unsigned comment added by MaggieJones99 (talkcontribs)

Replied and placed the userfied material in the user's sandbox. Acroterion (talk) 21:05, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Fort de Tancrémont

-- Cirt (talk) 00:03, 4 November 2010 (UTC)


Why would you delete my article about Wade Ritchie.. I was in the middle of editiing it you idiot. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bigpapalump (talkcontribs) 20:41, 5 November 2010 (UTC)

Because he's a recreational league player and not eligible for inclusion. Acroterion (talk) 20:54, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
Hum...if you're an idiot, then I must be a double idiot...I think that makes me twice as idiotic as you.--MONGO 02:56, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
At least they spelled it right. And in the syntax, Ur A 2X IDIOT. Hell, I just finished translating a French article, then went looking for better sources and found a near-duplicate of the article at another site. In the current atmosphere, with the P-word being thrown around, that could make me an idiot. Happily, it looks like the external site is later than the frwiki article, and thus removes the whammy - I think. In any case, I'll have to edit the hell out of it. Acroterion (talk) 03:10, 6 November 2010 (UTC) kidding. I'm getting pannicky about my work now too...many of my earliest articles like on wilderness areas are badly in need of inline cites and though they are reffed, I wonder if I followed old habits and did less sentence restructuring than I should have to avoid violating the P-word...hum. Check out the tool I found (probably been around awhile, I'm just a 2X IDIOT(!) so just learnth this one) I installed here at the most recent FA (Glacier National Park) I finally updated after I first pushed it to FA years ago...seems although I already went over it with a fine toothed comb, especially checking refs, the tool says I have at least 5 that are dead links...that doesn't seem right as I just did all the reworking just this past spring....--MONGO 03:20, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
Linkrot is pervasive. I guess I'll have to revisit some of my early stuff and give it a hard look. I suspect that there are a few stubs sourced from Federal sites that need attention. I thought at the time that I was being pretty conscientious, but times change. I don't know what a new editor these days is supposed to do. Acroterion (talk) 03:31, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
Yup...Yellowstone NP was a FA long ago, but I went and added 50% more material and did a complete update a few years its probably way out of date again...the original FA was mostly copy paste from public domain fed websites! It was reffed but still, verbotin by wiki standards today even though this is technically not copyvio to copy paste from USGov source with attribution.--MONGO 04:31, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

Pittsburgh toilet

Did you stumble that link too? TNXMan 22:05, 5 November 2010 (UTC)

Nope, used the traditional method. There really ought to be a scholarly paper somewhere about Pittsburgh toilets. Maybe there's a masters' thesis at CMU. Acroterion (talk) 22:08, 5 November 2010 (UTC)
Interesting article. You should look more into it and write a more detailed article and put it up for DYK. - NeutralhomerTalk • 00:03, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
Along with the links already on the article, I took the liberty of looking up some other links to help with the article if you wish to expand it. 1 (scroll midway down), 2 (discussed midway down), 3 and 4. Had another link, but it tripped the spam filter. Also, I got some good Flickr and Google Picasa pictures you can use. 1 and 2. I will help out if you like on the page cause it is in interesting regional topic. You probably could get some editors help also from WikiProject Pittsburgh. - NeutralhomerTalk • 00:31, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
Yeah, I'd like to expand it with something real, thanks for doing the legwork. Acroterion (talk) 03:52, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
"I'll have a go"...I totally LOL'd. :) Let me know if I can be of help in the editing process. Take Care...NeutralhomerTalk • 03:54, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
It's getting too late, I have to credit my unconscious, as the other meaning didn't occur to my sleepy mind. Good night, Acroterion (talk) 03:59, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
Even when it is the middle of the day, my unconscious is sharper than my conscious. :) - NeutralhomerTalk • 04:08, 6 November 2010 (UTC)


Hello. I have a big problem with User:Wiggy!. He vandalize the article 1. FC Kattowitz - introduces German POV, deletes polish officiall name of club, deletes sources!!! unwillingness to compromise. In spite of my posts on discussion, he still reverted. LUCPOL (talk) 13:09, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

Wiggy's edits aren't vandalism. If you make accusations like that, you can expect impatience from those you've accused. You have a content dispute. I'd suggest that you drop the vandalism accusation (and the claims of a German POV, which I don't see) and try to find a constructive solution rather than throwing around accusations. You appear to be arguing over whether the German history of the club should be in the lead or farther down in the article. Please look at WP:LEAD, which discusses how a lead paragraph should be written, which may give you some insight into how to make the lead adequately summarize the article. The lead should concisely summarize the article, and should be supported by the body of the article, so things stated in the lead should be repeated and expanded upon in the article. If the club was a major German club but is presently a minor Polish club, minimizing the German history seems inappropriate. You might also want to look at WP:RECENTISM. Acroterion (talk) 15:50, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
No, no., no.
  1. deletes other (in this case: polish) officiall name and deletes sources! is vandalism (ask the other admins)
  2. the club's greatest achievement is vice-champion of Poland and years 1920s-1930s as (polish) 1. FC Katowice.
LUCPOL (talk) 16:00, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
It's not vandalism. Acroterion (talk) 16:02, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
deletes sources is not vandalism? Huh!?! LUCPOL (talk) 16:03, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
No, for the third time, you have a content dispute. I see one source removed by Wiggy. Since I can't read Polish, I don't know whether the source is useful. Have you considered writing a separate article on the club, rather than fighting about it? This assumes that the club is notable, which is not clear to me. Do other clubs in this new club's league have articles? Acroterion (talk) 16:10, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
Citate "I see one source removed by Wiggy" - one? Two, no one. Wiggy removed a sources as revert (remove all my changes), not as removed a sources. In other words, his remove all my changes (to his version) with sources by the way... and this is vandalism. LUCPOL (talk) 16:18, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
Void. Do not change the subject. The problem is POV, Wiggi used false adjectives type German and bizarre and complicated version and deletes neutral version based on the dry facts - date. Plus his deletes polish officiall name and it gives it as an additive, although the officiall name (ipso facto exalting the German name), although it should be written both names equally. LUCPOL (talk) 16:28, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

<undent> If you came here to have Wiggy blocked for "vandalism" so you can win an edit war, that won't happen. You are (both) edit-warring, which can result in blocks for both of you, although I don't see a technical breach of the three-revert rule yet. Instead of telling me what bad things the other editor is doing, please explain to me about the article:

  • Is the Polish club a major team? Is it notable ?
  • Is it of greater or lesser standing than the German team
  • Is there any reason why the Polish team, if it is notable, can't have its own article? Wiggy's already suggested that, which seems reasonable.

Please address the substance of the dispute rather than casting it as vandalism or as a Germany vs. Poland issue. Acroterion (talk) 17:01, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

  1. I asked for help in solving the problem, I not asked for blocked for Wiggy. I can see by your posts, I wrong came.
  2. Re. your questions: "Is the Polish club a major team?", "Is it of greater or lesser standing than the German team", "Is there any reason why the Polish team, if it is notable, can't have its own article?" - I do not understand the questions. This is one club, formed in 1905 in Germany, after I World War went to the Poland because Katowice city attached from Germany to Polish. But, this is the same club. Later, in II World War (1939-45), he returned to Germany. In 1945, Germany lost, greater part of Silesia (and Katowice city) attached to Poland. Your questions are wrong and senseless. This is one club, this is the same club, only the country of game be changed Germany-Poland and Germany-Poland. As for achievement, the club's greatest achievement is vice-champion of Poland in "polish" years 1920s-1930s. In German time (1905-1922 and 1939-45 - lack of achievement of national.
  3. You can not explicitly specify, German club or Polish club therefore I made a version without adjectives (without word German and Polish) giving only in which countries and years played. Dry facts, no false adjectives. LUCPOL (talk) 17:22, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
You came here complaining about Wiggy, not the article, and claimed that he was vandalizing. He wasn't, but you were both edit-warring. My questions are not "wrong and senseless" (I'm allowing for English not being your first language - "senseless" is a very poor choice of word, for future reference), they are an attempt to understand the problem so I can help you - I'm not familiar with European football league organization. The root of the problem as I see it is that you claim that "this is the same club." I don't see that. They're in the same town with the same name, but a lot has happened since the 1930s, including a change of nationality, which seems to me to be significant. Leaving that out seems to me to be a very significant omission. Based on your comment above, you are making what appears to me to be a synthesis by omission. I am well aware of the territorial histories of Poland and Germany, which is why I'm skeptical of the concept that this is the same team. Again, is the present club in a major Polish league? Acroterion (talk) 17:43, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
No. Today, club played in A-class (about 5rd or 6th league). PS. I'll be the opposite for article sharing. This is the same club, not for articles type"1. FC Kattowitz (German years 1905-1922), 1. FC Katowice (Polish years 1922-1939), 1. FC Kattowitz (German years (1939-1945) etc. This is total stupidity. LUCPOL (talk) 17:57, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
It would help if you dropped the "this is total stupidity" attitude and recognize that other editors might legitimately question the rightness of your approach, and which would then let you focus on convincing them that you're right. I think we've discussed this between us enough; let's see what other editors have to say. Acroterion (talk) 18:29, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
I've raised the issue at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Football#1. FC Kattowitz, where there will be editors with sufficient background to assist both you and Wiggy in resolving this appropriately. Acroterion (talk) 17:54, 6 November 2010 (UTC)
Thanks for your sober approach. I have updated the article (properly sourced and all) and provided some background information on the article's discussion page and in the project forum. Wiggy! (talk) 04:48, 8 November 2010 (UTC)


This is true. I'm not making a hoax, you are making no sense whatsoever and aretaking away my right to publicise this and you are being a hypocrite as for this is wikipedia and it is what the users want to post. This is fascism. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Shreb447 (talkcontribs) 20:31, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

Replied on user's talkpage. Acroterion (talk) 20:44, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Nathalie Dupree

Ambox warning yellow.svg

The article Nathalie Dupree has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

Fails WP:GNG with no significant outside sources

While all contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. The speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. TM 16:40, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

I suggest you re-read WP:GNG, especially if you think that lacking reliable sources is not included in it. That being said, the article does have a reliable source, so thank you for adding that.--TM 17:30, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
And I advise that you read the article, which describes someone who's hosted nine television series distributed nationally, written several significant books, received major cooking awards and who ran an otherwise non-notable political campaign based entirely on her pre-existing notability and name recognition. I interpreted your deletion rationale as a lack of notability, not as a lack of sourcing. The appropriate deletion avenue would have been a BLP PROD, which would have been justifiable given the wretched sourcing. The GNG deals with notability according to RS, but doesn't mean that a notable subject can be deleted solely because the RS aren't cited in the article. Acroterion (talk) 17:37, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
To quote GNG, the article to that point did not present "...significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject" and thus my rationale for mentioning GNG in my prod. It is a moot point now that you have established through sources that she does pass the general notability guide.--TM 17:56, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
I understand and mostly agree about that, but if you used that argument in an AfD discussion, you'd hear (apart from the BLP sourcing issue, which we all agree is valid) that it just needs to be sourced, but won't be deleted. GNG should be cited as a deletion rationale because the subject isn't notable, not because the subject is clearly and credibly stated to be notable but lacks reference to sources supporting the asserted notability. For what it's worth, Nathalie Dupree wrote most of the initial article herself (and referenced her own websites), so it could bear a considerable overhaul anyway, and the election material is overstated. Thanks for flagging it, I'd been meaning to get back to it and fix it. Acroterion (talk) 18:03, 8 November 2010 (UTC)


wow, thanks for deleting my article buddy. i thought red links meant an article i could write- apparently not eh chum? Mynamismik (talk) 20:29, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

poor boyz productions, red link?

wow, thanks for deleting my article buddy. i thought red links meant an article i could write- apparently not eh chum? Mynamismik (talk) 20:39, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

It means that somebody (according to the edit history of Mark Abma, you) thought there might be an article there, subject to notability guidelines and an absence of promotion. The article you wrote was promotional and failed to assert credible compliance with WP:CORP, the notability standard for companies. Also, please don't post song lyrics as you did here [1] - they're a copyright violation.Acroterion (talk) 21:16, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
i apoligize mr. wikipedia nazi, but could you please clarify. i still dont quite understand what a red link means. Mynamismik (talk) 21:29, 8 November 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mynamismik (talkcontribs) 21:27, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
Thank you for your very courteous request. You implied that you did in your first post, and you inserted a redlink at Mark Abma. . A red linkmeans that somebody put square brackets around a section of text, which could lead to an article if one is created (which would make it a blue link). However, the mere existence of a redlink doesn't mean that an article could or should be written, it just means that a potential link exists. All articles must meet Wikipedia requirements for notability and avoidance of promotion. The article you wrote failed to substantiate notability and was promotional, so it was deleted as nominated. Acroterion (talk) 21:31, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
Acroterion, i dont apreciate your hostilility in this matter. i was not finished editing the article, which is why it appeared to be 'promotional'. may i ask have you researched Poor Boyz Productions at all before deciding it is un-worthy of wikipedia? Mynamismik (talk) 21:38, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
You are free to write a draft in your userspace, at, for example, User:Mynamismik/sandbox. It is up to you to write an appropriately encyclopedic article, to find sources and to comply with Wikipedia guidelines. Please remember that promotion may be deleted at any time, whether it's in article space or userspace. Acroterion (talk) 21:43, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
I am going to step in. Acroterion has been more than courteous with you given your "nazi" response. You have a post on your talk page under the header "Why Was My Article Deleted?" that and your questions will be answered. - NeutralhomerTalk • 21:40, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

correct me if im wrong, but i dont beleive anyone asked of your opinion, Neutralhomer Mynamismik (talk) 21:42, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

This is a wiki. All conversations are public, and all editors in good standing are welcome to comment on any subject. Acroterion (talk) 21:43, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

i will ask you again, have you researched Poor Boyz Productions at all before deciding it is not notible? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mynamismik (talkcontribs) 21:45, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

No. The burden of proof of notability and compliance with Wikipedia requirements is on you. If you don't write an article that satisfies inclusion guidelines, it will be deleted by one means or another. About 1200 are deleted every day. Acroterion (talk) 21:48, 8 November 2010 (UTC)
Read the post "Why Was My Article Deleted?" on your talk page on why it was deleted and how to make an article that won't be deleted next time. - NeutralhomerTalk • 21:49, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

Poor Boyz Productions is in fact a notible article, albeit a poorly written one. perhaps a more experienced editor assist with the writing of this article. Mynamismik (talk) 22:01, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

I'd be happy to assist you. You can start in the sandbox link I provided farther up the page, and I can offer suggestions. You'll need to review WP:NOTE and WP:CORP for the notability guidelines, and you'll need references in major media. By the way, since you've apparently taken the warnings to heart that you've received concerning courtesy, you might also want to be careful about the other issues that have been noted on your talk page - you're awfully close to a block by an administrator. Acroterion (talk) 22:06, 8 November 2010 (UTC)


Nuvola apps edu languages.svg
Hello, Acroterion. You have new messages at Neutralhomer's talk page.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.
...and again. - NeutralhomerTalk • 22:36, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

hey man i got started on that arty, its not even close to finished so lets all stay calm and not delete it. if anybody has time to help with this article id appreciate it. Mynamismik (talk) 01:21, 9 November 2010 (UTC)—Preceding unsigned comment added by Mynamismik (talkcontribs) 01:16, 9 November 2010 (UTC)

my account is genuine

It is suspected that the operator of this account has abusively used one or more accounts.

WHAT IS THGIS??? i have only one account and i hve contributed fruitfully to nomber of articles.also i am in touch with some senior administrators. what problem u hve with my account that u have pasted some link???Shrik88music (talk) 13:34, 10 November 2010 (UTC)

Replied on your talkpage Acroterion (talk) 13:45, 10 November 2010 (UTC)


as far as genaic is concerned who is she/he? she has been interfering with my work and i have told to some of the senior members. it has been a big nuisance to meShrik88music (talk) 13:49, 10 November 2010 (UTC)

Geniac is an administrator. S/he appears to disagree with some of your edits or sourcing, and perhaps has concerns about whether you've been editing without logging into your account; I haven't looked into it, but you should be careful about characterizing their concerns as "interference." I would suggest that you discuss your responses with them calmly, basing your edits and observations on Wikipedia policy on reliable sourcing and references, and not on personal knowledge or belief. Acroterion (talk) 13:57, 10 November 2010 (UTC)


Hey, why did you delete our page? —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talkcontribs) 18:11, 10 November 2010 (UTC)

Since your account didn't create it and you've provided no link or title, I don't know. Acroterion (talk) 18:24, 10 November 2010 (UTC)

I need some help Please

I am just creating a page for a character named Victoria from the Lilo & Stitch TV series, but I want to move it to the main list of Lilo & Stitch characters artical and I am having a lot of trubble doing this. Can you please help me out?Daninewton (talk) 20:09, 10 November 2010 (UTC)

regarding deletion of Never more than less

Yes, a page with this title has previously been deleted.

I was creating a new page with different content for Never more than less, yet the basics for a "band" is mostly similar. I was still working on the basics, on my way to add the new information, yet you have deleted it as soon as it was possible for you. At least give it a chance to be. kreations 10:45, 11 November 2010

Can you at least put it back I could use the hang on tag kreations 11:10, 11 November 2010

Not a Barn...

Random Acts of Kindness Barnstar.png The Random Acts of Kindness Barnstar
For showing insane amounts of patience above and beyond the amount people would have given and willing to give more than 100% of AGF, I hereby award you this barnstar. The patience and AGF you shown was commendable and worth recognition. Well done, Sir. :) - NeutralhomerTalk • 23:10, 12 November 2010 (UTC)

Acknowledgement of your fine image uploads at Commons

Barnstar-camera.png The Photographer's Barnstar
Acroterion, your image uploads at Commons has allowed us to greatly enhance many the very least, you deserve this commendation for your efforts.MONGO 07:13, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

Graham Gund

Please read my post at the Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Graham Gund page. I can help with building the article. I have just not had the time to devote to it, given that I have been one of the fortunate ones to be working six and seven days a week at the office in these times. I have also been working on musician Wikipedia pages, with music as my second career to architecture. Doc2234 (talk) 20:41, 14 November 2010 (UTC)


Not sure if you have (and if not i would wonder why) lodged one about User:Untillu loose, atWikipedia:Wikiquette_alerts#User_talk:Untillu_looseLihaas (talk) 00:57, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

No, I blocked him, as well as four of his socks just today, and he's the subject of a /16 checkuser rangeblock. We've long since passed concerns about Wikiquette. Acroterion (talk) 01:05, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

Logo Question

I think I know the answer to this one, but want to make sure. I couldn't use the File:Evangelical Lutheran Church in America.png logo in a userbox, could I? If not, could I use the File:Lutherrose.svg image since it is released CC/ASA 3.0 for the same reason? - NeutralhomerTalk • 01:23, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

Your instinct is correct: the first is a fair-use image that can only be used in direct relation to the subject - the second is in the public domain, so far as I can tell. Acroterion (talk) 02:33, 15 November 2010 (UTC)
That's what I thought but wanted to make sure. Thanks! :) - NeutralhomerTalk • 03:55, 15 November 2010 (UTC)


Why did you revert my John F. Kelly edits? At the very least he is a LtGen not a Major Gen. The capitalization of the titles is in question. But he is a LtGen: —Preceding unsigned comment added by DODCTR (talkcontribs) 17:33, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

Replied on your talkpage - feel free to correct the rank, but please use Wikipedia's manual of style. Acroterion (talk) 17:39, 15 November 2010 (UTC)
Ok, thanks for the info. I am a retired U. S. Marine and getting away from using our own jargon. Appreciate the response.::DODCTR (talk) 18:54, 15 November 2010 (UTC)
It's a hard habit to break; no worries. Acroterion (talk) 18:59, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

Arrondissements of Marseille

Hi can you transwiki [ this for me and the 16 different arrondissements?♦ Dr. Blofeld 18:58, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

Sure, will do. Acroterion (talk) 01:48, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. I'll get on cleaning them up shortly.♦ Dr. Blofeld 15:40, 16 November 2010 (UTC)


Your mountains and glaciers are amazing! Bishonen | talk 23:17, 15 November 2010 (UTC).

Thanks! I had fun taking the pictures. <zilla>Mountains make 'Zilla look puny</zilla> I'm about halfway through maybe 800-900 unique subjects, although there are a fair number of the less encyclopedic kind like the storm at Swiftcurrent, which was one compensation for a 5000 foot ceiling in a land of 7000 foot mountains. Acroterion (talk) 01:47, 16 November 2010 (UTC)
Puny? Zilla put little mountains in pocket of spiderman suit! I just realized I need to watch the Zilla portraits, btw; look what turned up today, which I stumbled on by complete serendipity: File talk Bishzilla. :-) Bishonen | talk 01:58, 16 November 2010 (UTC).
Unless they've been around since 2006 to encounter Bishzilla and her evolutionary precursors, they could be pardoned for being puzzled. Acroterion (talk) 02:08, 16 November 2010 (UTC)
['Zilla tenderly stuff puzzled little IP in cosy pocket. ] Friendliest place for little n00bs on big confusing Wikipedia! Frisk and frolic with little ArbCom in there, little IP! bishzilla ROARR!! 03:06, 16 November 2010 (UTC).
In adding all these images I've recalled that there used to be a steamship on Yellowstone Lake called the ... wait for it ... Zillah. Let's see, underwater volcanic activity, earthquakes, eruptions, city-stomping/chomping reptiles - could there be a link? Acroterion (talk) 03:28, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

One Word

"Hic" Yup, they are back. Damn. - NeutralhomerTalk • 02:32, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

Whatever you do, don't end up like the Hiccup Girl [2]. Acroterion (talk) 02:34, 16 November 2010 (UTC)
No worries there. :) - NeutralhomerTalk • 03:14, 16 November 2010 (UTC)


I know you already know this and see your AN/I report, but don't let the monsters at the 9/11 articles taunt you to the point you block them yourself...I think if a checkuser is submitted that doesn't look like a fishing expedition, you'll find all these bogus accounts that keep springing up match the same origination for all the IP vandalism we're seeing...but there may be more than one vandal...though the ridiculousness of the posts sure seem the same..maybe they all look that way to me now.--MONGO 02:47, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

I was watching it just now too -- wondering if it was being coordinated offsite. Antandrus (talk) 02:52, 16 November 2010 (UTC)
Precisely why I brought it up at AN/I, apart from calling their bluff about "show me where I can report you." I prefer that the behavior of the editor be the issue at hand, not some specious argument about whether I'm involved. There are 1000 other active admins, after all, who can block at discretion. I think there's a common thread in the recent activity too. Acroterion (talk) 02:52, 16 November 2010 (UTC)
I know...I learned my lesson about blocking anyone on any article I had even a remote relationship to the hard way...just wanted to let you know I got your back...and your back too Antandrus. BTW Acroterion...I'm very happy about your image work've allowed me to live vicariously through your travels and that's almost as good as being there myself. My recent barrage of stubs...they allow me the opportunity "go" there via geocoordinates/topos and Google Earth...a modest escape since money is limited and some form of escape is mandatory.--MONGO 02:59, 16 November 2010 (UTC)
Well, you are sort of the poster child for that sort of thing. I'm glad I can help out on the virtual vacation front. More coming in the next day or so. Acroterion (talk) 03:06, 16 November 2010 (UTC)
"Seasoned veteran". LOL -- that takes a bit of chutzpah -- and he objected angrily to my labeling him as a sockpuppet (uh... duh?). I wonder which banned user it is. Anyway, the result is right; but I predict there will be more of the same in short order. Antandrus (talk) 01:43, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
I saw that. A pity, I was looking forward to his case for ArbCom. From his spelling and syntax, I'm guessing he's a German (Italian?) speaker - I recall encountering Wiki-lawyering Germans with agendas on 9/11-related topics in the past. I believe I'll hoist the red flag. The angry Canadian IP has flamed out for now, but it's not the last we'll hear from that part of the world either. Acroterion (talk) 01:54, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
Which raises a question: I was poking around in my German dictionary, which admittedly isn't comprehensive, to see whether the rogue/rouge administrator joke translates to German. It doesn't - the German equivalents for rogue have far too many syllables, and the equivalents of pink or rose are close but not quite "rosse", which doesn't appear in my dictionary, except in contexts that could imply "horse." Do you have any insight into colloquial German? It's Italian. Never mind. Derived from the Red Brigades/Brigate Rosse. Acroterion (talk) 02:12, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
Unfortunately no -- to get my doctorate I needed to acquire a reading knowledge of German, sufficient to translate technical articles, but I'm completely incompetent at conversation or anything colloquial. It's a very limiting way to learn a language. (One of the things I don't like about our language userboxes is you can't make that distinction -- I'm probably not the only person who can read a bunch of languages but not speak them.) Do you know User:Future Perfect at Sunrise? He may have an idea or two. :) Antandrus (talk) 02:24, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
Probably not worth the trouble, just thought you might know. I have some of the same problems: I read French with reasonable ease, used to have decent conversational French if I kept it simple, but can't write it worth a damn. My German's enough to order meals without insulting anyone too badly, that's about it. Acroterion (talk) 02:30, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

The arbcom case allowed Aude a break from the SPA/IP and sock attacks to get Wail al-Shehri, Khalid al-Mihdhar, American Airlines Flight 77, American Airlines Flight 11, 7 World Trade Center and Construction of the World Trade Center, all 9/11 related articles, to FA...I had hopes with the tenth anniversary of the event less than a year away to get the 9/11 attacks article to FA level, making it more stable...but the on and off rash of fringe view pushers on the article talkpage makes coordination of such a monumental task a near impossibility...perhaps it is just as well, for not all articles can become featured anyway.--MONGO 03:39, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

Graham Gund Article for deletion

Acroterion, I put some references up to prove notability in the discussion for the Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Graham Gund page. He also graduated from RISD in 1967 (page 88 right column 17th entry, Alumni Directory 2009, Rhode Island School of Design). Doc2234 (talk) 02:06, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

Go ahead and add the references you've found as appropriate to the article; it's up to 30-odd references from half a dozen books and seven or eight articles in the New York Times. As I've said, it's effectively deletion-proof at this point, so I wouldn't let that issue worry you, just concentrate on making the article better. Do you have a copy of the 4th edition of the AIA Guide to DC? The National Association of Realtors building's on the cover, illustrating substantial notability for that particular building. I see it on Google Books, but I can't get to the entry on the building, my copy's the previous edition. Acroterion (talk) 02:18, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
I'll see if I can stop by the AIA on 18th Street or by a good local D.C. book store during lunch some time this week. Doc2234 (talk) 03:27, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
If I didn't already know, that'd tell me that you've got work. I'm not ready to buy a new edition - DC architecture moves pretty slowly. I did order a used version of the 1994 monograph for a whole ten bucks from Amazon. Acroterion (talk) 03:31, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
I have the book. I'll compose some additions to the article, and hopefully upload some this Sunday. The brief on the National Association of Realtors building explains its significance from a LEED standpoint. Doc2234 (talk) 01:27, 20 November 2010 (UTC)


I am sorry. I had the original Beastly21 usurped and i logged in and it said I was Beastly21, I am editing as Beastly21, so if i am creating confusion, will try to fix it if you tell me how you are confused. Im going to bed. A Word Of Advice From A Beast: Don't Be Silly, Wrap Your Willy! 03:54, 17 November 2010 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Beastly21 (talkcontribs)

I'd already noticed that you'd sorted it out, so no problem. By the way, if the IP returns, I will in fact block them. I'll remove that diff in any case. Acroterion (talk) 03:57, 17 November 2010 (UTC)


From your contributions here and at Commons, it does not appear that you entirely understand that images are here to support the encyclopedia, and that Wikipedia is not a showcase for pretty but less-than-useful images. In this case, you are edit-warring to include an image that is obviously unsuitable for an encyclopedia. I realize that you uploaded the original image, but the distorted version can't be used here. Edit-warring to include a distorted image is not acceptable, the more so since you've been editing while logged out. Acroterion (talk) 20:16, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

If the images that i have loaded for commons are pretty but less-than-useful images; than how come they are used on many articles? MULAZIMOGLU (talk) 20:36, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
Principally because you placed them there. I note that your submissions at Commons have been met with some of the same concerns I have about usefulness for an encyclopedia. However, the issue at hand is your edit warring to include an obviously distorted image at Pergamon. That is not acceptable. Acroterion (talk) 20:52, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
Than pls discuss on the issue that is at the hand. Do not discuss about the other images that i have downloaded for commons and also my personality. That has nothing to do good for wikipedia project but is a kind of biting people. I have done no change after i have been warned. That is not enough for you. Pls be kind. Thanks. MULAZIMOGLU (talk) 21:14, 17 November 2010 (UTC)
I'm not sure why you think your personality was an issue, nor why you think that legitimate concerns about your conduct here are unreasonable, but since you've indicated that you've stopped edit-warring, there is no further concern. Acroterion (talk) 21:23, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

Arrondissements of Marseille (2)


I saw that you imported some articles from the French Wikipedia in French. It is nice that all history is imported, but on the other hand, it is all in French and as the articles are actually not finalised, translating would actually mean rewriting them. Is it a test or something?


--Anneyh (talk) 09:56, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

Sorry I see now it is a request you got. Actually the requester asked back some help on the Wikiproject:France yesterday. --Anneyh (talk) 09:58, 18 November 2010 (UTC)
Yes, I've offered to import articles where an attribution chain to the original-language contributors is desirable. Generally, the requestor will translate them relatively quickly. They should get an {{intranslation}} template for the time being until they are translated. I'm trying to encourage importation/translation rather than cut/paste/translation/attribution as a better way to acknowledge the work of editos on other wikis, and more in keeping with the Creative Commons attribution requirements. Acroterion (talk) 12:29, 18 November 2010 (UTC)
I didn't even know it was possible to do that, but I find it very nice, much better than the templates on discussion pages of article. I suppose it is only possible if the page does not exist at all in the target wiki? Is it common practice among administrators? --Anneyh (talk) 15:05, 18 November 2010 (UTC)
Import isn't used much on enwiki, I think I'm the second-most active importer, and I don't do it that much. The German Wikipedia does it all the time, bringing in some DYKs, GAs and FAs that don't exist over there and translating them. It's possible to import where the page already exists and was clearly a translation on a given date from another wiki; you just import it to an out-of-the-way place here, do a history merge that cuts off the imported contributions on the creation date of the enwiki article, then move the whole thing to the target article again. I've done that for things I translated a few years ago - import was only enabled at the beginning of 2010 on enwiki, and can import articles from German, French, Spanish, Italian, Polish, Meta and Nostalgia (home of a bunch of early history that got disconnected as a result of a hard drive failure in 2002 or so). Graham87's been the most active importer, repairing all those old attributions form nostwiki. Acroterion (talk) 15:44, 18 November 2010 (UTC)
And obviously, if you have anything that you believe would be a candidate for importation or import/history merge, please let me know. I saw you comment on the arrondissements of Marseille; on articles that I've imported for my own purposes, I've been fairly ruthless and cut out whole swathes of opinionating, and have just not imported at all where there appears to be no material worth including. I would expect any requester to undertake to translate the material and to make sure that it complies with policy. I believe Blofeld's mostly interested in the formatting and basic structure, and I may have talked him into using import more freely. Acroterion (talk) 15:51, 18 November 2010 (UTC)
OK, it looks like he found somebody to help... Wikipedia started with "An apple is a fruit" after all.
On my side, one of my first contribution was to translate from the French article Ligne 8 du métro de Paris (FA on wp:fr) into Paris Métro Line 8. I need to dig into the history to provide you with some dates. I also need to finalize the translation, add some English sources and get a label ! Oh well... --Anneyh (talk) 18:13, 18 November 2010 (UTC)
Let me know if/when you need a history merge. I have the Tricoire book, by the way, so I might be able to help out. I can read French with reasonable ease, but my spoken French has atrophied over the past 30 years, and my written French is awful, hence the fr-1 infobox. Acroterion (talk) 18:43, 18 November 2010 (UTC)
Well actually the Paris Métro Line 12 failed a GA review a few weeks ago, but if you would happen to have some sources in English, it is pretty close! On my side, I bought "subterranean cities" from David L. Pike, but I still need to read it... --Anneyh (talk) 19:20, 18 November 2010 (UTC)
I have Paris:A Century of Change. I'll see if there's any material there that can help. I think I have a couple of other English sources, but they're in a box somewhere. I can certainly give the article a copyedit. I just got Ouvrage La Ferté to GA from mostly French sources. Acroterion (talk) 19:59, 18 November 2010 (UTC)
That sounds very good. Subterranean cities is the only source I would have about Métro... I'm currently mostly working on University of Heidelberg from German and English sources (my de-2 is justified by the fact that I live in Heidelberg and speak some German, though I work in English), but knowing that you're around sounds like a great ooportunity for Paris Métro (a lot of lines have reached the FA on wp:fr). --Anneyh (talk) 20:21, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

SP on Talk:September 11 attacks drops this afternoon.

Better prepare for that; You know who has been back already, and I don't doubt he'll try again; this kind isn't smart enough to stop. I may be wrong, but the sad thing is, I'm probably not. HalfShadow 18:41, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

I think there are a lot more eyes on the article now, which is good since I'll be out most of the evening and have things to do this weekend. Besides, I have no wish to be some kind of gatekeeper. The angry Canadian IP's been rangeblocked for a month, and our Croatian friend (who, after complaining about an invasion of privacy, turned around and revealed his IP for the whole world to see)is likely to be noticed. As you well know, we see this kind of editor from time to time on topics relating to Ireland, Macedonia, circumcision, vaccination, the speed of light, the divinity of Christ, Obama, Palin ... I don't think he realizes how many times we see this type of editor, and that the problem isn't with the topic or some grand conspiracy, it's with their conduct and single-minded focus on a Great Cause. Acroterion (talk) 19:11, 19 November 2010 (UTC)
Just thought I'd mention it anyway; you know what these little buggers are like once they get started... HalfShadow 19:27, 19 November 2010 (UTC)
Here is another one; I see he's already come on your radar. I wish we could watchlist contributions -- has this ever been discussed at the Village Pump? It's only recently that I've watchlisted 9/11 related articles and frankly I'm horrified (but not surprised) at the sheer persistence of these people. Antandrus (talk) 01:02, 21 November 2010 (UTC)
Yeah, I'm not sure what he's on about - how else would one "make calls?" I get the general impression that he doesn't believe calls were made at all, something I've encountered before. And yes, the histories of all 9/11-related articles are trainwrecks: the four flights, particularly United Airlines Flight 93, as well as 7 World Trade Center and thermite/nano-thermite, a particular hobbyhorse of a Truther subset, at least the ones who don't think WTC was nuked. Don't laugh, there's a Russian who claims to be an expert on small nukes, who had a comprehensive website on the subject, claiming that building codes in New York and Chicago require that fast, efficient demolition measures be built into tall buildings - a nuke being ideal. News to me, I can tell you. The guy showed up here a couple of years ago - see the deleted contributions of DKhalezov (talk · contribs). W54 occasionally gets hit for that reason. I'm sure there are others I've missed. I think a contribution watchlist has been proposed and nixed as enabling stalking. Acroterion (talk) 01:13, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

If you think that what we deal with here at Wikipedia is scary, you should see the way they have gone after those they know the real life ID of...from controlled demolition experts who have been vilified, to the relatives of some who died on 9/11 and's ugly and even scary for some of these people who have been harassed by the truthers in real life.--MONGO 02:07, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

Speaking of which...lookie here...more of these pages need to be move protected.--MONGO 02:10, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

Nukes??? Wow. I had no idea. Imagine how many terrorist cells there are right now chuckling over the useful idiots here and abroad. -- I have friends who believe this stuff too; one predisposition I find is a lack of formal education in logic -- but there is also a certain personality type attracted to these things, one I have trouble understanding. Curiously, related to the type that joins violent extremist groups. Are you familiar with Eric Hoffer's The True Believer? Antandrus (talk) 02:09, 21 November 2010 (UTC)
Yes, seriously, there's a "WTC wuz nuked" belief out there, in defiance of ... well ... everything, including the most extreme Truther theories. It's well into The Matrix territory. As I commented in the AfD of Nuclear demolition (see the deleted revisions for the actual article), I'm pretty sure my professional liability insurance doesn't cover me if I miscalculate the size of the required demolition device and take out the whole Chicago Loop. Also, my copy of AIA MasterSpec is missing Section 666: Atomic Demolition Munitions. I've not encountered Hoffer. 23 printings since 1951? A veritable prophet. I bet I can find a copy at the local used book store. Acroterion (talk) 02:31, 21 November 2010 (UTC)
I've move-protected everything on the hitlist. I've seen this guy before, don't remember where. Acroterion (talk) 02:48, 21 November 2010 (UTC)
Thanks ... have a feeling we haven't seen the end of this. Antandrus (talk) 03:36, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

Port Washington, Wisconsin

During some idle time, I was posting the names of soldiers who had been killed in Afghanistan on their high schools' pages. (It seems to me the death of a recent graduate is notable.) But I came to a guy who does not seem to have graduated from HS. So I posted hsi name on his hometown's page. Another editor took exception. What are your thoughts? Is posting on a HS page a good idea? On a hometown page? On neither? Your considered thoughts? Paul, in Saudi (talk) 05:59, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

(Non-administrator comment)(talk page stalker): There could be two sides of this coin. The editor who took exception is right (one side of the coin) that the person isn't notable enough for an article, they aren't notable enough for mention on Wikipedia. But also (second side of the coin) military service is, in and of itself, notable so mention of their death in the line of duty would be notable on the town-they-came-from's page, not particularly on the high school page. I would like to hear what Acroterion has to say on this, but I believe, since this is a two-sides-of-the-coin-kinda-thing that it requires going to WP:AN (not necessarily WP:ANI) for discussion to sort it all out and get a definitive answer.
I'd say that it's reasonable to note a recent graduate killed in Afghanistan on their high school's article, but they wouldn't warrant an actual article unless they'd been decorated at a high level or had some other distinction. I wouldn't put their name in the hometown's article; I realize that that's not entirely fair if they didn't graduate from high school, but a school is a small community of consistent size, while a town isn't, and the town articles tend to get cluttered with out-of-context entries rather quickly. It seems to me that there's an opportunity to create a Wikia-hosted wiki the focuses solely on veterans of all conflicts that could provide a valuable reference for service members and their families. The notability bar for individual members of the military is quite high - absent other events, a Silver Star won't establish notability. You need a DSC, Navy Cross or Air Force Cross, or to be a general officer O-7 or above to qualify with no other qualification. I see no cause for a visit to the Slough of Despond at AN/AN/I, since this is an issue of content, not conduct - maybe a request for comment would be helpful, though. Acroterion (talk) 15:26, 20 November 2010 (UTC)
The other editor and I are working on this in a very cooperative fashion.I am taking a time out to think it over. All in all, I think I agree with you, HS article, but not hometown article. Paul, in Saudi (talk) 15:31, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

An article I just submitted was instantly deleted?

My name is Preston and I am a producer at and I work for SONY as one of their main dance music producers and musical engineers. I am also the producer and business manager for "DanWritesSins." I recently decided to make a wikipedia article about him since he has many internet-based fans, and spent about 4 days typing it all up. About ten minutes ago I submitted it and it instantly got deleted. Did I do something wrong? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Danwritessins (talkcontribs) 18:30, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

Replied at the user's talkpage. Acroterion (talk) 00:32, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

Full Protection Request

Could you fully protect this page, please? Thanks. - NeutralhomerTalk • 00:53, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

Done. Acroterion (talk) 00:55, 21 November 2010 (UTC)
Excellent! Thanks!....and....
WhitePuppy.gif The Sparky Barnstar
For helping all users with questions most would ignore and making Wikipedia a better place, I hereby award you The Sparky Barnstar. Congrats! :) - NeutralhomerTalk • 01:00, 21 November 2010 (UTC)
Thanks, now I have five dogs (this one's the smallest). Acroterion (talk) 01:01, 21 November 2010 (UTC)
A close drawing to what our dog Sparky looked like when he was a puppy. He passed away in September of 2001....if that year couldn't have sucked anymore, it did. After a year here, I decided to make that a "personal" barnstar. Another user gave the "puppy barnstar" out, but it isn't the same. Sparky was awesome. :) - NeutralhomerTalk • 01:15, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

More images used

Howdy...I've been over at Commons stealing your images for our articles here...

Thanks for these.....--MONGO 20:58, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

I need to geotag some of those and will try to upload some more - I should have a few for either extreme of the Tetons left. The Sheep Mountain (Teton County, Wyoming) and other images taken around that time are unfortanately shot at ISO 1600 by mistake, so they're very noisy. In particular I'm chagrined about the Grace and Robert Miller Ranch [3], which I particularly like, but it won't stand very close inspection. Also, the sky was a little strange those couple of days because of a fire in the Gros Ventres, making it that weird pale blue. I may do a little masking on some of the images where it's too swimming-pool-blue and see if I can get it to a more natural look, through unnatural means. Acroterion (talk) 22:11, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

The Bugle: Issue LVI, October 2010

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I am working up edits for the Graham Gund page here. As I work on this, I am starting to formulate how the Outline should be structured. There is enough work performed for Disney to warrant a section covering just that. I have seen articles about that work in the past, and I would imagine that a reader would find that interesting. Doc2234 (talk) 22:08, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

I'm not sure what all that material is in the middle - if it's quoted material, it needs to be deleted ASAP, as copyrighted material can't exist anywhere here, userspace included, without attribution and a very good reason for use. It's also unencyclopedic. If it's a source, just extract what's appropriate from it and don't post it in WP, as it's too easy for blocks of text to make it into the article. Acroterion (talk) 01:44, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
Thank you for the advice. All that is on the page now is my paraphrased written work from reference sources. This is the first time that I have set up editing work space within WP. Doc2234 (talk) 02:51, 22 November 2010 (UTC)
No problem, just be careful about moving material onto the wiki, and make sure that it's not a close paraphrase; more like a summary. Acroterion (talk) 03:18, 22 November 2010 (UTC)


This user (who posted above) has posted a large bio on his userpage. User claims he is 18, so it wouldn't be in violation of WP:MINOR, but would be in violation of WP:MYSPACE, since it includes Twitter, Facebook and other links. I will let you decide what should be done, but I feel it should be blanked or at least deleted. - NeutralhomerTalk • 01:29, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

I moved it to a sandbox. If it doesn't indicate notability after a couple of weeks, it should be MfD'd. Acroterion (talk) 01:40, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

Frewin Jones

In 2009 you deleted this article because of "No indication that the article may meet guidelines for inclusion". (no significance?). I'm mostly working on the German WP and we are wondering why the wp-en does not have an article about this author. His books are published even in German. He is also known as Allan Frewin Jones. Maybe you want to undelete this article? (If you want to respond, please use my German talk page.) --ACNiklas (talk) 19:58, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

The article submitted here was both a copyright violation ("all material taken from his website") and made no indication of notability. I understand that this is a published author, but the article submitted did not indicate so beyond a very cryptic allusion. An encyclopedic article would be most welcome - the one I deleted certainly was not suitable for an encyclopedia, and is not suitable for restoration. Acroterion (talk) 20:34, 22 November 2010 (UTC)


This user has made three edits, all reverted now as vandalism. I went to his talk page and saw only one automatic nasty-gram. I thought it best to mention this you. Paul, in Saudi (talk) 09:42, 23 November 2010 (UTC)

As vandals go, it's pretty pedestrian; the edit filter log shows no hits, so there's nothing much to do. Acroterion (talk) 21:14, 23 November 2010 (UTC)

Happy Thanksgiving!

The First Thanksgiving cph.3g04961.jpg
Neutralhomer wishes you a Happy Thanksgiving and hopes your day is full of good times, good food, good family, good football, a good parade and a good nap...then shopping tomorrow. :) Have a Great Day! :)

Spread the joy of Thanksgiving by adding {{subst:HappyThanksgiving}} to their talk page with a friendly message.


Hi Acroterion, I would just like to thank you and HJ Mitchel for taking a firm stance with all the Until sunrise crap. --Kudpung (talk) 03:48, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. It appears to be kids who think they've found a way to either make Wikipedia keep their article, or to scam the wiki. Either way, it won't work. Acroterion (talk) 03:50, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

Tanyon Helzer

Hello, I failed to put a deletion notice on the creator's talk. :( Cracked acorns (talk) 04:31, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

No problem, deleted again. Acroterion (talk) 04:34, 26 November 2010 (UTC)
Again? Oh, my. Thanks Cracked acorns (talk) 04:35, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

Exterminating Angel Press - HANG ON!

Exterminating Angel Press was nominated for speedy deletion, A7 - but it is a notable press.

EAP published works by Danbert Nobacon, formerly of the band Chambawamba. Also, the editor and founder TOD DAVIES is married to cult film director Alex Cox (Sid & Nancy, Repo Man), and he did the illustrations for the afore mentioned book.

I'm actually the intern at the press, and am supposed to get this article up but have encountered some troubles... is there any way to make the article better? Like more links? References, etc.?

Thank you! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Abclg (talkcontribs) 18:15, 27 November 2010 (UTC)

Can you describe, with reference to published sources, why the company is notable, rather than what it publishes? In other words, has Exterminating Angel Press received press, preferably two or three articles focusing on the company in national or major regional media? Also, bear in mind that you have a conflict of interest, and that you need to understand how that impacts your editing here. If you've been assigned to place this on Wikipedia, your supervisor needs to understand that you may not be able to fulfill the assignment, and that the company may not meet Wikipedia's guidelines for inclusion. Acroterion (talk) 19:17, 27 November 2010 (UTC)


Please see Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents#User: Thanks. Viriditas (talk) 12:33, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, we crossed in the mail. Acroterion (talk) 12:42, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

Architecture by year categories

Please see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2010 November 24; someone is opposing the existence of these categories. Nyttend (talk) 14:49, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

Do you mind?

I'm just trying to use wikipedia. You're making me feel unwelcome! Please! —Preceding unsigned comment added by ENMUFAA12 (talkcontribs) 14:54, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

You've been abusing multiple accounts for no obvious improvement to the encyclopedia. Every other account is blocked for social networking abuse. Shall I block this one? Acroterion (talk) 14:57, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

Um, I apologize, Mr. (or Miss) Acroterion. ps DO NOT BLOCK ARANDOM2010 she did not do ANYTHING. —Preceding unsigned comment added by ENMUFAA12 (talkcontribs) 22:48, 3 December 2010 (UTC) Good day. >:| —Preceding unsigned comment added by ENMUFAA12 (talkcontribs) 22:51, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

Both accounts now blocked as obvious sockpuppets. Acroterion (talk) 23:29, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

Gail Shelby

Why did you speeddeleted politician Gail Shelby. She was in 1991 a member of Oregon parliament. (talk) 21:09, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

The article made no mention of that office. Her name is Shibley, and Oregon has a legislature, not a parliament. Also, since the deleted article dwells on her gender orientation, I would expect to see multiple English-language sources instead of a single German source, and I would expect that any article would focus on her political work rather than her personal orientation. A state legislator would be considered notable, had the article mentioned that, but it was still inadequately sourced. Acroterion (talk) 21:32, 1 December 2010 (UTC)


  • Wow...amazing someone is that bored. If either of you want to, the FA on Elk was listed to be mainpaged on 12/5 but I asked for an extension and it is now set for the 14th...I've been busy checking the refs and those listed are all now accurate...I think it might still need some more refs and still needs a read over from multiple eyes...any suggestions for improvement are welcome.--MONGO 19:08, 4 December 2010 (UTC)
FYI again -- I mentioned you briefly at WP:ANI regarding this editor (and another with the same MO, that I believe is a different person). Antandrus (talk) 17:29, 5 December 2010 (UTC)
I'd think that they're different too: reverts are a low-effort form of harassment, although I don't think Mukesh and the others realize that they're similarly simple to correct. Acroterion (talk) 18:27, 5 December 2010 (UTC)


You recently deleted this page:

I have gotten permission to use the copyrighted content and I sent the email to the OTRS system and I'm waiting for response. Where do I go from here? I posted OTRS notice on my talk page. When they review it will the article be reinstated or when and will I have to redo it? Thanks, Trevorcool (talk) 21:59, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

You should get an OTRS ticket number by return email, which should be noted on the article talkpage. I'm not sure how much lag there might be - this time of year volunteers are somewhat scarce. Might I suggest that you simply use the copyrighted material as a reference and rewrite it as a summary? It's usually better to do that anyway, so it fits better into the encyclopedic style and allows for multiple references, which are a good thing in any case. Any bio should have enough references to establish notability - if you lean on one "official" source rather than documenting coverage through the press, you leave the article open to deletion for lack of asserted notability. Acroterion (talk) 22:11, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

architectural styles

Bundled palms and wreaths

When you get a chance, can you let me know the architectural styles (e.g., Colonial Revival) of the following:


Bms4880 (talk) 22:37, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

Done, as noted above. Remember that residential designs tend to be rather eclectic, and that there are very few pure, textbook examples of a given style. Acroterion (talk) 04:19, 7 December 2010 (UTC)
Well, the palm trees matched the large yacht anchored in the river at the bottom of the hill, 1,500 or so river miles and 9 dam locks from the ocean. Thanks for your help. I've categorized these. Bms4880 (talk) 15:03, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Computer prank

Apparently because of an edit conflict, you deleted Computer prank at exactly the same time that I tagged it for speedy deletion, so it now appears that I have recreated the article, with a speedy deletion tag. Can you go back and delete it again? WikiDan61ChatMe!ReadMe!! 17:09, 7 December 2010 (UTC)


I am notable, I have recieved critical acclaim for my work. Swimmerwinner72 (talk) 21:35, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Then you'll be able to produce references in major independent newspapers, preferably of national standing to back that up. See WP:BIO and WP:WEB for details on the specific guidelines. Acroterion (talk) 21:36, 7 December 2010 (UTC)
OK, you win. I have recieved acclaim from small sources. :) Swimmerwinner72 (talk) 21:39, 7 December 2010 (UTC)
Acclaim is good wherever it comes from, we just have to draw the line somewhere. There are plenty of other things that you can do here, so don't let that worry you. Acroterion (talk) 21:42, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Quik C

Why is this page getting deleted? This is about a real Hip-Hop Artist who has just broke ground with To The Fallen Records. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Quikc (talkcontribs) 21:40, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Have you read WP:BAND for the notability guidelines? The issue is notability, not existence, and the bar for musical notability is fairly high. Also, we strongly discourage people from writing about themselves. Acroterion (talk) 21:43, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

well since the artist has been featured in newspapers and also music charts does this not qualify? as well as Radio Play of his songs? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Quikc (talkcontribs) 21:47, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

"Has been placed in rotation nationally by any major radio network" and " has a single or album on any nation's national music chart." Reverbnation isn't a "national music chart." As for newspapers, please provide references. Notice should be on a national or at least regional, multi-state level, with a focus on the music, not arrests. Acroterion (talk) 21:53, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

the references are listed at the bottom... — Preceding unsigned comment added by Quikc (talkcontribs) 21:56, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

I just went back and looked - no references. I can put the last version in a sandbox in your userspace if you wish - minus the legal problems, which violate half-a-dozen policies here. Acroterion (talk) 21:59, 7 December 2010 (UTC)
i built my page around Eminems page(including legal problems... but the refrence is right here page 3 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Quikc (talkcontribs) 22:03, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

I saw that - a 2006 article in the garrison newspaper is far short of establishing notability. Eminem's problems are well-documented in the press and are part of his persona. In general, unsourced personal information is immediately removed on Wikipedia. I've placed the article into User:Quikc/sandbox for you to work on there. Please read the notability guidelines carefully, and understand that all biographical material must be referenced to reliable sources. Unreferenced biographies are deleted, and the requirements for musical notability are steep. Acroterion (talk) 22:09, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Message 1 from Neptunemusic

Yes it was 82, but for a VERY short time. Then, it was 84 until 86 was deleted.

Neptunemusic (talk) 23:55, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

Political interests against shell

What are your motives in attempting to "moderate" the Shell IP Discussion page? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Legal102 (talkcontribs) 04:20, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

Seems to be resolved at your talk page and the IP. Acroterion (talk) 04:58, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

Thank You

Thank you, yes, I understand after reviewing how wikipedia works. I also see that you were just doing your administrator duties. You have a great page going here. We have had problems on other sights involving interests, and negative writing, but I can see that is not the case here, I'm sure you understand :) Everything on this end is done in good intentions, as I'm sure yours is also. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 05:02, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

You're welcome, glad we got that cleared up. Please remember to add new comments at the bottom so we can find them. Acroterion (talk) 05:09, 8 December 2010 (UTC)
Will do. After reviewing Wikipedia (this is my first time on the sight) it seems like an excellent project. I may very well create an account! :) ( (talk) 05:22, 8 December 2010 (UTC))

Bernhard Frank

I am quite concerned about this page. There was an article about this in today's (Wednesday's) NY Times. It seems this is a 90-something man who was 'stung' by a fellow who claims the older man was a war criminal. The Times said the author might be looking to make a dollar. In any case, the page makes some huge claims and has few sources. At the least it needs a "Living Person" tag. Can you direct this page to the attention of someone who specializes in this sort of thing? Paul, in Saudi (talk) 15:54, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

The BLP noticeboard is the place to go. In the meantime, I've boldly cut out the "Gould's Investigation:" it's unreferenced and contained extensive unattributed quotes, which are absolutely not acceptable. Acroterion (talk) 16:24, 8 December 2010 (UTC)
See my discussion at WP:BLPN#Benhard Frank. Acroterion (talk) 16:45, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

The Bugle: Issue LVII, November 2010

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Umm hi

Hi even though I am new here, I saw this one account that was suspected as a sock puppet thing of UserXxAyaXx. I was wondering, How do you know? It must be magical! P.S. DONOT ban me for asking this question! I was just curious OK? — Preceding unsigned comment added by LalaOportrie (talkcontribs) 00:28, 10 December 2010 (UTC)

Because grown-ups have eyes in the backs of their heads and can tell when somebody is too young to be editing Wikipedia. Acroterion (talk) 01:14, 10 December 2010 (UTC)

Castles in France

Hi, can you transwiki the following lists:

Dr. Blofeld 12:59, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

All imported, moved to corresponding titles with redirects, but keeping "châteaux" since many aren't really castles per se. Acroterion (talk) 03:42, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

new article from me

i have just uploaded my own article and this was based on a case study of Cisco centralizes IT material given to us at jonkoping univerity, contact ulf larsson for details. if the need be. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Abraham08 (talkcontribs) 23:44, 12 December 2010 (UTC)


Hi --- I encourage you to take a look at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject National Register of Historic Places#just do it by bot now. Cheers--Pubdog (talk) 00:17, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Deletion of "Christopher T. York"

I previously had my article "Christopher T. York" deleted and was told that there was insufficient sourcing provided to prove his athletic prowess. I completely revised the page and used utterly valid sources which prove his athletic prowess on the national and international level; achievements which are more than notable on the world running scene. Can you please explain why this article was removed? Thank you for your time and consideration, Tarahumara13 (talk) 04:02, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

The article, though sourced, did not indicate that the person was notable. Simple participation in meets would not meet the notability guideline. It did not appear that the subject had actually won or placed in the upper levels of a major national or international event. Acroterion (talk) 04:13, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Unless you are a competitive distance runner it may be difficult to understand that his place of 37th at the World Mountain Running Championships and his scoring position on the 24th team (University of Richmond) in the nation are more than noteworthy. Does the word "notable" need to be included in the body of the article? Thank you for your time, Tarahumara13 (talk) 04:16, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Can you clarify how the person meets Wikipedia's definition of athletic notability as defined at WP:ATHLETE? --- Barek (talkcontribs) - 04:21, 13 December 2010 (UTC)
<edit conflict> As Barek says, please read WP:ATHLETE for detailed notability information. In general, one must finish at a high level in major competition to qualify for inclusion. Acroterion (talk) 04:23, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

sandbox01 for a future page

Hello, Sorry it's an error of my part. --Geneviève (talk) 02:34, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

Oupssss vous traduisez des pages du Wiki Francophone. Peut être parlez vous la langue française ? enchantée de vous connaître. Effectivement je suis nouvelle sur le Wiki anglophone. J'ai travaillée quelques articles en français (voir mon ancienne page d'utilisateur ). Cela me fera un plaisir de dialoguer et d'échanger avec vous. Amicalement --Geneviève (talk) 02:40, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

Replied at user's talkpage. Acroterion (talk) 02:53, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

Thank you Acroterion for your kindness. I am going to read all the texts for Beginner. Do you have many snow at your home. In Montréal today we had snow and rain. Amicalement enjoy --Geneviève (talk) 03:02, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Harry W. Child

Materialscientist (talk) 12:04, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

Concerning Got Slapz

Why did you delete GOT SLAPZ?

Can you please tell me why it was deleted? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wordwizard95112 (talkcontribs) 00:04, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

Musicians must assert and sustain notability. See WP:BAND.for inclusion guidelines. Acroterion (talk) 00:06, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

Yahweh Article

I've recently found an interest group takeover to the article Yahweh. I assume them to be militant atheists or biblical fringe-theory realists (people who believe in the Bible, but want to put into realist terms). Anyway, they hijacked the article for a good few days, I put up some tags and a mod restored it. However, they are camping the page and making snide comments, trying to force me into saying something that makes me look stupid. I'm used to dealing with these groups, but its a lot to handle. They're already starting to reshape the article back to their POV wonderland. One of them has several notations for edit warring at other Bible-related articles. Really don't want to invest too much time on this project. Think you can lend me a hand? It would take quite the burden off my chest. I really don't like to dabble in these religion articles, and it makes it all the worse that they're usually camped by easily upset peoples. I imagine that it will soon devolve into attacks on each other's grammar. I always love meaningful discussion!--IronMaidenRocks (talk) 06:49, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

I'll take a look, but it's not an area where I can claim a closely informed perspective. Acroterion (talk) 12:34, 15 December 2010 (UTC)
It seems to be going alright, there is a very moderate user who seems to be helping things along. However, one user, User:Dbachmann moved the article without consensus. Seems like a spited retaliation, considering that the article was being made neutral again. In any case, I think his action should be looked into. --IronMaidenRocks (talk) 02:56, 16 December 2010 (UTC)
I haven't looked into the matter - I have a rotten cold and spent most of the afternoon trying to get a little sleep, so I'm in no condition to do anything that requires careful consideration of a topic with which I am not familiar. Acroterion (talk) 03:28, 17 December 2010 (UTC)


"moose has cultural ascendency in Britain for Alces? Where did you get that from? DuncanHill (talk) 15:24, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

Don't misquote me: "moose has cultural currency ", which is not the same as ascendency. Do you seriously think that nobody in Europe has heard of "moose" as an alternate term for European elk? Acroterion (talk) 15:27, 15 December 2010 (UTC)
I'm sure many have - but almost no-one will have heard of elk being used for another animal entirely. DuncanHill (talk) 15:33, 15 December 2010 (UTC)
Likewise in North America. If they haven't read yesterday's TFA, there are very few people that know that the confusion exists. As I said, I understand the problem, but am reluctant to change the status quo. I have a mounted elk (C. canadensis) head in my firm's conference room (the gift of somebody who owed us money and compensated us with taxidermy). I regularly have to explain that it's not a really big deer (well, it is, but...), but an elk. It's messy, no matter where we are. I dislike naming based on cultural imperialism (in this case, of a North American sort), or where the majority of likely searches might originate, but am unconvinced of the need to change, especially given the prominent coverage in both elk and moose of the issue. I do think the issue is handled correctly for buffalo; "buffalo" and "bison" are used promiscuously and incorrectly in North America (and I believe elsewhere), and going to a disambiguation page is the right way to go, since "buffalo" is regarded as a colloquialism. That is not the case with "elk" or "moose." Acroterion (talk) 15:49, 15 December 2010 (UTC)
Moose is a red herring - everyone refers to the same animal when they say "moose". Elk is different - part of the Anglosphere intend Alces alces when they say (or type, or link to) elk, and part intnd Cervus canadensis when they say or do the same. If you can suggest a way to warn editors linking to elk that they may not mean to link to wapiti, then please do. Making elk a dab page makes it easier to check and correct links. Also, having the North American usage as the primary topic is cultural imperialism (just as having Alces there would be, but in the other direction). DuncanHill (talk) 16:10, 15 December 2010 (UTC)
I believe I was making the same argument re: North American cultural imperialism as you have done; that said, I lean to the status quo. Let's see what other editors have to say on the subject. Acroterion (talk) 16:20, 15 December 2010 (UTC)

Talk:Paris Métro Line 12/GA2

A GA review of Paris Métro Line 12 has been put on hold for seven days. Clean up and cite tags have been placed on the article to indicate where work needs to be done. SilkTork *YES! 02:17, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

PS. You probably haven't noticed, but your talkpage is currently rather long, making navigation difficult. I also sometimes don't notice how long my talkpage has got, so I have set myself a target of archiving monthly, and that seems to work quite well. SilkTork *YES! 02:17, 16 December 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Canyon Hotel

Materialscientist (talk) 00:02, 20 December 2010 (UTC)

Re: Unnecessary edits.

People like you are the reason I do not donate to Wikipedia. Please try to grow up, and join the real world. Also, since you seem to be such a stickler for specifics, the dates are now wrong in the article you just removed half of the content from. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 19:25, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Wikipedia isn't a log for your Zelda sightings, nor for your co-workers' reactions. If you can provide references in reliable sources for these observations, please do so. That's what "grown-up" encyclopedias expect. (I'm assuming that Zelda (turkey) is what you're talking about).Acroterion (talk) 20:05, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Might want to stuff a cork in him pre-emptively; you can see what he'll do if he has free reign, even on his talk age... HalfShadow 21:12, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Good point. Cork applied. Acroterion (talk) 21:14, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

The Belgium Fraggers'

Dear Acroterion,

Okay, at least you told me what was wrong...

I'll try again some time, when I have another topic I can occupy.

Best wishes,

RasmusBE — Preceding unsigned comment added by RasmusBE (talkcontribs) 22:15, 22 December 2010 (UTC)

Replied at user's talkpage. Acroterion (talk) 22:19, 22 December 2010 (UTC)

Haha, thank you.

But I'm not Belgium, just part of a Belgium gaming soceity. In fact I'm Estonian, so I'll perhaps start translation from English to Estonian and creating articles in Estonian first.

I'll make the article "The Belgium Fraggers" in Estionian xD. Ok, just kidding =) — Preceding unsigned comment added by RasmusBE (talkcontribs) 22:22, 22 December 2010 (UTC)

Robin big snake

Hello. I was doing some new page patrolling when I came over this article. I saw you deleted it as an attack page. Just letting you know that I found a source supporting the claim.--v/r - TP 03:19, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

Nevertheless, it violates BLP, BLP1E and general notability and has no business being here. Acroterion (talk) 03:21, 23 December 2010 (UTC)
WP:BLP does not prevent bad things being said about people in articles. As far as BLP1E and WP:N, I'm not a hockey fan so I'm not going to argue it.--v/r - TP 03:24, 23 December 2010 (UTC)
It prevents pointless cataloging of accusations and innuendo where there is no encyclopedic purpose, and demands a much higher level of supporting references. It's not OK to have defamatory junk articles that happen to be supported by a reference, and definitely not acceptable to have an article like that with no reference at all, whether a potential reference exists somewhere or not. Please read WP:BLP1E, which is the central issue. Acroterion (talk) 16:10, 23 December 2010 (UTC)


Dear Acroterion,

Sorry to trouble you again, with a question. I don't know any other Administrators, haven't talked to them. And the question doensn't go under your area of expertise, but:

The artticle called "List of Sovereign States" says, that there are a total sum of 203 countries (I didn't recount all of them). But you don't have to be an expert to see that there are 10 countries (under other states), who are not widely recognized. But under those 10 countries is missing I know - Western Sahara. When I edited it back in the summer 2010, it got reedited. I don't understand why?

Could you shine the light on that for me? I'd appreciate it. And hopefully then I don't have to bother you again for a long time.

I'll be looking forward to your answer.

Yours sincerely,


P.S: Merry Christmas and a happy year of 2011! — Preceding unsigned comment added by RasmusBE (talkcontribs) 10:26, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

You might want to ask Gadfium (talk · contribs), who reverted your change, but it appears to me that the Western Sahara is regarded as a disputed tract of land rather than a state or a potential state: it's claimed by Morocco and the Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic, as noted at List of states with limited recognition. The Western Sahara has always existed in a kind of limbo, and it appears that our coverage tries to deal with it: perhaps not ideally, but I see why it's structured the way it is. You can always bring it up on the talk page, since it might need to be clarified for easier comprehension. I suspect Gadfium reverted because a change to numbers with no edit summary to explain why the change was made looks like a random test edit: you would need to leave an edit summary that describes why you did it the way you did, and to be prepared to discuss it on the talk page.
By the way, you're not bothering me at all: feel free to ask any questions at any time: that's what I'm here for. Happy editing! Acroterion (talk) 16:59, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

Alex Jones

Please keep in mind that you reverted only two of my changes. Arthur Rubin reverted all of my additions, not just the things you changed. Therefore, your comment on vandalism does not encompass everything that was being discussed. The notable guests section, and the see also do not need citations. If you look at any other page with a see also section, no citations are present. None of the other entries in the "Notable Guests" section have citations. (talk) 18:01, 24 December 2010 (UTC)

I didn't revert or change anything on the page, and I am referring only to your comments on "vandalism" which are mistaken. Acroterion (talk) 18:17, 24 December 2010 (UTC)
Again, your comment does not encompass everything I was referring to when I was talking to that user. So I would appreciate it if you got your facts straight before lecturing me on what constitutes vandalism. (talk) 18:23, 24 December 2010 (UTC)
I understand what you were saying: however, you don't get to label a disagreement over content as "vandalism" and get a free pass to edit-war after applying that label. Discuss it on the talk page. Acroterion (talk) 18:41, 24 December 2010 (UTC)
But there was not any reason provided for some of the reverted edits. If I went around deleting sections of random wikipedia article because I did not like them, it would be considered vandalism. I told the guy to discuss it with me because I don't mind talking about how to improve the article. (talk) 18:47, 24 December 2010 (UTC)
I understand, and I understand that IPs sometimes get treated differently from other users: just keep away from the v-word unless somebody's been adding "poop" or whatever. It decreases your credibility to use it for a content issue or a simple revert. Acroterion (talk) 18:58, 24 December 2010 (UTC)


I know you are not the user who mentioned this, but do you mind explaining to me how one would go about citing a source for a POV tag? Someone removed my POV tag saying, "no sources have been cited to support it". How do you cite a source for that? (talk) 19:01, 24 December 2010 (UTC)

I'm not aware of a requirement to reference a tag: normally, one would tag the matter that concerns them and leave a moderately detailed rationale on the talkpage. Articles on radio hosts are often minefields of original research and synthesis, because everybody knows what they heard. It's often remarkably hard to find a neutrally-written reference for that kind of subject, particularly of the subject is a polarizing figure, so if you have some potential sources, by all means mention them on the talkpage. Acroterion (talk)
Would it be okay if you took a quick look at the edit history for the Alex Jones (radio host) article, and if you can figure out what User:Gwen_Gale means by "no sources have been cited to support it" let me know? Thanks. (talk) 19:17, 24 December 2010 (UTC)
I'd say in general that the lack of a ":criticism" section is not grounds for a POV tag: often, the existence of a criticism section yields a POV, or the article becomes a coatrack for the criticism, and ends up being tagged that way. I note that on the talk page GG removed a comment by you that amounted to innuendo; while I might not have done that myself, she's right that you can't make critical comments without backup, and that biography of living persons policy applies to all parts of the project. Note that BLP enforcement and interpretation has become much more aggressive in the past couple of years. I'll repeat what I said above: it's very hard to write and reference an article of this kind and keep it neutral. The Herbal Gerbil's comment on the talkpage sums it up well. You'll need to provide ironclad references from top-shelf publications: YouTube won't get any traction at WP> Acroterion (talk) 19:54, 24 December 2010 (UTC)
I did not mean to imply that I was going to use youtube as a source or that I was actually going to incorporate that specific scenario that I brought up on the talk page in the actual article. What I mentioned about the gun rights rally is something I mentioned just to demonstrate Alex Jones is a controversial figure. (talk) 20:12, 24 December 2010 (UTC)
The mention of YouTube is a red flag and something to stay away from; I don't think anybody disagrees that Jones is controversial. I'd search for discussions in major mainstream media: national newspapers, serious magazines, that sort of thing. Acroterion (talk) 20:54, 24 December 2010 (UTC)


How come you delete articles so fast.Are you a robot?Maybe I wasn't done finishing my article.I kinda agree with the unsigned comment made by tthe perso only identifiable as user 208.54.94 —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 04:52, 25 December 2010 (UTC)

We get hoax, madeup or wannabe gangs here all the time. We're not in the business of promoting criminal organizations. Sourced, verifiable content about significant organizations is required. Acroterion (talk) 05:05, 25 December 2010 (UTC)
Assuming you're Sculcrusha (talk · contribs), you have received advice from several editors which you've chosen to ignore. I've deleted your userpage, which was completely inappropriate. Please reconsider your approach to editing the encyclopedia. Wikipedia is not a directory of gangs, particularly fictional ones. Acroterion (talk) 05:34, 25 December 2010 (UTC)

Merry Christmas

Gerard van Honthorst 001.jpg
Neutralhomer wishes you a Merry Christmas and hopes your day is full of the true spirit of the day.
Plus, good food, good family and good times. :) Have a Great Day! :)

Spread the joy of Christmas by adding {{subst:User:Neutralhomer/MerryChristmas}} to their talk page with a friendly message.

Thanks, and Merry Christmas to you too! Acroterion (talk) 05:32, 25 December 2010 (UTC)

Why did you delete Irma Nici page?

She is a famous person with tons of NOPV sources about her.Just google her and you'll see.I was still working on the article that's why it was incomplete. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 15:24, 26 December 2010 (UTC)

She is also mentioned in 2 other wiki articles including David Beckham' s page.So why not make an article about her for the people who are interested? —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 15:49, 26 December 2010 (UTC)

Please read and understand WP:BLP and WP:BLP1E. The article you wrote was unsourced and defamatory to Beckham; the reference in the Beckham article makes it clear that Beckham thinks so too. Nici appears to be solely notable for the alleged relationship with Beckham, which is insufficient for inclusion. The article fails BLP, BLP1E and general notability. Acroterion (talk) 17:11, 26 December 2010 (UTC)t

OK,but then why a Rebecca Loos article?She became famous because of the same reason... —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 20:24, 26 December 2010 (UTC)

She appears to have had a TV career and it is clear that she's notable. The article is profusely referenced, and I note that there is no lawsuit concerning the allegations re: Beckham, as there is with Nici. In general, arguments that we should include so-and-so because something else is included are rejected; all articles must stand on their individual merits, and must not violate BLP. Acroterion (talk) 20:37, 26 December 2010 (UTC)


I was in the process of creating a page for an independent movie production company. When I attempted to save the page, it said that it was deleted to an infringement violation. Is there something I need to do first before I can post this information?

Thanks. PJS5604 (talk) 04:29, 28 December 2010 (UTC)

The account was blocked because it violated username policy, as it represented a group or organization rather than an individual and was engaged in promotion of that organization. The article and userpage were deleted because they were overtly promotional and inappropriate for an encyclopedia. It was clear from the content that the company is seeking publicity and has not yet achieved sufficient notability for inclusion on Wikipedia. You appear to have a conflict of interest in this matter. You are welcome to contribute to Wikipedia, but should avoid editing on topics concerning yourself or your business. There are links in the block notice to detailed Wikipedia policies concerning COI and promotion. Please also read the notability guidelines: Wikipedia documents pre-existing notability and is not to be used to generate publicity or as part of a social media campaign. Acroterion (talk) 04:36, 28 December 2010 (UTC)


Hi there,

It's disappointing that I cannot create a page about my favourite band without it being deleted before I've finished. How do you know what's notable in the UK?


Todd — Preceding unsigned comment added by Toddst1again (talkcontribs) 01:43, 29 December 2010 (UTC)

I don't, I go by the notability guidelines for bands, found at WP:BAND and what you tell us. "Underground bands" that release free music and go by word of mouth are pretty clearly not notable according to those guidelines. By the way, Toddst1 deleted the first version of the article in August, when I assume you were Balfont (talk · contribs). You can't use a rephrasing of his name, sorry to say. I'll have to block this account: in the meantime, you will need to read and understand the notability guidelines. Acroterion (talk) 02:39, 29 December 2010 (UTC)

PR & images Galaxy opal

Please accept my apologies, this is my first time posting anything, I'm a NEWBie and not techno savvy much. 'Galaxy' is noteworthy as The World's Largest Polished Opal by Guinness Book of Records. It is extremely thick and double-side, VERY Rare! It is also Very Beautiful, hence wanted pictures, gave them credit and copyright sign. The last one, I had shot last month by Deb Welsh, the other two were done 20 years ago for us and have been published b4, I gave those references but they also were deleted along with 3 pictures. A picture is worth a thousand words.

I also added a link to Piaui, Boi Morto mine in Brazil but was deleted.

please explain what is promotional vs informational? my name, availability or a price where NOT mentioned.

Yes, I want the world to know about 'Galaxy' It's SPECIAL.

not sure how this works, just found this service today 12/29/10 might not find it again for another month.

better Steve <email redacted> 415.647.1860 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Steven Sodokoff (talkcontribs) 00:08, 30 December 2010 (UTC)

You need to be very careful to avoid even a hint of promotion: peacock terms, superlatives (apart from the obvious fact of "largest") and such are inappropriate for an encyclopedia. We're looking for plain, factual language that describes the subject as neutrally as possible. You'll need to step back and consider what that constitutes, and whether your enthusiasm tinges your prose. Images are welcome, provided you have clear ownership and are willing to release the image for any purpose at all. You lose all control when you publish an image here, so you should be very sure you want to allow any and all use, even commercial use. Acroterion (talk) 03:11, 30 December 2010 (UTC)

architects help

thanks for helping! i hit an edit conflict, and put in my version losing a few of ur edits, which i'll be happy to restore later. i'm done, not doing any more for a while, to avoid e.c.'s. maybe inserting some section breaks would be good? i won't myself. thanks! --Doncram (talk) 02:22, 30 December 2010 (UTC)

Give me a few minutes, I'm picking low-hanging fruit and will put in some sections. Acroterion (talk) 02:24, 30 December 2010 (UTC)
I've done the ones I know by sight - you have to watch out for changing partnerships and multi-generational firms. I'll do a few more as time permits. Acroterion (talk) 03:05, 30 December 2010 (UTC)

please reconsider bthebusinessnetwork


Please take another look at the site bthebusinessnetwork, It has the potential to do a lot of good things for a struggling economy.


Mitchell Everts <email redacted> — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mitch39everts (talkcontribs) 07:17, 30 December 2010 (UTC)

Please review WP:WEB, which describes Wikipedia's inclusion guidelines for web content. All articles must credibly assert notability through reference to significant coverage in major third-party media. Wikipedia is a means of documenting pre-existing notability, not a means for gaining notice. New accounts solely devoted to promoting such an entry, such as Neolava2191 (talk · contribs) are a remarkably bad idea. Acroterion (talk) 12:27, 30 December 2010 (UTC)


Thank you for jumping in and trying to explain the situation to OWAtech (talk · contribs). Ultimately, I wound up blocking the account for legal threats. I don't think there's anything I need to follow up with from his requests at the top of the talk page, but if you think I need to follow any of this up in-house anywhere, let me know. —C.Fred (talk) 05:56, 31 December 2010 (UTC)

It was clear that the OP had no clue about copyrights of any kind, much less free content, and that we could not in good conscience accept any assurance that that particular person (for their own sake and their company's sake) might give concerning the status of the material. Given the follow-up demand, which displays a complete lack of understanding of any kind of trademark or fair use doctrine, I suspect the company's counsel and PR people will be explaining a few things to the OP next week. That's what happens when IT people try to do PR. I don't see any in-house issues, and it's a pretty straightforward thing for OTRS to deal with if they are contacted. Acroterion (talk) 14:38, 31 December 2010 (UTC)