User talk:Dicklyon

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Contents

Original Barnstar.png The Original Barnstar
I'm not sure why you haven't picked up a bevy of these already, but thanks for all your effort, particularly in tracking down good sources with diagrams, etc., on the photography- and color-related articles (not to mention fighting vandalism). Those areas of Wikipedia are much richer for your work. Cheers! —jacobolus (t) 02:05, 27 February 2008 (UTC)


Barnstar-camera.png The Photographer's Barnstar
To Dicklyon on the occasion of your photograph of Ivan Sutherland and his birthday! What a great gift. -User:SusanLesch 04:40, 23 May 2008 (UTC)


Allaroundamazingbarnstar.png All Around Amazing Barnstar
For your hard work in improving and watching over the Ohm's law article SpinningSpark 00:59, 18 January 2009 (UTC)


Original Barnstar.png The Original Barnstar
For your improvements to the Centrifugal force articles. Your common sense approach of creating a summary-style article at the simplified title, explaining the broad concepts in a way that is accessible to the general reader and linking to the disambiguated articles, has provided Wikipedia's readership with a desperately needed place to explain in simple terms the basic concepts involved in understanding these related phenomena. Wilhelm_meis (talk) 14:29, 6 May 2009 (UTC)


Surreal Barnstar.png The Surreal Barnstar
For your comment here which at once admits your own errors with humility yet focusses our attention upon the real villain Egg Centric (talk) 17:09, 9 February 2011 (UTC)


Barnstar-camera.png The Photographer's Barnstar
For your great contribution to Wikipedia in adding pictures and illustrations to articles improving the reader's experience by adding a visual idea to the written information.--Xaleman87 (talk) 05:57, 26 February 2014 (UTC)


Special Barnstar Hires.png The Special Barnstar
I could not find a barnstar for standing up to an outrageously unjust block so you get a special one. Hang in there. В²C 23:25, 3 February 2015 (UTC)


Resilient Barnstar Hires.png The Resilient Barnstar
For your work in standardising article titles in line with the now consistent MOS:JR guidance, I present you this accolade. Your continued work in this regard, and in others, has been appreciated. It may have taken years, but much was accomplished. RGloucester 14:44, 30 July 2016 (UTC)

thanks but[edit]

Thanks for the !vote at Talk:Trübsee, but could you move it to the correct section? Andrewa (talk) 05:55, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

Done. Dicklyon (talk) 06:00, 2 February 2017 (UTC)
Thanks! Andrewa (talk) 10:47, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

User talkpage reversion[edit]

Hi Dicklyon, I'm curious as to how you came to/why you saw fit to make a 3rd party 'drive by' edit to my talkpage on behalf of User:Checkingfax? --Kevjonesin (talk) 06:46, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

I think my reasoning was well expressed in the edit summary. See if you agree. Dicklyon (talk) 06:48, 2 February 2017 (UTC)
Or, instead of "cut it out" you could double down in being that way, which I see you have done. Oh, well. Dicklyon (talk) 00:42, 3 February 2017 (UTC)

Regarding recent refactoring/deletion in my user space and name calling[edit]

--Kevjonesin (talk) 11:22, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

WP:ANI notice[edit]

Information icon There is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Kevjonesin (talk) 13:27, 2 February 2017 (UTC)

Congratulations...[edit]

...on being published. If you have time you should write a quick essay on how you managed to write it in a style different from the one you are accustomed to using. It seems to be an inordinately difficult task for some folks. Primergrey (talk) 01:06, 6 February 2017 (UTC)

It's really not a big deal to follow a style guide. And I wouldn't say that WP is what I'm accustomed to; I never did LQ before (but I like it), and most styles do use Title Case for titles and headings; for good reasons, WP does not. It's all good. Dicklyon (talk) 01:25, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
Oh, one more thing: buy a copy: [1]. Or email me for a free preview. Dicklyon (talk) 05:47, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
Nice, congrats. I'll suggest the book to my local library. Back in the day I knew a blind fellow, Harvey Lauer, who tested and promoted one of the first braille-to-sound machines (added link), which at the time seemed to be a pioneering machine in the field (don't know if that's related to the book, and haven't thought of Harvey in years). Randy Kryn 18:53, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
Thanks for that, Randy. My stuff goes the other direction, analyzing sound rather than producing it, mostly. Dicklyon (talk) 20:38, 6 February 2017 (UTC)

Bad faith[edit]

In short, a "bad faith user" (as you can probably guess) is just a user that primarily edits in bad faith. DarkKnight2149 01:53, 6 February 2017 (UTC)

Oh, like a bad-faith user! I get it! Dicklyon (talk) 01:58, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
I guess you didn't get my friendly hyphen ribbing. Dicklyon (talk) 01:59, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
Ah, I see. I guess I didn't. DarkKnight2149 02:02, 6 February 2017 (UTC)
It worked better here. Less subtle, right next to a relevant heading. Dicklyon (talk) 02:12, 6 February 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Katherine Johnson[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Katherine Johnson. Legobot (talk) 04:24, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

Fringe[edit]

Information icon There is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Slatersteven (talk) 18:49, 7 February 2017 (UTC)

Generation Snowflake move closure[edit]

Hi, this is just to let you know I intend to ask for a review of the closure. Normally a non-admin shouldn't make a "no consensus" closure of a move or deletion discussion and I think this needs to be re-examined. REgards. MaxBrowne (talk) 09:21, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

Move review for Generation Snowflake[edit]

An editor has asked for a Move review of Generation Snowflake. Because you closed the move discussion for this page, or otherwise were interested in the page, you might want to participate in the move review. MaxBrowne (talk) 09:32, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

Rail line templates[edit]

Just as an FYI, I haven't been touching the templates of any rail line move discussion that has been closed as move. I've been trying to cleanup the articles to use the new title, but didn't want to mess with the templates since I'm not particularly familiar with the rail line ones. TonyBallioni (talk) 18:31, 12 February 2017 (UTC)

Right; me, too. I tried fixing a template or two some time ago and got scolded for not understanding how their names and contents interacted with other stuff, so I'll let that to the project experts to decide what to do with. Dicklyon (talk) 19:26, 12 February 2017 (UTC)
And thanks for all your work closing and cleaning up! Dicklyon (talk) 19:26, 12 February 2017 (UTC)
Yes, the last thing I want is to get into a discussion on the complexities of rail line templates, so leaving it to them does seem to make the most sense. Not a problem on the closes. I hate seeing backlogs, and decided to take a break from the NPP backlog today. Glad to be of help. TonyBallioni (talk) 19:42, 12 February 2017 (UTC)

That's what I said[edit]

What I said was it is not an analogy, which it isn't. What I said in my edit comment was was "reflection from the ionosphere etc" -- the etc meant things like "refraction." The paragraph AS WRITTEN is incorrect. It should be re-written, and in fact I don't know any secondary source who would agree with evident intentions. I am re-reverting you edit until we clarify this. Using the word "analogy" as the previous edit said is incorrect -- it is NOT an analogy -- and WP needs to be correct. LaurentianShield (talk) 16:24, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

And my point was that light is a poor analogy for radio, since the straight-line propagation model is an approximation for short wavelengths, which is not so applicable to radio until you get up to pretty high frequencies (that is, your edit summary assertion that "they are exactly the same and do travel in straight lines" is not true enough to justify your edit). I'll see if I can find a source to support this interpretation of what Hertz was thinking, or something somewhat different that would support a rewrite. Dicklyon (talk) 16:50, 13 February 2017 (UTC)
Thanks for the response. I think you see that the problem I have is saying light and radio waves are merely analogous, not that they don't have different properties at different wavelengths (insofar as their interaction with matter). In fact I seriously doubt that Hertz would have thought they did. However, was he possibly wrong about the necessity of line-of-sight? A good source that I have right here is The Making of the Electrical Age by Harold Sharlin. According to a quote on page 90, Hertz believed radio waves needed to be focused with mirrors. This is a different issue altogether than not anticipating ionospheric reflection (which is the most important phenomenon in long-range propagation) or refraction (which actually hardly matters for ordinary radio waves). LaurentianShield (talk) 17:02, 13 February 2017 (UTC)
Well, books generally say he understood quite well the wavelengths, diffraction, reflection, etc. But I don't see any explaining why he dismissed practical use for communications and such. The stuff about straight lines is generally attributed to other scientists skeptical of Marconi, a bit later, before anyone thought of a reflecting layer in the atmosphere. Dicklyon (talk) 18:07, 13 February 2017 (UTC)
Maybe move this discussion to the Hertz Talk page? I started a thread: Talk:Heinrich Hertz#Removal of paragraph on radio wave/light analogy on it. --ChetvornoTALK 21:45, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

Bay Area WikiSalon invitation for February 22[edit]

Please join us in downtown San Francisco!
A Wikipedia panel discussion about journalism

The last Wednesday evening of every month, wiki enthusiasts gather at Bay Area WikiSalon to collaborate, mingle, and learn about new projects and ideas.

We allow time for informal conversation and working on articles. Newcomers and experienced wiki users are encouraged to attend. Free Wi-Fi is available so bring your editing devices. We will have beverages (including beer and wine) plus light snacks.


Please note: You should RSVP here, and bring a photo ID that matches your registration name. This also helps us figure out how much food and drink to bring in.


For further details, see: Wikipedia:Bay Area WikiSalon, February 2017


See you soon! Ben Creasy and Wayne | (Subscribe/Unsubscribe to this talk page notice here) | MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 06:47, 15 February 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Reza Aslan[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Reza Aslan. Legobot (talk) 04:24, 17 February 2017 (UTC)

Badgering[edit]

Your continual badgering of myself and other editors who disagree with you, as you did here is getting rather wearing. We may or may not be correct but we have a right to state our opinions without having them continuously questioned. Please stop it. Optimist on the run (talk) 05:38, 18 February 2017 (UTC)

How does my citing of observations from evidence get interpreted as questioning of opinions? Or badgering? I don't get it. Dicklyon (talk) 06:07, 18 February 2017 (UTC)
Ah, there were two parts to my edit you linked. In the second part, I pinged you to remind you that I had asked if you had any evidence, or if the presentation of evidence had changed your mind. I guess the answer is no to both. It's cool. Dicklyon (talk) 06:10, 18 February 2017 (UTC)
Anyway, since it closed just after I pinged you, I realize that may be annoying. Sorry about that. Dicklyon (talk) 06:12, 18 February 2017 (UTC)

Daily News[edit]

Hi. Booo. But on your comment that the title can't be partially italicized, yes, it can by using a 'DISPLAYTITLE' template. So that option is there, if you'd like to explore it or change your close. Thanks. Randy Kryn 18:02, 20 February 2017 (UTC)

Thanks for clarifying; I updated there. Dicklyon (talk) 18:56, 20 February 2017 (UTC)
I was wrong, on a practice edit the newspaper infobox seems to override any new 'DISPLAYTITLE' code. Am pretty sure there's a way around it, I've just never memorized it. Randy Kryn 21:14, 20 February 2017 (UTC)
Yes, a parameter would need to be added to the ibox, |italic title=no, so either {{DISPLAYTITLE}} or {{Italic title}} could be used external to the ibox. Also, the Italic title's "string" parameter makes it even easier: {{Italic title|string=Daily News}}  Paine Ellsworth  put'r there  08:43, 21 February 2017 (UTC)

Bay Area WikiSalon February reminder[edit]

Please join us in downtown San Francisco!
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Wednesday, February 22, 2017 at 6 p.m.


For details and to RSVP: Wikipedia:Bay Area WikiSalon, February 2017


See you soon! Ben Creasy and Wayne (co-coordinators) | (Subscribe/Unsubscribe to this talk page notice here) | MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 02:58, 21 February 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Ty Law[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Ty Law. Legobot (talk) 04:24, 25 February 2017 (UTC)

Undiscussed moves[edit]

I was very tempted to revert your move of Sutton Park Line on a technicality - you may have discussed on at WT:UKT, but you made no mention that you were doing so on the article's talk page. There may be other editors like myself who have specific railway line articles on their watchlist but not necessarily WT:UKT, so if you are discussing a move it is essential that notification is placed on the appropriate talk page. Please ensure you do this for any other articles you are discussing. Optimist on the run (talk) 22:56, 26 February 2017 (UTC)

Optimist, please do revert the move if you think it's incorrect or needs discussion. It's unlikely that I'm going comply with your request, since the people who care about such things all appear to be involved on the project page. Dicklyon (talk) 23:02, 26 February 2017 (UTC)
So you have full information about who's watching any given article? Interesting - please share how you do this. Optimist on the run (talk) 23:05, 26 February 2017 (UTC)
I'm only suggesting that most British rail fans who care about such things, such as yourself, are likely to be involved in the project. Others who are watching will see the move, with the link to the discussion, and can join in at that time, or revert the move. As I pointed out before, reverts are cheap; there's no big cost of an error, and errors are rare, so adding extra work is not justified except when there's reason to think the move might be controversial. Dicklyon (talk) 23:22, 26 February 2017 (UTC)
Do you believe you are following due process? If so, fine; if not, is your argument basically 'due process is too much like hard work' ? Rjccumbria (talk) 00:11, 27 February 2017 (UTC)
What process do you believe is "due" here? I'm following part of the process that I proposed at the project talk page, which so far nobody has objected to. The alternate process that Mjroots had me following before, involving lots of RM discussions on things that had no chance of being controversial, did get some pushback, and didn't even make him happy; it just created lots of extra work and noise for everyone. But let me know if that's that you would prefer. Dicklyon (talk) 00:16, 27 February 2017 (UTC)
As I understand it, before making a page move you are seeking the views of those watching the project page, but are not attempting to take on board the views of those watching the page to be moved. Offhand, it would seem to me that - whatever the fine detail of 'due process' - if the move doesn't merit discussion, it doesn't merit discussion with anyone: if it does merit discussion, then that discussion should be with everyone who has an interest in the page. The observation that those watching the project page have not objected doesn't address the more interesting question of what those left out of the discussion might feel about that approach. ('I have already discussed this with the people who matter, but I didn't think it was worth asking you' would be one interpretation of it.)
A simple mention on the talk page of each page under discussion that that a potential move is under discussion on the project page would seem to me to avoid any unnecessary apparent/unintentional discourtesy to those who are not 'railfanboys' but watch individual lines (perhaps because they are their local lines). That, I would have thought, could be done without too much extra effort by a standard message ; to minimise 'old ground being gone over again' it might be wise for the standard message to explain the methodology, and hence why objections to down-casing are unlikely to be sustained, but I would see that as advisable rather than essential.Rjccumbria (talk) 20:03, 27 February 2017 (UTC)
There certainly seems to be a case to answer for the Sutton Park Line. I think it should be reverted and discussed. G-13114 (talk) 22:51, 27 February 2017 (UTC)
I reverted that one per your request. We can discuss. Dicklyon (talk) 23:09, 27 February 2017 (UTC)
Each proposed move absolutely must be listed on the article’s talk page. Time and time again I have come across editors who have only a single—or very few—railway lines on their watch list, because their interest/expertise is for a particular locale. Useddenim (talk) 12:25, 22 March 2017 (UTC)

Cambrian Line[edit]

Just to let you know I've requested a reversion of the move of Cambrian Line at User talk:Anthony Appleyard, for reasons specified there. Incidentally, whilst reversions of edits can be considered "cheap", this does not always apply to page moves, especially where administrative actions are required. Firstly page moves often always require updates to any redirects to the page (such as Cambrian Coast Line). Secondly, where an administrator is required to move a page, reversion may be considered wheel warring, which is usually against policy. (In this case, reversion may be allowed, but I take a 0RR view of reverting admin actions, i.e. I choose not to). Optimist on the run (talk) 13:00, 27 February 2017 (UTC)

Yes, good, that's been reverted per your request; happy to discuss that one, even though the proposal to move it at the project page was unopposed for a week. Dicklyon (talk) 15:22, 27 February 2017 (UTC)

2017 Art And Feminism Wikipedia Editathon @ CCA[edit]

You are invited! - Friday, March 10 - SF CCA ArtAndFeminism 2017
Arts+Feminism logo
Please join us at the California College of the Arts'
Simpson Library
on Friday March 10, 2017, for
an event aimed at collaboratively expanding Wikipedia articles covering Art and Feminism, and the biographies of women artists!

--Jscarboro (talk)

Please comment on Talk:Donald Trump[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Donald Trump. Legobot (talk) 04:24, 5 March 2017 (UTC)

Dash/hyphen in a title?[edit]

I think List of highest funded equity crowdfunding projects needs a dash/hyphen in its title, though I am dumb as to exactly where. Can you help? --Izno (talk) 13:30, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

At least in highest-funded. Go for it. Dicklyon (talk) 15:44, 8 March 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Natalie Portman[edit]

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Please comment on Talk:Sean Spicer[edit]

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Mark Barr has been nominated for Did You Know[edit]

Updated DYK query.svg Hello, Dicklyon. Mark Barr, an article you either created or to which you significantly contributed,has been nominated to appear on Wikipedia's Main Page as part of Did you knowDYK comment symbol. You can see the hook and the discussion here. You are welcome to participate! Thank you. APersonBot (talk!) 12:02, 22 March 2017 (UTC)

Xxx Tunnel/tunnel[edit]

You might want work on fixing this titling. Useddenim (talk) 12:28, 22 March 2017 (UTC)

What do you have in mind? Did you notice some with unnecessary capitalization? Why not go ahead and fix them yourself? Dicklyon (talk) 02:57, 23 March 2017 (UTC)
Twin Peaks Tunnel. Working on other things; this seems to be your area of interest. Useddenim (talk) 15:12, 23 March 2017 (UTC)

Your invitation: Bay Area WikiSalon series at Noisebridge[edit]

Please join us in San Francisco!
A Wikipedia panel discussion about journalism

The last Wednesday evening of every month, wiki enthusiasts gather at Bay Area WikiSalon to collaborate, mingle, and learn about new projects and ideas. This month we are meeting at Noisebridge makerspace/hackerspace in the Mission near 16th Street BART (temporary change of venue). The good news is this means that you can bring spontaneous guests if you forget to RSVP!

We allow time for informal conversation and working on articles. Newcomers and experienced wiki users are encouraged to attend. Free Wi-Fi is available so bring your editing devices. We will have beverages (including beer and wine) plus light snacks.


If possible, please RSVP as it helps us figure out how much food and drink to bring in. For further details and to RSVP, please see: Wikipedia:Bay Area WikiSalon, March 2017


See you soon! Co-coordinators Ben Creasy and Wayne
(Subscribe/Unsubscribe to this talk page notice here) | MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 02:06, 23 March 2017 (UTC)

«Zeiss formula»[edit]

Dear Dick,

re: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeiss_formula

Under https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Zeiss_formula I've added the new address of the source in question.

--SR-7v (talk) 11:19, 23 March 2017 (UTC)

Thanks; I updated in the link in the ref on the article. Dicklyon (talk) 23:15, 25 March 2017 (UTC)

A favor, SVP[edit]

I wonder if you'd be so kind as to do a GA review, when the time comes, of Harry R. Lewis? I'd like to get it promoted to GA, and then through DYK, by mid-April. EEng 03:18, 24 March 2017 (UTC)

I could try; I have no experience doing GA reviews. Point me at some instructions or hints? Dicklyon (talk) 23:15, 25 March 2017 (UTC)
Thanks! Wikipedia:Good_article_nominations/Instructions#Reviewing, but also WP:GANOT. It's meant to be a quite lightweight process. We're not quite ready to nominate the article yet, though. EEng 03:19, 26 March 2017 (UTC)
I've made the nomination. If you're still willing to do this, if at all possible I'd like the review complete by about 4/7 because (as mentioned) I'd like to take to to DYK next in time for 4/19. Don't hesitate to tell me if you're not up to this now.
The expansion of Mark Barr has been most gratifying, hasn't it? EEng 21:06, 30 March 2017 (UTC)
I may not be up for it, as I'm pretty busy in RL and not up on the process, and it looks like a pretty meaty article. Yes, good work on Mark Barr. Dicklyon (talk) 22:54, 30 March 2017 (UTC)
Don't sweat it. Maybe another time. EEng 02:17, 31 March 2017 (UTC)

21st century fossil fuel regulations in the United States[edit]

Hello; a few minutes ago I moved what was the article "21st century fossil fuel regulations in the United States" to Draft:21st century fossil fuel regulations in the United States. I did this because it was and is seriously defective as an article (I thought it risked being sent to WP:AFD and deleted) but very promising as a draft -- simply, I demoted it in the short term in order to improve its chances in the medium term.

Most moves leave a redirect, but moves from article space should not. For those who have previously worked on this draft, it may seem to have disappeared. This is why I'm posting this message to the talk pages of Hmthorner, Alexis1621, Conservationyear, Fairweatherfriend, and Dicklyon. Please feel free to inform others, and to improve the draft, which I hope can soon become a fine article.

I'm not watching your talk page; if you have a question about the draft, please ask in Draft talk:21st century fossil fuel regulations in the United States. Thank you. -- Hoary (talk) 03:03, 28 March 2017 (UTC)

Reminder: Tonight is Bay Area WikiSalon at Noisebridge[edit]

Please join us in San Francisco!
A Wikipedia panel discussion about journalism

Details and to RSVP: Wikipedia:Bay Area WikiSalon, March 2017 (optional, but helpful for food and special needs accommodations)

We are meeting at Noisebridge makerspace/hackerspace (temporary venue change) near 16th ST BART in SF.


See you soon! Co-coordinators Ben Creasy and Wayne
(Subscribe/Unsubscribe to this talk page notice here) | MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 18:52, 29 March 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Robert Plant[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Robert Plant. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 1 April 2017 (UTC)

DYK for Mark Barr[edit]

Updated DYK query.svg On 1 April 2017, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Mark Barr, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that erection engineer Mark Barr had a business making rubbers, said bicycles stimulated ball development, and was elected to the screw committee? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Mark Barr. You are welcome to check how many page hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, Mark Barr), and it may be added to the statistics page if the total is over 5,000. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

Mifter (talk) 12:02, 1 April 2017 (UTC)

Re: your email[edit]

I do chime in on RM discussions where I think I have a valid opinion. There haven't been many de-capitalization discussions lately, except those I have instigated, but if you ever see some, feel free to wake me up. The making of lots of edits is made possible by sharp tools, such as AWB. For job titles, I have over 500 various rules for over 100 ranks/titles in different situations (followed by full stop, preceded by "promoted to", linked, unlinked, etc.), and for those I wrote a program that produces the rules in XML format that I can splice into an AWB settings file. Knocking out an article with a dozen cap fixes can be done in 15 seconds if there are not many false positives. If I stop to do a full half-hour copyedit on one out of a hundred articles, I'll obviously get four times as many articles edited than if I stop to do it on four out of a hundred. Happy editing! Chris the speller yack 15:17, 4 April 2017 (UTC)

Thanks. I looked at using AWB, but saw that it needs Windows, which put me off. Maybe some day. Dicklyon (talk) 15:24, 4 April 2017 (UTC)

Jeffrey Long[edit]

Please vote keep at Jeffrey Long. It is really hard working on that subject. You should check, what they did last days with the article near-death experience. If I work on other articles, there are not these problems. Wega14 (talk) 22:05, 4 April 2017 (UTC)

Yes, the anti-fringe people go overboard to not let Wikipedia talk about fringe topics. But I don't want to take on fixing that one. You can add refs from reliable news sources, and then I'll vote to keep. Dicklyon (talk) 22:49, 4 April 2017 (UTC)
I think it is not only anti-fringe people, that is a kind of religion. I try to work on that subject with academic research results. That subject is very interesting from point of artificial intelligence. Could you tell me please, if the sources I added so far to the article, are ok? Well, I don't know all these newspapers and TV-Stations, so I don't know, if that are serious one, which position they have and so on. So it is very difficult for me to find sources, which would convince other people. If you would still know one or two, I could add, please let me know. Thank you. Wega14 (talk) 15:36, 5 April 2017 (UTC)
Find some where the author of the news article is not Jeffrey Long and they might do the job. Dicklyon (talk) 00:59, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Erik Prince[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Erik Prince. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 11 April 2017 (UTC)

Lower case stuff[edit]

Greetings. You may find the recent activity and talk on the Richard O'Connor article interesting or amusing. Chris the speller yack 13:24, 12 April 2017 (UTC)

Odd that he would just revert when you've started a discussion. I followed up there. Dicklyon (talk) 14:31, 12 April 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Abraham[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Abraham. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 19 April 2017 (UTC)

Wednesday night you are invited! Bay Area WikiSalon[edit]

Please join us in downtown San Francisco!
A Wikipedia panel discussion about journalism

The last Wednesday evening of every month, wiki enthusiasts gather for the Bay Area WikiSalon series to collaborate, mingle, and learn about new projects and ideas.

We allow time for informal conversation and working on articles. Newcomers and experienced wiki users are encouraged to attend. Free Wi-Fi is available so bring your editing devices. We will have beverages (including beer and wine) plus light snacks. We will have some announcements and lightning talks from the floor, and a breakout session. This is our one year anniversary, so there will be cake!


Please RSVP here, and bring a photo ID that matches your registration name. This also helps us figure out how much food and drink to bring in.


See you soon! Ben Creasy and Wayne
(Subscribe/Unsubscribe to this talk page notice here) | MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 06:19, 26 April 2017 (UTC)

Nominee[edit]

Hello, and I hope all goes well. How about this fellow for the List of computer pioneers? Seems to me to fit the basic definition presented in the lead, which is quite loose but maybe still gets the job done. How does he look from your point-of-view? Thanks. Randy Kryn 02:39, 28 April 2017 (UTC)

Looks good. Dicklyon (talk) 04:14, 28 April 2017 (UTC)
Thanks, and done. Will see if it sticks. Randy Kryn 18:28, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Book spam[edit]

To all my talk page lurkers: buy my new book: Human and Machine Hearing: Extracting Meaning from Sound. Dicklyon (talk) 04:22, 28 April 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:David Ferrie[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:David Ferrie. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Sheela Murthy[edit]

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Please comment on Talk:Presidency of Donald Trump[edit]

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Everybody is invited to the May 31 Bay Area WikiSalon series![edit]

Please join us in downtown San Francisco!
A Wikipedia panel discussion about journalism

The last Wednesday evening of every month, wiki enthusiasts gather at Bay Area WikiSalon to collaborate, mingle, and learn about new projects and ideas. This month we are taking it on the road to Noisebridge makerspace/hackerspace!

We allow time for informal conversation and working on articles. Newcomers and experienced wiki users are encouraged to attend. Free Wi-Fi is available so bring your editing devices. We will have beverages (including beer and wine) plus light snacks. There will be periodic guided tours of Noisebridge. You can stay late, on your own! YeeHaw!


For details and to RSVP, see: Wikipedia:Bay Area WikiSalon, May 2017


See you soon! Ben Creasy and Wayne
(Subscribe/Unsubscribe to this talk page notice here) | MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 06:07, 24 May 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Hasan Salama[edit]

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Please comment on Talk:Gisele Bündchen[edit]

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Up your alley[edit]

You'll probably want to chime in here: Talk:List_of_mayors_of_Finsbury#Requested_move_10_June_2017. --В²C 21:11, 12 June 2017 (UTC)

That one doesn't look like it needs my help to fail. Dicklyon (talk) 05:05, 14 June 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Fabolous[edit]

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Please comment on Talk:Isaac Newton in popular culture[edit]

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The Bay Area WikiSalon is an unSalon this month![edit]

Please stay where you are for an unSalon!
A Wikipedia panel discussion about journalism

We are taking July off! Please gather your thoughts for changes that you would like to see in the next 10 months and present them at our July 26 WikiSalon.

Ordinarily, the last Wednesday evening of every month, wiki enthusiasts gather at the Bay Area WikiSalon series to collaborate, mingle, and learn about new projects and ideas.

We normally allow time for informal conversation and working on articles. Newcomers and experienced wiki users are encouraged to attend.


Mark your calendars now for Wednesday, July 26 at 6 p.m.! The venue will be the Noisebridge hackerspace/makerspace on Mission Street in San Francisco.


Sincerely, Ben Creasy and Wayne | (Subscribe/Unsubscribe to this talk page notice here) | MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 04:44, 28 June 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Wikipedia talk:Manual of Style/Biographies[edit]

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The Black Woman is God Edit-a-Thon in San Francisco, July 22[edit]

You're invited to The Black Woman is God Edit-a-Thon at SOMArts in San Francisco on Saturday July 22, 1-4 pm. It'll be at 934 Brannan Street (between 8th & 9th). Everyone is welcome to join this editing event, held in conjunction with The Black Woman is God exhibition to raise the online visibility of Black women artists and challenge the gaps in art history that erase or minimize Black women’s contributions as artists, activists and social change-makers. (Message requested by Dreamyshade and delivered on 14:23, 9 July 2017 (UTC). You can subscribe/unsubscribe to San Francisco event talk page notices here.)

Please comment on Talk:2017[edit]

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Please comment on Talk:Michael Jackson[edit]

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Please comment on Talk:Randy Quaid[edit]

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Move requests at Wikipedia:Requested moves/Technical requests concerning commas[edit]

Hi. This message is concerning your constant requests for article moves to remove the comma from article titles (e.g. here). Please cease these requests for the time being, and discuss and gain consensus for the inclusion or exclusion of a comma (per WP:JR, as you say) at a different wider community page, where you can gain more views on the issue. Too many of your requests have come back to the technical requests page to be moved back (e.g. here), and discussions have ensued (e.g. Talk:Buffalo Bill Jr.#Requested move 13 July 2017). Once you have a clear consensus on the topic from the wider community, then it would be best to start these requests again, but only after that. Thanks. -- AlexTW 07:22, 27 July 2017 (UTC)

Alex, there has been more than ample discussion as to removal of the comma for bios, and the consensus is clear. I have moved hundreds of them myself, using the WP:RMT mechanism for the technical moves. No further consensus is needed in that area, but I have avoided moving any articles about fictional/creative works, and Dicklyon should be fine if he does the same for the time being. Those titles constitute perhaps one percent of the total. ―Mandruss  10:01, 27 July 2017 (UTC)
Clearly not enough discussion if the requests come back under "Requests to revert undiscussed moves" and discussions are started for the moves. -- AlexTW 13:22, 27 July 2017 (UTC)
@AlexTheWhovian: Has that happened for ordinary bios? How many? Example? None linked above, as far as I can tell. ―Mandruss  13:31, 27 July 2017 (UTC)
Alex, the consensus is well established. A very few exceptions (not bios) have been discussed with different results. I don't think I'm treading in that territory with my move requests. These are bios that are several thousand down in the ranked lists of articles you get by searching for "Jr" in title. Basically very obscure people, because everyone that anyone has heard of was fixed already over the last couple of years. Dicklyon (talk) 06:14, 28 July 2017 (UTC)
The near uniformity of WP style is apparent in this search of the top 2000 page hits with "jr". Search the hits for ", Jr." and you'll find only a handful; a few movie and tv show titles, and some redirects. Every time removing a comma from a bio was discussed, the consensus was to follow the recommendation that had been cemented by a big RFC. We're still working slowly through the implementation on pages way down in popularity. Dicklyon (talk) 06:51, 28 July 2017 (UTC)
See Wikipedia_talk:Manual_of_Style/Biographies/2016_archive#About_done from over a year ago, when we were "about done". Dicklyon (talk) 06:57, 28 July 2017 (UTC)
Or see the RM close at Talk:Steamboat Bill, Jr., which reiterated that WP:JR applies to actual people and not movie titles. At the very least, respect protocol and begin a requested move discussion rather than unilaterally making title changes under the radar. If your cause is just, then you should have no problem reaching consensus with other editors. There is no reason not to request such moves out in the open. --Tenebrae (talk) 21:03, 2 August 2017 (UTC)
It didn't really reiterate; that was the closer's supervote position. Most discussion about application of WP:JR to non-bio topics have concluded in favor of following the style advice of no comma, with Steamboat Bill, Jr. as a notable exception. But here we're just talking about bios anyway. Dicklyon (talk) 03:58, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
Being sarcastic as you were to me on my talk page was hostile and unnecessary. You know very well that we address stylistic lower- and uppercasing in proper nouns and titles, which is why we don't title articles "TIME (magazine)" and "addidas." And as I recall, your objection to the closer was taken to appeal, and the appeal also supported the closer's decision. This desire to eliminate commas in movie and TV titles though they appear in the copyrighted / trademarked / onscreen titles is beginning to feel like an unhealthy obsession. --Tenebrae (talk) 13:34, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
The ironic thing is that I'm an editor and journalist and, like you, judging from the stylistic-tip box at the top of this page, a stickler for grammar. I'd like to think that if we can get past this unusual issue that we could actually be very good colleagues. --Tenebrae (talk) 14:57, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
Group hug! C'mon guv'nor, leave a few commas for the boys in the Antiquities Department to marvel over. Randy Kryn (talk) 17:20, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
Yes, group hug as Randy says. Sticklers are us. But the idea of "respect" coming by aping the on-screen style where the comma is concerned (on a film with not even the same words in the title in this case), while being OK with our style for the caps and such, seems rather unlike what I'd expect from a stickler. Hence my sarcastic question about where do you stop. Dicklyon (talk) 02:57, 4 August 2017 (UTC)
And if you'll re-read the close review you linked, you'll see that it was concluded that "the closing statement was unfortunately worded at best". At worst, it was way off base. Certainly not precedent setting. Dicklyon (talk) 02:59, 4 August 2017 (UTC)
First, I still don't believe sarcasm is constructive, and I think we're proving here that we can speak among each other with civility and in good faith. Second, yes, let's do re-read the appeal closing in its entirety, including the conclusion "I would also have closed it with the same result." We can't go around changing an author's titles. That's like saying Steinbeck wrote Of Mice & Men or that the Dick Wolf TV series is Law and Order.

I see a rough consensus that the ultimate decision to move is consistent with the state of the RM discussion at the time it was closed, but that the closing statement was unfortunately worded at best. In light of the strongly worded concerns about the closing admin's involvement from several editors, I have also independently examined the original RM and am satisfied that I would also have closed it with the same result.

--Tenebrae (talk) 21:32, 4 August 2017 (UTC)
Sure, but "I would also have closed it with the same result" isn't saying much when the complaint was primarily about the closer's previous involvement in the issue and his over-reaching super-vote in his closing statement. If an uninvolved editor had been given a chance to close it and closed it the same way but with a reasonable closing statement, you wouldn't have seen such an uproar about it. It still amazes me that he was not even admonished for that beyond "unfortunately worded at best". I think we're in agreement on MOS:AMP; why not on MOS:JR? Dicklyon (talk) 04:05, 5 August 2017 (UTC)
I don't believe we're in agreement about MOS:AMP if your feeling is that we should change the actual copyrighted, trademarked, common-name, onscreen title of movies and TV shows. MOS:JR is solely about people's names and not movie or TV or book titles. --Tenebrae (talk) 15:30, 5 August 2017 (UTC)
I don't know of any cases where we disagree w.r.t. MOS:AMP. Dicklyon (talk) 15:34, 6 August 2017 (UTC)
Tenebrae, you keep insisting "MOS:JR is solely about people's names and not movie or TV or book titles", like a broken record, but it simply is not true, and you know it, because we've been over this a dozen times before. We don't apply MOS:JR to a title if and only if it's consistently given with the comma both in RS and by the author/producer. Thus the result at, e.g. The Adventures of Brisco County, Jr., but the opposite result at Hank_Williams Jr.'s Greatest Hits, and numerous similar results for ships, monuments, libraries, schools, fictional characters, etc., etc. Please stop re-re-re-asserting total WP:BOLLOCKS. PS: I actually argued to keep the comma in the Williams case because it was a little more common in RS and in "official" materials, and this argument did not prevail, yet it is the one you are relying on.  — SMcCandlish ¢ ≽ʌⱷ҅ʌ≼  17:36, 20 September 2017 (UTC)

Requested moves[edit]

Hello, I would like to inform you that your requested moves have been carried out. --Kostas20142 (talk) 07:23, 28 July 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Yusof Ishak[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Yusof Ishak. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 4 August 2017 (UTC)

William and Helen Martin Murphy Ziegler, Jr. House‎‎[edit]

Please read the talk page, where I explain why I moved this back, and get a consensus for moving this before you do it again. Thanks. Beyond My Ken (talk) 06:04, 8 August 2017 (UTC)

Did you...[edit]

...plan to go to Wikimania? Randy Kryn (talk) 11:30, 9 August 2017 (UTC)

No plan. When/where? Dicklyon (talk) 01:21, 10 August 2017 (UTC)
Now, Montreal. WP:WYWH for that beer I owe you. Randy Kryn (talk) 14:16, 10 August 2017 (UTC)
You'll have to owe me still. Dicklyon (talk) 15:18, 10 August 2017 (UTC)
This might have worked. Randy Kryn (talk) 11:06, 11 August 2017 (UTC)
Nice one! I'd add a dash of this one. Dicklyon (talk) 04:30, 13 August 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Lindy West[edit]

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Please comment on Talk:Ching Hai[edit]

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WikiProject Investment[edit]

Hey there! I just re-launched the WikiProject Investment.

Feel free to check out the project and ping me if you have any questions.


A1 Houston Office Oil Traders on Monday.jpg

I'd like to invite you to join the Investment WikiProject. There are a lot of Investment related articles on Wikipedia that could use a little attention, and I hope this project can help organize an effort to improve them. So please, take a look and if you like what you see, help get this project off the ground and a few Investment pages into the front ranks of Wikipedia articles. Thanks!


Cheers! WikiEditCrunch (talk) 08:37, 24 August 2017 (UTC)

RM for Benjamin Franklin, Jr.[edit]

Your move of Benjamin Franklin, Jr. to remove the comma was controversial, so I have reverted it and started an RM at Talk:Benjamin Franklin, Jr.#Requested move 26 August 2017. You also did 2 moves back and forth on 28 July 2017. Please stop move warring. GeoffreyT2000 (talk, contribs) 04:35, 26 August 2017 (UTC)

Ah, sorry, careless of me not to notice that this one had been previously moved and moved back. Dicklyon (talk) 06:20, 26 August 2017 (UTC)

George Phillips Odom Jr.[edit]

If you move pages, such as this one, please don't forget to adjust/update the associated Wikidata item otherwise the links to the foreign language wikipedias will get lost.--Kmhkmh (talk) 19:12, 27 August 2017 (UTC)

@Kmhkmh: This is done automatically on the Wikidata side in most cases. It is good to verify after a day or two if you are concerned it might have happened that the script on the Wikidata side didn't take care of it, but in most cases I've seen, it works just fine. --Izno (talk) 19:19, 27 August 2017 (UTC)

And I have no idea how Wikidata works. Please tell me where to look for things to fix. Dicklyon (talk) 19:31, 27 August 2017 (UTC)

Well click on the Wikidata item link (among the links on the left side) and un the wikidata page look for the Wikipedia section/entry, it contains all language wikipedias and you can and and remove entries there. There you can remove the old name (now being a redirect or deleted) and then add the new name. That's one way to do it by hand at least.
However if a script is doing such changes automatically after a move as Izno says above, there is probably nothing to worry about (assuming it works reliably). I've just noticed that foreign language wikipedias were (still) gone shortly after the move as I have the article on my watch list.--Kmhkmh (talk) 20:01, 27 August 2017 (UTC)
Why would anyone need to do this anyway, except for the rare instance that a title being moved from is flat-out wrong and no redirect is left behind? Even if the wikidata-updating bot failed for some reason, the incoming reader from another Wikipedia would still end up at the right page, via the redirect left behind after the move.  — SMcCandlish ¢ ≽ʌⱷ҅ʌ≼  17:24, 20 September 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Dina Powell[edit]

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Please comment on Talk:Theresa May[edit]

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Please comment on Talk:Debbie Wasserman Schultz[edit]

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Please comment on Talk:Montgomery C. Meigs[edit]

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Little Ricky[edit]

Hi, I didn't know you made the request. It's one of the 'juniors' I had watched-listed back in the days of the comma wars, and before the intervening RMs. Are you saying that individual characters should be de-commaed if their character isn't the name of the show? I'd go the opposite way on that, but it could make for a good discussion, and I haven't memorized the guideline wording enough to know if characters are covered (I would think they would be allowed the comma). Haven't really thought of "Little Ricky" in years. Randy Kryn (talk) 22:23, 24 September 2017 (UTC)

Actually the common name should probably be Little Ricky! That's what the character was known as. Randy Kryn (talk) 22:27, 24 September 2017 (UTC)
Oh yeah, no doubt. Little Ricky is the name used throughout the article, and there are quite a few I Love Lucy show titles which use the name 'Little Ricky'. Randy Kryn (talk) 22:29, 24 September 2017 (UTC)
Little Ricky would be OK by me, except that it's already taken for the actor instead of the character; could fix that (most uses of the redirect look inappropriate as it is; could ask for a technical to fix this). The comma is not OK, as we don't do names that way. Dicklyon (talk) 22:30, 24 September 2017 (UTC)
See also this page and images. Dicklyon (talk) 22:39, 24 September 2017 (UTC)
Also most books. Not clear why you'd ask for a comma. Dicklyon (talk) 23:01, 24 September 2017 (UTC)
The doll you found does seem to give the edge to the commaless form, at least in how the show was portraying the name (unless a screen shot shows the comma). The actor using the name 'Little Ricky' gets quite a few views a day, but not many come from the redirect 'Little Ricky' (at least as recorded on the redirect page). Don't know why the actor would get the redirect for the character he played, but he does seem to have used and been given the name 'Little Ricky' during the show's run. But yes, if you want to go back to the commaless jr. of the fictional name for now I wouldn't object, unless someone comes up with a screen shot of the name with a comma. Randy Kryn (talk) 03:32, 25 September 2017 (UTC)
As a technical again? Dicklyon (talk) 03:34, 25 September 2017 (UTC)
Sounds good. Randy Kryn (talk) 03:39, 25 September 2017 (UTC)
I asked User:Jcc; you can comment on his talk page if you wish. Also, in looking for commas to take out, I came upon my old Caltech classmate Taras Kiceniuk Jr. and took his. Dicklyon (talk) 03:54, 25 September 2017 (UTC)
Okay, will drop a note there. Avoid Taras at the next reunion? Randy Kryn (talk) 03:59, 25 September 2017 (UTC)
Not my year, but I wouldn't mind seeing him. Dicklyon (talk) 04:08, 25 September 2017 (UTC)
Talk-page stalker just has to say: It's so very nice to see a calm discussion about commas and Jr. for a change. Yay!  — SMcCandlish ¢ ≽ʌⱷ҅ʌ≼  05:07, 25 September 2017 (UTC)

Brazilian political party moves[edit]

FYI, I procedurally changed all the technical requested you contested to RMs. TonyBallioni (talk) 03:16, 27 September 2017 (UTC)

Komma Warz[edit]

Hi. Could you maybe switch back the comma in the title Brisco County Jr. (character). Thanks. Episode summary, 10th episode, third season: "Brisco Feels Naked Without Something, But Can't Quite Put His Finger On It". Brisco, a fictional character with a name that rhymes with 'Crisco', has to time-travel into an online universe to retrieve his comma. Randy Kryn (talk) 10:17, 29 September 2017 (UTC)

Reliable sources seem to be comfortable with this styling of the name. Dicklyon (talk) 15:34, 29 September 2017 (UTC)
Yes, but seems that the current Wikipedia choice is to keep these commas for fictional representations. This one is different than Little Ricky for several reasons, the most important being that the entire show is named after this character and contains the comma (the page on the show is also a featured article), although any fictional character who doesn't, say, have a era-timed toy named after them, i.e. Little Ricky discussed above, would probably retain the comma. You could do an RM and reopen the comma wars (it's now a cold war, with small skirmishes), which would add clarity but would probably result with it being kept with the comma. Randy Kryn (talk) 16:03, 29 September 2017 (UTC)
Although, this seems to be timed perfectly for an interesting discussion, if you or a talkpage reader put it up for an RM. The source-consistency argument/guideline would say that yes, the comma should be taken off, because the sources are not overwhelmingly consistent. You've proven that above. I and hopefully others would say that, from another guideline or just from common sense, that the more familiar name in English should have prevalence, and that his core familiarity comes from the television show that is named after him (at least named after the commaful version of his alternate selves). Randy Kryn (talk) 21:02, 29 September 2017 (UTC)
You would argue that for TV shows, using the comma makes the name more recognizable? Even though that argument was considered bogus for people names? Dicklyon (talk) 01:19, 30 September 2017 (UTC)
And didn't we just go through this for a fictional character? And what would we do for the sound track [2], [3]? Why not just respect standard WP style instead of the occasional exception? And what's going on here? Can you move that horse's ear so I can see if it looks familiar? Dicklyon (talk) 02:01, 30 September 2017 (UTC)
Good finds, although the soundtracks were released way after the original creation, and someone thought it would be good to either remove the comma or try to diminish the 'Jr.' by downsizing it. The horse's ear can either be hiding the comma or, in an artistic sense, is acting as the comma (commas come in many shapes and species). I think a good consensus was made by exempting fictional characters or names of fictional works from the no-comma Jr., and there are not really that many of them compared to the real people whose articles have been defined as commaless. On Wikipedia, in this small corner of titling, works of art now have a right on their pages that people don't have on theirs, and it's a good historical remnant (like a diorama or stuffed passenger pigeons in museums) of when the Jr.-commas had their day. Randy Kryn (talk) 12:47, 30 September 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Stephen Miller (political advisor)[edit]

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Disambiguation link notification for October 2[edit]

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Wikipedia appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited List of events named massacres, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Odessa massacre (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

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Fixed. Dicklyon (talk) 06:13, 9 October 2017 (UTC)

100 000th edit[edit]

Congratulations with passing the milestone.--Ymblanter (talk) 06:08, 9 October 2017 (UTC)

Mostly just commas, dashes, and arguments, but thanks! Dicklyon (talk) 06:12, 9 October 2017 (UTC)
Ooh, you get a striking box: {{User 100,000 edits}}. There's a topicon version if you like those.  — SMcCandlish ¢ >ʌⱷ҅ʌ<  08:58, 11 October 2017 (UTC)
Done. Dicklyon (talk) 18:18, 11 October 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Manny Pacquiao[edit]

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A tale of two crooks[edit]

Two crooks, John Gotti and Bernie Madoff. On their respective Wikipedia pages Gotti is described as Italian-American whereas Madoff as simply American. Why specify one and not the other? A coincidence? Perhaps. Mtlkid (talk) 06:25, 11 October 2017 (UTC)

It's unlikely that there's any explainable relationship between those pages. If that motivates you to edit one or the other, you at least need to leave an edit summary to say what you're doing. You don't just add and remove things like ethnic identities without even a hint of a reason. Dicklyon (talk) 07:01, 11 October 2017 (UTC)
That was just one example; there seems to be a pattern on here. Why not be consistent? And what is there to explain? Is there a reason why Gotti's ethnicity is hyphenated and Madoff's isn't? Either way, there is nothing really to explain, but you have to remain consistent across the board. Mtlkid (talk) 19:40, 11 October 2017 (UTC)
Drive-by comment: Hyphenation is a matter of whether whoever's writing at the time bothered to read the WP:MOS material on when to use hyphens. "I am an Italian American" doesn't get a hyphen; "I'm Italian-American" does, because it's a compound adjective. Whether an ethnic term of this sort is used in a particular article is determined by what the sources do, and for recent subjects may also be a WP:ABOUTSELF / MOS:IDENTITY matter. There does not have to be consistency in terminology across all articles at all.  — SMcCandlish ¢ >ʌⱷ҅ʌ<  21:03, 11 October 2017 (UTC)
You completely missed this one. I guess it went over your head!! In other words, no comment.Mtlkid (talk) 21:22, 11 October 2017 (UTC)
M, your edits that I reverted removed "Italian-" in one place, and added "Jewish-" in another. I obviously could not have guessed that those were motivated by a desire for consistency. If you want to go that way, or for any kind of edit for that matter, leaving an edit summary that gives a clue to your intent will usually attract some help if it's needed, rather than a revert. So start over, heed the advice to look at WP:MOS and such if it bears on what you're trying to do. Movement toward consistency is a good thing, often appreciated, but not if it's just consistency with your own seat-of-the-pants idea as opposed to consistency with documented guidelines. Let me know if you have questions, and I'll be happy to help. Dicklyon (talk) 01:33, 12 October 2017 (UTC)
Apparently at least one editor found the addition of "Jewish-" to be offensive: [4]. I'm not sure why; it's well document that Mr. Madoff's fraud specifically took advantage from his Jewishness and Jewish friends, but maybe when writing about his wife this doesn't come off well. Anyway, my revert was primarily to get your attention to using edit summaries; I'll let others take on the more subtle and/or substantive issues of when it's appropriate to mention ethnic and national things. Dicklyon (talk) 05:24, 12 October 2017 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for October 14[edit]

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Wikipedia appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited Lone Wolf (Hank Williams Jr. album), you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Greatest Hits, Vol. 3 (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

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Fixed. Dicklyon (talk) 16:44, 14 October 2017 (UTC)

How do you find pages with Sr/Jr commas in their names?[edit]

  • How do you find pages with Sr/Jr commas in their names? Template:Intitle does not work here, as it seems to ignore punctuation. Anthony Appleyard (talk) 05:35, 17 October 2017 (UTC)
  • You wrote "There are only 112 more of these Jr Sr comma removal technicals to go after these, then we'll be done with them forever.)"; but likely people after now will still start new pages with Sr/Jr commas in their names, or rename pages putting the comma in. Anthony Appleyard (talk) 09:01, 17 October 2017 (UTC)
I got help from a couple of editors who knew how to query the database. See Wikipedia:AutoWikiBrowser/Tasks#Comma_before_Jr._and_Sr.; and User:Certes/JrSr/titles where I counted the blue links in the right-hand column after eliminating any that had moved already. Dicklyon (talk) 16:44, 17 October 2017 (UTC)
I don't mean there won't be a bit of ongoing maintenance, but no more batches needing technicals. Dicklyon (talk) 16:45, 17 October 2017 (UTC)
Speaking of which, I completed the most recent batch. Please let me know if I made any mistakes. SkyWarrior 01:57, 18 October 2017 (UTC)
Thanks! Dicklyon (talk) 03:05, 18 October 2017 (UTC)

Looks like Tom.Reding has done GSD G6 requests for the rest of the list, to have the redirects deleted so that all the moves can be automated. Seems smarter, so I'll relax and watch. Dicklyon (talk) 04:23, 18 October 2017 (UTC)

Page moves reverted[edit]

I have reverted your page moves of the Tubbs Fire, et al. Please discuss your proposed changes on the article talk page. See, for example, all other articles about wildfires in the modern era of the Incident Command System and wildfire naming (South Canyon Fire, Station Fire (2009), etc. That's how fires are officially named. If you disagree with this longstanding consensus and practice, please open a discussion on the relevant article talk page and gain consensus. Thank you. NorthBySouthBaranof (talk) 05:32, 18 October 2017 (UTC)

Note that I don't really have a quibble about older fires that predate any official naming system or protocol, so I'm unconcerned about Peshtigo, et al. My concern is with the very clear and standardized terminology in use at least since the 1960s by wildland fire agencies to designate fire incidents. NorthBySouthBaranof (talk) 05:37, 18 October 2017 (UTC)
I was not aware of that standard, and assumed that the usual WP style applied, which is to treat as proper names things that are consistently capped in reliable sources, specialist sources notwithstanding. Dicklyon (talk) 05:43, 18 October 2017 (UTC)
Journalistic sources vary, though. The Chronicle, the largest newspaper in Northern California, capitalizes it, as does the Arizona Republic, KRON, the Sacramento Bee, KQED, CNBC, and others. So *at the very least* we have a situation where journalistic sources vary. Official sources such as CalFire, USFS, etc. do not vary - they invariably capitalize it. Where one set of sources is inconsistent while another set is entirely consistent, I would argue that we should stick with those that are consistent. At a minimum, we have a situation that calls for a return to status quo and a discussion rather than reversion. If there's a clear consensus in favor of lower-casing it, I'll defer to that consensus. NorthBySouthBaranof (talk) 05:49, 18 October 2017 (UTC)
NorthBySouthBaranof—Actually, we tend to downcase if there's some evidence out there of such in publications. Bear in mind that organisational docs, and marketing and PR materials, tend to cap everything in sight. There's obviously a boosterism factor here—a kind of arms race. But serious publications tend to be more considerate of readers' eyes. So the fact that a certain fire organisation caps is only one consideration in our decision-making here. Note that WP downcases lots of names, such as those of models, hypotheses, theories ... even when coupled with a person's name. Constrast this with, say, US vs UK spelling: changing that is a definite no-no. Note that publishers upcase or downcase paper and chapter titles in reference lists according to their own house style, harmonised, rather than reproducing casing decisions made by the original publisher. By convention, though, academic journal and conference titles are titled-cased. Tony (talk) 06:00, 18 October 2017 (UTC)
Also "official", by which NorthBySouthBaranof means governmental, writing uses government publication capitalization expectations, which are extremely liberal with capital letters. WP follows its own style manual, not that of the US Government Printing Office or similar works. But all this is probably better saved for RM discussion. [end talk-page-stalker mode]  — SMcCandlish ¢ >ʌⱷ҅ʌ<  07:04, 18 October 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Wikipedia:Village pump (policy)[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Wikipedia:Village pump (policy). Legobot (talk) 04:23, 20 October 2017 (UTC)

WP:CLEAN[edit]

Edit-clear.svg

Hello Dicklyon:
You are invited to join WikiProject Cleanup, a WikiProject and resource for Wikipedia cleanup listings, information and discussion.
To join the project, just add your name to the member list. North America1000 05:14, 25 October 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Gillian Keegan[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Gillian Keegan. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 28 October 2017 (UTC)

Goddess forsaken mess[edit]

Hi, and belated Happy Halloween. Have you followed any of the various topics on the talk page of List of pioneers in computer science over the past couple of weeks? On a quick glance I didn't see your name (may have missed it) and I haven't read the wall-of-text sections as it seems many editors are handling the concerns well. The topic that your expertise would help clarify is the section (multiple sections?) on criteria for list inclusion. If I missed your comments in there, as Gilda Radner used to say, never mind. Randy Kryn (talk) 11:41, 1 November 2017 (UTC)

Yes, it's a mess. I notice Lynn Conway is not listed, even though she won the Computer Pioneer Award. I think we need to work out objective criteria, like which awards qualify one. Probably should include people who have been specifically called out in books as pioneers of some sort (slightly open ended, but not as much as now). It's still going to be western/male biased, I'm sure, but that's hard to help. Dicklyon (talk) 16:26, 1 November 2017 (UTC)

Speedy deletion declined: EMC Fundamentals[edit]

Hello Dicklyon. I am just letting you know that I declined the speedy deletion of EMC Fundamentals, a page you tagged for speedy deletion, because of the following concern: Not a recently created redirect - consider WP:RfD. Thank you. TonyBallioni (talk) 05:04, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

Jack Cade's Rebellion[edit]

Thoughts on caps for this? See [5] and [6] Regards, Cinderella157 (talk) 00:21, 4 November 2017 (UTC)

I don't see that much capping in sources besides the headings and titles in title case, and references to Jack Cade's Rebellion of 1450 and The Historical Literature of the Jack Cade Rebellion. Dicklyon (talk) 00:54, 4 November 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Template talk:Birth date and age[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Template talk:Birth date and age. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 5 November 2017 (UTC)

Why did you revert a constructive edit by N3bulous to the article CIE 1931 color space?[edit]

You reverted an addition to an image caption that said "The dotted curve is the Planckian locus". I see nothing wrong with this statement, because the Planckian locus curve in the picture really has superimposed black dots, and hence your reason for reverting ("It's not really a dotted curve") isn't actually valid.

Furthermore, I see no reason for mentioning the assumption of "good faith" in the edit summary either, because there's really nothing in the edit by N3bulous that could even remotely be interpreted as purposefully unconstructive. In my opinion, mentioning the Planckian locus curve in the image caption was a totally welcome addition, as it really is a piece of information that was missing.

Perhaps you would like to return the mention of the Planckian locus to the image text? If the wording "dotted curve" is not exact enough for your taste, how about e.g. "curve with superimposed black dots"? Nephelococcygia (talk) 19:06, 9 November 2017 (UTC)

I don't see the dotted curve you're referring to; just some tic marks outside the color region. I'm pretty sure it was a good faith edit, and didn't want to imply that I thought otherwise.. Dicklyon (talk) 17:25, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
Are you sure we're looking at the same picture? I can clearly see a dotted curve in this image near the center of the chromaticity diagram. Anyway, I took the liberty to return the mention of the Planckian locus curve to the image caption and elaborated it a little. I hope you find this ok. Nephelococcygia (talk) 19:12, 11 November 2017 (UTC)
Oh, I see. Yes, I was a bit confused. I don't think that a solid curve with dots on it should be called a "dotted curve", but otherwise it's OK. I'll fix if nobody has yet. Dicklyon (talk) 20:33, 11 November 2017 (UTC)

Removal of references in contravention of WP:LISTCRITERIA[edit]

Hi, in this edit, you removed numerous references, despite WP:LISTCRITERIA, which says, "In cases where the membership criteria are subjective or likely to be disputed ... it is especially important that inclusion be based on reliable sources given with inline citations for each item." Rather than just reverting your edit, I thought it more polite to ask you here if you would restore those references yourself. Thanks, Zazpot (talk) 19:10, 9 November 2017 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) But only one ref is needed in that list for him; see WP:OVERCITE.  — SMcCandlish ¢ >ʌⱷ҅ʌ<  01:54, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
SMcCandlish, look at the edit closely, and you will see that Dicklyon removed all of the references for Nakashima's entry. I hope you can therefore agree that my complaint was justified. Zazpot (talk) 16:14, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
I'm saying only the most reliable one should be put back, not that whole festival of over-citation. Nothing's precluding you from doing it.  — SMcCandlish ¢ >ʌⱷ҅ʌ<  16:47, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
I moved the references to the article that I created on him; if you think the references can also do some good in the list, feel free to put them back. Dicklyon (talk) 17:22, 10 November 2017 (UTC)

Hong Kong railway station names[edit]

Per Wikipedia:Naming conventions (capitalization), the word "Station" should be capitalised as these are proper names in the Hong Kong context. For any mass name changes, please seen consensus at WPHK. Thanks, Citobun (talk) 03:22, 12 November 2017 (UTC)

Are you saying that Hong Kong is special? Most countries don't treat these as proper names (e.g. see WP:USSTATION, WP:UKSTATION). What makes you think these are proper names? Dicklyon (talk) 03:25, 12 November 2017 (UTC)
Please join the discussion at Wikipedia:Village_pump_(policy)#RFC_on_Chinese_railway_station_title.2Fstyle_conventions. Dicklyon (talk) 03:28, 12 November 2017 (UTC)
And note that in many (most? all?) of the article where you re-capitalized Station, "Station" does not appear as part of the title in the infobox; and sometimes not in the lead. This and common use of lowercase in sources suggests that "Station" is not really part of the proper name. Just like in other countries. Dicklyon (talk) 04:11, 12 November 2017 (UTC)
They are treated as proper names in all government and MTR documents. Station is capitalised on/in the stations themselves. If the US and UK are "special" and have their own naming conventions, then I don't see why HK wouldn't either. Again, please seek consensus at WPHK. Citobun (talk) 08:06, 12 November 2017 (UTC)
@Citobun: The UK and US guidelines are fairly consistent with regard to capitalisation; they differ mostly in respect to the use of “Xxx station” vs “Xxx railway station”. Useddenim (talk) 13:10, 12 November 2017 (UTC)
Example of MTR use, example of Legislative Council use, example of government use, example of appearance on the stations themselves. Citobun (talk) 08:31, 12 November 2017 (UTC)
Sure, but wikipedia style is different. We don't follow official and governmental styles in capping. In that first doc, for example you find "The Smoke Extraction system was activated by the Environmental System Controller (ESC) in the Operations Control Centre (OCC) to relieve the workload of Station Controller (SC)." In WP, we would write "The smoke extraction system was activated by the environmental system controller (ESC) in the operations control centre (OCC) to relieve the workload of station controller (SC)." In the second doc, the fist station mentioned is Racecourse Station (MTR), which we represent in the article, as on the sign at the station, as just "Racecourse", because that's the station's name. No need to cap the station bit when appending it; lots of sources don't, e.g. [7]. Dicklyon (talk) 16:44, 12 November 2017 (UTC)
@Citobun: SCMP and HKFP both often use "Admiralty station" or "Admiralty MTR station", and furthermore use "Kwun Tong MTR line", "Kwun Tong line" and sometimes "Disneyland line" (without "Resort", which is incorrect). It would be valid to rename them to lowercase based on WP:RS though I'm not sure how much of this is down to a lack of editorial consistency on the newspapers' part. Jc86035 (talk) 01:26, 13 November 2017 (UTC)
I wouldn't argue that "Station Controller" or similar term should be capitalised as a proper name on Wikipedia based on the above source, as it most probably wouldn't be capitalised in common use or by news media. But a station name is much more ambiguous and not comparable to those other terms. SCMP is inconsistent – sometimes they capitalise "Station" within the station name, sometimes they don't – and other media outlets like EJInsight and The Standard tend to be more inclined to capitalise than otherwise. I ask that any changes of this magnitude please be agreed upon at WPHK. The discussion cannot be lumped in with Chinese railway stations as the context is entirely different – English is not an official language in mainland China, English station naming there is highly inconsistent, and there isn't really a popular English mass media to refer to. Thank you, Citobun (talk) 14:13, 14 November 2017 (UTC)
Of course, I know you would not argue to cap Station Controller. That's why it makes no sense to point to a doc that does that when arguing to cap the station name. Some styles cap a lot; WP doesn't. When sources are inconsistent, we downcase. What would suggest doing differently for Hong Kong? Dicklyon (talk) 16:07, 14 November 2017 (UTC)
And if EJInsight is "more inclinded to capitalized", but sometime don't as here, doesn't that mean they don't see station as part of the proper name? Dicklyon (talk) 16:11, 14 November 2017 (UTC)
Drive-by comment: signage and internal agency usage is irrelevant. Both signs and governmentese rampantly overcapitalize and we all know this. They're primary sources and not reliable for how to write encyclopedic English for a general audience. WP has its own style manual and does not follow the house style of a government transit agency or any other external publisher.  — SMcCandlish ¢ >ʌⱷ҅ʌ<  19:16, 12 November 2017 (UTC)

Railway stations[edit]

I've split the first two sections of User:Certes/Railway station into subsections. The two sections can probably be merged, but I've left them separate for now in case you were working through one of them. I've suggested a treatment for each article but it's very tentative, so please feel free to ignore it and do something else. The main open question for me is about historic stations: is the article about a museum called "Deadville Railway Station" (big R big S), or about the defunct "Deadville" railway station (small r small s)?

It's possible that some of the "probably incorrect" entries need to keep a capital R. For locations I've not heard of, I've assumed that "Foo Bar Railway Station" means the railway station in Foo Bar City, but it may sometimes mean the Bar Railway's facility at Foo City. Certes (talk) 23:02, 13 November 2017 (UTC)

Right, these need to be looked at carefully. I'll see if I can get some rail fans to help. Dicklyon (talk) 23:17, 13 November 2017 (UTC)
I know a bit about railways, if only in Britain, so I've had a look myself. I think just three need closer examination, and I've split those off. Certes (talk) 11:12, 14 November 2017 (UTC)

@Certes: can you get a count of total titles containing "railway station" in any case? Dicklyon (talk) 05:00, 14 November 2017 (UTC)

17,500; see VPP discussion for details. Certes (talk) 11:12, 14 November 2017 (UTC)


Spam Links?[edit]

Hi Dick, I see that you have removed some links to ControlSystemsAcademy.com. I thought the links would be useful to readers since the portal provides interactive examples not found on wiki. Could you please comment? Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by NorthEastResearcher (talkcontribs) 14:57, 22 November 2017 (UTC)

When an editor does nothing but add external links to a site, that's a WP:SPA, and the links are spammy until shown otherwise. What is your relation with the site? If you're involved (e.g. see WP:COI), it would be better to propose the links on the article talk pages, and let other editors decide. Dicklyon (talk) 02:36, 23 November 2017 (UTC)

What is Talk Page Theatre? Come find out![edit]

Please join us in downtown San Francisco!
Classic theatre meme

Come find out what "Talk Page Theatre" is all about! The last Wednesday evening of every other month, wiki enthusiasts gather at Bay Area WikiSalon to collaborate, mingle, and learn about new projects and ideas.


We allow time for informal conversation and working on articles. Newcomers and experienced wiki users are encouraged to attend. Free Wi-Fi is available so bring your editing devices. We will have beverages (including beer and wine) plus light snacks. We will be at the NEW Wikimedia Foundation offices! w00t!!!


Please note: You should RSVP here, and bring a photo ID that matches your registration name. This also helps us figure out how much food and drink to bring in.


For further details, see: Wikipedia:Bay Area WikiSalon, November 2017


See you soon! Ben Creasy, Nikikana, and Wayne | ( Subscribe/Unsubscribe to this talk page notice ) | MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 09:30, 14 November 2017 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Steve Bannon[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Steve Bannon. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 23 November 2017 (UTC)