User talk:Jllm06

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Hello, Jllm06, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Again, welcome!  clearthought 23:19, 2 August 2006 (UTC)



Original Barnstar[edit]

Original Barnstar.png The Original Barnstar
Thank you for your valuable contributions to the articles Nature Center and List of nature centers in the United States, naming so many nature centers from around the world. Sebwite (talk) 23:01, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

This account made edits to Stanford Roble Gym. It has been nominated for deletion by I. You will take into account that you may comment on this proposal if this matter concerns you, if not disregard this message. That is all.FireTool87 (talk) 00:47, 30 July 2011 (UTC)

Working Man’s Barnstar[edit]

Working Man's Barnstar.png The Working Wikipedian's Barnstar
Great work & BZ in breaking out the Arboreta category into separate state lists. That was HUGE! FieldMarine (talk) 18:00, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

Iowa Barnstar[edit]

Iowabarnstar.PNG The Iowa Barnstar
For your contributions to Iowa-related museum articles, I belatedly award you the Iowa Barnstar. Billwhittaker (talk) 21:30, 24 October 2008 (UTC)


Just stopping by with cookies for those editors who started new articles today.

--Rosiestep (talk) 01:36, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

It just spreads good cheer. --Rosiestep (talk) 01:44, 6 May 2008 (UTC)


one of these days I'll add all the ones I'm suppposed to. In the mean time, don't hit me ;)

Category Barnstar.png The Categorisation Barnstar
thanks for all your help with the museums TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 17:09, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

I don't know if it's a complete list, but I find them at Wikipedia:Barnstars. I don't like the standard ones, prefer instead to find ones more suitable to t he particular task(s). I'm guessing Museums... is a sub-set of visitor attractions because many things are visitor attractions, not all of which are museums. I don't know necessarily that we need both for all areas. Would people be more or less likely to search for one or the other category? There was recently a discussion (I'll find the link if I can) about over categorization as it related to children's museums, don't know if that's likely to be an issue here. I'm eager to use the NY list to fix the NYC museums and cultural institutions, which is currently a mess. Want to raise this at the Museums discussion page for more input? I'll put this on your talk page in case you're not watching this. Thanks again! TravellingCarithe Busy Bee 20:39, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

Northern Neck Thanks for the links to museums in the Northern Neck article. It looks really good and is a vast improvement. That must have taken awhile.16:28, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Recognizing your template-mania :)[edit]

Blueprint Barnstar 2.PNG The Template Barnstar
For updating and/or creating Protected Area for so many states, then adding them to all the appropriate articles, I award thee this barnstar. Keep up the good work! :) Ebyabe (talk) 14:30, 1 August 2009 (UTC)

Nature centers[edit]

I know you have contributed a lot to all the lists of nature centers. Currently, the way the list is presented (as an external link farm) does not comply with Wikipedia guidelines, and when I created it, I only intended it to be this way as a temporary measure. The ultimate goal is to convert this to a list of blue links, which would indeed comply.

While articles currently exist only for a minority of nature centers, I am sure many more are notable. Now that Google News, Books, and Scholar are more readily accessible, I am sure it is possible to find two or more reliable sources on quite a lot of them just by googling.

I am not expecting one person to create articles on all of these. It would be a better idea to recruit people from every region to work on articles on those nature centers near where they live. Each person would then be able to not only write the articles, but also go to them and take some pictures.

How do you like this idea? Sebwite (talk) 03:21, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

I think it's a great idea to create more articles about the larger nature centers. I started the list because so many are overlooked, but they are a great resource for environmental education, and many also feature natural history museums, live animals, etc. There was no comprehensive list before. I will be glad to help with centers in CT and Westchester County, NY. Right now I am working on List of museums in Ontario, but when that is finished I can work on this project. How do you go about asking for people's help with this? Jllm06 (talk) 16:16, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

There is something called a WikiProject in which users are recruited to work on articles in a particular field of interest. I am planning on starting a WikiProject Nature Centers. I will keep you updated. Meanwhile, I can work on creating or improving those in or within an hour or so of Baltimore, where I live, as well as a few in other places I have visited.
I also recently created the Infobox nature center which can be placed in articles about nature centers. Sebwite (talk) 18:01, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
Great infobox. I added another category, Buildings and structures infobox. I also thought it might go in the Category:Organization infobox templates. Which nature centers have you used it on so far? Jllm06 (talk) 21:42, 6 January 2010 (UTC)
So far, I have only include it in Charlotte's Quest Nature Center, which I just created yesterday. But this is just the start. In the coming days, I plan to add it to several others that have existing or soon-to-be-created articles. Sebwite (talk) 23:21, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

AWB and HotCat[edit]

I see you making a lot of category changes in Commons, which I applaud -- the better the categories, the more likely we'll stumble across an image we need.

You're a far more experienced editor than I, so forgive me if you know this, but sometimes Wiki is not good at disseminating information about tools. May I suggest you look at both HotCat and AWB, which you don't appear to be using.

HotCat adds a -|+/-|+ in back of each category to allow you to remove, modify, or add a cat without going to the edit page. It's available by clicking the box at my preferences>Gadgets>editing gadgets.

AWB allows you to hand it a list (one you generate, or a category or other internal list) of articles or files and then go through making manual or automatic changes (eg search and replace). Since each file opens automatically (no clicks), you save calling up the file and going to the edit page. I might have used it to go through Category:Houses in Middlesex County and change each one manually to Category:Houses in Somerville or whatever. Alternately, you could go through Category:Houses in Middlesex County and have it search and replace HiMC with Houses in Somerville and just skip the ones that weren't in Somerville. Then again for Cambridge, etc. AWB requires an application for permission on each Wiki. . . . . Jim . . . . Jameslwoodward (talkcontribs) 11:55, 7 February 2010 (UTC)

The documentation for AWB can be a little opaque -- I make no claims to being expert, perhaps just barely competent, but I'd be happy to work out any difficulty you might have (and maybe learn from it). . . . . Jim . . . . Jameslwoodward (talkcontribs) 20:35, 7 February 2010 (UTC)

County lists of museums[edit]

Hi, I've recently come across List of museums in Somerset & find that you have done similar lists for all counties. I've started adding photos & moving the external links into references etc - grateful for any comments. I've read the lead which says "institutions (including nonprofit organizations, government entities, and private businesses) that collect and care for objects of cultural, artistic, scientific, or historical interest and make their collections or related exhibits available for public viewing. Also included are non-profit art galleries and university art galleries." but I'm still a little unsure about the inclusion and exclusion criteria - some of those which are in I would count as historic sites but not necessarily museums as they don't have specific collections (examples might be Ashton Windmill, Cleeve Abbey etc) and other sites which I would have expected to see included are not examples might include Ashton Court, Brean Down Fort, Taunton Castle etc. What about heritage railways etc or EH sites, NT sites etc I don't want to go changing one county too much if there are agreed criteria for all counties.— Rod talk 20:11, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

Also I've just taken a look at List of museums in Bristol (it would be great to add the relevant wikiproject banner to the lists talk page, where appropriate, so that local editors know of the existence of the list) and wondered if "museum ships" eg Pyronaut & Matthew (ship) should included. It would also be useful to add something about these lists to talk at Wikipedia:WikiProject Museums.— Rod talk 20:33, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
And what about zoos eg Noah's Ark Zoo Farm or Bristol Zoo?— Rod talk 20:38, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

These are all good questions. To me, the definition of "museum" is fluid, and sometimes depends on the type of museum. In England, in particular, there are many sites operated by English Heritage that have historic interest. Most of the English Heritage sites I did not consider museums are ruins that are open for tour, with only outdoor panels or a booklet describing the site and its significance. Brean Down Fort seems to be a similar site, but it's hard to tell from the photos and descriptions I see on the National Trust's page. If there were guided tours or exhibits, then I would classify it as a military museum. Maybe there should be another type of museum designation for these types of outdoor historic ruins and remains that have explanatory panels. Any good ideas on a useful descriptive name? "Historic sites" is too broad and ambiguous, as is "Historic ruins". Help!

Sometimes the websites for certain locations make it difficult to tell what is being exhibited. I could not tell if the interiors at Ashton Court were on public display as a museum itself. Are the rooms furnished or not? The website focuses on private functions like weddings, and the gardens seem to be public. If the interior is open to the public regularly, then I would include it in the list of museums.

Taunton Castle is listed as a museum under the Somerset County Museum article. From the county's website, it's hard to determine whether the castle is open as a historic house, or is just completely the home of the new Museum of Somerset. Any help here would be welcome.

Heritage railways are included if they feature a museum or exhibits, but not if they just offer rides. In the same way, museum ships are included when they are permanently moored and open for touring, not just a traveling ship. I can't tell whether Pyronaut is open for tours from the website. Matthew (ship) seems to be just for harbour tours.

Zoos, arboreta, botanical gardens and aquariums are often labeled as museums on tourism websites, but I consider them a category separate but related to museums. That's why I always included the See Also link to visitor attractions in a county, like Category:Visitor attractions in Somerset. In this way related attractions could be found, including heritage railways, ruins, cathedrals and other historic houses of worship, etc. If one of these venues included museum exhibits or an art gallery, then I try to include it in the list of museums and note what the site offers. Nature centers should also be considered museums if they feature exhibits, not just trails and wildlife.

Photos of the sites are a welcome addition, although they do make the page take longer to load, particularly on a list with a lot of museums. I understand why you moved the links to footnotes, but the reason I posted websites or information sites was to aid Wiki visitors in finding the actual website for a museum without an existing Wiki article. If the article exists, then that's where the link would be, but many smaller museums may never be considered notable enough to have an article created about them, so the website listing is there to go to directly. In many cases, tracking down the official website was a challenge! Unfortunately, I think most people won't read the footnotes, so by moving the website to a footnote it limits the usability of the link. I suggest keeping the websites as part of the Summary for museums with no existing article. Jllm06 (talk) 12:31, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the response. I agree the definition of museum is difficult & was explored at Wikipedia:WikiProject Museums. As for specifics Ashton Court is included in List of museums in Bristol - althoug it is closer to Bristol than most of Somerset but officially falls within the county of Somerset. I hope to turn all the red links blue on the Somerset list over the next few weeks & add to the descriptions - which is what we are referencing, not using WikiPedia as a travel guide. These are based on previous experience and discussions of getting lists to Featured List status (eg Grade I listed buildings in Bath and North East Somerset (FLC), Grade I listed buildings in Bristol (FLC), Grade I listed buildings in Mendip (FLC), Grade I listed buildings in North Somerset (FLC), Grade I listed buildings in Sedgemoor (FLC), Grade I listed buildings in South Somerset (FLC), Grade I listed buildings in Taunton Deane (FLC), Grade I listed buildings in West Somerset (FLC), List of civil parishes in Somerset (FLC), List of locks on the Kennet and Avon Canal (FLC), List of Sites of Special Scientific Interest in Somerset (FLC). I also hope to add coordinates for each entry on the list which enables a kml file to map them all for users. Hope some of those ideas are useful/OK with you. I think more general discussion on the wider lists of museums (rather than just Somerset) should probably be at Wikipedia:WikiProject Museums.— Rod talk 18:17, 26 May 2010 (UTC)
Thanks for your message re coordinates on List of museums in Somerset, however I don't understand your comment about it affecting the sorting Town/City column. I've tried it & it still works alphabetically.— Rod talk 11:54, 31 May 2010 (UTC)
Ahh I understand now. I hadn't looked at secondary level sorting within a town. We could move it to the summary field, either at the start or end of the text, but I think that may look out of place. I would suggest adding a new (non sortable) "coordinates" column. The coords are seen as useful for mapping & almost a requirment if we want to get this sort of list to FL - which is where I see this heading eventually.— Rod talk 07:23, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

List of museums in Scotland[edit]

Just a quick note to say thanks for all your work on List of museums in Scotland. The images make a big difference. --Deskford (talk) 14:15, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

You are now a Reviewer[edit]

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Hello. Your account has been granted the "reviewer" userright, allowing you to review other users' edits on certain flagged pages. Pending changes, also known as flagged protection, will be commencing a two-month trial at approximately 23:00, 2010 June 15 (UTC).

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Category:Historical Societies of [pick a state][edit]

Hi Jllm06,

I've created a lot of categories and, sometimes, editors of specific articles complain that I'm flying over at 30,000 feet and don't really understand the situation on the ground. Sometimes I find they have a good point; other times they just don't get the big picture of what I'm trying to do. Well, the shoe is on the other foot here:

Small States[edit]

When the very refined cats of California are ported over to a state with less than 3 counties and less than 1 million people like Delaware, nearly every article can be a stand-alone category that is unlikely to expand. This is the case with Category:Historical societies in Delaware. Indeed 26 of 38 of these state cats have only a single article or 2 articles that could be linked with "See also" sections.

Were you planning on coming back and creating new articles to place in the new cats? If not, we should rename the cats with one article in the singular so they don't misrepresent their contents, e.g., Category:Historical SOCIETY in South Dakota, Category:Historical SOCIETY in Idaho, etc. Renaming the cats after the single article would work too.

Big States[edit]

Now, in theory, I can imagine a Historical Society that advocates or appreciates history without owning any historic structures. But in practice, the new Historical societies in Oregon cat lists 1 historical society that runs a museum while the pre-existing Historical society museums in Oregon cat contains 7 museums run by a historical society. Is that a distinction without a difference?

Maybe you can share what you're trying to accomplish so I better understand the view from 30,000 feet? RevelationDirect (talk) 04:13, 5 September 2010 (UTC)


Hi, thank you for contacted me about understanding my categorization rationales. I was trying to organize the historical societies by state and link such categories within each state, so that people interested in a state's history or looking for local history organizations can more easily find them. While currently there may only be one article for a state, such as Delaware, I am sure there are other historical societies in such states and other articles that may be created in the future. Not all historical societies may be notable enough to warrant an article, but lists may be created for each state. I could easily see an article created like "List of historical societies in Delaware", like List of museums in Delaware.

In general, I believe category names should be consistent across a category, and thus "Historical societies in" ... allows for someone to easily find articles for a state of their choice. Also, I have linked the categories to organizations in each state and the history of that state, which can help someone looking for such an organization. I do not think the categories should be renamed, because if future articles are created for such categories, that would force another renaming. This way things are more consistent.

There are many historical societies in the United States, and I've looked at many websites for them. Some operate museums, but many just collect historic documents, photos, archives or artifacts, and some offer genealogical research. There is also a definite distinction between a museum and the historical society which runs the museum. The public may know the museum, but not the actual historical society name that runs it, or may be looking for information about a town and not be aware of a museum. Some historical societies also operate several museums or historic house museums. Each museum should be categorized separately, and the society as well, which should be linked to its community of focus.

I believe that historical society museums should be a subset of historical societies, not the other way around. I have linked them in that way. Jllm06 (talk) 18:56, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

An additional wrinkle here is that some "historical societies" are actually government agencies. For example, the Oklahoma Historical Society is a state agency that appears to have essentially the same functions as the Tennessee Historical Commission, yet the two entities are categorized differently because of their different-sounding names. --Orlady (talk) 19:36, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
An excellent point. Maybe state history agencies should also be linked as a separate category that links to historical societies, since civil societies should be non-government organizations. Maybe "State history organizations", which can include also archives, like Category:State archives of the United States or historic commissions and state history museums. Jllm06 (talk) 20:08, 5 September 2010 (UTC)
Your breakdown is logical and reasonable. It also appears to be ahead of the curve compared to the current state of the articles. But, if the Historical Society articles expand like you expect, the cats will fill out of over time.RevelationDirect (talk) 04:31, 6 September 2010 (UTC)


Categorisation barnstar1b.png The Categorisation Barnstar
This, my excellent co-editor, is for you for the pleasant surprise of seeing you as being the last editor on many articles that I watch. Your work on categories is awesome and I very much appreciate it. I can probably speak for all of WP:NYCD when I say thanks so much for the help on categorizing the articles related to our project! upstateNYer 01:38, 7 October 2010 (UTC)
Export hell seidel steiner.png A beer on me!
Here's a beer for your fine efforts on improving Wikipedia! Cheers! for an astoundingly fast and constructive response to the above. ElijahBosley (talk ☞) 19:25, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

Hiking trails[edit]

Hi Jllm06, I think you're doing a phenomenal job improving the level of detail of categories for places. Would you consider creating categories for trails by county? Currently, in New Hampshire, the trails are in "Protected areas of [x] County", but several of the trails cross private land are not necessarily protected. The Cohos Trail, for instance, crosses large swaths of logging company land and nearly closed (for lack of volunteers, not due to landowners) a few years ago. Just a thought, --Ken Gallager (talk) 15:17, 19 October 2010 (UTC)


I just wanted to give thanks for all the work you've done organizing categories on Oregon-related articles! Jsayre64 (talk) 01:50, 16 February 2011 (UTC)

Thank you categories Wisconsin[edit]

Many thanks for putting the category on the various Wisconsin articles. The categories need WikiProject Wisconsin templates. I did a large share of them but decided to wait until you getting finished. It is nice to have the templates on so we know what we have and need. Please let me know when you are finished. Thank you-RFD (talk) 17:01, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

You go to the talk page and added: {{WikiProject Wisconsin}} Make sure you add the category part-some editors get a little irritated. Thanks-RFD (talk) 17:34, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Amazing omission[edit]

Categorisation barnstar1b.png The Categorisation Barnstar
What can I say? From the look of your work, this barnstar was specifically created for none other than you. HuskyHuskie (talk) 19:22, 11 March 2011 (UTC)
My mistake--this isn't an omission at all, you've already got this barnstar twice before ([1][2]) I just didn't see it listed at the top with your other barnstars. Well, regardless, you deserve this thrice as much as anyone else anyways, I'll bet.HuskyHuskie (talk) 19:44, 11 March 2011 (UTC)


So Husky got to you before me. AH well. I will make it doubly nice then. Your work is noticed and appreciated. Keep it up.

Categorisation barnstar1b.png The Categorisation Barnstar
There is categorization and there is categorization. This award is for Jllm06, hardcore categorizer. IvoShandor (talk) 15:02, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

And then . . .

Minor Barnstar.png The Minor Barnstar
Awarded to Jllm06 for many significant minor, and usually unnoticed edits, beneath the rough, beneath the recategorization mission. Some of us notice. Keep up the good work and happy editing! IvoShandor (talk) 15:02, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

IvoShandor (talk) 15:02, 15 March 2011 (UTC)

And Illinois[edit]

Original Barnstar.png The Original Barnstar
Why not a bigger barnstar? Thank you for your work in the Prairie State! Did you know that the Royal Navy named a series of warships HMS Indefatigable? Bigturtle (talk) 02:43, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

Thank you![edit]

I wanted to thank you for the category work that you did concerning various pages related to the Dayton region. There needed to be a clean up and reorganization like the one you performed. Texas141 (talk) 12:40, 25 April 2011 (UTC)

Transportation in X County, Michigan[edit]

Do you plan on creating that for all 83 counties of the state? In general, we've only added county categories to state highway articles if the highway exists in one county only, and relied on regional categories for others. M-28 runs through nine counties, and I-75 is in 15. Just curious, because otherwise the category list at the bottom of some of these articles will start to get quite large. Imzadi 1979  19:42, 3 June 2011 (UTC)

Wow, awesome user page you have - amazing awards and impressive layout! Anyway, I have mainly created transportation categories for counties with airports. I have added some road listings to those categories if they were listed in the county or major city section, but if you believe that's not needed then remove those categories. I am working my way through each county backwards through the alphabet. Jllm06 (talk) 23:34, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
Thanks. I'm pretty neutral on the situation. Michigan has so many shorter highways that are in one or two counties (especially in the UP where the counties are a bit bigger) and so many that are quite lengthy and run through many counties. I'm not sure what is best, but I was just curious what your plans/thoughts were. Imzadi 1979  23:37, 3 June 2011 (UTC)


Thank you for the improvements to Pamunkey Indian Tribe Museum. Really nice of you. Let me know if you need any help in your areas of interest. See you around. --Divide et Impera (talk) 13:47, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

Reverted myself. Yeah, I figured that out much later, after I was looking at some randomly chosen Featured Lists. The article is far from there: we ought to have all the museums in and then write well supported summaries. I'll start some DYKs for the redlinked museums, so that we can have everything there. Or is it not required to have all the museums in the list for a FL? FL page says providing at least all of the major items and, where practical, a complete set of items; Another question: is there an equivalent to the Good Article for the lists, or should one just go with a peer review? --Divide et Impera (talk) 15:27, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
Categorisation barnstar1b.png The Categorisation Barnstar
Let this be one of your many categorization barnstars (probably you're a recordholder), as my personal gratitude for a very tedious, yet extremely necessary and noble work. Thank you! Divide et Impera (talk) 17:36, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

MN articles[edit]

Great work on the myriad MN articles and their categories -- seems like you've done a tremendous amount of work. It doesn't go unnoticed and I thank you for taking the time. Annatalk 02:52, 1 July 2011 (UTC)


Can you help me Sir, how can I check my recent edits by date or how can I check my rank in edits. How can I put my name into this list Wikipedia:List of Wikipedians by number of recent edits.--AssassiN's Creed (talk) 11:31, 10 July 2011 (UTC)

A cookie for you![edit]

Choco chip cookie.png Hello JIIm06! I hope you enjoy this cookie as an amicable greeting from a fellow Wikipedian, SwisterTwister talk 05:27, 12 October 2011 (UTC)

A pie for you![edit]

A very beautiful Nectarine Pie.jpg To thank you for all the categorizing and such. :) Ebyabe talk - Repel All Borders ‖ 02:31, 15 October 2011 (UTC)

New Page Patrol survey[edit]


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Barn-Ogi-Sensu-Red-Hinomaru.png WikiProject Japan Barnsensu Award
I've been watching you plow through many different categories of articles which are part of WikiProject Japan as you are organizing them, and I just wanted to recognize you for all that hard work. Category sorting is a very underappreciated job, and you're doing a lot of good work there. Thanks! ···日本穣? · 投稿 · Talk to Nihonjoe · Join WP Japan! 06:15, 16 December 2011 (UTC)

Lassi for you ! ! ![edit]

A barnstar for you![edit]

Special Barnstar Hires.png The Special Barnstar
Thanks for your contributions to Wikipedia! SwisterTwister talk 21:06, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

A barnstar for you![edit]

BoNM - Russian Federation.png Russian Barnstar of National Merit
For your excellent work categorizing buildings and structures of Russia by oblast. ♦ Dr. Blofeld 16:33, 7 July 2012 (UTC)

In honor of your continuing good work[edit]

Categorisation barnstar1b.png Categorization Barnstar
Wow! You are good at identifying needed categories and figuring out which pages need to be added to them. I'm continually impressed and appreciative. Orlady (talk) 15:33, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

Categories for New Jersey municipalities[edit]

Keeping categories for New Jersey places grouped together within their county category as in this edit seems to be an effective solution; They're in the county category in alphabetical order and they're readily identifiable. I will use this model in creating categories for other municipalities in the state. Alansohn (talk) 15:55, 21 June 2013 (UTC)

We reached a rather effective solution in June. As discussed then and as I've labeled each category, the municipality is a township/borough/town/city, the category is not. These categories add nothing other than to needlessly and wastefully pump up edit counts. Stop and discuss before causing any additional disruption and violating this previous consensus. Alansohn (talk) 19:14, 20 October 2013 (UTC)

PLEASE do not remove the municipality categories for categories in New Jersey! It is very appropriate to list all the Township, Town, City and Borough categories under the parent category for the state! By removing the link it becomes extremely difficult to find all the named categories, such as cities in New Jersey. Categories named after a municipality are TOTALLY appropriate to include in that parent category. Your rationale for removing them would force the removal of far too many categories from their appropriate parent, such as category about a municipality in a county not being linked to the parent category for the county, i.e. not including the category for Elizabeth, NJ in the category Union County, NJ, since Elizabeth is not the county! Please, before you make more changes, I ask the topic to go to a higher level of discussion. Jllm06 (talk) 19:19, 20 October 2013 (UTC)

I very much disagree. Please look at the work done in every other state to list municipal categories at the parent and county level. There is indeed a value to know the name municipal categories at the state level. Jllm06 (talk)
The problem is not that these categories are unneeded; the problem is that they are 100% wrong. I and other editors spent needless days cleaning up and undoing the mess you created months ago. The purpose of categories is to organize articles by common characteristics, not as a means to more effectively find categories. Furthermore, unless someone knows in advance that a municipality is a township/ town / borough / city / village in advance it does them no good, nor does having a single category include hundreds of boroughs or township aid navigation in any way. Your misunderstanding of the purpose of the category system is further demonstrated by your example of Elizabeth, New Jersey, for which people, places and other articles associated with the city are included within Category:Union County, New Jersey, and every article associated with the city is in turn associated with the parent Category:Union County, New Jersey. A school or person from Elizabeth absolutely, under no circumstances whatsoever, belongs in Category:Cities in New Jersey, but the Elizabeth article does. As part of this senseless effort, thousands upon thousands of articles are now improperly included within the structure for Category:Townships in New Jersey. Not only haven't you accomplished anything, but you have managed to utterly screw up the category structure for an entire state just to impose your arbitrary opinion. Respect the consensus we both accepted in June, reach out to other editors in the state and see if you can convince them that the fatal defects are justified before reapplying these hundreds of disruptive edits. Respect the status quo consensus and get consensus before imposing your views again. Alansohn (talk) 02:10, 21 October 2013 (UTC)
Just to pick one example of the categorization problems, the article for Boonton Historical Society and Museum is now part of the structure for Category:Towns in New Jersey. Why? The museum is (properly) categorized as being in Category:Boonton, New Jersey, which you have improperly inserted into the structure for Towns in New Jersey. The museum does belong in the structure for Category:Morris County, New Jersey, as all people, places and things in Boonton are correctly associated with Morris County, but why is the museum now a Town in New Jersey? I look forward to a response that addresses the substantial objections that your changes have wreaked, before I start removing these categories that have been needlessly and disruptively added. Alansohn (talk) 17:04, 21 October 2013 (UTC)
First, please tone down your language, I am only trying to help and you are making me feel very attacked. I did not intend to cause damage in any way, just add to the usefulness of the categories as has been done in every other state!
Second, let's take the Boonton Historical Society and Museum article. A. It clearly fall in Category:Museums in Morris County, New Jersey. B. It is located in Boonton, New Jersey and can be linked under that category just as all buildings, organizations, local geology, etc that are part of the town. C. It also falls under Category:History museums in New Jersey. These are all common characteristics that are associated directly with the category of the article, but not necessarily the parent category.
Categories can be linked like a network, with many paths and branches and not just in a linear top-down fashion. Category:Boonton, New Jersey is a town, and articles in the town category belong to the town. This does not mean that all the Boonton articles are also assumed to be "Towns in New Jersey", just the category "Boonton, New Jersey".
Under your system, a category for a municipality (like Category:Boonton, New Jersey), will only be found by users if they look at the parent county category (Category:Morris County, New Jersey) or linked through an article. However, the category could also appropriately be found in Category:Towns in New Jersey.
Please look at other states, for example Category:Greenwich, Connecticut. It also falls under Category:Towns in Fairfield County, Connecticut, Category:Populated coastal places in Connecticut, and Category:Towns in Connecticut for a complete list of town categories in the state. Jllm06 (talk) 21:33, 21 October 2013 (UTC)
Please understand that we went through this same problem only four months ago. Rather than discussing the issue again and explaining why you believe these changes are necessary, you went through and updated hundreds of categories. Boonton, New Jersey is a town and it belongs in Category:Towns in New Jersey. Anyone looking for articles about towns in the Garden State will find it in that category. Boonton Historical Society and Museum is a museum in Boonton and it belongs in Category:History museums in New Jersey. Both Boonton and the museum (and everything else associated with Boonton) are in Category:Boonton, New Jersey, and the parent of that is , which makes sense because the museum and the town (and everything associated with Boonton) are in Morris County. But the town category is not a town, and putting it there means that the museum is now in the structure for Category:Towns in New Jersey. Why? I'd be more than happy to correct the category structures in other states, but the fact that they're dysfunctional there is a problem that I don't have time to deal with now, nor is it a valid justification to disrupt the category structure across an entire state. The purpose of the category system is being subverted here, and the only explanation seems to be that it makes it easier to find the Boonton category. Let's find a way to do that without disrupting all other navigation, but the only way to do that is to undo the categories that have been erroneously added and to start over again. I will work on the cleanup as soon as I have a chance. Please try to understand that the benefit of being able to find the categories for all towns in New Jersey at Category:Towns in New Jersey (and not just their articles) comes at a cost of putting every single article associated with every town in the state into that one category structure. Let's work together to find a solution that can address your goal without any unintended consequences. Alansohn (talk) 22:06, 21 October 2013 (UTC)
I have to go out now and will not be able to respond until tomorrow. Jllm06 (talk) 22:13, 21 October 2013 (UTC)


Information icon Hi, and thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia. It appears that you tried to give Hancock Museum a different title by copying its content and pasting either the same content, or an edited version of it, into Great North Museum: Hancock. This is known as a "cut-and-paste move", and it is undesirable because it splits the page history, which is legally required for attribution. Instead, the software used by Wikipedia has a feature that allows pages to be moved to a new title together with their edit history.

In most cases, once your account is four days old and has ten edits, you should be able to move an article yourself using the "Move" tab at the top of the page. This both preserves the page history intact and automatically creates a redirect from the old title to the new. If you cannot perform a particular page move yourself this way (e.g. because a page already exists at the target title), please follow the instructions at requested moves to have it moved by someone else. Also, if there are any other pages that you moved by copying and pasting, even if it was a long time ago, please list them at Wikipedia:Cut-and-paste-move repair holding pen. Thank you. Christian75 (talk) 19:07, 4 February 2014 (UTC)

btw. with 339,406 edits I think you know. I would just let you know that I requested the history merged (and I have not used this template before, so I didnt know have beginner-like it was. Best regards, Christian75 (talk) 19:11, 4 February 2014 (UTC)

Category:Law enforcement museums and memorials in Canada, which you created, has been nominated for possible deletion, merging, or renaming. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the Categories for discussion page. Thank you. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 12:15, 27 March 2014 (UTC)

Petty museum[edit]

thanks for the cleanup. I really need to get better at categories. StarM 01:16, 31 March 2014 (UTC)

April 2014[edit]

Hello! Thank you for your help of the List of university art museums page! I am so happy with the way it is turning out, and I have a question for you. I am not sure if it is kosher to post on your page or not (I am *brand* new here), so apologies in advance if that is the case...Anyway, I loved the list so much, I thought I would like to do one for art history programs all over the world (plus salaries and stipends)...I am just not sure it is a Wikipedia thing, and I wondered if you had an opinion on the matter.

This is the template I am working with in Google docs.

Thank you again for all your help. Sincerely (Vhfs (talk) 15:02, 10 April 2014 (UTC))

Vanguard High School[edit]

Just so you know, when you're trying to restore an older version of an article because of prior vandalism that didn't get caught promptly, it's not actually necessary to manually revert every individual edit all the way down the list — you can actually do it in one step instead of five or six by just selecting the specific version you want to restore, hitting the edit tab and then clicking save. It's a lot less work that way. Bearcat (talk) 16:06, 29 April 2014 (UTC)


For all your work on Dharawal National Park. One of the things that's sometimes hard about working through lots of AfC entries is knowing that I'll end up accepting perfectly good articles that need a lot of cleanup work and knowing I won't get to do the second part. It's great to see such a great cleanup effort happen so quickly. Thanks again! --j⚛e deckertalk 19:38, 5 May 2014 (UTC)


Thanks for all your help. Would you be so kinds as to add Sulphur Springs History and Heritage Museum to the List of museums in Florida article? I'm not very good with tables. Candleabracadabra (talk) 19:33, 13 May 2014 (UTC)


Thanks so much for your continued help categorized and such. Much appreciated. Candleabracadabra (talk) 06:38, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

Pog (drink)[edit]

I haven't looked into whether the subject is independently notable myself, but a couple of editors here thought is should be merged so I tried to work it into the best target I could come up with. The POG article and the new article I create Meadow Gold Dairies (Hawaii) both need better sources. I appreciate all your assistance and housekeeping work. Take care. Candleabracadabra (talk) 22:17, 21 May 2014 (UTC)

After reading both articles, I thought it best to keep them separate. One is mostly about the drink and the associated game, while the other is about the parent company that also makes other products. It also keeps the categories more appropriate, since the dairy is not a fruit juice. Jllm06 (talk) 22:20, 21 May 2014 (UTC)
Okay with me. The concern was over independent notability. If the fad stuff is true that would help. I understand about categories. I had that concern working on some Jamaican beverages, one of which got merged into the parent company. Quinabeer or something similar if I recall correctly. Candleabracadabra (talk) 23:34, 21 May 2014 (UTC)

You made my day[edit]

DYK nomination of Organ Mountains-Desert Peaks National Monument[edit]

Symbol question.svg Hello! Your submission of Organ Mountains-Desert Peaks National Monument at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Edwardx (talk) 22:31, 26 May 2014 (UTC)

Changes to Sangiran page[edit]

Hi. I notice that you've changed the Sangiran page. My guess, looking at what you have done, is that you suggest it would be useful to change the way museums are listed on Indonesian pages?

I appreciate what you are planning. However I'm not sure, if I may say so, that it's a good idea at present. Certainly this will be useful down the track. But the problem (and it is a classification problem) is that, at present, there are not really enough Indonesian museums listed on Wikipedia to make it worthwhile listing Indonesian museums by province (there are a total of 34 provinces in Indonesia). There will be too much fragmentation, and access to pages will be lost, if pages are created to list Indonesian museums by province.

My own preference (bearing in mind the limited number of museums in Indonesia which are currently listed) would be do to the following: (a) list all museums on an "all Indonesia" page, and perhaps as well (b) list museums by major Indonesian areas (ie, Java, Sumatra, Kalimantan, Sulawesi, and Eastern Indonesia). This latter listing would be a good step, I believe, in the useful direction that you have in mind. Regards Pmccawley (talk) 21:21, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

I think a list by area would be useful. I understand that there are only a few museums with articles at this time, but in the long run I think it is best to categorize them by province, since that is the major subdivision of Indonesia. Hopefully more museums will get their own articles. Jllm06 (talk) 14:43, 8 June 2014 (UTC)
I agree with Pmccawley. It makes it rather tiresome to find a museum if one has to go through a long category structure. Furthermore for many readers it will be more difficult to find what they are looking for, since provinces are relatively recent and are subject to change. If for example a tourist visiting Bogor-Java wants to find the museums in that city first has to figure out what province is it in, even though the museum might have been for over a century in Bogor/Java, and is best known as such. I have similar issues with other categories by province you've just made, so would like to appeal to you to take a moment and reflect on how useful such categories are. --ELEKHHT 23:01, 9 June 2014 (UTC)
My thanks to Elekhh and also to Jllm06 for the kind reply. I agree with the points that Elekhh makes. There is another consideration as well. Wikipedian Jllm06 notes that "hopefully more museums will get their own articles". I certainly agree. However, the unfortunate fact is that, for the time being, Indonesian museums are poorly represented on Wikipedia. This situation, to be realistic, is not likely to change soon. The supply of good articles from our Indonesian colleagues is limited for various reasons. So it would probably better, until the population of good articles about Indonesian museums on Wikipedia grows substantially, to limit the number of categories that Indonesian museums are listed under. Pmccawley (talk) 01:21, 10 June 2014 (UTC)
I have not created more museums by province in Indonesia categories, but I am adding them to the visitor attractions by province category. I suggest adding the city category to the article as well, for the future creation of the city category. I have tried to add museums by type if possible, i.e. history, etc. Jllm06 (talk) 02:00, 10 June 2014 (UTC)
But do you think tourists care about provincial boundaries or island boundaries more? Ujung Kulon was at the westerns tip of Java for over a century, but it is only since 2000 in Banten province. Also as a national park it is protected at national level and is within the authority of the national ministry, so again province level administration is not relevant. --ELEKHHT 22:35, 10 June 2014 (UTC)


I realise by your contribs that you get a lot done. We try (not many of us mind you..) at Wikipedia Project Indonesia to actually put WikiProject Indonesia in rather than just WP - there is a possibility that standardisation works... but then in these strange times we live in, maybe it doesnt matter - also we tend to put the 'other' project in the form of education/univerisities/museums - whatever... maybe quirky, but... satusuro 15:14, 9 June 2014 (UTC)

Dont be suprised if you get responses - the level and intensity of your edits in the Indonesian project area hasnt been seen in the history of the project... satusuro 02:26, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

DYK for Organ Mountains-Desert Peaks National Monument[edit]

Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 08:02, 14 June 2014 (UTC)


Sri Lanka Barnstar.png The Sri Lankan Barnstar of National Merit
For all your work in Categorization of Sri Lankan articles.
this WikiAward was given to Jllm06 by Dan arndt (talk) on 14:04, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

Sri Lanka is a fascinating country, well worth exploring and immersing yourself in the culture if you ever have the opportunity.Dan arndt (talk) 15:05, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

Quechee State Park[edit]

I see you've added an NRHP infobox to the article on Quechee State Park. I'm trying to add the NRHP reference number but can't find any indication that the park is on the list. Quechee Historic Mill District is nearby, but it doesn't look like it is a part of the Park. Do you have any pointers to more info on the park being on the NRHP list? Generic1139 (talk) 16:09, 15 July 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for your help![edit]

Thank you for correcting the problem with categories on Hollywood Star Time (dramatic anthology). I appreciate your help! I saw the message yesterday when the page was patrolled, but I couldn't figure out what I had done wrong. Why did the categories I had included appear as regular text, rather than in a category box?Eddie Blick (talk) 18:57, 7 October 2014 (UTC)

There was a colon : before the category listings. I removed this, but did not include all the categories since there were some parent categories that were linked through the categories I kept. Jllm06 (talk) 19:00, 7 October 2014 (UTC)

Thanks and a question[edit]

Thanks for updating the Automobile Museums articles. In looking at them, I decided it would be nice to know where the museums are located other than just "United States." So I added the City and State information. In doing so, I came across an oddity. Most city entries in Wikipedia show both City and State, Tacoma, Washington or Allentown, Pennsylvania. However, Los Angeles and Mount Desert Island (Maine) are just shown as City names without the State. Seems to me this ought to be cleaned up to be consistent.

That's all for now. I'm of to search the Net for mote nits... — Preceding unsigned comment added by Alweiss (talkcontribs) 21:56, 7 October 2014 (UTC)

Whoopie for Jllm06[edit]

Whoopie for Jllm06! A plate of Whoopie Pies for your tireless recent edits getting the Texas museum lists in good shape. — Maile (talk) 23:46, 5 November 2014 (UTC)

External links on List of sites of interest in Philadelphia[edit]

Hi there; I recently removed external links from "List of sites of interest in Philadelphia," and I see you added them back as footnotes. I'm concerned with the article's compliance with the Wikipedia policy on external links, which notes: "Stand-alone lists or embedded lists should not be composed mainly of external links. These lists are primarily intended as internal navigational aids, not a directory of sites on the web. This does not apply if the external link is serving as a citation for a stand-alone list entry that otherwise meets that list's inclusion criteria." Although the items on the list definitely need a citation for being notable enough to appear, the official website is not appropriate, because these are not independent of the subject. In short, I can't really see a situation in which including official website links in this article would be appropriate; it is explicitly something lists should avoid. As I mentioned in my edit summary, the official links can be included on the main article for each site of interest.

To further improve the article, I'd like to peg down selection criteria, as recommended for WP:STANDALONE lists. "Sites of interest" is a potentially limitless category, after all. My suggestion would be to limit the list to those sites of interest which meet the general notability criteria, i.e., those which have or should have their own Wikipedia article.

In short, my recommendations for improving the page are: removing the official website links, removing entries without their own Wikipedia article (or redlinking them if they should have one), and possibly annotating the entries to explain their notability.Knight of Truth (talk) 02:01, 25 December 2014 (UTC)

Mission Mill Museum-->Willamette Heritage Center[edit]

Information icon Hi, and thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia. It appears that you tried to give Mission Mill Museum a different title by copying its content and pasting either the same content, or an edited version of it, into another page with a different name. This is known as a "cut-and-paste move", and it is undesirable because it splits the page history, which is legally required for attribution. Instead, the software used by Wikipedia has a feature that allows pages to be moved to a new title together with their edit history.

In most cases, once your account is four days old and has ten edits, you should be able to move an article yourself using the "Move" tab at the top of the page (the tab may be hidden in a dropdown menu for you). This both preserves the page history intact and automatically creates a redirect from the old title to the new. If you cannot perform a particular page move yourself this way (e.g. because a page already exists at the target title), please follow the instructions at requested moves to have it moved by someone else. Also, if there are any other pages that you moved by copying and pasting, even if it was a long time ago, please list them at Wikipedia:Cut-and-paste-move repair holding pen.

I know I'm templating a regular but that's not how we accomplish what you tried to do, OK? Valfontis (talk) 02:49, 27 January 2015 (UTC)

Introducing the new WikiProject Hampshire![edit]


The flag of Hampshire

I am happy to introduce you to the new WikiProject Hampshire! The newly designed WikiProject features automatically updated work lists, article quality class predictions, and a feed that tracks discussions on the 2,690 talk pages tagged by the WikiProject. Our hope is that these new tools will help you as a Wikipedia editor interested in Hampshire.

Hope to see you join! Harej (talk) 20:42, 10 July 2015 (UTC)

A barnstar for you![edit]

Original Barnstar Hires.png The Original Barnstar
Another question. Do you know how to change the color a Navbox. DonJakes (talk) 14:20, 9 August 2015 (UTC)

Track listing headings[edit]

You may be interested in giving your opinion on which track listing format is best to use for Wikipedia here. ilovechristianmusic (Tell Me Something!) 13:38, 14 October 2015 (UTC)

Italic Titles[edit]

Something puzzles me in that why is it that some titles on pages are italicizes, yet it doesn't have Italic title or DISPLAYTITLE that seems oddly peculiar to me. DonJakes (talk) 14:44, 22 October 2015 (UTC)

I am no expert here, but I think it might be related to certain infoboxes. That's my guess.Jllm06 (talk) 19:28, 22 October 2015 (UTC)


Reference errors on 15 November[edit]

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Disambiguation link notification for November 19[edit]

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ArbCom elections are now open![edit]

You appear to be eligible to vote in the current Arbitration Committee election. The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Wikipedia arbitration process. It has the authority to enact binding solutions for disputes between editors, primarily related to serious behavioural issues that the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the ability to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail. If you wish to participate, you are welcome to review the candidates' statements and submit your choices on the voting page. For the Election committee, MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 16:05, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Templates for discussion/Log/2015 November 24[edit]

This template is up for deletion. You might have input on the request to delete it.

7&6=thirteen () 13:58, 24 November 2015 (UTC)