User talk:Future Perfect at Sunrise

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Not so urgent

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Please Explain


Can you please explain why you have allowed the Assyrian People Page to regress back to original state of displaying nothing other than Assyrian political propaganda? Sr 76 (talk) 23:23, 6 October 2016 (UTC)

removed link


Regarding the link on the Modern Greek page ( Ask any question about the Greek language and a qualified Greek teacher answers you ). I opened a discussion on the talk page here:

In summary : 1) It links to a completely free service 2) Unique and valuable to people having serious questions about the Greek language. 3) Other external links on that page do belong to commercial sites . I have given two examples.

Could you please respond and clarify?Leontaurus (talk) 09:10, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

Can you read this?

Are you able to read what's handwritten here in German? Basemetal 15:11, 16 October 2016 (UTC)

I could cheat and say I read it alright, but these 18th/19th century scripts are quite hard to read for people today, and Haydn's handwriting in his old age wasn't the best. But it's transcribed on the web as "Heute den 1ten April verkaufte ich mein schönes Fortepiano um 200 fl" (followed obviously by the signature "Jos: Haydn" and the date line "im 78 Jahr"). "Today, 1 April, I sold my beautiful piano for 200 Gulden". I'm familiar enough with this type of handwriting to confirm that that's what it says, having found the transcription elsewhere. Fut.Perf. 16:33, 16 October 2016 (UTC)
Thanks a lot. Basemetal 18:03, 16 October 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protection needed

Hi Future Perfect at Sunrise, It seems that the threat from vote x for change is not yet over. He vandalized the Hegira article on 17 July 2016‎ with a ip-sock and the article remained in the distorted state for about two months. Being a not-so-notable article, it is monitored by only those related to its development, and not by others. This makes it vulnerable to long-standing disruptions. I think an indefinite semi-protection is needed here.

The article is not on a current issue, and almost all vital info has already been added. There is virtually nothing important to add here. So, a semi-protection will not be a problem, rather a good defense against the ip disruptors and socks. -AsceticRosé 15:54, 17 October 2016 (UTC)

When or where can -ier rhyme with -ür in German?

The following stanza (from Der Greis by Johann Wilhelm Ludwig Gleim)

Hin ist alle meine Zier!
Meiner Wangen Roth
Ist hinweggeflohn! Der Tod
Klopft an meine Thür!

rhymes Zier und Tür! Hello? Just a random isolated license or is there an explanation or maybe even a system? Basemetal 20:32, 17 October 2016 (UTC)

Many German dialects (especially central and eastern ones) have a phonological pattern called unrounding of front rounded vowels, whereby "ü" and "ö" sounds fall together with "i" and "e" sounds respectively. In these dialects, it was naturally possible to rhyme "ie" with "ü". As far as I know (but I have to admit I haven't read up on the backgrounds, so don't take my word for it), among the authors who shaped the German poetic tradition between the 17th and 18th centuries, from the Silesian poets of the Baroque to the classicists around Goethe, there were many who came from dialect areas that had this kind of phonology. As a consequence, based on the examples of these classic authors, the license to use such rhymes in poetry became somewhat conventionalized, even among authors whose own dialects would otherwise have preserved the phonological distinction as in Standard German. In the concrete example you quoted I couldn't tell you if the author in question was from an i-ü-merging dialectal background himself or if he was using it just as a conventional poetic license. These rhymes are now known as "impure rhymes" ("unreiner Reim") in German. They were fairly frequent in 19th-century writings (a nice example of two of them in a row is from Heinrich Heine:

Und er brüstet sich frech und lästert wild;
Die Knechtenschar ihm Beifall brüllt.
Der König rief mit stolzem Blick;
Der Diener eilt und kehrt zurück.

This article [1] should have some of the details, if you wanted to read up on it. – Fut.Perf. 20:51, 17 October 2016 (UTC)

Thanks a lot for your answer and for the reference. I couldn't access the whole paper since, as you know, Google will refuse to show a page once in a while, but what I got so far was already quite interesting. Beatrice Primus gives five processes that account for almost all of the unreine Reime, the first one being the unrounding which you mentioned in your response above. The first example in her paper (actually in the "epigraph" (?) to her article? is that the right word?)

Die Nachtigall im Schlafe
Hast Du versäumt:
So höre nun zur Strafe
Was ich gereimt.

puzzles me a little as it uses -äumt as an unreiner Reim to -eimt. Does that fall under the unrounding process too? (It would have to, I guess, as I can't see any one of the others fitting) Do the dialects that make ü and ö sound like i and e also make äu sound like ei (e.g. Feuer like Feier)? Is the diphthong ei globally taken to be the unrounded version of äu? (The first component of ai can surely not be taken as the unrounding of the first component of eu even though the first is indeed unrounded and the second rounded, but maybe there is a historical explanation) Basemetal 22:27, 17 October 2016 (UTC)