User talk:Htonl/Archives/2010

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Ambox warning yellow.svg This is a discussion archive containing comments posted in 2010. Please do not post any new comments on this page. See current discussion, or the archives index.


Nice work adding all those maps. Thanks --NJR_ZA (talk) 13:17, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Please help with a map

Please take a look at Talk:English_language#Map_-_Why_is_South_Africa_dark_blue.3F, can you help fix the problem please? You're the only wikieditor I know who can do this and would care about it. Regards Roger (talk) 10:47, 7 February 2010 (UTC)

Are you able to assist us with plotting onto Gauteng Map. Please contact Anne on 0789556711

Discussion on settlement categories

Hi Htonl

As a followup to the withdrawn CFD 2010 March 14 discussion on settlements/cities, tows & villages, please see User:BrownHairedGirl/ctvs, where I have drafted something to start a centralised discussion on the naming of the top-level categories for human settlements/inhabited places, and I'd be v grateful if you could take a look at it before I post it. Feel free to edit away; we can discuss any changes afterwards.

My intention was that once complete, it should be posted at a suitable place for a centralised discussion. I thought of WT:GEOGRAPHY, but I'm not sure whether that is the best place, and other alternatives include WT:CAT. Do you have any preferences?

I have posted the same msg to Orderinchaos (talk · contribs), because the two of you seemed to me the most active on this topic at CFD. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 19:03, 15 March 2010 (UTC)

What you've written there looks good to me. As far as where to post it, I would suggest making it a subpage of WT:CAT (because it seems likely to lead to a lot of discussion which would overwhelm that page if posted directly there) and then link to it from both WT:CAT and WT:GEOGRAPHY, and perhaps also WT:CITIES. - htonl (talk) 19:36, 15 March 2010 (UTC)
Many thanks for checking it over.
That's a good idea on location: I have posted it to a subpage of WT:CAT, at Wikipedia talk:Categorization/Categorising_human_settlements. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 22:15, 15 March 2010 (UTC)

The strangeness of provincial roads

I found two Government Gazette entries at [1] and [2] - it occurred to me when extracting this that "P" may be a fiction of the government's own records system rather than an actual used range, much like we in WA have "road numbers" which nobody but the titles office and a few Wiki geeks would know (see eg. Beach Road, Perth which is Road No.246 on that system.) Orderinchaos 18:36, 31 March 2010 (UTC)

That's correct, the P-numbers seem to be the government's internal administrative numbering scheme. You'll see on those notices where it says "also known as R33" and "also known as R81" - those are the numbers on the road signs and on the maps. (The situation is further confused by the fact that roads that have R-numbers may actually by administered by the national government, while roads with N-numbers may actually be administered by the provincial or municipal government, and so on.) I'm going to try next week to do some non-Internet research to find a reliable source that describes the whole numbering scheme. - htonl (talk) 19:53, 31 March 2010 (UTC)
No worries - good luck with that! Similar situation here where "National Highways" are often funded by state governments but "State Routes" are often funded by Federal road grants. Orderinchaos 20:06, 31 March 2010 (UTC)

Richard Goldstone

If you have the energy, the Richard Goldstone article is taking some strain, and there's been a request for more South African perspective. Greenman (talk) 16:34, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Driving licences in Africa

Ambox warning pn.svgTemplate:Driving licences in Africa has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Thank you. De728631 (talk) 19:02, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

South African Wikimedia Chapter

The idea of setting up a local Wikimedia chapter has been discussed by South African Wikipedians (and those associated with other Wikimedia projects) for some time now, and we want to help turn this dream into a reality. There are currently over 25 chapters established around the world, and several more planned and being discussed, but so far, none in Africa. A South African chapter, should it become a reality, would be a continental first. If you're interested in being involved in the creation of a South African Wikimedia Chapter, could you please email me directly at Kaydee (talk) 13.22, 08 June 2010 (UTC)


HI I suspect this article a hoax. 7 google hits. Can you veirfy it? If not, AFD? Also there is a suspect statement in Dimbaza which needs verifying. Regards. Dr. Blofeld White cat 20:14, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

I thought as much. I wasn't disputing the accuracy of Dimbaza, rather I was concerned there might be some sort of racial agenda with the perosn who created it. Dr. Blofeld White cat 22:07, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

2009 Election

Hey Htonl, Before I begin, thank you so much for your files you have added on commons, they are very useful and display alot of information, thank you. But I am mainly here to ask about where I can get statistics from the 2009 election for wards/district muncipalities/muncipalities etc.? Thanks for your time :) Bezuidenhout (talk) 10:37, 26 June 2010 (UTC)

Station infoboxes

Headings don't have to be exactly a certain way. We can do better than Wikilinking mulitiple times to the same place within an infobox. Lots of station articles do not even use the "type" parameter and some just say "Railway Station". There are many variations. You could also create a template for the "style" parameter, which displays the headings in a distinctive corporate manner; including font, size, color and background. Type in "style = PRASA" as an infobox parameter to see what I have created as an example. The two background colours are from their website. These are mostly your articles and no one can say you are wrong. Secondarywaltz (talk) 16:58, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

I think the best idea would be "Railway station" for main-line stations and "Metrorail station" for those that are only Metrorail stations. I'm not personally so keen on the whole styling thing - not that there's anything wrong with the style you've done for PRASA, just that I would prefer a consistent Wikipedia style to lots of different "corporate" styles. - htonl (talk) 18:31, 7 July 2010 (UTC)
Okay. That's what I said; these are yours; you're the boss. Do you want me to speedy delete my two PRASA templates so that nobody else can use them? Thanks for your good work - and thanks for the World Cup. Secondarywaltz (talk) 22:02, 7 July 2010 (UTC)
Yeah, you could go ahead and delete them. If I did decide to go with styling, in any case, it would be separate Metrorail and Shosholoza Meyl styling - the PRASA corporate "image" isn't actually used on any trains or stations (yet, anyway). Thanks. - htonl (talk) 22:05, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

University Estate

Thanks for changing the postcode, only just realised I was wrong and was about to change it my self.--Discott (talk) 17:37, 25 July 2010 (UTC)

No problem, it popped up on my watchlist and I happened to notice the code was wrong. - htonl (talk) 20:30, 25 July 2010 (UTC)

South Africa

HI. I agree. Somebody linked them this way in templates like America places.Starzynka (talk) 14:49, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

Hi. please remove wrong ,western cape endings to Template:Eden District Municipality, thoise which do not need dabs. I will then start the articles.Starzynka (talk) 09:57, 16 August 2010 (UTC)

Cape Town Edits

Hi! You removed the disambiguation for the Molteno Dam in Cape Town. The problem is, there are several "Molteno Dams" in South Africa - most of which I imagine are not big or historically significant enough to merit articles, but could nonetheless cause confusion with the more well known one in Cape Town. You decide if it still needs the disambiguation - I just wanted to give you the relevant background info. Thanks! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Abu Shawka (talkcontribs) 10:05, 28 September 2010 (UTC)

Constitutional Sources

Hello! I noticed that you contributed to some articles related to the Constitution of South Africa. I need some help in identifying particular issues of the Government Gazette containing Act 32 (Constitution of 1961) and a Proclamation enacting the Constitution of 1983. Please drop me a line at email address as shown at this LINK. Thank you. --arch_editor (talk) 19:00, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

Main places in South Africa

I noticed that you seem to have a source for the population of "Main places" in South Africa at the 2001 Census (at least for Durban and Cape Town). Is it possible to get a link to the source? Personally, I haven't been able to locate any good online source, so any help is appreciated.--Pjred (talk) 10:33, 18 September 2010 (UTC)

Unfortunately, I don't have an online source; I have access to the Census 2001 Community Profiles Database at my university library. Apparently you can get in touch with Stats SA to order a copy by emailing I've been toying with the idea of writing a web interface to provide at least the basic statistics; if I ever get around to it I will certainly let you know.—htonl (talk) 15:17, 18 September 2010 (UTC)
Thanks for your reply! I just sent you an e-mail through Wikipedia.--Pjred (talk) 15:46, 18 September 2010 (UTC)

File:South Africa location map.svg

Hello! I ask my atlases if a river is permanent or intermittent. If they differ I take the more plausible version. I think this is better than trusting just one source, it minimises mistakes. Regards, NNW (talk) 08:42, 6 October 2010 (UTC)


Why have you redirected all of the stubs? Complete waste of time.Starzynka (talk) 19:36, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

I looked at the lists of places on the navbox templates (the lists you used to produce all the stubs) and discovered that many of them are actually just neighbourhoods in towns, not really settlements of their own. So I decided that it would be more useful to redirect the neighbourhood article stubs to the (generally more informative) articles on the towns that they are part of. It also makes the navbox lists shorter and more manageable. Of course, if someone wants to expand the neighbourhood articles they can always revert the redirection. - htonl (talk) 20:04, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

OK.Starzynka (talk) 21:35, 26 October 2010 (UTC)


Hi, now that Bergsig is a disambiguation page, please don't forget the WP:FIXDABLINKS policy. Thanks, --JaGatalk 12:49, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

I recently removed links to Bergsig from some well-used templates, and now I'm waiting for the "What links here" list to fully update so that I can find the remaining articles that link to it. - htonl (talk) 14:49, 25 October 2010 (UTC)
It's done. - htonl (talk) 17:13, 25 October 2010 (UTC)
Great, thanks! --JaGatalk 20:04, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

South African Barnstar

BoNM - South Africa.svg The South African Barnstar of National Merit
I would like to thank you for the the sheer volume of work on South African related articles, your commitment to correcting mistakes, adding geographical coordinates and for the many years of contribution to improve wikipedia's coverage of South African related topics. NJR_ZA (talk) 15:29, 7 November 2010 (UTC)
this WikiAward was given to Htonl by NJR_ZA (talk) on 15:29, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

An Invite to join the Highways WikiProject

Autoroute icone.svg Yuegezhuang Overpass.jpg
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- - - - - - - - - - - - WikiProject Highways - - - - - - - - - - - -
Hi, Htonl/Archives, you are graciously extended an invitation to join the International Highways WikiProject and its new regional taskforces! The Highways WikiProject is an evolving and expanding WikiProject. We are a group of editors who are dedicated to creating, revising, and expanding articles, lists, categories, and Wikiprojects, or anything related to International Roads. This includes supporting existing regional road WikiProjects and fostering the development of new international highway WikiProjects. We have recently created five regional task forces focused on Europe, Asia, Africa, Oceania and Latin America.

To improve road and highway articles, here are guidelines for B class criteria. Please add any higher GA, FA quality articles to the international roads portal. Also, please help out by inviting new or unfamiliar editors with the Wikipedia:WikiProject Highways/New articles/Invite template.

We look forward to welcoming you to the project!

JCbot (talk) 01:54, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

South African municipalities and their names

Hi Htonl! Do you know of any reasonably up-to-date list of the local municipalities of South Africa with their most recent official denomination? I understand that the one I'm using now, from the 2007 community survey (link) is in many cases no longer factual. Thank you for you help! --LK 21:08, 27 December 2010 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Underlying lk (talkcontribs)

Not really, unfortunately. The closest to up-to-date is probably on the Ward Delimitation page on the Municipal Demarcation Board website. But it's not completely up-to-date either (e.g. it has "Thembisile" rather than "Thembisile Hani"). The problem is that municipality naming is controlled by the provincial government, by proclamations in the "Provincial Gazette", and no-one, it seems, bothers to keep track of the changes. (Another one you're going to notice is Langeberg Local Municipality, which virtually everyone still calls "Breede River/Winelands".)
Feel free to ask me if you have a doubtful case - I have access through my work to a search index for the Gazettes, through which I can usually find the naming notices. (That's how I found the ones that I linked to for Tlokwe and Thembisile Hani.) - htonl (talk) 22:10, 27 December 2010 (UTC)
Thank you for your help Htonl, all these names can be maddening at times... can you help me with this one, EC153? It was formerly known as Flagstaff, now according to several diverging sources (I can't determine which one is the most recent) it's called either "Ngquza Hill" or "Qaukeni".--LK 09:58, 30 December 2010 (UTC)
It's "Ngquza Hill" at the moment. Evidently it was Ngquza Hill from 2001 to 2002, and then Qaukeni from 2002 to 2008, and since then it's been Ngquza Hill again. The latest notice is here. - htonl (talk) 12:44, 31 December 2010 (UTC)
Thank you again! I hope they won't change the name again for at least a couple of years...!--LK 12:47, 31 December 2010 (UTC)