User talk:Baseball Bugs/Archive017

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JUL 2013 - DEC 2013


Pending evil Carolinity Or is that Caroline evil?

If you do actually have the source you mentioned, I would like to read it. I would like to suggest those interested take the right direction. μηδείς (talk) 03:59, 1 July 2013 (UTC)

It looks like they are not, in fact, going to tax groceries. You can go to and get the lowdown on the whole thing. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 20:55, 1 July 2013 (UTC)


I don't know whether you have already seen my original answer to your message on my talk page, but if you have you may like to look again, as I have posted an update. JamesBWatson (talk) 12:50, 4 July 2013 (UTC)

Baseball Manager

I just wanted to make Baseball Bugs aware of Baseball Manager. Bus stop (talk) 16:19, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

The look of helplessness on that manager's face befits the current Marlins situation. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 10:21, 11 July 2013 (UTC)

Soapboxing on Talk:Edward Snowden

Sorry, Bugs, but I think you've abused WP:NOTFORUM far too much on Talk:Edward Snowden - we have policies regarding what is appropriate talk page usage for a reason, and I don't see why you should be considered immune just because you have strong opinions on Snowdon. Consider this a friendly warning - or an unfriendly one - if you carry on as you are, I'm liable to raise this at ANI. I don't like having to say this, but you are setting an abysmally-poor example, and you surely know better by now. AndyTheGrump (talk) 13:56, 12 July 2013 (UTC)

Your complaint has been noted and logged. Meanwhile, how about you turn your unbiased eye on the folks on the talk-page who want to hero-worship that guy. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 15:11, 12 July 2013 (UTC)
I'n not interested in a debate about what others are doing - you have been here a long time, and should know better. AndyTheGrump (talk) 16:05, 12 July 2013 (UTC)
You, who were blocked more recently than I, are in no position to be lecturing others about policies and rules. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 18:15, 12 July 2013 (UTC)

ANI (though not to worry)

I mentioned your name here at AN/I in a thread about User:Capt S D Wong. Chris857 (talk) 01:00, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

"Oldies but baddies." ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 15:29, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

Rand Paul

Re this discussion, I'm not sure how you can call Rand Paul a "true libertarian" given his stance on abortion. (P.S. Can we please try to keep this sort of clutter off the talk page?) --Dr. Fleischman (talk) 22:23, 18 July 2013 (UTC)

I will if you will. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 22:29, 18 July 2013 (UTC)
Ok. It's a deal. :) --Dr. Fleischman (talk) 23:52, 18 July 2013 (UTC)
You broke your promise. I'm debating whether to raise this at ANI. What do you think? --Dr. Fleischman (talk) 18:28, 22 July 2013 (UTC)
You lost me at the bakery. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 20:08, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

self defense

Totally anecdotal, but I heard some pundit say that self-defense as defined under the stand-your-ground law did not at all take into account anything such as the "defender's" prior provocative actions. Hence the stalk-provoke part of the stalk-provoke-kill sequence would have been blocked by the defense team as irrelevant under that law. I have no idea if that's actually the case. Isn't it comforting to know Z is perhaps back on the streets tonight, looking for more aholes to make sure they don't effing get away with it? μηδείς (talk) 01:43, 20 July 2013 (UTC)

You misspelled "asshole". I can't begin to emphasise enough the importance of using good proper form and grammar. SlightSmile 00:53, 21 July 2013 (UTC)
No, it's sanitized for TV. :) I see where Zim helped rescue somebody last week. He should take that up as a career, and maybe in a few decades he'll have somewhat redeemed himself. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:39, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Beyond disagreement

My post stated the opposite of your assertion. Maybe Wikipedia is ridiculed because positions are mischaracterized and molehills are presented as mountains. Tiderolls 17:43, 21 July 2013 (UTC)

I should post the article I saw that gives the top 10 battleground topics on Wikipedia. Hint: Snowden and Rand Paul are not on the list. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 20:10, 22 July 2013 (UTC)
Here it is.[1]Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:36, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

Edward Snowden

Pot, kettle, black --NeilN talk to me 20:14, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

You're funny. That one user griped about my editorializing in response to the OP's editorializing, while leaving the OP's editorializing unchallenged. Too many hero-worshippers on that talk page. They need a broader perspective. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 21:03, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

No need to feign surprise

Information icon Hello. There is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you.

Here's a direct link for your convenience. --Dr. Fleischman (talk) 07:41, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Show my support

After that ridiculous affair at AN/I I wanted to let you know I support you and I agree wholeheartedly that Snowden is not a hero and that I find it is a shame that Jimbo seems to be one of the "hero-worshippers".Camelbinky (talk) 23:24, 26 July 2013 (UTC)

+1. This place is going down the shitter pretty goddamn fast. What's her name (You mean Sue Gardner right? MM (Report findings) (Past espionage) 10:15, 2 August 2013 (UTC)) started the major politicization of Wikipedia with that bullshit blackout. Toddst1 (talk) 15:45, 28 July 2013 (UTC)
Todd, that's not moral clarity anymore; now you're just being a right-wing activist. (At some point you moral conservatives will have to learn that you're a liberal the moment you start believing in educating the masses--and you're helping our cause by virtue of being here.) And don't you know that I'm the only one allowed to post on this talk page? Want me to talk to a real admin and get your ass blocked? Ha! Drmies (talk) 22:19, 28 July 2013 (UTC)
8) Toddst1 (talk) 16:08, 29 July 2013 (UTC)
Thank you. I'm just waiting to see what happens if Russia decides to ship him back home. Think it's POV-pushing on that article talk page now? The fur could fly. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 01:31, 27 July 2013 (UTC)

To be quite honest I find Want me to talk to a real admin and get your ass blocked? Ha! to be verging on a personal attack. Besides, aren't we all supposed to be neutral and leave our political views at the entrance to the wiki? MM (Report findings) (Past espionage) 10:15, 2 August 2013 (UTC)

A cheeseburger for you!

Cheeseburger.png Here's a good old American cheeseburger to liven up your talk page a bit. Note the slice of (processed) American cheese, one of many pleasures your man Snowden will have to forego for the while. Drmies (talk) 03:36, 28 July 2013 (UTC)
I shudder to think what Russian hamburgers are like - especially in an airport. Can you imagine going more than a month without a shower or a change of clothes? And I'm sure the borscht is good there, but it would get kind of tedious three times a day. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 06:37, 28 July 2013 (UTC)
Brrr. Hey! I just noticed that I'm the only one allowed to post here! Thanks, Bugs! Drmies (talk) 14:39, 28 July 2013 (UTC)

A challenger appears

Just letting you know I mentioned you in passing at AN/I based on my memory of some amusing trolls in the past. - The Bushranger One ping only 00:31, 1 August 2013 (UTC)


Who's LC? μηδείς (talk) 23:44, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

A banned UK-based user named "Light current". Animal sexuality was one of his obsessions. This one brought it to mind, but it's not really the same M.O. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 00:05, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
Thanks. We should have a list of prominent Wikipedia sockmasters. μηδείς (talk) 00:23, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

translation request

Cookatoo seems to be saying that as someone who's dying, Bono is posting odd requests for comment. I'd rather Cookatoo speak for himself, given the nasty implications of my interpretation. The Latin is easily goolable: don't say ill of the dead. Cookatoo uses the term as if it means don't speak ill of the dying. μηδείς (talk) 21:28, 17 August 2013 (UTC)

Uncalled for

This comment was completely uncalled for. I make one comment and suddenly I'm abusing Wikipedia? I think you should step back and cool off for a bit. --Chris 15:07, 22 August 2013 (UTC)

Everyone who supports moving the page to "Chelsea" is abusing wikipedia. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 17:28, 22 August 2013 (UTC)
I'd be inclined to disagree. I'm aware you may have strong views on this, Bugs, but that discussion is beginning to look like you're leaping on everyone who has a different opinion to you and shrieking "How dare they! How dare they not understand!"
The Trans Media Watch style guide suggests to "Avoid using pronouns and gendered descriptors that conflict with an individual’s personal experience of their gender identity.", and "In accordance with the Gender Recognition Act, avoid revealing the previous names or identity (i.e. photographs) of transsexual persons - except where their explicit permission is given."[1]. I understand that this might be difficult in the case of a high profile individual such as Manning, but the essence of what you're saying is that a person is not considered to have an opinion on their own gender identity - that duty must be up to Wikipedia editors.

I'm not saying that's the only side of the coin, but making statements saying "Everyone who has the opposing view to me is abusing Wikipedia" is a far cry from reasoned debate, and is offensive to those with different view points. Have some bubble tea and chill out.


Horatio Snickers (talk) 19:19, 22 August 2013 (UTC)


Please avoid purposefully contentious discussion such as the comment at the end of this section and the one after it, and discuss the article in a civilized way. This should serve as a second warning. Shii (tock) 22:24, 22 August 2013 (UTC)

Who the hell are you to be issuing me warnings? Tell the POV-pushers on that page to revert the page back to its proper title, then get back to me. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 22:28, 22 August 2013 (UTC)

Look, insults are not helping anyone. Slow down and try to put yourself in the liberal shoes (it may be tough, but that's how Wikipedia's consensus process works). If you can't contribute civilly, I may have to block you for an hour or so, to force you to step away from the keyboard. Shii (tock) 22:50, 22 August 2013 (UTC)

A beer

Export hell seidel steiner.png A beer on me!
Take a sip, dude. I fully agree with you, but getting blocked over this Bradley/Chelsea thing would be silly. Take a breather, have a beer. Cheers, and regards from (the apparently blathering and transphobic) Yintan  23:41, 22 August 2013 (UTC)
I've just about had it with Wikipedia. My own wife laughs every time I cite Wikipedia as a source of facts. I think she's on to something there. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:43, 22 August 2013 (UTC)
Yep, I know the feeling. Which is why it's beer time. Yintan  23:48, 22 August 2013 (UTC)
I'm pretty much a non-drinker, so let's make it an A&W Root Beer. :) P.S. Thank you for your support. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:54, 22 August 2013 (UTC)
[walks to the bar to change the order]
And thank you, too. Yintan  00:06, 23 August 2013 (UTC)


I'm no fan of Manning's, personally, but reading through the mess that is Talk:Chelsea Manning, your comment here stood out. Contentious as the issue may be, no person deserves to be dehumanized by being called "it." Please, reconsider your words. --Fran Rogers (talk) 01:11, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

Echoing what people have told you in the past, please remember that WP:BLP applies to all articles about living people. Failure to follow it on Talk:Chelsea Manning will result in your blocking --Guerillero | My Talk 01:47, 23 August 2013 (UTC)
There is no BLP issue. The promoters of this nonsense are abusing Wikipedia. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:07, 23 August 2013 (UTC)
I have proposed topic banning you from the article here --Guerillero | My Talk 04:11, 23 August 2013 (UTC)
You all have already hijacked the page, and your next logical step is to stifle anything resembling dissent. Way to go. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 04:33, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

Illegitmi non carburndum

or something to that effect. Toddst1 (talk) 05:28, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

Yup. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 06:30, 23 August 2013 (UTC)
Illegitimi non carborundum -- Deborahjay (talk) 09:11, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

Aversion vs. fear

Greetings, Bugs! Twice in responding to the Phobias... query on the Humanities Ref desk, you broadly associated "aversion" with "fear." Please take a look at what I consider a useful grouping of synonyms per the MS Encarta Dictionary's thesaurus:

  • aversion: dislike, hatred, loathing, repugnance, distaste, hate, antipathy, abhorrence, detestation, repulsion, disgust
  • fear: terror, dread, anxiety, horror, distress, fright, panic, alarm, trepidation, apprehension. Also: worry, anxiety, terror, nightmare, phobia, concern

As you see, there's no overlap between them, so I see this as worth consideration. In the ways "homophobia" and "Islamophobia" do or don't involve fear and hatred, I'd contend that the spectrum of {aversion > fear} varies directly with the degree of actual violence in the outsider group's activism (or militancy), plus (as I wrote in my response) perceived threat to the in-group's way of life. My professional field is Holocaust documentation, so I'm familiar with the historical components of antisemitism and how it was promoted. Goebbels took great advantage of the newly introduced channels of mass media in his day. Now consider the exponential developments in media distribution and sources of content from then till today, which I humbly suggest also includes what we're doing on the WP Ref desks. Anyway, I thought this was too extensive to post on the desk but am glad to share it with you here. Cheers, Deborahjay (talk) 08:56, 23 August 2013 (UTC)


I just want to tell you're right, but you're unlikely to prevail. --Niemti (talk) 12:26, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

Tone it down, please

You have engaged in some rhetorical excess. I think this is making it substantially less likely that you will achieve what you want, and some editors have (with good reaosn) found several of your comments to be gratuitously offensive. Please tone it down. Remember, for trans people this is not a trivial issue and it will have direct relevance to reala nd painful experiences in their own lives. There's no need to allow changes that break policy due to political correctness, but please show some class. Guy (Help!) 13:23, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

Hey Rabbit

If I may weigh in. A traitor who doesn't want his - okay keep it nice, wants a sexual re-assignment. Sounds like a really good topic to walk away from. A glass of beer might not be such a bad idea. SlightSmile 13:41, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

Manning reference that said Wikipedia is "ahead of the major news organizations". That, just by itself, demonstrates that Wikipedia has violated its own rules.'

Well said on many points. WP has been falling over itself to be liberal in its gender politics, to the extent that it has lost sight of the need for a basis on reliable sources, not the transitory. Andy Dingley (talk) 19:36, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

Thank you. What the advocates don't realize is that I am generally sympathetic to the cause. But Wikipedia is not supposed to be the vehicle for that cause. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 20:53, 23 August 2013 (UTC)


Looney tunes careta.png
  • Bugs: "Wales supports this rename, using arguments that violate Wikipedia's policies...."
  • Fudd: "Bugs, it's impossible to violate Wikipedia's policies, because one of them is Wikipedia:Ignore all rules."
  • Blanc: "Guys, I support amending the IAR policy so that it can only be done by listing the incident at a central location together with a justification, upon request by any other editor. And their justification better be pretty damned good."
  • Daffy: "Blanc, who the heck would enforce that? ArbCom? You've got to be kidding."
  • Porky: "Daffy, Blanc's idea is good, but you raise a valid point. Way too much power is concentrated in ArbCom. Wikipedia needs to employ a jury-like system in which a random set of ordinary editors are invited to decide each case, or at least to do the fact-finding."
  • Sam: "This is a very good discussion, proving once again that Loony Tunes are more sensible than Wikipedians. I endorse what Blanc and Porky said."

Anythingyouwant (talk) 09:27, 29 August 2013 (UTC) (surveilling conversation in dimly lit bar where the participants also revealed whether Bobby Riggs threw the match with Billie Jean King, where Hoffa is, who hired Oswald, etc)

Sources using Chelsea Manning or Bradley Manning

I've started a discussion on the CM page. I said elsewhere I'd tag you, but couldn't figure out how to work it in, so I'm bringing it to your talk page instead. I found very little other than the AP using either name in the last week. The Washington Post articles I'd seen were really from the AP, but there was exactly one article I could find on Manning on the WP that was after the 22nd and it used CM. Please feel free to comment or add sources you can find. Hobit (talk) 00:07, 31 August 2013 (UTC)

I'm sick of that discussion. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 02:55, 1 September 2013 (UTC)

Arbcom case

You are involved in a recently filed request for arbitration. Please review the request at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests#Chelsea Manning and, if you wish to do so, enter your statement and any other material you wish to submit to the Arbitration Committee. Additionally, the following resources may be of use—

Thanks,--v/r - TP 22:35, 31 August 2013 (UTC)

The advocacy has moved

link - Kelly hi! 13:25, 3 September 2013 (UTC)

Ugh. I've made one post there now and I hope to keep it that way. This debate has made me ill. This debate is different from Obama and Palin. There it was understandable politics. This is advocacy run wild, at the expense of Wikipedia rules and reputation. Ugh. Again I say: Ugh. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 13:42, 3 September 2013 (UTC)
Agree, totally. Kelly hi! 14:14, 3 September 2013 (UTC)
The user Collect recommends renaming to "Private Manning". I like that idea. There may be debate about "Bradley" vs. "Chelsea". There is no debate about "Private", is there? ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 14:33, 3 September 2013 (UTC)
Thanks. Though my "attitude" is clearly deficient per the ArbCom Tea Party case <g>. Have fun there (veg) the case is likely pre-destined in the old Presbyterian sense. Collect (talk) 15:01, 3 September 2013 (UTC)
[2] :-)Anythingyouwant (talk) 17:04, 3 September 2013 (UTC)
If major news sources are now saying "Chelsea", that's what wikipedia should do. Note I said IF. I'm not convinced yet. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 21:12, 3 September 2013 (UTC)

Ave atque vale

Barring a return of common sense to the project (WP:Tiptibism has reared its ugly head, indeed) Collect (talk) 12:11, 5 September 2013 (UTC)

I can't count the times I've been told what amounts to "you may be right but we don't like the way you're saying it." ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 12:50, 5 September 2013 (UTC)
I know - and, IIRC, I have backed you up as many times as that canard has been used.<g> Cheers. Collect (talk) 12:54, 5 September 2013 (UTC)
And I thank you for your support. :) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 12:59, 5 September 2013 (UTC)


I am to the Libertarian right of the Tea Party, but seem to agree with you 90% of the time. μηδείς (talk) 03:31, 6 September 2013 (UTC)Ś

Hmmm... then at least one of us is going wrong somewhere. >:) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 05:53, 6 September 2013 (UTC)

Temporary Injunction Enacted

The Arbitration Committee has passed a temporary injunction in the case in which you are a party to. The full text of the injunction follows:

The articles "Bradley Manning", "United States v. Manning", and "Chelsea Manning gender identity media coverage" are placed under standard discretionary sanctions for the duration of the case. Unless otherwise provided for in the final decision, any sanction imposed pursuant to this injunction will automatically lapse upon the closure of the case.

On behalf of the Arbitration Committee,
- Penwhale | dance in the air and follow his steps 23:09, 6 September 2013 (UTC)

Whatever. I'm done with that subject. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 01:19, 7 September 2013 (UTC)

Evidence phase open - Manning naming dispute

You were recently listed as a party to a request for arbitration. The Arbitration Committee has accepted that request for arbitration and an arbitration case has been opened at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Manning naming dispute. Evidence that you wish the arbitrators to consider should be added to the evidence subpage, at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Manning naming dispute/Evidence. Please add your evidence by September 23, 2013, which is when the evidence phase closes. You can also contribute to the case workshop subpage, Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Manning naming dispute/Workshop. For a guide to the arbitration process, see Wikipedia:Arbitration/Guide to arbitration. For the Arbitration Committee, Seddon talk 10:57, 7 September 2013 (UTC)

The horse has already left the barn. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 14:41, 7 September 2013 (UTC)

Gouda or 'Church of the Holy Rolling Cheese Wheel'

For TPS context, about The Bible: (Copied from Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Science September 6, 2013)

"Ahh, what's so special about the" Dutch? Surely it applies to any manufacturers of dairy products! ROTFL!Face-grin.svg --220 of Borg 11:07, 8 September 2013 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free media (File:Pedro and Aconcagua.JPG)

Ambox warning blue.svg Thanks for uploading File:Pedro and Aconcagua.JPG. The media description page currently specifies that it is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, it is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the media was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that will be useful. However, please note that media for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

If you have uploaded other unlicensed media, please check whether they're used in any articles or not. You can find a list of 'file' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "File" from the dropdown box. Note that all non-free media not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. Werieth (talk) 17:15, 8 September 2013 (UTC)

Fixed. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 18:33, 8 September 2013 (UTC)


Please don't continue this nonsense calling Tea Party members teabaggers. I find it personally ofensive, my father being tea party chairman of his county, and no bigot or fool. You are aware the term is used derogatively, and is no more appropriate than calling gay men c@cksuckers. μηδείς (talk) 19:55, 27 September 2013 (UTC)

To which they might well respond, "And what's your point?" I'm sure your dad is a wonderful husband and father. But from the public policy standpoint, if he supports the likes of Ted Cruz, Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachmann, et al, he should be ashamed of himself. And as I already pointed out, "teabagger" is a term the tea party itself coined. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 21:31, 27 September 2013 (UTC)
(stalker) Oy, Bugs! In a democracy, people are allowed to have whatever opinions and follow whatever kooky politics they like. That is pretty much the point of a democracy. Disagree with whomsoever you please, but please don't dump shame on people for merely thinking differently from you. -- Jack of Oz [pleasantries] 21:38, 27 September 2013 (UTC)
That's not the problem. It's that a small minority, who hate America and hate Americans, are trying to impose their will on the country. That's not "democracy", it's Nazism. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 22:51, 27 September 2013 (UTC)
So what does the guy say when he wakes up in the morning and notices a little string hanging out of his mouth? SlightSmile 21:28, 28 September 2013 (UTC)
Maybe he should pull on it and see if a lightbulb switches on. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:07, 28 September 2013 (UTC)

Arb finding

Just a heads up, they're proposing findings about you over at the ArbCom on the Chelsea Manning dispute. [3] Phil Sandifer (talk) 21:07, 28 September 2013 (UTC)

"Please sir, may I have another?" seems to be an ArbCom motto currently :(. The concept that all editors must be in precise accord with the WP:TRUTH is, IMHO, an unwise trend. Cheers. Collect (talk) 23:00, 28 September 2013 (UTC)
A bunch of Wikipedians (including Wales himself) violated the rules when they insisted (without valid sourcing) on calling the subject "Chelsea". Now that there supposedly is valid sourcing, the issue is as dead as my interest in it. Although, if the two advocate-admins are let off the hook, then whatever the ArbCom decides will be a humbug. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:05, 28 September 2013 (UTC)


Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Manning naming dispute/Proposed decision

Bugs, as you know, we haven't really crossed paths much at Wikipedia, but I would like to ask whether you're interested in me speaking up for you a bit at your ArbCom "proceeding". If you're indifferent then I won't bother. But, as usual, I think ArbCom is exploring new ways to violate WP:NPA from their lofty perch. They start by putting the word "malice" in your mouth, as if your defense of WP:NPOV is forbidden by some higher rule against criticizing other editors; you never accused anyone of "malice" AFAIK (if ArbCom doesn't know the difference between malice and malfeasance then they are mal-educated). Anyway, I guarantee that ArbCom would be swayed (if at all) the wrong way by anything I might say to them. Cheers.Anythingyouwant (talk) 12:21, 29 September 2013 (UTC)

If you worded your last sentence correctly (I'm not sure), then it would be better to say nothing. It appears they're about to topic-ban from topics that I almost never get involved with anyway. And my core complaint was, and still is, that they were renaming that article without proper sourcing and because of a personal agenda. Supposedly there is now proper sourcing, so the factual part of the issue is no longer relevant. But it's worth pointing out that this kind of thing is why I don't get into political articles much anymore. It's also worth pointing out that I had at most one or two edits on the page in question. The rest of it was talk page discussion. So, you need not say anything in my defense. I've got no intention of going near that or related articles again. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 16:45, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
I have to say that I don't know what the term "discriminatory speech" refers to. I am sympathetic to those with personal issues. I am NOT sympathetic with those who use their personal issues as an excuse to commit crimes against the United States. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 16:51, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
Okay, thanks for your reply. The bit about discriminatory speech was somewhat puzzling to me too, except in its consistency with their false accusation that you attributed malice to other editors. Anyhow, I did word the last sentence correctly, and so will leave it at that. Cheers.Anythingyouwant (talk) 17:10, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
I have commented on the talk page. There's no justification whatsoever for a broad indefinite ban. μηδείς (talk) 19:47, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
Thank you. It probably is overkill, as you say. It's also useful to know that I had best stay away from commenting on oddities like Giuliani in drag, which I didn't know about until now. :) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 20:59, 29 September 2013 (UTC)
After I commented above, the arbitrator "AGK" mentioned your use of the term "he/she/it" with reference to Manning. As in: "Manning is a convicted criminal, and I couldn't care less about him/her/it.” Per WP:BLP, “the possibility of harm to living subjects must always be considered when exercising editorial judgment,” and therefore we're always supposed to care about living people whether they're criminals or not. At least on that basis, you might want to retract the sentence in question. I still see no grounds for ArbCom's accusation that you attributed "malice" to other editors. You attributed lots of other stuff to other editors, like malfeasance, POV-pushing, et cetera --- but not "malice" as far as I can tell.Anythingyouwant (talk) 04:49, 30 September 2013 (UTC)
That's called "satire". As regards "malice", I don't recall accusing anyone of that, but regardless, what I objected to was the flagrant violation of the rules requiring valid sourcing - not "bad faith" necessarily, just wrong-headedness. As regards "harm", last I heard is that Manning is headed for Leavenworth, which is not a fun place to be. Random comments by random editors on a Wikipedia talk page are the least of Manning's worries. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 08:24, 30 September 2013 (UTC)
I agree that editors can be very wrong even in good faith. They can even flagrantly and intentionally violate Wikipedia rules without being hateful or malicious. It's often just wrong-headedness, as you said. I have no idea why ArbCom cooked up this "malice" thing. They're supposed to be setting an example of no personal attacks. You also supposedly personalized a dispute, but I see that your comment did not even name any other editors: "Everyone who supports moving the page to 'Chelsea' is abusing wikipedia." I doubt that there would have been any objection by ArbCom if you had said: "Moving the page to 'Chelsea' would be abusing wikipedia." What an incredibly slim basis for an indefinite topic ban. They ought to list their best evidence against you, and leave the minutiae out. Following the inevitable topic ban, it will be nice to still have you around the rest of wikipedia.Anythingyouwant (talk) 12:27, 30 September 2013 (UTC)
As long as they don't topic-ban me from garden vegetables, all will be swell. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 13:31, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

A cup of tea for you!

Meissen-teacup pinkrose01.jpg Here's a little something and just the way you like it. SlightSmile 17:20, 29 September 2013 (UTC)

Your name has been mentioned in an arbitration proceeding

This is a message to inform you that an finding has been proposed in regards to you in the Manning naming dispute arbitration case. You may find it useful to review the guide to arbitration. Regards, Callanecc (talkcontribslogs) 12:37, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the notice. Someone told me about this already. Hence the link at the top of the page. Such a tempest over an issue that is now moot. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 13:30, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

Pss, pss

You have new message/s Hello. You have a new message at Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Miscellaneous#Ubersexual's talk page.

I was so scared of posting on herem since there are no comments (O_o)? Miss Bono [hello, hello!] 15:37, 3 October 2013 (UTC)

Please, stop.

I can't take this anymore Bugs. I have attempted to defend you at the ANI, where you are in trouble for comments in part in regard to someone's sexuality.

You continue to use what's considered the name of gay sexual practice to deride your political enemies. Let's say as gay person I agreed with your political stance. Why in the world would I think using an anti-gay slur against them would be acceptable? Please revert your last use of the term, and feel free to delete my response. Otherwise I'll have to take this to an admin because you are making it impossible for me to contribute civilly to wikipedia by your insults. μηδείς (talk) 23:16, 5 October 2013 (UTC)

(stalker) I couldn't work out what Medeis's issue was, since according to Bugs's testimony, the Tea Party members used the expression in reference to themselves, so why shouldn't others? Until I read this, from Tea bag (sexual act): Apparently unaware of the sexual connotations of the term, members of the Tea Party Movement initially called themselves "Teabaggers" or used the verb "Teabagging", in reference to the Boston Tea Party.[citation needed] Progressives adopted this as a mocking derogative for their members, leading Tea Party members to disown this term.
I'd never heard this expression before now in a sexual context, either, FWIW. The article makes no particular association with gay sexuality, by the way; no mention at all, in fact. -- Jack of Oz [pleasantries] 23:27, 5 October 2013 (UTC)
It's NOT an anti-gay slur - in fact, it's not even about gay or straight. Its other meaning, besides the literal "tea bag" that the tea party used in its early demonstrations, is a specific sexual act upon a man, which can involve either gay or straight. As I had understood it, it comes from porn videos involving a woman doing this particular thing to a man. I don't do anti-gay. I support same-sex marriage for those who want to, and I oppose homophobia/transphobia/etc. in general. I don't know what else to tell you at this point. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:49, 5 October 2013 (UTC)
I should add that I appreciate very much your support at ANI and other places - and I try to defend you when other editors start getting ban-crazy. I don't understand why you think this is an anti-gay slur as opposed to merely satirizing the tea partiers. Please explain. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:59, 5 October 2013 (UTC)

Actual history

FYI, in February 2009, a conservative protester was photographed with a sign using the words "tea bag" as a verb, which swiftly led to left-leaning websites like Wonkette introducing teabagger as a term for Tea Partiers.[4][5] Thus, the term "teabagger" originated with lefties. The latter link has some good advice: "it’s good to call people what they want to be called, and for that reason I refer to them as 'Tea Party protesters' and 'Tea Party activists.'" It's completely understandable if you weren't aware of this actual history, since the pertinent Wikipedia articles tell a different story.Anythingyouwant (talk) 00:30, 6 October 2013 (UTC)

The tea party coined the verb form "to teabag".[6]Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 01:09, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
Right, I said that one protester was photographed doing that in February 2009. Then in the same month (Feb. 2009) Wonkette coined the term "teabagger". I think your link only refers to later stuff (March 2009).Anythingyouwant (talk) 01:12, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
It doesn't take much for the media to jump on something. And by the way, the term "teabagger" is not even close to the neighborhood of offensiveness that is the term coined by activists in reference to Rick Santorum. I'll be the first to say Santorum's politics make me nauseus. But the activists who were so concerned about hurting Pvt. Manning's feelings and making BLP arguments, were gleefully forcing this "Santorum" thing upon Wikipedia, despite the grossly (and I do mean "grossly") obvious BLP violation. And unlike the non-orientation-specific "teabagger", that term is a blatant homosexuality-related slur. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 01:22, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
I dunno, we're talking about two different sex acts (teabaggers versus the Santorum neologism), and I guess they're disgusting to some people but not to others, in varying degrees. Anyway, you won't find me in a state of shock that hypocrisy exists at Wikipedia.  :-)Anythingyouwant (talk) 01:32, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
The one, which is sex-neutral except for the recipient, is about an act. The other is a bodily fluid. It's not so much the hypocrisy as such - it's the abuse of Wikipedia for advocacy purposes. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 01:35, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
Bugs, you apparently didn't read my post above. I've now underlined the bit that's relevant here. -- Jack of Oz [pleasantries] 01:39, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
Yes, I did read it. They disowned the term once their dim bulbs came on and they realized it had another connotation. But to my mind, it fits perfectly. Here's why: The tea party types don't believe in any kind of assistance to the disadvantaged, nor in any kind of reigns on business. They strictly believe in Reaganomics, a.k.a. the "trickle-down theory". So in essence here's what it is: The tea party types believe in groveling before the ultra rich, kissing up to them in such a way that they hope something will "trickle down" to them. Now, having pointed out why I use that term, I'll stop using it. OK???Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 01:47, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
Did anyone even see this? Teabagger and tea bag are acceptable terms for the Tea Party movement. SlightSmile 02:34, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
(stalker)When I first heard the term used in sexual context I immediately thought it originated from an old joke I heard nearly 4 decades ago about a man who unfortunately injured himself after misinterpreting the instructions for making tea. The joke did not mention gays nor did it even imply anything of a homosexual nature. Now I understand how the term could have evolved into an anti-gay slur, but I don't how or when that may have happened, if in fact it has. I have never heard it used where it would strictly imply a homosexual context. Just my $0.02. --RacerX11 Talk to meStalk me 14:45, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
ec fwiw I know we're not suppose to soapbox but Bugs is so exactly right about trickle-down and groveling to the ultra rich. To this day I can't understand how anyone with a brain could subscribe to such idiocy. One possible theory is that indeed, big business will reward these teacozies with opportunities to make the bucks themselves. That's brownnosing, isn't it? SlightSmile 15:40, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
It is clearly "controversial" and not "accepted" as it has clear dysphemistic and pejorative connotations. Use of it is akin to saying the "n word" is "controversial" in the black community -- it does not "clean up" the word by any means. Collect (talk) 15:28, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
ec As I think of it more, teabagger does seem easy on the tongue (please believe me no pun) to describe Tea Party people and it's not Bug's or anyone's fault that the word is also associated with a sex act. Loosen up guys. SlightSmile 16:03, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
That's an extremely offensive comparison. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 15:57, 6 October 2013 (UTC)

Use of sexual terms for a political question.

Warning, Baseball Bugs I admire your intelligence & expertise despite your use of sexual terms for two subjects during a political discussion. The "skew" in your political responses are also getting progressively worse. Please remove or strike these at Wikipedia:Reference_desk/Humanities#Succession_of_the_U.S._Speaker_of_the_House per Wikipedia:Reference desk/Guidelines. Thank you and sincerely do not misinterpret this as anything other then a friendly warning. Market St.⧏ ⧐ Diamond Way 12:40, 6 October 2013 (UTC)

In general, I'm only repeating what editorialists are saying. And I already told Medeis here and on the Medeis talk page that I won't use that one term again. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 14:10, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
I get that, I do, but everything that has RSs doesn't always qualify to be RSed, I'm thankful we avoided an "arms race of the reliable sources".
The terms however remain, which striking or removal was the purpose of this warning. Market St.⧏ ⧐ Diamond Way 15:08, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
You're going to have to explain more fully. Is it my reference to "santorum" that you find offensive? ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 15:52, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
As I stated above: "despite your use of sexual terms for two subjects" (emphasis added) my borderline excessive debate on the topic also mentionsreferences both "Santorum" & "teabagger", I don't doubt your conclusion of which may be more offensive, but they both are. Thank you again for your time in this matter. Market St.⧏ ⧐ Diamond Way 16:12, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
Don't post here again until you've demonstrated a willingness to expunge "santorum" from Wikipedia. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 16:22, 6 October 2013 (UTC)
The term "santorum" is a hundred times more offensive than "teabagger". Once you've expunged that gross BLP violation from Wikipedia, get back to me. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 16:05, 6 October 2013 (UTC)


When your wording has clearly dysphemistic and pejorative connotations, it is rational to remove the term from your posts and relegate it to the Wiki trash bin. Cheers. Collect (talk) 15:25, 6 October 2013 (UTC)

The complaints about it are based on a false premise. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 15:53, 6 October 2013 (UTC)

LA vs. Atlanta

Did you see the catch by the LA left-fielder in the stands in the 8th inning? I don't think it is worth taking the chance of getting hurt to catch a foul in the 8th with a 10-4 lead. Bubba73 You talkin' to me? 04:19, 7 October 2013 (UTC)

I did. He landed on concrete, and that stuff doesn't have much give. He took a big chance. Overall, it looks like the Braves are headed for yet another post-season disappointment after an excellent regular season. The Dodgers haven't got it wrapped up yet, though. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 04:28, 7 October 2013 (UTC)


Bugs, would you like to sign my guestbook. Thanks! Miss Bono [hello, hello!] 20:01, 11 October 2013 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

Barnstar of Diligence Hires.png The Barnstar of Diligence
For your mastery of 'Diffs' research and ability to always give your best to 'call it like you see it'. All this in addition to your attempts to make Wikipedia a better and more knowledgeable place. Market St.⧏ ⧐ Diamond Way 01:40, 13 October 2013 (UTC)
Thank you. :) Although you may want to rethink this award after I get topic-banned. :( ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:12, 13 October 2013 (UTC)
Humble to a fault lol. Tomorrow is a new day, but a great deed should always go rewarded, besides I'm a Pirates fan so being a 'bum' one decade (or 2) & a hero the next is par for the course. Market St.⧏ ⧐ Diamond Way 04:57, 13 October 2013 (UTC)

Babe Ruth and Toronto Island

I found this paragraph in the article Toronto Islands, History:

In 1894, a land reclamation project by the Toronto Ferry Company created space for an amusement park at Hanlan's Point. In 1897, the Hanlan's Point Stadium was built alongside the amusement park for the Toronto Maple Leaf baseball team. The stadium was rebuilt several times over the years, and in 1914, Babe Ruth hit his first professional home run into the waters of Lake Ontario from this stadium. In the 1920s the Maple Leaf team moved to a new stadium on the mainland.

I doubt it is true. In Babe Ruth, the claim is that his first professional home run was in an inter-squad game in March, 1914. March on Toronto Island would not be a time to be playing baseball.

I went to have a look at the ref in the Babe article (there was none in the Toronto Islands' article) which is #33, Creamer, but I can't find any reference in full with Creamer as the author. Can you help?

Thanks Bielle (talk) 20:21, 13 October 2013 (UTC)

In a way, both reports are correct, depending on definition. In Bill Jenkinson's book The Year Babe Ruth Hit 104 Home Runs, there is a list of every known home run Ruth hit in a competitive game. For 1914, there are only two: March 7th, at Fayetteville, during spring training, and in fact it was an intersquad game; and September 5, at Toronto, a regular-season International League game. In the prose portion of the book, he says Ruth's homer was reported as "far over the right field fence", but no indication (or not) of whether it landed in Lake Ontario. And by the way, he pitched a one-hit shutout that day. Playing for Providence, he helped pitch them to the league championship. So the first one he hit in competition was at Fayetteville in March, and the first "official" one came in Toronto in September. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 22:31, 13 October 2013 (UTC)
Thank you. When you have a questions, ask someone who knows where to find the answer. That solves the problem for the Toronto Island game, but who is Creamer for the refs? Do you know? Bielle (talk) 22:45, 13 October 2013 (UTC)
That would be Robert Creamer, who wrote an in-depth and highly regarded biography of Ruth in 1974. I've got it someplace, but would have to find it. The most interesting thing would be to find a contemporary newspaper account and see if the Lake Ontario story was reported immediately or if it turned up some time later - as with the "called shot" story. Although if the right field fence was fairly close to the water, it wouldn't be a surprise if the ball landed in it. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:48, 13 October 2013 (UTC)
Take a look at this picture of Maple Leaf Stadium. The smaller ballpark in the background is Hanlan's Point Stadium. Unless the lake level is unusually high, it would seem that a home run into Lake Ontario (technically the "Inner Harbour") would be fairly commonplace. I saw they had a grainy aerial photo in the airport article, so I added it to both the Hanlan's and Maple Leaf Stadium articles. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 02:57, 14 October 2013 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Manning naming dispute closed

This arbitration case has been closed and the final decision is available at the link above. The following remedies have been enacted:

  1. Hitmonchan (talk · contribs) is indefinitely topic-banned from all pages relating to any transgender topic or individual, broadly construed.
  2. IFreedom1212 (talk · contribs) is indefinitely topic-banned from all pages relating to any transgender topic or individual, broadly construed.
  3. Tarc (talk · contribs) is indefinitely topic-banned from all pages relating to any transgender topic or individual, broadly construed.
  4. Josh Gorand (talk · contribs) is indefinitely topic-banned from all pages relating to any transgender topic or individual, broadly construed.
  5. Baseball Bugs (talk · contribs) is indefinitely topic-banned from all pages relating to any transgender topic or individual, broadly construed. He is also topic banned from all pages (including biographies) related to leaks of classified information, broadly construed.
  6. David Gerard (talk · contribs) is admonished for acting in a manner incompatible with the community's expectations of administrators (see #David Gerard's use of tools).
  7. David Gerard (talk · contribs) is indefinitely prohibited from using his administrator permissions (i) on pages relating to transgender people or issues and (ii) in situations involving such pages. This restriction may be first appealed after six months have elapsed, and every six months thereafter.
  8. The standard discretionary sanctions adopted in Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Sexology for (among other things) "all articles dealing with transgender issues" remain in force. For the avoidance of doubt, these discretionary sanctions apply to any dispute regarding the proper article title, pronoun usage, or other manner of referring to any individual known to be or self-identifying as transgender, including but not limited to Chelsea/Bradley Manning. Any sanctions imposed should be logged at the Sexology case, not this one.
  9. All editors, especially those whose behavior was subject to a finding in this case, are reminded to maintain decorum and civility when engaged in discussions on Wikipedia, and to avoid commentary that demeans any other person, intentionally or not.

For the Arbitration Committee, Rschen7754 01:29, 16 October 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the update. Those topics are not on my radar, so this should be safe.
One thing, though: If your decision did not include revoking the admin rights of the two advocate-admins who caused this problem in the first place, then your process is a humbug.
For the Rabbit Ration Committee, Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 01:38, 16 October 2013 (UTC)

Needling Arb clerks

Arbcom is fundamentally defective in many ways, as I showed, but there's no value in that outburst. "Shooting the messenger", y'know? Grab a beer and go watch the first half of your namesake, the Cards are up 4-2 n the 7th. Tarc (talk) 02:27, 16 October 2013 (UTC)

I hate the Cardinals. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 02:28, 16 October 2013 (UTC)
I've asked for clarification on the topic ban, Wikipedia talk:Arbitration Committee/Noticeboard#Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Manning naming dispute closed, because as far as I can see broadly construed could include the reference desk. CambridgeBayWeather (talk) 08:11, 16 October 2013 (UTC)
The two topics in question almost never turn up on the ref desks. And if they do, I can let someone else answer them. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 13:24, 16 October 2013 (UTC)
It's just to cover you in case someone who doesn't like you sees that you edited the page 3 sections below a forbidden topic and decides to make a fuss about it. CambridgeBayWeather (talk) 21:44, 16 October 2013 (UTC)
Over the course of time, most of the editors who really, really didn't like me have gotten themselves indef'd, so I'm not too concerned about them. But thanks for the tip. You never know. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 22:40, 16 October 2013 (UTC)
Well, you never know who Tarc's going to be from one day to the next.Anythingyouwant (talk) 02:08, 17 October 2013 (UTC)
Er, I don't have the slightest desire in seeing Bugs banned from anything, which is why I dropped the cool-down advice here. We go way back to the fun Obama Arbcom days, though I did get a little miffed at him over his WR slagging last year, but people can't see eye-to-eye 100% of the time. So in the future, take the "better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and to remove all doubt" proverb to heart, kiddo. Tarc (talk) 02:33, 17 October 2013 (UTC)
We've not always agreed on specific things, but we get along. I think topic-banning is kind of desperate. But sometimes these things happen, and you just have to ro-o-oll with the punches, and get to what's real. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 02:40, 17 October 2013 (UTC)
Sheesh, I didn't think a smiley face was needed at the end of my comment to signify humor, but maybe it was. Who'da thunk everyone would be so serious here at this page. I guess the House stenographer's condition may be catching. This is a talk page divided!  :-)Anythingyouwant (talk) 05:14, 17 October 2013 (UTC)
Sarcasm isn't conveyed by text very well no, sorry. Let's have a Beer summit and call it a day. Tarc (talk) 12:34, 17 October 2013 (UTC)
This is where small print comes in. So, what day shall we call it? Given your proposal, I'd call it Thirst-day. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 13:00, 17 October 2013 (UTC)

peer into the distant past

Your God viewpoint, Alpha Centauri, their "now". Your brilliance is exceeded only by your magnificence! SlightSmile 03:05, 17 October 2013 (UTC)

Thank you! But don't put my frontal lobes on a pedestal yet. I'm waiting for the purists to attack my argument. (Sometimes purists lack imagination.) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:07, 17 October 2013 (UTC)

Clever turns of phrase

"they were Kenyans, moor or less". Kudos to you. (Or any other candy bars of choice.) Edison (talk) 05:25, 20 October 2013 (UTC)

Thank you for noticing. :) And given how I'm too often spaced out, I'll take a Milky Way. :) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 05:31, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
I'm sorry to intrude (not very), but, regarding Milky Way candy bars, you have got to see the movie This is the End (if you haven't) which has a great scene regarding that particular candy bar. Plus, you will be hip and aware of what the young people are thinking (and smoking).Anythingyouwant (talk) 16:11, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
Interesting idea - an "apocalyptic comedy". I'll have to look for that one in the rental stores. As regards being hip, I was never hip even when I was a young people. But knowledge is good. :) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 16:21, 20 October 2013 (UTC)


For your comments. I note MC and RD seem quite adamant in their insistence that my words were so offensive to polity that I must needs be chastised. I am more than half tempted to list some "nice quotes" from their own editing careers <g>. And be sure to vote the "B&T ticket" for the ArbCom elections! Collect (talk) 18:55, 20 October 2013 (UTC)

I'm not sure what the correct protocol would be for amassing quotes or other evidence regarding an admin, but it would certainly be an interesting exercise which might attract other editors besides yourself.Anythingyouwant (talk) 18:59, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
It could lead to unexpected results, so be cautious. "Once you open a can of worms, the only way to re-can them is with a much bigger can." I used to keep a collection of crazy insults, but I only posted them from any given user after that user had been indef'd. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 22:33, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
Yeah, and this can would be about the size of Jupiter. (No comments about the next planet, please.)Anythingyouwant (talk) 22:41, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
You got something against Saturn??? :) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 22:48, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
Oh, right, you got me, I meant the one after that. The one before Neptune. The one that's the only planet whose name is derived from a figure from Greek mythology: Uranus, who was son and husband of Gaia, Mother Earth. Let's not have any discriminatory comments about that relationship.  :-)Anythingyouwant (talk) 23:08, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
TMI. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:35, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
I loves it when you says them big words. SlightSmile 23:49, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
Yup. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:51, 20 October 2013 (UTC)
Phremologicalification. SlightSmile 00:02, 21 October 2013 (UTC)

Motion re Finding of fact regarding you

I have posted a motion supporting rewording of the finding of fact regarding you in the Manning naming dispute arbitration case here. Risker (talk) 01:28, 21 October 2013 (UTC)

"The Decline of Wikipedia" - new on Oct 22, 2013.

A cheeseburger for you!

Cheeseburger.png I was going to leave you a hot dog, since that's baseball food, I hear, but this is the best the cafeteria could come up with. Later Bugs. Drmies (talk) 05:19, 22 October 2013 (UTC)

Motion regarding Manning FOF

Hi BB. As I've announced on the arbitration noticeboard, please be aware that the committee has carried the motion to amend the Manning naming dispute finding of fact relating to you. I have also implemented this motion, including by replacing the old finding on the actual decision page. Please let me know if anything is unclear or you have any questions. Regards, AGK [•] 22:28, 24 October 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for your note. With any luck, I'll never hear about this whole sordid subject again. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 22:33, 24 October 2013 (UTC)
What subject? Was there a subject?Anythingyouwant (talk) 22:58, 24 October 2013 (UTC)
They're going to rename the article Womanning. Get it ? Hey ? Get it ? Manning WoManning . Woman. Man? This is where I look around the classroom to see if anyone's laughing. SlightSmile 00:22, 25 October 2013 (UTC)
[7]Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 00:58, 25 October 2013 (UTC)

Ref desk

Hi, I got your message. I understand your point. Are you saying we can't ask about fictional creatures or alternate history theories on the Refdesk? I didn't mean to disrupt, I didn't see any prohibition of such on the RD main page. Fishface gurl (talk) 04:01, 25 October 2013 (UTC)

Hatting on Science RD

Sorry about unhatting your post in the Science RD. It honestly never occured to me that you would have hatted your own post, I just assumed someone else had done it - guess I should have checked the history. Anyway, I have added a more informative header to the template to explain that you have hatted your own post, so no-one else will make the same mistake. Gandalf61 (talk) 14:37, 25 October 2013 (UTC)

Thoughts re User:Fishfacegirl

I'm just curious to understand, the logic behind your effort to identify Fishface as a sock, for presumably banning or blocking that user. (I mean, even if you are successful, identify him, get him blocked or banned as a sockpuppet, he is just going to create a new user, User:Birdfaceboy, and there we are, back to the starting line once more. And again. And again. And again. And again. And again. You see the idea. So I'm wondering if that is what you like to do with your time, supporting ill-conceived and illogical/dysfunctional Wiki practices, that accomplish nothing, except perhaps amuse the hell out of Fishfacegirl [whom there's no shadow of a doubt is obviously OGB], but again, what's the point? The time/effort expended in the apparent dysfunctional Wiki practice of identify & destroy, brings an image to my mind [I can't help it; if it's not true please explain how it isn't true] of a dog chasing its tail. Pointless effort; amusing Braniff.]) Ihardlythinkso (talk) 22:32, 25 October 2013 (UTC) p.s. Braniff isn't all bad; he has something to contribute, but his contributions are uneven. Meanwhile, he's also a prankster. Really he is just showing the WP how dysfunctional its current troll-handling practices are, isn't he? And that should be of some value too. (Like hiring a hacker, to test the soundness of a security software implementation.)

Maybe we should just stop blocking and banning altogether. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 22:40, 25 October 2013 (UTC)
I'm sure Malleus would agree. (I'm with him.) Best, Ihardlythinkso (talk) 05:48, 26 October 2013 (UTC)

Adam Bishop...

...issues a personal attack against me on the ref desk talk page, and then blocks me when I won't take the bait. Cute. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 05:23, 27 October 2013 (UTC)

I suggest you file an unblock request immediately. Bishop has said in response to my inquiry that he expects you to be unblocked as soon as you do so. I must say I am very surprised at this. μηδείς (talk) 05:39, 27 October 2013 (UTC)
I want you to know that I very much appreciate your standing up for me on Bishop's page. I don't know what's eating him today. Maybe he had a rancid croissant from that boulangerie I mentioned. I also must mention that I have been blocked a few times in the past but have never filed an unblock request (except for technical reasons one time when they didn't do the unblock properly). I am in the habit of sitting out the block time, even when it gets shortened (which has been known to happen). Thanks again. :) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 05:46, 27 October 2013 (UTC)
The fact that you have this habit at all is the real problem. We should make a separate Reference Desk for baseball, Tom Lehrer lyrics, and accusing people of being nannies. That would solve everything. Adam Bishop (talk) 05:50, 27 October 2013 (UTC)
You called me "useless". Until you retract that gross personal attack, don't post here again. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 05:54, 27 October 2013 (UTC)
  • I've unblocked you. Please ratchet down the rhetoric. Thanks.--Bbb23 (talk) 15:08, 27 October 2013 (UTC)
  • Bbb23 unblocked you one minute before I tried to. I hate it when that happens. Bishonen | talk 15:10, 27 October 2013 (UTC).

fyi Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case#Adam_Bishop NE Ent 22:28, 27 October 2013 (UTC)

Just a suggestion

You've been through a lot lately, you might want to consider the idea of taking a short Wikibreak to re-charge the batteries and re-set the circuit breakers. When you come back, you'll be able to paste all the pathetic palookas with your powerful paralyzing perfect pachydermus percussion pitches. Warmest regards, Beyond My Ken (talk) 07:25, 28 October 2013 (UTC)

I don't know if you celebrate Halloween but... Happy Halloween!

Bat icon.svg
Hello Baseball Bugs, Miss Bono has given you an lovely bat, to wish you a Happy Halloween! You see, these things promote WikiLove and hopefully this has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by giving someone else a lovely bat! Enjoy!
Spread the goodness of a lovely bat by adding {{subst:User:Miss Bono/Halloween}} to their talk page with a friendly message.
I love to hear the crack of a bat. Especially a Louisville Slugger. Edison (talk) 03:02, 1 November 2013 (UTC)
Yes. And it's a little-known fact that Batman started out as Batboy for the Gotham Giants. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 11:17, 1 November 2013 (UTC)
 :D Miss Bono [hello, hello!] 19:49, 1 November 2013 (UTC)
 :-) SlightSmile 23:16, 1 November 2013 (UTC)

Mississippi River

Thanks for your input; you and StuRat easily answered my question. FYI, per Mississippi River#Lower Mississippi, the Ohio is actually the dominant factor below Cairo (Google Satellite View shows that it's wider, not just "bigger"); and per Missouri River#Passage to Sioux City, it's only six feet deep at St Louis as well as being narrower than the Mississippi. Nyttend (talk) 13:26, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

Surreal Barnstar Hires.png The Surreal Barnstar
For a very unique and yet tireless Wikipedia reference desk contribution streak. Surreal in every sense of the word Baseball Bugs, and a big thanks for making me smile and laugh. Market St.⧏ ⧐ Diamond Way 08:18, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Topic ban

Bugs, you're topic banned from "all pages relating to any transgender topic or individual, broadly construed".

This reference desk thread mentions such an individual in its section title and also as part of the original poster's question. You then responded by, inter alia, making comments about what the U.S. government should have charged that individual with, along with your own commentary about the individual's actions, like "theft is theft". As well as where you believe the individual would be "better off". (You then also very quickly got into an argument, though not mostly one about that individual.)

To me this does not seem to be compatible with your topic ban. But I'd rather not bother going to WP:AE to find out if I am right or wrong about that, so just knock it off, OK?

P.S. if you're wondering why I'm the one giving you this reminder, it's because you prohibited everyone else from posting here! --Demiurge1000 (talk) 20:13, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Snowden is TS? Collect (talk) 20:29, 4 November 2013 (UTC)
Aha, I knew there was an explanation!
Sorry, no, he isn't. I think I must have him confused with someone else.
Excuse me while I topic-ban myself from political issues in general for a while... Just as well I started here rather than AE.
Bugs is also topic-banned from pages "related to leaks of classified information, broadly construed", and should perhaps be cautious in threads such as the one I mentioned, but I don't think I should be pursuing that one right now. Thank you for the quick correction. --Demiurge1000 (talk) 20:40, 4 November 2013 (UTC)
I'll back off that one then. Better to be safe. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 21:14, 4 November 2013 (UTC)
Why? You chicken? SlightSmile 21:23, 4 November 2013 (UTC)
I'm just a dumb cluck. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 22:18, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Thanks, Bugs. As far as the topic ban on "all pages (including biographies) related to leaks of classified information, broadly construed", it would be prudent to avoid edits like these: [8] [9]. You are a good editor and I would hate to see you get into worse difficulty. Jonathunder (talk) 21:26, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Bugs is topic banned from even mentioning Nathan Hale as far as I can tell ... or Benedict Arnold as the "ArbCom final solution" was written.
He is also topic banned from all pages (including biographies) related to leaks of classified information, broadly construed.
He can not mention the Vietnam War and its connection to intelligence communities, as far as I can tell, either. And probably can not mention any President of the US during wartime. Positively brilliant! Collect (talk) 00:38, 5 November 2013 (UTC)
I'm guessing that the only thing I'm allowed to say about intelligence is that I'm lacking it. :( ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 00:54, 5 November 2013 (UTC)
Rocky Squirrel: "Hey, what's the meaning of this?" Man in trenchcoat: "Military intelligence. That phrase mean anything to you?" Rocky: "It sounds like a contradiction in terms." Edison (talk) 01:25, 5 November 2013 (UTC)

Fuck it and fuck you

Were you asking me specifically? No, I don't think it's blockable. BTW, I understand if someone gets irritated at the chit-chat that some of us enjoy so much, and I'd just let it slide. Later, Drmies (talk) 03:17, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

It was more funny than anything else. He went there looking for trouble, and he found it. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:19, 6 November 2013 (UTC)
Yeah, maybe, but he wasn't going to find a block. Later Bugs, and take it easy, Drmies (talk) 04:21, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Belated thanks

Thanks for cluing me into the Monty Python - Star Trek crossovers on You Tube. I found several but I think my favorite was the mix of clips to the Camelot song from ...Holy Grail. It looks like the put some thought into what clips to use and having Trelayne singing "In-de-fat-e-gable" was a real treat. Thanks again and cheers. MarnetteD | Talk 19:33, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

I don't recall how I happened across that one, but it's brilliant. A good mixture of fan(s)affection and obsession. :) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:55, 6 November 2013 (UTC)


Only Clarityfiend and Someguy1221 gave a decent answers to the legitimate question Its a science board where people expect more in-depth answers than just "oh its obvious, because it is hard". Straws are solids and water drops are not so its a legitimate question and the OP followed up with a similar question where the velocities are equal, so you are reframing his question and assuming bad faith with a strawman. Please for the sake of sanity on this board, refactor or remove your insult there. [10] I did not see him jerking anyone, but you and your strawman. Consider too that simply dropping a large block of ice will also hurt [11], (for it doesn't have to be moving very fast. --Modocc (talk) 16:05, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

He admitted to it. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 16:17, 7 November 2013 (UTC)
To what? To jerking us around? He admitted to no such thing at all.. He went from being general with respect to solids vs liquids to being more specific. The answers for both are nearly the same. But you read into it more than you should or needed too with this lets hat he's jerking around bit. --Modocc (talk) 16:44, 7 November 2013 (UTC)
Your inability to see it is your problem, not mine. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 17:04, 7 November 2013 (UTC)
I do give you points, though, for coming here with it (mostly) instead of attacking so much on the ref desk page, as the other nannies tend to do. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 17:06, 7 November 2013 (UTC)
Thank you for your second point. :-) I don't know why you didn't initiate the meta-discussion on the R@D talkpage, for the damage (as I see it) is already done. Posters shouldn't have to feel like they have to be walking on eggshells or trending on thin-skin and to be bitten by nannies (unless they truly deserve it) --Modocc (talk) 17:20, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

Enough, Aldrete. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 17:23, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

Your editing

As per Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents, it is expected that people try to resolve problems with an editor on their talk page first. This is what I am doing. I refer to this diff of yours. I believe this is part of an annoying pattern on your part. It consists of making constant, slightly irritating off-topic remarks that wind people up, and poke at them, as if looking for trouble. Then someone makes a reference to your annoying conduct, and you always escalate by criticising them back. I do not remember you ever taking criticism gracefully, or attempting to defuse the situation. The difference between your conduct and theirs is not based on explicit adherence, or lack thereof, to specific rules, but a difference in apparent attitude. You invariably retaliate. One of the more blatant cases I have seen was here, specifically, your comment "...which is more than you can say for yourself. " Is there anything that will make you see my point, and change your editing? It is not primarily the side comments that I often find irritating, but the predictable retaliation that follows when you get on someone's nerves, and they are finally provoked to express this. Is it possible for you to change, and seek to defuse situations that pop up? IBE (talk) 23:33, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

In the two instances you cite, one was initiated by a typical cowardly drive-by IP, and the other was from a registered editor who's notorious for attacking users in front of the OP while making no effort to address the OP's question. Find some legitimate examples before you post here again. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 18:53, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Baseball Reference question

Hey there. Hope you are doing well. Had a question that may or may not be in your wheelhouse. As an idle exercise I ran this search) at Baseball Reference, wondering: if the National League made up an equivalent to the Edgar Martínez Award, that is, an award to be given to the pitcher who hits the best, who would they name it after? I limited it to NL players, since it could only ever be an NL award. I don't subscribe to BR, so I can't see the best answers to that question (though I know from previous searches the number 6 guy, with the .270 BA, is Don Newcombe, who would be far from the worst choice as far as naming the thing hypothetically goes). I'm not asking who the top guys are. My question is this: I am seeing "TOT" listed as a team that some players played for. This makes no sense. Not only is there not a team that is abbreviated TOT, it can't stand for "total" either (else why would it sometimes appear in the midst of a player's list of teams played for, rather than exclusively at one end?). Any ideas? ☯.ZenSwashbuckler.☠ 19:08, 7 November 2013 (UTC)

TOT does mean "TOTAL" for a guy who played with more than one club in a given year, but I think their computer is taking things a bit too literally. Review this guy, for example:[12] As to who the NL might name a best-hitting-pitcher after, I don't know - but isn't there something called the Silver Slugger award? I'll look into that when I get the chance. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 19:41, 7 November 2013 (UTC)
They do give out the Silver Slugger to a man at each position in both leagues (a pitcher gets one in the National League, a DH gets one in the American League). But the AL also has the separate award that is only given out to the DH (and has been since its adoption in 1973). I figure handling both ends of the pitcher-batter transaction admirably is hard enough that the NL should make up an equivalent.
More to the point, though, thanks for clarifying the TOT notation - that was the only reasonable word it could be short for, just couldn't figure out why it was in the middle of a string of teams. ☯.ZenSwashbuckler.☠ 20:36, 7 November 2013 (UTC)
Looking at this list of the best-hitting pitchers (albeit 2 years old),[13] the best answers would seem to be Hendrix (who is unknown today), Zambrano and Hampton. In general, naming the award for a pitcher who was a good enough hitter to be used as a pinch-hitter would be good choices. Don Drysdale is one. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 19:01, 8 November 2013 (UTC)
(talk page stalker)The guy you're looking for may be Red Lucas (played 1923-1938), described on his Reds Hall of Fame bio as "the best pinch-hitter in the National League during his career and one of the great pinch-hitters to ever play for the Cincinnati Reds." [14] Per SABR, "He held the major league career pinch-hit record from 1933 until Smoky Burgess broke it in 1965." [15]. --Arxiloxos (talk) 21:13, 8 November 2013 (UTC)
That could be a good candidate. Not that anyone except historians know who he is (for that matter, how many young fans know who Edgar Martinez is?) But a name like Red Lucas has a crisp sound to it. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 21:18, 8 November 2013 (UTC)


While unsourced :), I thought this was a very perceptive comment: "I expect a lot of suicides don't necessarily want to die, they just want the pain to go away." Thanks, Bielle (talk) 05:03, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

Thank you. I do what I can. :) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 01:39, 29 November 2013 (UTC)
When I feels blue I puts me some kanga on da barbie and it just picks me right up, mate. SlightSmile 02:19, 29 November 2013 (UTC)

Notification of automated file description generation

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personal insults

The personal "insults" aimed at me are so bad they are fun on a very rare occasion--kind of like having one or two small fencing scars--that's why I am keeping them. But your defense, while appreciated by me (here and on many other occasions), detracts from the effect, hence my reversion. μηδείς (talk) 02:31, 30 November 2013 (UTC)

Roger. (Note that I was talking to the Toronto-based IP.) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 02:44, 30 November 2013 (UTC)
Yes, I knew, the edit summary was a joke. μηδείς (talk) 03:02, 30 November 2013 (UTC)

bible prediction

I've hatted the subthread on the basis that the comment is OR about a living person, which is really all that matters, even if your conclusion is right.

As a side issue irrelevant to the reason for the hatting, and only since you ask, I will suggest you consider whether a comment saying that the reason his magic spell didn't work is because he either said it wrong or read the wrong magic book. Obviously those are not the only two possibilities. Your conclusion does not follow. Perhaps the proper Bible simply doesn't allow the prediction whether it is misread or not. In any case, discussing the BLP's actions based on OR remains inappropriate. μηδείς (talk) 22:44, 6 December 2013 (UTC)

He based it on a calculation of some kind. Either he did the calculation wrong, or he had a misleading translation. Both factors are possible in combination, of course. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:14, 6 December 2013 (UTC)
Well, you are not going to get me to argue in his defense! It still doesn't follow that you could necessarily make the prediction if you had a proper reading of the right bible. Nowhere does Jesus say, like a thief in the night wearing a GPS ankle bracelet.  :) μηδείς (talk) 23:22, 6 December 2013 (UTC)
My in-universe view (never mind whether I literally believe it) is that only God knows when He's coming back, so any "calculation" is automatically wrong. Which is apparently the conclusion Camping finally came to, after suffering public humiliation more than once. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:33, 6 December 2013 (UTC)


I'm just giving you a 'heads up' in regards to a recent ANI you and I both commented on. More info here. Cheers - theWOLFchild 17:38, 13 December 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the tip. We'll see what develops, if anything. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:49, 13 December 2013 (UTC)

1911 World Series

Hi, your edits in 2007 produced the same text as . There's no for that page, so I can't tell which came first. The Baseball Page may be copying from Wikipedia, which would explain the "By WIKI" note. On the other hand, The Baseball Page is claiming copyright. Do you happen to remember the source you used in 2007? vzaak 21:09, 16 December 2013 (UTC)

Yikes, 6 years ago. I'll take a look at it. This much I can tell you: I don't do copyright violations. I put things in my own words. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 00:10, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
Those are my words. I don't think I've ever seen a sportswriter use "albeit" in a sentence. As to the "source", the general information was probably from one of my old World Series books, and the length of the idleness gap was probably taken from a records book. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 00:23, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
I also checked 1912-1916, all of which match The Baseball Page. At first glance the article histories show gradual wording changes suggesting that The Baseball Page is the duplicate and Wikipedia is the original. I'm not sure if a WP:REVERSECOPYVIO-type policy exists, but I did find the talk page template {{backwardscopy}}. vzaak 01:29, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
It might be worth looking into. As far as I know, other websites are free to duplicate Wikipedia info as long as they provide proper attribution. It might also be interesting to google my phrasing "albeit on the west coast" or whatever, and see how many other copycats there are. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 01:36, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
I googled [1911 world series, albeit on the West Coast] and a number of diverse entries came up. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 01:39, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
Right, I wouldn't have given it a second thought were it not for the "© The Baseball Page. All Rights Reserved" at the bottom. I presume there is some way to alert WMF, who may just send a polite form letter asking for attribution. It may be that WMF already worked out a deal, which didn't occur to me until now. vzaak 02:19, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
Sometimes those assertions of rights are what could be called a "legal bluff". ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 02:26, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
I'm asking at a ref desk. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:00, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

ANI Discussion

It has been mentioned at ANI that you are being obnoxious at the reference desk here, courtesy notification. --kelapstick(bainuu) 23:45, 16 December 2013 (UTC)

You should also point out that it is not just the reference desk that you are obnoxious at (that is me kidding for those who won't know the difference). --kelapstick(bainuu) 23:48, 16 December 2013 (UTC)
I was going to say "So what else is new?" I don't know what they would be yelping about on this occasion. I can't think of anything I've done recently that's particularly bad. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 00:09, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
Nor could the complainant. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 00:26, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
Everybody is a critic I suppose, but some don't know what to complain about. --kelapstick(bainuu) 00:39, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
The admin sized the situation up pretty quickly. Thanks for letting me know about it. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 00:53, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
Interesting, this looks just like one of wickwack's recent attempts to have me blocked, down to the wording and complaint he couldn't edit my talk page. μηδείς (talk) 02:49, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
What an extraordinary coincidence. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 02:50, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

nutritional wickwack advice

You'll notice from the history, the nutritional advice question was hatted, wickwack unhatted it, and you responded. I reverted the section to before the unhatting, removing your comment. Letting you know in case you think it should be restored outside the hatting. μηδείς (talk) 02:46, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

You've got a better knack for nicking wickwack. The question is borderline medical. I know Bubba73 from way back on this site, so I don't think he's really asking for medical advice, he's just asking whether anyone really knows. But it's a tough question to answer authoritatively, as the authorities themselves don't agree. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 02:53, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
Yes, I know he's no problem, and the answers are still in place, just not searchable, basically a CYA rather than a reprimand. As for WW, the IP was obvious here, but you'll also notice he has trouble using the subjunctive: "It is time BB is blocked", rather than the proper "It is time he be blocked." μηδείς (talk) 03:47, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
He missed the obvious, which would be, "It be time BB be ..." ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:53, 17 December 2013 (UTC)


Hi. I have filed an ANI against User: here, you are mentioned. μηδείς (talk) 03:31, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

I see the admins again took quick action. Thank you for watching out for me. :) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:45, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
Don't get a big head. You are barely tolerable, but he is not. Hehe. μηδείς (talk) 03:49, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
Don't worry, I'll accept anything that vaguely resembles a compliment. :) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:52, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

Harold Camping

Dude, It's not the end of the world. :) Toddst1 (talk) 14:25, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

Except for him, if it's true. :) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 14:26, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
Bring out your dead... I'm not dead yet. Toddst1 (talk) 14:28, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
I'm slightly inclined to believe that that website isn't a hoax - it is a service that sends out emails, and it looks like there is some kind of subscriber based email newsletter service for Family Radio: [16]. Hopefully more sources come out though. – Connormah (talk) 14:55, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
When that movie star died in a wreck a weekend or two ago, the experts here wouldn't allow TMZ to be considered a valid source, even though they had the story right. So, unless we get mainstream verification, BLP demands that we keep a lid on it. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 14:57, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
I'm thinking that's may better idea as well. Anyways, it shouldn't be long until something else shows up, if it's true. I've already reverted the re- addition twice. – Connormah (talk) 15:02, 17 December 2013 (UTC)
Yes. Err on the side of caution. Google shows there was a similar rumor a couple of years ago. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 15:03, 17 December 2013 (UTC)

IP 54

I've pointed out to Mark Arsten that the IP you reported and he declined to block is apparently a sock of blocked user User_talk: μηδείς (talk) 03:01, 31 December 2013 (UTC)

Very good. Thank you. I wonder if there's a practical way to look at the "contributions" of an IP range? ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:12, 31 December 2013 (UTC) (talk · contribs) (talk · contribs) (talk · contribs)

Too large a range to block, but at least awareness is raised. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:15, 31 December 2013 (UTC)

please cease the playground-level back-and-forth

These exchanges are an embarrassment. You are failing to assume good faith. You are not being civil. You are engaging in personal attacks. You are disrupting Wikipedia to make (some kind of) a point. Either grow up and start improving the encyclopedia, or repair to an elementary school playground and spare the rest of us your petty childishness. —Steve Summit (talk) 14:31, 31 December 2013 (UTC)