User talk:Oncenawhile

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A barnstar for you![edit]

Writers Barnstar Hires.png The Writer's Barnstar
Dear Oncenawhile, thank your for your contributions to Wikipedia, especially your recent creation of Mutamassirun. You are making a difference here! With regards, AnupamTalk 08:23, 5 June 2014 (UTC)

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Jewish refugees (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver)
added a link pointing to Palestinian exodus
Refugee (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver)
added a link pointing to Palestinian exodus

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July 2014[edit]

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  • but regularly as a land that had become something else, and as a people who had been annihilated)."}}</ref> and following the emigration of Canaanite speakers to [[Carthage]], was also used as a self-
  • threatening in that of his successor, displacing the Amorites and prompting a resumption of Semitic] migration. [[Abd-Ashirta]] and his son [[Aziru]], at first afraid of the Hittites, afterwards made

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  • them up into four categories that are now conventionally labelled "Reth" (Egyptians), "Aamu" ([[Levant|Asiatics]], "Themehu" ([[Ancient Libya|Libyans]]), and "Nehesu" ([[Nubians]]). These are

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Your AE complaint about 1950–1951 Baghdad bombings[edit]

Your AE complaint has been closed with warnings to you and Plot Spoiler. Further unilateral reverts may lead to a topic ban from ARBPIA. Thanks, EdJohnston (talk) 15:26, 14 July 2014 (UTC)

the Aamu[edit]

Before renaming any files, perhaps you should discuss it first. See Talk:Canaan#Image_of_Canaanite. Y-barton (talk) 03:02, 16 July 2014 (UTC)

DYK for One Million Plan[edit]

Gatoclass (talk) 04:39, 17 July 2014 (UTC)

Reference Errors on 20 July[edit]

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Disambiguation link notification for August 5[edit]

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You are engaging in disruptive editing[edit]

User Oncenawhile, you are apparently engaging in disruptive editing - see your recent actions of Expulsions of Egyptian Jews (1956). I remind you that you are editing WP:ARBPIA articles and should pay attention to details, considering recent warnings.GreyShark (dibra) 10:41, 10 August 2014 (UTC)

User:Greyshark09, you have had three months to respond to the concerns I raised at Talk:Expulsions of Egyptian Jews (1956). See User_talk:Greyshark09#Talk:Expulsion_of_Egyptian_Jews_.281956.29. Oncenawhile (talk) 10:49, 10 August 2014 (UTC)
The rename procedure was made on August 7, don't try to get away with this.GreyShark (dibra) 10:50, 10 August 2014 (UTC)
User:Greyshark09, this relates directly to the points previously raised. Please respond to them. I have no intention to edit war - I want to discuss. So please respond to the detailed concerns i have raised to the article which you wrote. Oncenawhile (talk) 10:53, 10 August 2014 (UTC)

Pogrom[edit]

I noticed you reverted someone's attempt -- an attempt based apparently on WP:DONTLIKEIT -- to remove the sourced Olmert quotes from the Pogrom article. I undid the latest reversion (which came from someone who was recently formally warned on Arab-Israeli editing), and User:Galassi promptly reverted my undo, yet again for the absurd and invalid reason of there being "no consensus for inclusion" (see Talk:Pogrom#POV_pushing if your memory needs refreshing on all of this fun). He's now done this twice in the past several hours, and appears to be using Twinkle to aid him in his suppression of sourced content. It strikes me that you've an interest in maintaining the article in a state characterized by well-sourced citations, NPOV language, and an atmosphere as free as possible from meta-political considerations, be they made through coatracking or via conspicuous absence of relevant information. It also strikes me that you're a much more experienced Wiki editor than me. Hopefully I'm wrong in this assumption, but I foresee the possibility of yet another edit war over the Olmert "pogrom" quotes sourced content. I don't know the ins and outs of WP:3RR, or whether or not my continued undoing of reverts based on spurious and unencyclopedic (read:political) reasons will expose me to something like a temporary ban from editing for violating 3RR. I would appreciate your help or, at least, your advice in this matter. Thanks so much Direct action (talk) 20:32, 12 August 2014 (UTC)

This user is really active about recent conflict and it seems he writes not so unbiased text --CONFIQ (talk) 20:42, 13 August 2014 (UTC)

DYK for Tabnit sarcophagus[edit]

Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 08:21, 14 August 2014 (UTC)

Criticism of the Israeli government, name discussion[edit]

hi
I noticed that you had previously contributed to Talk:Criticism of the Israeli government#Better name for article? and thought I'd let you know that a similar discussion has opened at Talk:Criticism of the Israeli government#Request move Gregkaye (talk) 16:14, 15 August 2014 (UTC)

Descendants of Israelites[edit]

Recent edits to Israelites on the genetics of Palestinians seem to contradict what Palestinian people says about their genetics. I'd appreciate your input. I've had problems with the same IP 24.42.116.19 (talk · contribs) at Groups claiming affiliation with Israelites which also needs attention. I've removed stuff the IP added about the Lemba being agreed to be of Israelite descent (people don't seem to even bother to read main articles). Thanks. Dougweller (talk) 08:57, 17 August 2014 (UTC)

Hi Doug, thanks for bringing this to my attention. I think that the work on I-P genetics on wikipedia needs a huge cleanup, as most of the "conclusions" being pushed by various editors are still in the realm of scientific conjecture at this stage as opposed to hard facts. I'm not ready to go into bat on the topic though as I would need to do a full review of the latest research before I could do so in a meaningful fashion.
Oncenawhile (talk) 10:57, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
That's ok, but would you take a look at Talk:Israelites? Lots of OR, assumptions about the Cohen Modal Prototype, misuse of sources, etc. At least IMHO. I reverted a big chunk and don't think it should be replaced without clear evidence about the current prevailing opinion. Dougweller (talk) 11:15, 17 August 2014 (UTC)

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List of ethnic cleansings[edit]

FYI please see Talk:List of ethnic cleansings#RfC: Inclusion criteria -- PBS (talk) 22:14, 27 August 2014 (UTC)

Having done your merge I think you need to adjust the lead from "follow definitions given in this article" to perhaps "follow definitions given in the ethnic cleansings article" or something similar.
On a completely different subject as this page is getting very large why not set up a bot to archive this page? If you are not sure how to do it, see Talk:List of ethnic cleansings where I am about to do the same.
-- PBS (talk) 08:40, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

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September 2014[edit]

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Proposed deletion of Paralia (Palestine)[edit]

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The article Paralia (Palestine) has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

Just a dictionary definition. Not enough to justify a stand alone article although the name could be mentioned in the article on Palestine.

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the {{proposed deletion/dated}} notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing {{proposed deletion/dated}} will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. noq (talk) 12:12, 21 September 2014 (UTC)

Nomination of Paralia (Palestine) for deletion[edit]

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Paralia (Palestine) is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Paralia (Palestine) until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article. noq (talk) 13:02, 21 September 2014 (UTC)

Talkback[edit]

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Hello, Oncenawhile. You have new messages at Noq's talk page.
Message added 18:55, 21 September 2014 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

noq (talk) 18:55, 21 September 2014 (UTC)

The comment made that Muslim converts were once Christian and that they share the same history eludes to mistruths. Although some Muslims may have once been Christians. Once Muslim they are now not the same. The wording you allow on here must be truth and without distortion otherwise wiki will become unreliable as any good source who twists truths would be. — Preceding unsigned comment added by TruthOnlyPlease123 (talkcontribs) 15:47, 24 December 2014 (UTC)

Reference Errors on 24 September[edit]

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How many Iranian Jews?[edit]

Hi. Can I get your help with editing and input on some edit warring over the number of Jews in Iran? I noticed that on several articles, newer info was being suppressed. I've seen many attempts to keep the number at 30,000 in Iran - this is what Jews now says without citation, cuz of this edit of yours, which removed a cited figure of around 9,000. Please consider putting it back, as it's based on an actual, official, recent government census); see http://english.alarabiya.net/articles/2012/07/29/229078.html or http://www.timesofisrael.com/jewish-woman-brutally-murdered-in-iran-over-property-dispute/#ixzz3Ac6duaqw or the government's own report, https://www.amar.org.ir/Portals/1/Iran/90.pdf. If you wish to discuss, I'd prefer if you reply here; I'll be watching. --{{U|Elvey}} (tc) 20:30, 1 October 2014 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Arab satellite lists[edit]

Symbol question.svg Hello! Your submission of Arab satellite lists at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Alex2006 (talk) 18:05, 7 October 2014 (UTC)

DYK for Commemorative stela of Nahr el-Kalb[edit]

Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:04, 8 October 2014 (UTC)

Stela/stelae of Nahr el-Kalb[edit]

Hi, Oncenawhile. I've left a comment on the talk page … Awien (talk) 13:29, 8 October 2014 (UTC)

DYK for Arab satellite lists[edit]

HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 12:03, 10 October 2014 (UTC)

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letter[edit]

Hi Do you have access to IDF archives?--Shrike (talk) 09:47, 17 October 2014 (UTC)

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Enforcement notice[edit]

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Dear user Oncenawhile, a case of WP:ARBPIA sanctions enforcement has been opened regarding your recent actions at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Enforcement. Thank you.GreyShark (dibra) 23:14, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

November 2014[edit]

Stop icon with clock
You have been blocked from editing for a period of 48 hours for edit warring, as you did at Jewish refugees. Once the block has expired, you are welcome to make useful contributions. If you think there are good reasons why you should be unblocked, you may appeal this block by adding the following text below this notice: {{unblock|reason=Your reason here ~~~~}}. However, you should read the guide to appealing blocks first.

During a dispute, you should first try to discuss controversial changes and seek consensus. If that proves unsuccessful, you are encouraged to seek dispute resolution, and in some cases it may be appropriate to request page protection.  HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 00:12, 20 November 2014 (UTC)

Hi HJ Mitchell, thanks for looking in to this. I have been editing for almost five years, and am particularly experienced in a difficult area, and I am very proud of my clean history. I have always done my best to avoid both edit-warring and AE-warring. Specifically I generally try to avoid attacking other editors at AE, as I would rather build trust and mutual respect and as AE admins you have enough on your plate.
The decision to block me was taken in just over an hour of Greyshark's AE filing, possibly tarnishing my previously perfect behaviourial record without allowing me time to comment.
You correctly pointed out at the AE that Greyshark did not report Galassi in his filing despite Galassi crossing 1RR first. This is an important part of the context here. Unfortunately our editing history shows that Greyshark has negative feelings towards me, and I suspect this was just an attempt to hurt me.
The content dispute with Galassi is not a complex one; (s)he was simply reincluding a sentence without adding supporting evidence per WP:V. During the debate with Galassi (always with thoughful and detailed edit comments), I spotted Galassi's original 1RR, and then checked the page to confirm this was not under ARBPIA before proceeding. I did not cross 3RR at any point. I also opened a talk page discussion, as I had decided to stop after reaching the 3RR (broadly defined, since it was over a more than 24 hour period, I always feel it is better not to get too close, and follow the spirit instead of the rules).
A block of Galassi and me in this situation helps only Greyshark, and encourages use of AE as a battleground.
I would like to appeal this as far as a I can go because I do not want my history tarnished - proper behaviour here is something I value very highly. Please could you let me know what I should do next?
Oncenawhile (talk) 10:10, 20 November 2014 (UTC)
Thinking about this a little more I would really appreciate the opportunity to comment at the AE thread before it closes. Could I be temporarily unblocked so that I can contribute there (I am happy to commit to not editing any other pages during this period)? I would like at the very least to draw people's attention to the quality of edit comments made on the page, which shows that neither Galassi nor I were "edit warring" in the classic sense, insofar as we were engaging in good faith discussion via the edit comments since Galassi had provided new sources each time. Oncenawhile (talk) 11:30, 20 November 2014 (UTC)
Hi HJ Mitchell, just one last quick point - for the avoidance of doubt I would request that Greyshark09 is NOT investigated or punished for the questionable selectivity in his AE filing. Whilst the deterioriated relationship between Greyshark and me is the real issue underlying the AE, I would much rather this situation might act as a catalyst for Greyshark and me to talk to each other, bury the hatchet and rebuild a little trust. I have always respected Greyshark and as I have said to him in the past I would like to repair our relationship. We both have complimentary knowledge bases on similar subjects and real collaboration between us has proven successful in the past. AE warring, a path down which I have seen other editors led, only seems to increase the emotional stakes between editors and builds further barriers to the collaboration that some of our more difficult topic areas desparately need. Oncenawhile (talk) 12:22, 20 November 2014 (UTC)
If you agree not to edit the article in question or engage in a dispute about similar material in other articles for the remainder of the original 48 hours, I'll unblock you. You can still edit the talk page, and you can comment on the AE thread if you wish. HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 14:13, 20 November 2014 (UTC)
Hi HJ Mitchell, I agree to those terms. Please could you offer Galassi the same? I hope (s)he will respond to my comment on the article talk page. Oncenawhile (talk) 23:23, 20 November 2014 (UTC)
Done. I've already extended the same offer to Galassi. Best, HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 00:23, 21 November 2014 (UTC)

Your request for more discussion at WP:AE[edit]

Hello Oncenawhile. Regarding your post at AE, "could we keep this open until I have had a chance to have my position heard?". What did you mean by 'having my position heard'? The dispute at Jewish refugees does not involve Plot Spoiler, and there were clear 1RR violations. That means there was no special need to examine the motivations of those reverting. What do you think would be accomplished by more discussion? EdJohnston (talk) 17:26, 23 November 2014 (UTC)

Hi EdJohnston, if I understood HJ Mitchell's comments correctly the edits have not been deemed to fall under ARBPIA's 1RR rule (consistent with my own conclusion at the time when Galassi crossed that line first), but rather under WP:EW. As to the specific issue at hand, both Galassi and I showed clear evidence of "trying to resolve the disagreement through discussion" (i.e. my detailed edit comments and moving to the talk page, and Galassi's good faith attempts to provide appropriate sourcing). So we find ourselves in a very strange situation where neither editor involved believed there was any edit warring, yet we have both been punished.
Either way, in terms of what I would like to be accomplished, my real concern is the building of a misleading disciplinary record. As I mentioned, the two prior warnings being referred to did not assign any specific fault against me or any other editor, as my complaints were never fully investigated. Yet those warnings are now being used to cast aspersions against me and will likely be used again, just as this block will, by editors who would like to build a narrative to make me look like a disruptive editor.
For what it's worth, when editing in the I-P area my intention is to build collaboration between editors from both sides. I even prepared a Wikimania Leaflet, and a list of precedent scholarly collaborations, to try to encourage more people into the spirit. But not all editors think like this and many would prefer to work alongside only people who think as they do, hence the increasingly common ARBPIA AE-warring which I think is often destructive to the project.
Oncenawhile (talk) 19:37, 23 November 2014 (UTC)
The page at Talk:Jewish refugees carries the banner {{Arab-Israeli Arbitration Enforcement}}. This makes the page eligible for the ARBPIA 1RR. Can you quote anything by User:HJ Mitchell that makes you think 1RR does not apply? EdJohnston (talk) 20:16, 23 November 2014 (UTC)
Hi Ed, I was referring to this comment. Also, please note that the banner was added after the AE. Oncenawhile (talk) 21:39, 23 November 2014 (UTC)
Your edits at Jewish refugees seem to concern Jews who were seeking refuge in Israel. If so that would fall under the Arab-Israeli conflict. Also note that a person can be blocked for an ARBPIA 1RR violation without being (yet) eligible for discretionary sanctions. I think that is the point of HJM's comment about WP:AEBLOCK. If admin is consciously making an AE block (not a conventional block) they are supposed to use the {{uw-aeblock}} template. Such a template was not used in your case. EdJohnston (talk) 22:07, 23 November 2014 (UTC)
Hi Ed, to my mind, whether the edit fell under ARBPIA is a grey area which both Galassi and I interpreted in the same way. I don't disagree that one can make the argument both ways, but since there was "silent consensus" amongst the two involved editors at the time it seems unduly harsh for a third party to take a different view without letting us know politely at the time. Which is what puzzles me with this block - nothing was getting out of hand, noone was being disrupted, and both editors were behaving cordially. We had already moved to talk, so the block achieved nothing other than blackening a clean disciplinary record.
To that point, would you mind responding to the other points made in my response to you at 19:37? Oncenawhile (talk) 00:03, 24 November 2014 (UTC)
Whether Jewish refugees falls under WP:ARBPIA or not needs more than two editors to decide. If you want to make that argument, why not do so in the WP:AE complaint. EdJohnston (talk) 00:17, 24 November 2014 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for December 24[edit]

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Some falafel for you![edit]

Falafel award.png Thanks for you efforts to make the Israel article a NPOV article. Gouncbeatduke (talk) 01:52, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

Reference Errors on 28 January[edit]

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Biblical Hebrew[edit]

When I saw that you had added 503 bytes to the "Biblical Hebrew" article, I was preparing for the worst, but was actually favorably surprised. AnonMoos (talk) 02:56, 7 February 2015 (UTC)

Back to being unfavorably unsurprised[edit]

Not too impressed by the remarks you left on my user talk page; to start with, Pausanias wrote 250 years or so after the Septuagint Pentateuch was translated, not at the "same time". And you seem to fail to understand that Palaistinē entered the Greek language as an equivalent to the Hebrew term Pelesheth or "land of the Philistines" (though not borrowed directly from Hebrew to Greek). If the form Φιλιστια occurs in the Septuagint, I'd sure like to see a citation to the exact verse... AnonMoos (talk) 19:15, 15 February 2015 (UTC)

Unfortunately, raw Google Books URLs are not too useful to me in that form, since I'm not good at Google Books and I don't like Google Books (partly because it sometimes comes close to crashing my browser). I might follow those links (probably by arranging to use a different computer), but I can't guarantee that it will be any time very soon. Providing raw Google Books URLs with no further accompanying information had the effect of slowing down the conversation... AnonMoos (talk) 05:07, 20 February 2015 (UTC)
Sorry about greatly delayed reply, but I was away from Wikipedia for a week, and when I returned and saw that the quotes left on my user talkpage largely consisted of unscholarly whining about how the Septuagint got everything wrong and was full of mistakes, it didn't motivate me to give the matter a high priority... AnonMoos (talk) 18:55, 14 March 2015 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for February 7[edit]

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Your GA nomination of Palestine[edit]

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Your GA nomination of Palestine[edit]

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Thanks[edit]

Thanks for that note - I'm amazingly ignorant about technical matters. PiCo (talk) 10:54, 26 February 2015 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Palestine[edit]

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Thanks[edit]

I didn't even notice Palestine was under GA review until the approval template was added. I checked and saw you handled it alone. Well done!Nishidani (talk) 22:24, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

Congradulations with question :([edit]

[Moved to Talk:Palestine#Moved_from_User_talk:Oncenawhile. Oncenawhile (talk) 07:41, 14 March 2015 (UTC)]

A barnstar for you![edit]

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Thank you for bringing Palestine to Good Article status! — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 03:14, 15 March 2015 (UTC)

Talkback[edit]

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DYK for Palestine[edit]

Coffee // have a cup // beans // 00:01, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

A barnstar for you![edit]

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...For bringing Palestine article to GA status. Your hard work has not gone unnoticed :) The article is a wonderful and thorough read. Great work!! Étienne Dolet (talk) 07:25, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

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A page you started (Ekron Royal Dedicatory Inscription) has been reviewed![edit]

Thanks for creating Ekron Royal Dedicatory Inscription, Oncenawhile!

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Palestine[edit]

Hi. I've made some comment on the article talk page about some worries I have with the article, but I don't want to touch anything with out your agreement, given all the work you've put into the page. Would you like to comment? (I promise I won't change anything without your agreement). PiCo (talk) 08:10, 12 April 2015 (UTC)

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Jesus the Jew[edit]

Thanks for discussing this. Let's take it up on the talk page. Can you show that secular historians consider this topic important enough to include it in this section? I've only run across it in Christian sources. Jonathan Tweet (talk) 14:00, 15 April 2015 (UTC)

Siloam inscription[edit]

Something is not quite right. I've tried to fix it the best I could, but maybe you missed adding a ref or something else. You might want to take a look. Bgwhite (talk) 22:51, 17 April 2015 (UTC)

Nebuchadnezzar_Chronicle[edit]

Do you remember what you meant with the sentence

This has been compared to dates in the book of Ezekiel are given according to the year of captivity of Jeconiah (i.e. the first fall of Jerusalem)

?? I tried to figure it out and fix it a bit, but that's not worth much at all. It would be great if you could add a reference. Many thanks! Arminden (talk) 18:04, 22 April 2015 (UTC)Arminden

Hi Arminden, i have fixed this. Oncenawhile (talk) 22:00, 22 April 2015 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Assyrian lion weights[edit]

Symbol question.svg Hello! Your submission of Assyrian lion weights at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Prioryman (talk) 21:44, 8 May 2015 (UTC)

Another issue I'm afraid, please check the nomination page linked above. Prioryman (talk) 12:13, 12 May 2015 (UTC)

DYK for Ekron Royal Dedicatory Inscription[edit]

Harrias talk 10:06, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

DYK for Assyrian lion weights[edit]

Harrias talk 07:17, 22 May 2015 (UTC)

With regards to Mesha Stele[edit]

My intent was clarifying that "Palestine" meant the region, not the modern State. I agree with your reversion though.

I'm not sure why my edit on the History of the Name Palestine was deleted. Why would an edit with "little change" need consensus? --Monochrome_Monitor 20:37, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

The Half Million Award[edit]

Million award logo.svg The Million Award
For your contributions to bring Palestine (estimated annual readership: 850,000) to Good Article status, I hereby present you the Half Million Award. Congratulations on this rare accomplishment, and thanks for all you do for Wikipedia's readers! Winner 42 Talk to me! 17:50, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

Talk:Mandatory Palestine/FAQ: Transjordan[edit]

I've returned "Response by DaoXan" & Zero's reply to the page to let know to a reader about other POV. Can you please explain your "moving to main talk page - this is an FAQ, and should be discussed on the main talk page" deletion's description  ? Regards, --Igorp_lj (talk) 22:04, 6 July 2015 (UTC)

As I see you insist on deletion. IMHO, your "this is not a talk page" does contradict with the "Talk:Mandatory Palestine/FAQ: Transjordan" page name. Isn't it? --Igorp_lj (talk) 22:17, 6 July 2015 (UTC)

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Galilee sanjaks[edit]

Hi Oncenawhile. I know you've worked on the Mutasarrifate of Jerusalem and other articles on Ottoman districts. I'm working on a little article about Safad Sanjak. Apparently this district was supplanted by the Acre Sankjak at some point, but I can't seem to find out when this happened. Was it during the time of Zahir al-Umar, Jezzar Pasha or after the Egyptian period (1831-1840)? If you have any sources or info please let me know or feel free to post it here. Regards, --Al Ameer (talk) 02:21, 28 July 2015 (UTC)

Disruptive editing regarding the Southern Levant[edit]

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Samaria[edit]

Hi, please see Talk:Samaria about a map that was originally uploaded to Commons by you. The erroneous description of the green part as Samaria was added by an anon at Commons, see here. It shows "Samaritans", not "Samaria". Cheers. Zerotalk 11:55, 16 August 2015 (UTC)

FYI[edit]

WP:ARBPIA3 is now open and evidence can be submitted until September 8. 62.90.5.221 (talk) 09:11, 2 September 2015 (UTC)

Ottoman Rule in Amman[edit]

Hey, I am sorry to have removed your content without explaining my reasons.. Don't you think what you added is overly detailed in a period of time that didn't have much significance? --Makeandtoss (talk) 21:00, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

Hi @Makeandtoss:, thanks for your post. It is detailed, and would like to figure out how to cut down. The relevance of both the quote and the photo is that they are the best known evidence of the "refoundation" of Amman in the 1870s. What those sources say is that it was an uninhabited ancient ruin until a band of Circassians were brought in by the Ottomans. And the quote shows that with a good description around it. We could move the quote into the reference and summarise it?
If you look at the history, there were two key decisions which led to Amman coming into existence as a major metropolis: (1) the settlement of the circassians, and (2) the railway. On the latter point, unfortunately I can't find any good sources explaining the moment of that decision to open a railway station at Amman along the Hejaz Railway line.
Oncenawhile (talk) 22:35, 12 September 2015 (UTC)
@Oncenawhile: Moving the quote into the reference like what you did in the Timeline of Amman sounds like a good idea, however, I am still not sure about that picture as it shows it was a complete wasteland. --Makeandtoss (talk) 22:43, 12 September 2015 (UTC)
Yes, that is exactly the point of the picture - it shows in visual form that the city was uninhabited except for a few Circassian families in tents. Oncenawhile (talk) 22:54, 12 September 2015 (UTC)
Okay --Makeandtoss (talk) 23:11, 12 September 2015 (UTC)
@Oncenawhile: I moved the quote into the reference. I also replaced the 1879 picture with an 1898 picture from the same location but a different angle, I hope you don't mind? --Makeandtoss (talk) 20:45, 22 September 2015 (UTC)

Edits of Palestinian National Authority.[edit]

You made this edit.

Accuarding to this source, you are wrong about the flag and the anthem. For the coat of arms I searched for some sources but didn't found. I will continue my research on this eventially.

Please explane: "Currently these are all related to the State of Palestine, not the PNA". Since I gave a large number of sources to contradict the technically unbased claim the PNA transformed to SoP I don't understand if this edit was made accuarding to the original bearly based consensus or becuase you still disagree with over 40 sources (And I can provide more, just ask). --Bolter21 14:54, 1 October 2015 (UTC)

The Million Award for Palestine ![edit]

Million award logo.svg The Million Award
For your contributions to bring Palestine (estimated annual readership: 1,000,000) to Good Article status, I hereby present you the Million Award. Congratulations on this rare accomplishment, and thanks for all you do for Wikipedia's readers! — Cirt (talk) 18:38, 2 October 2015 (UTC)


Long due, and impressive above all in coming from an uninvolved editor, and thus reflects an undeniably objective judgement. One watches your steady, patient, meticulous work in silent admiration.Nishidani (talk) 18:43, 2 October 2015 (UTC)

Palestine is a partially recognized country.[edit]

The term "partially recognized" applies to all countries which lacks the needed recognition to be legal countries i.e. UN member states. Israel, China, Armenia, Cyprus, RoK and DRoK have limited recognition but doesn't have recognition problem. Kosovo, Palestine, Abkhazia, South Ossetia Western Sahara and others are partially recognized regardless of the number of recognizers. Kosovo has a number not far from SoP's recognizers number, it is a partially recognized country becuase it is blocked via recognition from being a member of the UN and thus being a legal country. --Bolter21 23:21, 4 October 2015 (UTC)

Nomination of One Million Plan for merger[edit]

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article One Million Plan is suitable as a standalone article in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be merged.

The article is discussed at Talk:Aliyah Bet#Merge until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

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File:Historical boundaries of Palestine (plain).svg[edit]

Please see the discussion at Wikipedia:Reference desk/Miscellaneous#Boundaries of where? I think the current illustration is confusing because the two dashed green lines show two different boundaries. --Quest for Truth (talk) 12:39, 4 November 2015 (UTC)

Addressing your argument on the Sasanian Empire talk page![edit]

PLEASE listen to what I have to say carefully as what I am about to say will be very important regarding that topic altogether!

That map in the infobox was a map that I created. Now as I said in the talkpage of the Sasanian Empire article and on my talkpage two years ago, I will address the problems with the map. That map has been there for two years now and untouched on top of that. There is a valid reason for that one as well.

Here is where me addressing your argument on your talkpage comes in!

Roughly three years ago around 2012, I was new to Wikipedia and I tried to make some edits here and there, eventually got into a conversation with the editors of that article at the time which caused a massive edit war that created numerous talks on the Dispute Resolution Notice Boards of Wikipedia. It eventually ended, only for a consensus via RfC with the help from the Wikipedia Map Workshop Team to arise. It was eventually settled and the map that you see in the infobox stands there today. I did not think of Palaestina at the time as the name of the province, but rather Judea.

Before that edit war, there were other arguments and minor edit wars that took place regarding the infobox map alone, dating ALL the way back to 2006 with the topic constantly being rehashed since then! The edit war I was in happened to be the last one and it has remained that for two solid years. If you don't believe me on this, look in the archives. There was one guy who tried to rehash the conflict, but he did get anywhere for obvious reasons.

Side note: (Also, since there were three Palaestina's within the Diocese of the East of the Byzantine Empire, I still don't see how that is a big deal.)

With all that said, I strongly advise you not to rehash this topic on the Sasanian Empire talk page. If anything, go the the Map Workshop! Perhaps I will have them improve the map altogether or simply leave the topic alone! That would be the best idea.

Regards! Kirby (talk) 05:26, 5 November 2015 (UTC)

EDIT:

Here is a list of all the sources for that map that put all my effort into making years ago:

[1]

Chosroes II continues his victorious career, conquering Egypt and Asia Minor and occupying both Alexandria and also Chaceldon across the Bosporus from Constinanople.[2]

[3]In this campaign the Persians broke through Byzantiums's eastern provinces; in 609, they reached Chaceldon, directly facing the capital, and their triumphal progress, far more serious than before, occupied the first part of the reign of Herakleios.

[4] [5]

[6] Chosroes II of Persia who owed his throne to Maurice, declared war on the muderer of his benefactor. Persian armies were victorious in Mesopotamia and Syria, capturing the fortress towns of Dara, Amida Haran, Edessa, Hierapolis and Aleppo, though they were repulsed from Antioch and Damascus. They then overran Byzantine Armenia and raided deep into Anatolia through the provinces of Cappadocia, Phrygia, Galatia, and Bithynia. Byzantine resistance collapsed. A Persian Army penetrated as far as the Bosporus. Antioch and most of the remaining Byzantine fortresses in Syria and Mesopotamia and Armenia were captured(611). After a long seiges, the invaders took Damascus (613) and Jerusalem (614). Chosroes then began a determined invasion of Anatolia (615). Persian forces under General Shahen captured Chaceldon on the Bosporus after a long siege (616). Here the Persians remained, within one of of Constintanople, for more than 10 years. Meanwhile, they captured Ancyra and Rhodes (620); remaining Byzantine fortresses in Armenia were captured; the Persian occupation cut off a principal Byzantine recruiting ground. After defeating Byzantine garrisons in the Nile Valley, Chosroes marched across the Lybian Desert as far as Cyrene. These victories cut off the usual grain supplies from Egypt to Constantinople. Under Chosroes II the Persians virtually eliminated the Byzantines from all their Asiatic and Egyptian provinces, expanding Sassanid dominions to the extent of the Empire of Darius.

[7]The able Persian generals Shahrvaraz and Shahin led the Sassanid armies through Mesopotamia, Armenia and Syria into Palestine and Asia Minor. They took Antioch in 611, Damascus in 613, and then Jurusalem, in 614 (sending a shock through the whole Christian world). At Jerusalem the Christian defenders refused to give up the city, and it was taken by assault after three weeks, and given over to the sack. The Persians carries off the True Cross to Ctesiphon. Within another four years they had conquered Egypt and were in control of Asia Minor, as far as Chaceldon, opposite of Constantinople on the shores of the Bosporus. No shah of Persia since Cyrus had achieved such military successes.

[8]

NOTE: The sources that I quoted from are the sources that cannot be linked due to them not being available to read on the internet. The sources that I cited and quoted from were from books at my local libraries.

Also, in case you were wondering, www.iranicaonline.org as one of my sources, even users who edited that article years ago acknowledged that website was a reliable source.

Finally, my map is heavily based off this map: http://ecai.org/sasanianweb/maps/sasanianempire570.htm

Regards. =D Kirby (talk) 05:35, 5 November 2015 (UTC)

  1. ^ [1]
  2. ^ H.E.L. Mellerish (1994) pg. 428
  3. ^ Robert Fossier The Cambridge History of The Middle Ages 350-950 (1990) pg.175
  4. ^ >http://www.iranicaonline.org/articles/bahram-the-name-of-six-sasanian-kings#pt7
  5. ^ http://www.iranicaonline.org/articles/abna-term
  6. ^ R. Ernest Dupuy and Trevor N. Dupuy (1970) pg.193, 210, 211, 214
  7. ^ Michael Axworthy A History of Iran (2008) pg.64-65
  8. ^ http://www.iranicaonline.org/articles/byzantine-iranian-relations

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DYK for Tutankhamun's mask[edit]

Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:01, 18 December 2015 (UTC)

Palestine and synonyms[edit]

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December 2015[edit]

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Copying within Wikipedia requires proper attribution[edit]

Information icon Thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia. It appears that you copied or moved text from Israel into List of Earthquakes in the Levant. While you are welcome to re-use Wikipedia's content, here or elsewhere, Wikipedia's licensing does require that you provide attribution to the original contributor(s). When copying within Wikipedia, this is supplied at minimum in an edit summary at the page into which you've copied content. It is good practice, especially if copying is extensive, to also place a properly formatted {{copied}} template on the talk pages of the source and destination. The attribution has been provided for this situation, but if you have copied material between pages before, even if it was a long time ago, please provide attribution for that duplication. You can read more about the procedure and the reasons at Wikipedia:Copying within Wikipedia. Thank you. --Diannaa 🍁 (talk) 18:51, 27 December 2015 (UTC)

Hi, thanks for noticing and continuing to collaborate on the Evolution of the Palestinian Territories template. You reverted my changes, which ofcourse is fine. (huh, wasn't aware there was a rule blocking new users from editing Palestinian articles)

If you thought my text was biased, you are probably correct, and most certainly welcome to edit it.

However, consider leaving the edited images in, for these reasons: A) There's a noticeable twenty-six year gap (from 1967 to 1993) in the series of images. My maps fill that gap accurately. B) The current "1948–67 (Actual)" map is actually inaccurate, because it implies the land was under Palestinian control during that time period. It wasn't: the land was under Egyptian and Jordanian control. By using the same color (green) it accidentally misleads readers to think that the Palestinians had control of the land prior to 1967, when really it was controlled by Egypt and Jordan. C) The final image "1993–Present" actually is inaccurate. From 2006 to the present, the Palestinian Authority has not control the Gaza strip. It is actually administered by Hamas. This continues despite attempts at forming a unity government between the PA and Hamas. Again, using separate colors would make this clear.

Are you using the green color to represent what ethnicity happens to live in that area, or are you using it to indicate who has control? In either case, the current maps are historically inaccurate. — Preceding unsigned comment added by ComServant (talkcontribs) 20:21, 31 December 2015 (UTC)

'Evolution of the Palestinian Territories' maps[edit]

Moved to Template_talk:Palestinian_territory_development#Recent_edits. Oncenawhile (talk) 20:58, 31 December 2015 (UTC)

Here's a cartoon[edit]

Here's a cartoon that's relevant to your interests: http://wondermark.com/c/2014-09-19-1062sea.png AllGloryToTheHypnotoad (talk) 22:31, 31 December 2015 (UTC)

Administrator's Noticeboard[edit]

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Curious[edit]

Where did you find that newspaper section? Makeandtoss (talk) 01:56, 23 January 2016 (UTC)

It looks like some one insanely good library, mind sharing? Makeandtoss (talk) 02:01, 23 January 2016 (UTC)
Why, cant u send it here? --Makeandtoss (talk) 13:51, 23 January 2016 (UTC)
can't view it. Anyway, if you find anything related to Falastin. Kindly send it to me Makeandtoss (talk) 15:03, 23 January 2016 (UTC)
Isn't that book that you emailed me...? Makeandtoss (talk) 18:08, 23 January 2016 (UTC)
Lol why did you resend it? I can't view the book's content anyway Makeandtoss (talk) 14:17, 24 January 2016 (UTC)
Haha thanks anyway Makeandtoss (talk) 16:14, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

υπερ της Παλαιστινης in Pausanias means "above Palestine" (i.e. in the hills behind the coastal plain)[edit]

Whatever -- about the time that you were setting up your big showdown, I was becoming less interested in spending time on Wikipedia in general, and you can't be blamed for that. However, the material you left on my user talk page at that time was basically worthless, and -- in combination with your ignorance of ancient Greek -- it strongly inclined me to disbelieve that devoting time to the other parts of your showdown would be worthwhile in any way. AnonMoos (talk) 07:35, 27 January 2016 (UTC)

DNA article[edit]

When I read that DNA study article, I was completely convinced. It's quite a game changer... But since you mentioned controversy, which wasn't mentioned in the article, adding the criticism to the article will be great. Would you mind adding/pointing out to sources mentioning the controversy? Thanks Makeandtoss (talk) 02:48, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

To be quite honest, I only read 60% of article. I stopped because it was getting too much detailed and confusing... And probably anyone who is interested like me, would read the same portion, thus being convinced on something that is controversial. Makeandtoss (talk) 23:26, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

Article name[edit]

Don't you think it should be called "Nineteenth century travelogues of Palestine" or "Travelogues of Palestine in the 19th century" or something? That way it would be possible to name articles for other time periods in a consistent fashion. Zerotalk 13:46, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

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Sources[edit]

Hello, may I ask where you got access to this from? ~ Elias Z. (talkallam) 12:02, 4 February 2016 (UTC)

I so envy you! I have nothing in mind right now, thanks for your offer and for your wonderful edits. ~ Elias Z. (talkallam) 12:09, 4 February 2016 (UTC)

Hello! There is a DR/N request you may have interest in.[edit]

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Your GA nomination of Balfour Declaration[edit]

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March 2016[edit]

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DYK nomination of The Future of Palestine[edit]

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Biblical Philistia[edit]

Hey thanks for calling shenanigans on my Goliath-like edits to the Philistine article. From my research this morning, our witnesses to the pre-Hasmonean book of Reigns (1 Sam - 2 Kings) and DtrH generally are too poor to conclude that DtrH intended "Philistines" as such as the antagonists to Dan and Judah. Hope I didn't come off like a jerk. --Zimriel (talk) 18:15, 11 March 2016 (UTC)

Hi Zimriel, thanks and certainly you didn't come across in any negative way. It's a very healthy discussion and I hope we can make even more progress there. Oncenawhile (talk) 22:48, 11 March 2016 (UTC)

DYK for The Future of Palestine[edit]

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Category:Semitic peoples[edit]

I closed the old discussion as No consensus, but feel free to re-nominate this category, as one of the involved editors removed the CFD tag again from the page (after you had already reinstated it once). – Fayenatic London 12:11, 5 April 2016 (UTC)

Copying within Wikipedia requires proper attribution[edit]

Information icon Thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia. It appears that you copied or moved text from Al-Aqsa Mosque into Minarets of the Temple Mount. While you are welcome to re-use Wikipedia's content, here or elsewhere, Wikipedia's licensing does require that you provide attribution to the original contributor(s). When copying within Wikipedia, this is supplied at minimum in an edit summary at the page into which you've copied content. It is good practice, especially if copying is extensive, to also place a properly formatted {{copied}} template on the talk pages of the source and destination. The attribution has been provided for this situation, but if you have copied material between pages before, even if it was a long time ago, please provide attribution for that duplication. You can read more about the procedure and the reasons at Wikipedia:Copying within Wikipedia. Thank you. This is the second time I have had to notify you of this legal requirement. Please have a look at this edit summary and the templates I added to the two talk pages if you are unsure what to do. Please let me know of you have any questions. Thanks, — Diannaa (talk) 01:27, 8 April 2016 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Balfour Declaration[edit]

The article Balfour Declaration you nominated as a good article has passed Symbol support vote.svg; see Talk:Balfour Declaration for comments about the article. Well done! If the article has not already been on the main page as an "In the news" or "Did you know" item, you can nominate it to appear in Did you know. Message delivered by Legobot, on behalf of Royroydeb -- Royroydeb (talk) 04:01, 16 April 2016 (UTC)

FAs[edit]

Hi, thanks for the vote of confidence, but I'm afraid I don't have experience either in improving WP:Israel articles or in FAs. The only time I tried to apply for an FA, I got a string of comments and suggestions for improvement that I simply didn't have the time to pursue. I also had the same experience with my handful of GAs, though I found that if everything's sourced and the sources are all working, it generally passes after only one set of questions from the reviewer. Perhaps you could ask another editor who is more familiar with FAs. Good luck! Yoninah (talk) 20:47, 16 April 2016 (UTC)

DYK[edit]

Symbol question.svg Hello! Your submission of Balfour Declaration at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and some issues with it may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! North America1000 03:39, 17 April 2016 (UTC)

Turns out the submission is not usable, because the page has appeared as a bold linked article in the "On This Day" section of Main page. Sorry. North America1000 22:40, 18 April 2016 (UTC)

Help[edit]

Hi Oncenawhile, can you please give your opinion on the censorship issue on Talk:Yisrael Katz (politician born 1955)? 2A02:C7D:3FDE:D400:34AC:583A:B24A:5AF3 (talk) 15:18, 24 April 2016 (UTC)

ANI[edit]

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Semitic people[edit]

The situation at Semitic people is out of control and users like Cathry are rewriting it because they don't like that it's a racialist term. I don't know what to do about it, she keeps reverting back and is following my edits on other pages to change them when I change "Semitic people" to "Semitic-speaking people". It's very frustrating, people just yell SCIENTISTS USE IT when in fact scientists most explicitly do not. Ogress 18:03, 26 April 2016 (UTC)

May 2016[edit]

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Stop and think[edit]

What the hell are you doing?!?! Do you seriously think sanctions of a jew-related topic are justified because a fringe scholar accused his detractors of being zionist stooges? --Monochrome_Monitor 08:08, 2 May 2016 (UTC)

Your own edit comment said it was a battleground. Oncenawhile (talk) 08:10, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
I said YOU were politicizing it. Dear god! It is a nuetral topic about a language WHICH YOU ARE POLITICIZING by inserting all manner of fringe bullshit alleging zionist coverups by mainstream linguists. Did you not read the talk page??! And stop abusing wikipedia policy. Adding a template to a talk page is not a comment, it's an edit which can be reverted. --Monochrome_Monitor 08:19, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
You're looking a lot like a bully now. It's one thing to do this with Arab/Israeli topics but this is a Jewish topic with no relation whatsoever to the arab-israeli conflict.--Monochrome_Monitor 08:23, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
10 days after an AE you come and make the same bulk reversion without any discussion on an article. Then you remove my talk page edit comments twice. Then you come to my user page to make further aggressive comments.
"Bullying" "is the use of force, threat, or coercion to abuse, intimidate, or aggressively dominate others".
Please stop it.
Oncenawhile (talk) 08:32, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
Use of force, threat or coercion... oh, that's exactly what you did when you started that vexatious AE. --Monochrome_Monitor 22:49, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
By your reasoning we should put the Bible under Arab-Israeli sanctions. It is highly controversial and very pro-Israel after all. --Monochrome_Monitor 08:28, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
Nope. Just consider why you dislike Wexler so much, and you will realize that your behaviour is driven by exactly what these sanctions are here to stop. Oncenawhile (talk) 08:32, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
Bullshit. I don't want him IN THE LEAD because of WP:LEAD. He's WP:FRINGE and doesn't belong in the lead, it's that simple. And the reason I don't like him is because I think he's a jackass for his stupid "pretend to be some guy who isn't paul wexler and give other yiddishists bad reviews and then deny you did exactly that". Why do YOU want it to be included? Because of YOUR bias alleging zionist conspiracies against wikipedia. I'm the one who's nuetral on this and following mainstream thought.--Monochrome_Monitor 09:08, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
@Irondome: @Nishidani: I don't know how to respond to this kind of behaviour - any advice would be appreciated.
MM, the edit you made did not amend the lead. Nor is Wexler mentioned in the lead. I don't know what you are talking about.
Oncenawhile (talk) 11:19, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
What article are we talking about? Please can someone clarify? What the hell is going on basically? Irondome (talk) 12:43, 2 May 2016 (UTC)

he's a jackass for his stupid "pretend to be some guy who isn't paul wexler and give other yiddishists bad reviews and then deny you did exactly that".

Translation. Paul Wexler is rumoured to have written under a pseudonym a scorching criticism of other Yiddish scholars in 1988, and denied he was its author. Therefore, MM will eliminate him from Wikipedia. It's a variant of the games almost everyone plays: don't examine anyone's reasoning. If you dislike his or her conclusions, just dig up some dirt, and throw it their way to discredit them. It's the polemicist's version of original sin: if you make just one slip in your life, you are forever damned and the Erinyi of vendetta will hound you to the last. The Italian journalist,Giorgio Bocca, a writer of great insight, once wrote a piece critical of Israel's prospects after 1967, when it came into possession of the West Bank. Some months afterwards, he gave a talk, and a woman stood up and waved a photocopy of a paraphrase of the Protcols of Zion he provided as a tyro journalist when he was 19, for a fascist newspaper in 1939. He didn't know it was a forgery, having been raised in the closed totalitarian state that was Fascist Italy: he had in the war been close to the Jews of Cuneo, had fought in the resistance, was a friend of people like Primo Levi and Arnaldo Momigliano. For years afterwards, the woman from the Centre of Jewish Documentation turned up at his press conferences, dogging his heels, waving her photocopy, the message being 'you were an anti-Semite and you are totally unreliable for anything you might say of the world, or Israel's occupation.' Most of his Jewish friends rightly thought:'Well, you did write that once', but didn't let this juvenile stain affect their relationship or influence the way they interpreted his journalism, which was lucid, trenchant, acutely informed, libertarian until his dying day. MM, what you are doing with Wexler, is what la signora Ravenna did with Bocca. You have a right to do that, but no one remembers her: a nation of readers still feels indebted to Bocca's work.Nishidani (talk) 16:25, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
I don't think Wexler's theories on relexification are persuasive, simply because he has persuaded very few Yiddish scholars of their validity. In this I therefore agree with MM. I disagree with here, and with numerous other editors who get upset, revert Wexler out, and shout 'fringe!,' for the simple reason that Wexler's theories are still thought important enough to be regularly mentioned in the standard literature on Yiddish. Scholars don't regularly rebut fringe theories in their area: they kill them by silence, or pithy dismissals. There are 3 main models for the Ashkenazi and Yiddish. The Rhineland model dominated, until the Bavarian-Czech model emerged, together with Wexler's eastern hypothesis. Now Weinrich has been notably redimensioned. Eastern Yiddish has strong connections to languages in Czech lands, according to Alexander Beider, for example.
What follows smacks of condescension, but it needs saying nonetheless. I'm very tolerant of MM because of her passion for knowledge. I am harsh because of her intellectually parlous (for her, not the world) tendency to think she has the answer to everything. We live in a slipshod world of handy simplifications, and time and again, she is prepossessed by a sense of hermeneutic mission to the plebeian reader to set things straight which means, practically, ironing out the dissonance in our sources or knowledge in order to corroborate a specious 'commonsensical' narrative. It is one of the aspects of the Zionist/Israeli political blowback on diasporic Jewish discourse, always open to second thoughts, dialectical sophistication, and complexity, that disturbs me most. At her age, I specialized in very obscure fields, and in my MA wrote a history of the topic from 1896 onwards, and of 75 books and articles in several languages, I discovered that only 3 showed signs of creative thinking - this in a rarified academic world. The rest was all paste and copy or extrapolation from the few masters, applying their results, as assumptions, to areas by analogy. This has stayed with me. Get out of the ivory tower, and presentation of complexity to the public evaporates: it is all black and white, this or that, antipathy or glowing endorsement. Life, and history, as opposed to the political spin on events, is simply not like that. MM doesn't understand this. If, say, anti-Semitism is an index of a zero grade of self-knowledge, in that no enmity can presume to justify itself by smearing an unknown (all racists refuse to recognize the 'other' as part mirrors of themselves), the obverse is also true: anyone badgering a topic to prove an a priori that is irremovable will have a half a life of credibility as short as the decay rate of Hydrogen-7.
In sum, Wexler is not fringe, but a significant if minor voice in Yiddish studies, and in so far as a lead summarizes the article content, if the section on him provides a fair perspective on his position within the field, then this must be anticipated by a line or two in the lead. If the section is lacking,-I haven't looked recently - then it should be built up first, and then the lead adjusted to take note of it.Nishidani (talk) 13:08, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
First off, reliable sources call him fringe. It's not just his theory on yiddish but in all jewish languages and in jewish studies in general. Or do you think the notion that "the Jewish people doesn't exist" is a minor but significant view rather than a fringe one? I'm not being accusative, I generally wonder. Just to be clear, I don't usually speak this way to editors, with "what the hells" and whatnot. In part I'm reacting to the rather patronizing way he spoke to me on Talk:Semitic people "I am encouraged by the research you have done. As your understanding of these facts builds, at some point it will click.. ... At some point you are going to have to accept that your understanding of all this is simply incorrect". I find it irritating that he speaks as if the purpose of our talking is to make me "see the right path". I participate in dialogue to get a consensus for a change in wikipedia, not to change the opinions of editors I disagree with. He speaks to me as if he's a psychoanalyst with the prerogative of diagnosing me with pathological zionism. 99% of the people on Talk:Modern Hebrew agreed with me, I provided their quotes as evidence in the ridiculous arbitration case against me, remember?
That brings me to why I am here right now. It's because Oncinawhile added an Arab-Israeli conflict sanctions template to Modern Hebrew,[2] even though the aforementioned arbitration found that such a classification was bullshit and thus I didn't commit the sin of 1RR. In the arbitration I also described my frustration with his tendency of adding templates against the preconditions for adding them, and when reverted, accusing detractors of committing some trespass against rules twisted to protect edits which themselves violate rules. And then encouraging them to go to the talk to work it out as if his edits are consensus or the status quo, which they aren't. When I reverted this totally illegitimate addition of a template deceptively declaring the page subject to arab-israeli conflict sanctions, he invoked a rule against editing another person's comments. I don't think I need to elaborate on why that pissed me off.

And lastly, Simon, I'm hurt by your words, but I respect them. I suppose I thought our relationship was more amicable than mere "tolerance" of one another. --Monochrome_Monitor 16:23, 2 May 2016 (UTC)

I'm always amazed when people pick one thing they like out of an article (Wexler is fringe) and ignore what the article is saying, namely Batya Ungar-Sargon's very good overview for the general reader of the state of the art in the origins of the Yiddish debate is nowhere reflected in our article on Yiddish. IF you think a source is insightful, it should orientate your approach more broadly. What Ungar-Sargon stated is that

In her article about the mysterious origins of the Yiddish language, the late Cherie Woodworth described the field’s dramatis personae as “a very small but committed cadre of scholars”—a wildly tactful understatement. One metonymic step away from the Holocaust’s devastation, the tiny field of Yiddish linguistics has ballooned in importance, becoming a place where both the past and the future of the Jewish people is battled over, one phoneme at a time, through a combination of academic and extra-academic means. Threats of legal action are par for the course. So are character assassinations, pseudonymous academic hits, accusations of lunacy, and denials of the existence of the Jewish people.It’s gotten worse over time, but it’s almost always been thus

Conclusion? Tread very very warily here, because it is a toxically contested field of study. You'd never get this impression from the 'serenity' and orthodoxy being imposed on the Yiddish language article we have. And Wexler is out. What Ungar-Sargon then does is look at Alexis Manaster Ramer, Dovid Katz, Max Weinreich, Alexander Beider and Paul Wexler and point up their vigorous disagreements. Of the last, she says:
'For when fields are weak and orthodoxies reign, a fringe tends to develop; in Yiddish linguistics, that would be Paul Wexler. - - Indeed, though he has a following amongst non-specialists, most linguists disagree with Wexler.'
Some deep scholars of Yiddish express their debt to Wexler (Neil Jacobs has acknowledged the stimulus of his ideas in his work on that language, for example). Fringe here is 'minority' and it means that within a field that had an orthodoxy which Alexander Beider admits rides on an unproven and undocumented assumption (the flow eastwards of Rhineland Jews), an orthodoxy shaken by the 'Canaanite' Bavarian-Czech theories, Wexler is on the fringe in taking the challenge one step further by arguing for an East European origin. Now most linguists would challenge his Iranian-Khazar details, but quite a few Yiddish experts would defend the idea that Eastern Yiddish has origins distinct from Western (Rhineland) Yiddish. In a fluid field, full of experts disagreeing, you should not preemptively dismiss out of hand anything, esp. since Wexler's unorthodox or 'revolutionary' paradigm is still widely discussed by his colleagues, something that doesn't happen with authentically 'fringe' theories. And secondly, your certainties about everything should take one step back and digest what Ungar-Sargon states, as the dearly departed Cheryl Woodworth did, that a rather chaotically fluid field of controversy is characteristic of that discipline. Since Yiddish experts can't agree on much of the details of their respective models, you have no right to make a call, which in any case is beyond an editor's remit here. Nishidani (talk) 17:19, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
Oncenawhile and MM. If you haven't read it, I think you would both profit by a close study of Alexander Beider , Origins of Yiddish Dialects, Oxford University Press, 2015 pp.525-567. It's a long a densely argued overview of all of the literature. He is not well-disposed to Wexler's theories, but gives a fair analysis of them in the context of the other perspectives, showing the difficulties of each, while proposing his own theory.Nishidani (talk) 17:29, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
To template a language article with ARBPIA seems incorrect. It is at the very least inflammatory. Putting aside Wexler's past, if he holds a view which is held to be a minority viewpoint by the published scholarship out there, then WP:UNDUE. Does he explicitly say "The Jewish people do not exist"? Is he being rhetorical? it would be news to about 14 million souls who have obviously living under a silly delusion. The main point is that you get stressed. It gets personal with you Georgia. Think of Wikipedia like this: Ok lets use the analogy of different justice systems around the world. In most of Europe at least, a trial is conducted as an impartial, joint search for truth by all the legal professionals involved. I think it is called the inquisitorial system. Many continental lawyers are appalled by the Anglo-American adversarial system that is employed in our courts, with rhetorical tricks etc. Think Perry Mason etc. Imagine yourself (all of you in fact) to be members of a commission, an enquiry board set up to weigh the evidence, with no preconceptions of what the final outcome may look like. You must sift and weigh evidence, some of which is distasteful to your POV but it must be weighed with the rest. If evidence is insubstantional, not widely accepted, discard. Wexler may be of this type of evidence. If Wexler is included, would you be comfortable with a form of wording which indicates this is a view which is not accepted by a significant numbers of his peers? Don't resort to the bloody boards, templating etc etc blah blah. Our personal outrage should not come into it. Wexler is not an existential threat to the Jewish people MM. But if he is included, a form of words can be fabricated which politely says, a lot of other scholars think he is talking bollocks. Simples. Irondome (talk) 17:44, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
Apropos "The Jewish people do not exist" That, in these times, looks like a particularly vicious form of denialism. Wexler is a learned man. It is a commonplace, here transferred to 'the Jews', of what many statesmen, philosophers and observers remarked on observing how the rising nation-states were making over the many distinct local populations in their territories to conform to a modern of a unified 'people', a nationality. The idea is best expressed in Massimo d'Azeglio's L'Italia è fatta. Restano da fare gli italiani,('We've engineered the unity of Italy, all that remains to be done is to manufacture Italians.' Only 6% of Italians read and wrote that language at the time of the Risorgimento, just as 90% of the Japanese had no idea who the Imperial dynasty's ancestor was in the early Meiji period, whereas, indoctrinated they learnt within a generation to behave and think and kill themselves for him after a generation). Metternich had similar views. Napoleon's first army had huge problems because Gascons, Picards, folks from Provence, Bretons etc couldn't understand each other. They had to be taught to be 'French'. Members of the Juhuro, the Rothschild family, the B'nai Moshe, or figures likeYiḥyah Qafiḥ and Albert Einstein are all Jews of course, but Eric Hobsbawm didn't write about invented traditions, among which are those of a unified sense of shared ethnicity, for nothing. I'm biased of course. I think like Wexler on this - national feelings exist, but are a very private thing, and invariably tampered with to make us prey to partisan identities that lock us in to a prejudice that favours none of us as individuals, while predisposing us to think of outgroups as threats or competitors, and invariably filching credit for the outstanding achievements of our own group which we, personally, have done nothing to earn, simply on the strength of a shared ethnicity, a bit like football fans, who see themselves in every club champion (and curse them if they fail to win).Nishidani (talk) 19:16, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
I agree with your sentiment here - it is often just blind tribalism, even in the most educated and sophiaticated of people.
I continue to feel that all wikipedia editors who work on articles relating to any "national" concepts (national identities / ethnicities, national languages, national histories, etc.) should read Hobsbawm and Anderson as a prerequisite. Learning about the reality of Imagined community and Invented tradition across all nationalities would help editors like User:Monochrome Monitor take things less personally. As children we are indoctrinated with nationalism in all its glory - a significant component of intellectual maturity in these areas is the unlearning of all that. Oncenawhile (talk) 19:58, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
I don't think nationalism is inherently bad. It's human to feel affinity for those similar to us. Nationalism can do great things, like when the Indians got free of the British Empire. Gandhi was an Indian nationalist. There is nothing wrong with "I recognize that I am X and feel affinity for X". Nationalism becomes bad when it goes "I recognize that I am X, and X > Y. Nationalism can be about fighting for the fundamental right of X to self-determination, so that X = Y, ie, the Kurds being allowed to display the Ala Rengin in Turkey and educate their children in Kurdmanji. --Monochrome_Monitor 20:16, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
@Monochrome Monitor: your comment misses the point. Learning to control one's emotions around this topic requires an introspection of the deeply held beliefs that drive such feelings. You write about "affinity for those similar to us" in relation to nationalism. You, me, Nishidani and Irondome may come from different nations and ethnicities. Given our shared interest in Wikipedia and knowledge in general, it is likely we are much more similar to one another than we are to the average person within each of our "nationalities". Your idea that people of the same "nationality" are "similar to us" is a fiction which has been deconstructed by Hobsbawm, Anderson and many others. Oncenawhile (talk) 21:40, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
In any case, I give up on MM. Her behavior, not deigning to look at the evidence, but simply staying quiet as a lamentably bad editor persistently reverted me back to her preferred versions even when I happened to have a strong evidential case that the sources were misconstrued, is manipulative, and show no independence of judgement. The sudden entry of User:Ferakp has an explanation I'd prefer not to think about. Nishidani (talk) 19:16, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
Oh fuck, Nish was the one who made the hurtful comment, sorry simon. These formatting is confusing me. (edit: apparently demonstratives confuse me too. I need a nap)--Monochrome_Monitor 19:25, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
Also, nish, I'm sorry about the lamentably bad editor. I didn't get notifications for that, the reverting to my version. There's a fair chance I would have reverted it otherwise. It saddens me that you don't trust me and think I made a sock, feel free to ask some admin person to check the IP. YES I sinned once by editing under my ip address, but it started as a mistake and then went downhill... anyway, I have learned from that clusterfuck of my own making. --Monochrome_Monitor 19:28, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
Also, about the article on yiddish. Yes, it allows deviation from the standard Weinrich model. I thought you would like that, I certainly did. I think the model is right in Yiddish being Germanic but there are lots of uknowns... are Eastern and Western yiddish different language? Where were the Romance features added to the language? What language was it, French or Italian? Was it acquired by Jews before Jews settled in Germanic lands or after? The german language itself has a fair amount of romance words, the roman empire was very influential. How did the Northwest Semitic elements get into Yiddish? Was it from Aramaic spoken by the Judeans or was it Hebrew preserved in the Mishnah? Those are all perfectly valid questions.--Monochrome_Monitor 19:44, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
And what article are you referring to exactly? --Monochrome_Monitor 19:48, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
You're right that I missed the point. Lets get back to it. You put a template on an article warning of sanctions which AE ruled don't exist, and then preposterously claimed that me reverting you was deleting your comments. That's really shitty of you.--Monochrome_Monitor 22:49, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
Forgive me for my crudeness, I just thought you were above that sort of sleaziness. I find your views and your tactics in implementing them objectionable, but I did have a level of respect for you as someone with seniority who doesn't get heated and resort to edit warring (like myself). I said you follow the letter of the law but not its spirit, but in this case you followed neither. --Monochrome_Monitor 23:02, 2 May 2016 (UTC)
With all this good advice and intellectual insight from numerous editors, you have an opportunity to grow as a human being. You may never have such an opportunity again. Still, you can respond to this with another negative or combative comment and then forget about everything that has been said to you. Or you can take the opportunity for true introspection. The first option will give you short term satisfaction, and the second will give you long term enrichment.
Good luck. Oncenawhile (talk) 23:05, 2 May 2016 (UTC)

I only disagree with Quinto Simmacho on saying Wexler is fringe as opposed to being in a decidedly minoritarian position. ‘Fringe’ is as in Edward de Vere, 17th Earl of Oxford or anyone proposing one of the gallimaufry of tomfoolery gracing the List of Shakespeare authorship candidates, or with interesting but way out speculators like Emmanuel Velikovsky. Fringe applies when an idea or thinker is dismissed for obvious nonsense, and then cut out of the discourse except as a curiosity, which is not the case for Wexler, as is it for, for example, Martin Bernal. For the simple reason, unlike Bernal, that(a) Wexler had a chair in the subject (b) is widely discussed in the relevant literature, even if his ideas are not shared to any noticeable extent (c) the subject itself is extremely technical, and very very few are competent to judge, as opposed to the hordes of editorialists and general spokesman whose remarks are basically gossip based on third hand reports (d) it tends to be forgotten that everyone of Wexler’s critics acknowledges the great richness of his primary data and the comprehensiveness of his command of all of the relevant sources (e) he is the object of hysteria in the relevant blogosphere which displays a decided anxiety about political impact or cultural fallout from just two aspects of the manifold set of arguments he has set forth in great philological details in several large books. My interest in this, contrary to the usual suspicions, is related to broader observations, about paradigmatic models and dissonance. A lot of the dissonance is muffled over time (replaced by other types of atonic dispute), but it often proves to be hermeneutically productive, and occasionally tips the scales, by altering a staid and complacent paradigm. In various areas of wiki I have consistently argued that the minority academic or technical view be noted, and handled without passion, fairly. Mostly I fail to persuade editors to do this.

  • The standard paradigm for Greek language and culture when I learnt it was the Indo-European model, and it is the correct one, but about 10-15% of the vocabulary, some of it quite crucial in Greek modes of thinking, material and institutional life, comes from a pre-Greek stratum. This fact, one reading it in B.F.C.Atkinson’s The Greek Language, Faber & Faber 1931 pp.17-26) made me from the outset open to anything that challenged the monotonous purism of the received model. The IE model influenced for centuries a tendency to think in terms of an Indo-european racial exfoliation, and this bias in the paradigm only started to suffer serious cracks when Michael Astour, a Jew whose mother was murdered by the Nazis, and his father by the Communists, and several others like Walter Burkert and Martin West, rewrote our ethnocentric map to make it into a rich tapesty of Indo-European, pre-Greek, Asiatic and Semitic cultures. The rigid ethno-linguistic model of cultural isolates broke down into one of regional cross-fertilization and cultural interpenetration. This example still has not percolated down into general reading the Tanakh, which is an extraordinary mélange of distinct cultural traditions and ethnically variegated lore, of heteroglossia, because reading is dominated by Christian and Jewish faith hermeneutics which accentuate dogmatics or the theological formation of national identity at the expense of discursive tensions still resident in an otherwise homogenizing composition.
  • Yevgeny Polivanov (murdered by the Soviet Secret police, probably because he disagreed with the Lysenko of Soviet linguistics, a fatuous idiot called Nicholas Marr) argued for an Austronesian origin for Japanese, The continental theory prevailed. In reading the history of these debates, one always has to keep in mind the geopolitics of theory: the strike north faction in prewar Japan would be disposed to an Altaic model, the strike south faction to a Polynesian model: had Japan lost on the continent and retained a Pacific empire, you could have been sure that Polivanov's theories would have been dusted off and used to give a deep cultural justification for their colonial grip on the Polynesian south. That theory in any case has minoritan status, but it is still mentioned as a serious and useful contribution to the endless history of theories of the origins of that language. No mention of him in articles on that subject in wiki.
  • When a dispute arose re the introduction of a theory that the Zhou dynasty, based on a linguistic theory, might not have been Han Chinese but rather another ethnic group, I intervened to argue that the articles (Shang Dynasty/Zhou Dynasty should register this view). Everyone focused on Scott DeLancey (the Paul Wexler of the piece), and said he was fringe. I still think they had an ideological a priori rejection of anything that might challenge the standard model and were misreading everything one might mention in arguing in favour simply of some mention of theories dissonant with the general trend. Editors have kept this material out in all articles related to this topic. Some very fine editors disagreed with me. They would say I overvalue a fringe view; I would suggest they are not sufficiently wary of the larger cultural subtexts, and bias, in all theories, and too ready to embrace a single consensus which happens to coincide with the government's own views.
  • Whenever these things are discussed in wiki, I may be wrong but I sense, a group consensus hurriedly forming to keep out the minority argument, a consensus that, particularly in the I/P area, shows no sign of sophistication and betrays severe identity anxieties. My view is that on the Wexler page, it is right that his ideas be given a comprehensive, neutral exposition primarily, then a section on his critics. Elsewhere, on the Yiddish and modern Hebrew pages, he deserves a fair mention because his heterodoxy is so frequently discussed. At the same time, the presentation should be succinct compared to the main theories. The kind of deplorable edit one sees here last night by the usual warrior, User:E.M.Gregory , is a good example of the rot and should have no place here because it uses a popular sources pitched to the linguistically illiterate by a cub reporter who doesn’t know the topic, but just phones round to get juicy smears. A large number of scholars have criticized Wexler formally, their remarks are readilyt available, and in an encyclopedic article one should paraphrase their technical criticisms, not the blabber from the blogosphere.

In other articles, like Yiddish, or modern Hebrew Wexler, having by universal acknowledgement established one of the three basic paradigms for an origins theory of Yiddish, should have that noted, very briefly, a half a sentence is enough, in the lead, and be given four or five unanxious lines in the relevant section (together with others who have held similar views). It should not per WP:Due, invade the topic. If you look at the Khazar page which I wrote, all of the controversies are dealt with briefly, though with ample sourcing, as neutrally as possible, avoiding the temptation to try to spin a verdict on the reader. I find Oncenawhile a very good close reader, MM, and I have no memory of him being, as I have been, obstreperous. MM again works very hard and is a net gain to Wikipedia. So I suggest you both let bygones be bygones,stop for a week, and then negotiate some compromise.Nishidani (talk) 13:14, 4 May 2016 (UTC)

Nominated for deletion[edit]

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Copyright problem: Template:Palestinian territory development[edit]

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DYK nomination of Jisr Jindas and Yibna Bridge[edit]

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Jisr al Majami[edit]

Hi, I´m collecting sources on Jisr al Majami and Jisr al Sidd, please feel free to add anything to User:Huldra/Jisr al Majami.

There is a problem, as I believe that quite a lot of the pictures marked Jisr al Majami on commons, actually show some other bridge; I presume it is the nearby (now destroyed) Jisr al Sidd. Jisr al Sidd is described by Petersen, 2001, p. 189, as "This structure was described in the unpublished notes of the Survey of Western Palestine as a: 'ruined bridge of five arches over the Jordan; [with] pointed arches [and] Saracenic masonry'", which looks like this, or this. But then, which is the railway line, also crossing there? Any thoughts? Huldra (talk) 22:57, 18 May 2016 (UTC)

Hi @Huldra: I took a look on google street view. The newer looking railway bridge with the five round arches is still in existance and looks exactly like this [3].
I can't see [4] this one anywhere though (ie the one with the middle pointed arch).
Oncenawhile (talk) 23:21, 19 May 2016 (UTC)
Actually i'm wrong - I found them both! I will post the link. Oncenawhile (talk) 23:23, 19 May 2016 (UTC)
Well, the oldest was still standing in 2010, according to this commons-pic., and the same with the newer bridge. The question is, where this is? Huldra (talk) 23:28, 19 May 2016 (UTC)
Hi @Huldra: here is the link: [5]
Google maps is amazing, really.
I think your last link is a different bridge altogether. Oncenawhile (talk) 23:30, 19 May 2016 (UTC)
Excellent! And yes, I also think that the last link is to a different bridge, although it is named Jisr al Manami. I wonder if it is the (now destroyed) Jisr al Sidd? Huldra (talk) 23:34, 19 May 2016 (UTC)

Israel[edit]

Hello, Oncenawhile. I only now saw your reply to my opinion regarding the redirect of Israel Palestine conflict. You wrote: 'but there was an "Israel" in the minds of the Zionists. From also day one there was a push to change the name of Palestine to Eretz Israel.' I would reply to that, that 1. the "Israel" in the minds of Zionists is not an official name that we can use on Wikipedia and find neutral and reliable sources about. 2. "Eretz Israel" is not the same as "Israel". Which is why we have two different articles for them on Wikipedia. Debresser (talk) 18:58, 19 May 2016 (UTC) Hi @Debresser: understood and agreed that's technically right. I am simply trying to explain why scholars are comfortable using the term Israel to apply to the whole conflict. I think we as a community are "not seeing the wood for the trees" on this specific issue under debate, getting lost in minute technicalities to the detriment of clarity. Oncenawhile (talk) 22:59, 19 May 2016 (UTC)

DYK for Yibna Bridge[edit]

Updated DYK query.svg On 20 May 2016, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Yibna Bridge, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that Mamluk Sultan Baibars built two bridges near the towns of Jindas and Yibna in the outskirts of Ramla, which have survived more than seven centuries? You are welcome to check how many page hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, Yibna Bridge), and it may be added to the statistics page if the total is over 5,000. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 12:02, 20 May 2016 (UTC)

Hello! There is a DR/N request you may have interest in.[edit]

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Reference errors on 26 May[edit]

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Hello! There is a DR/N request you may have interest in.[edit]

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Just letting you know that per the DR/N you're expected to produce a draft for the section. There's a 48 hour window to respond, otherwise the moderator will close the DR/N. Since you're interested in collaborating through the DR/N, I'm hoping you'll submit your draft before it closes. Drsmoo (talk) 22:05, 11 June 2016 (UTC)

Hi[edit]

I noticed that you uploaded this picture. I wonder if you ever came across similar pics that show urban settlement in Jordan before 1950s like this one? Or the question of where I can find ones? I searched the congress library with no luck. Makeandtoss (talk) 13:02, 30 May 2016 (UTC)

Mausoleum of Abu Huraira listed at Redirects for discussion[edit]

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Your GA nomination of Sea Peoples[edit]

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Your GA nomination of Sea Peoples[edit]

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Reference errors on 8 July[edit]

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Disambiguation link notification for July 9[edit]

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A polite request![edit]

I don't know if the Bronze Age is a particular interest of yours, but I have off and on been trying to improve the article at Kussara. It's an interesting topic, and while I think I've improved the page, there's a very long way to go yet. If you feel like having a look, I'd appreciate it. Thank you! Dumuzid (talk) 20:11, 20 July 2016 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Sea Peoples[edit]

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Copying within Wikipedia requires proper attribution[edit]

Information icon Thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia. It appears that you copied or moved text from Battle of Kadesh into Kadesh inscriptions. While you are welcome to re-use Wikipedia's content, here or elsewhere, Wikipedia's licensing does require that you provide attribution to the original contributor(s). When copying within Wikipedia, this is supplied at minimum in an edit summary at the page into which you've copied content. It is good practice, especially if copying is extensive, to also place a properly formatted {{copied}} template on the talk pages of the source and destination. The attribution has been provided for this situation, but if you have copied material between pages before, even if it was a long time ago, please provide attribution for that duplication. You can read more about the procedure and the reasons at Wikipedia:Copying within Wikipedia. Thank you. If you are the sole author of the prose that was moved, attribution is not required. — Diannaa (talk) 16:36, 13 August 2016 (UTC)

DYK for Kadesh inscriptions[edit]

Updated DYK query.svg On 19 August 2016, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Kadesh inscriptions, which you recently created, substantially expanded, or brought to good article status. The fact was ... that the 1275 BC Battle of Kadesh (relief of Ramses II in battle, pictured) is one of the best documented battles in ancient history due to the multiple Kadesh inscriptions? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Kadesh inscriptions. You are welcome to check how many page hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, Kadesh inscriptions), and it may be added to the statistics page if the total is over 5,000. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.

— Maile (talk) 00:01, 19 August 2016 (UTC)

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Cust[edit]

Hi, I did not find a publication of Cust's report until 1968 (by the Israel State Archives, see WorldCat). The original is marked "Confidential" so probably wasn't published at the time. According to the rules of UK crown copyright that makes it free in 2018. If you can find a publication before 1966, that would make it free now. I have the original on microfilm but published later. Zerotalk 03:39, 28 August 2016 (UTC)

Hi Zero0000, I am confident it is out of copyright. The only unclear question is whether it was created by the UK Government or the Palestine Government (which Israel's copyright law inherits):
  • [6] and [7] it was published by HMSO in 1929. In this case it would be out of copyright under UK Crown Copyright (50 years post publication)
  • Publication by the Israeli State Archives as you suggest, and later by Ariel Publishing House in Jerusalem, suggests the Palestine Government. Israel's copyright law of 2007, which applies to Mandate documents states "Copyright in a work in which the State is the first owner of the copyright in accordance with the provisions of Chapter 5 shall last for a period of 50 years from the date of its making", in which case the it would also be out of copyright (50 years post creation)
Oncenawhile (talk) 10:13, 28 August 2016 (UTC)

Hi, the citations you found only say that it was printed in 1929, not that it was published then. Actually it was only printed for internal government use. (I read that somewhere; can't find it now.) To confirm that, I looked quite hard for the original in libraries, but I don't think it exists, even in the British Library or the National Library of Israel. However, it says "printed for the Government of Palestine" so you are on solid ground with that argument. Zerotalk 12:02, 28 August 2016 (UTC)

Balfour Declaration[edit]

Yes! Very interesting subject. What sources will you use? FunkMonk (talk) 16:32, 3 September 2016 (UTC)

Don't know if you saw it, I replied on my own talk page, we can just continue the discussion there, or do you prefer the peer review page? FunkMonk (talk) 17:26, 3 September 2016 (UTC)