User talk:Greenman

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New Wiki Writer[edit]

Hi Ian, I went through the list of entries you've contributed and I have an interest in similar topics. One of your entries on Lillian Ngoyi and the like. Trying to focus on SA women in history however information and pictures often difficult to find...any suggestions on ways to get good quality info up? Thobeka-77 (talk) 19:01, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

Hi Thobeka-77 and welcome! Great to see you contributing, and very happy to see the article on the South African Potato Boycott. Just the kind of content Wikipedia needs more of. Information and particularly pictures are difficult to find. In my case, it's mostly been media (obituaries are often a good source), books I already have, or other online sources (http://www.sahistory.org.za/ is a good one, especially http://www.sahistory.org.za/people for people). You're at Stellenbosch University I see, so have access to a good library at least. Pictures are much harder - quite often what there is is locked under copyright, so mostly I don't find anything. Pictures become unrestricted only after 50 years after publication, (see Copyright law of South Africa) which is why it's so important that new content is created under a usable licence. Your first article was excellent and well-referenced, and so it managed to survive. Most people's first articles quickly get nominated for deletion, so you've passed the hardest test! But English Wikipedia can be quite bureaucratic, so if you run into any problems just ping me and hopefully I'll be able to help. Greenman (talk) 19:43, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

Cape Party[edit]

Hello Greenman,

I am still awaiting your response in the cape party issue the current version is not Neutral , its negative and in order for it to be neutral the opposing version must be stated, if you do not agree to whom can I escalate this complaint?


Hello Greenman, — Preceding unsigned comment added by 105.224.90.215 (talk) 07:37, 11 February 2017 (UTC) I agree with you that submissions hereto must be nuatral its for that very reason that I edited the current page to give both sides of the coin is that not a common principle ? to hear both sides?

This is what will make the current one sided article , nuataral when both sides is presented and not just one side. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 105.224.90.215 (talk) 04:25, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

The current version only gives the critism but not the answer to that are the reader not entitled to hers both sides and then dedice instead of only been given a one sided version?

I did not delete the negative date I simply put the Cape Parties ansswer to it is this not the correct manner to do it? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 105.224.90.215 (talk) 04:18, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

I have moved to the discussion to Talk:Cape Party, as it's about the article and others interested could also join in. I will reply there. Greenman (talk) 08:06, 11 February 2017 (UTC)


Archives[edit]

Greenman is presented this Africa Award for his excellent contributions to Africa-related articles, particularly his thorough work on South Africa-related coverage. Presented by Jcw69 18:12, 14 December 2005 (UTC) from the Africa-related regional notice board

Ahmed Adly[edit]

Thanks for editing out the old info. I've updated it with up to date info. Sorry if you get a message saying its been undone, that's not quite true. I simply wanted to use the correct coding for the infobox. Jkmaskell (talk) 22:21, 30 January 2015 (UTC)

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'Boer Wars' article reversion Aug 2014[edit]

Hi. I noticed that in Aug 2014 you reverted the 'Boer Wars' article (edit 621049883, reverting to 553305341) to a much older version. This removed an entire section on the Boer Wars in fiction, and removed several links and other minor edits that seemed valuable. Before I undo the reversion (or re-edit, since that page has since been moved/DABed), I wanted to check with you what you think/thought is best. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Arthurattwell (talkcontribs) 15:57, 9 February 2015 (UTC)

Arthurattwell, feel free to undo it. Looking at the edit history, I was in the midst of undoing a spate of vandalism, and probably just quickly looked at the top of the diff and assumed content had been removed. I see though that it was a substantial reworking and content was added further down. Greenman (talk) 08:41, 10 February 2015 (UTC)
Greenman, thanks. The earlier article has been restructured, so I've added the 'In fiction' section back to South African Wars (1879–1915).Arthurattwell (talk) 12:37, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

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Tim Couzens[edit]

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Cape Town 9[edit]

Hi Ian, it sounds like we missed each other. The waiters landed up giving me a table for 5 at the very back of the cafe' at 10:30am when I arrived. I did have some notices up advertising our table but should have put a note up on the Cape Town 9 Wikipedia page as well. Sorry we missed each other. Either way I owe you some tea.--Discott (talk) 12:24, 6 September 2015 (UTC)

Just setup Cape Town 10 in early October so we can make up for missing each other today.--Discott (talk) 12:55, 6 September 2015 (UTC)
I arrived at 11 and saw User:Greenman immediately - I confess I didn't look any further. We enjoyed our chat. Wizzy 17:06, 6 September 2015 (UTC)

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Your country needs more of you[edit]

Hi Greenman, I've setup some style guide subpages on WP:ZA. Would you be interested in writing a style guide for future editors? The idea is to get more standardisation across these articles. The guide is should be structured in the same way as the article layout, you can have a look at the one I started for government cabinets. Of course, your extensive experience on Wikipedia is perfect for the task of explaining on how it should be done.

Lastly, if you're keen, you might wanna help get the WP:POLITICSZA task force off the ground. At the moment, it's only me - but trying to collect all the editors interested in South African politics. A lot of the articles are disarray and need some sort of centralised team input. - That Video Shop Guy (talk) 22:26, 17 September 2015 (UTC)

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Shutdown of thermohaline circulation[edit]

Hey Greenman, the quotes in "Effects on weather" section are the last 2 paragraphs of the section; the quotes are not evident since there has been a bit of back and forth between me and Prokaryotes on this page, i had put a quote template in which was removed. Please see the talk page: Talk:Shutdown_of_thermohaline_circulation#Copying_text_from_other_sources. cheers David Woodward ☮ ♡♢☞☽ 00:59, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

Nomination of Tsonga Wikipedia for deletion[edit]

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1994 National Soccer League (South Africa)[edit]

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Proposed deletion of Venda Wikipedia[edit]

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Tarik Nehal[edit]

Hey, I noticed you voted keep on [1]. I added a comment on the discussion which I think would be of interest to you. If you could, please change your vote. CerealKillerYum (talk) 03:05, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

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List of National Assembly members redundant?[edit]

@Greenman: can we combine the List of National Assembly members of the 26th Parliament of South Africa with 26th South African Parliament article. It seems a bit WP:LISTCRUFT to separate it out. The Brits have it in their Parliament articles 56th Parliament of the United Kingdom, except they have redirected to a list. Although in South Africa we do not directly vote for MPs, rather a Party that in turn places MPs into the National Assembly based on the number of votes won. Thoughts?

Personally I prefer the separate pages, it would make the main articles very long to combine. But add a note on one of the talk pages and we can discuss there with others. Greenman (talk) 17:35, 27 June 2016 (UTC)

I am just an IP address user but here is a suggestion. Think about the person who is going to read this and what is expedient to the user. Maybe you think the Brits are cool kids? The cool kids get it wrong. Instead rather ask: is doing this violating Principle of least astonishment? Maybe factoring something into its own page is is not necessary if its small enough, and you instead keep everything together and save me having click another link? 197.87.172.12 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 04:56, 25 July 2016 (UTC)

Sorry for trolling[edit]

As the title says I blatantly trolled African National Congress which you quickly took care of. Well done.

Motivated by guilt I decided to try add something useful. My revision (which you undid) contained several spelling and broken references to other pages but was meant to actually improve the article. lel.

Please see the revision provided by linked below and the the summaries and suggestions I have compiled on the history of the ANC. The sources I use are from Wiki articles that you can follow in the links.

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=African_National_Congress&oldid=731344476 (maybe a tool flagged as trolling/vandalism by one of your tools?)

edit: alternatively, if you don't to read the wall of text below please delegate the stuff below to persons of historical facility. after this is done I was thinking of writing tooling for WikiProject South Africa and want to hear your specific needs. here is a REST API we can use: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/API:Main_page

197.87.172.12 (talk) 02:51, 25 July 2016 (UTC)

I suggest adding the suggestions below to the ANC talk page, and there others interested/knowledgeable can also comment. Alternatively, if you make incremental improvements without breaking links etc, they may end up staying ;) As for tools, nothing comes to mind, as the existing functionality works well for me, but if there's something you want to suggest, feel free. There's also a local Wikimedia ZA mailing list (https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaza), so perhaps someone there has ideas. Greenman (talk) 08:58, 25 July 2016 (UTC)
As per above, the suggestions below were copied over. Thanks, but a mailing list is far great big a commitment! ;) For now, I will be lurking around, and help out from time to time. Cheers 197.87.172.12 (talk) 16:51, 26 July 2016 (UTC)

ANC history[edit]

The early history of the ANC as it is currently written implies that it was radical from the very beginning with this (strongly worded) sentence: "The founding of the SANNC was in direct response to injustice against black South Africans at the hands of the government then in power."

In fact, the South Africa Act 1909 meant that blacks, coloreds in the Cape Colony we in principle were allowed to vote subject to the Cape Qualified Franchise. The requirements were based on education and wealth, and excluded all women (including whites). In reality, the number of blacks and coloreds who owned land and sufficiently educated to be represent politically was not very.

It is also important to understand that there were to parties prior to 1948 that had once been part of a coalition. The more liberal United Party and the anti-British conservative Afrikaner nationalists that had fought the British in the Second Boer War. When South Africa allied with Britain during the Second World War it was an outrage to Afrikaners that they should fight for a people that had brutalized them (the British was among the first to use concentration camps) and their families.

After the Second World War, appealed the concerns of whites as Blacks began express a their political will. In the early 1930's Blacks were denied all representation but the UP hoped that in time Blacks would gradually assimilate into urban centers and be "civil" enough to be given equal representation. The 1948 election was decided in favour of Afrikaners were another matter entirely. Their ideology was incompatible with this idea and realizing a national identity had been a long cherished idea that they had fought two wars against the British for.

After 1948 election is when Apartheid really began through a wholesale racial segregation of society to preserve Afrikaner identity. After Mandela was elected head of the ANC national assembly it became an active force in politics. Importantly it was committed to adhering to a principle of non-violence importantly was multi-racial and inclusive to other races as opposed to being African-centric.

Much can be said about the ANC's history after 1960 called the Year of Africa which was anticipated: "The wind of change is blowing through this continent. Whether we like it or not, this growth of national consciousness is a political fact". Sharpeville incited the to ANC become militant, and through Mandela's Marxist-Leninist thinking was inspired by other revolutionary governments like Fidel Castro's July 26th Movement, and its direct involvement in wars fought in Angola and Mozambique as well its involvement with the Soviet Union. As mentioned, Mandela's law background was very important in the early 1950's prior to his trial and subsequent imprisonment for treason. The international attention and support that this lent to the ANC by United Nations, universities and sympathetic governments should also be developed.The complicated relationship between Western government support for Apartheid as opposed the ANC's communist background (see also: Freedom Charter) has been studied by academics which I initially added in my edits.

The negotiations through CODESA and that led to the interim government and election in 1994 must also be added.

197.87.172.12 (talk) 02:52, 25 July 2016 (UTC)

Criticism sections for South African Articles in General[edit]

The ANC article's criticism is tagged warning "slanted towards recent events". This is just one of many indicators of a problem with South Africa articles in general. It is critical that we fix inaccuracies such as these and expand history sections to remedy the ignorance of history in this country. The damage is not merely epistemological but can potentially misguide people's beliefs leading to things like this Rhodes Must Fall. This happened because of an ignorance of history.

197.87.172.12 (talk) 02:52, 25 July 2016 (UTC)

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Nomination of Venda Wikipedia for deletion[edit]

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List of cryptocoins[edit]

Why do you keep removing my edit to the following page: Wiki page? There are other / newer coins at a lower volume, lesser ranked that you aren't removing? leopheard (talk) 04:28, 3 November 2017 (UTC)

leopheard, there are hundreds of cryptocurrencies - this page lists those that are WP:NOTABLE and so have their own article. See WP:WTAF as well. Greenman (talk) 07:38, 3 November 2017 (UTC)
Greenman you're right - so why does this page have many other old, dead, less notable cryptocoins on there still? leopheard (talk) 07:20, 14 November 2017 (UTC)

Wikipedia:GOODFAITH[edit]

--76.210.190.130 (talk) 19:37, 19 November 2017 (UTC)

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