User talk:OnBeyondZebrax

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Stop copy/pasting content into lead sections[edit]

Please stop copy/pasting content from article sections into their lead sections. Lead sections are supposed to be summaries, and having content appear twice in the same article serves no purpose except to confuse readers.Spylab (talk) 15:25, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

Leads are not supposed to exactly duplicate content that appears in later sections.Spylab (talk) 15:31, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

I will paraphrase the content then. Thanks for your adviceOnBeyondZebrax (talk) 15:32, 6 September 2014 (UTC)
I looked an MOS:LEAD and I didn't see a specific rule against repeating content, although, the phrase "summarize" is used, which implies changing the content. Still, I didn't find an explicit statement that the lead should not re-use sentences from the article. I would see the concern more if I was transposing an entire paragraph, but what I was trying to do was handpick key sentences and use them to build new lead paragraphs. If the MOS:LEAD does say not to cut and paste sentences, I would just appreciate knowing where it says this. Maybe I missed it, but I didn't see it. OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 16:10, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

Hello OnBeyondZebrax. I must admit I don't understand the gain in making lengthy introductions, such as those you did in History of the Jews in Russia, History of the Jews in Ukraine, History of the Jews in France, History of the United States Army, History of the United States Marine Corps. In these articles, the first paragraph gave a concise overview, and then a structured content went step-by-step. When I try to read the current versions of these articles, I feel like just skip the paragraphs 2-4 and go straight to the main content. Let me just compare it to scientific publications. Scientists developed over many decades a style of publication, where the reader can quickly get the main information from an abstract, and then all details are explained in the body of the article. Here is just one arbitrary example, a recent milestone discovery paper in fundamental physics: 1. The abstract is just one paragraph; then all details are discussed in length in the body. This paper was written by a collaboration of several thousand authors! So far, most Wikipedia articles which I saw were built with a similar scheme. What is your motivation in putting so much detail in the lead section? --Off-shell (talk) 21:56, 23 September 2014 (UTC)

I found articles with one sentence ledes, like Russian literature and then created leads for these articles. When I came to the Russian Lit article, the lede was as follows: Russian literature refers to the literature of Russia or its émigrés and to the Russian-language literature of several independent nations once a part of what was historically Rus', Russia or the Soviet Union...." This lede was not a "standalone introduction to the topic", as suggested by the guidance in MOS:LEAD. The new lede that I created names the big names in Russian Literature: Gogol, Dostoyevsky, Tolstoy, etc. I am proud of that new lead. The History of the USMC is a four paragraph lead, which appears to comply with lead guidelines. History of the Jews in Ukraine is also a four paragraph lede. History of the Jews in Russia is a three paragraph lede. You talk about the use of one-paragraph abstracts in science. This is interesting, but MOS:LEAD says WP leads can be up to four paragraphs long (depending on the length of the article). My goal is to give every article a lead that serves as a standalone intro to the topic, which is what MOS:LEAD instructs us to do.OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 19:05, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

Teahouse talkback: you've got messages![edit]

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Hello, OnBeyondZebrax. Your question has been answered at the Teahouse Q&A board. Feel free to reply there!
Please note that all old questions are archived. Message added by Yunshui  13:29, 8 September 2014 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{teahouse talkback}} template.

Sandboxes[edit]

By the way, I've just recalled that User:Technical 13 had a nice little sandbox template, {{User:Technical 13/SandBox/DraftHeader}}, which you might find useful; it allows you to see all of your sandboxes and drafts in one place. Just add that string of code to the top of your sandbox page to see what it does. Yunshui  14:04, 8 September 2014 (UTC)

THanks for your suggestion. I added the code and it doesn't seem to work for me. I'll try again. OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 14:22, 8 September 2014 (UTC)
I've fixed it for you (it literally is that exact string; you don't need to add your username in place of T13's). Anything you create using the box will be listed inside it, so you can use it to create as many drafts as you like and keep them organised. Or you can just delete the little string of code, if you don't find it useful. Yunshui  14:27, 8 September 2014 (UTC)
On a related note, that draft (at User:OnBeyondZebrax/sandbox Psychology) doesn't look as though it meets the userpage guidelines - Wikipedia isn't a webhost, and I can't see how that page is ever likely to become a usable Wikipedia article. You may well find that it gets deleted under the speedy deletion criteria fairly soon. Yunshui  14:31, 8 September 2014 (UTC)
Hi, Thanks for your advice. I thought that I could do "anything" in my userpages, but obviously I didn't understand the policy.OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 14:34, 8 September 2014 (UTC)
No worries; it's a common misconception. Yunshui  14:41, 8 September 2014 (UTC)
I have another area I need help with: I don't know how to archive my talk pages. Is there a simple code I can use to archive my talk pages?OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 14:44, 8 September 2014 (UTC)
The short answer is yes... the longer answer is that there are quite a few parameters involved, so it depends on how you define "simple"... Details can be found at WP:ARCHIVE, but I'd be happy to set it up for you if you'd prefer. Yunshui  14:53, 8 September 2014 (UTC)
I tried adding the code, but it didn't create an archive like I was hoping. I would appreciate your help in setting up an archive.OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 14:58, 8 September 2014 (UTC)
No problem; it's done. You'll need to wait a day or so for the bot to catch up, and then it should run automatically. I'll also rename your existing archive, which should move it into the Archives box at the top of the page. Yunshui  15:02, 8 September 2014 (UTC)
Thanks for all your help. Sorry about putting all my personal stuff on the Userpage!OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 15:07, 8 September 2014 (UTC)

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Hairstyle[edit]

There seems to be a bit of duplicate content in this edit. Best, Anna Frodesiak (talk) 16:11, 10 September 2014 (UTC)

The lede was way too short, and did not give the reader a sense of the history. I took the article body and reduced it down to two paragraphs, that just hits the key points. I have gone back and removed more details. There is, however, still reproduction of text from the body. It is difficult to rephrase statements that are made very well in the body.OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 16:26, 10 September 2014 (UTC)
Take a single example, the sentence "In the early 17th century male hairstyles grew longer, with waves or curls being considered desirable." (taken from the article's body) If you think it would be better, this could be reworded as "Early in the 17th century men tended to grow their hair longer, and waves or curls were popular", but I think that the original text is better and clearer.OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 16:30, 10 September 2014 (UTC)
Fair enough. Many thanks, and good work! I trust your judgement. :) Anna Frodesiak (talk) 23:47, 10 September 2014 (UTC)

References for World War II additions[edit]

Gday. Can you pls also include the long citations for Fitzgerald 2011, p. 4 and Hedgepeth & Saidel 2010, p. 16 in "References" section? As you have only given short cites readers really have to guess which books these come from unless the full reference is also included. Thanks. Anotherclown (talk) 22:17, 19 September 2014 (UTC)

Cheers for that. I've moved them now to the references section to try to use the style that is predominately used in the article. All the best. Anotherclown (talk) 00:21, 20 September 2014 (UTC)

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WikiProject Military history coordinator election[edit]

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Good edit, but can you clarify?[edit]

This : [1] looks helpful, but could you clarify what FLN is? It doesn't appear to be used previously in the article. A citation would be even more awesome. CombatWombat42 (talk) 20:56, 8 October 2014 (UTC)

Response[edit]

I ask you, please, to first get consensus regarding your recent edits of adding war crimes to the lead of articles, as World War II is a notable example of not including it in the lead. It does single them out by individual events, but it doesn't specifically mention it directly as a whole by all sides. That includes crimes commited by the Italians, the Soviets, the Allies, and Japanese. I ask you to discuss and get consensus first, please, and I am willing to self-revert then. Thank you for reading, and I wish you have a good day. Supersaiyen312 (talk) 01:52, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

I honestly don't want to get into an unnecessary argument here. I think you seem like a pretty cool guy, so I'd rather work together, you know? Best wishes, and thank you. Supersaiyen312 (talk) 03:41, 30 October 2014 (UTC)

I don't want to get into an argument. I also think you seem like a good guy, and I have been impressed with your knowledge about history. I have not made any personal negative comments about you so far (I don't think), it is just a difference of opinion about the war crimes issue. I would rather work together. I wish you well, thank you :) OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 12:02, 30 October 2014 (UTC)
Thanks man, same here. If you ever need anything, always feel free to call out to me. I am glad we were able to conclude this. Supersaiyen312 (talk) 03:59, 31 October 2014 (UTC)

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By all means put it back[edit]

I mostly undid it because the picture did not appear. Missing a "]" perhaps? Einar aka Carptrash (talk) 22:21, 22 October 2014 (UTC)

and feel free to be bold on the suicide thing. I mean, what's the worst that could happen? Someone might make the list?? Carptrash (talk) 00:09, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

2014 Parliament shooting[edit]

Hi, if you'll look in the page history you'll notice it was an accident. I hit the rollback button by mistake, so I reverted myself and made a dummy edit explaining. --Richard Yin (talk) 21:50, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

List of suicides in the 21st century[edit]

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I re-used text from the Wikipedia article List of suicides, with acknowledgement in the historyOnBeyondZebrax (talk) 03:05, 29 October 2014 (UTC)

Jian Ghomeshi[edit]

Honestly, is there even one single solitary legitimate reason why the shorter summary, which already adequately presented both sides of the story and simply avoided excess prurient detail, wasn't sufficient? You're also making major formatting errors that are badly borking the article text, for the record. If you have any objections or concerns about the existing version, kindly take them to the talk page for discussion. Bearcat (talk) 21:43, 29 October 2014 (UTC)

The existing version did not include the new information from the lawsuit, nor did it have Ghomeshi's claim, on Facebook, that he likes "rough sex" that is consensual. Re: formatting errors, I am still learning to do proper cite-web's. Up till recently I just used bare URLs to reference. Please be patient during this learning process.OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 21:48, 29 October 2014 (UTC)
Except that it does include his claim that the sex was consensual. Bearcat (talk) 21:50, 29 October 2014 (UTC)

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References[edit]

We at Wikipedia love evidence-based medicine. Please cite high-quality reliable sources. We typically use review articles, major textbooks and position statements of national or international organizations. A list of resources to help edit such articles can be found here. The edit box has a build in citation tool to easily format references based on the PMID or ISBN. WP:MEDHOW walks through editing step by step. We also provide style advice about the structure and content of medicine-related encyclopedia articles. The welcome page is another good place to learn about editing the encyclopedia. If you have any questions, please feel free to drop me a note. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) (if I write on your page reply on mine) 01:15, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

Was some content added without references.
By the way how did you came across this page [2] to leave a comment?
Best Doc James (talk · contribs · email) (if I write on your page reply on mine) 01:54, 2 November 2014 (UTC)
Through a circuitous route! Do you happen to remember the article?OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 01:56, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

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Re: Jian Ghomeshi[edit]

I don't have a solid grasp on fair use policy but it sounds reasonable to me. I'm sure if it's not right someone will let you know. Tchaliburton (talk) 18:16, 15 December 2014 (UTC)

Re: Interesting view on Pattinson article[edit]

Hi, the Twilight Film Series are one of the most highest grossing films worldwide. Especially The Twilight Saga: Breaking Dawn – Part 2 which is the highest among the Twilight series, which is relevant from Pattinson's career point of view. What I am saying is there are reviews available from critics, why not add them in the actor's article instead of Rotten Tomatoes score, which is more suitable for film article. At Rotten Tomatoes, there are number of reviews and I am sure some of them have detailed description about his performance in the film, which the reader of the Pattinson's article will find more useful then film's overall Rotten score. Just my thought. Because I haven't seen any Wikipedia article for actor where Rotten Tomato score of the film is given instead of actor's performance description from the reviews.--Jockzain (talk) 17:43, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

Giving the film gross in the actor article is implying that the actor helped the film to earn its gross. That is why I think the Rotten Tomatoes score is interesting. But I will look for individual reviews for the article.OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 18:28, 17 December 2014 (UTC)

Theatrical genre[edit]

Hello! I've noticed that you've added genres in Benedict Cumberbatch's lead paragraphs. I think it would be appropriate to add Shakespearean in the first paragraph as well where it says... He first performed at the Open Air Theatre, Regent's Park in [please add Shakespearean] productions such as Love's Labour's Lost (2001), A Midsummer Night's Dream (2001)...

Also, since you've already added his master's degree in the lead. I think in this sentence "continued his classical acting training at the London Academy of..." it would be better drop "classical acting" as it's already understood having graduated with an MA in Classical Acting. It just sounds redundant to me.

Thank you very much! 202.134.14.151 (talk) 05:23, 18 December 2014 (UTC)

Inserting specific Masters degree in Benedict Cumberbatch's page[edit]

The specific degree which is "Classical Acting" was deleted in the lead paragraph after "MA" rendering the information and the whole sentence incomplete. It should be indicated that it's an "MA in Classical Acting" as there are different Masters degrees, we should be specific in this case. And there shouldn't be a citation in the lead paragraph as the page is a GA (good article page). It has already been cited in the body, no need to cite it in the lead paragraphs. Thanks! 83.83.3.12 (talk) 16:52, 18 December 2014 (UTC)

Oh and please let's keep the descriptors simple, concise and altogether short.

  • William Pitt the Younger- Youngest prime minister of UK
  • WIlliam Prince Ford- preacher and plantation owner
  • Julian Assange- Wikileaks founder
  • Alan Turing- Father of Computer Science and Artificial Intelligence
  • Also, War Horse can simply be described as WWI film and Atonement as a Romantic WWII film.

No need for long-winded adjectives. 83.161.153.219 (talk) 16:59, 18 December 2014 (UTC)

Good points!OnBeyondZebrax (talk) 17:03, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
The descriptions were deleted as they don't belong in the lead, you can describe his character in the body of the article when it talks about that film but not in the lead, who he played is enough. LADY LOTUSTALK 17:08, 18 December 2014 (UTC)

Canvassing[edit]

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A barnstar for you![edit]

Brilliant Idea Barnstar Hires.png The Brilliant Idea Barnstar
Thanks for helping create a new article on the militarization of police. Viriditas (talk) 09:21, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

credentialism[edit]

Hello OnBeyondZebrax, I edit the Open Education Sociology Dictionary. I noticed traffic coming from Wikipedia and saw the dictionary's definition of credentialism was linked on the credentialism page. Out of curiousity I looked at the revision history and noticed the conversation between you and Sminthopsis84.

I just posted about some of the issues Sminthopsis84 raised on his talk page and wanted to include you in what I said.

Thanks for you for your efforts and keep up the good work.

Kenton Bell (talk) 13:56, 3 February 2015 (UTC)

Jack Hoxie in the SWAT article[edit]

I see you edited the SWAT article recently. Would you please review the article's Talk page section on Jack Hoxie (at the end) and, if you agree, remove that name from the article? Thanks. 71.197.166.72 (talk) 10:12, 4 February 2015 (UTC)

Spanish Civil War, an article that you or your project may be interested in, has been nominated for a community good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. Isthisuseful (talk) 22:41, 2 March 2015 (UTC)

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Conducting[edit]

You're welcome! Hyacinth (talk) 13:17, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

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Holocaust[edit]

Hi. If you think its appropriate would you consider adding Jehovah's Witness' to the list of victims of the Holocaust. There weren't that many murdered by the regime, about 1000, but 10's of thousands were held in concentration camps. Their symbol for recognition in the camps was a purple triangle. I know you can't include every single group that were victims, but I at least wanted to ask. Thanks for reading my request.

Joneseygirl28 (talk) 13:18, 19 June 2015 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Wigger[edit]

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Advice[edit]

I took a look at the talk page and the argument there. I don't think there's any question of synthesis going on, but it seems to me very much like the user opposing you has ownership issues with the article. If there is any consensus (technically, there undoubtedly is, but numbers become an issue when they're in the single digits) in a discussion with only 4-5 people involved, that consensus is squarely upon your side. I've seen you and at least two others disagree with CombatMarshmallow's stance. My advice is twofold:

  1. Start an Request for Comment in a relevant category at the talk page. Try to get all of the issues you are having rolled into one or two concise questions, and be sure to find all the relevant categories. I will be happy to participate in such an RfC.
  2. If the issue with this user persists, you may want to look at the Dispute Resolution Noticeboard to establish a more formal statement on what should be in the article. If the issues is still not resolved, you may want report the user's behavior.

Do not skip steps if you decide to take my advice. CombatMarshmallow deserves the chance to have his voice heard, so going directly after him as the 'source' of the problem would be unfair, and would likely backfire. Hope this helps! MjolnirPants Tell me all about it. 13:19, 31 August 2015 (UTC)

Postscript: My above advice does not apply to the actual RfC you opened regarding gender, race and sexuality. That RfC hasn't produced a consensus. My advice was regarding the last two sections on the talk page, and was limited to those. MjolnirPants Tell me all about it. 13:33, 31 August 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for your helpful advice, MjolnirPants. There is so much to learn on Wikipedia: I have been editing since 2006 and I still learn new stuff about policy, MOS rules, and guidelines every week! OnBeyondZebraxTALK 20:23, 31 August 2015 (UTC)

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Heavy Metal Music[edit]

"...heavy metal music has proved to be far more complicated than has been previously suggested." This is not previously suggested. Even in the article..…..She states that heavy metal harmony typically uses modal harmonic relationships " That is Already is stated “Harmonically speaking, this means the genre typically incorporates modal chord progressions such as the Aeolian progressions I-VI-VII, I-VII-(VI), or I-VI-IV-VII and Phrygian progressions implying the relation between I and ♭II (I-♭II-I, I-♭II-III, or I-♭II-VII for example)” So you added something that says "as previously suggested" that has not ever been suggested, it makes no sense. Also the statement about Modal Harmonic Relationships why have it there instead of where Harmonic Modal relationships are mentioned already. Also what happened with this section being worked out first so people don't try and revert their point without reading and understanding it first. Thats what is supposed to prevent this. CombatMarshmallow (talk) 16:03, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

When she says heavy metal is "far more complicated than has been previously suggested", I think she means that it is far more complicated than other previous studies have said it is. On the second point, you are correct that the article already discusses modal relationships--however, she goes beyond this and says that in addition to using modal harmonic relationships, metal uses pentatonic and blues-based elements. The sentence could be moved up with the other modal harmonic relationships section. Thanks for your suggestions!OnBeyondZebraxTALK 16:37, 9 September 2015 (UTC)
You're welcome. Glad to help when I can. Anywhere that I can, even in my own town.CombatMarshmallow (talk) 16:54, 10 September 2015 (UTC)

its your edit maybe you should correct it before all kinds of people get all bent and defend inaccuracies. just in case you didnt notice your drum addition at Hardcore Punk is good and pretty Accurate. As opposed to what you added last year. If you remember. I never got around to hitting the thank feature. CombatMarshmallow (talk) 16:05, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

Thanks! It's hard to find information on hardcore punk from books. Probably the best place for information would be zines. Like you, I am trying to improve the articles by adding information. Thanks for your feedback.OnBeyondZebraxTALK 16:30, 9 September 2015 (UTC)
You're Welcome, Glad it was/is helpful. CombatMarshmallow (talk) 16:58, 10 September 2015 (UTC)

Do you teach music.[edit]

Are you a Music Professor.CombatMarshmallow (talk) 01:49, 13 September 2015 (UTC)

I wanted to be, a long time ago, but I dropped out of the program after a year.OnBeyondZebraxTALK 01:50, 13 September 2015 (UTC)
A resultant tone is attached to no genre. I would avoid editing music pages that teach. People go to them to learn. Accurate and Professional level information. If you are not a scholar do everyone a favor and leave it to the Experts. In the nicest way, Im sharing that with you. CombatMarshmallow (talk) 01:59, 13 September 2015 (UTC)
I am not a scholar. I am just a regular volunteer editor. I disagree with your suggestion that only experts in a field are allowed to edit articles. I read what a scholar–Robert Walser–did write about power chords in heavy metal, and he said that the use of loudly amplified, distorted power chords on the lower strings creates a resultant tone (an octave lower for a typical power chord) which he says adds weight to the sound. The previous section on power chords said that the power chord is a fifth played on the guitar. Walser says that the way power chords are used in heavy metal, it is not just playing a fifth. The combined effect of all the ways of playing the fifth (loud, distorted, lower strings, etc) make it sound heavier.OnBeyondZebraxTALK 02:08, 13 September 2015 (UTC)
The heavy metal music article talks about how heavy metal uses bass pedal points, even though this technique is used in many genres including rock, pop and Classical. The article talks about the use of modal chord progressions, even though this approach is used in other styles of music. A reliable source says resultant tones created by loud power chords are an important part of heavy metal. So even though resultant tones are used in other styles of music, like pipe organ music, this doesn't mean the heavy metal article can't mention them.OnBeyondZebraxTALK 02:26, 13 September 2015 (UTC)
I didnt type experts are only allowed. For example "Even when played without distortion, the simple ratios between the harmonics in the notes of a power chord can give a stark and powerful sound, owing to the resultant tone effect.". Hopefully just understand without being emotionally charged. Perhaps to take more time to understand, what people are sharing with you. CombatMarshmallow (talk) 02:47, 13 September 2015 (UTC)
I don't think you have a clue what Im typing about. Lets take our time replying. This is a No Rush issue, its not an "argument", its not something that is going to be 10ft long on a page. Its simple stuff. It needs to stay simple. CombatMarshmallow (talk) 02:50, 13 September 2015 (UTC)
Do you mean the heavy metal article should stay simple?OnBeyondZebraxTALK 02:54, 13 September 2015 (UTC)
Thats not even what I am referring to. Its fine for now. If you don't realize, no issue, if you do we can discuss it if we do. If you don't, its even better. Im not up for spider-web of back and forth. have a nice evening or day. CombatMarshmallow (talk) 03:20, 13 September 2015 (UTC)
Now you know something Im referring to. It has Nothing to do with "heavy metal". Its only about two notes and an resultant tone and frankly you should have enough sense to leave it to the experts. That material is no joke. Its not some article that has all kinds of inaccuracies.CombatMarshmallow (talk) 17:48, 13 September 2015 (UTC)
The way that resultant tones are used in heavy metal, the playing of the fifth on lower strings with high volume and distortion makes the resultant tones more audible. Resultant tones have something to do with heavy metal if a reliable source says they do. Robert Walser's university press published book says resultant tones are "...absolutely crucial." You don't have to be an expert in music theory to edit the Combination tone page. All you have to be is a regular volunteer.OnBeyondZebraxTALK 18:16, 13 September 2015 (UTC)
That page is independent of genres. You have to at least have an understanding of the page, in the least. Why don't you just face the fact. You don't know what you are doing over there. Dust yourself off its ok. In the future its Also Ok to have a reference that doesn't promo some name attached to the opinion. The name of the author is fine in the reference. People will see it, if they care. Unless you are trying to give fame to those people. Which isn't going to help them. Its the material people are looking at. This is what you like or something? Long Drawn out discussions that should be relatively simple, with some common sense applied. Whats to not understand. Its about Two Notes and the Resultant Tone. Is that simple enough to understand. Of course. CombatMarshmallow (talk) 18:49, 13 September 2015 (UTC)

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Heavy metal edits by CombatMarshmallow[edit]

I see you edit on heavy metal a lot. I also see you've been lectured by the "expert" CombatMarshmallow. What I find staggering is that this CombatMarshmallow has been inserting material from a band, Hogans Heroes, almost nobody has heard of, are featured on virtually zero literature, music publications, music magazines nor mentioned by other bands, yet he/she has written most of their article, has uploaded a blurry image he/she took of the band, and has been able to insert it into articles unchecked, one of which was, I say was as thats where it's headed, a featured article. Where is the notability? What is this persons involvement with this little known band? I call conflict of interest and bias. Then there's the awful blurry quality of the sole band image he/she took of them. I am no fan of Bullet for My Valentine and could care less about them, but they are notable, they are listed in VH1 as one of the main metalcore artists, they feature in literature, music publications etc, and their image is of good quality which was in the heavy metal article before any dispute and the intervention of CombatMarshmallow and the insertion of his/her little known band. You have made over 30,000 edits so you know how it works, contentious edits require consensus on talk, yet it's been the other way round on the article in that he/she has somehow been able to make edits and then require that consensus on talk is needed to change them. Is this going to be allowed to continue?RyanTQuinn (talk) 14:12, 19 September 2015 (UTC)

WikiProject Military history coordinator election[edit]

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You're invited! Women in Red World Virtual Edit-a-thon on Women in Architecture[edit]

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  • Host/Facilitator: Women in Red (WiR): Did you know that only 15% of the biographies on Wikipedia are about women? WiR focuses on "content gender gap". If you'd like to help contribute articles on women and women's works, we warmly welcome you!
  • Sponsor: Solomon R. Guggenheim Museum in association with Beverly Willis Architecture Foundation, Women in Design, and Wikiproject Women Wikipedia Design
  • Event details: This is a virtual edit-a-thon hosted by WiR in parallel with a series of "physical" Guggenheim edit-a-thons. It will allow all those keen to improve Wikipedia's coverage of women in architecture and design to participate. The campaign aims to further the goals of Ada Lovelace Day for STEM, and Art+Feminism for art, in a field that by its nature combines both. As the virtual edit-a-thon stretches over a week and a half, inexperienced participants will be able to draw on the assistance of more experienced editors while creating, translating or improving articles on women who are (or have been) prominent in this field. All levels of Wikipedia editing experience are welcome.
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Philosophy[edit]

Adding your own personal selections of things you find interesting to the lede is not good wikipedia policy. You have been reverted three times now and you MUST take these changes to talk. If you raise a good case there other editors will back you. Carry on like this and you risk sanctions ----Snowded TALK 19:45, 25 October 2015 (UTC)

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You're invited! Women in Red World Virtual Edit-a-thon on Women in Science[edit]

You are invited! Join us remotely!

World Virtual Edit-a-thon on Women in Science

Love Heart KammaRahbek.SVG
Women Science.png
  • Dates: 8 to 29 November 2015
  • Location: Worldwide/virtual/online event
  • Host/Facilitator: Women in Red (WiR) in collaboration with Women scientists: Did you know that only 15% of the biographies on Wikipedia are about women? WiR focuses on "content gender gap". If you'd like to help contribute articles on women and women's works, we warmly welcome you!
  • Sponsor: New York Academy of Sciences
  • Event details: This is a virtual edit-a-thon hosted by WiR in parallel with a "phyisical" event during the afternoon of Sunday, November 22 in New York City. It will allow all those keen to improve Wikipedia's coverage of women in science to participate. As the virtual edit-a-thon stretches over three weeks, new participants will be able to draw on the assistance of more experienced editors while creating, translating or improving articles on women who are (or have been) prominent in the field. All levels of Wikipedia editing experience are welcome.
  • RSVP and learn more: →here←--Ipigott (talk) 11:14, 31 October 2015 (UTC)

Women in music[edit]

Music barnstar.png The Music Barnstar
Absolutely brilliant work on pulling together information for women in music. A very important topic in understanding the construction of modern popular music. An excellent start. My only criticism would be that it's mainly Western-centric at the moment, though for just one month's work it's impressive. Some random things off the top of my head that could be added: Female rappers, Édith Piaf, Muslim female artists, women in African music, Japanese female rock musicians. Tons of interesting stuff, I could go on and on Face-smile.svg SFB 22:03, 1 November 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for your support. You are right, the article is Western centric. Most of my effort so far is to try and make it not Classical and art music-centric, as so many music articles are. I appreciate the suggested articles and I will try to add more Eastern and Southern Hemisphere content. The challenge is that in addition to the racial bias in Wikipedia, there is a racial bias and Western-centric aspect to all music websites, books and journals. OnBeyondZebraxTALK 23:22, 1 November 2015 (UTC)
I certainly agree with that! I think it's the biggest challenge to the current standard of sourcing and should be an encouragement to people to document the less lauded cultures. SFB 20:06, 2 November 2015 (UTC)
  • I too would like to congratulate you on an excellent start to coverage of women in music. The article also offers a sound basis for expanding coverage, especially by adding biographies with the support of WikiProject Women in Red. Maybe, with Gerda Arendt's assistance, we could also start to compile one or more lists of women in music: composers, singers, players, etc., along the lines of the List of female dancers. Let me know if you are interested and whether you have any ideas about how we should proceed.--Ipigott (talk) 11:40, 5 November 2015 (UTC)
I appreciate your supportive comments. I agree that we need more lists of women composers, singers and players, to help readers to find articles about women in music. Task one would be to create more of these lists. Then I think task two would be to "publicize" these lists by adding them into other general articles on music (e.g., a list of women rock singers or a list of women folk singers could be added to the singer article). There are two bigger picture issues I wanted to get your input on. I have been creating "Women in [topic name]" sections in articles, to draw the attention of readers to the role of women in specific genres. I think this is a good first step (although the ideal step is to integrate more notable women into the body of the article). As well, I wanted to know if I am the only person who thinks that the current categorization system is controversial. When you create an article about a notable composer (who happens to be a woman), under the current system, the only category she can be put in is "female composers". Automatically, composers are divided by gender. This is more defensible for women in sport, given that women usually compete against other women. But composer is not a gender-divided activity. I think all composers should be put into a general "composer" category, regardless of gender. OnBeyondZebraxTALK 12:57, 5 November 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for thinking of me, but I am not good at lists ;) - Go over my articles, and you will find many female Bach singers, go over the cantatas and look in the recordings sections, you will find many more (not in those of course where detailed information was removed). --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:05, 5 November 2015 (UTC)
Sorry, OBZ, it's taken me so long to reply to you comments. I have been bogged down with the editathon on Women in science. I certainly agree we need to do more to publicize the role of women in music. I suggest we start thinking about an editathon of up to three weeks, perhaps in January or early February.
You are quite right in maintaining that women composers should be included in the appropriate main categories (Category:Composers by century, Category:Composers by nationality, Category:Composers by genre, Category:Composers by instrument, etc). When you create a new article about a woman composer you should in fact first include it in one or more of the main categories as well as in Category:Female composers. (Female composers should be a "non-diffusing category" - just updated - like all its correctly marked subcategories.) It seems to me the situation has been upset by the inclusion of Category:Male composers by Ekips39 last December. In my opinion, it should be deleted and articles should be moved to the appropriate gender-free categories. Perhaps our category expert Ser Amantio di Nicolao and/or Women in Red coordinator Rosiestep can also advise on this. As for the lists, I see we already have List of female composers by name but I think a breakdown by country with a few words on each would be in order. You will also see under Category:Lists of women in music that there are a number of other lists but we certainly need to compile various lists of singers and players. The List of female rock singers and List of classic female blues singers are simply lists of names which add little to the corresponding categories. The List of operatic contraltos is not much better. On the other hand, there is quite a good List of female violinists (with plenty of red links for Women in Red).--Ipigott (talk) 11:28, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
Women in music is an important article, so first, thank you for that! I support @Ipigott's idea of a Women in Music edit-a-thon in January or February, perhaps for 10-14 days. All the "women" categories are, to my knowledge, non-diffusing, so any biography in a "women" category must also be added to a non-gendered category within the same field. --Rosiestep (talk) 15:00, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
@Rosiestep: Thanks for your support for an editathon on women in music. How about 10 to 31 January? Maybe Pharos can tie us up with something otherwise it would be interesting to see how we make out alone. Maybe we should concentrate on composers and instrumentalists to avoid initial overspill on pop. As for the categories, I think in music especially, categories such as Category:Female singers and most of the subcategories are main categories in their own right as female voices need to be distinguished from the males voices. Category:Female dancers likewise.--Ipigott (talk) 15:35, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
We've had a good relationship in NYC and a number of past events with the New York Public Library for the Performing Arts, and User:Kosboot is actually a librarian there. The most recent event was this past May, when User:Lange.lea organized us for Wikipedia:Meetup/NYC/WomenOfJazz. That said, scheduling something for January would depend on circumstances and the availability of different people.--Pharos (talk) 15:45, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
Thanks Pharos for your amazingly quick response. We seem to be establishing an excellent relationship. For the time being, I'll put the proposal for January on the WiR talk page. If you can come up with anything, let me know. My own inclination is that we should have an open event on composers and instrumentalists initially and perhaps organize something specific on jazz and/or other genres later. It would also be good if we could become involved in events extending outside of NYC too. Perhaps Tim riley and Victuallers could let us know if there is any interest in the UK or Europe in January of February?--Ipigott (talk) 16:07, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
I'm off to a wikimeet in Birmingham this weekend. I'll ask ... Victuallers (talk) 16:13, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
Thanks Roger. Further discussion on the event on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Women/Women in Red#Music editathon in January or February?.--Ipigott (talk) 16:30, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
Bags of useful international pop, jazz and folk material, I'm sure, and for classical music though there will necessarily be slim pickings on female composers there are masses of top notch women performers whose articles could be improved if a female-oriented editathon is thought desirable. My great guru on editathons in London has been User:WereSpielChequers, but that was a little while ago, and things may have changed. – Tim riley talk 18:08, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
Thanks, Tim. We're probably corresponding on the wrong page but I agree with you that we need to promote performers and instumentalists. Interesting work on composers may emerge from some of the other languages. For a start, just look at Argentina. Maybe not all completely classical but... --Ipigott (talk) 19:05, 9 November 2015 (UTC)

I see I was mentioned here. I don't understand why we need a female composers category and not one for male composers -- presumably there is something particularly notable about composers' gender, but what that might be is beyond me. Hence the male composers category. Female composers has in fact been tagged as non-diffusing since February. You may do as you see fit, of course, but I remain confused. Best wishes for the editathon. ekips39❀talk 03:56, 10 November 2015 (UTC)

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  • guitar solo has become a characteristic part of rock music. Guitar solos are a defining feature of ][heavy metal music]], in which most songs feature a solo, Metal solos often showcase the virtuosity of the guitarists,

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Copying within Wikipedia requires proper attribution[edit]

Information icon Thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia. It appears that you copied or moved text from William Grant Still into Black conductors. While you are welcome to re-use Wikipedia's content, here or elsewhere, Wikipedia's licensing does require that you provide attribution to the original contributor(s). When copying within Wikipedia, this is supplied at minimum in an edit summary at the page into which you've copied content. It is good practice, especially if copying is extensive, to also place a properly formatted {{copied}} template on the talk pages of the source and destination. The attribution has been provided for this situation, but if you have copied material between pages before, even if it was a long time ago, please provide attribution for that duplication. You can read more about the procedure and the reasons at Wikipedia:Copying within Wikipedia. Thank you. --Diannaa (talk) 14:58, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Hi, thanks for your message. I have been creating new articles that draw on existing articles for much of their content, like Women in music, Women in law, Women in philosophy and Black conductors. I have been trying to give attribution in the edit summary for each time I copy content from one WP article to another. Thank you for alerting me to my failure to do so for William Grant Still. I will be more attentive.OnBeyondZebraxTALK 20:39, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Your habit to copy and paste material[edit]

Please don't just copypaste content between articles without copying full attributions as well, as in Women in music. Readers who are not experienced Wikipedians will be puzzled by short attributions that are not explained within the article and cannot be expected to figure them out on their own, or check the history to find your edit comments. Wikipedia serves the reader, not you as a contributor; don't make things easy for yourself when it makes things harder for the reader. I'm sorry to say that this simple copypasting is a quite ugly lazy habit. It also leads to cite errors, by the way. --Florian Blaschke (talk) 23:06, 17 December 2015 (UTC)

You may wish to read WP:CIVIL. I will not treat you in a disrespectful way back, though. I am complying with the minimum requirements set out in the copying within Wikipedia guidelines. As well, my cut and paste edits from the Women in music article were done to help reduce the low coverage of women and women's contributions in Wikipedia. See Gender bias in Wikipedia. Copypasting is permitted. I am serving the reader by making information more available to readers. Thank you.OnBeyondZebraxTALK 23:57, 17 December 2015 (UTC)
Where did you find anything uncivil in my comment? I'm curious because I was extra careful to word it as nicely as possible. Calling something "a lazy habit" is not uncivil, by the way, as it was ad rem and not ad hominem.
I realised very well your purpose – and it is a very good one that I support without reserve, don't get me wrong. That does not, however, excuse copypasting when it results in unexplained short attributions or cite errors. What is uncivil is to leave it to others to fix them when you could have fixed them more easily yourself. I'd think it's not that hard and frustrating to copy the full refs from the literature lists additionally. Thank you. :-) --Florian Blaschke (talk) 03:13, 21 December 2015 (UTC)

(page stalker) Some interesting points have been raised. I hope this discussion doesn't get derailed by distraction from focus on editors. Willondon (talk) 04:10, 18 December 2015 (UTC)

(another page stalker) No need to play the victim and deflect. User:Florian Blaschke politely but firmly asked you to clean up your sloppy edits. Why not just be a good sport and take their advice? Magnolia677 (talk) 04:30, 21 December 2015 (UTC)

Both User:Florian Blaschke and User talk:Magnolia677 deny that there was uncivil conduct by Florian Blaschke. Florian Blaschke left the following edit summary referring to my edits on Women in music: "01:31, 17 December 2015‎ Florian Blaschke (talk | contribs)‎ m . . (121,379 bytes) (+688)‎ . . (→‎Classical era: Fixing another cite error, result of lazy and stupid copypasting)". WP:IUC, the section of WP:CIVIL on identifying uncivil conduct, lists "1. Direct rudeness... (d) belittling a fellow editor, including the use of judgemental edit summaries or talk-page posts (e.g. "that is the stupidest thing I have ever seen", "snipped crap")". Negative comments about edits themselves are uncivil when terms like "lazy" and "stupid" are used.OnBeyondZebraxTALK 05:07, 22 December 2015 (UTC)
Well, sorry, I have to disagree there. Calling out inappropriate behaviour without attacking the person who behaves inappropriately is not uncivil. I purposefully never called any one person lazy or stupid (I didn't even know at the time who made the edits, after all). The ad hominem vs. ad rem distinction is the most useful criterion according to which civility can be gauged. But I do not wish to distract you further. --Florian Blaschke (talk) 23:14, 22 December 2015 (UTC)

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Thank you for your help with Women in Punk Rock[edit]

Dear OnBeyondZebrax, Thank you for your editing help with the Women in Punk Rock article. It is very much appreciated. Happy new year - have a great 2016! Netherzone (talk) 21:46, 31 December 2015 (UTC)

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Your changes to Voice leading[edit]

Dear colleague Wikipedian,

I saw your recent changes to Voice leading, but did not really understand them.

  • "In part-writing for a string section or string orchestra, or string quartet, the second violin and viola parts are called 'inner voices'..."

Why do you limit "inner voices" to part-writing for strings? "Inner voices" would also exist in choral writing, in keyboard works, etc., and may even result from an abstract thinking deducing separate voices from a single compound melody! You are right that some precision about this must be given (also including outer voices, by the way), but I wonder whether this must be given in a separate section, or in an explanatory footnote.

  • "In counterpoint, voice leading (American) or part-writing (British), is the rules regulating the melodic movements [...], typically in a Western classical music context."

But isn't counterpoint itself typical of an Occidental context? If counterpoint can be said to exist in some exotic music, I suppose that the rules regulating the melodies there would also be called "voice leading", or something or the kind. Your remark, therefore, IMO really belongs to the counterpoint article, not here.

  • "Principles of voice leading include the importance of "outer voices" (high-register melody and bass line), giving less active lines to "inner voices" (often moving in stepwise motion)"

First or all, the statement (long before your changes) that principles of voice leading include the importance of "outer voices" is in itself questionable: is the importance of outer voices a principle of voice leading? But your description of the upper voice as "high-register melody" is inexact: the upper voice is the highest one, but may be quite low nevertheless. And I am not sure that inner voices often move stepwise, which, said so, would seem to imply that the upper voice less often does so. This often would be true for the bass, but deserves more comment (Schenker spoke of that aspect).

I will further think of all this, and possibly make changes. But this needs caution, and time; I thought that perhaps you might want to do some changes yourself. I will happyly discuss this with you, of course. — Hucbald.SaintAmand (talk) 19:01, 7 January 2016 (UTC)

Thank you for your corrections. It is misleading to call the upper-register voice the "melody". I changed this wording and a number of other sentences in response to your points. The reason for my edits was that Wikipedia did not have an article on inner voices, so I thought it would be helpful to create an inner voices section in the voice leading article. I will continue to review and improve my edits to this article.OnBeyondZebraxTALK 19:49, 7 January 2016 (UTC)
OnBeyondZebrax, I am concerned with the problem of consistency between WP articles, and I think that if points have to be made clearer, it should be done in the main article concerned, to which other articles may link. I am sorry to bother you on your talk page, instead of correcting the article itself. But I don't want this to turn into a war.
Some of your recent propose definitions of "voice", "outer voice", "inner voice", etc., but this hardly concerns voice leading. There is a specific article on voices, Part (music) (which also is a redirect from Voice (polyphony)), where these notions are already explained. You might want to add explanations there.
I'd comment your recent changes as follows:
  • "The concept of "inner voices" and "outer voices" also applies to writing for choral ensemble, keyboard, winds, brass, and other instruments."
These concepts (1) apply to any type of polyphony; (2) do not concern voice leading. See Part (music).
  • "... the application of these rules [...] often in a Western classical music context."
I still fail to see the point of this. Counterpoint indeed often happens in a Western context, as already more or less implied in the Counterpoint article when it says that "It has been most commonly identified in classical music". As to voice leading, it happens equally often –always– in any type of counterpoint.
  • "voice leading" is used for both instrumental writing for ensembles and keyboard instruments and choral (vocal ensemble) writing."
You won't easily include all cases. You might as well speak of "polyphonic writing for ensembles, or for solo polyphonic instruments [which, by the way, also include the guitar, the harp, and many others], or for vocal polyphony [not only choral]." You might then summarize all this saying "voice leading is used in polyphonic writing", but wasn't that already implicit in the first words of the article, "In counterpoint..."?
  • "... high-register lines ..."
The point I had wanted to make earlier was not about melody vs line, but about "high register": the upper voice may be quite low. Part (music) rightly defines the upper voice as the "top voice".
  • "Voice leading is also called "part leading" or the "guiding", "management", "progression" or "conduct of parts".
I don't think this deserves a separate section called "terminology". The lede already gives alternative terms, to which some of these could be added. But I have my doubts about many of these:
– the "guiding voice" (or "leading voice") is a concept in Schenkerian analysis, denoting the fact that one single voice may lead the whole harmony or counterpoint in a passage. This concept certainly is not merely a terminological variant of "voice leading". It might deserve being explained here, but I am not sure this would be the right place.
– "voice management" appears to concern the management of one's voice in speech; nothing to do with voice leading.
– "progression" is a related concept, but it appears to concern the global result of the voice leading, especially when one speaks of "harmonic progression"; progression certainly is not synonymous to voice leading.
– "conduct of parts" sounds to me as a retranslation of the French conduite des voix, which is the usual translation of ... voice leading.
On these points, see also Talk:Voice_leading#A_couple_of_suggestions.
  • "(Note:V/V means the dominant of the dominant)" (In the legend of the figure.)
There is a Secondary dominant article, to which V/V redirects... [And I hate this example, which contains at least one gross error: in case 3, the top voice goes D-B-C while the third one (tenor) has C-B-C; this would be rejected in any textbook concerning voice leading. I very strongly doubt that it could be found in the source given. See also Talk:Voice_leading#Faulty_example (which concerns earlier versions of the example, I think).]
  • Your quotation from Sittler, Garry. "Design, Harmony, and Voice Leading" in AAAI Technical Report, WS-96-03
This paper, which is available on Internet (https://www.aaai.org/Papers/Workshops/1996/WS-96-03/WS96-03-007.pdf), is not a very good source. It is written by a member of a computer science department, and the fact that four part harmony is based on voice leading does not say much about voice leading properly speaking. [It says a lot, however, about four-part harmony, a pedagogical device developed in the 19th century allegedly to teach common practice harmony, and in which confusion reigns between rules of harmony and of conterpoint – a confusion to which Gary Sittler also has been a victim.]
I may open a sandbox page where we could rework some aspects of this article. But I urge you first to read its talk page, which includes several remarks of interest. — Hucbald.SaintAmand (talk) 13:28, 8 January 2016 (UTC)
Thank you for your comments and points. Relocating variant terms to a "Terminology" section is an approach set out in MOS:LEADALT. Note that I only relocated the terms ("progression" and others) there from the lead. I did not introduce these terms to the article. We could add a [citation needed] tag to these terms. You refer to the lead article. What do you see as the lead article? It seems to me that if we put the articles in a hierarchy, then Part (music) would seem to be a subarticle under Voice leading. As well, even though Part (music) explains what a "voice" is, I think it helpful to clarify to the reader of voice leading that a "voice" can also include instrumental parts. A reader may arrive at voice leading from any number of links, and he/she may be unfamiliar with the terminology. Re: adding "Western Classical music", I am adding this because often music articles about Western music are written without considering that there are other musical traditions. Articles will say things like "composer X was the most prolific composer in the history of music" when in fact the composer is the most prolific composer in Western classical music. OnBeyondZebraxTALK 17:48, 8 January 2016 (UTC)
1) Terminology: you are right, or better said you would be right if these terms were true alternatives to "voice leading". I realize now that you merely relocated them, but this puts them in evidence and their (IMO) inadequacy becomes all the more visible. Adding a [citation needed] tag indeed is a solution [I did it]; but it will probably long remain without answer... Such terms are unknown, I think, at least in classical music theory.
2) I think that Part (music) logically comes before Voice leading. This only concerns the direction of possible links: if extended definitions of what a voice is, or an outer, or inner one, are to be given, it is there, because these first concern the definition of voices. There are few voice leading rules that explicitly would differentiate inner voices from the top one; the case of the bass may be different, but there is little point stressing this before we have added a special section about this. There may be a case to make of the special role of outer voices: Hindemith wrote about this and is worth quoting; but that will be for later.
3) I am sensible to your point about "Occidentalocentricity", if I may call it so. It already was as a result of such a discussion that the article begins with "In counterpoint..." instead of "In music...". But one should not throw the baby with the water: "voice leading", in general, describes voice leading in any music based on several voices! What may be stressed is, on the one hand, that counterpoint is mainly a feature of Western music and, on the other hand, that the rules described later in the article are Western rules; but it certainly would not be true that there are no rules of voice leading in non-Western counterpoint!
Each of these points deserves further consideration; let's not be too fast about correcting them. — Hucbald.SaintAmand (talk) 18:36, 8 January 2016 (UTC)

About racism[edit]

Hi! How are you?

Codice1000.en (talk) 16:18, 9 January 2016 (UTC)

Good! One of my editing concerns is racial bias in Wikipedia. Most editors are white, so there is not much coverage of Black history or black issues.OnBeyondZebraxTALK 16:22, 9 January 2016 (UTC)

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Rendition[edit]

Hello, I reverted your recent edit to the CIA article, where you added a "definition" to extraordinary rendition in the lead. I've started a discussion on the talk page about it and thought you might like to take part. Cheers. - theWOLFchild 14:32, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

Hi, WP:MOSINTRO guidelines require uncommon terms in the lead to be defined. Extraordinary rendition is an uncommon term.OnBeyondZebraxTALK 14:35, 29 January 2016 (UTC)
This was just for the purposes of notification. All discussion should be kept to the CIA talk page. Cheers - theWOLFchild 15:25, 29 January 2016 (UTC)
I always make an initial reply in both locations. If this is not compliant with WP policy, please indicate the relevant guideline.OnBeyondZebraxTALK 15:50, 29 January 2016 (UTC)
Huh? No... I'm not saying your reply here is a violation of WP policy. I was just saying that in regards to the subject of discussion, I would only be replying at the article talk page about it, not here. This is your talk page, you can pretty much do whatever you like, it makes no difference to me. Cheers - theWOLFchild 16:12, 29 January 2016 (UTC)
Great! I wasn't sure about what you meant. :) OnBeyondZebraxTALK 17:24, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

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Some unexpected thanks[edit]

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Stale Drafts[edit]

The stale drafts project [3] has identified some of your user subpages as stale drafts. I've made a list here: Wikipedia:WikiProject_Abandoned_Drafts/Stale_drafts/Zebra. If they are no longer of use you can request deletion with WP;G7. Thanks. Legacypac (talk) 15:17, 10 March 2016 (UTC)

Hi Legacypac, yes, I would like to delete these stale drafts using WP:G7. Do I have to put a delete tag -Db-g7-on each page?OnBeyondZebraxTALK 19:33, 10 March 2016 (UTC)

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Wikipedia:Notability cannot be purchased[edit]

Hi, I saw the edit you made in February to Wikipedia:Notability cannot be purchased on celebrities selling books. Thanks for adding the section! I am trying to figure out how it best fits within the overall page, and am hoping you can help me out. The essay, of course, is on the concept that notability cannot be purchased... Celebrities, of course, are notable on their own terms, independent of any book they may publish, either in a vanity press or elsewhere. Are you arguing that a book authored by a celebrity may not be notable just because the celebrity is notable? Because that makes sense, although I think the argument may belong under "Notability is not inherited". But then again I am not sure I have you right. Can you help me out here? Thanks! KDS4444Talk 07:09, 29 March 2016 (UTC)

I am arguing that if a person published a series of books using a vanity press, these books cannot be used to support a claim that a person is notable, since a vanity press will publish whatever a person pays them to publish. This contrasts with cases where an independent, reputable publishing house (e.g., Random House or Penguin) agreeing that a person's books are well-written and publishing the books. Hope this is helpful. P.S., celebrities are not automatically notable in WP. Just because a person's photo is on page 1 of tabloids for alleged scandals, doesn't mean sh/e meets WP:GNG.OnBeyondZebraxTALK 16:50, 29 March 2016 (UTC)

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Wikiproject Food and Drink Newsletter – April 2016[edit]

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Proposed deletion of The Weakening[edit]

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Proposed deletion of Tena Palmer[edit]

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Nothing at all to suggest how she's solidly independently notable and my searches found nothing at all aside from a few links, certainly questionable article overall. Everything is basically simply sourced by her own website which is simply not enough.

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"Women are everywhere"[edit]

Hi OnBeyondZebrax. I'm an editor of the Italian Wikipedia. I'm trying to participate to an IEG with the project "Women are everywhere". You will find the draft at this link https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:IEG/Women_are_everywhere It would be great if you could have a look at it. I need any kind of suggestion or advice to improve it. Support or endorsement would be fantastic. Many thanks,--Kenzia (talk) 18:00, 3 April 2016 (UTC)

Thank you very much for your support OnBeyondZebrax! English or italian, the point is to agree on the importance of the subject. Grazie!--Kenzia (talk) 21:56, 3 April 2016 (UTC)

Hi OnBeyondZebrax, you did really a great job on my draft of the project "Women are everywhere". I'm so grateful! You understood perfectly my point of vue, that's wonderful. I don't know if I'm going to propose the project, there are comments pointing out that I have not been very active on the Italian Wikipedia, which is true. Too engaged in studying and working. Anyway, I'm really grateful for your great help. GRAZIE--Kenzia (talk) 21:13, 4 April 2016 (UTC)

You are welcome! You are doing a PhD? I did the first year of a PhD, so I have a great respect for people who are doing the degree. I am happy to see that editors like you are trying to encourage more content about women!OnBeyondZebraxTALK 00:46, 5 April 2016 (UTC)
It's very kind of you. I got my PhD in History. It was hard work, you can understand :) Thank you for all your help and your encouragement! --Kenzia (talk) 09:20, 6 April 2016 (UTC)
Hi OnBeyondZebrax, how are you? You gave such a great help with my project, that I feel you are part of it. Well, I've decided to withdraw the proposal and I'm waiting to know how to do it. If you wish, you can read it in the talk page of the project. I'm very discouraged. It's like if I were not ok, not having enough experience, not having a methodology, not giving explication enough about the project. It's sad, but someone made me feel like if I were going to create problems in the community if ever I had this grant. I don't want to create problems to anyone. You have been so kind to me, you helped me so much. I will always be grateful for your support :) Ciao, --Kenzia (talk) 20:22, 1 June 2016 (UTC)

Some dim sum for you![edit]

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Citing reviews[edit]

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The excerpts were found on the Rotten Tomatoes website, therefore I cited the Rotten Tomatoes website. It seems that this is no different from giving a quote from a poem that appears in an anthology of poems. You can cite the anthology. You don't need to cite the original publication that the poem appeared in. If you know of a Wikipedia policy or guideline which indicates that the original source is required, kindly draw it to my attention. Thank youOnBeyondZebraxTALK 20:57, 14 April 2016 (UTC)

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2016 Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director Search Community Survey[edit]

The Board of Trustees of the Wikimedia Foundation has appointed a committee to lead the search for the foundation’s next Executive Director. One of our first tasks is to write the job description of the executive director position, and we are asking for input from the Wikimedia community. Please take a few minutes and complete this survey to help us better understand community and staff expectations for the Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director.

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Second account listed at Redirects for discussion[edit]

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Nomination of Zachary Bogue for deletion[edit]

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Philosophy history edits[edit]

Hi there Zebrax,

I did some tentative major overhauls on the philosophy page. Some of the (good) edits you've been making might have been affected. Just wanted you to know so you can (a) review my changes, and evaluate them, and (b) go back and re-do your edits as you see fit. Thanks. P.S. Everytime I see your name, my brain says "ZaphodBeeblebrox". CircularReason (talk) 05:56, 28 June 2016 (UTC)

Digital Anthropology research[edit]

Hello OnBeyondZebrax, My name is Stephanie Barker and I am a student at the University of Colorado Boulder. I am currently enrolled in a Digital Anthropology class, which attempts to answer how the digital world affects culture and how culture affects the digital world. For my final project I am doing an ethnography on women Wikipedia users and as a member of the WikiProject Women page I was hoping I could ask you some questions about your experiences editing Wikipedia pages. 1. Have you ever been locked into an intense editing war? If yes, please explain the situation to me. 2. How did you become interested in editing Wikipedia pages and did you have any initial fears/hesitations when you started editing pages? 3. Have you ever been a victim of a mass deletion or other vandalism on Wikipedia? If yes, please explain the situation to me. 4. How would you describe your gender? 5. Is there anything else you would like to share with me about your experiences as a Wikipedia editor? Thank you for taking the time to read this email. I would like you to know that I am only sharing my research with my professor and the other students in my class. If you would like me to send you a copy of my final project, I would be more than happy to! Sincerely, Stelba90 (talk) 00:39, 2 August 2016 (UTC)

Hi Stephanie, Thanks for your interest in Wikipedia. It is probably one of the biggest collaborative projects in history...people from all over the globe collaborating with total strangers from other countries, via the online editing system. I have worked with all sorts of people from around the world on articles.

1. Have you ever been locked into an intense editing war? If yes, please explain the situation to me. In Heavy metal music, my proposal to add a few sentences about the fact that almost all major heavy metal artists were men was repeatedly removed, even when I used reliable sources. Finally, I called for a RfC, a Request for Comments on this issue, to get a broader range of editors from Wikipedia to give their input. After extensive debates, it was ruled that I could put two sentences into the article about the role of women. I was accused of trying to politicize the article by pointing out the fact that most heavy metal musicians are men. Here is the tiny two-sentence section that caused so much controversy:

  • In relation to the gender composition of heavy metal bands, it has been said that "[h]eavy metal performers are almost exclusively male"[1] "...[a]t least until the mid-1980s" [2] apart from "...exceptions such as Girlschool."[1] However, "...now [in the 2010s] maybe more than ever–strong metal women have put up their dukes and got down to it",[3] "carv[ing] out a considerable place for [them]selves."[4]


2. How did you become interested in editing Wikipedia pages and did you have any initial fears/hesitations when you started editing pages? If you work for a huge organization (private, government or non-profit), you pretty much can't type a sentence onto the organization's website without it being approved by 7 different levels. In contrast, on Wikipedia, you create a new article, press "Save", and "boom", the new article is available for everyone to read. At first you don't think you really can change, edit and modify articles. At first I just made tiny changes. Now I routinely make major changes in articles. I added entire sections on women musicians to the articles on Conducting and Double bass.

Then you realize that if you do good quality edits, you can completely change articles and have your changes stay in the encyclopedia. It can be very gratifying to have an article you wrote become the number one Google hit (or close to it, like number 2 or number 3) for that term. For example, I wrote Women in music, Women in philosophy and Women in law due to a lack of coverage of women in Wikipedia (see Gender bias in Wikipedia for details on the lack of coverage of women and women's issues), and now it is usually the number 1 or number 2 Google hit for "Women in music". That means that people all around the world are learning more about the important role of women to music.

3. Have you ever been a victim of a mass deletion or other vandalism on Wikipedia? If yes, please explain the situation to me.

During the heated debate over whether the heavy metal music should mention the absence of women from most major bands, another editor began WP:Wikihounding me by deleting my edits made on other articles. Following other editors around the website to interfere with their work is against the rules. Eventually, an Administrator intervened and told the editor to stop Wikihounding me.

On Philosophy, for a long time, every edit I made was deleted. Now there is a new editor who is strong and who agrees that the article should cover women.

4. How would you describe your gender? Male. But I was raised by a feminist mum, so I have feminist views.

5. Is there anything else you would like to share with me about your experiences as a Wikipedia editor? It is so rewarding to be able to create new articles and instantly make them available for people around the world to read. I love the idea that right now, some 12 year old across the world is doing a book report or presentation on Women in music and she/he has read the Wikipedia article to get a sense of the issues about this topic.

Gender bias on Wikipedia is a real issue. Most Wikipedia biographies are about men. There are articles about men who finished 23rd in the Olympics, but no articles on huge numbers of major women scientists, musicians, etc. As well, in general articles, they tend to focus on what famous men did. Like Philosophy; only recently did I manage to add a section entitled "Role of women", Philosophy#Role of women, which describes how very few women have been considered to be part of the "official" Western canon of philosophy. Until recently, my attempts to add info about women philosophers to the article were deleted. It took a huge effort to get editors to agree to have the first picture of a woman in the philosophy article. The section also describes the harassment that women philosophers are facing in recent years in universities and the under-representation of women on philosohpy faculties. This is in part because most editors are male. As well, some people think the somewhat confrontational editing atmosphere (name calling, criticism, attacks) makes women less interested in participating.

I also write essays about Wikipedia, to help editors to improve. The essays are at WP:Essays. I have written a number, including WP:OCD editors and WP:ADDIMAGES.

OnBeyondZebraxTALK 16:49, 16 August 2016 (UTC)

References[edit]

  1. ^ a b Brake, Mike (1990). "Heavy Metal Culture, Masculinity and Iconography". In Frith, Simon; Goodwin, Andrew. On Record: Rock, Pop and the Written Word. Routledge. pp. 87–91. 
  2. ^ Walser, Robert (1993). Running with the Devil:Power, Gender and Madness in Heavy Metal Music. Wesleyan University Press. p. 76. 
  3. ^ Eddy, Chuck (July 1, 2011). "Women of Metal". Spin. SpinMedia Group. 
  4. ^ Kelly, Kim (January 17, 2013). "Queens of noise: heavy metal encourages heavy-hitting women". The Telegraph. 

The WikiProject Food and Drink Newsletter (August 2016)[edit]

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Many thanks[edit]

In December 2014, I listed "Police militarization" on my "To Do" list of articles that very much need to be created. Now, many months later, I am excited to see that you actually started this article only the next month. To think, I've been feeling guilty all this time, when amazing work was being done to document this important topic :)

Thanks SO much for making the article. I'm amazed at the breadth and depth. I have worked in tiny incremental amounts to improve our article on SWAT police, with some limited success. Did you know initially, that the only source used to reference the purpose of SWAT police, in the lead, was a children's book, "Police Swat Teams: Life on High Alert" ? The book's description read,

"Twenty Attention-Grabbing Career Titles Guaranteed to Get Your Middle Schoolers Thinking About Their Future. This compelling new series for the middle school reader is designed to appeal to the thrill seeker in all of us. Each book includes information about a different extreme career, with a focus on safety and training. Readers will learn what it takes to get into these professions and what to expect when embarking on one. These volumes also provide information on the exciting aspects of these extreme careers and highlight the possible dangers and risks involved. Colorful photographs and informative sidebars help to make these books an invaluable resource for those young readers looking for a thrilling and fun-filled profession."

Yikes. Anyway, I'm happy to see that this whole issue is documented in greater detail here. Cheers. -Darouet (talk) 16:23, 17 August 2016 (UTC)

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Your edit to End user[edit]

This edit looks like the start of an WP:INTEGRITY problem. Do you have a WP:RS that could avoid that? -- DanielPenfield (talk) 00:18, 30 August 2016 (UTC)

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WikiProject Food and Drink Newsletter: September 2016[edit]

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Comment[edit]

I took a peek at your edit record and as far as I can tell you never consult or cite a reference source for anything. Sincerely, Opus33 (talk) 05:33, 12 September 2016 (UTC)

Thank you for your courteous reply. In truth, I see your edits going far beyond what you describe -- there is page after page of material that seems to coming out of your (often vague) memories.
It is easy (and fascinating) to learn more about a topic on Google Books before you edit. Perhaps you might give this a try? Yours sincerely, Opus33 (talk) 15:54, 16 September 2016 (UTC)

Military history WikiProject coordinator election[edit]

Greetings from the Military history WikiProject! Elections for the Military history WikiProject Coordinators are currently underway, and as a member of the WikiProject you are cordially invited to take part by casting your vote(s) for the candidates on the election page. This year's election will conclude at 23:59 UTC 23 September. For the Coordinators, MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 06:01, 16 September 2016 (UTC)

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WikiProject Food and drink Newsletter: October 2016[edit]