User talk:EdJohnston

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Caste in India[edit]

Hi EdJ, it was one person warring against many at Caste system in India, and they were doing so without regard to the existing sources. Against them was me, Kautilya3, Victoria Grayson, Joshua Jonathan and perhaps more: some of us really do know what we're talking about here. All I was doing was trying to clean up the citations etc. Locking the thing down seems a bit disproportionate. - Sitush (talk) 17:34, 25 June 2015 (UTC)


Dear Ed, just wanted to thank you for protecting the Caste system in India article. Soham321 (talk) 18:16, 25 June 2015 (UTC)

Yeas, it's great, isn't it. Just the way to stop a lot of good work that was going on and all because of a naive caste warrior who didn't even bother to read the recent talk page discussions or the cited sources. I just love Wikipedia sometimes, especially when the idiots win. - Sitush (talk) 18:23, 25 June 2015 (UTC)
Dear Sitush, (Personal attack removed) Soham321 (talk) 18:28, 25 June 2015 (UTC)
I removed a personal attack above. If there is enough vituperation it takes the matter toward the territory of WP:AE. Despite the high level of hostility, I see some good work on the article talk page. EdJohnston (talk) 01:52, 26 June 2015 (UTC)

Long past, but quick comment[edit]

When I agreed to an editing ban at the Nassim Nicholas Taleb article, I did not, as you stated in closing at any time, as you say here, Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/3RRArchive281#User:Leprof 7272 reported by User:LoveMonkey (Result: Voluntary restriction), agree not to reply to false statements made at noticeboards. I did agree to not edit the article, or engage in chat there, or with the two offensive editors involved at their Talk pages. These I agreed to, and did.

I accepted stepping back, ultimately, because another couple of experienced editors/admins came in and turned the matter around, via another Noticeboard, moving the article away from being broadly sourced from Taleb's personal web pages to having statements modified or otherwise sourced.

The bottom line is, the two editors that ganged up, though were never challenged, despite their winning their petty Noticeboard matter, eventually allowed the article to be moved in a direction consistent with WP policies. This was achieved only after moving it away from the narrow Noticeboard to which the offensive editor brought it (seemingly know in which "Court" he would find narrow, favorable hearing). Why you serve there is a mystery to me; it cannot be because of a strong commitment to true, just adjudication of matters. Well, to me, only the article quality matter. Justice is not a goal of this place, nor of mine, anymore, here. Cheers. Le Prof. (talk) 21:58, 25 June 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for your note. I fixed the above link to the 11 May 3RR report. The main purpose of the WP:AN3 board is to prevent article disputes from continuing, whenever they consist of wars on the article text itself. There are other problems with articles that AN3 may not give much help with. EdJohnston (talk) 01:41, 26 June 2015 (UTC)

East Azerbaidjan Province[edit]

Could you please move this page to East Azerbaijan Province, which is how Azerbaijan is spelled in English? Alakzi (talk) 20:40, 26 June 2015 (UTC)

Thank you. Alakzi (talk) 21:16, 26 June 2015 (UTC)


Plz See nationalism editing such this user.SaməkTalk 21:05, 26 June 2015 (UTC)

That editor is now blocked per WP:AN3. EdJohnston (talk) 15:47, 27 June 2015 (UTC)

Caste system in India[edit]

Thanks very much for changing the protection to semi. - Sitush (talk) 15:10, 27 June 2015 (UTC)

On a related tangent, would Category:Anti-caste movements be a POV category? --Ebyabe talk - Border Town ‖ 15:27, 27 June 2015 (UTC)
Not looked at it but I don't see why it should be. For example, the SNDP and the B. R. Ambedkar-related movements would be likely members. Anti-casteism is a valid and significant force in Indian society. - Sitush (talk) 15:40, 27 June 2015 (UTC)

More edit warring??[edit]

You recently closed semiprotected some articles with your closure at WP:AN3 referring to my issue with a series of anon IPs - see my talk page. Today, I find from my watchlist that another IP - - has worked their way up the list of articles I have created and has marked dozens as non-notable and/or needing improved refs. They have made no other edits, other than to pages I created, totalling 75 edits in 49 minutes. This is a clear case of stalking. Now, in some cases, these were justifiable (the majority were translated as is from French Wikipedia) but that is not the case with all and I made edits to either revert or to highlight refs where possible. Now I find that yet another IP, with 17 edits in, has begun to revert my edits. I'm worried. Can anything be done? Emeraude (talk) 22:17, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

Additionally, I've just noticed is also in, with 15 edits in 16 minutes. None of these IPS has made anay other edits ever. Emeraude (talk) 22:22, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

If they are only adding proper tags and not warring then the behavior is fishy but not disruptive. What is unusual is that these IPs only deal with your articles, no one else's. Consider attaching a template to the article's talk page to show it's been translated from the French Wikipedia. For example, {{Translated | fr | À mort l'arbitre}} . That will make people aware that the article is at least considered notable in its original home. EdJohnston (talk) 23:00, 28 June 2015 (UTC)
I think they all have that note anyway, or most do. It's clear that this is a personal attack. I've no objection to tagging articles as needing refs etc, but when I remove them with a reason and they are immediately reverted it becomes disruptive. Consider, for example, Edward Hain, which was tagged for refimprpove. The article is fully referenced, and I removed the tag with that reason. I was reverted. The article is STILL fully referenced! (though I'm about to remove the tag again) Emeraude (talk) 09:52, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
I'm sorry to bother you again, but this is still continuing and is clearly a sustained attempt to pick on me. Please look at the following articles and their edit histories - in each case, unnecessary tags (refimprove, notability) have been added. In each case, I have reverted and explained why the tags are unnecessary, but to no avail as a series of IPs - presumably all the same person - continue to simply revert with no explanation given and taking no notice of my comments. The articles are:

Perhaps it is time to block these IPs?

Many thanks. Emeraude (talk) 12:59, 3 July 2015 (UTC)

The IPs who are reverting you seem to come from the Japan Tokyo Open Computer Network. Few of them appear to lie in a reasonable subrange so I haven't noticed any rangeblocks that would be reasonable. If you can provide a short list of articles that deserve semiprotection I could consider that. EdJohnston (talk) 14:28, 3 July 2015 (UTC)

ANI thread[edit]

Sorry Ed, I've always ANI a *****. One of several reasons I prefer to contribute as an IP. Probably better I just "go away" from Wikipedia for a few days. Cheers, (talk) 16:04, 29 June 2015 (UTC)

Actually, it might be better if you would stay and work this out. It's not a superhuman task to refrain from editing or moving others' posts, if they turn out to be touchy about it. And using an IP to reduce confrontations seems not to be working. EdJohnston (talk) 16:21, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
Fyi, I believe the only time I moved a post was here – I did that in gf (please see edit summary) following the constructive interaction/s on my my IP talk page. Additionally I believe I made a proposed minor change to some indenting for the purposes of clarity. (feel free to move this to the ANI thread if that helps)
Btw, for me using a registered account has been far, far worse (fwiw, I remain logged in on Meta). Regards, (talk) 16:43, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
Thousands of people use regular accounts without suffering greatly thereby. Especially the people who aspire to make real content contributions, as you do. EdJohnston (talk) 16:55, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
Thank you Ed, but I believe I actually already have a history of real content contributions. For example, as an IP editor I was one of the main contributors to bringing Pancreatic cancer to FA (in active collaboration with an initiative involving Cancer Research UK). (talk) 17:05, 29 June 2015 (UTC)

RE your closure [[1]]: Yes, I do indeed wish the serious points I raised to be addressed. This sort of treatment leaves me with a bitter taste, and does nothing whatsoever to encourage me to log in on Wikipedia (I'm far better logged out or away altogether, thanks!). Fwiw, I blame the woeful inadequacy (imo) of the ANI process as a whole, rather than any individual admin. (talk) 17:15, 29 June 2015 (UTC)

In reply: The thread seems to have been re-closed by you anyway. Fyi, I wasn't even informed that the case had been opened. Whatever possible personal considerations there may be (regarding other individuals) which I don't know about, I have to say that the whole process appears to me have been absurd. No, I do not wish to open a complaint that might lead to another constructive editor being blocked. What I did – and still would – request is that someone try to explain to the editor about the relevance of WP:REDACT, WP:AGF, etc in this sort of context. That seems to me to be a reasonable request which is unlikely to harm anyone. Alternatively, I have to confess to the temptation to request to be self-blocked. Whatever the esoteric procedural bureaucracy of ANI, I don't think this is the way Wikipedia as a whole (and please note I'm not saying you personally) should be treating its contributors. (talk) 19:38, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
Without looking into it deeply, it seemed to me that you *were* making changes to others' posts in ways that weren't strictly necessary. That reduced my willingness to do a complete study of what everyone said and did. I've no opinion on who is actually behaving better. EdJohnston (talk) 19:48, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
Look I find that comment absurd and frankly insulting. I have been trying to be as considerate as possible to all concerned. Kindly consider that the other user has been accusing me of sock puppetry without the slightest cause. That the user did not even inform me of the ANI case. That I've repeatedly tried to dialogue constructively with the user about the relevance of TGF over the last week or so. That I've just wasted my afternoon raising my blood pressure providing you with fiddly diffs. Yukkk!!!! (talk) 20:10, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
Wikipedia sure knows how to distance contributors from Wikipedia! (talk) 20:19, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
...Oh, and btw, the case was taken to the edit-warring noticeboard... I'd really like to know what possible cause there could possibly have been for that (other than wrecking my day!)? And all you can say is stuff like:

Without looking into it deeply, it seemed to me that you *were* making changes to others' posts in ways that weren't strictly necessary. That reduced my willingness to do a complete study of what everyone said and did. I've no opinion on who is actually behaving better.

Sorry, goodbye! — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 20:35, 29 June 2015 (UTC)

Template Error[edit]

Hi EdJohnston,

When you moved {{snd}} on 22:05, 29 June 2015, you broke it. Instead of working properly, it currently displays

REDIRECT Template:Spaced en dash

This is a redirect from a page that has been moved (renamed). This page was kept as a redirect to avoid breaking links, both internal and external, that may have been made to the old page name. For more information follow the category link.

I think the source of the problem is that you forgot to include <noinclude></noinclude> around the redirect notice template, but I'm not entirely sure of that as I'm not an expert in that area. Please correct this mistake and try to avoid it in the future. Thanks.  White Whirlwind  咨  22:19, 29 June 2015 (UTC)

You can see the unpleasant results of this edit in the references for Widener Library (refs 30, 85, 122, among others). Please fix ASAP. – Jonesey95 (talk) 22:31, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for the feedback. I have reversed the move, and will let the original requester, User:Alakzi, decide whether he wants to open a full move discussion. The Widener Library page seems to be back to normal. EdJohnston (talk) 22:42, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
This was a double redirect. After moving a template, you need to ensure that you've re-targeted all of its redirects; {{Spaced ndash}} has got 8. Alakzi (talk) 22:57, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
I'll leave it for now. Since template moves are usually cosmetic (the name isn't visible to the reader of the encyclopedia) we can wait for the outcome of a full move discussion, if you want to start one. EdJohnston (talk) 23:28, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for the quick fix. – Jonesey95 (talk) 23:20, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
Why might we need an RM? We've already agreed that "en dash" is a better name at Template talk:En dash#Requested move 21 June 2015. Just move it back and I'll get the redirects sorted. Alternatively, lower the protection to template, and I'll perform the move; 25k transclusions do not warrant full protection. Alakzi (talk) 23:33, 29 June 2015 (UTC)
Template:Spaced ndash is under cascade protection. I'd prefer not to mess with that. If you don't want to wait for a move discussion, ask any other admin who knows how to deal with cascade protection. EdJohnston (talk) 23:44, 29 June 2015 (UTC)

──────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────── I did not ask for a protracted move request; if you don't know to move a template successfully, just leave it to somebody else. Alakzi (talk) 00:23, 30 June 2015 (UTC)

I was hoping you'd leave a note on your request at RMTR advising people about the double redirects, but you didn't do so. By opening a move discussion, I'm able to document the problem. EdJohnston (talk) 00:38, 30 June 2015 (UTC)
You could've left a comment directly under my TR. How is opening a RM helping anything? Alakzi (talk) 00:40, 30 June 2015 (UTC)


Hi, I just seen this rewriting of wiki-history while commenting about an unrelated matter (ie: not following Twobells around). It's practically agitation, claiming there has been an effort to ban them, canvassing etc. - Sitush (talk) 10:17, 30 June 2015 (UTC)

And then followed by this (sorry, there is a bit of an unrelated edit by Kenfyre in that diff). - Sitush (talk) 11:31, 30 June 2015 (UTC)

Talk:Panic bar[edit]

I'd be very interested to hear how you came to the decision that there was a consensus to move this article from the British title to the American title, since those who supported the move didn't seem to be aware that this was an ENGVAR issue (the nominator, an American, said that panic bar was more common, which is only true in North America; another contributor, also an American, said that he'd never heard the term "crash bar", which is irrelevant; and an anon made a statement which didn't seem to make much sense) and there was not sufficient discussion after I pointed out that it was. We do not generally call them panic bars in the UK, and therefore under WP:ENGVAR and WP:RETAIN the article should clearly have remained at the original title. I'd request you to reconsider this close. -- Necrothesp (talk) 10:47, 30 June 2015 (UTC)

Per your objection, I've undone my closure at Talk:Crash bar#Requested move 31 May 2015 and have advised more discussion on the matter of WP:ENGVAR. The best solution might be something that is recognizable in all regions, if such a term exists. Some Google searching might show what that is. EdJohnston (talk) 16:54, 30 June 2015 (UTC)

AE Appeal[edit]

Ed, you said you take note of the promotional language. The language was quoted from a medical journal review with inline text attribution, so what exactly are you taking note of in your close? It appears you took others at their word and did not look at any of the information I provided. I contest your close and the language you used, and ask that you please reconsider. There were other reasons mentioned in my appeal which you also seem to have overlooked. The reason I contest it follows from WP:CLOSE: "Consensus is not determined by counting heads, but neither is it determined by the closer's own views about what is the most appropriate policy. The closer is there to judge the consensus of the community, after discarding irrelevant arguments: those that flatly contradict established policy, those based on personal opinion only, those that are logically fallacious, those that show no understanding of the matter of issue.[2] If the discussion shows that some people think one policy is controlling, and some another, the closer is expected to close by judging which view has the predominant number of responsible Wikipedians supporting it, not personally select which is the better policy. He or she is not expected to decide the issue, just to judge the result of the debate, and is expected to know policy sufficiently to know what arguments are to be excluded as irrelevant. If the consensus of reasonable arguments is opposite to the closer's view, he or she is expected to decide according to the consensus. The closer is not to be a judge of the issue, but rather of the argument."Atsme📞📧 12:31, 30 June 2015 (UTC) M

Please see comments on my talk page[edit]

--Rockybiggs (talk) 11:04, 1 July 2015 (UTC)

I would also like to add why wasn't the other user facing the same, despite my requests to him to goto talk page, and his obvious history of reverting without EVER going to the talk page?--Rockybiggs (talk) 11:04, 1 July 2015 (UTC)

My rationale was given at at ANEW (permalink). Only one party was blocked because only one party broke the WP:1RR. Two other people in that thread are already notified of WP:ARBPIA. Consider opening a WP:Request for comment or use other methods of WP:DR. EdJohnston (talk) 13:28, 1 July 2015 (UTC)

Editing dispute[edit]

Hello. Can you please help me solve a editing dispute. I enhanget some time ago this family tree articles (1; 2; 3; 4; 5), but the user Jaqeli keeps deleting my contributions. His sole argument is that there are too much informations, but I have the opinion that this is what a family tree is about, to show the family relations of the monarchs. To make a comprehensive family tree, not just a simple monarchs listing. Those are usefull informations for a short articles like that. What's your opinion? I'm asking you, because some time ago you told me to ask for help in solving a editing dispute. --Daduxing (talk) 16:29, 1 July 2015 (UTC)

Per WP:IINFO, Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate selection of information. See also WP:NOTGENEALOGY. You are adding many entries for people who don't have their own articles (and thus lack notability) and you often use names for them which are not unique, so we can't be sure who you are referring to. Your additions aren't linked to any references so we can't tell if your information is even correct. If you and User:Jaqeli can't reach agreement, consider using the steps of WP:Dispute resolution. Thank you, EdJohnston (talk) 22:06, 1 July 2015 (UTC)

Page protection request[edit]

Hello Ed Johnson, I'm requesting a page protection for article: Zeitgeist (film series). The article is causing major disputes over sources, information, etc. The article's history shows plenty of reverts already but no violations of 3RR. I'v already warned some editors for 2RR, but it seems that some believe they can still revert and get away via main dispute of source WP:3RRNO exemption #7 and WP:GRAPEVINE. Are these policies a "get away with it" pass to revert continuously...? Thanx & Cheers! — JudeccaXIII (talk) 18:10, 1 July 2015 (UTC)

I've applied one month of full protection at Zeitgeist (film series). If I recall correctly, this page is the subject of almost continuous dispute. EdJohnston (talk) 18:39, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for the article protection. Hopefully this will calm things down once the protection expires. Happy editing & Cheers! — JudeccaXIII (talk) 19:42, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
Ed Johnson, I'm contacting to ask for a down-grading of the edit-protection on Zeitgeist (film series). At least two of the reverts today were a mistake caused by a 'patroller' misunderstanding an IP edit. I was on the point of asking myself for protection, though I would have asked for a lower level. You and JudeccaXIII are quite correct that talk page is in a state of 'almost continuous (acrimonious) dispute' but there is little actual edit-warring. There may well be a number of SPA's, but they have confined themselves mostly to 'talk'. My own involvement is very recent as a result of a RFC.Pincrete (talk) 20:37, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
@Pincrete, If Ed Johnson lowers the protection standards to where editors can edit the article again, wouldn't those other editors return to bicker amongst each other again and possible weekly to daily reverts? It may not look like edit warring, but it is in a caution status. In the end, this is up to the admin's decision. — JudeccaXIII (talk) 20:57, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
I agree that the talk page is a constant state of disruption, and there has been low-level edit-warring, just not to the point of 3RR. Will you, User:EdJohnston, be monitoring the talk page to deal with the personal attacks, or will some other admin do that? I would hope that the article can be unprotected after less than a month, but that is largely up to whether the editors will collaborate. Two of the three RFCs have now completed their 30-day course. Maybe closure of the RFCs might help. Robert McClenon (talk) 21:04, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
JudeccaXIII, of course it is the admin's decision. The I.P. 'warring' today was actually largely right (text not in source, refs attached to wrong quotes), I thought EdJ should know that. Pincrete (talk) 21:21, 1 July 2015 (UTC)

Request for speedy deletion help[edit]

Hi Ed,

I'm beginning to implement an article page move that has entanglements in the name space involving a disambiguation file and various redirects, one of whose histories it would be well to preserve. It will require the touch of an administrator to delete a couple of redirects at the right time. While I could submit normal requests and then wait, I'd like to expedite the timing of the changes, since it affects namespace stability as much as it does, and since I have tasks to do both before and after the help. I've documented the whole process of implementation (so I don't forget things) on my talk page so I can also keep a record in case I need to refer back. Description of the specific help and how it fits in can be found there. If you accept, would you please contact me at the bottom of that section, and we can ping each other there to coordinate efforts? Thanks much, in advance! I'm already starting on the first tasks. Evensteven (talk) 20:52, 1 July 2015 (UTC)

Looks like it's all done now. Someone else stepped in. Thanks! Evensteven (talk) 21:49, 1 July 2015 (UTC)