User talk:Pointillist/Archive 2008

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Happy to help. :) faithless (speak) 12:20, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

Asher assessment

Just FYI: The default importance for biographies of people in medicine is Low. The class could be either B or Start, depending on how complete it is. (Without actually reading it, I'd personally rate it as Start class based on length, with the option of an upgrade on detailed consideration.) Since you've suggested that JFW consider that issue, then I'll let him make that choice. Please leave a note on my talk page if you get no other response during the next week. BTW, if what you actually want is something more like a POV check, then you might post a general note on the project's talk page. I don't know how many people watch the assessment subpage. WhatamIdoing (talk) 00:34, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

  • Thanks for the feedback. Basically I agree but I've been surprised by how often his name crops up in recent publications, which is why I thought perhaps JFW's perspective would be useful - after you've spent a lot of time assembling citations you need a fresh view of their value. Perhaps the real importance lies is the ideas Asher articulated and his sceptical attitude, rather than who he was biographically. He's a bit like Lord Denning - biographically not very interesting except for his effect on assumptions/attitudes in his profession. In the longer term, Asher's enduring ideas would be articles in their own right and his biography would be proportionally reduced. Short term, at least the article acts as a placeholder for a lot of citations that could be useful elsewhere and have not hitherto been correctly referenced. Pointillist (talk) 01:04, 23 March 2008 (UTC)
Hmmm... just discovered that there is an established article on Bed_rest. I'll look at it properly tomorrow - Pointillist (talk) 01:17, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

WhatamIdoing, just to say that JFW has very kindly assessed (and improved) this article. Pointillist (talk) 01:24, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the note. JFW is a great editor. I'll take your user page off my watch list. WhatamIdoing (talk) 06:30, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Championship Course/Boat Race maps

The maps are absolutely great and my only question is whether my tables of landmarks are now needed - they look clumsy compared with your elegant maps - the region labels are fine - they don't clutter the maps at all. Well done, and thanks. Sorry I don't have any pictures of the start or know anyone who might. TrulyBlue (talk) 11:49, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

  • I've replied on your talk page Pointillist (talk) 17:07, 7 April 2008 (UTC)
I got the co-ordinates by browsing google maps and clicking on the relevant places. However, visually the co-ordinates look bad in the tables, and clickable links would be better even if they are no very wiki-style. Walking the course for photos would be above and beyond the call of duty. Best, of course, would be to have pictures of the landmarks with racing (or at least some rowing for the Championship Course wiki) in the foreground: a simple picture of Craven Cottage from across the river wouldn't add very much, I think. TrulyBlue (talk) 21:01, 7 April 2008 (UTC)
  • I was thinking of really tiny thumbnails (like the mockup below) so readers recognise the landmarks when they watch the race live or on TV. It was just an idea to make your useful table more inviting. Pointillist (talk) 17:41, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
Landmark Coordinates Comments
Westminster School Boat Club early morning.jpg
Exterior KCS Boat House.jpg
Oxford boats from Westminster School Boat Club (left), and Cambridge from King's College School Boat Club (right). Both clubs are near the Start, just downstream of the Black Buoy.
The Start by Putney Bridge
51°28′02″N 0°12′50″W / 51.467319°N 0.213756°W / 51.467319; -0.213756 (Boat Race start)
Boat Race Start stone.jpg
Boat Race start section.jpg
The University Stone lies on the south bank. The winner of the toss chooses their station (the Surrey station has won 10 out of the last 15 races).[1] In the straight section after the start the Middlesex crew tries to hold the fastest water on the centre line of the river.
The Black Buoy
51°28′16″N 0°13′16″W / 51.471211°N 0.221132°W / 51.471211; -0.221132 (The Black Buoy)
Boat Race Black Buoy.jpg
Roughly marks the end of the Putney Boat Houses. Apparently the Black Buoy has now been painted yellow to avoid collisions (needs verification).
Fulham Football Club
51°28′30″N 0°13′18″W / 51.474895°N 0.221655°W / 51.474895; -0.221655 (Fulham Football Club)
Boat Race Craven Cottage.jpg
'Craven Cottage': crews stay wide (preferring the Surrey bank) round the bend as the area in front of the football ground (known as 'the Fulham flats') is shallow, with slack water.[2].
The Mile Post
51°28′43″N 0°13′37″W / 51.47852°N 0.226987°W / 51.47852; -0.226987 (The Mile Post)
Boat Race 1st Milestone and bust.jpg
Marked by a bust of Steve Fairbairn. A traditional timing point in the Boat Race. The Middlesex bank water continues to be shallow and slack all the way to Hammersmith Bridge.[2]
The Crabtree
51°28′55″N 0°13′25″W / 51.482041°N 0.223482°W / 51.482041; -0.223482 (The Crabtree)
Boat Race Crabtree Reach.jpg
This section is called the "Crabtree Reach" after the Crabtree Tavern pub on the Middlesex bank (just to the right of the camera).
Harrods Furniture Depository
51°29′05″N 0°13′41″W / 51.484633°N 0.227956°W / 51.484633; -0.227956 (Harrods' Furniture Repository)
Boat Race Harrod's Depositary.jpg
Previously the warehouse for the famous shop, now apartments. For the next 8-9 minutes the bend will be in Surrey's favour. The deep water channel now lies close to the Surrey bank.[2]
Hammersmith Bridge
51°29′17″N 0°13′50″W / 51.488129°N 0.230536°W / 51.488129; -0.230536 (Hammersmith Bridge)
Boat Race Hammersmith Bridge.jpg
Coxes aim for the second lamp-post from the left which marks the deepest part of the river and therefore the fastest line. 80%-85% of boats ahead at Hammersmith Bridge have won, though only 50% in the last 6 years.[1] The turning point comes once the crews are under Hammersmith Bridge.
St Paul's School
51°29′20″N 0°14′09″W / 51.488983°N 0.235855°W / 51.488983; -0.235855 (St Paul's School)
Boat Race St Paul's.jpg
1.80 miles have been rowed and the direction and perhaps the wind and water conditions are about to change. The next 3-4 minutes are Surrey's last major opportunity to kill the Middlesex crew off.[1]
Chiswick Eyot ("eight")
51°29′15″N 0°14′45″W / 51.487596°N 0.245814°W / 51.487596; -0.245814 (Chiswick Eyot)
Chiswick Eyot.jpg
An uninhabited river island. The river is straight again, and the deepest water is half-way between the Eyot and the Surrey bank.[2]
Fuller's Brewery
51°29′14″N 0°15′01″W / 51.487182°N 0.250411°W / 51.487182; -0.250411 (Chiswick Eyot)
Boat Race Fullers Brewery.jpg
Just visible to crews, behind the eyot. The most exposed section of the course with the risk of wind problems.[1]
Chiswick Pier
51°28′57″N 0°15′03″W / 51.482452°N 0.250937°W / 51.482452; -0.250937 (Chiswick Pier)
Boat Race Chiswick Pier.jpg
2.87 miles have been rowed. If there are wind problems the inside of the Middlesex bend may offer calmer water.[1]
The Crossing
51°28′44″N 0°15′02″W / 51.47879°N 0.250583°W / 51.47879; -0.250583 (The Crossing) Marks the end of the long Surrey bend. The deep water channel is in the centre of the river.[2]
The Bandstand
51°28′36″N 0°15′08″W / 51.476572°N 0.252149°W / 51.476572; -0.252149 (The Bandstand)
Boat Race Bandstand.jpg
The deep water channel lies close to the Middlesex bank at this point, and water near the Surrey bank is shallow.[2]
Barnes Railway Bridge
51°28′22″N 0°15′14″W / 51.472736°N 0.253758°W / 51.472736; -0.253758 (Barnes Railway Bridge)
Boat Race Barnes Railway Bridge centre span.jpg
Crews must pass through the centre arch. 95% of boats leading here have won. Only one boat has won since 1945 when trailing at Barnes Bridge: Oxford came from behind this late in 2002. The Barnes Bridge corner is very tight: if both crews are level this is a real test for the coxes.[1]
Stag Brewery
51°28′14″N 0°15′59″W / 51.470474°N 0.266376°W / 51.470474; -0.266376 (Stag Brewery)
Boat Race Mortlake Brewery.jpg
3.94 miles have been rowed. Previously a Watneys brewery, now producing Budweiser beer.
The Finish by Chiswick Bridge
51°28′22″N 0°16′05″W / 51.472861°N 0.268151°W / 51.472861; -0.268151 (The Boat Race Finish)
Boat Race Finish posts.jpg
Boat Race Finish post 800x533.jpg
The finish, just before Chiswick Bridge is marked by a stone on the south bank and a post on the north bank.
  1. ^ a b c d e f Craig Doyle, James Cracknell, Wayne Pommen, Tim Foster, Barney Williams, Peter Drury (2008-03-29). The Boat Race 2008. ITV Sport. 
  2. ^ a b c d e f "Rowing Chart" (pdf). Rowing on the Tideway. Port of London Authority. 2006-09-06. Retrieved 2008-04-12. 
Wow, yes, that would be great - also reducing the font size for the co-ords is a definite plus. I don't know who has collected the various stats of number of times the leader at Barnes has been overtaken etc - Geoffrey Page's book is probably definitive up to about 20 years ago. Be bold and make the changes! By the way, have you any references for your slur on St Paul's? TrulyBlue (talk) 08:58, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
  • TrulyBlue, I have added some images (still more to do) and expanded comments using the 2008 commentary and PLA Course Map. Can you do a sense-check before I move this to The Boat Race? Thanks - Pointillist (talk) 01:09, 13 April 2008 (UTC)
  • That all looks good to me, though the picture for the Crabtree shows Hammersmith Bridge and Harrods, but not the Crabtree itself - maybe the "landmark" entry should change to 'Crabtree Reach'? I'm guessing that the picture was taken from opposite the Mile Post - the caption could reflect that? The black bouy used to be a huge black barrel, lying horizontal in the water - that yellow peril seems to be in the right place, though this is what I remember it to be. Can't find any reference to it bein replaced or painted, so I'm at a loss, too. The famous lamp post is the second from the left after the tower - there are others between the tower and the bank, though this should be fairly obvious to any viewer. Great work, go for it! TrulyBlue (talk) 13:29, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
  • Thanks - can you take one last look now please, including the text?
    • I guess the black buoy should be just downstream from that yellow thing that I had, and I think it is the yellow and black one I have now pictured (badly - I'll get a better one sometime - from Bishop's Park it does really look like a barrel).
    • I've changed the Crabtree Reach shot again: the actual pub is a stone's throw to the right of the picture but it is hidden behind trees that are now in leaf - I'll have to get a better shot next winter, but in the meantime the Crabtree is still the landmark even though it is not pictured. My very first Crabtree Reach shot included the pub but it was at low water and very grey (got drenched on Saturday).
    • The updated Hammersmith Bridge shot has a marker to show the lamppost. That's the right one, isn't it?
    • The Surrey crossing and the brewery are still to do (could be a challenge: lots of foliage on the Barnes/Harrodian stretch as I recall). Other images I'll improve when I next walk this way.
  • If you OK this then I'll copy it into The Boat Race. Hmmm "TrulyBlue", "True Blue"... so were you in Isis 1987? Pointillist (talk) 16:04, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
  • You are doing a great job with all these pictures - here and elsewhere Regards Motmit (talk) 16:09, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
  • Motmit, thanks for that (and for improving the Chiswick Eyot layout) - much appreciated. Doing the Luas layout and the Boat Race thumbnails has given me some ideas about image handling in Wikipedia: do we need a "micro gallery" template instead of having so many pictures down the right-hand side (e.g. in Thames Tideway it's getting hard to match the images to the text); and would it be helpful if editors could upload a (sharper and more contrasty) image for thumbnail purposes (e.g. for the Boat Race landmark table the images have to be much crisper). I might try to get you involved in this discussion some day if you are interested. - Pointillist (talk) 22:56, 14 April 2008 (UTC)
  • This is all looking good. Yes, that's the right lamp post, and that appears to be the black buoy in a new guise. As someone with a little knowledge of the course (yes, Isis in 87 plus a few HoRRs etc) I never did manage to work out where the Crabtree is - you tend to be right on the other side at that point, miles away (physically and mentally). I'd suggest the wording for Fulham is not quite accurate - yes, conventional wisdom is that the crew on Middlesex gets about 1/3 length advantage from the bend, but they should be ahead only if they're fast enough, if you see what I mean. The crossing is not very photogenic - no landmark per se, other than the poplars on Middlesex, and I don't think that every point necessarily needs a picture: after all I just cobbled together a list of points from my distant memory, and the Chiswick Steps mark a timing point but aren't mentioned (opposite Chiswick Eyot, I think). Time to put this live and see if there's reaction? TrulyBlue (talk) 10:22, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
  • Done - it is live on The Boat Race now (without should be ahead). Thanks for the feedback: a pleasure working with you. - Pointillist (talk) 13:07, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
Barnstar-camera.png The Photographer's Barnstar
For your footwork, shutter-work and keyboard-work on The Boat Race and The Championship Course, You deserve great credit. Thank you. TrulyBlue (talk) 11:09, 16 April 2008 (UTC)


Thanks - On Tideway, I felt it needed illustrating and tried to select appropriate examples by section. If I had had your lifeboat, I wouldn't have bothered with the police boat so that would have avoided the section overflow there. The straight line down the right hand side is now a bit awesome, but for the river sections there is a natural sequence of views along the river. I don't really like galleries they seem too easy to ignore. Other editors don't like having the image size set so they have to be at thumb or they will get changed. As for crispness, there is a problem that people on the featured picture exercise don't care about the thumb, expecting people to enlarge what may be quite fuzzy thumbs - which is one of the reasons I take an interest in this from an Enc' point of view. The Tideway article is in an interesting position. It prevents the River Thames article from being too London oriented. The down stream sections have sub articles, but there are no sub articles for the inner and outer London sections so at the moment it has to do all the work for them as well. Regards Motmit (talk) 10:39, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Sort of related - you may be interested in the "upright" tag which I included in the William Hogarth article following your lead. Regards Motmit (talk) 20:50, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
  • I'm trying to get my head around the "upright" effect - I see what you mean in William Hogarth, and it did just the right thing for Francis Bacon's birthplace. More on this soon - Pointillist (talk) 21:50, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
  • It seems to set the base of a portrait to the equivalent size as the side of a landscape image, giving them an equivalent area for the same dimensions. I did Hogarth as an example, so if you don't like it, do change it back. BTW I would like to move your ARA plaque to the logo in the info box if that's OK. Regards Motmit (talk) 11:52, 21 April 2008 (UTC)
  • In my tests (see User:Pointillist/lightbox) adding "upright" to an image seems to reduce the thumbnail width by approx 76%, rounded to the nearest multiple of 10.
Preferred width If upright Ratio
180 140 77.77%
200 150 75.00%
250 190 76.00%
300 230 76.67%
So if a page contains uploaded images whose sides have lengths in the ratio 180:140, and the user has thumbnails set to 180 pixels, then yes, you're quite right: landscape thumbnails will be 180 pixels wide and 140 high, and "upright" portrait thumbnails will be 140 pixels wide and 180 high so the area will be the same. Thanks for explaining that.
  • Go ahead with the ARA plaque by all means. Pointillist (talk) 18:19, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Image copyright problem with Image:Chiswick Eyot.jpg

Thank you for uploading Image:Chiswick Eyot.jpg. However, it currently is missing information on its copyright status. Wikipedia takes copyright very seriously. It may be deleted soon, unless we can determine the license and the source of the image. If you know this information, then you can add a copyright tag to the image description page.

If you have any questions, please feel free to ask them at the media copyright questions page. Thanks again for your cooperation. Polly (Parrot) 17:50, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Entrance to 7 Eccles Street at the James Joyce Centre Dublin.jpg

Thanks for uploading or contributing to Image:Entrance to 7 Eccles Street at the James Joyce Centre Dublin.jpg. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is not a suitable explanation or rationale as to why each specific use in Wikipedia constitutes fair use. Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale.

If you have uploaded other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on those pages too. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that any non-free media lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Now, I see you made the case that the image is irreplaceable with a free alternative, but I'm not sure whether the image qualifies as fair use, since I don't see how the significance or the encyclopedic value of the image itself. Mosmof (talk) 00:41, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

  • I took this photograph and I wanted to dedicate it unconditionally to the public domain to the maximum extent I can, which is why I marked it {{pd-self}}.
However, I know there are situations where a photograph of a cultural work can be restricted by the copyright in the original work. For example, if you paint an original picture and I take a photo of it, you still have the copyright in the picture. I can't make lots of prints of my photo and sell them, and I can only put my photo onto Wikipedia if it meets the fair use rules.
So I wanted to explain why I thought my photograph should not be restricted by the copyright in the design and execution of the doorway. My rationale is:
  • This is a low resolution photograph of a three-dimensional doorway (i.e. a piece of architecture).
  • The doorway dates from before 1923.
  • There is no copyright statement on the doorway.
  • The doorway was visible for many years on a public street.
  • It is now displayed at the James Joyce Centre, which does not prohibit photography of the doorway, or claim copyright in it.
Somewhere on the route the image got tagged "not free" which is not what I had intended. Hope this clears things up. Pointillist (talk) 18:49, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

WYSIWYG - don't just complain about it

If you don't like how the article is written, fix it yourself. Nobody here is required to bow down and follow your pronouncements, so if you want the article changed to fit your ideal it's going to have to be up to you to do the work. DMahalko (talk) 02:15, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

  • DMahalko, I haven't "run off feeling all smug" - I am working on it right now. The problem is that the article is full of inaccurate assertions that don't cite their references. Bear in mind that it can take a vast amount of effort to get each valid reference for Wikipedia. Believe me, I have intimately detailed technical knowledge about DTP and WYSIWYG software development from the late 1970s through to early 1990s. Relevant systems I used included IBM MC Composer, entire OS/6 range, Wang OIS, Xerox 860, 820, 8010 Star, I was a member of the BSI working party on SGML, interviewed and consulted to key users from the printing and publishing community. Even with all this it still takes me hours or days of effort to get independent evidence for each claim that I know to be true because I actually used the systems, wrote the software, have copies of the brochures, own slides showing the hardware (that I have to dust-off and scan before uploading etc). You've been around on Wikipedia some time I think, so you know the rules. Talk pages are for raising doubts, everything on an article page must be 100% objective with external citations to back it up. We both care about the articles, so let's be friends, eh? - Pointillist (talk) 03:10, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

Bed management

(see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Bed management)

Good work on bed management. You beat me to the first big rewrite so I've just added my additional bit and will leave you to it. Colonel Warden (talk) 15:30, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

  • Thanks for that - probably needs someone with expertise in healthcare management to take it much further. Not sure what should link to it though. Perhaps you could make suggestions via Talk:Bed_management? Thanks - Pointillist (talk) 15:53, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

NHS "Paying twice"

First off, I didn't add the section you're talking about! It looks like it was added on 13th December 2007 in a set of alterations to what was there before. I in fact very much prefer the older text, looking at it. I think the education comparison stands up in as much as it counters the argument that it's unfair because you still have to pay tax whether you use the service or not. That argument is - for all the reasons you outline - a pretty stupid one, but hey. Anyway, we should probably discuss this on the talk page in case anyone else has views, so I'll post the old edit and the diff there. Nmg20 (talk) 16:27, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

No problem - it was good of you to ask my opinion given that you thought it was my edit! Nmg20 (talk) 18:30, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

Boat rigging (sport rowing)

Hi Pointillist. Following your brilliant work on the Championship Course and Boat Race, I have a huge favour to ask you. The next time you're in the area of the Putney boathouses, could you possibly take some photos to ilustrate the above article? I threw it together but it needs illustrations and, given my lack of drawing ability, superimposing some arrows on drawings of actual equipment should make the meaning a lot clearer. If you don't generally frequent the area, no worries, and I'll try to remember the next time I'm near a boathouse, maybe Henley this year (I'm not near any boathouses these days). Cheers, TrulyBlue (talk) 19:17, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

  • I'll see what I can do - probably later in June after I've completed something else. Not sure whether illustration might be better than photography, e.g. like the rigging article on the BNC Boat Club site [1]. In my day gates were rather lower tech and covered with layers of mucky grease! - Pointillist (talk) 09:07, 8 June 2008 (UTC)
    • Yes, some combination of diagrams in the style of the BNS website and some real pictures may be the way to go - thanks for the link. When I learned to scull pitch adjustment was through the use of hammers. Photos would be great, but obviously this is low urgency. Cheers TrulyBlue (talk) 10:56, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

Informal from article talk

Compete aside: I recently got shit (on WP:AN/I!) from an editor for using his real first name (despite it being a very obvious Google search from his userpage). Of course, mine is an even shorter step, since I mention it explicitly on my userpage (plus I don't think it's any kind of secret). But you might watch out for other editors who are touchy. On the other hand, seeing it brought a smile to my face, so y'know editors vary. LotLE×talk 23:28, 9 July 2008 (UTC)

Oops, I thought that as it was on your user page, and I was trying to be ultra-collaborative++ .... Anyway, point taken! - Pointillist (talk) 06:44, 10 July 2008 (UTC)
Oh, I myself am absolutely and totally not offended. I think it's charming for people to use my outside name (and I sort of invite it further by bragging of being a "relevant expert" on the talk page). OTOH, when I used a different user's first name, I was completely jovial and light hearted, and didn't imagine any possible offense. I'm just giving you some (unsolicited) WP advise that... well, some editors who aren't me are weirdly touchy. LotLE×talk 07:04, 10 July 2008 (UTC)
I read that exchange and took a look at some of that user's other interactions, so I see what you mean. - Pointillist (talk) 07:12, 10 July 2008 (UTC)
Oh, I didn't want to put you to that much work looking through histories. I assume you found something like this AN/I report. Or the discussion at the bottom of User talk:Lulu of the Lotus-Eaters/Archive24. The details aren't that important, I just learned a surprising lesson. LotLE×talk 07:29, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

Boat Race Layout

Objective was really to try and bring together some of the sections that were scattered across the article and give it a bit more of a coherent structure. Generally I would have thought that the history of the event was more 'generally interesting' than the course, which is quite a specific factor. The 'average reader' arriving at the page is, I believe, more likely to be after the history than exact details of the course. I can have a bit more of a look at the layout shortly and see whether it can be improved further. Mrh30 (talk) 10:44, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

Georgette Heyer

Hi Karanacs, I've moved your comments to the Georgette Heyer talk page - let's continue the discussion there. - Pointillist (talk) 21:50, 13 November 2008 (UTC)

Place of the "citations needed" template

Hi, you say that the "citations needed" template should be at the top of the article. I don't agree that is *always* true, and especially not on this case; but I won't fight over that.

Indeed, the "subroutine" article surely could use more references, especially on the history section. We could also easily add a couple of references that would cover most of the technical matter; I will see what I can do. However, the latter is so elementary that providing a reference to every statement would be silly. There are probably millions of programmers out there who could confirm the correctness of the artcile's contents, yet would be hard pressed to cite a reference for any particular statement.

All the best, --Jorge Stolfi (talk) 13:36, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

OK, I've moved the "citations needed" template to the top of the History section. If you can put a couple of generic references into the References section (I imagine as bullets not as citations) that would make it a lot better. I still have a problem with statements like "Most computers before the late 1960s such as the PDP-8 did not have support for hardware stack registers." being unsourced. Sounds reasonable but how on earth would I verify it? What I find annoying is that the person who wrote this very likely did have a source in mind, but was just too idle to cite it. In any case, surely you don't have to have hardware stack registers to implement a stack, do you? AFAIK the B language (first developed on the PDP-7) supported recursion, but presumably had to implement the stack in software. Anyway, thanks for caring enough to reply. - Pointillist (talk) 19:10, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

RfA thankspam

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Thank you for your participation in my recent RfA, which failed with 61/52/7; whether you supported, opposed or remained neutral.

Special thanks go out to Wizardman and Malinaccier for nominating me, and I will try to take everyone's comments on board.

Thanks again for the trust the community has placed in me. A special Christmas song for you all can be found at the right hand side of this message!

Apologies if you don't like RfA thankspam, this message was delivered by a bot which can't tell whether you want it or not. Feel free to remove it. Dendodge TalkContribs, 17:35, 15 December 2008 (UTC)

Seasons Greetings

Pointillist, my very best wishes for the festive season English holly.jpg stay safe and talk to you in 2009.--VS talk 11:24, 24 December 2008 (UTC)