User talk:Buster7/Archives/2008/November

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Ge zijt over 't algemeen wel just (en 't is lang :p). Ma 'k zen ni zo zeker over uwe zin this will also lead to a new language consciousness. omdat de mensen ier vooral un identiteit (er)ontdekken voor tegen de Fransen te "vechten" [figuurlijk] (en ook voor onafankelijkeid te willen) maar nie voor tegen de Nederlanders te kunnen zeggen da we een andere taal praten... De meeste mensen kunnen nie anders dan denken da we dezelfde taal praten: niemand schrijft iets op in 't Vlaams. Gevolg is: groeiend bewustzijn maar niet elemaal op taalkundig gebied... Btw, kende al de website ? Da moette ne keer lezen. Verstade mijn Vlaams? Do you understand my Flemish? I can repeat it in English if you want.. SPQRobin (talk) 15:31, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

Ik pies dannek it kan verstaan...mor mischien nie. Can you translate into English so that I am sure that I understand? I will move a copy to my talk page. Thank you very much!--Buster7 (talk) 12:59, 4 November 2008 (UTC)


Well done, you and your team, Buster. You got your man home!

I think the trick is sticking with him now the real work starts. ;) Alastair Haines (talk) 09:06, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Great challenges face us as a people. But we now face them a team. I voted for him and worked for him because he will bring us together, unify us, make us whole. There are many rivers to cross. A new and bright future is possible because of what was decided yesterday. I pray that this man will continue to be a leader for America and for the World. We have been without a guide for so very long.--Buster7 (talk) 12:06, 5 November 2008 (UTC)
And let's not forget the mountains. Mountains which we, who heeded the call to a new and better future, must climb. And on the mountains we must pray that this great and saintly man, this light in the darkness, will lead us to reach out to the climbers on the other team, even though they followed another path. Reach out to them because we are all united by a common humanity. Can we? Yes we can--and must— reach out to each and every one of them as they cling to the precipice of hope in the ice storm of loss, huddled together against the sour winds of uncertainty. Reach out and knock the bastards into the abyss embrace them. For the sake of America. And the world. And all humankind. And my gerbil Derek. Hallelujah! — Writegeist (talk) 23:38, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
Wait just a minute. I don't mind rowing a little bit, but I'll be damned if I'm gonna climb some God forsaken MountAIN!!!! The last time I tried to climb the steps at the Lincoln Memorial I only made it part way before collapsing into a huddled mass of OLD! And did anyone help? Of course not. I had to tumble down the steps till I reached solid ground. See you @ Sara's Place!--Buster7 (talk) 00:04, 7 November 2008 (UTC)
I'm in the same boat. Or on the same steps, or something. But no problem. Sarah says we can borrow the gubernatorial helicopter if it hasn't sold on eBay by then. — Writegeist (talk) 01:08, 7 November 2008 (UTC)


Retrieved from Palin/Talk

My time in the brig did not go to waste: I learned, for instance, that Notability, WP's grand old warhorse, has been wrongly deployed both here and at McCain.

Notability is a criterion for inclusion of the topic or person in WP, not the content of the article. All arguments and negotiations re content that are predicated on notability are irrelevant. Had I known this sooner, what has looked to me like multiple suppressions and subversions might have been prevented, with considerable benefit to the encyclopedic depth and reliability of the articles in question. See WP:NOTABILITY and WP:Notability (persons). Let's, er, take note.

Surprisingly the food was OK, thank you for asking; and on a clear day, if I stood on tippytoe on my bunk-buddy's head, I could see Russia under that "little tent of blue which prisoners call the sky", so I have volunteered as Secretary of State in the Obama administration. — Writegeist (talk) 05:56, 6 November 2008 (UTC)

Not quite. For there to be an article, there are strict rules about the notability of the subject. Once there is an article, though, we still don't just jam in any random facts. Every fact in the article must be in some way notable, but will generally not be notable enough to have an article all to itself.
The standards are different, and the particular policies you referred to don't apply to content, but there are some standards. In particular, WP:NNC says: "However, because of the nature of an encyclopedia, the concept of notability nonetheless affects article content. Treat each aspect with a weight appropriate to its significance to the subject." "Significance" and "notability" are pretty much synonymous. -- Zsero (talk) 08:34, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
Operative word is "affects". NNC states: Notability guidelines do not regulate the content of articles, except for lists of people. Instead, various content policies govern article content. (Emphasis added.) Furthermore: Notability guidelines do not directly limit article content. (Emphasis added.) Notability is not a criterion for inclusion or exclusion of content; the criterion for that is compliance with WP content policy etc. Notability affects only the weight given to content. The fact remains: "notability" has been misused here as a means of limiting, removing and suppressing content that fully complies with WP content policies. — Writegeist (talk) 17:29, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
To me, the operative sentence of NNC is the last one: "Keep in mind that an encyclopedia article is a summary of accepted knowledge regarding its subject, not a complete exposition of all possible details." When people say that an individual fact is not notable, they're generally referring to some combination of this, WP:WEIGHT, and/or WP:IINFO. Oren0 (talk) 17:37, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
The word "notability" is used informally as a shorthand for whether material is significant and relevant enough, as evidenced by the weight of reliable sources, for inclusion in the article. So you are right that the notability guidelines do not rule. But they do share some features - the requirement that things be sourced, the notion that things be of due WP:WEIGHT, etc. Various guidelines have been proposed for content inclusion within an article but they have all been rejected and nobody has come up with a complete formulation for editor discretion here. The closest I've seen is that content proposed for an article should bear some significant relevance to the notability of the subject of the article. If you propose to add a Tina Fey joke and people say "that's not notable", they do have a point - they're just using the word in a different sense. Hope that helps. Wikidemon (talk) 20:56, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
Informed and insightful. Danke, Wikidemon. — Writegeist (talk) 21:00, 6 November 2008 (UTC)


But I have a feeling these guys are getting a paycheck for this. I wonder how long they will try to keep it up.Factchecker atyourservice (talk) 22:47, 8 November 2008 (UTC)

Will you get a load of this guy? He's stalking my edit history and lashing out at me on the talk page for making this comment. Am I not allowed to make private comments to other editors?Factchecker atyourservice (talk) 23:14, 8 November 2008 (UTC)
Howabout this funny one. AP, which stands for Associated Press, may also stand for Anti Palin or Anybody but Palin. GoodDay (talk) 23:31, 8 November 2008 (UTC)


You managed to keep your composure throughout and despite. Well done. Fcreid (talk) 00:49, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

Thank you

CopyeditorStar7.PNG The Copyeditor's Barnstar
For your constant help making Wikipedia a nice place for all of us to stay. Miguel.mateo (talk) 14:40, 9 November 2008 (UTC)
Seconded. You're a great asset to Wiki, Buster. Not only do you give time to the project, but you give time to the people who make up the project. You are the most creative team-player I've met on Wiki. You are imaginative and human about encouraging others towards sticking with what they're doing here. I'll be cheeky, you remind people "We can do it!"
Thanks for the "Lucky Penny", that's a perfect barnstar for Miguel, I'm honoured to be given one as well. I'll make a point of passing them on! Alastair Haines (talk) 22:57, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

Happy Thanksgiving!

Happy Thanksgiving, Buster7/Archives/2008!
As we all sit down at the dinner table and say our thanks today, I would like to give thanks to you for your wonderful contributions and wish you a very happy Thanksgiving. May your turkey and ham satiate you until next year!
Kind regards, – Obento Musubi (CGS) 02:15, 28 November 2008 (UTC)
A traditional Thanksgiving dinner.
To send this message to another friend, please paste {{subst:User:The Obento Musubi/Thanksgiving | ~~~}} on their talk page.

Saint Sarah

Sincerely sorry to see you bow out. You did sterling work there, particularly during the period when it really mattered. The parting shot, elegantly delivered, was highly accurate. — Writegeist (talk) 19:18, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

Black Swans.jpg

Pls note Canadian spelling applies on Cdn articles

I just reverted your edit of "centred" to "centered" on Cranbrook (electoral district), as "centered" is a US-only spelling and this is an article about a Canadian topic. Please be wary of such edits in future (Cdn "centre", "theatre" etc....).Skookum1 (talk) 16:29, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

Considering that you're Flemish or Dutch, how would you feel if Dutch words and placenames were put in German versions?Skookum1 (talk) 16:30, 19 November 2008 (UTC)
In answer to your question, I wouldn't feel anything since I am neither Dutch nor German. But, I DO understand your meaning and apologize for any offense. It was not intentional.--Buster7 (talk) 23:48, 19 November 2008 (UTC)
I wasn't meaning to be heavy-handed about it, also; just the other day in another article someone made a spelling change on a Canadian article with the justification "since most people who read Wikipedia are Americans, American spelling shoudl be used"...which caused quite a bit of hilarity actually for those of us who saw it...."centred" is an odd one because "we" usually think only of the noun and the present tense of the verb; but it applies to the past tense/adective as well.....Skookum1 (talk) 23:54, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

Favor #32/Feb2009

BTW...Is there some copy-editing that I forgot to do? Let me know. The reason I stopped by was to ask for some help to make editing easy for me. I"m sure there must be an easier way to do something...

  • I'm involved with the Rescue Squad, saving articles (mostly created by newbies) that are up for Deletion. I google for more information pertaining to the topic from different angles...looking for some meat to put on the bare bones. Then I come back to the article, add it and add the reference...
  • So, right now, I have to type in the long and complicated address ( example: http;//www___/______/28749%80/blah/blah/blah/blah/blah.pdg...) mistakes in transfer are common and very time consumming. Ive tried to cut/copy/paste but I must be doing something wrong. It doesnt work. I thought to myself "there must be an easier, less problematic and faster way than to have to type it out all the time.."...That leads me here to Mateo, my friend, the problem solver. Any ideas?

also, Good luck with the above negotiations regarding Images. I see that you have made it all the way to "Grand Wizard of Images, Elcobbola", who seems to be quite helpful. (I always knew there were various "wizards" around. It only makes sense to have one individual final source to makes decisions and provide guidance, each in his/her arena of interest. Congrats that you seem to have made it "behind the curtain'. You can depend on the answers you get from "a wizard"--Buster7 (talk) 12:48, 12 February 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for the compliments, the battle in converting the euro collector articles to FL is still not finished and IMO it's a very soft ground to step on. I want to do a good copy edit of the Finland article and then submit it to see what happens. If you have time, please take a look at the whole Finland article. I am running out of time these days, but I contribute whenever I can.
With regards to your problem, yes indeed, it is a very painful process. But for me copy and paste works great to create a <ref>{{cite web | url= | title= | publisher= | accessdate=}}</ref> where ever I need references. What browser do you use so I can tell you exactly how does that work better for you (Microsoft Internet Explorer, Firefox, Opera, Safari ... etc.)? Let me know. Miguel.mateo (talk) 00:52, 13 February 2009 (UTC)
Microsoft Internet Explorer.--Buster7 (talk) 20:58, 13 February 2009 (UTC)
Try going to the url you want to reference to, click in the icon shown in the url bar as in the picture, then press Ctrl C (to copy), you should be able to go back to Wikipedia edit box and press Ctrl V to paste the URL. That is what I usually do. I hope it helps. Thanks, Miguel.mateo (talk) 23:51, 13 February 2009 (UTC)


Messages from Former Presidents

  • "Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. The cost of one modern heavy bomber is this: a modern brick school in more than 30 cities. It is two electric power plants, each serving a town of 60,000 population. It is two fine, fully equipped hospitals."....Dwight Eisenhower
  • "We stand at the edge of a New Frontier:the frontier of unfulfilled hopes and dreams, a frontier of unknown opportunities and beliefs in peril. Beyond that frontier are uncharted areas of science and space, unsolved problems of peace and war, unconquered problems of ignorance and prejudice, unanswered questions of poverty and surplus."....John Kennedy
  • "With malice toward none; with charity for all; with firmness in the right, as God gives us to see the right, let us strive on to finish the work we are in; to bind up the nation's wounds; to care for him who shall have borne the battle, and for his widow, and his orphan — to do all which may achieve and cherish a just and lasting peace, among ourselves, and with all nations."....Abraham Lincoln
  • "We cannot learn from one another until we stop shouting at one another, until we speak quietly enough so that our words can be heard as well as our voices."...Richard Nixon
  • "May God guide this wonderful country, its people, and those they have chosen to lead them. May our third century be illuminated by liberty and blessed with brotherhood, so that we, and all who come after us, may be the humble servants of thy peace....Gerald Ford
  • "Mankind must put an end to war or war will put an end to mankind"....John Kennedy
  • "I have seen war. I have seen war on land and sea. I have seen blood running from the wounded. I have seen the dead in the mud. I have seen cities destroyed. I have seen children starving. I have seen the agony of mothers and wives. I hate war"....FDR

The purpose of Wikipedia

The purpose of Wikipedia is to create a high-quality, free-content encyclopedia in an atmosphere of camaraderie and mutual respect among contributors. Use of the encyclopedia to advance personal agendas – such as advocacy or propaganda and philosophical, ideological or political dispute – or to publish or promote original research is prohibited.

— Anonymous Editor


Dispute resolution, Bible style - and actually an excellent model on Wikipedia as well.

If your brother sins against you, go and show him his fault, just between the two of you. If he listens to you, you have won your brother over.
But if he will not listen, take one or two others along, so that 'every matter may be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.'

If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, treat him as you would a pagan or a tax collector.
— Matthew 18:15


As stated at Wikipedia:Verifiability:

The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth—that is, whether readers are able to check that material added to Wikipedia already has been published by a reliable source, not whether we think it is true. Editors should provide a reliable source for quotations and for any material that is challenged or is likely to be challenged, or the material may be removed.


Maxim of Quality


  • Do not say what you believe to be false.
  • Do not say that for which you lack adequate evidence.


  • The true means of being misled is to believe oneself finer than the others....Duc de La Rochefoucauld
  • All too often arrogance accompanies strength, and we must never assume that justice is on the side of the strong. The use of power must always be accompanied by moral choice....Theodore Bikel
  • Think thru the implications of each new edit....anon GFE

Useful comebacks from other editors

  • "Rather than reverting, discuss disputed changes on the talk page. The revision you want is not going to be implemented by edit warring"......From Editor:HughD
  • "I understand it this way" is all I have said".......From Editor:KillerChihuahua
  • " violated if the distinction had no objective and/or reasonable justification, it did not pursue a legitimate aim, and/or it was not proportionate to the aim pursued."......From Editor:Lingoist
  • "I plan on addressing the concerns raised and working to improve in the next several months".....From Editor:Download
  • "Please reconsider your words before you type them...and then again before you save them"......Editor:Supermark
  • "The smart thing to do when you offend somebody, if it is unintentional, is to retract the offensive remark....Editor:Jehochman
  • ".....when I login to Wikipedia, (I try) to do my best, and not dwell on the things (Conflicts, edit wars, etc.) that I can not change"....Editor:Ched
  • " a propagandist reason for starting the war, no matter whether it is plausible or not"....Editor:AHitlore
  • "DO NOT subvert the discussion"........Editor:Walter Allen Simpson

Wiki Essays

Wikipedia:Advice for new administrators

Wikipedia:The role of policies in collaborative anarchy

The Durova Incident (by JzG)

[ Dealing with harassment on wikipedia by Use

Stonehenge Total.jpg

r talk:JzG|User:JzG]


Disjoncteur HT-fig5.svg

Lacon, Il

Lacon 1091.jpg
Disjoncteur HT-fig5.svg


2005 Penny Obv Unc D.png ]]United States penny, obverse, 2002.png

Edit Summary

When editing an article on Wikipedia there is a small field labeled "Edit summary" under the main edit-box. It looks like this:

Edit summary text box

The text written here will appear on the Recent changes page, in the page revision history, on the diff page, and in the watchlists of users who are watching that article. See m:Help:Edit summary for full information on this feature.

Filling in the edit summary field greatly helps your fellow contributors in understanding what you changed, and, perhaps, why you made the change. Filling in the edit summary field, especially for big edits or when you are making subtle but important changes, like changing dates or numbers, is a courtesy to other editors. Ease of finding edits on watchlist pages and the like is an added bonus. Thank you. --Buster7 (talk) 11:33, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

categorical syllogism

any valid forms of categorical syllogism that assert a negative premise must have a negative conclusion.


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