User talk:Narky Blert

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Archives[edit]

Disambiguator's Barnstar[edit]

Disambiguation Barnstar Small.png The Disambiguator's Barnstar
The Disambiguator's Barnstar is awarded to Wikipedians who are prolific disambiguators.
I forget if I gave you one of these already, but here, have (another?) one because either way you deserve it. Nessie (talk) 17:10, 15 March 2019 (UTC)

Thank you! Narky Blert (talk) 17:14, 15 March 2019 (UTC)

Protocole/Help!/You Rock[edit]

I'm positive I'm not doing this correctly - leaving a message for you, so please forgive me for not fully understanding how to leave a message. You contributed/improved an article I wrote about a figure in Hollywood that I am a inspired by named Jeff Beacher. I did a ton of research about him and found very reliable sources and articles about everything I posted. I was very encouraged by the amount of support - and by the quality of editors here that were helping to improve the article - and was proud to have it on the platform. Well, I went to share it with a friend last night and saw it had been deleted. I am abosolutely dumbfounded as to why it was deleted, so I'm reaching out to a few of the people who had supported it, including you. Again, so sorry if I did this message to you the wrong way, but I would be grateful to hear back from you. Thank you again for being so cool and supportive of my article on Jeff Beacher. You rock! DarthBuffet (talk) 19:54, 15 March 2019 (UTC)

@DarthBuffet: You just posted a message/cry for help to another editor in a very proper manner.
I'm not an admin, so don't have the ability to see the content of deleted articles. What I can see is:
10:10, 6 March 2019 Anthony Appleyard (talk | contribs) deleted page Jeff Beacher (G11: Unambiguous advertising or promotion)
Those reliable sources may not have been as good as you thought! (Read WP:RS.) Or, you may have been overly promotional, rather than neutral.
There is a way of asking for a page back so that you can work on it (WP:REFUND) – but, it can't be used in a WP:G11 case like this. If you've got your draft article saved: no problem, you can work from that. If you haven't: post on the talk page of the admin who deleted it (see above), and ask for a copy. (I'm basically repeating what's on your Talk Page, at User talk:DarthBuffet#Speedy deletion nomination of Jeff Beacher.) Feel free to link to your request here and to my advice: the link is User talk:Narky Blert#Protocole/Help!/You Rock. In either case, work on the article in your sandbox. Once you're happy with it, go through the 'Submit your draft for review!' rigmarole. An experienced editor will review it (OK perhaps not tomorrow, there's always a backlog), and either accept it or suggest what you need to do to improve it.
Every experienced editor was a newbie once. Happy editing! Narky Blert (talk) 20:35, 15 March 2019 (UTC)
@Narky Blert: You are awesome! And thank you for the kind words and encouragement. I'm going to be able to spend more time on this tomorrow (and yes, I did save all of my work off-line); and will take a deeper read of your response and follow your lead. I did get word from the editor who deleted the article and he was really cool and is offering to help me too. Appreciate y'all! Back soon... DarthBuffet (talk) 22:52, 18 March 2019 (UTC)
@DarthBuffet: There's a major guideline you might be interested in skimming through: WP:DONTBITE. Narky Blert (talk) 23:25, 18 March 2019 (UTC)
@Narky Blert: Again, thank you for your time and support. I just purused that article. It doesn't feel like I was getting attacked per se, just that they felt the article wasn't written in a wiki-tone. I'm going to reach back to the editor who I thought had deleted it and try and work with them to get it back up. This guy Jeff Beacher is really inspiring to me and I found tons of content about him on-line that appears solid, and I avoided using any references from gossip rags about him. Really appreciate your kindnes! DarthBuffet (talk) 18:37, 19 March 2019 (UTC)
@DarthBuffet: As a general tip - use adjectives sparingly, and preferably only factually. I seem forever to be reading articles which begin "John Doe is a notable/famous/inspirational/legendary whatever". Those adjectives don't make him so, they annoy me, and I'm already getting to dislike John Doe. Let the facts speak for themselves.
As an extreme example, I've written articles about three people who IMO died heroic deaths: a mountain rescuer, and a policeman and a priest murdered by the Nazis. The fact that all three have had streets named after them says something. None of those articles uses the word 'hero' outside direct quotes. That was what I wanted readers to think, but I didn't want to tell them how to think. Yrs, Narky Blert (talk) 19:47, 20 March 2019 (UTC)
@Narky Blert: This is EXTREMELY HELPFUL! Truly, it's hard to find this kind of straight-forward plain-speak information about Wiki on Google/Youtube. I wish you would write a book about wiki with this kinda of straight talk!! So, on the 19th, the deleting editor, Anthony Appleyard, restored my article about Jeff Beacher. I just left him a nice note. I really appreciate your time, you and a few other editors here have made me feel like I matter and have encouraged me to dig deeper to get better at this. Appreciate you!DarthBuffet (talk) 17:20, 21 March 2019 (UTC)

Category:Musical settings of poems by Aldous Huxley has been nominated for discussion[edit]

Category:Musical settings of poems by Aldous Huxley, which you created, has been nominated for possible deletion, merging, or renaming. A discussion is taking place to decide whether this proposal complies with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. Legacypac (talk) 16:53, 3 April 2019 (UTC)

new editor questions[edit]

Hello, sir i have question [according to whom?] on article of Ikram Akhtar https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ikram_Akhtar well i have found many references on internet from leading news media of india some links are here: https://www.ndtv.com/entertainment/ikram-akhtar-announces-next-film-hoor-vs-langoor-with-an-entire-new-cast-1771073 (Multi-talented director, writer and Producer Ikram Akhtar carved a niche for himself in the genre of comedy with a series of successive commercial hits like Aankhen, Shola Aur Shabnam, Salman Khan's Ready and many more.) you can search Mr. Ikram Akhtar on Internet you may find many references of him. please help me out sir what should i do? kindly let me know.


The Maven Car Sharing Wikipedia article looks a little out of date. Can you help me update it? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maven_(car_sharingThe ) — Preceding unsigned comment added by DietDrPepper123 (talkcontribs) 15:11, 17 April 2019 (UTC)

@DietDrPepper123: Sorry, I'm rather busy, and I know nothing about the subject.
Improving an existing article is a really good way of learning how to edit. Make sure you add sources for new information. The {{cite}} complex takes some getting used to, but you can get the job done in a simple way by using <ref>[url title]</ref>. (That's much better than <nowiki[url title]</nowiki>, which puts a bluelink in the main text. Linkrot is always a problem, and bad links in main text are difficult to spot.)
Don't forget to add a short edit summary. That way, anyone watching a page can easily understand what it was you did.
You could have linked to that article more simply as Maven (car sharing) - there's no need for the full url when linking to another Wikipedia article (and in fact, it's a bad idea). If you're linking to an article with a qualifier (like that one), it's usually best to pipe it, like this: [[Maven (car sharing)|Maven]], which displays as Maven.
Don't forget to sign your posts on talk pages with four tildes, like this: ~~~~. Yrs, Narky Blert (talk) 08:03, 18 April 2019 (UTC)
PS. The most common citation template is {{cite web}}, which in a simple form looks like this: {{cite web |url= |title= |last= |first= |date= |website= |accessdate=}}. You only need the |last= and |first= parameters if the citation has a named author, and |date= if it's dated. That's a better method than the one I described above. Narky Blert (talk) 08:24, 18 April 2019 (UTC)

Sources needed for Days of the Year pages[edit]

You're probably not aware of this change, but Days of the Year pages are no longer exempt from WP:V and direct sources are required for additions. For details see the WikiProject Days of the Year style guide. Thanks for following up with a source on September 28. Toddst1 (talk) 14:28, 21 April 2019 (UTC)

@Toddst1: Understood. I wouldn't add an entry to a day or year page without a WP:RS source anyway. (The year of birth let alone the date seems often to be in doubt with the sort of people I find myself writing up.)
I did think that source was a particularly impeccable one... Yrs, Narky Blert (talk) 14:42, 21 April 2019 (UTC)
Sono d'accordo con te. :) Toddst1 (talk) 14:46, 21 April 2019 (UTC)

Bones[edit]

I would note that there was a RM on the talk page in 2013 and it doesn't seem like much has changed so I have made a request at WP:RMT to move it back. Crouch, Swale (talk) 17:03, 22 April 2019 (UTC)

@Crouch, Swale: I found the page as a WP:MALPLACED error: Bones -> Bones (disambiguation). The edit I made was part of a technical WP:ROUNDROBIN move. Narky Blert (talk) 17:11, 22 April 2019 (UTC)
Thanks, I understand that that's because someone pointed the redirect to the DAB, I have no strong opinion either way, just that the PT shouldn't be changed without discussion. A new RM should be held if there is a desire to have no PT. Crouch, Swale (talk) 17:18, 22 April 2019 (UTC)
@Crouch, Swale: I have no strong feelings on whether Bones should be a DAB page, or a WP:PRIMARYREDIRECT to Bone (with the hatnote from there to Bones (disambiguation) which works either way). If you open a discussion on that topic, {{ping}} me and I'll put some thought into it. Narky Blert (talk) 18:17, 22 April 2019 (UTC)
I wasn't planning on opening a discussion on that but I suspect that that might happen, if the MALPLACED issue happens again I'll revert it and suggest to the user to start a discussion (and I'll ping you if they do start one) thanks. Crouch, Swale (talk) 18:29, 22 April 2019 (UTC)

Bolding alternate names[edit]

Hi Narky Blert, I see that you have recently re-bolded the common names within the text of the article for the sponge Porites porites. While bolding alternate names equivalent to the article title is usually the recommended practice, in this case both of the common names (hump coral and finger coral) are not uniquely synonymous to the article title, but are instead dab pages that also used by several other species. As this applies to many other pages as well, should an alternate name be bolded when that name is shared among different species and the term does not re-direct to the current article? 'Cheers, Loopy30 (talk) 12:41, 23 April 2019 (UTC)

@Loopy30: The MOS is sniffy about bolding things like ambiguous common names (see MOS:BOLDLEAD), but doesn't prohibit it. I think it can help reassure readers that they're in the right place. Three examples off the top of my head: Common blackbird, European robin and Northern wheatear, always called by the noun alone in UK. Yrs, Narky Blert (talk) 12:59, 23 April 2019 (UTC)
Yes, other examples certainly exist and many birds here too are also always called by their noun alone (American robin, European starling and Common grackle), even by most birdwatchers. But while this may be the most common usage regionally, it is not correct in a global context and is ambiguous to our world-wide English speaking readers. However, as the MOS does not prohibit its use outright, then it is clearly no biggie for articles to vary in this way. I certainly wouldn't want anyone to get "sniffy" over it (love that word by the way). All the best, Loopy30 (talk) 13:18, 23 April 2019 (UTC)
@Loopy30: I found P. porites because an editor had made an ambiguous link to finger coral. Fortunately, only one of those corals occurs in the Caribbean.
FYI, wikt:sniffy, meaning #1. Yrs, Narky Blert (talk) 13:30, 23 April 2019 (UTC)

Help[edit]

Hi,

I kindly ask your help, I recently realized the existence of two identical disambiguation pages (Habsburg Hungary and Habsburg Kingdom of Hungary).

Since the first one is well-set, please

a, delete Habsburg Kingdom of Hungary

b, redirect Habsburg Kingdom of Hungary -> Habsburg Hungary.

Thank You(KIENGIR (talk) 22:54, 27 April 2019 (UTC))

@KIENGIR: It was even worse - Habsburg Kingdom of Hungary was a one-entry DAB page. I've retargetted it, and everything that linked to it, to the DAB page Habsburg Hungary. I didn't delete anything, because (a) it's always best to preserve the page history, and (b) I'm not an admin, so I couldn't. Yrs, Narky Blert (talk) 17:46, 28 April 2019 (UTC)
Well, does it make sense that because of my edit it became a one entry (two was before my edit), and maybe my removal of the other one was too sudden? Still I consider not the most appropriat the period 1867-1918 to refer Hungary as Habsburg Hungary, but I may undertstand because of the King of the Habsburg House, indeed...in case if I self-revert my former removal of the another entry, will you be able to delete the page? (since the removed content of mine is already part of the currently redirected one?) Thank You, Yours.(KIENGIR (talk) 22:39, 29 April 2019 (UTC))
@KIENGIR: I like the position as it now is. DAB pages and article titles should help readers find what they're looking for, and I think this DAB page and these titles do. You and I may know the difference between the Holy Roman Empire, the Austrian Empire and the k.u.k. Reich, but most English-speaking readers won't. It's our job to make it easy for them to learn about it. Yrs, Narky Blert (talk) 05:54, 30 April 2019 (UTC)

Move 'Red Gum' to 'Red gum'[edit]

I have requested at Wikipedia:Requested moves/Technical requests that the disambiguation page Red Gum be moved to Red gum, as most of the pages disambiguated are not proper names requiring Upper Case. I assume this is uncontroversial, but if you object for any reason, you can move the request to the 'Controversial requests' section. Happy editing, Cnilep (talk) 09:35, 29 April 2019 (UTC)

@Cnilep: I agree with your proposal at WP:RMT. Get back to me if anyone objects. Narky Blert (talk) 09:59, 29 April 2019 (UTC)
@Cnilep: I've followed through on the now-completed move by adding two {{R from}} tags to Red Gum. Narky Blert (talk) 06:07, 30 April 2019 (UTC)
Thank you! Cnilep (talk) 06:10, 30 April 2019 (UTC)

Advice When Creating a Wikipedia Page[edit]

Hello Narky Blert,

I wanted to know if you can advise on how to begin creating a successful Wikipedia page. Thank you in advance!

LaWr123 (talk)

@LaWr123: For an overview, and some high-minded principles, read Wikipedia:Five pillars.
A topic which that page hints at but does not spell out, which is absolutely key: the concept of Wikipedia:Notability (see in particular WP:GNG). If you want your article to stay up, you simply must get over that hurdle. That means: support the article with independent in-depth sources (see WP:RS). Things like these don't count towards notability: FaceBook, Instagram, YouTube, blogs, passing mentions, promotional interviews, press releases, and so on. Those can be used to support statements of fact, but not to assert notability. On the other hand, if you find an article by a music journalist in a national publication which says, "I would rather gouge my own eyes out with spoons than listen to another second of this band's music", that's as strong for notability purposes as one which says, "This band is the new Beatles".
(If you imagine that I've never had an article deleted at WP:AFD for failing to demonstrate notability, you're wrong.)
Draft your first few articles in your sandbox, and go through the WP:AFC routine. The editors who review articles there are trying to help, not to drive new editors away. Listen to what they might have to say.
OK, so now you've asserted notability, here are some optional but recommended extras:
  1. Format your references nicely. That makes your article look better, impresses experienced editors, and gives some protection against WP:LINKROT. There's no guarantee that a good link today will still exist in five years time, or even tomorrow. The best general way to format an online reference is through {{cite web}}. (You can ignore many of the optional fields; the key ones are |url= and |title=. Nevertheless, fill in as many as you can.)
  2. Add bluelinks from your article to other, relevant, articles which readers might reasonably want to visit from it. (I think we all know what a tree, or a town, or water is, but I've seen all those linked.) If you're writing at article about someone from Hicksville, by all means link to the place – but don't link to Arkansas or U.S.A., no-one is ever going to click on those links.
  3. Add categories to your article. If you're not sure of what ones to add, look at a comparable article or two for ideas. Categories are a useful search tool.
  4. I assume that you want as many people as possible to read your article? Make it easy for them to find it, by linking to it from other, existing, articles. (1) Think up where it could be linked from (e.g. a new section 'Notable people' in that Hicksville article). (2) Use the searchbox to find articles which mention the title of your article but don't link to it (because it didn't yet exist). If the searchbox drops you into an existing but irrelevant article, search for e.g. 'fizbuz .' rather than 'fizbuz'. (I wrote an article last week about a 13yo Italian kid who was awarded the Gold Medal of Military Valour during WWII; a serious decoration, on a par with the Victoria Cross and the Medal of Honor. Without links-in, it might be getting 1 view/day (if that); it's getting 8.)
Write an article or two, and you will likely be invited to visit the WP:TEAHOUSE; another place where experienced editors offer advice to newbies. Happy editing! Narky Blert (talk) 22:25, 30 April 2019 (UTC)

Wish[edit]

Hello. Help add [1] for article Maureen Wroblewitz. Thanks you. 27.74.247.140 (talk) 08:41, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

 Done Narky Blert (talk) 08:45, 4 May 2019 (UTC)
I think I should delete the Facebook link.27.74.247.140 (talk) 08:48, 4 May 2019 (UTC)
Nothing wrong at all with including the FaceBook link among the External links. It isn't a reliable source for notability purposes (neither is IMDb), but it's relevant. Narky Blert (talk) 08:54, 4 May 2019 (UTC)
But I think it's best to keep only one link IMDb. 27.74.247.140 (talk) 08:57, 4 May 2019 (UTC)
The FB and IMDb links do different things. They're both valid. Narky Blert (talk) 08:59, 4 May 2019 (UTC)
The IP has been leaving random comments to different users to remove that link. Based on what I have seen Facebook is not a reliable source for Wikipedia per policy [2], so I removed it. Psychologist Guy (talk) 09:02, 4 May 2019 (UTC)
@Psychologist Guy: WP:RS doesn't apply to ELs. However, I see that FB is ruled out as EL by WP:LINKSTOAVOID #10. Narky Blert (talk) 09:10, 4 May 2019 (UTC)

Ignore this sock puppet: Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/HaiyenslnaJonesey95 (talk) 21:25, 5 May 2019 (UTC)

@Jonesey95: Ta. Now that you mention it, the name Maureen Wroblewitz does seem to ring a bell. I think I may have been a year or so ago invited by an IP at least once to help improve that page, a request or requests which I ignored because of total lack of interest. (I perform well-defined verifiable small requests from IP editors as a matter of routine. I seem to attract them.)
Anywayz, now I know of that WP:SPI thread... Yrs, Narky Blert (talk) 21:49, 5 May 2019 (UTC)

Pat the Dog Links[edit]

Good night. I'd like to know why you've made changes to the profile of one of Pat the Dog main characters. Why excessive links? I just put / added information. Why did you consider this as excessive links? I did not understand your attitude.

Blank entries[edit]

Do you know why some of the links on the bonus list give blank screens, then continue to show up on the bonus list? Try the three links under "Communism in India".
Vmavanti (talk) 15:14, 14 May 2019 (UTC)

@Vmavanti: I know that one – it's due to the Communism in Asia template, which is a child of Template:Asia topic. See Wikipedia talk:Disambiguation pages with links/Archive 14#Template time again. Narky Blert (talk) 15:22, 14 May 2019 (UTC)

Litto[edit]

Hi! Just wanted to check with you. I've seen your changes and the dab link repairs and the tags are great, but I think the heading simplification doesn't make it better, I think it looks tidier with the headings. Is there a specific policy or a check-mate rationale for that bit? Thanks! Dr. Vogel (talk) 19:54, 17 May 2019 (UTC)

@DrVogel: If there's a bright-line rule, it's buried somewhere deep in WP:MOS (and is probably contradicted somewhere else). There is some guidance at MOS:DABORG, but it's mostly about longish DAB pages. I try to follow a commonsense approach: what's the simplest way to help readers find what they're looking for? Sections of up to about six, or even eight, entries are easy to scan by eye (though it's worth separating seriously different things, like e.g. people and places/other uses, because those guide the eye to what you're after). Above that, and it's worth considering a split into sections. (Surnames are a common example. If there are only a few names, it's easy to find the person you want. If there are ten or more, it's an indigestible mass and you end up having to read every single entry in detail to find the one you're after.)
A flipside to that: it should also be easy to discover that the page you thought you were looking for isn't on the DAB page!
Readers who are searching by a name may not know if it's a given name, a surname, or a nickname. If they knew the full name, they wouldn't be reading the DAB page, they'd have gone straight to the article.
Some guidance on tags on the {{dab}} bit. Add |surname if there's even one person with that surname on the page. Add |geo if there are two places the important bit of whose name is the page title (the two places in Litto are a good example). Add |hndis if there are two people known primarily by a mononym. Don't add |given name unless there are several of them – any fool can dream up a novel given name, and many of them do.
If you do split a DAB page into sections and the table of contents appears, add {{TOC right}} just after the lead. Most readers looking at a DAB page will have at least a rough idea of what they're looking for, and the TOC gets in the way: you have to start with a scroll down before getting to the interesting bit.
Litto is a thoroughly good DAB page which needed writing. You've filled a gap. Do you know the intitle: search command, and the corresponding tag {{intitle}} for the see-also section? They're good ways of finding stragglers. Did you add the InterWiki link to de:Litto? because if you did, you did very well.
Get back to me any time. Yrs, Narky Blert (talk) 22:09, 17 May 2019 (UTC)

Japan Academy Prize[edit]

A possible mistake here. The biochemist Tamio Yamakawa is on the DAB bonus list for winning the Japan Academy Prize for 1976. But on that list of winners for 1976 is biochemist Takashi Sugimura.
Vmavanti (talk) 19:52, 18 May 2019 (UTC)

@Vmavanti: Gud catch!
The list in Japan Academy Prize (academics) is very incomplete. The 1976 entry in ja:日本学士院賞 is, according to Google Translate:
    Sugimura Takashi (Ph.D.)-"Experimental research on the development of gastric cancer"
    Haruyuki Kaneko (Dr. of Literature)-"The Anthropology of Luther"
    Shigeo Shibata (Dr. of Literature)-"Study on historical thought of sectarian sect
    Kenji Seki (Ph.D.)-"Structural Thermodynamics of Solids"
    Sato Mikio (Ph.D.)-"Theory of Superfunctions and Its Applications"
    Tokio Yamamoto (Ph.D. Phys.)-"Genetic and Developmental Physiological Research on Sex Differentiation of Fish"
    Hashiguchi Takakichi (Dr. Eng.)-"Study of Metallic Materials by Internal Friction"
    Tamura Saburo (Agriculture Doctor)-"Chemical research on physiologically active substances"
    Yamakawa Tamio (Med. Doctor)-"Biochemical research on glycolipids"
and there they both are, and some others.
The state of the citations in both the English and the Japanese articles is appalling. However, Yamakawa's prize is mentioned in his obit (ref. 2 in his article, a top-rate WP:RS). It all looks legit, and I have both fixed the DABlink in Tamio Yamakawa and added him to Japan Academy Prize (academics).
I also took the opportunity to add {{cleanup section|date=May 2019|reason=dates in reverse chronological order, contrary to [[WP:DATELIST]].}} to the Prize article. That's one of my pieces of boilerplate text; it's astonishing how many editors seem to think that the best way to present history is with the newest stuff first. Yrs, Narky Blert (talk) 20:58, 18 May 2019 (UTC)

An old adversary is on its bike[edit]

Wikipedia:Templates_for_discussion/Log/2019_April_16#Module:Cycling_race has closed as delete. Certes (talk) 23:25, 24 May 2019 (UTC)

@Certes: I can't say that I'll miss that collection.
Closer may have reasoned that (1) both the template and the keep arguments are unintelligible, and (2) what's wrong with wikitable anyway?
No-one even mentioned the quality problems with Wikidata; or the assumption that everyone in a cycling race passes WP:NCYCLING.
Advice from an experienced English-speaking cycling pro to a novice: "Learn to swear in several languages. Your teammates will respect you for your efforts to communicate". Narky Blert (talk) 08:02, 25 May 2019 (UTC)

Firetrap[edit]

I found a couple sources for "firetrap". One here which also uses the term "fire sack" and "anti-tank area". "These were ambush sites on routes that armour might follow if it broke through and continued into a rear area." A second source states on p. 68: "A fire trap is a location preselected by friendlies as an opportune defensive position. Selection is based on being able to draw the enemy into the trap and then extractive a heavy toll from him." Sounds like an ambush. But I would like to find a better explanation.—Vmavanti (talk) 01:10, 10 June 2019 (UTC)

@Vmavanti: There's a hole in WP. Kill zone is a related topic, but written entirely from a modern perspective
The idea of a defensive area which it is death to enter goes back to at least the Ancient Romans. They sometimes defended their forts with what is called a Punic ditch (no article; and despite the name, almost certainly nothing to do with Carthage). That was a ditch with an outer wall which was too steep to climb back up, a shallower inner wall which exposed the attackers to the defenders' fire, and possibly a narrow ankle-breaker ditch at the bottom. With gunpowder came the idea of interlocking fields of fire; see e.g. the C17 star-shaped forts of Sébastien Le Prestre de Vauban#Defensive doctrines; fortifications, and the early C19 Lines of Torres Vedras; that type of idea continues. The aim is to discourage attackers from attacking.
A related but arguably distinct topic is the massacre zone, where the attackers don't foresee the danger. It can be intentional (in which case it is often an ambush or an envelopment, both of which could include luring an attacker into a prepared lethal position) or accidental. There are many examples of the former, including the battles of Teutoburg Forest and Cannae and the Falaise Pocket. The latter type can explain the wholly disproportionate casualties in pre-gunpowder battles such as Towton and Agincourt, which I surmise were the results of crushes.
A typical case of knowing enough about the subject to see the problem, but not enough to write the article... Yrs, Narky Blert (talk) 07:54, 10 June 2019 (UTC)
@Vmavanti: I've posted at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Military history#Firetrap, and related topics. Narky Blert (talk) 19:18, 11 June 2019 (UTC)
You have an encyclopedic memory.
Vmavanti (talk) 19:22, 11 June 2019 (UTC)

Thanks for help[edit]

I wanted to express my great gratitude to you for your repaired the page at 15:28, 11 June 2019‎. Please repair it again after my edits. -- Khurshed.yusufbekov (talk) 02:31, 12 June 2019 (UTC)

Tndis?[edit]

I thought there actually was a {{tndis}}, as implied in your edit note. I seem to remember one. So, do you just add the category and there is no dab template at all? (I’ve been away from editing for a while. Some things have clearly changed!) — Gorthian (talk) 03:34, 18 June 2019 (UTC)

Okay, never mind, I found your explanation Thanks! — Gorthian (talk) 04:41, 18 June 2019 (UTC)

Disambiguation pages without "(disambiguation)" identifier[edit]

Hi Narky Blert, I noticed that you recently changed the redirect hatnote link from Cognizance to Cognizance (disambiguation) at the Cognizant article in Special:Diff/902817811. In this case, since Cognizance (disambiguation) redirects back to Cognizance, is it still preferred to use "(disambiguation)" in the link? — Newslinger talk 20:05, 21 June 2019 (UTC)

Just why[edit]

Just why you put the disambig tag on this article? I know you are a master on this kind of stuff.--Jeromi Mikhael (talk) 12:30, 25 June 2019 (UTC)

@Jeromi Mikhael: Central Executive Committee is a DAB page, and none of the entries on it relate to Indonesia. I was unsure as to what the CEC was the CEC of; hence the {{dab}} tag. If you know, and can either add its full name or add a parenthetical qualifier to turn the link into a redlink, or can redirect it to an article which mentions it - job done!. Yrs, Narky Blert (talk) 12:48, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
I put the translation on the term. CEC is a translation on the term I got in the newspaper. Dewan means "council", pimpinan means "leader" (hence the term executuve), and pusat means "central".--Jeromi Mikhael (talk) 13:10, 25 June 2019 (UTC)
@Jeromi Mikhael: Good solution, I've removed the dab tag. Narky Blert (talk) 13:22, 25 June 2019 (UTC)

RAj[edit]

Thanks so lot are you understand history of rajpasi

    Very very thanks Adolf bijili (talk) 07:37, 7 July 2019 (UTC)

Lazar Paču[edit]

Hello, I would like to ask why did you add the tag on Lazar Paču? I see no ongoing discussion or bigger problems on the article, which indeed needs more work. Mm.srb (talk) 07:14, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

@Mm.srb: I did not add a tag; all I did was add a sortkey, and fix an ambiguous link to King Peter (also removing the {{dn}} tag which was next to it). Narky Blert (talk) 07:59, 9 July 2019 (UTC)
Ok, ty. Mm.srb (talk) 08:18, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

Lakkos tou Fragkou[edit]

Localities.cy (talk) 10:33, 19 July 2019 (UTC)Narky Blert Thanks for your messages, I'm new in Wikipedia so mistakes will happen.

Thanks for editting for me.

@Localities.cy: You're welcome. We all make mistakes; I've had the embarrassment of finding and correcting ones of my own. Narky Blert (talk) 10:46, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

You do such a fantastic work all around, I must congratulate you[edit]

By giving a look at your recent contributions I see how you make an incredibke ammount of all sort of fixes, corrections and improvements all over Wikipedia. See you have been focus latelly in fixing DAB isues, but not only, your ammount of technical work and mantainance is so valuable. It is so nice when diferent sort of editors working together archive an excellent result. Content creation editors can be as good and experienced as they can, but it is your work later that makes that content to be in the right place, properly interconected within the universe of content, and to be accessible from where it should be. I must say that I trully admire your passion and dedication to our project here. I know usually this sort of work goes underestimated but I am happy to verify you got plenty of recognition, and if you don´t take me wrong from taking you this coupla of minutes, I would like to highlight your so deserved recognition even more.

Tireless Contributor Barnstar Hires.gif The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
Master of the backstage, doing the technical work necessary to keep the project running smoothly as this wheel, you are an brilliant editors which certainly deserves much recognition. Kindest regards, FkpCascais (talk) 23:32, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

This barnstar is basic, and, as far as I remember, one of the oldest ones, but I see you don´t have it despite having many other much more sofisticated ones. The star is in perpetual motion, so I hope it will look cool, and besides, it´s perfect for you, since your continuos contributions make the project run efficiently and in motion reming of the star.

I wander how haven´t we crossed earlier, this time I noteced you because you fixed some links in a couple of articles I created these last days. One was Josip Takač where you fixed my link just perfectly. But, the other is Zdravko Juričko. Your dmb choice was not a good one. I see where you came with her from, from Yugoslavia national under-23 football team and its options. Yugoslavia U-23 is basically an alternative name for the Olympic team. The U-21 side only got into the story because on one, and only one, occasion, in 1978, the U-21 team replaced the U-23 one.

In my view I think that merging Yugoslavia national under-21 football team and Yugoslavia Olympic football team will be correct, as the U-23 team, just as in most rest of the world, is just a team that competes for qualifiers for the Olympics. At least that is how it was back then. What happened in 1978 when Yugoslavia sent the U-21 team instead of U-23 one, was just an exception, worth mention in the main article, but bot enough reason to put in question if U-23 and Olympic are usually the same.

Then, I guess I see the problem with Zdravko Juričko. It was my mistake of linking the U-23 Yugoslav team. He played for the Yugoslav B national team. The B national team existed in both, monarchist and communist times. Yugoslavia was sort of UK, and forming a consensual national team was mission imposible since the begining. Furthermore, not only there were numerous good players disputing same spot in the squad, but also there was a political interference which insisted all nationalities and regions to be represented in the A national team. This created a mess and the YFA decided to form a B team which will include players deserving to be in the A national team but for various reasons were not. The B national team would usually gather at same time when main team, and would play numerous friendly or exhibition matches, occasionally international tournaments. The main coach of A national team would also use the B team to experiment tactics and avaluate players. The Yugoslav B team, despite not competing officially and not having its games recognised by UEFA or FIFA, still enjoyed high reputation and popularity, especially domestically outside major urban centers, as usually provided a chance for spectators to see more players from the local clubs, opposed to the well known stars established in the main team usually for long periods of time.

There are several publications, some even containing the full information about the games and players the B Yugoslav national team had, I had free access to them some time ago trough colleagues I collaborate with regarding football history, I may see if I can get access again and create an article about Yugoslavia national B football team, but until the I am not sure which link would be the most adequate one for Juričko, however, the U-21 definitelly wouldn´t be the one, as the B team was a senior team by all means. Not sure how familiarised with football you are, I´ll wait for your suggestion definitelly. Kindest regards, and keep up the great work! Whenever you come across some doubts about Balkans or ex-Yugoslavia please feel free to ask me, I will gladly help if I can. FkpCascais (talk) 23:32, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

@FkpCascais: Thank you for the barnstar and the kind words! The more time I spend on WP, the more I discover that there are all sorts of specialists doing work behind the scenes which the general reader doesn't notice.
I had come across DABlink problems to the DAB page Yugoslavia national under-23 football team before. They have often been a puzzle of some sort. I don't remember seeing such a problem with any other country (although of course I may have done). I agree with your suggestion to merge the two pages. What you say makes great sense. If those articles puzzle an experienced DABfixer, they will most certainly puzzle general readers.
I wasn't happy with that fix in Zdravko Juričko. "A regular at the Yugoslav B national team" didn't sound like a junior player. I found no help in hr:Zdravko Juričko (1929.). From what you know about the B team, I suggest changing the link in that article to Yugoslavia national football B team, a redlink.
Is there an article about Yugoslavia B in any of the South Slavic WPs? It's a difficult topic to search without knowing the exact name they played under, in five or six languages and two scripts. The team certainly deserves an article. I've found a parallel: England national football B team, although that was a team for up-and-coming younger players rather than a second team. There's a link in that article to Switzerland national football B team – a very thin article, with no references and no links to other WPs.
It is a measure of Tito's strength of personality that he managed to hold Yugoslavia, an entity cobbled together after the collapse of first the Ottoman and then the Austro-Hungarian Empires, together as one country for ten years after his death. The Balkans (like the Middle East) are a sort of human parallel to tectonic plates in geology, whose collisions result in volcanoes and earthquakes. Yrs, Narky Blert (talk) 08:42, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
Eheh don´t forget there was Yugoslavia before Tito, and it was Serbia who was independent and fought 3 wars in order to get all South Slavs free which were still under Austro-Hungarian or Ottoman rule. People use to forget that and think Yugoslavia emerged right away from nothing, and wasn´t like that, there were tho already independent monarchies (Serbia and Montenegro) fighting for Yugoslavia to become reality. The Serbia that existed in 19th and early 20th centuries still had half of Serbs living outside its borders, and after winning two Balkan wars and a decisive WWI, it finally got the right to expand to the lands Serbs lived in which still belonged to those earlier empires. In a complicated geopolical strategy, it was decided that Serbian army should liberate a bit further and add Croats and Slovenens as well to their nation, in what many western chancellaries saw a an ideal way to create a slightly bigger, but multiethnic state, instead of Serbian one. All Tito did after WWII was to take by force the power which was agreed to be shared with the king. He ignored the king,couple of years later he ignored Stalin as well, and he created this new Yugoslavia which enjoyed prestige because it ended up being the only nation which liberated itself from the Axis by its own resistance, without being Soviet or American troops to do it. Internally, Tito menaged balance mostly by sacrificing Serbs with the excuse of creating more balance, an action at time accepted with the idea that in the end all Serbs would live in this Yugoslavia united with its motherland anyway, however, this ws what triggered all the problems that would rise in the 1990s.
Tito had its good and bad sides, my grandfather after all worked almost directly to him and was his personal escort to many of his trips mostly related to the Non-Aligned Movement he dedicated himself so much. However, its unfair that Tito shadows the previous Yugoslavia, which was Karadjordjevic´s dinasty sacrifice in order to make more people happy then just their own. Yugoslavia after all took all seats at international organisations which were the ones of Serbia. Not like if the country came to existance from nothing.
Regarding the Wiki issues, Slavic wikipedias are not very strong and usually just follow what we do at en.wiki. I´ll try to see what can I gather about Yugoslavia B team and see if an adequate article can be made. But, as you well concluded, it´s definitelly NOT a youth team, but a senior one much like the Swiss and English exemples you brought. FkpCascais (talk) 17:17, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
@FkpCascais: The Balkan WPs can sometimes be very good on local topics (which is what they should be good on, of course). I've added {{ill}} links to all six of them to solve DAB problems in English WP.
There was a lot of pan-Slav enthusiasm in the late 19th Century. A lot of it was very naive: it was assumed that Russia would welcome and treat other Slavs as equals.
I did know that the Yugoslavs threw out the Nazis unassisted, and that Tito refused all offers of Soviet "help" and stopped them from meddling.
I have actually written a Serbia-related article: Milenković family. Reading between the lines, I get the impression that Svetozar made it clear in no uncertain terms to his parishioners that whatever they might think of Jews, either they did it his way or they could expect a very unpleasant experience indeed in the afterlife.
Fun Balkan fact #1. The 1883 Paris Convention is one of the basic treaties relating to industrial property (patents, industrial designs and trademarks). Check the list of original signatories.
Fun Balkan fact #2. In 1920, C. B. Fry, best known as a cricketer, was offered the crown of Albania.
Fun Balkan fact #3. Raguser is a French word for 'betray'; from Ragusa; not because the Ragusans had a reputation for betrayal, but because Napoleon's Marshal Marmont, Duke of Ragusa did. Narky Blert (talk) 18:46, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
Well, Tito did allowed Soviets to enter Belgrade and Vojvodina, but that was not because he needed them against Germans, but because both communist Partisans and monarchist Chetniks basically racing eachother who will liberate most territory, and Tito used Soviets to enter from the east and occupy Belgrade to give him the advantage. Its was such a nasty political move, brilliant on his side. Everyone knew Soviets would back Tito Partisans and have no simpathies towards monarchists. After the war, Tito was part of the Cominform, but soon Stalin felt Tito was having too much influence, and the Tito–Stalin split occured. In name of all people born in Yugoslavia, I can say we were so lucky because of it, because we didn´t had in Yugoslavia none of the restrains Soviet-allies had, and we had a sort of most liberal socialism possible.
You made such a great job with Milenković family. I can just say that other neighbours offered no help because those were such hard times back then. Germans had special hate towards Serbs. I don´t know if you know how Hitler hated specially Serbs, because as a nationalist, he grew up in Austria following vividly the WWI events, and it was not even in his dreams that a mighty Austro-Hungarian empire would be humiliated and defeated by a small Serbia, an event which resulted in destruction of the empire Hitler was born in and was proud of. Hitler made a law that said that for each German soldier killed a 100 Serbian civilians would be massacred, and for each wounded, 50. That is why Chetniks after initialyly becoming the first resistance group, later adopted a more passive atitude, because they didn´t wanted the nation to be slaughtered, while Partisans were more radical and engaged in actions regardless. That would become a major polemic later,because Tito Partisans would use that to accuse monarchists of being collaborationists, a very complicated situation. Anyway, Jews and Serbs were seing their faith being shared under nazi regimes, it was really hard. Tito later came and demonised all other resistance groups, and even made Croatia the major Axis state not to pay any war reparations, and even got territorially expanded, despite being brutal equally, or even mre, than Gemrans themselves, in the will of anhiquilation of Jews, Serbs, and other undesired elements...
Fun fact n1, no wander :)
Fun fact n2, if you see, only Serbia is the nation in the region that only had its own royal families, the others all had foreigners as rulers. Another funny exemple is Independent State of Croatia offer of crown to Prince Aimone, Duke of Aosta. They wanted so badly to have a monarchy they offered themelves to Aimone, who.... refused them... lol
Fun fact n3, Ragusan may mean betrail because of the following. Ragusa became proeminent when during middle ages became an commercial outpost of Serbia. Serbia was known as a major producer of metals, and as such, became known along Portugal as main forgery of coins. Specially during Serbian empire. This forgery of monney irritated western monarchies to its maximum levels, is it maybe because of that that they considered Ragusa "betrail"? Cause all Serbian exports including counterfited coins were exported trough Ragusa. FkpCascais (talk) 23:18, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
@FkpCascais: The most implausible royal dynasty in Europe, if not anywhere, may be the House of Bernadotte, which still survives.
Jean Bernadotte was the son of a French lawyer. He joined the French revolutionary army as a private. He was an outspoken anti-monarchist, was rapidly promoted, and was raised to the rank of Marshal by Napoleon. Napoleon nearly had him court-martialled twice for cowardice, and IMO he would have richly deserved it.
He was kind to some Swedish prisoners. After Sweden's royal line died out, he was offered the crown, and accepted it. Narky Blert (talk) 11:23, 22 July 2019 (UTC)

James[edit]

@Narky Blert, Thank you for fixing the link to the DAB page for the James discography I edited on July 4, 2019. It was my first edit ever! Hopefully I'll create an actual page for it. Also I will study the DAB link articles you provided on your user page--very helpful. I have learned a lot already. As it turns out, learning takes time. :o) Your credentials are impressive and fun for someone like me to consider. Thanks again! CharlesTStokes (talk) 22:56, 22 July 2019 (UTC)

@CharlesTStokes: That's the sort of thing us WikiGnomes do! I'm pleased that you found something of use on my User Page. All we editors have a lot to learn; I keep on finding new things. Feel free to ask me questions anytime.
As a James fan, it was a pleasure to make that edit (even by adding a redlink) and improve the article. Happy editing, as they say. Narky Blert (talk) 23:25, 22 July 2019 (UTC)

Chronicon Altinate[edit]

Hi, in Chronicon Altinate, you changed Chronicon Gradense to Chronicon Venetum et Gradense. Do you have a WP:RS? The cited source in the Chronicon Venetum et Gradense article explicitly says "John [the Deacon] has also been credited, but erroneously, with the 'Chronicon Gradense'". As far as I can tell, the Chronicon Venetum is distinct from the Chronicon Gradense, with different authors and different dates. See Giovanni Monticolo, Cronache Veneziane Antichissime, 1890 full text. See also the comments of Ugo Balzani, Le cronache italiane nel medio evo, 1973, p. 144. --Macrakis (talk) 16:27, 29 July 2019 (UTC)

@Macrakis: I think I was wrong and you are right: a bit more googling appears to show that Gradense and Venetum et Gradense were distinct. Narky Blert (talk) 16:32, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
@Narky Blert: What seems to be going on is that Venetum was published together with Gradense by Monticolo and others. I don't think there's actually a thing called Chronicon Venetum et Gradense, just one called Venetum and the other called Gradense. But it's not easy to find solid sources -- many sources talk loosely about Chronicon Venetum et Gradense without apparently knowing the documents themselves. --Macrakis (talk) 17:51, 29 July 2019 (UTC)
@Macrakis: Untrustworthy sources are a pest. In one of my articles, I added an editorial footnote saying, in suitably neutral language, that I thought that accounts in two sources (which contradicted each other, which were supported by nothing else, and which if true could only have been based on reports by non-existent eyewitnesses) were fictional. I also remember a DABfixing problem involving a German exonym, where I managed to track down a digitised version of the original source. It was a C18 book, and if it had been a WP article I would have hauled it up before WP:AFD as pure WP:OR. I solved the problem, but had serious doubts as to whether what the source said was true. Narky Blert (talk) 07:48, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

Broken tools[edit]

Do you have any ideas about fixing the problems with these broken tools, Dabfix, Commonfixes, etc.? I can't even login to this page without getting a Python error. They have been helpful tools—when they work. I've left many messages on the Talk page of the user Dispenser, but I never get a response, and the tools appear to be in worse shape than ever. There are others on Wikipedia who know how to program. Is there a way to connect them with these problems? My knowledge of this area is sketchy and scant. Thanks.
Vmavanti (talk) 17:02, 1 August 2019 (UTC)

@Vmavanti: I don't use either of those tools, so haven't noticed anything. (My major annoyance is Disambiguation pages with links and its fix lists returning 503 errors, which it does several times a day - probably something within ToolForge.) The one active editor I know of who might understand those tools is R'n'B. Feel free to discuss the issue here, to avoid WP:DISCUSSFORKing it. Narky Blert (talk) 17:48, 1 August 2019 (UTC)

Intramolecular DAB[edit]

Thank you for doing the legwork to resolve those! DMacks (talk) 06:42, 5 August 2019 (UTC)

@DMacks: YW. All now done, I hope. As I expected, 95% of the links were about reactions, and only a few about internal H-bonds or the like. Narky Blert (talk) 06:54, 5 August 2019 (UTC)

Concern[edit]

Hiii, Narky Blert! I have a concern regarding my edit on the article Sanjivani (2019 TV series) and MTV Hustle which is getting reverted. Am I wrong with my editing capabilities. Or I'm not suitable for Wikipedia. Or just ip user is given the right to contribute Wikipedia with their valid edit. As we have to abide by the 3RR and to have a good rapport with the fellow editor. Thanks CrewBeat (talk) 15:32, 12 August 2019 (UTC)

@CrewBeat: c8ac has been busy busy busy, but I don't see much wrong with their edits (or with yours, come to that); though both of you should perhaps add edit summaries more often (ideally, every time). The editing histories of those two articles look pretty normal. Reversion doesn't always mean that another editor thinks you're misbehaving; it can just be a sign that another editor disagrees with you, and the notification means that you get a heads-up about the disagreement.
It can be difficult to interact with IP editors, because they often don't respond to posts on their own Talk Page. If a problem does seem to be developing, start a discussion on the article Talk Page, mark your edit with a hidden note something like <!--See Talk Page-->, and try to get some input that way.
Both addition and removal of the {{more references}} tag on MTV Hustle were judgment calls. I haven't looked at the references, but three on an article about a brand-new series is a good number: there's support for all the sentences in the lead paragraph. I've seen many articles about Indian TV and film where the sourcing was very much worse.
If you have any other questions of this kind, the best place to ask is the Teahouse (there's a link in the welcome message on your Talk Page). That way, you might get advice from several editors, rather than just the one who may or may not know what they're talking about. Happy editing! Narky Blert (talk) 16:17, 12 August 2019 (UTC)

Any reliable way to detect DAB pages via API?[edit]

Hi, I noticed you had made an edit to repair a DAB page on Index of Singapore-related articles. In my update of the list, it seems that the DAB tag may have been dropped. The script I use simply takes the actual page titles from Singapore related categories via API and churn out the list. Short of either making a secondary call for each page to determine if the page is DAB page through its membership of to the disam category or lackof, or manually repair the page offline before updating, is there any reliable manner to detect such pages via API? I want to try to avoid making 10000+ calls (to check each page), on top the 2.4k+ calls (on each category) I am already making. Please advise. Thanks! robertsky (talk) 17:46, 15 August 2019 (UTC)

@Robertsky: I don't use API, so can't help there.
It may not be worth the effort of adding tedious time-consuming code to check every page found by a script to see if it's a DAB. There are today 5,072 DAB pages with links (see WP:TDD Table 1 Column 1). It takes me about 4-5 weeks to cycle through the DABlink report updated every 12 hours (made by User:DPL bot) on which that Table is based, so nothing easily soluble should hang around for too long, and the difficult ones will get flagged as {{dn}}. (Other WP:DPL members concentrate on attacking other DPL bot reports.)
If you want an easy indication from an article that a link is to a DAB page without mousing over or opening everything: go to Special:Preferences/Gadgets#Appearance, and enable 'Display links to disambiguation pages in orange'.
Pinging Certes, who has expertise in this area. Yrs, Narky Blert (talk) 18:57, 15 August 2019 (UTC)
Noted. For the time being while a sane programmatic way is found, I will account for that one page in the script. robertsky (talk) 00:13, 18 August 2019 (UTC)

Backlog Banzai[edit]

In the month of September, Wikiproject Military history is running a project-wide edit-a-thon, Backlog Banzai. There are heaps of different areas you can work on, for which you claim points, and at the end of the month all sorts of whiz-bang awards will be handed out. Every player wins a prize! There is even a bit of friendly competition built in for those that like that sort of thing. Sign up now at Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/September 2019 Backlog Banzai to take part. For the coordinators, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 08:18, 22 August 2019 (UTC)

Help[edit]

(I've just archived some old material on this page, and am therefore restarting this section.)

I have said this to you before, O respected IP editor (I am not being in any way sarcastic – I really do mean that!) who keeps asking me to make changes to protected pages. Create a named account for yourself, and make the 500 edits needed to become a WP:EXTENDEDCONFIRMED editor. All your suggestions are so good for Wikipedia that you should make them under your own username, and take the credit for yourself. Some of the errors you have found are of types which are extremely difficult to find, and I congratulate you on finding them. If you had a named account, I would award you a WP:BARNSTAR of some sort.

Am I right in thinking that English is not your mother tongue? If I am right, consider editing the Wikipedia in your mother tongue also. In my experience, the Wikipedias in all languages of the Subcontinent are embarrassingly awful. They should be world-class on local topics. Think of your favourite cricketer, and look at the Wikipedia articles on him in English and in his mother tongue. Where should kids in the Subcontinent be able to first find information on their hero? not English Wikipedia, that's for sure! Those kids may be the editors of the future – if they first find Wikipedia through an article in Bengali, Gujarati, Hindi, Kannada, Malayalam, Marathi, Odiya, Punjabi, Tamil, Telugu, Urdu, or whichever language they speak.

Some languages of the Subcontinent, notably in northeast India, have no Wikipedia at all. I think that's scandalous. Narky Blert (talk) 23:20, 30 August 2019 (UTC)

Dear Narky Blert! Can you linking from Category:Chase films to Category:American chase films and from Category:Detective films to Category:American detective films in The Last Stand (2013 film) and from Category:Chase films to Category:American chase films in Transformers (film) and Johnny Mnemonic (film)? Thank you! --178.66.110.17 (talk) 09:38, 31 August 2019 (UTC)

 Done x4. Narky Blert (talk) 16:26, 16 September 2019 (UTC)

Dear Narky Blert! Can you linking from Category:Serial killer films to Category:American serial killer in Replicant (film), from Category:Neo-noir to Category:American neo-noir films in The Dark Knight (film) and Batman Returns? Thank you! --178.71.201.74 (talk) 07:15, 1 September 2019 (UTC)

 Done x3. Narky Blert (talk) 16:38, 16 September 2019 (UTC)

Dear Marky Blert! Can you linking from Super Cassettes Industries T-Series to T-Series (company) in Bairavaa, Guru Randhawa, List of film production companies in India and List of live-action film production companies? Thank you! --178.71.161.221 (talk) 16:48, 1 September 2019 (UTC)

Not done The links are redirect to T-Series (company), and will be useful if the Super Cassettes Industries topic is ever split out. See WP:NOTBROKEN. Narky Blert (talk) 16:46, 16 September 2019 (UTC)

Dear Narky Blert! Can you linking from 118 to 118 (film) in article Nivetha Thomas? Thank you! --178.71.161.221 (talk) 06:50, 2 September 2019 (UTC)

 Done Narky Blert (talk) 16:50, 16 September 2019 (UTC)

Dear Narky Blert! Can you linking from Mumtaz to Mumtaz (actress) in article Rajesh Khanna? Thank you! --178.71.205.84 (talk) 08:09, 11 September 2019 (UTC)

 Done Narky Blert (talk) 16:50, 16 September 2019 (UTC)

Dear Narky Blert! Can you linking Category:Indian films about revenge and Category:Films about Indian slavery in K.G.F: Chapter 1 and Category:Films about Indian slavery‎ in Srimanthudu, Category:American sequel films and Category:American films about revenge in Avengers: Infinity War and Avengers: Endgame? Thank you! --95.55.106.2 (talk) 10:15, 22 September 2019 (UTC)

 Done x4. Narky Blert (talk) 15:55, 13 October 2019 (UTC)

dn breaking cs1|2 citation templates[edit]

With your revert of my revert of your edit you left this edit summary: Either fix it or unlink it. A link to a DAB page is USELESS.

Before you initially added {{dn}} to |authorlink=Blu the link worked ([[Blu|Blu]]). Yes it linked to a dab page, but at least there was a link that might or might not be USELESS (there really is no need to shout) because there is the possibility that readers can navigate from the dab page to wherever is appropriate. After your edits, there is no link because |authorlink=Blu{{dn}} puts all of this:

[[Category:All articles with links needing disambiguation]][[Category:Articles with links needing disambiguation ]]<sup class="plainlinks noprint Inline-Template" style="vertical-align:text-top;white-space:nowrap;">[<i>[http://dispenser.info.tm/~dispenser/cgi-bin/dab_solver.py?page=Kommunity_FK&editintro=Template:Disambiguation_needed/editintro&client=Template:Dn <span title="Link needs disambiguation.">disambiguation needed</span>]</i>]</sup>

inside of a plain wikilink (two category wikilinks and an external link plus html markup). MediaWiki cannot make sense out of nested wikilinks and shouldn't be expected to do so. Because MediaWiki cannot resolve the mess that results from adding {{dn}} to |authorlink=, readers have no opportunity to navigate to the appropriate article because there is no link to anywhere that is useful to readers – dab solver is fine for editors but not for readers.

So, parroting your words back to you, Either fix it or unlink it or, add {{dn}} after the cs1|2 template. I would also suggest that {{dn}} get modified to accept |reason= so that you can explicitely state which link in a cs1|2 template needs disambiguation. Depriving readers of a link to somewhere is not a solution to the problem

Trappist the monk (talk) 19:53, 31 August 2019 (UTC)

@Trappist the monk: Links to DAB pages are errors under WP:INTDAB. They need to be fixed. Links to DAB pages are, except in very rare cases, unhelpful to readers. They are beyond useless if there is no relevant entry on the DAB page.
The placement of my {{dn}} tag makes it perfectly clear that the problem is the link to the DAB page Blu. It is perfectly normal practice to put dn tags inside {{cite}} and other templates to mark where the problem is. I see and fix several every day. No |reason= field is needed: dn is self-explanatory. (It is, however, common practice among experienced DABfixers to add <!-- --> notes to explain in difficult cases how they've tried and failed to solve a problem for the benefit of others.) Your removals of the dn tag have meant that Kommunity FK keeps disappearing from Category:Articles with links needing disambiguation, so that no other expert DABfixer who might be able to solve this problem is notified of it.
I shouted, because you have reverted me four times but have done nothing to address the underlying problem. I see this specific problem about every four or five weeks, because that's how long it takes me to cycle through the 5000-odd entries in Disambiguation pages with links, trying to hold that number or reduce it. This specific problem is beginning to really annoy me. If this Blu is notable, identify him from from among the options on the DAB page; or, add a qualifier and redlink him. If he isn't notable (and I suspect he isn't), unlink him. There is no other option. Narky Blert (talk) 23:46, 31 August 2019 (UTC)
I do not dispute that links to dab pages are ofttimes errors. Nor do I dispute that they need to be fixed. What I dispute is your practice of 'fixing' one kind of error by creating another kind of error which is what happens when you add {{dn}} to |authorlink=. It may be common practice to put {{dn}} in various templates but that should always be done with care. When a template merely echos parameter values in the template's rendering such practice is likely harmless. In cs1|2 templates, |author-link= and the various other |<name>-link= parameters are not so echoed but are manipulated by the template code before the result is rendered. Even for those cs1|2 parameters that are not manipulated, many of the parameters where wikilinking is permitted should not have {{dn}} added to their values because the whole value is included in metadata that these templates produce; inclusion of the rendered {{dn}} (as above in my first post) corrupts the metadata. This proscription is noted in the cs1|2 template docs as, for example, here at {{cite web}}.
I have no interest in Kommunity FK nor any interest in Blu (whomever that might be). My only interest in that particular article arises because your misapplied 'fix' drops the article into Category:CS1 errors: parameter link. I presume that you count yourself among those whom you label experienced DABfixers (edit summaries of 3000+ of the 5000 most recent of your en.wiki contributions refer to some form of 'DAB page' work). As an expert, clearly you should have been able to have resolved the dab-page link problem at Kommunity FK by following the instructions that you demanded of me: Either fix it or unlink it. Had you obeyed your own commands, this conversation would not have been necessary.
Trappist the monk (talk) 18:03, 2 September 2019 (UTC)
I've unlinked the term. It refers to Christine Blu Ashton who has no article or mentions worth redlinking. Of course, I've not solved the general problem. We do need these dn tags, but it would be better to find a way to insert them without breaking the page rendering. Certes (talk) 01:15, 1 September 2019 (UTC)
@Certes: Members of the {{cite}} family aren't the only ones which have this sort of issue. Others include {{jct}}, {{main}}, several railway templates including {{s-line}}, and {{election box candidate with party link}} and its relatives. An additional problem with the latter two is that even if the answer is known, DABfixing may need to be done somewhere deep within complex template code.
{{Infobox river}} bluelinks to any tributary it can find with an article, but gets round the problem by blacklinking anything with {{dn}} attached.
Hatnotes aren't a problem. If the solution isn't immediately obvious, that hatnote field should be deleted.
A related, but minor, annoyance in cite is that |authorlink= doesn't accept {{ill}}. The link to the author has to be placed in the reference outside the cite template. Narky Blert (talk) 10:07, 1 September 2019 (UTC)
Placing {{dn}} after the citation template, immediately before the </ref> tag, may be the least bad option. The semi-automated dab fixing tools don't do that, but I know you normally edit such pages manually. It may be less obvious which link to fix, but many of us have links to dabs highlighted in some way. Certes (talk) 11:39, 1 September 2019 (UTC)
{{ill}} does not work in |author-link= for the same reason that {{dn}} does not work. {{ill}} renders as a local wikilink plus and inter-wiki link plus a category link plus miscellaneous html; cs1|2 then wraps that with |author= (or |last= and |first=) into another wikilink:
[[[[<local wikilink>]]<sup class="noprint" style=" font-style: normal; ">&nbsp;&#91;[[:<lang code>:<article title>|<lang code>]][[Category:Interlanguage link template link number|<sort key>]]&#93;</sup>|<author name>]]
MediaWiki cannot make sense out of nested wikilinks. To interwiki-link |author= using |author-link=, write:
|author-link=:<lang code>:<article title>.
Trappist the monk (talk) 18:03, 2 September 2019 (UTC)
I dislike soft Interwiki links on general principles (except in the parenthetical form ([[:lang code:article|lang code]]), which points the reader in the right direction while expressing doubt that a translation would get through WP:GNG). It isn't obvious from a softlinked bluelink that an article might be missing; and if the article does get written, the link still points to a non-English rather than (more usefully) to the English article. Narky Blert (talk) 18:21, 2 September 2019 (UTC)

Wikiproject Military history coordinator election nominations open[edit]

Nominations for the upcoming project coordinator election are now open. A team of up to ten coordinators will be elected for the next year. The project coordinators are the designated points of contact for issues concerning the project, and are responsible for maintaining our internal structure and processes. They do not, however, have any authority over article content or editor conduct, or any other special powers. More information on being a coordinator is available here. If you are interested in running, please sign up here by 23:59 UTC on 14 September! Voting doesn't commence until 15 September. If you have any questions, you can contact any member of the coord team. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 02:38, 1 September 2019 (UTC)

Purpose of Disambiguous/Redirect Links & Spelling[edit]

Check the talk section:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:American_and_British_English_pronunciation_differences#Purpose_of_Disambiguous%2FRedirect_Links_%26_Spelling

NKM1974 (talk) 17:41, 03 September 2019 (UTC)

@NKM1974: I've already replied at that Talk Page. Narky Blert (talk) 17:53, 3 September 2019 (UTC)

Strange dabs in templates[edit]

Could you take a look at Template:Dalcassians which includes links to dab pages Flannagan & Scully. It doesn't show up at "Templates with dab links" but is generating lots of dabs & I can't work out what is going on.— Rod talk 08:33, 6 September 2019 (UTC)

@Rodw: Very odd. I looked at the links-in to Flannagan and Scully, and everything seems in order.
However, Template:Dalcassians calls them through their (disambiguation) redirects - which are completely unnecessary, because they are both pure name pages. I haven't always gone all the way back, but this is my analysis of the relevant page histories:
  1. Flannagan has been a name page since at least 15 December 2018
  2. Scully has been a name page since 19 January 2019; it had previously been classed as {{dab|surname}}; see this diff
  3. Template:Dalcassians has called those two pages through their (disambiguation) redirects since at least 2 October 2018; see this diff
  4. Flannagan (disambiguation) and Scully (disambiguation) were both created in August 2010 by User:RussBot, which is owned by our colleague R'n'B
  5. In August 2010, Flannagan was categorised as {{dab}} (<rolls eyes />); see this diff
  6. In August 2010, Scully was (improperly) categorised as {{dab}} {{surname}}; see this diff
In brief, I can see no recent changes which might have made anything happen.
IMO, Template:Dalcassians should be edited to link directly to Flannagan and Scully, and the redirects deleted under WP:G6. (I am aware that some editors have the opinion that (disambiguation) redirects to name pages are harmless and need not be deleted. I disagree.) I haven't made such changes, because this discussion is in progress.
Yrs, Narky Blert (talk) 09:47, 6 September 2019 (UTC)
@Rodw: What exactly do you mean by generating lots of dabs? I agree that we should bypass these redirects but I don't see where they are currently causing problems. On the other hand, Fenelon (which I just fixed) really does need to link to Fenelon (disambiguation). Certes (talk) 10:55, 6 September 2019 (UTC)
If you look at Articles With Multiple Dablinks there are 20+ articles showing 2 links to dab pages (eg Ballinalacken Castle, Ballyhannon Castle, etc etc). What they have in common is that they include Template:Dalcassians (under the title Dál gCais).— Rod talk 11:14, 6 September 2019 (UTC)
So they do. That report usually omits all links to X (disambiguation), assuming them to be INTDABLINKs. Perhaps it reports links to X (disambiguation) where X is not a dab, in case that needs attention? Certes (talk) 12:36, 6 September 2019 (UTC)
A report of all (disambiguation) redirects which have non-DAB targets might be worthwhile. Narky Blert (talk) 12:42, 6 September 2019 (UTC)
While on the subject, I've just turned The Perils of Pauline from an SIA into a DAB page. There were 5 bad incoming links. (The Perils of Pauline (disambiguation) already existed.) Narky Blert (talk) 12:57, 6 September 2019 (UTC)

Fusilladeplaats Rozenoord[edit]

In the past you made this article. I was there yesterday and it seems the mentioned coordinates are wrong. You will find the right coordinates in the Dutch article. In the meantime there is a dutch article for the new monument as well nl:Monument Rozenoord with lots of picture on commons. I pinged Wikidata as well (I am not good in mentioning the coordinates),Ceescamel (talk) 09:58, 13 September 2019 (UTC)

@Ceescamel: Dank u wel. In the English article, I have corrected the coordinates; added the link Monument Rozenoord [nl]; and also added commons:Category:Rozenoord (Amsterdam). Narky Blert (talk) 10:16, 13 September 2019 (UTC)

Milhist coordinator election voting has commenced[edit]

G'day everyone, voting for the 2019 Wikiproject Military history coordinator tranche is now open. This is a simple approval vote; only "support" votes should be made. Project members should vote for any candidates they support by 23:59 (UTC) on 28 September 2018. Thanks, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 03:37, 15 September 2019 (UTC)

Kho wikimedia[edit]

Good day! please don't change the Kho wikimedia page if you are not the same surname hope you can understand we need peace! Same surname need to give you a great day! Thank you! K.b.cheng (click to talk to me) 10:01, 16 September 2019 (UTC)

@K.b.cheng: Kho is very difficult to navigate. The changes I made obeyed the guidelines MOS:DABORDER, MOS:DABGROUPING and WP:LONGDAB. Narky Blert (talk) 14:16, 16 September 2019 (UTC)

Hi[edit]

Could you please move Indian Television Academy Awards for Best Actor Drama to Indian Television Academy Award for Best Actor Drama? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2405:205:411F:68F3:0:0:1ED7:F8A5 (talk) 15:25, 16 September 2019 (UTC)

Not done No reason given. Narky Blert (talk) 16:52, 16 September 2019 (UTC)

Wikiproject Military history coordinator election half-way mark[edit]

G'day everyone, the voting for the XIX Coordinator Tranche is at the halfway mark. The candidates have answered various questions, and you can check them out to see why they are running and decide whether you support them. Project members should vote for any candidates they support by 23:59 (UTC) on 28 September 2018. Thanks, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 07:36, 22 September 2019 (UTC)

What is a DAB page?[edit]

Thanks for fixing something that was wrong with the extra link I put into the CBS_Records_International page's 'See also' section, namely a link to Oriole_Records_ (UK): Latest revision as of 13:11, 22 September 2019 (edit) (undo) (thank) Narky Blert (talk | contribs) (Link to DAB page repaired)

I'm still a newbie here and would like to know what a DAB page is and why the link to it had to be repaired?

Thanks in advance if you could explain a bit more about all that please? AnameisbutanameTalk 13:55, 22 September 2019 (UTC)

@Anameisbutaname: Thanks for asking. 'DAB' is Wikipedia shorthand for 'disambiguation'. Oriole Records is a refreshingly simple example of a DAB page, with only two entries. If you look at it, you'll see why my edit was necessary: the link I repaired was clearly meant for the UK company and not the long-defunct US one. (Not all fixes are so easy.)
You will probably not want to read the relevant guideline, Wikipedia:Disambiguation, and its subsidiary pages. The lead (above the Table of Contents) gives the general idea, though.
A bot (User:DPL bot) sweeps all articles in English Wikipedia twice a day, and compiles reports of articles which link to DAB pages. WikiGnomes such as myself work on them, to try to keep the numbers down: new links to DAB pages arrive at around 500-800 a day.
Happy editing! Narky Blert (talk) 14:08, 22 September 2019 (UTC)
@Narky Blert: Thanks a lot! AnameisbutanameTalk 15:43, 22 September 2019 (UTC)

Incoming links[edit]

I have produced a list of some examples of articles that had incorrect incoming links at User:Crouch, Swale/NC v PT#Examples of incoming links notice that in the case of Danbury 11 out of 50 links were incorrect. Would you have supported the Danbury RM? Crouch, Swale (talk) 18:01, 27 September 2019 (UTC)

A stalker writes: the top ten place-related link errors which I fixed recently were:
After that come several places where those unimaginative colonials have appropriated British names: Norfolk, Canterbury, Worcester, Wellington, Boston, etc. I'm sure other editors have fixed plenty of anatopisms not on this list. Hope that helps, Certes (talk) 20:50, 27 September 2019 (UTC)
I'd note that Cambridge has 9903 links meaning that less than 1 in 36 were incorrect and although as you noted at WT:D there were probably some you missed its still relatively low compared to Danbury. Crouch, Swale (talk) 16:17, 28 September 2019 (UTC)
@Crouch, Swale and Certes: 1 in 36 (almost 3%) is a pretty bad error rate, even if 'better' than Danbury.
I don't remember seeing the Danbury RM. If I had, I'd probably have !voted support. (User:DPL bot reports RMs involving DAB pages in Disambiguation pages with links; it takes me 4-5 weeks to cycle through that report, so I don't see them all.) There is often too much emphasis in WP:PTOPIC discussions about saving the majority of readers one click, and not enough on the damage caused by editors creating bad links.
I am a very junior veteran of the New York Wars, during which I chipped in to remark that those editors who argued that the primary meaning of 'New York' was the state not the city were undoubtedly American not British. During those wars, BD2412 fixed something like 65,000 links (sic).
To the PTOPICs mentioned by Certes, I will add the following, which we found during our User talk:Narky Blert/2019#Taxa linked to surnames project: Amman, Baker, Chiron, Exline, Hedge, Jordan, Miller, Perry, Rose, Spruce and van Dyck. There is another list at User:Certes/misdirected links#Examples, and a different brief discussion at User talk:Certes#Misdirected links.
I will also add User talk:Andrewa#Primary Topic (again), for Word; andrewa is another editor interested in this subject area. Narky Blert (talk) 19:31, 28 September 2019 (UTC)
Indeed as someone in England I'd say the city was the clear primary topic and indeed its likely that only Americans would argue that the state is primary, I remember seeing somewhere that in a random sample of links many were for the city. Crouch, Swale (talk) 20:23, 28 September 2019 (UTC)
@Crouch, Swale: IMO the New York Wars ended in the correct consensus – different primary meanings in at least UK and US, and possibly within US, so no PTOPIC. The vast majority of links to New York, whether city or state, are WP:OVERLINKs anyway. Who is ever going to click on them to learn something? Some editors seem to think that the more bluelinks their article contains, the better it is. I disagree. Narky Blert (talk) 20:34, 28 September 2019 (UTC)
Yes I often unlike overlinked words such as England, island and village for example that while have clear primary topics, they aren't useful to the average user. Crouch, Swale (talk) 20:36, 28 September 2019 (UTC)
I've just been through the mainspace links to "Danbury" and there were 2 for Essex but only 1 for Connecticut. Crouch, Swale (talk) 20:57, 28 September 2019 (UTC)
Very interesting comment above different primary meanings... so no PTOPIC. It seems to me that if we adopt that, we may as well abolish P T completely... there won't be many left in any case. Discuss either here or at User talk:Andrewa/Primary Topic RfC#Was the NYRM no P T decision correct where I reply in more detail. Andrewa (talk) 21:35, 28 September 2019 (UTC)

Disambiguation RM discussion[edit]

Since you participated in this discussion about disambiguation pages just shy of two months ago, would you be willing to voice your thoughts on this move discussion that deals with the same issue? I believe you would have something to say about it. Eventhorizon51 (talk) 19:47, 9 October 2019 (UTC)

SVU Season 14 Episode Traumatic Wound[edit]

1. Your name Was in Revision History, so Have You seen this Episode? Yes or No?

2. did [Alex, Jake, Britt, Louis, Ralph] know 100% that [Gabby was Going to Get raped]?(2601:243:400:B5E0:351A:13F4:4B6C:CBEF (talk) 21:38, 9 October 2019 (UTC)).

No, I have not seen that or any other episode. Best, Narky Blert (talk) 21:41, 9 October 2019 (UTC)

Giant tortoise (disambiguation)[edit]

Could you comment on Talk:Giant_tortoise_(disambiguation) about what type of page you think this is, a dab or list?. Don't depend on the pagename as the name itself is contended. Regards, Sun Creator(talk) 13:22, 15 October 2019 (UTC)

 Done Narky Blert (talk) 13:50, 15 October 2019 (UTC)

GA reassessment[edit]

Saint Dominic in Soriano, an article that you or your project may be interested in, has been nominated for a community good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. Display name 99 (talk) 14:39, 18 October 2019 (UTC)

Precious anniversary[edit]

Precious
Cornflower blue Yogo sapphire.jpg
Three years!

--Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:05, 21 October 2019 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of DXBM-TV (disambiguation)[edit]

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A tag has been placed on DXBM-TV (disambiguation) requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section G14 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because it is an orphaned disambiguation page which either

  • disambiguates only one extant Wikipedia page and whose title ends in "(disambiguation)" (i.e., there is a primary topic);
  • disambiguates zero extant Wikipedia pages, regardless of its title; or
  • is a redirect with a title ending in "(disambiguation)" that does not target a disambiguation page or page that has a disambiguation-like function.

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@Pkbwcgs: Gud catch, the cleanup after Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/DXBM-TV (Davao) hadn't been complete. Narky Blert (talk) 17:06, 27 October 2019 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Flavored tobacco (disambiguation)[edit]

If this is the first article that you have created, you may want to read the guide to writing your first article.

You may want to consider using the Article Wizard to help you create articles.

A tag has been placed on Flavored tobacco (disambiguation) requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section G14 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because it is an orphaned disambiguation page which either

  • disambiguates only one extant Wikipedia page and whose title ends in "(disambiguation)" (i.e., there is a primary topic);
  • disambiguates zero extant Wikipedia pages, regardless of its title; or
  • is a redirect with a title ending in "(disambiguation)" that does not target a disambiguation page or page that has a disambiguation-like function.

Under the criteria for speedy deletion, such pages may be deleted at any time. Please see the disambiguation page guidelines for more information.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason, you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. However, be aware that once a page is tagged for speedy deletion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself, but do not hesitate to add information in line with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. If the page is deleted, and you wish to retrieve the deleted material for future reference or improvement, then please contact the deleting administrator. Pkbwcgs (talk) 20:05, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

@Pkbwcgs: Nolo contendere, no longer a DAB page. This should have gone when flavored tobacco was turned into a WP:BCA. Narky Blert (talk) 20:12, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

ArbCom 2019 election voter message[edit]

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Vandalism on Sambandam[edit]

Sambandam[edit]

Semi-protection: High level of IP vandalism.Revert and protect)

Google Code-In 2019 is coming - please mentor some documentation tasks![edit]

Hello,

Google Code-In, Google-organized contest in which the Wikimedia Foundation participates, starts in a few weeks. This contest is about taking high school students into the world of opensource. I'm sending you this message because you recently edited a documentation page at the English Wikipedia.

I would like to ask you to take part in Google Code-In as a mentor. That would mean to prepare at least one task (it can be documentation related, or something else - the other categories are Code, Design, Quality Assurance and Outreach) for the participants, and help the student to complete it. Please sign up at the contest page and send us your Google account address to google-code-in-admins@lists.wikimedia.org, so we can invite you in!

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If you have any questions, please let us know at google-code-in-admins@lists.wikimedia.org.

Thank you!

--User:Martin Urbanec (talk) 21:58, 23 November 2019 (UTC)

Chemical formula links[edit]

Following on from here, but off the topics of edit filters and Tokusatsu: these articles have adjacent wikilinks to chemical elements. Once we're done with oxygen there are plenty of other elements and ions such as oxide to check, and that search overlooks elements separated by a number such as H2O. If these need correcting then I can probably do so in a semi-automated way once I know a good replacement pattern. However, the last example in the documentation to {{Chem}} has explicit wikilinks to elements, so they may not actually be wrong. What do you think we should do with these? We should probably check with WT:WikiProject Chemistry before doing any bulk edits but they can probably give a more helpful response if we give them a specific proposal. Certes (talk) 01:16, 2 December 2019 (UTC)

@Certes: Always MOS:OVERLINKing. No reader coming across a mention of dihydrogen monoxide (H
2
O
) (dangerous substance, responsible for several hundred thousand deaths every year; always contains trace amounts of hydronium hydroxide) is going to gain any benefit from links to articles about the two highly-reactive chemical elements which caused the Hindenburg disaster.
Sometimes WP:SEAOFBLUE, e.g. NaCl (one part of a substance which reacts violently with the aforesaid hydrogen hydroxide, one part of another which was used as a poison gas in WWI; spontaneously ignite if mixed, don't try this at home).
IMO that last example in {{chem}}, and the whole of {{chemical formula}}, is thoroughly misguided; although I suppose they might just find use in specifying the composition of an alloy, amalgam, or other mixture in which the elements retain their identities (air is N
0.781
O
0.210
Ar
0.009
+ traces), or in expressing the results of a CHN analysis.
Diatribe over. I think we can ignore the broader class of {{chem}} links: I find them unstylish, but they aren't major mistakes. Don't stir up a hornets' nest in a china shop with a sleeping dog. A WikiProject Chemistry discussion could easily turn into a Big-Endian/Little-Endian dispute with a large expenditure of effort and no consensus.
However, the results in the ]][[ search which you linked above are turning up as false positives in the broader Tokusatsu hunt, and can safely be fixed without unlinking anything (or, I would hope, upsetting anyone). Some (mis)use an undocumented feature of the {{chem}} template by omitting a pipe; others don't use the template at all (and I think they should; WP:NOTBROKEN doesn't apply, because they're creating an effect which has been identified as impeding a troll-hunt). There are fewer than 500, which is well within hand-fixing territory. I think that's the way to go: it should be quicker and safer than writing and proving a one-off bot: there could well be exceptional cases easier to solve with wetware than software. I propose to get started on it. Narky Blert (talk) 08:47, 2 December 2019 (UTC)
Thanks for the advice (though your mixed metaphor was a spanner in the ointment). The bulk of the cases should match a few simple patterns, so I can handle those semi-automatically if you'd like to do a few examples by hand for me to copy. It sounds as if we need not bother the wikiproject. Certes (talk) 10:55, 2 December 2019 (UTC)
You are making a poor rendering result by mixing styles. {{chem}} uses something like {{su}}, which isn't the same sort of subscripts as <sub>. Consider this my editorial objection to a change to poorer display with no stated actual improvement (vs apparent personal preference). And a WP:TROUT for re-doing it with still no voiced explanation even after I undid your edit at fluorescent lamp with a clearly stated WP:ES about it. DMacks (talk) 13:08, 2 December 2019 (UTC)
@DMacks: I hadn't seen your ES when I re-edited fluorescent lamp; I was sampling a large list to see what needed doing. When I re-edited boric acid, I did see your ES and used my Plan B.
This is not a matter of personal preference, or some sort of Wikipedia:Comprised of exercise. It follows from discussions at WP:ANI and most recently at Wikipedia:Edit filter/Requested#Excessive and irrelevant linking, even down to syllables of words. The problem is a prolific IP-hopping vandal who has been difficult to spot except by accident. There are examples of its "work" in that discussion. The best way of detecting it thought of so far is to search for ]][[, which should be an uncommon combination. False positives are a problem, and there are several hundred of them in chemistry articles.
If chem and sub format differently, I agree they should not be mixed: a "solution" which causes another problem is not a solution. I also agree that formatting should not be changed without good reason; not least, because life is too short. An answer would be to tailor edits to existing formats: using either {{chem}} or a <!-- ... --> note as appropriate. Narky Blert (talk) 14:55, 2 December 2019 (UTC)
A couple of questions about a simple example might help. Baryte is a mineral consisting of barium sulfate (BaSO4), written as [[barium|Ba]][[sulfur|S]][[oxygen|O]]<sub>4</sub>. Is this style of wikitext encouraged, deprecated or of disputed merit? If deprecated, what should replace it? Certes (talk) 15:23, 2 December 2019 (UTC)
Although our vandal and good-faith chemistry editors both add wikitext like ]][[Article title|x, x represents lower case text for the vandal (the m in [[Apple|Exa]][[Banana|mple]]) but an upper case letter for chemistry (the last C in [[Sodium|Na]]|[[Chlorine|Cl]]). We can distinguish them, though it complicates the filter. We should only edit the chemistry articles to improve them, not merely to mark them as not vandalism. Certes (talk) 15:51, 2 December 2019 (UTC)
Another, related, search might be for ]][[x]], where x is any character. I haven't seen the Tokusatsu vandal doing that, but have occasionally seen edits where a vandal has linked every letter in a [[w]][[o]][[r]][[d]]. Narky Blert (talk) 16:08, 2 December 2019 (UTC)
I found and fixed just one15 errors of that type. A second case is probably wrong but my Tsou is a little rusty (search for CCVV). I suspect that some kind gnome has checked this recently, or there may be an edit filter. Certes (talk) 16:36, 2 December 2019 (UTC)
I WP:BOLDly decided that that was a duplicate link: the second C matches the first, and the same is surely true of the pair of V's. The second V had been linked since 2008, when the article was greatly expanded by a registered editor. I also concluded that a trocha was a deformed foot, and fixed that redlink. Narky Blert (talk) 16:51, 2 December 2019 (UTC)