User talk:Dicklyon

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A random style tip:

Another styletip ...

Downcase the generics

Correct (generic): The university offers programs in arts and sciences.

Correct (title): The University of Delhi offers programs in arts and sciences.

Incorrect (generic): The City has a population of 55,000.

Add this to your user page by typing in {{Styletips}}

Please add new talk topics at the bottom of the page, and sign with ~~~~ (four tildes will expand into your signature).
I will reply here, and expect you to be watching my user talk page, even if you are Nyttend.

Original Barnstar.png The Original Barnstar
I'm not sure why you haven't picked up a bevy of these already, but thanks for all your effort, particularly in tracking down good sources with diagrams, etc., on the photography- and color-related articles (not to mention fighting vandalism). Those areas of Wikipedia are much richer for your work. Cheers! —jacobolus (t) 02:05, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

Barnstar-camera.png The Photographer's Barnstar
To Dicklyon on the occasion of your photograph of Ivan Sutherland and his birthday! What a great gift. -User:SusanLesch 04:40, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

Allaroundamazingbarnstar.png All Around Amazing Barnstar
For your hard work in improving and watching over the Ohm's law article SpinningSpark 00:59, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

Original Barnstar.png The Original Barnstar
For your improvements to the Centrifugal force articles. Your common sense approach of creating a summary-style article at the simplified title, explaining the broad concepts in a way that is accessible to the general reader and linking to the disambiguated articles, has provided Wikipedia's readership with a desperately needed place to explain in simple terms the basic concepts involved in understanding these related phenomena. Wilhelm_meis (talk) 14:29, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

Surreal Barnstar.png The Surreal Barnstar
For your comment here which at once admits your own errors with humility yet focusses our attention upon the real villain Egg Centric (talk) 17:09, 9 February 2011 (UTC)

Barnstar-camera.png The Photographer's Barnstar
For your great contribution to Wikipedia in adding pictures and illustrations to articles improving the reader's experience by adding a visual idea to the written information.--Xaleman87 (talk) 05:57, 26 February 2014 (UTC)

Special Barnstar Hires.png The Special Barnstar
I could not find a barnstar for standing up to an outrageously unjust block so you get a special one. Hang in there. В²C 23:25, 3 February 2015 (UTC)

Resilient Barnstar Hires.png The Resilient Barnstar
For your work in standardising article titles in line with the now consistent MOS:JR guidance, I present you this accolade. Your continued work in this regard, and in others, has been appreciated. It may have taken years, but much was accomplished. RGloucester 14:44, 30 July 2016 (UTC)

Tireless Contributor Barnstar.gif The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
For an eternity of super-gnoming at WP:Requested moves to rein in entire swathes of article-titling chaos and bring them into order. I'm sure it can seem thankless work at times, so thanks!  — SMcCandlish ¢ >ʌⱷ҅ʌ<  19:41, 13 December 2017 (UTC)


Product names and hyphens[edit]

Hi! I see that you moved the Scania K-series, N-series and F-series to other names without a hyphen. These are not just some series of models with the letters K, N and F in them, but are consistently used product names since they were introduced more than a decade ago, and they have always been written with a hyphen and lowercase s. They are sold in most parts of the world, except North America.

They way I see it, your correction of spelling should not apply to these names, because then fixing other "misspelled" names like iPhone and iPod would be the next obvious step. And I don't beleive that was what you intended. The other "K-series" articles you renamed seems not to be any actual product names, so they are fine with me. Bergenga (talk) 00:02, 22 July 2018 (UTC)

When I looked at sources such as news, I saw consistent normal punctuation, without hyphen for K series as a noun, with hyphen in things where a modifier such as "K-series coach". Even the Scania pages usually have "SCANIA K-Series City Bus" and such. Where do you find it hyphenated as a noun? Dicklyon (talk) 01:40, 22 July 2018 (UTC)
@Bergenga: Hi, I'm one of Dick's page-stalkers. I have looked at his log and find a long list of improvements to article titles for product names. My question is: who has been spraying hyphens (not to mention caps) indiscriminately into these names? I'm sure the companies wouldn't be pleased that their names are being made less atractively and harder to read on en.WP. Tony (talk) 02:39, 22 July 2018 (UTC)
Yeah, "Foo X-Series" seems to be a double error for "Foo X series". It's not a compound modifier or anything else that would require a hyphen, and the "series" thing is a descriptive categorization like everything else we're lowercasing: Manx cat, Ford pickup truck, BBC documentary, etc. – the words after the proper names do not take capital letters. No one plays "FIFA Football", prefers "European Newspapers", has favorite "HBO and Netflix TV Shows", or likes "McDonalds French Fries" better than "Burger King French Fries". But iPhone and iPod don't have anything to do with this. There are no hyphens or descriptive categorizers present. If we had an article at the title "iOS-Devices" it would definitely be moved, however, to "iOS devices".  — SMcCandlish ¢ 😼  10:39, 22 July 2018 (UTC)
Mainstream media wouldn't follow the manufacturers naming scheme on product names for either of two reasons; because they insist on correct spelling, or because they have no clue. I believe the first is the case in the examples found on Google news search, while unfortunately the latter is the case here in Norway after they all fired their proofreaders many years ago. The current Scania website contains very little information at all, but here are some archived things I've found:
In fact, I can't remember to have seen the likes of "K series" (without hyphen) in any official information from Scania AB ever, but I'm sure that some rare cases do exist.
Scania also use the same naming scheme on the trucks, with the P-series, G-series, R-series and T-series (and in the new range also S-series and L-series). The only difference between them is the cab, everything else on the trucks are identical, so they are all just parts of the same range. When I made the article I named it Scania PRT-range, because that was the only name I could find, and was used at the launch back in 2004. I have for a long time wondered if I should rename it to "Scania PGRT-range" (as the G-series was launched later), but now I see that I should rather think about renaming it "Scania PGRT range" instead. (The part with the LPGRS range should be split from the article anyway, as it is a new range, not a second generation, but that's not really relevant in this discussion.) Before that there were the 2-series, 3-series and 4-series for both trucks and buses back to the early 1980s, so the use of hyphen in the product names appears to be an old tradition with the company.
I'm not really sure, but I guess the main reason why Scania use hyphen is because then it is similar to the names in Swedish ("K-serien", "R-serien", etc.). Actually, in Swedish (like in Norwegian), only "K-serien" or maybe even "Kserien" would be allowed, while "K serien" would produce a spelling error that is known as sv:särskrivning.
What I'm discussing here is not what is correct spelling in English, I leave that to you who are native speakers, but if Wikipedia should "break" product names that are used consistently, and that was why I mentioned iPhone and iPod, since they are also product names that have some kind of misspelling. The equivalent to the example with "iOS-Devices" mentioned by SMcCandlish would be something like "K-series-Chassis" or "K-series-coaches". The Scania K-series is a product name, a proper noun, and I think that the renaming of the articles were wrong because of that. I would also say that if the names had been used inconsistently by Scania, I wouldn't have reacted at all, since then there wouldn't be anything more correct than the other. Bergenga (talk) 14:03, 22 July 2018 (UTC)
But correct spelling (and punctuation and styling) in English is what matters here. There's scant evidence that "K-series" "K series" is a "product name". It sounds more like a designation of a range of products, as most companies use it, and as the lead sentence says. The hyphen sends a signal that doesn't make sense in this context, when it's not modifying "chassis" or something. Dicklyon (talk) 15:06, 22 July 2018 (UTC)
Regarding correct spelling in English, on my talk page we found out that there appears to be no strict rule if a hyphen is mandantory or if it must be avoided in special cases such as these "letter-word" combinations.
To me, omitting the hyphen here looks disturbingly wrong, and it takes some while until the stray letter gets mentally connected to "series" to form a compound noun - totally destroying the flow. But this doesn't happen for compounds like "book series", where I would be with you to avoid the hyphen unless it's used as a modifier. Thinking about why that is, my gut feeling tells me it must be either because "X-series" is a rather unusual (compound) noun or because "X" is so short. Can "X" even be considered a word? Checking f.e. this guideline ([1]), taking "X" as a word, the usage of a hyphen appears to be covered by Rule 2b ("When writing out new, original, or unusual compound nouns, writers should hyphenate whenever doing so avoids confusion.") However, considering "X" to be some kind of prefix, abbreviation, truncation, digit or letter, further down Rule 1 ("Hyphenate prefixes when they come before proper nouns or proper adjectives") or Rule 6 ("Writers often hyphenate prefixes when they feel a word might be distracting or confusing without the hyphen") seem to apply.
What I read from this (and other) guideline(s) is that the hyphen should be used if the construction is somewhat unusual, but can be avoided if it is a well established term. Obviously, people have different ideas about if something is usual or not, but given the fact that this isn't a clear-cut case and that many article editors obviously included the hyphen for some reason when they created the pages, this is not uncontroversial and therefore these moves are not entitled to technical move requests. Please be careful before you continue to mass-rename articles as you do right now. There might be no consensus for these moves and they may need to be discussed first.
--Matthiaspaul (talk) 18:38, 24 July 2018 (UTC)
Last I looked, we have no guideline that would suggest something like "K-series", except when used as an adjective, as in "K-series engine".  — SMcCandlish ¢ 😼  20:03, 24 July 2018 (UTC)
Obviously, it's not that easy. I already cited from a guideline suggesting to hyphenate compound nouns when they are unusual (and I would consider constructions like "X-series" or "E-series" unusual). Here's another guideline ([2]) suggesting that many such terms originally start with a hyphen ("e-mail") when they are still new and over time may become closed ("email") or open compound words. From this it can be deduced that both forms are allowed most of the time, although one may be more common than the other depending on time and context. --Matthiaspaul (talk) 21:43, 24 July 2018 (UTC)
There's nothing unusual about a letter series (e.g. the B series) or a number series (e.g. the 200 series). See n-gram stats. I understand that e-mail is different. Dicklyon (talk) 23:13, 24 July 2018 (UTC)
And you (Matthiaspaul) didn't cite a guideline, you cited someone's external site, which WP doesn't follow. We have our own style guide. I have the book for which that site's a promo. It's one of the shortest, most derivative, and least authoritative style guides (and for American business English in particular) available. The primary markets for it are as a quick-reference for secretaries and as a remedial English book in community colleges. Anyway, there's definitely nothing unusual about such a construction. An unusual one would be, say, loot-boxer, or weasel-shaving, or some other neologistic or uncommon compound. And (the The Blue Book is just wrong on this, one of its innumerable errors of omission) it's not done with all of them, just a particular kind (see below). "Type X" or "Model J" , "B Type", or "Z Series" (for actual trademarks, or lowercase words for classifications) aren't even compounds at all; they're the same type of construction as "River Avon" and "Mount Rushmore" (lowercase "meters squared" and "letters patent"), or "Amazon River" and "Pacific Ocean" (lc: "water buffalo, "kettle logic"), respectively. They're not compounds, just noun phrases, and don't take hyphens. Noun constructions take hyphens (or get fully compounded) when they're object–verbal-noun compounds ("egg-beater", "pizza-lover", "man-eater", and gerund variants, "his obnoxious brow-beating", "her obsessive cat-hating"); I'd actually forgotten the term, but there was coincidentally a thread about it at RDL recently [3]. Even this usage is slipping in vernacular writing, and more common on one side of the Atlantic than the other; it's common to see them with a space, as well as fused into one word. "K series" is not any kind of compound of a verbal noun and its object.  — SMcCandlish ¢ 😼  06:50, 25 July 2018 (UTC)
There's scant evidence that "K-series" "K series" is a "product name".
But you haven't even looked. You know nothing about the topic (that never stops you), you refuse to look at sources, and you march straight over any article, on any topic. Ford D Series - look at Ford's own literature, look at the masses of published secondary literature about what is a product (the product of a truck factory is still a product). That's a product name - but you ignore that, and how WP is structured to deal with such a proper name, in favour of a simplistic language style guide. Same for Rover K-Series engine.
But correct spelling (and punctuation and styling) in English is what matters here.
Yet again, you've let dogma run away with you. No, this is just not true here. We have policies like COMMONNAME and following sources as well. If it's a proper name, then they over-rule whichever mid-century typesetter's handbook you're evidently following. Andy Dingley (talk) 20:55, 24 July 2018 (UTC)
When I look at sources (books), I find the Ford D-series, a Ford D Series six-wheel tipper, medium-weight D-series, an Old Ford D series, Ford's D-Series, the new Ford 'D' Series, the venerable Ford D series, Ford 'D' Series vehicles, Ford "D" Series trucks, the Ford D Series, the Ford 'D' Series range, the Ford D series of chassis, a ford D series coal lorry, the Dodge K and Ford D series, etc. Given the complete lack of consistency or pattern in sources, I don't see why we wouldn't go by standard English grammar and our own style guidelines. And there are no sources linked on the article, and no "Ford D Series" at or, so not sure where would be better places to look. And yes I know companies cap all their stuff in their marketing literature. When I look at the Ford A series, it's a bit different, with random case but very few hyphens: [4], [5]. Dicklyon (talk) 21:11, 24 July 2018 (UTC)
And Ford's brochures show that they don't use the hyphen (on the covers in title case and all caps at least). Inside, in a sentence, they say "the new 'A' Series Light Truck Range"; why they cap all that stuff including "Range" is hard to fathom, but I don't think we should move Ford A-Series to Ford 'A' Series Light Truck Range; better to normalize it as Ford A series. Dicklyon (talk) 21:56, 24 July 2018 (UTC)
And ads like this one show the letters are separable from the word "series", and in "R, K AND W SERIES". This is what you'd expect of normal English treatment of such compound descriptors, not what you'd do with product names or trademarks. Dicklyon (talk) 22:04, 24 July 2018 (UTC)
But that's an ad, so it's written in title case, thus tells us nothing. Read the prose from secondary RS - like Commercial Motor. Andy Dingley (talk) 00:03, 25 July 2018 (UTC)
It's all caps, not title case. All it tells us that they're not unwilling to treat these as two-word compounds. Dicklyon (talk) 00:39, 25 July 2018 (UTC)
Yep. It destroys the "this is an official proper name" argument. Completely.  — SMcCandlish ¢ 😼  04:21, 28 July 2018 (UTC)

The Scania literature includes phrases like "an extension of the P-series", which can only be interpreted as meaning the extension of a series designated by the letter P. An "extension of <PRODUCT_NAME>" would make much less sense. In English, the way to fix this and make it clear is to just omit the hyphen: "an extension of the P series". The hyphen just sows cognitive dissonance, or makes it look like a poor translation from a language that uses hyphens differently, which is what it is. Dicklyon (talk) 03:12, 25 July 2018 (UTC)

Yes. Many of the Germanic languages use hyphens and full-compounding in ways that English doesn't; it's even been nicknamed the "German-hyphen" (rather self-referentially).  — SMcCandlish ¢ 😼  04:24, 28 July 2018 (UTC)

BMC engines[edit]

Hi! Your recent changes to the titles of some BMC engine article is being discussed at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Automobiles#More dogmatic case-related renames. You should probably add your view of things.  Stepho  talk  04:17, 22 July 2018 (UTC)

Thanks. Andy gets on my case all over the place, but doesn't seem to think I should hear about it. Dicklyon (talk) 04:37, 22 July 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Donald Trump[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Donald Trump. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 22 July 2018 (UTC)

A [B, C, ...] series[edit]

These are great disam pages. I wish I had thought of the idea myself. DGG ( talk ) 08:20, 24 July 2018 (UTC)

Thanks. Cleaning up series was a ton of work, with about 100 moves and 500 other edits. Got some minor pushback in a few places, but the only move that got reverted got un-reverted to everyone's satisfaction. Dicklyon (talk) 15:00, 24 July 2018 (UTC)

Image quality[edit]

Hi, I saw that you participated in the Image quality article a couple of years ago. I'm trying to work around that article, and I'd like to know if I can count with your help on reviewing it afterwards. --Scann (talk) 15:09, 25 July 2018 (UTC)

Sure, I can look. At first glance, it seems you have changed the lead definition from a subjective thing to a "set of features" one. I'd rather see a broadening that more clearly encompasses both objective and subjective, and I don't see where this "set of features" comes from or means; what it says now about subjective (viewing conditions) seems rather off the main point for the lead. Ping me when you want me to look again; I'll be on a long plane ride today. Dicklyon (talk) 15:20, 25 July 2018 (UTC)
Thanks for that! I'm still working on it, but I don't seem to find any definition that I like so far. The "set of features" was slightly inspired by this guide up to certain point but I guess you're right. I'll let you know when I've come to something I like more. Thanks again! --Scann (talk) 22:01, 25 July 2018 (UTC)

Portals WikiProject update #014, 27 July 2018[edit]

Development of design continues, full speed ahead...

Excerpt slideshows are here![edit]

Can you say "paradigm shift"?

Now, in addition to picture slideshows, we have slideshows that can display excerpts. Portals are not just for topic tasting anymore. Now they can be made useful for surveying Wikipedia's coverage of entire subjects. This gives a deeper meaning to their name. Hmmm. "Portals"... Doorways to knowledge.

Portal:Lithuania was redesigned using excerpt slideshows. Check it out.

For those of you who cannot wait to test out these new toys...

We have not one, but three excerpt slideshow components to pick from:

{{Transclude excerpts as random slideshow}}

For this one, you specify the page names where the excerpts are to be extracted from.

{{Transclude list item excerpts as random slideshow}}

This one accepts source pages from where the page names are gathered from list items. Then an excerpt from one of those pages is displayed. The selection of what is included in the slide show can be limited to a specific number from the collection (of the page names gathered), and that selection is renewed from scratch each time the page is purged.
For example, if you specify Template:World Heritage Sites in Spain as a source page, the slideshow will cycle through those sites. Now you don't have to type them in one-by-one. This greatly reduces portal creation time.

{{Transclude linked excerpts as random slideshow}}

Same as above, but gathers links instead of just linked list items.

Panoramic banners[edit]

{{Portal image banner}} displays a panoramic picture the width of the page, and adjusts its size, so it stays that way even if the user changes page view size. And it accepts multiple file names, so that the picture displayed randomizes between them each time the page is visited/purged.

Give resizing the page a try:

Vilnius old town banner.jpg
Vilnius, the capital of Lithuania.

You can now balance section boxes[edit]


Reptile types
Amphibian types


Reptile types
Amphibian types

Notice how the box bottoms line up. That readjusts even if you click the slideshow buttons.

The template used for this is {{Flex columns}}.

By the way, when you include more than one box in a column, any left over whitespace in that column is divided between them.

Box-header colour[edit]

You may have noticed the new {{Box-header colour}} template used above. It lets you pick the color locally (right on the same page). Before, this was handled on a subpage somewhere.

Testing, testing[edit]

Now that we have lots of toys to play with for making cool portals...

Don't forget, that the majority of views of Wikipedia these days are from mobile devices. We need to make certain that portals display well on those. So, remember to check your work on portals in mobile view mode...

To see a portal in mobile view mode, insert a ".m" into a portal's url, after "en", like this:

If you discover problems in a portal you can't fix, report them on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Portals/Design.

Until next time...[edit]

Have fun.    — The Transhumanist   00:57, 27 July 2018 (UTC)

Portals tasks requests: presented in the newsletter below...[edit]

Portals WikiProject update #015, 31 July 2018[edit]

Now that we have lots of toys to play with, it's play time!

Here are some fun activities to use our new toys on...

Fun activity #1: put the improved panorama template to use[edit]

Would you like to travel around the world? Well, this may be the next best thing...

Here's another fun toy to play with: {{Portal image banner}}

To see what it looks like, check out the panoramas at the tops of the following portals:

The task: There are many geography portals that lack panoramas. Please add some. Please keep the file size down below 2 megabytes, and keep in mind that you may find quality banners at commons: at less than 200K (.2 megabytes). Good search terms to include with the place name are "banner", "cityscape", "skyline", "panorama", "landscape", etc.

Related task: There are also lots of geography portals that have panoramas used as gaudy banners (with print or icons splattered across them) or that display them in some random location on the page. In many cases, those pages would be improved by displaying the panorama as a clean picture at the top of the intro section, like on the examples above. This works best with banner-like panoramas. Please fix such pages when you come across them, if you believe it would improve the look of the page.

Taller images might be better suited displayed further down the page, or in the "Selected images" section.

Note that {{Portal image banner}} supports multiple images, and displays one at random upon the first visit, and each time the page is purged.

Fun activity #2: install "Selected images" sections[edit]

That is, image slideshows!

Over 200 have been installed so far. Just 1200 to go. (Be sure not to install them on portals with active maintainers, unless they want you to).

The title "Selected images" reflects the fact that not all images on Wikipedia are pictures, and encompasses maps, graphs, diagrams, sketches, paintings, pictures, and so on.

The toys we have to work with for this are:

{{Random slideshow}}


{{Transclude files as random slideshow}}

The task: Using one of the above templates directly on a portal's base page, replace static "Selected picture" sections, with a section like one of these:

Selected images
Selected images

The one on the left uses {{Random slideshow}} (which accepts file names), and the one on the right uses {{Transclude files as random slideshow}} (which accepts source pages from which the filenames are gathered).

The above section formatting is used on many of the pages you will come across, but not all. In those cases, use whatever section formatting matches the rest of the page.

Note that you may come across "Selected picture" sections done with {{Random portal component}} templates. That template call is the entire section. Replace it with a section that matches the other sections on the page, and put the new slideshow inside that.

For example, in Portal:California, this code:

{{Random portal component|max=21|seed=27|header=Selected picture|subpage=Selected picture}}

was replaced with this code:

{{/box-header|Selected images|noedit=yes}}
{{Transclude files as random slideshow
| Culture of {{PAGENAME}}

And the new section blended right in with the formatting of the rest of the page. Note the use of the {{PAGENAME}} magic word. Plain article titles also work. Don't feel limited to one or two page names. But be sure to test each slideshow before installing the next one. (Or if you prefer, in batches - just don't leave them hanging). Report technical problems at the Portal design talk page.

Fun activity #3: upgrade "Selected article" sections[edit]

These sections, where unmaintained, have gone stale. That's because 1) the excerpts are static, having been manually copied and pasted, and 2) because they lack automatic addition of new entries.

They can be upgraded with:

{{Transclude random excerpt}}


{{Transclude list item excerpt}}


{{Transclude linked excerpt}}

All three of these will provide excerpts that won't go stale. The latter two can provide excerpt collections that won't go stale, by providing new entries over time. The key is to select source pages or source sections that are frequently updated, such as root article sections, mainstream lists, or navigation templates.

Where will this put us?[edit]

When the above tasks are completed for the entire collection of portals (except the ones with specific maintainers), we'll be more than half-way done with the portal system upgrade.

Keep up the great work.    — The Transhumanist   19:09, 30 July 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Philip II of Spain[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Philip II of Spain. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 15 August 2018 (UTC)

Portals WikiProject update #016, 15 Aug 2018[edit]

Future portal tool[edit]

Discussions are underway on the design of a portal tool (user script) that will hopefully have features for modifying portals at the click of a menu item, to make editing them easier. It might do things like change the color for you, add to a selection, add a new section, move a section, and so on.

If you'd like to be involved and suggest features for the tool, please join us at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Portals/Design#What would you want a portal tool to be able to do?.

Progress report: upgrade of portals[edit]

As new portal components are built by our Lua gurus, those components are being used to upgrade portals. Each component automates a section of a portal in a particular way.

The sections that are mostly upgraded so far are the Intro, and the Associated Wikimedia section.

The sections currently undergoing upgrade are: Selected image, Categories, and the Intro.

The Intro? Isn't that done already?

Yes, and no.

The upgrade of the excerpt in intros is mostly complete (there are about 70 non-standard portals that still need it).

Now we are doing another upgrade of intros in the form of adding a panoramic picture at the top of the intro, on portals for which such a picture is available on Commons:. Dozens of panoramas have been added so far, and they are really starting to affect the look of portals — the portals that have them look really good.

Regions are the most likely subjects to have panoramas, but a surprising number of other subjects have banner-shaped pictures too. Some examples of non-geographic portals that they have been added to are:

Speaking of pictures, several hundred Selected image sections have been upgraded to include image slideshows.

Progress report: design[edit]

The push for automation continues, with new components under continuous testing in the field. As problems are spotted, they are reported to our programmers, who have done a fantastic job of keeping up with bug reports and fixing the relevant Lua modules fast. I am highly impressed.

Construction time on new portals is now down to as little as a minute or less. Though not in general. If you are lucky enough to spot portals that fit the profile of the new tools (their strengths), then a portal can be complete almost as soon as it is created, with the added time it takes to find and add a panorama. Source page titles are not generally standardized, and so it source pages in many cases must be entered manually. Where source page titles follow a standard naming convention, portal creation for those subjects goes quickly.

So, we still have some hurdles, but the outlook on portals is very good. New features, and many improvements to features are on the horizon. I'll be sure to report them when they become available.

What will the portal of the future look like? That is up to you!

See you on the project's talk pages.

Sincerely,    — The Transhumanist   21:03, 15 August 2018 (UTC)

Portals WikiProject update #017, 22 Aug 2018[edit]

This issue is about portal creation...

Creating new portals[edit]

Myself and others have been testing and experimenting with the new components in upgrading existing portals and in building new portals. They have now been applied in hundreds of portals.

The templates are ready for general use for portal creation.

They are still a bit buggy, but the only way we are going to work the rest of the bugs out is by using them and reporting the bugs as we come across them.

I look forward to seeing what new portals you create!

Be sure to report bugs at WT:WPPORTD.

The main portal creation template is {{box portal skeleton}}.

Portal creation tips[edit]

After starting a portal using {{box portal skeleton}}...

  1. Placing a panorama (banner picture) at the top of the intro section is a nice touch, and really makes a portal look good. {{box portal skeleton}} doesn't automatically insert panoramas. So, you will need to do that by hand. They can be found at Commons:. For some examples, check out Portal:Sharks, Portal:Cheese, and Portal:Florence
  2. The search term provided in the Did you know? and In the news sections is very basic and rarely matches anything. It is best to replace that term with multiple search arguments, if possible (separate each argument with a pipe character). For example, in Portal:Capital punishment, see Searches in templates use Lua search notation.
  3. Check the In the news and Did you know? sections for mismatches. That is, sometimes entries come up that shouldn't be displayed. If there are any, refine the search strings further, so they don't return such results.
  4. Finish each portal you've created before creating a new one. We don't want unfinished portals sitting around.

Need a laugh?[edit]

Check out the Did you know? section on Portal:Determinism.    — The Transhumanist   01:53, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

A barnstar for you![edit]

Original Barnstar Hires.png The Original Barnstar
hey look! phi ratios all over barnstar.. thanks for the note. i was mainly interested in demonstrating the reasoning process. there is so much noise out there. Gahnett (talk) 03:24, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
Dang, nice observation on the barn pentagram. Thanks. Dicklyon (talk) 05:10, 22 August 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Elon Musk[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Elon Musk. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 23 August 2018 (UTC)

Automated vs Autonomous car[edit]

I got your note regarding the talk page not being moved, and I added an explanation as to why I didn't move it: simply put, I got an error when I had "move talk page" checkmarked.

I couldn't find the part of the existing talk page that discussed moving the article. Given the industry practice that I've outlined, and especially the SAE J3016 document, I think it's pretty clear cut that autonomous is an incorrect term. I'm happy to have a discussion about it, but please provide me with a good reason not to move the page, given that I've provided a few good reasons for moving it.

My favourite quote on this subject: "A truly autonomous car would be one where you request it to take you to work and it decides to go to the beach instead."

Ewaladel (talk) 18:10, 26 August 2018 (UTC)

Attn: WikiGnomes[edit]

WikiProject Portals has a fun task for you...

There are lots of new portals.


Not a few.


So, it's time for another round of "These are not listed yet".

Instructions and a list of the portals that have not been listed yet are included at that link.

List as many as you have time for, and pick away at the list at your leisure. Every single entry helps.

This is an especially fun task, because you get to browse the new portals while you are working on it.


Dive right in. ;)

And of course...

...have fun!    — The Transhumanist   22:42, 29 August 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Ayn Rand[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Ayn Rand. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 31 August 2018 (UTC)

Portals WikiProject update #018, 04 Sept 2018[edit]

Bug hunt![edit]

As you know, portals are now supported by a number of new templates, which are in turn supported by some new Lua modules.

Those templates and modules are being put to the test, in the new portals that have been created since this WikiProject rebooted, plus a number of existing portals that have been revamped.

The new portals, and revamped ones, can be found at Category:Single-page portals.

Please browse the new portals at your leisure, and report any and all problems that you spot. Post bug and other portal problem reports at WT:WPPORTD. Please report bugs, quirks, awkward aspects, or anything weird or off that you notice. Compliments and suggestions are also welcome. :)

When you report a bug, please indicate the portal's name, the section that the problem appeared in, and the name of the article appearing (first) in the section with the problem. Most problems will likely be encountered in the Selected general articles" section, due to quirks in a displayed article's wikicode that the lua modules don't handle yet. Your help in spotting those is of utmost value. Thank you.

Don't delete portal subpages just yet[edit]

For portals that have been converted to the single-page design, we are not deleting their subpages at this time, because we are working on ways to harvest the data from those pages. For example, the Selected picture subpages include filenames and captions that would be valuable for the image slideshows. Please don't delete portal subpages, for now. They'll be slated for d-batch speedy deletion after harvesting. Thank you.

Development notes[edit]

We are currently testing a feature added to {{Transclude files as random slideshow}} that allows it to accept both sourcepages and filenames. Courtesy of Evad37. This will pave the way for harvesting files and their captions from portal subpages, for use in image slideshows.

We need your help[edit]

The bulk of the work is being done by a handful of editors. But we can't do it all. We need help with spotting bugs, refining the search parameters in new/revamped portals (in the "Did you know..." and "In the news" sections), adding images to slideshows for a broader selection (they default to showing the images on the root article page but are capable of showing so much more), adding panoramic pictures at the top of the intro section of region portals (cities, counties, states, provinces, countries, continents, and other regions), to name but a few task types.

It is rewarding to be a part of the growing portal phenomenon. And you get to see its expansion and refinement up close.

Feel free to join in on the fun. ;)

Thank you,    — The Transhumanist   06:49, 4 September 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:James Randi[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:James Randi. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 8 September 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Mohammad bin Salman[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Mohammad bin Salman. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 16 September 2018 (UTC)

Bay Area WikiSalon invitation for September 26![edit]

Please join us in downtown San Francisco!
Wikimedia Community logo
WikiSalon attendees

Periodically, on the last Wednesday evening of the month, wiki enthusiasts gather at the Bay Area WikiSalon series to munch, mingle, and learn about new projects and ideas.

We allow time for announcements, informal conversation and working on articles. Newcomers and experienced wiki users are encouraged to attend. Bring a friend! Kid/family friendly. Free Wi-Fi is available so bring your editing devices. This months' focus is Did you know ... ?

We will have beverages (including beer and wine) plus light snacks (maybe pizza too!).

Details and RSVP here (note: we are meeting at the new WMF HQ at 120 Kearny Street!)

See you soon! Avik (User:Quantumavik), Lodewijk (User:Effeietsanders), Ben Creasy (User:Ben Creasy), Stephen (User:Slaporte), and Wayne (User:Checkingfax)
(Subscribe/Unsubscribe to this talk page notice here) | MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 02:45, 18 September 2018 (UTC)

List of United States senators expelled or censured[edit]

You recently moved the page List of United States senators expelled or censured without first asking consent. This is not proper. The page shall be renamed to its previous name. U.S. Senator is accepted.

WhatsUpWorld (talk) 03:59, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

Not sure what you mean. Are you familiar with MOS:CAPS? There was supporting discussion of such things at least, at Talk:Dan_Sullivan_(U.S._senator)#Requested_move_8_September_2018. Dicklyon (talk) 04:10, 21 September 2018 (UTC)
LOL, WUW is on a crusade to ensure every use of "senator", "mayor", and "governor" is capitalized even when it's not necessary. senator is clearly a common noun in this instance, not referring to a specific person. One does not have to "ask consent" to move pages in the first place. Ignore him. Reywas92Talk 18:38, 21 September 2018 (UTC)

Portals WikiProject update #019, 22 Sept 2018[edit]

Portals progress report[edit]

Don't blink. You might miss something.

As of a few days ago, portals had doubled in about a month and a half.

Also, there were 98 incompleted portals in Category:Portals under construction. Now there are just 43.

The WikiProject page has been thoroughly revised[edit]

The goals, plans, and task sections have all been updated.

Orphaned portals need a home...[edit]

Many new portals are still orphans, and need links pointing to them:

  1. A portal link at the bottom of corresponding navigation footer template. E.g., Template:Machines for Portal:Machines. See examples of a portals link at the bottom of Template:Robotics and Template:Forestry.
  2. A {{Portal}} box in the See also section of the corresponding root article for each portal. If there is no See also section, create one and place the portal template in that. (Rather than placing them in an external links section -- they're not external links).
  3. A {{Portal}} template placed at the top of the category page corresponding to each portal.

All new and revamped portals can be found at Category:Single-page portals.


This is the main list of portals.

Nearly 2,000 of the new portals need to be listed here.

They can be found at Portal talk:Contents/Portals#These are not listed yet. Instructions are included there.

Customized Portal Rating system is now in place[edit]

Portals now have a new rating system of their own designed specifically to support portal evaluation! We were trying to use the standard assessment system for articles, but that doesn't fit portals very well.

Many thanks to Evad37, Waggers, AfroThundr3007730, SMcCandlish, Tom, BrendonTheWizard, and Pbsouthwood for their work and input on this.

The new system can be found at the top of all portal talk pages, in the WikiProject portals box. Those with "???" ratings need to be assessed, which makes up most of the older portals.

Most of the new portals were started out with an initial "Low" level of importance when their talk pages were created. Those deserving higher importance should be promoted as you come across them.

Improving the new portals[edit]

The starting point for new portals included minimal parameters and content, in the form of default values in the template(s) used for their creation.

Embellishing embedded search strings[edit]

So, for the search strings in the "Did you know..." and "In the news" sections, this was the magic word {{PAGENAME}}, which represents the portal's name. Unfortunately, the resulting term is alway capitalized, which limits its effectiveness as a search string for anything but proper nouns. Results for those two sections can be improved, by replacing the "PAGENAME" magic word with multiple search strings, and search strings that begin with lower case letters. There is no inherent limit as to how many search parameters may be included. Lua search notation is used. The more general the subject, the more subtopic search terms you may want to include. For example, on Portal:Avengers (comics), {{PAGENAME}} turned up nothing. But, when more parameters were added, as in the wikicode below...

{{Transclude selected recent additions | {{PAGENAME}} | Iron Man | Spiderman | Antman | Hawkeye | The Hulk | Incredible Hulk | David Banner | Captain America | Scarlet Witch | Black Widow | Tony Stark | Nick Fury | Age of Ultron | Infinity War | months=36 | header={{Box-header colour|Did you know... }}|max=6}}

... that returned several results in the portal's DYK section.

Be sure you make the improvements to both the DYK section and the "In the news" section, as they both require the search strings.

Expanding the slideshow contents[edit]

The default starting selection for the image slideshow in most new portals is whatever images happen to be in the corresponding root article (via the PAGENAME magic word). You can improve image slideshows by adding more sourcepages and filenames as parameters in the "Selected images" section of portals.

See Template:Transclude files as random slideshow/doc for instructions.

More exciting things are to come...[edit]

Portals used to take about 6 hours or more to create. Now, for subjects that have particular navigation support, we've got that down to about one minute each, with even more content displayed than ever. True, that means the new portals pick you, rather than the other way around. Creating a specific portal that doesn't happen to have the requisite navigation support is still pretty time consuming. But, we are working on extending our reach beyond the low-hanging fruit.

And efforts are ongoing to keep shaving time off of the creation process. Eventually, we may get it down to seconds each.

In addition to improving automation, we're always looking for new features and improvements that we can add to portals, and there is plenty of potential to expand on the standard design so that new portals are even better right out of the starting gate. Additional designs are also possible.

On the horizon, there are many more portals waiting to be created. And we can expect to see at least a few more section types emerge. I never expected slideshows, for example, especially not for excerpts. Who knows where innovation will take us next?

Keep up the great work everyone.

Sincerely,    — The Transhumanist   07:05, 23 September 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Jimmy Page[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Jimmy Page. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 24 September 2018 (UTC)

Last call for RSVPs for Wednesday evening[edit]

Please join us in downtown San Francisco!
Wikimedia Community logo
WikiSalon attendees

Hey, folks.​ Reminder:​ Wednesday evening ​at 6 ​is the Bay Area WikiSalon series​.​

Details and RSVP here (note: we are meeting at the new WMF HQ at 120 Kearny Street!)

See you soon! Avik (User:Quantumavik), Lodewijk (User:Effeietsanders), Ben Creasy (User:Ben Creasy), Stephen (User:Slaporte), and Wayne (User:Checkingfax)
(Subscribe/Unsubscribe to this talk page notice here) | MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 06:32, 26 September 2018 (UTC)

Dame Judi Dench's criticism[edit]

Thanks for your contribution to the ' All the Money in the World" article, if you'd like to make a contribution to the talk page, in a effort to build consensus please see the talk page:'s_criticism_of_decision_to_remove_Kevin_Spacey's_performance Jono1011 (talk) 12:17, 28 September 2018 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for September 30[edit]

An automated process has detected that when you recently edited Milwaukee, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Kinnickinnic River (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver).

(Opt-out instructions.) --DPL bot (talk) 09:18, 30 September 2018 (UTC)

Fixed. Dicklyon (talk) 15:02, 30 September 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Keanu Reeves[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Keanu Reeves. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 2 October 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Jimmy Page[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Jimmy Page. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 10 October 2018 (UTC)

Portals WikiProject update #020, 12 Oct 2018[edit]

Whew, a lot has been happening.

A bit of defending of the portals has been needed. But, most activity recently has been directed upon maintenance and development of existing portals.

The majority of portals now use the new design, about 2400 of them, leaving around 1200 portals that still employ the old style.

Newest portals[edit]

Please inspect these portals, and report problems or suggest improvements at WT:WPPORTD. Thank you.


Since the last issue of this newsletter, Nineteen portals were nominated for deletion. All posted by the same person.

Two portals were deleted.

One resolved as "no consensus".

Sixteen resolved as "keep".

Links to the archived discussions are provided below:

  1. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Air France
  2. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Alexander Korda
  3. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:August Derleth
  4. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Average White Band
  5. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Bee-eaters
  6. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Ben E. King
  7. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Benny Goodman
  8. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Bill Bryson
  9. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Billy Idol
  10. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Billy Ocean
  11. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Bob Hope
  12. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Bobbie Rosenfeld Award
  13. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Body piercing
  14. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Canton, Michigan
  15. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Compostela Group of Universities
  16. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Diplo
  17. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Diversity of fish
  18. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Pebble Beach
  19. Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Peter, Paul and Mary

Many thanks to those who participated in the discussions.

To watch for future MfD's, keep in mind that the Portals WikiProject is supported by automatic alerts. You can see them at: Wikipedia:WikiProject Portals#Article alerts: portals for deletion at MfD

Creation criteria[edit]

There was also some discussion of creation criteria for portals. The result was that one of the participants in the discussion reverted the portal guidelines to the old version, which has the minimum number of articles for a portal included in there: "about 20 articles", a guideline that was in place since 2009.

Many of the portals that existed prior to April 2018 do not have that many (being limited to however many subpages the portal creator created), and therefore, these portals need to be upgraded to the new design (which automatically provides many articles for display). Using the new design, exceeding 20 articles for display is very easy.

Linking to the new portals[edit]

Efforts have been underway to place links to new portals (all 2200 of them created since April).

  1. Link (portal button) from corresponding category pages.  Done
  2. Link from See also section on corresponding root articles. check Partially implemented
  3. Link from bottom of corresponding templates. check Partially implemented
  4. Link for each portal on Portal:Contents/Portals. check Partially implemented

Your help is needed. It is easy to access the page mentioned in #1, #2, & #3 from the portals themselves.

AWBers could do these tasks even faster (that's how the category pages were done), except #4...

Item #4 above pretty much has to be done by hand. (If you can find a way to speed that up, I would be very impressed). The links needing placement can be found at Portal talk:Contents/Portals#These are not listed yet. Instructions are included there.

The conversion effort: news sections[edit]

There are still around 1200 old-style portals that have only undergone partial conversion to the new design concepts, still relying on subpages with copied/pasted excerpts that have been going stale for years, out of date (manually posted) news entries, etc.

The section currently being tackled on these is news. You can help by deleting any news section on the old-style portals that has news entries that are years old (that is the dead giveaway to a manual news section). Be sure not to delete the news sections of portals that have up-to-date news, or active maintainers. For maintainers, look at the portal's categories, and/or check the participants list at WP:WPPORT.

Eventually, conditional news sections (that appear only when news items are available for display) will be added using AWB to all portals without a news section.

News items (and even the news sections themselves) are automatically generated for portals that were created using the Basic portal start page. On those portals, there is a hidden comment at the top of the page (that you can see in the edit window), that says this:

<!-- This portal was created using subst:Basic portal start page -->

Design development[edit]

Presently, we are in the process of implementing the new design features, creating new portals with them, and installing them in existing portals.

But, what about development of new new design features?

We have a wish department.

Post your wishes at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Portals/Design#Discussions about possible cool new features, and they might come true. Many have already, and for many of those, this is where they were posted.

Cascade effect[edit]

A resource that has been elusive so far will be obtained eventually: categories. That is, the ability to pull category member links to populate a page.

Rather than populate portals directly with such links, it may be more beneficial to the encyclopedia to utilize them in navigation footers, because portals already have the ability to generate themselves based on those.

So, this would create a cascade effect: auto-gathering entries from categories, would enable the construction of new navigation footers, that would in turn support the development of new portals.

The cascade effect would also be felt by existing portals, as existing navigation footers could be expanded using the category harvesting methods, which would in turn expand the coverage of portals that access those navigation footers.

You can help by providing leads about any potential category harvesting methods. Please report anything you know about harvesting categories at WT:WPPORTD. Thank you.

Looking into the future: the quantum portal?[edit]

One idea that has been floating around is the concept of a pageless portal. That is, a portal that isn't stored anywhere, instead being generated when you click on a menu item or button.

Many of the new portals were generated by a single click, and then saved via a second click.

Therefore, it seems likely that the portals of the future will employ the one-click concept.

Because of the need for customization by users, this concept would need to be augmented with a way to integrate user contributions. This could be done in at least two ways: posting an existing portal, autogenerating one from scratch if such does not yet exist, or have a special data page for user contributions that is folded into the auto-generated portal.

How soon? That is up to you. All that is needed are persons to implement it.

Until next time...[edit]

Keep up the good work on portals. They are improving daily. Thank you.    — The Transhumanist   04:17, 12 October 2018 (UTC)

Archimedes, Fibonacci, and Galileo square root...[edit]

Please help in reformatting. The data solves aspects of ancient math problems.


Milo Milogardner (talk) 03:01, 18 October 2018 (UTC)

Milo, where's a reference I can read about this? Dicklyon (talk) 03:17, 18 October 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Eugene Gu[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Eugene Gu. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 18 October 2018 (UTC)

WP:CYCLE on Ron Stallworth[edit]

Just a reminder of how WP:CYCLE works. A change is made (you added a picture). If someone reverts it (I did), then it's time to discuss. It's NOT time to re-add the picture again and again and again. Please read that page, if you haven't already. Amsgearing (talk) 15:58, 22 October 2018 (UTC)

The pictures have been discussed at length over the last month. Headshot had good support, but use in lead did not. Now what? Dicklyon (talk) 16:41, 22 October 2018 (UTC)
No, the headshot does not have good support. How do you ignore reality like that? You're looking at an RfC in which you and Randy are the only ones who are in favor of adding the picture, and at least 5 editors say it's inappropriate. You're only in favor of adding it because you were on the yearbook staff and are clearly not looking at this with a neutral eye. You canvassed Randy to vote with you - but even if your two votes are counted as legitimate, no one else in the RfC agrees with you. Do you just go with "alternative facts"? Is it that important to you to get your way that you're willing to suspend reality and ignore every other editor's opinion? Amsgearing (talk) 01:12, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
I respected your RFC about the headshot being too early in life to use as lead image. I'm talking about the previous RFC, in which 5 or 6 editors said it was OK to use the headshot; so I used it in the early life section. Did you not see that? Dicklyon (talk) 02:56, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

Edit warring at Ron Stallworth[edit]

Per the result of the edit warring complaint, you and Amsgearing are both warned. If either of you adds or removes a photo from the article in the next two weeks you may be blocked, unless you have first proposed the change on the talk page and got consensus for it there. Thank you, EdJohnston (talk) 16:12, 24 October 2018 (UTC)

EdJohnston, can I add the image back in the early life section? The RfC is now mute, as all agree that the image doesn't fit as a lede image, but its use in the early life section seems fine and relevant to the text. Amsgearing doesn't seem to comprehend the difference between sections, and also keeps pulling my name into the discussion. EdJohnston, if you have a few minutes maybe you can close the entire matter and give a ruling about the images use in the early life section, just to end this ongoing feud-over-nothing-really-that-important. Thanks. Randy Kryn (talk) 19:19, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
Randy, why not propose your addition at Talk:Ron Stallworth and see if there are any responses. I hope somebody can post there and summarize what the opinions are. A crude count suggests that people don't want the regular yearbook photo, but maybe they were only opposed to putting it in the lede. As an admin, I have no special authority on talk pages. But if somebody asks for a discussion to be closed, I might be able to do that. Thanks, EdJohnston (talk) 19:25, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
I would also suggest asking for an opinion on the talk page before unilaterally re-adding the picture, if for no other reason than to avoid reinforcing the impression that yourself and Dicklyon worked in concert by trading reverts in order to avoid 3RR. Additionally, several editors in the current RfC have expressed their opinion that the picture is low-quality, is not relevant, and generally not acceptable for an article in an encyclopedia, so it's unlikely that it would be an uncontroversial addition. EdJohnston (talk) EdJohnston, if you think the RfC has had enough responses, then I would like to formally ask it be closed. Amsgearing (talk) 19:36, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
Have added a new section on that question alone. The RfC on using the image as a lede image seems to have already moved on, with all agreeing that it is better used elsewhere or not used. Yes, Dicklyon and I have been secretly plotting and working for years in order that someday, and the time is now if God and country have anything to do with it, the high school image of Ron Stallworth will be used on the subject's page. We may have overplayed our hand, or may have underwhelmed the opposition with logic. Time will tell. Randy Kryn (talk) 19:41, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
I'm glad you're making jokes about something so trivial, but here's the question: if it's so trivial to you, and worthy of only joking around about it, why are you dedicating so much time and effort to ensure that a low-quality irrelevant photo gets adde to the article? You can't have it both ways. Amsgearing (talk) 19:54, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
I want to have it both ways. Randy Kryn (talk) 20:05, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
You want to say it's not important to you, and then act like it's really really important to you. Got it. Amsgearing (talk) 20:15, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
Importance isn't relevant. The question has been asked if a high school headshot is an appropriate image for a page, and we disagree. I don't think high school headshots are appropriate for all pages, or even many, but since this one has become a "thing", and my name has been tossed about with attached accusations, I might as well weigh in on the conclusion. Randy Kryn (talk) 20:19, 24 October 2018 (UTC)
Given the pause, I will redouble my efforts to obtain a good scan of the newer and larger headshot from Stallworth's senior-year 1971 Round Up; my brother who was in his class has a copy, if I can just get him to scan it. Dicklyon (talk) 01:50, 25 October 2018 (UTC)

@EdJohnston, Randy Kryn, and Amsgearing: – I don't know if this is Amsgearing throwing in the towel, or if he's just taking some time off before his next move, but it looks to me like my advertising at a few places brought in several uninvolved new voices who all support using the headshot. One of them (Worldbruce) did a concise job of rebutting the opposition arguments (which I have also tabulated at Talk:Ron_Stallworth#Consensus_to_use_the_photo_for_now). Can we call it OK for now and move on to restoring the headshot in the Early life section? Dicklyon (talk) 01:44, 29 October 2018 (UTC)

And this pretty much confirms that he's done with discussing; he self-reverted after realizing it wasn't on his own talk page. Dicklyon (talk) 20:31, 29 October 2018 (UTC)

Portals WikiProject update #021, 24 Oct 2018[edit]

Portals have passed the 4,000 mark.

More new portals...[edit]

Here's a list of portals created since the last issue

List of new portals

Please inspect these portals, report problems or suggest improvements at WT:WPPORTD, or develop them further (see below). Thank you.

What's next?[edit]

There is still lots to do...

There are many subject gaps that need to be filled. This can be done by creating new portals, or by adding Selected article sections to existing portals. To create a new portal, simply place {{subst:Basic portal start page}} on an empty portal page, and click "Preview". If the portal is complete, click "Save". After you try it, come share your experience and excitement at WT:WPPORTD.

Each new portal is just a starting point. Each portal of the new design can be further developed by:

  • refining the search parameters to improve the results displayed in the Did you know and In the news sections.
  • adding more specific Selected articles sections, like Selected biographies.
  • inserting a Recognized content section.
  • adding more pictures to the image slideshow.
  • placing a panoramic picture at the top of the intro section (especially for geographic portals).

Besides the new portals, there are still about 1200 portals of the old design that need to be converted to the new design.

Many portals need to be de-orphaned, by placing links to them (in the See also section of the corresponding root articles, at the bottom of the corresponding navigation footer templates, and on the corresponding category pages).

Many of the new portals still need to be listed at Portal:Contents/Portals.

Bugs keep popping up in portals. These need to be tracked down and reported at WT:WPPORTD.

Tools are needed to make developing and maintaining portals quicker and easier.

Dreaming up new features and capabilities. Innovation needs to continue, to design the portal of tomorrow, and the portal development-maintenance-system of the future. Automation!

So, if you find yourself with a little (or a lot) of free time, pick an area (or more) above and...

...dive in!    — The Transhumanist   07:11, 25 October 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Leo Tolstoy[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Leo Tolstoy. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 26 October 2018 (UTC)

WP:ROWN Frustrated with revert of my edit, only to add most of it back in[edit]

Thanks for you many great contributions to Wikipedia. But I was frustrated by your revert of my edit at Tilt–shift photography: Difference between revisions - Wikipedia, followed moments later by adding back in most of my text. Please just edit the text to make it better rather than reverting helpful and well-intentioned edits. See Wikipedia:Revert only when necessary ★NealMcB★ (talk) 15:51, 27 October 2018 (UTC)

OK, I could have gotten there by a better path. I reverted because I objected to your use of "internal" in two places. But I agreed that there was a good intent there, so I put some back, and removed some other misleading junk at the same time. I hope it ended up OK, and sorry if the revert caused bad feelings. Dicklyon (talk) 16:00, 27 October 2018 (UTC)
At U.S. Route 395 in Nevada, I went the other way, and put a lot of work into cleaning up a contribution that I probably should have just reverted; it was subsequently all reverted anyway. Anywho, sorry, and I'll try to avoid reverting well-intentioned edits like that. Thanks for reminding me of that guidance. Dicklyon (talk) 16:03, 27 October 2018 (UTC)

Automobiles (film) listed at Redirects for discussion[edit]


An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect Automobiles (film). Since you had some involvement with the Automobiles (film) redirect, you might want to participate in the redirect discussion if you have not already done so. Dennis Bratland (talk) 22:54, 28 October 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Frank Zappa[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Frank Zappa. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 3 November 2018 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Joseph Kirschvink[edit]


The article Joseph Kirschvink has been proposed for deletion because it appears to have no references. Under Wikipedia policy, this biography of a living person will be deleted after seven days unless it has at least one reference to a reliable source that directly supports material in the article.

If you created the article, please don't be offended. Instead, consider improving the article. For help on inserting references, see Referencing for beginners, or ask at the help desk. Once you have provided at least one reliable source, you may remove the {{prod blp/dated}} tag. Please do not remove the tag unless the article is sourced. If you cannot provide such a source within seven days, the article may be deleted, but you can request that it be undeleted when you are ready to add one. Polyamorph (talk) 08:37, 9 November 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:David M. Cote[edit]

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Portals WikiProject update #022, 11 Nov 2018[edit]

Welcome AmericanAir88[edit]

Give a hearty welcome to AmericanAir88, who has adopted working on portals as one of his main purposes on Wikipedia. So far, he has created the following portals:

Way to go!

Where's Evad?[edit]

Evad disappeared from Wikipedia on October 18.

He has been, and will continue to be, sorely missed.

Hopefully, he is okay, on a Caribbean cruise or something.

The conversion continues[edit]

Portals of the old design, are slowly but surely being converted to the new single-page design.

One factor that has slowed things down is that for many sections, the section header call and section contents call are integrated into a template and buried in a lua module, locking them in on each portal. They have been that way for years.

This means that these sections can't be directly edited like the other sections on the same portal. So, search/replaces affect all the sections except those. So, upgrading headers on these portals, for example, misses the integrated sections and inadvertently results in 2 different header colors.

Before we can continue with the upgrade of these portals, the headers and section contents calls need to be restored to each portal, so that those can be edited in concert with the other sections on the portal, and worked on independently of each other.

This is underway, with a solution implemented on about 1/4 of the affected portals so far. Around 300 of them. The remaining 900 should be done within a couple weeks or so.

Going wide...[edit]

We now have banner-shaped pictures included in the introduction sections of 180 portals. The rarity of such pictures has made it difficult to find suitably narrow images for display across the tops of portals.

We have a solution for this, courtesy of FR30799386...

Most pictures are not banner-shaped. But, you can still use them as banners. Here's how:

{{Portal image banner|File:Blueberries .jpg |maxheight=120px |overflow=Hidden }}

Using both maxheight=120px and overflow=Hidden produces this:

Blueberries .jpg

Project's status[edit]

There are now 4,140 portals, with more being created almost daily. Prior to this project's reboot, portals were created at about the rate of 80 per year. Since April of this year, we've created about 2,600 new portals, or 32.5 years' worth at the old rate.

Of those new portals, about 3/4 of them need links leading to them. Almost all of them are linked to from the category system, but they still need links in article see also sections, at the bottom of navigation templates, and on the main portals list at Portal:Contents/Portals.

Of the 1500 portals created before the reboot, about 300 have been completely converted to the new design so far. About 1100 more have been partially converted, with intros, image slideshows, and associated wikimedia sections getting the most attention.

Discussion has resumed on the portal guidelines.

Until next issue...[edit]

See ya round the portal system!    — The Transhumanist   11:41, 11 November 2018 (UTC)

Portals wikignome task[edit]

We need Category:Portals with titles not starting with a proper noun added to the remaining portals it is applicable to.

Differentiating these from capitalized subjects will enable many types of tasks.

I've tried Hotcat to place the category on some of the portals. It is pretty fast.

Thank you.    — The Transhumanist   14:18, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

Lighthouse names[edit]

Hi Dick, thank you for policing the spelling on Wikipedia, but please would you stop moving lighthouse names while there is a discussion about this at the relevant project, as you are well aware. FWIW my research of the sources to date strongly suggests the word "Light" or "Lighthouse" is part of the proper name of the structure. So we'd be grateful if you'd revert the moves you've made so far and await the outcome of the discussion. Thanks. Bermicourt (talk) 18:01, 14 November 2018 (UTC)

I concur with Bermicourt, please revert your moves when you get online. And do please refrain from edit warring: in Wikipedia:Naming conventions (architecture) you have again added your undiscussed changes; I suggest you self-revert. Also, please refrain from edit warring in main space. A mere look in NP 24 Black Sea (2004) p. 197 should tell you that you are wrong in regards to Adziogol Lighthouse where you are edit warring with Doremo. Sam Sailor 16:23, 15 November 2018 (UTC)
I'm not edit warring at the convention; you reverted my change, restoring a clearly anti-WP-style old idea of making up proper names; that can't stand, so I fixed it once more. And I'm not warring with Doremo; just discussing, helping him see what sources might support his position, which his original refs did not; see the difference? As for when Light or Lighthouse is part of a proper name, I've been looking to sources and trying to determine that; if I got some wrong, please point out one or two, which will help focus the discussion. So far, it just feels like I'm being criticized for the volume of my work, with nobody saying which ones I got wrong (Doremo and a couple of technical moves excepted). Dicklyon (talk) 01:38, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
I don't see what ref you're referring to as NP 24 Black Sea (2004); point it out and I'll have a look. My point was really that as many sources use lowercase as upper, so the caps are unnecessary. If you're seeing a preponderance of caps for that one, let me know. Dicklyon (talk) 01:43, 16 November 2018 (UTC)
I do find "Stanislav – Adzhigol'skiy Leading Lights" in what may be the 2003 (first) version of NP 24. What did they change it to, and where can I find that? Dicklyon (talk) 01:58, 16 November 2018 (UTC)

Re- SJC Public Art[edit]

I don't see this section as having much encyclopedic value. At the least it needs to be consolidated into another section, as it barely qualifies as a minor detail within the article as a whole. If you feel it needs to be kept in, where do you think it best belongs? I don't think an entire tier-one header subsection should be reserved for such a short stub. --Resplendent (talk) 00:17, 17 November 2018 (UTC)

Feel free to improve it as you see fit, but do leave an edit summary to say what and why, so that your edit will be distinguishable from vandalism. Dicklyon (talk) 00:21, 17 November 2018 (UTC)

November 2018[edit]

Information icon Hello, I'm CLCStudent. I wanted to let you know that one or more of your recent contributions have been undone because they did not appear constructive. If you would like to experiment, please use the sandbox. If you have any questions, you can ask for assistance at the Help Desk. Thanks. CLCStudent (talk) 16:09, 18 November 2018 (UTC)

Please see WP:DTTR. Say here or at the talk page why did an uncommented revert of my restoration of relevant sourced material. Dicklyon (talk) 16:12, 18 November 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Biography/Politics and government[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Biography/Politics and government. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 19 November 2018 (UTC)

NRHP post office name[edit]

Hey, I just reversed your rename of U.S. Post Office and Federal Building–Cañon City Main within the corresponding NRHP list-article, because the list-article is intended to show the NRHP listing names. Same for what appears in the NRHP infobox in the article. I don't disagree about your rename of this article, because the name you moved it to is indeed supported in the NRHP document. And like some other post office names in particular, the NRHP listing name is a bit awkward. In general, I hope you will please open a proper wp:RM about any other articles which we have by dint of their being NRHP-listed. --Doncram (talk) 06:02, 19 November 2018 (UTC)

OK, got it – will stick to HRHP names in NRHP lists and infoboxes in future. Dicklyon (talk) 16:58, 19 November 2018 (UTC)

ArbCom 2018 election voter message[edit]

Scale of justice 2.svgHello, Dicklyon. Voting in the 2018 Arbitration Committee elections is now open until 23.59 on Sunday, 3 December. All users who registered an account before Sunday, 28 October 2018, made at least 150 mainspace edits before Thursday, 1 November 2018 and are not currently blocked are eligible to vote. Users with alternate accounts may only vote once.

The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia arbitration process. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail.

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ArbCom 2018 election voter message[edit]

Scale of justice 2.svgHello, Dicklyon. Voting in the 2018 Arbitration Committee elections is now open until 23.59 on Sunday, 3 December. All users who registered an account before Sunday, 28 October 2018, made at least 150 mainspace edits before Thursday, 1 November 2018 and are not currently blocked are eligible to vote. Users with alternate accounts may only vote once.

The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia arbitration process. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail.

If you wish to participate in the 2018 election, please review the candidates and submit your choices on the voting page. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 18:42, 19 November 2018 (UTC)

Reliability of scientific dating[edit]

Don't you think that scientific dates for archaeological remains should warn that they may be way off? Maxwell Roland Martin 1 (talk) 00:24, 26 November 2018 (UTC)


Howdy. You revert to governor at the Bill Walker article. But nobody does the same for the other Alaska governors or the lieutenant governors. Or for that matter, all the bios of US governors & lieutenant governors. Very frustrating. GoodDay (talk) 01:45, 26 November 2018 (UTC)

When things are inconsistent, move in the direction indicated by guidelines. Dicklyon (talk) 02:17, 26 November 2018 (UTC)
BTW: At the US prez & vice prez articles, decapitalization is a no-no. I'm going to ask at the Donald Trump article, whether this should be changed per WP:JOBTITLES. Why the Trump articles? it's related to the topic & will get the biggest attention/response. GoodDay (talk) 02:52, 26 November 2018 (UTC)

Wikipedia:WikiProject Portals update #023, 25 Nov 2018[edit]

There are now 4,180 portals.

Will we break 5,000 by the end of the year?

I know we can. But, that is up to you!

( New portals are created with {{subst:Basic portal start page}} or {{subst:bpsp}} )

Happy Holidays[edit]

Spread the WikiLove; use {{subst:Season's Greetings}} to send this message

Jingling along[edit]

The following portals have been created since the last issue:

Keep 'em coming!

By the way, the above list was generated using this Petscan query. It can be easily modified by changing the date. The data page (under the Output tab) also has options for receiving the data in CSV or tabbed format, which some operating systems automatically load into a spreadsheet program for ease of use, such as copying and pasting the desired column (like page names).

In closing[edit]

We'll keep it short this issue.

Expect a flood next time. Or the one after that. Face-wink.svg

Cheerio,    — The Transhumanist   07:35, 26 November 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Antisemitism in the UK Labour Party[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Antisemitism in the UK Labour Party. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 27 November 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Draft talk:Joan Kelley Walker[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Draft talk:Joan Kelley Walker. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 5 December 2018 (UTC)


As an endorser of bd2412's closure, it seems odd that I ultimately had to agree with the closer of the MRV. And if I had not been involved, I would have closed it the same way. The clincher for me was the fact that bd2412 had brought "support" to move back to WHS to the MRV, and no matter what else was said, bd2412 did not budge from that position. To an objective closer, that looks like, "Oh yeah, the closer admits that they were wrong and should have moved the page back." And there was little the rest of us could say to alter that. I know, not much of a comfort. I'm writing this to you because I noticed your withdrawn attempt to continue the effort. That article will be here six months from now, and nobody has established an exact moratorium. "If at first you don't succeed..." Best to you! Paine Ellsworth, ed.  put'r there  02:05, 11 December 2018 (UTC)

I know, there are other over-capitalizations to bang my head against in the mean time. Life goes on. Dicklyon (talk) 02:12, 11 December 2018 (UTC)

Hello from AndreAdrian[edit]

Hello Dick Lyon. I see you have a background in electronics, too. I'm a ham, callsign is DL1ADR. Maybe you want to look at the Squegging article and even read the external link.[1] I have learned that it is sometimes sufficient to "agree that we disagree" among experts. Give a little slack. AndreAdrian (talk) 13:04, 11 December 2018 (UTC)


  1. ^ Adrian, Andre. "Power MOSFET "Squegging": Cause and Cure" (PDF). High Frequency Electronics. Retrieved 1 May 2014.
I think I gave lots of slack by asking you to fix your stuff, rather than reverting it. Give it a once over, and I'll pitch in when I get time. Dicklyon (talk) 15:13, 11 December 2018 (UTC)

Apollos and Oranges[edit]

On the Apollo thing, thank you, if I understand correctly. Overall, I think our interactions on the Apollo pages have combined to improve them. I'll keep editing and polishing some of those pages, and have made some clarifying edits to the lede of the module page that you might enjoy. Thanks for getting me focused on the Apollo pages for its 50th year. Randy Kryn (talk) 20:42, 12 December 2018 (UTC)

Yes, all good. More to do... Dicklyon (talk) 20:56, 12 December 2018 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Jackie Walker (activist)[edit]

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Jackie Walker (activist). Legobot (talk) 04:23, 13 December 2018 (UTC)

Tremont Street Subway[edit]

What the heck was with those moves? "Tremont Street Subway" and "Boylston Street Subway" are proper nouns, and all three words are always capitalized in sources. Pi.1415926535 (talk) 03:38, 14 December 2018 (UTC)

Well, obviously, I think they're not; that's a position I arrived at by noting that in sources "subway" is very frequently lowercase in that context. Are you seeing otherwise? Dicklyon (talk) 03:41, 14 December 2018 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for December 16[edit]

An automated process has detected that when you recently edited Apollo Guidance Computer, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Command module (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver).

(Opt-out instructions.) --DPL bot (talk) 09:29, 16 December 2018 (UTC)