User talk:Angr/Archive 40

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Deletion review for Image:Cardassian Dreadnought.jpg

An editor has asked for a deletion review of Image:Cardassian Dreadnought.jpg. Since you closed the deletion discussion for this article, speedy-deleted it, or were otherwise interested in the article, you might want to participate in the deletion review. — OranL (talk) 18:28, 30 July 2008 (UTC)

WithdrawnOranL (talk) 16:50, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Just a question

Since I've promised not to meddle, among other things for lack of specialist knowledge, why haven't you simply corrected the article Quirky subject yourself? With a, perhaps, annoying presence (me) out of the way, and specialists surely watching, the article is yours to edit and be corrected by specialists. The article doesn't deserve to be left hanging with citation needed and all that stuff. Why don't you shorten it as you know best, and others will fill in? All the best, Angr (have you decided which OI meaning fits you the best?) and cheerio Io (talk) 17:41, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

I've been busy with other things, especially at Wikisource. I'll get to it! —Angr 18:23, 31 July 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for the answer. But you didn't answer another question: Which Old Icelandic (or Modern Icelandic) name fits you best? There are more of those: Munnangur means a sore in the mouth and sálarangur means, regrettably, soul anguish. So, which one are you? :-) Cheers Io (talk) 19:36, 31 July 2008 (UTC)
None of the above! My user name is derived from my real name and has nothing to do with "anger" or "ang(u)r". —Angr 20:26, 31 July 2008 (UTC)
Pity. There are tons of words you might choose from, not all negative. In any case, I was just joking, no offense meant. Cheers Io (talk) 20:48, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

Image:Cardassian Dreadnought.jpg

Hey, sorry about the deletion review. I didn't mean to offend you or anything, and I apologize if I did. Can you please take a look at this image and undelete it if you agree that it would benefit the Cardassian starships article as long as a valid fair-use rationale was added to the image? Thank you! — OranL (talk) 16:50, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Done. I've updated the "No rationale" tag to today so you have a week to add one. —Angr 18:34, 1 August 2008 (UTC)
Thank you! I've added the appropriate fair-use rationale to the image. Please let me know if anything is still wrong with it. — OranL (talk) 18:55, 1 August 2008 (UTC)


Dia dhuit, tá ceist agam mar gheall air seo [1] agus b'fhéidir gurbh cheart dom WP:UE a chuimhnigh. :) While I understand your reasoning, I would be hesitant to label it "blatant advertising". No specific CD is mentioned in the edit and no link to buying any such CD is given. As an active Irish speaker myself, I know that these CDs have given the language a lot of goodwill when famous artists usually singing in English have recorded songs in Irish. In short, I think the CDs merit a mentioning in the article. JdeJ (talk) 19:32, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

The external link I removed is a link for a specific CD that says "In shops now! Or available on line at..." at provides a link where the CD can be bought. That external link is definitely inappropriate. The section of text might not be blatant advertising, but it's difficult to see what it's doing there other than encouraging the reader to listen to the CD. It's certainly not providing any information about the language itself. —Angr 09:44, 2 August 2008 (UTC)


Greetings! Message for you on wicitestun. Lloffiwr (talk) 20:08, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Homeschooling in Germany

I noticed that you have removed the link to the site twice now. I only tried to add this to provide a more balanced point of view to the article on Homeschooling in Germany which says that this is illegal. Technically the German government is able to recognise in law, home education, but it is reticent to. This stance contravenes several International Charters and Agreements. Did I do something wrong in the edit process or do you object to the site? Kinderlehrer (talk) 00:22, 2 August 2008 (UTC)

The site is a blog or forum, and a non-neutral one at that. I don't think it satisfies the conditions at WP:EL for external links. It is not Wikipedia's place to advocate for legalization of homeschooling in Germany, either directly or through the links provided on the page. —Angr 09:39, 2 August 2008 (UTC)

Irish digraphs

Hi Angr,

In Irish orthography, which sequences in the vowel chart do you believe count as digraphs/tetragraphs etc., and which are just for clarification? I'm trying to get our account straight. kwami (talk) 09:12, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

Well, it's a little hard to say in some cases. "bh" by itself is already a digraph, but then "abh", "abha", "abhai", "eabh", "eabha", and "eabhai" can all stand for the single diphthong /au ~ əu/ (and the monophthong /o:/ in Donegal), suggesting that they too are trigraphs/tetragraphs/pentagraphs/hexagraphs. —Angr 11:53, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
Thanks! kwami (talk) 11:56, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
But wouldn't the e and i of eabhai indicate palatalization of the consonant rather than the vowel /o:/? kwami (talk) 11:58, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
Yes, but they could be considered as being part of the complex grapheme representing /o:/ between two palatalized consonants:
   < l  eabhai r  >
   / l′ o:     r′ / (Donegal)
   / l′ əu     r′ / (elsewhere)
Alternatively, they could be considered "silent letters" serving a diacritic function. For that matter, "h" could be considered to serve a diacritic function in the digraphs "bh, ch, dh, fh, gh, mh, ph, sh, th", and indeed in Gaelic script a diacritic mark is used instead of an "h". Whether you want to consider the "eabhai" of leabhair a hexagraph or the trigraph "abh" preceded by one and followed by two silent letters depends a lot on how you want to define the term "digraph" and its numerical followers. —Angr 12:08, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
Thanks. Is adh a monophthong in Donegal as abh is? kwami (talk) 21:33, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
Yes, it's /e:/. —Angr 21:45, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
Thanks. Is there no eagh(a(i)) in Irish orthography? Everywhere else dh and gh appear symmetrical. kwami (talk) 00:11, 15 August 2008 (UTC)
Well, when I was making up the original version of that page (long before Wikipedia!) I couldn't find any words with that sequence, but now that I have a searchable electronic Irish dictionary, I find there are a few words with it, so I guess it needs to be added. —Angr 04:32, 15 August 2008 (UTC)

Dew-new merger

After encountering a broken redirect in the article Phonological history of English vowels (dew-new merger), I noticed in the edit history for Phonological history of English high back vowels that you rewrote this part of the article and by doing so the rewrite seems to have downplayed the importance of the merger. The rewrite has also changed the title of the section, thereby breaking the link so the redirect no longer works. It may be appropriate to review the wording of the latter page so as to be more consistent with the page you edited. Thanks -- B.D.Mills  (T, C) 00:39, 11 August 2008 (UTC)

Data for good page

What material do you feel needs to be added to Luba-Katanga language for it to be an acceptable page? RJFJR (talk) 19:12, 14 August 2008 (UTC)

Take a look at Wikipedia:WikiProject Languages/Template. —Angr 20:20, 14 August 2008 (UTC)

Misspellings of proper names of 2008 Olympic Venues

Hi, Sorry to bug you again about a spelling issue, but there's a bit of a problem with names associated with the 2008 Olympics. A couple of orthographically anti-American Wikipedians (above all Bleedingshoes), as well as a few other relatively innocent Wikipedians who don't understand WP:ENGVAR have made a number of unfortunate changes to pages connected with the 2008 Olympics which I can't undo. Basically, everything listed at /Category:Venues_of_the_2008_Summer_Olympics/ ([2]) with a non-American spelling (like "Centre") is incorrect. One exception: Qingdao International Sailing Centre, which (at least for now) is indeed spelled with "Centre". These are proper names, and the proper names are spelled with the non-British spelling.

One could of course argue that the proper name is in Chinese, not English, and that the silly Chinese transliterated their own names incorrectly, and Wikipedia should "correct" the ignorant U.S.-loving/British-hating Chinese, but that would be a stretch. Could you rearrange the redirects so that the correct spelling for these pages (except Qingdao) is the primary page? (Or give me temporary authority to do it, if that's easier, and possible.)

Thanks, SW

P.S. See [3] for verification.

P.P.S. There are some others listed here: /Category:People's_Republic_of_China_sports_venue_stubs/ ([4]). I'll go through those this weekend and verify which spellings are incorrect.

P.P.P.S Sorry, I don't know how to link to Categories without using the full URL!

Ack, I don't have time to do this now, but I'll see what I can do later. To link to categories, just put a colon before the word category, thus: [[:Category:People's Republic of China sports venue stubs]]. —Angr 11:20, 15 August 2008 (UTC)
OK, Thanks! (It can wait a few days.) Samuel Webster (talk) 11:38, 15 August 2008 (UTC)
Hang on, I see that I am able to move quite a few them. I'll get to this tonight (Europe Time), or during my next break, and then report back with a list of those that can't be changed. Thanks again, and sorry for the hassle. Samuel Webster (talk) 11:50, 15 August 2008 (UTC)

Hi, sorry for the delay. An "incident" developed which seems to be resolved now (see Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/IncidentArchive467). The two proper names that I can't change are:

Olympic Sports Centre Gymnasium


Olympic Sports Centre Gymnasium

They should be spelled with "Center".

Thanks for your help! Samuel Webster (talk) 17:54, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

Pardon my sleep-deprived incoherence... (naming "two" things that need to be moved that are the same)... :)
The only one left is: Olympic Sports Centre, which should be moved to "... Center".
Samuel Webster (talk) 17:09, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

Reversion on Celtic Nations

I have commented on the Celtic Nations page, but have not reversed your revert. However, am considering readding info but removing some of the "unsourceable" comments. ♦Drachenfyre♦·Talk 12:41, 17 August 2008 (UTC)


You beat by a few seconds. Thanks. Flamarande (talk) 18:45, 17 August 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the read

I just wanted to say that I enjoyed reading your user page (I spotted you on the Vegetarianism talk page). I'm a vegetarian as well. I'm not a vegan, and still eat cheese and icecream, so don't shun me, LOL. But I understand your pain and frustration about what strict vegetarians such as yourself go through. Vegans have it tougher, I don't doubt, but we less-strict vegetarians have it tough as well. My family (though I explained to them that my choosing to be a vegetarian all those years ago was more out of curiosity and wanting to see how healthy it would be, and that it just stuck) still does not get my not eating meat, and sometimes even tries to offer me fish just because some vegetarians (better known as pescetarians) eat fish (well, that...and because when I started a vegetarian diet, I used to eat fish; I was 12, and was told fish is not meat). Thanksgivings are hard, I tell ya (all that repeating that meat is not for you, LOL).

Anyway, I'll see you around. Flyer22 (talk) 22:30, 22 August 2008 (UTC)

Hi, I'm not a vegan or even a particularly strict vegetarian. I try to avoid meat if I can but if I'm with people who are going to KFC or McDonald's to eat, I'll eat meat too. The story on my user page is just using veganism as a metaphor for my frustration with the use of non-free material in this supposedly free content encyclopedia. —Angr 16:28, 24 August 2008 (UTC)
LOL. After I wrote that, I figured, "What if there is a chance this person is not a vegan/vegetarian?" Either way, thanks for the read. I loved it. Flyer22 (talk) 03:29, 25 August 2008 (UTC)
And, oh, I caught the metaphor (your links, of course). I just figured it was a clever way for a vegan/vegetarian to link the problems that arise with being a vegan/vegetarian to problems some may have with Wikipedia. Flyer22 (talk) 03:32, 25 August 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for defending me on the SAE talk page

I don't know where else I could possibly go to ask the questions I have. I think the talk page is a great place to discuss things that could possibly be mentioned in the article, provided that someone can find a reliable source for that material. If you can't talk about the things I like to use the talk pages for, then they're really no fun at all. Thegryseone (talk) 17:39, 27 August 2008 (UTC)

Removal of table on PIE article

This annoyed me quite a bit. It's completely counter-productive to just remove another users additions unless it's vandalism. The table is clearly relevant to the article but maybe you think it's not in the right section, at least discuss it first. No one has the sole right to act as arbitrator. ( (talk) 11:59, 29 August 2008 (UTC))

No, but part of consensus-finding is dealing with the fact that some of your additions are going to be removed by people who consider them to be out of place. The table is not relevant to the article as it doesn't show us anything at all about PIE. It doesn't even include a column for the reconstructed PIE forms of the verb; and if it had, it still would have been out of place as there is a separate article on the Proto-Indo-European verb. Random bits of unconnected information do not improve encyclopedia articles. —Angr 13:23, 29 August 2008 (UTC)
I didn't realise there was a seperate article for Indo-European languages, where the table would be better placed. I've moved it there for now, but I expect it will get deleted by people who feel like they have ownership of an article as usual. ( (talk) 11:05, 30 August 2008 (UTC))
It would have a better chance of survival if you added a paragraph or two of prose explaining the relevance. Just slapping up a chart of some languages' conjugations of the word "to carry" without any explanation of its significance isn't really a helpful addition. —Angr 12:49, 30 August 2008 (UTC)

Indo-European languages

(Moved to Talk:Indo-European languages#Conjugation comparison).