User talk:Quiddity (WMF)

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Questions about WP:Flow in general? Please ask at Wikipedia talk:Flow, to keep discussions non-fragmented!
"I have studied many philosophers and many cats. The wisdom of cats is infinitely superior." - Hippolyte Taine


Category:Flow, which you created, has been nominated for possible deletion, merging, or renaming. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the Categories for discussion page. Thank you. Armbrust The Homunculus 16:11, 4 October 2013 (UTC)

Whoops! Agreed with rename, thanks. Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 16:52, 4 October 2013 (UTC)

Wikiprojects interested in assisting with Flow's first release[edit]

See User talk:Maryana (WMF)#Wikiprojects interested in assisting with Flow's first release.


I've been waiting for this since we worked together at Wikipedia talk:User Advocacy over the summer. I was thinking Wow, wouldn't Quiddity make a great addition to the WMF team and here you are. This is great news for the project. Sorry I didn't notice until just now. Congratulations. Go team!. (talk) 06:48, 2 November 2013 (UTC)

Thank you muchly!
Someone told me, many years ago, (and I wish I could find the exact comment and author, but many searches have failed), something along the lines of "you're not a real Wikipedian until you've made, and learned from, 50 mistakes". I imagine the same will apply to this new role.
*/me raises a toast, to new and interesting mistakes/lessons* :) –Quiddity (talk) 17:51, 2 November 2013 (UTC)

Comments on flow[edit]

  1. Too much white space. Needs to be compacted up. We Wikipedians write a lot and need more packed on a page.
  2. My fancy signature does not appear to work. Not a huge issue.
  3. New topics should appear at the bottom rather than the top. That is Wikipedia convention. Could probably adapt.
  4. I like not having to hit an edit button. Big plus as it is faster (much faster) and that will win me over. VE sucked as it was too low.
  5. Like the new time since the edit was made. Way better than that old time thing.
  6. Nothing under history yet. I assume that is coming.
  7. I like the fact that you cannot edit others comments.
  8. While need a way to hide personal info / delete legal attacks
  9. And refs? We need a way to add references, preferably using the cite template. We discuss refs lots on talk pages

Doc James (talk · contribs · email) (if I write on your page reply on mine) 22:13, 27 November 2013 (UTC)

Some thoughts from the edge[edit]

A few weeks ago, I noticed something on Wikipedia. I noticed it while editing in my volunteer capacity, but as it so happens I work for the Wikimedia Foundation, and what I noticed relates directly to mw:Flow, the product I'm working on. While thinking about how to approach it, it brought home to me the serious dilemma I face every day - an overabundance of choices. I took some notes on my thought processes, to give the community insight into what I'm actually doing as a liaison (because so much is hidden in private email or public-but-off-wiki locations such as IRC/bugzilla/mingle).

What I noticed is that Flow is missing copy of the copyrightwarning, in the edit-mode. Now, I am normally a cautious and critical (in both senses) person. I will happily point out the flaws in something, whilst taking joy in any of the fine points. I was one of the handful of grumpy & conservative commentators and participants in the various 2006 redesigns (main page, help pages, community portal, sidebar, etc). So, never mind my job, it's in my nature to point this out. A year ago, I would have just taken it to the project-talkpage and said, "Here's the problem, and [if I have any] here's the possible solutions." Now, that simple approach has become a lot more complicated.

As a new liaison - someone who listens to the daily meetings and IRC discussions, and receives a ton of daily email from various directions - I'm getting to know the team's decision-trees and workflow-patterns. For a missing feature, with visual elements, that has to be added somewhere, it needs to be:

  1. approved by the manager and prioritized,
  2. sent through research, brainstorm, and design [created in Flow at a visual and psychological level]
  3. planned, developed, and documented [created at a software level]
  4. tested
  5. approved.

As an editor-but-also-liaison, I could therefor take the problem to any (or all!) of:

  • the WT:Flow/Design FAQ wiki talkpage
  • bugzilla
  • the Core Feature Team's public IRC-channel
  • the Core Feature Team's public mingle
  • the Core Feature Team's internal mailing-list
  • or just send an email to the product manager and other pertinent "1st-step" staffers.

Each of which has potential pros and cons I have to consider.

[I went with the latter, who bounced it off the legal dept, and entered it into mingle for project-management and further work.]

This is a problem that Wikimedians are familiar with - the profusion of places that Wikimedians have to obtain information. If I make the wrong choice, there are potential consequences. If I take it to the public discussion areas: how many editors are going to suggest an idea that doesn't get used (thereby frustrating them [cf. my years of redesign experiences]), and how many editors will be angry that I even bothered them with such an "obvious" decision (and take it as confirmation that "none of it will ever work! nosir!")? I also know:

  1. how prone to distraction many deep-thinkers are. ("Instead of fixing it simply/quickly, let's re-imagine the thing entirely!" [cf. my recent simple question about fixing something typographical at the design-mailing-list, which rapidly tangented into a "big-dreams" thread])
  2. How much TL;DR happens if I give ALL the background details. [All of this description so far, is of course just a fraction of what goes through my mind]

I also know how difficult design-by-committee is...

  • Eg. Since the last successful Main Page redesign in 2005/6 (which was quite acrimonious), all 4 subsequent attempts have stalled out - a few of them did so only after many-months-long-processes that embittered some previously-enthusiastic editors.]
  • [Eg.2. the 2006 site sidebar redesign took 7 talkpages and dozens of upset editors. The 2013 sidebar update RfC last month stalled out with no consensus on anything.

(And if I do take it to the public first, how do I phrase it - As an editor, or as a "liaison"? (How many hats can I wear in a single sentence or paragraph? Should I suggest things with one account ("Quiddity") and then reply with another account ("Quiddity (WMF)")? That direction leads to madness!) [I just asked, and found out that our unofficial styleguide for liaisons suggest that in onwiki communications we refer to the staff we work with as "they". It's all very zen and multiperspectival, which makes me happy!])

So, I have to decide "who do I want to bother with this decision?" as well as "how can I help this decision get made, and get the feature implemented, in the most well-considered, widely-acceptable, and efficient way possible?"

I do a lot of thinking about how to describe things. That includes myself, and my job. The latest job description I've devised is: "difficult questions, phrased cohesively". That's what I'm trying to do this week, at least. (and usually a lot briefer than this! It was even longer originally, but Maggie kindly re-arranged and deleted a few parts, to give it more coherence. :) Public or private feedback is welcome. –Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 20:51, 8 December 2013 (UTC)

Help with bugzilla[edit]

Hey N (not sure if you use your name on-wiki). At WP:Village_pump_(technical)#Highlighting_within_an_article_from_a_list_of_regex_expressions, Kipod came up with the following bit of monobook.js code for a request of mine, which works great, as far as it goes:

if (mw.config.get( 'wgAction' ) === 'view')
mw.loader.using(['jquery.highlightText', 'jquery.tipsy'], function() {
   mw.util.$content.highlightText( 'interest lua');
       title: function() { 
           return 'See \[\[User:Dank/SomePage#' + $(this).text() + '\]\]';

That will bold the words "interest" and "lua" anywhere they appear, and when I hover over "interest" for instance, I get a popup saying "interest is highlighted" (see below). The purpose is to allow Wikipedians to bold the appearance of any word of interest (without making any actual changes to the text) and attach notes so they know why it's bolded, but in particular, I'm working on a big list of "common mistakes" that writers and reviewers want help catching (similar to WP:RETF, but more than just typos).

The problem is, the code doesn't allow regex; in fact, it won't even let me bold a two-word phrase (I've tried \ , \\ , \s, "two words", etc. to code the space, no luck). I imagine people who take bugzilla requests are more likely to respond to people they know, so I haven't tried bugzilla before ... could you help me submit this request? - Dank (push to talk) 13:31, 10 February 2014 (UTC)

P.S. I just inserted a more interesting popup message into the code. - Dank (push to talk) 13:55, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
It would also be helpful if it were possible to click on the link in the popup, as is the case for the popup gadget at Preferences/Gadgets. - Dank (push to talk) 14:04, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
Hey @Dank: (I prefer just using "Quiddity" everywhere onwiki, to prevent confusion :)
Regarding bugzilla requests, it's much like Wikipedia: Newcomers should be welcome and encouraged, and mistakes are expected and forgiven (and fixed or clarified by experienced users). So, file away at bugzilla, whenever needed (and if you don't already have an account there, bear in mind that it publicly displays your email address, so select that accordingly :)
Regarding the question itself, it looks like Matma Rex has given some newer feedback (and he's always good to listen to), so possibly that solves it? (Fwiw, examples/use-cases always make requests clearer. I found, and like the direction of, User:Dank/Highlighter/list!)
HTH. –Quiddity (talk) 20:04, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
Yep, and thanks much. - Dank (push to talk) 20:17, 10 February 2014 (UTC)

FLOW feedback[edit]

Thank you for soliciting my feedback on wp:Flow. I am sorry I cannot find the time to be more involved. As far as Wp:Breakf is concerned, I believe that if updates and improvements are posted at wt: breakf, more ediors would be engaged.

Here is the little I collected as feedback:

  1. I get no notification when someone replies to my post (I think?)
  2. No way to thank participants for a post
  3. Weird entry on my user contributions when I post on Flow
  4. No titles? (I think this one has been fixed?) – but I still cannot create a sub-thread with a new title
  5. Indenting is primitive (no reply to reply)
  6. Flow is only legible when I view it on a mobile device
  7. Why are dates on mobile showing up as “X days ago” while normal screens show a date (I prefer date)
  8. Icons need a legend in an obvious location (is there a legend somewhere?)
  9. The dot-dot-dot permalinks have disappeared for me – never got a chance to use them
  10. I like the idea of having archives with permalinks – is there one somewhere that editors can view? HTH XOttawahitech (talk) 00:25, 25 February 2014 (UTC)
  11. Afterthought addition: I thought the idea was to have threads with recent replies bubble to the top? XOttawahitech (talk) 00:31, 25 February 2014 (UTC)
@Ottawahitech: Thanks. I fully (all too well) understand the difficulties with finding time for the thousands of interesting possibilities around here. :)
  1. You should get a Notification when someone clicks "reply" on your posts, or when someone Mentions/links your username (if you have those Echo Notifications enabled). Let me know if this isn't happening.
  2. The Thanks extension is being integrated with Flow by a couple of Facebook Open Academy students (mw:Flow/Thanks).
  3. The usercontribs/watchlist/Recentchanges elements are currently being overhauled, with more consistent ordering and link names, and an auto-excerpted edit-summary. Once that's in place, they'll ask for fresh feedback.
  4. There's a bug with some of the existing topic titles here (bugzilla:61939), but I think it's specific to the code-version that Enwiki is on. We'll see when it updates tomorrow.
    • Regarding subthreads, it's been suggested by myself and other editors, that we might be able to just use "===subheaders===" in root-level posts within a topic.
  5. A third level of indenting is on its way. Once we've had a chance to test that out, they'll ask us for further feedback.
  6. What do you mean by "Flow is only legible when I view it on a mobile device" ?
  7. The "Elapsed-time" (eg. 1 month ago), and "Exact-time" (eg 00:25, 25 February 2014 (UTC)) are an issue I've raised. Some people like the new Elapsed format, others prefer the standard Exact format. I'm hoping it will become a user-preference.
  8. Icon Legend: Hmm, that might be a good idea.
  9. the dot-dot-dot icons are still there, but darn hard to see, because they're so faint/pale gray. There's a fix (darker icon) on its way.
  10. The topics and posts all have permalinks (in the action menu (dotdotdot icon)). Those are real permalinks, which won't break if the topic-title is changed! There's a requested feature to also have "permalinks to topics within a historical context" (ie, we can see some of the topics above and below the targeted topic). They're already paginated, so that should be easy enough. (I say, not knowing anything about how it works! >.> )
  11. They're currently adding a "sort topics" mechanism, so that we can re-arrange the view, either by-time, or by-recent-activity. Suggestions for other "sorting methods" that could be implemented, are welcome.
HTH. :) Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 22:40, 26 February 2014 (UTC)

Flow newsletter?[edit]

Hi Quiddity. Is the November 2013 newsletter the most recent one? Just curious if I missed anything more recent. Also, any ETA on when we might be able to opt-in to test Flow on our user talk pages? Thanks, 28bytes (talk) 21:17, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

Hi @28bytes: It is the most recent one. Partially because the team has been working on a large quantity of underlying-architecture-level code, rather than new features, and partially because there's a front-end overhaul that I was hoping to announce in the 'next' newsletter, but it has been much-delayed since work started on it in January, due to issues with javascript libraries (if I remember and understand correctly). However, getting a new copy of the Newsletter out is near the top of my priority list, and likely to be here by the end of next week, at the latest.
Re: Opt-in for user-pages, the brand-new and currently draft-state set of Annual Goals, mw:Wikimedia Engineering/2014-15 Goals#Editor Engagement - Core Features has "User talk:" as a focus for development, and hopefully opt-in deployment, in quarter 2.
HTH. Thanks again for your interest; More feedback/requests are always appreciated. :) Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 21:53, 10 June 2014 (UTC)
Thanks! 28bytes (talk) 22:05, 10 June 2014 (UTC)

Some stroopwafels for you![edit]

Gaufre biscuit.jpg No reason in particular, I've just been coming across a lot of your contributions recently and I'm glad you're on our side :D EdSaperia (talk) 20:58, 28 June 2014 (UTC)

Maintenance script[edit]

A "dev" (??) wrote "If its really a problem to have them in contributions i can probably write up a maintenance script to change the owner". Would you please ask Dev to do that, and remove that from my contributions list? Sincere thanks Quiddity (WMF). Eddymason (talk) 13:21, 1 August 2014 (UTC)

Hi Eddymason. Per the rest of what the developer wrote, "but generally its not considered a great idea to go back in time and change existing revisions." it would be best to just wait a month, at which point all of us who have these bug-entries will get them cleared automatically. (eg. I have some, too). Manually changing existing-revisions in the database table carries the risk of very-hard-to-fix mistakes, plus it would take time away from fixing other bugs, and creating new features. Would you be ok with waiting patiently for a month? Thanks for considering it. :) Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 16:14, 1 August 2014 (UTC)
Okay. It helps to know that these are present in the contributions lists of others, too. Thanks. Eddymason (talk) 16:55, 2 August 2014 (UTC)

Flow in other wiki[edit]

Moved from User talk:Quiddity.

When Flow extension will be included in other wiki (2014, 2015, ....)? What we need to do to turn it on some pages in ru-wiki already now?Sunpriat (talk) 12:12, 25 August 2014 (UTC)

Hi, Sunpriat. Sorry I didn't see this (at my other talkpage) earlier, and just missed you on IRC today.
Re: Timeline - Flow is getting rolled out very slowly, and currently just to pages that request it and seem like appropriate locations to help actively test Flow in a working environment, whilst it is developed - i.e. places that will give ongoing feedback on the many experimental features, and help report any new bugs (and be aware that new bugs will appear), and importantly to help suggest new features - We don't want to just end up with a replacement for talkpages - we want an improvement. (although, there's already a long (and needing an update) list collecting many of the planned/discussed features, that will be developed over the coming months).
Re: To turn it on in new locations: Technically - we currently have to ask the development team (who change a configuration file), and also get approval from the product manager. Practically - Ask your community to test out the sandbox at mw:Talk:Sandbox, and decide where you might want to have it turned on at Ruwiki to begin with. Once you've got consensus for a page (or a few) to be flow-enabled, let me know, and I'll add it to the list. From there, it would be up to the Flow product manager to decide on the exact timeline. It's a slow-but-steady process, just like the development of the software itself. ;)
Feel free to ping me again on IRC, I'm in the UTC-8 timezone. Or keep replying here. Thanks. Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 16:35, 28 August 2014 (UTC)
@Quiddity (WMF): These two: ru:Википедия:Песочница/Flow, ru:Википедия:Форум/Новости/Flow. Our discussion - ru:Википедия:Форум/Предложения#Включить Flow. Sunpriat (talk) 10:49, 30 August 2014 (UTC)
@Quiddity (WMF): There is a ticket in Trello about the ruWP pages? Sunpriat (talk) 10:09, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
@Sunpriat: There is a ticket. I'll have to ask the product manager what the specific timeline is for the next rollouts, and it might be longer than desired (possibly a few months) because there's an upcoming staff change, but please do keep me uptodate with what the general and specific feedback is from Ruwiki. Thanks again, for all the information and details so far. :) Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 02:33, 8 September 2014 (UTC)

Quiddity (WMF): Then I copy the important question here from a letter: We have difficulty in understanding and accurate translation of the name "Flow" in translatewiki!translated. The WMF has a requirement as it should look like - as a name or word? For example, a company called Apple (en), in a different language it is also called Apple (as a company, or use the transcription Orthographic transcription), but if they will translate it into they language as a fruit then it will be quite a different word. What can we do better - translate like a word or use the transcription or you have not requirement, and you leave the choice to ruWP community? Sunpriat (talk) 18:44, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

@Sunpriat: I've asked, and was given a fairly ambiguous answer: "Generally product names are retained, not translated. But there are variants by product and by language." - So, it appears to be up to the individual translators at translatewiki. You could either use the word "Flow", or a direct translation, or a translation that hints at "workflow" (which is partially where the name comes from), or something else. However, it is (most?) common to retain the original product name.
The same applies to the "Topic" namespace (which was chosen partially because "Thread" was already taken), which you asked about, elsewhere.
Hope that helps. Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 19:53, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

Can I work on flow?[edit]

Hi, I have heard about your new project flow which provides UI rich interface for editing discussion and talk pages. I am skilled in various web based programming laguages such as javascript, PHP etc. I was just wondering if you needed any help with the development of flow, as I am eager to help.

Thank you in advance

NetworkOP (talk) 19:52, 27 December 2014 (UTC)

I can't put it any better than (or nearly as well as) Zhaofeng Li did at your talkpage! Thanks, both of you. :) --Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 21:31, 29 December 2014 (UTC)

You've got mail![edit]

Hello, Quiddity (WMF). Please check your email; you've got mail!
Message added 00:59, 24 January 2015 (UTC). It may take a few minutes from the time the email is sent for it to show up in your inbox. You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{You've got mail}} or {{ygm}} template.

Go Phightins! 00:59, 24 January 2015 (UTC)


Wikipedia_talk:Notifications#Pings_not_working could use some attention. --NeilN talk to me 14:42, 28 January 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for the nudge. --Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 23:18, 28 January 2015 (UTC)

Flow revert warring[edit]

"there is a lot of opinion and many inaccuracies" Could you please detail the inaccuracies since you used that as a pretext to revert-war the link off of the page? Cla68 (talk) 05:12, 10 February 2015 (UTC)


Quiddity test ping. Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 00:19, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

test again. Quiddity (talk) 18:28, 29 September 2015 (UTC)


Nuvola apps edu languages.svg
Hello, Quiddity (WMF). You have new messages at Northamerica1000's talk page.
Message added 16:35, 23 February 2015 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

On my talk page, a user has requested help with errors that have occurred on the Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Breakfast talk page per using Flow. I am unable to fix the matter on the project's talk page. Please see the discussion. Thanks. NORTH AMERICA1000 16:35, 23 February 2015 (UTC)


Greetings! I've tried several variations to change the "you have new messages" text color in my global.css and none of them works right. Feel like helping me out? Face-grin.svgATinySliver/ATalkPage 02:42, 21 April 2015 (UTC)

@ATinySliver: You need to add the !important at the end of each variable (before the semi-colon), per my example. I don't remember enough about CSS to explain why! Sorry, hope that helps. :) Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 03:46, 21 April 2015 (UTC)
That did it. Thank you. :) —ATinySliver/ATalkPage 05:15, 21 April 2015 (UTC)

Canada and United States affiliates meetup[edit]

Flag of Canada.svg
Wikimedia Canada
Wikimedia DC
Wikimedia New York City
The GLAM-Wiki US Consortium
Cascadia Wikimedians User Group
New England Wikimedians
North Carolina Triangle Wikipedians
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You are invited to attend the Canada and United States affiliates meetup at Wikimania 1015, Friday, July 17 at 17:30 and Saturday, July 18 at 18:00. Please RSVP and state your topic preference(s)!
Wikimedia Canada
Wikimedia DC
Wikimedia New York City
The GLAM-Wiki US Consortium
Cascadia Wikimedians User Group
New England Wikimedians
North Carolina Triangle Wikipedians

Flow survey[edit]

[moved across from user talk:Quiddity...]

Could you please quickly point me to the results of this survey: Flow/Second contributor survey

Thanks. --Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 06:08, 16 August 2015 (UTC)

@Kudpung:, That survey was not sent/used at all (I.e. it was drafted, but nothing more. I don't recall why not.). I've now added a note at the top of mw:Flow/Second contributor survey to indicate this. Thanks, Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 17:48, 16 August 2015 (UTC)
Thank you. --Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 20:02, 16 August 2015 (UTC)

Slightly off topic question[edit]

I know that you're working on Flow, but I've got a question about a different WMF project. Is anyone still working on improving the article creation experience here on en.wp? I see there were proposals at mw:Article Creation Workflow and mw:Wikipedia article creation, but nothing seems to have come of those. Conifer (talk) 20:39, 17 August 2015 (UTC)

Hi Conifer. Afaik, the Wikipedia:Drafts namespace was the last thing that that team worked on/with, before the individuals went off to other teams (or left the WMF).
Much like every area of wikimedia, there is a huge to-do list, and not quite enough people, or hours in the day, to improve everything concurrently. :(
Eventualism is my/our only hope! Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 21:41, 17 August 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for your prompt answer. Sorry to hear that nothing's underway at the moment. Conifer (talk) 21:49, 17 August 2015 (UTC)

Sorry about this[edit]

...but I can not figure out how to edit this page and wanted to comment (since if I am reading the village pump page right you opened up the page for comments) if that's ok. My suggestion is to enable it site wide for a week so everyone can experience it then make it a preference to opt in for. In this way, we all get to try it, those that like it can keep it, and those that don't can return to whichever older system they prefer. TomStar81 (Talk) 05:47, 15 September 2015 (UTC)

Hi TomStar81, you should be able to just click "Reply" under any of the posts there, or in the box at the very bottom (screenshot). If that doesn't work, could you let me know what browser and OS you use? (you can also do sandbox tests at Wikipedia talk:Flow/Developer test page)
In reply to your good suggestion itself: User-preferences are what I always asked for, when I was purely a volunteer editor; but now that I'm more familiar with how software development works, I can understand why developers, product managers, designers, etc, are very reluctant to "just make it a preference". This is (IIUC) because it leads to more complex code, which: increases the chances of problems, increases the number of user-setting-variables that have to be tested-against, increases the maintenance burden over the longterm, and increases the number of things to consider when adding further features that affect that area of the code/UI. Hence, whilst it can be a 'quick fix' at the time, and was perhaps used as such too much in the early days, it leads to more difficulties in the longterm. This is a small part of why we don't have dozens of vastly different site-skins! HTH, and thanks. Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 22:54, 15 September 2015 (UTC)

Sanity check. Pasting here too.[edit]

Year ICM location Medalists Institution (At the time of receiving the medal) Birthplace Current/Last residency Current/Last Institution
1936 Norway Oslo Lars Ahlfors University of Helsinki Finland United States Harvard University
Jesse Douglas Massachusetts Institute of Technology United States United States City College of New York
1950 United States Cambridge Laurent Schwartz University of Nancy France France Université de Paris VII
Atle Selberg Institute for Advanced Study Norway United States Institute for Advanced Study


Can you oversight a Flow post? Alsee (talk) 20:20, 15 September 2015 (UTC)

@Alsee: I cannot. Please see Wikipedia:Oversight for the standard 'who to email' instructions. Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 20:29, 15 September 2015 (UTC)

I got it cleaned up. My Watchlist token got caught in a full-page copy. Alsee (talk) 20:37, 15 September 2015 (UTC)

Not cleaned up. New bug report. Oversight fails. Can you get someone to remove the post? Alsee (talk) 20:40, 15 September 2015 (UTC)

New bug report. The full page copy appears to be so large that it's blocking my access to the menu item to hide the post Alsee (talk)

Working on it... Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 21:02, 15 September 2015 (UTC)
Thx. It's not critical info, but jeeze this is getting ridiculous. No oversight AND no hide bugs, at the same time. Alsee (talk) 21:08, 15 September 2015 (UTC)
@Alsee: After much testing with a number of oversighters, we have been unable to reproduce the bug (even after I reproduced the post that you made, using my own screen (and redacting the token)). At the moment, I'm suspecting either a cacheing error, or some confusion about timing and the need to refresh the page to see some updates. I'll ask Keegan to see if he specifically can reproduce, tomorrow, but 3 other oversighters had success.
(Just FYI, the hide/delete/suppress links are all duplicated on the History page, so even posts that include crazy divs that partially cover the dropdown menu, can be moderated :) Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 02:16, 16 September 2015 (UTC)

The community is requesting restoration of article creation to unregistered editors[edit]

The very first line is misinformation (there is no "consensus"). Closing topic to prevent further edit-warring (at the WP:WRONGVERSION). Please discuss elsewhere. Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 19:46, 20 October 2015 (UTC)

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

This has been discussed in various places and consensus has been achieved in each.

The relevant parts of the latest discussion this week at User talk:Jimbo Wales are as follows:

When they search a topic and there's no article let the comment be

You may create the page "X" but consider checking the search result below to see whether the topic is already covered ...

The proposal to allow article creation by unregistered editors within pending changes has been discussed at the Village Pump and in a thread here which was archived yesterday morning ...

Pending changes reviewers do not fret - any autoconfirmed editor will be able to review these articles - the first edit by an autoconfirmed editor (whether pending changes reviewer or not) will automatically remove the article from pending changes so that the content becomes visible to the general public.

Please ask the developers to implement the change. (talk) 18:12, 23 September 2015 (UTC)

That content doesn't appear anywhere except on this page. I'd be happy to see links to the discussions you mention. Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 19:20, 23 September 2015 (UTC)
Yes links to these discussions would help. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 19:52, 23 September 2015 (UTC)
I would also like to see links to the discussions. I was not aware of them. Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 20:25, 23 September 2015 (UTC)
Of possible interest is a very similar proposal [1] at the VP in July initiated by a ban-evading sock. Voceditenore (talk) 09:28, 24 September 2015 (UTC)
See also this comment reverted at User talk:Jimbo Wales 3 days ago as "Sock of banned user". It contains the quoted text above virtually verbatim. Voceditenore (talk) 09:41, 24 September 2015 (UTC)
At the risk of appearing to partially side with the intent of banned socks, I think that the message-text could use some updating, myself. But I don't think that anons need direct page-creation in mainspace, we already have page-creation capability in draftspace -- but since draftspace is a new feature, perhaps nobody has yet considered updating the redlink-info-page-wording? Here is an example topic, a redlinked mechanical engineering professor, Nerat_Veziroglu, which upon being clicked says this:
Here is a proposed wording-adjustment:
This is a rough stab, not fully polished, obviously. The advantage of the proposed wording, is that it explicitly encourages people to use draftspace, for immediate gratification. The 'disadvantage' is that the proposal fails to try and channel them into the register-first-edit-second behavior, plus makes it one-click-easy to manually search for drafts. p.s. And no, I didn't make the Draft:T._Nerat_Veziroğlu body-prose specifically for this comment about wording.  :-)     That was a serendipitous coincidence. (talk) 15:42, 24 September 2015 (UTC)
I disagree. The verbiage will put people off. Why do you think it is advantageous to try and channel them into the register - first - edit - second behavior? Last time I looked there were nearly 500 drafts waiting in draftspace. Add to that the backlog in AfC and the number of articles which cannot be improved by other editors is approaching four figures. This is the antithesis of crowdsourcing. If you want new editors you have to incentivise people to work here. People like to bounce ideas off each other, not work in a vacuum. Putting their work on ice for six months is not the recipe for attracting people. How many other journals work in this manner? None. (talk) 13:49, 30 September 2015 (UTC)

To the IP(s): Please stop revert-warring, it doesn't help. This page is not the appropriate place to discuss it. Discuss it elsewhere, and once there is consensus (by vastly more than 2 people) create an account on phabricator and file a task there. Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 19:09, 30 October 2015 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Notifications at Commons[edit]

Commons notification6346456.png

Hi Quiddity, I apologize for reporting this here but I'm absolutely clueless with noticeboards at Commons, Basically the new notification system has returned there and all image categories are appearing like this
Just thought I should make you aware :)
Thanks, –Davey2010Talk 19:48, 23 September 2015 (UTC)

@Davey2010: I can't reproduce this problem. I've tried with a variety of accounts, and in Chrome and Firefox, and even tried enabling every single gadget.
Aha! After looking at various IRC channels, I think the problem was already reverted.
It was not related to notifications. - (Over-simplified: All code in 'core' and in all extensions is pushed to the active sites on a weekly schedule (at minimum). For Commons, that is Wednesday. (see wikitech:Deployments/One week for the overview, and the parent page for details and links specifically about this week (continuously updated). I.e. hundreds (thousands?) of things change once a week, every week, though most of them won't be directly visible to editors.)
In this particular case, the bug is tracked/discussed at phab:T113511. It seems they were trying to clear up what-appeared-to-be-duplicated-code (described in phab:T110709), but actually turned out to be necessary. HTH. :-) Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 20:23, 23 September 2015 (UTC)
Ah it's back to normal now :), That all sounds complicated Face-grin.svg, Well least it's all fixed now :), Thank you for looking in to it & replying :), Thanks, –Davey2010Talk 20:42, 23 September 2015 (UTC)

Merry Christmas and happy new year[edit]

Merry Christmas and happy new year. (:


Notification about disabling the Wikipedia collections tool[edit]

Thank you for using the collections feature in Wikipedia beta! Due to technical and moderation issues, we will be turning off this experimental feature. Your collections will be available for viewing and export until March 1st. If you would like to save your collection as links on a special Wikipedia page, please fill out the following form. If you are interested in giving your feedback about Wikipedia Collections please do so here.


Jon Katz
Product manager, Wikimedia Foundation
Jkatz (WMF) (talk) 23:57, 26 February 2016 (UTC)

Tech News: 2016-13[edit]

19:37, 28 March 2016 (UTC)


i need someone to speak.. Eljayajra (talk) 16:26, 15 April 2016 (UTC)

@Eljayajra: Hi, how can I help? Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 16:37, 15 April 2016 (UTC)

Tech News: 2016-23[edit]

20:43, 6 June 2016 (UTC)

Wikimania 2016: IdeaLab Workshops[edit]

IdeaLab beaker and flask.svg

Wikimania 2016 is almost here! Mjohnson (WMF) and I are running two workshops for IdeaLab during the conference, and you are invited to join us for either (or both!)

If you have a proposal or idea you are thinking about, and would like a space to work on it on your own or with others, please consider joining us for either the Thursday or Saturday sessions. We'll discuss a little about IdeaLab and how it works, and the rest of the time is space for idea building. You can also use this session to ask questions about Wikimedia Foundation grants that are available if your proposal or idea may need funding. Thanks, and see you at the conference! I JethroBT (WMF) (talk) 20:45, 19 June 2016 (UTC)


Hi Nick.I've left a message for you on your MediaWiki talk page. If possible, please ping me on my WP talk page when you answer. Best, --Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 01:59, 8 July 2016 (UTC)

Ping changes[edit]

Hello Q. Thanks for your posts at this thread Wikipedia:Village pump (technical)#Notification issue. In trying to help another editor in an unrelated manner I was reading the Wikipedia:Notifications page and found that there have been no updates to the info there to take into account how things have changed. I am sure that you are busy so you might not have time to get to the needed updates so I have also posted a request here Wikipedia talk:Notifications#Update needed. Thanks for your time and best regards. MarnetteD|Talk 16:14, 10 July 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for moving the post I made today to the proper spot. I have never posted to VPM - and still haven't I guess :-) I have added the page to my watchlist. Cheers. MarnetteD|Talk 00:31, 5 August 2016 (UTC)
Hello again Q. Well we tried to get more input but enough time has passed that I think that you should proceed as you see fit. Whether it be your suggestion or a combination of Jo-Jo's and yours I think it is time to move ahead on this. I know you are busy so whatever you think is best is fine with me. MarnetteD|Talk 00:48, 16 August 2016 (UTC)
Thanks, I've added it to my to-do list. I won't promise an ETA, but a.s.a.p. Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 21:54, 17 August 2016 (UTC)
Sounds good. Warning boxes have been added to the top of both pages notifying people that the info is out of date so that should help until you get a chance to work out how to proceed. I find it kinda funny that we have gone from the big "Orange Bar of Death" to a red and blue ping that are so small that they are hard to see for aging eyes like mine :-) Cheers. MarnetteD|Talk 22:11, 17 August 2016 (UTC)

Tech News: 2016-29[edit]

20:13, 18 July 2016 (UTC)

VPT Breakout[edit]

As far as the 2 kinds of "patrolling" go - if they are actually different things - we may want to discuss retiring the "old" one - from what I can tell the classic "Mark this page as patrolled" type action (&action=markedpatrolled) doesn't normally have an "undo" at all - and if *I* go to a page I get this dialog, if I use another account I get the "bar" format that allows for marking as reviewed or unreviewed - is there a different shell in place because I am an admin? — xaosflux Talk 21:46, 17 August 2016 (UTC)

It's a tangled system of overlapping code and terminology. As best/clearly as I can figure it:
Re: Log items - I'll answer at VPT.
Re: "retiring the old one", probably not, or at least not anytime soon. Whilst many editors like NPP, many prefer using RC or Special:NewPages. Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 22:54, 17 August 2016 (UTC)
Thank you, I'm guessing I have something broken in my user scripts that is breaking "pagetriage" for me - I can never get the triage bar to show (but I do get the "Mark this page patrolled" link). On my other account I don't get that link, I just get the triage bar. — xaosflux Talk 00:43, 18 August 2016 (UTC)
Little more detail, on my other account the [Mark this page as patrolled] link appears momentarily, then is replaced by the triage bar. — xaosflux Talk 01:19, 18 August 2016 (UTC)

Part 2: regarding "Pending changes" (FlaggedRevisions) is the acceptance mechanism just tied to group value - or to a permission in a group? — xaosflux Talk 21:49, 17 August 2016 (UTC)

(You redacted this question, but I already wrote the reply! Replacing, just in case helpful). This is what the "review" and "autoreview" user-rights are connected to. Software is always tied to a user-right, and never (or rarely) a user-group. Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 22:54, 17 August 2016 (UTC)

Edit summaries[edit]

Please use accurate edit summaries. Your edit summary for this edit: [25] stated that you were making the statement "shorter and more precise". In fact, you were entirely changing the meaning of what was said, since your edit removed totally mention of Flow replacing talk pages. I've correspondingly reverted that edit. Seraphimblade Talk to me 01:27, 14 September 2016 (UTC)

@Seraphimblade: The section that is linked to, is about the survey. The survey is about satisfaction with Flow. The section is not discussing whether or not to replace talkpages with Flow (especially not at English Wikipedia). Hence the original wording was inaccurate and potentially misleading or confusing, and I was trying to make it more precise/accurate. Perhaps you could take a second look? Thanks. Quiddity (WMF) (talk) 16:05, 14 September 2016 (UTC)

NPP & AfC[edit]

A dedicated venue for combined discussion about NPP & AfC where a work group is also proposed has been created. See: Wikipedia:The future of NPP and AfC --Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 07:40, 24 September 2016 (UTC)

A barnstar for you![edit]

Vitruvian Barnstar Hires.png The Technical Barnstar
For helping me with notifications. Iazyges Consermonor Opus meum 03:23, 29 September 2016 (UTC)


Changes made to LilaTretikov's user page. I left the edit as-is except for a few typoes and such that really called for a fix. Happy for others to decide what tense should be maintained etc. Samsara 03:43, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

New Page Reviewer granted[edit]

Wikipedia New page reviewer.svg

Hello Quiddity (WMF). Your account has been added to the "New page reviewers" user group, allowing you to review new pages and mark them as patrolled, tag them for maintenance issues, or in some cases, tag them for deletion. The list of articles awaiting review is located at the New Pages Feed. New page reviewing is a vital function for policing the quality of the encylopedia, if you have not already done so, you must read the new tutorial at New Pages Review, the linked guides and essays, and fully understand the various deletion criteria. If you need more help or wish to discuss the process, please join or start a thread at page reviewer talk.

  • Be nice to new users - they are often not aware of doing anything wrong.
  • You will frequently be asked by users to explain why their page is being deleted - be formal and polite in your approach to them too, even if they are not.
  • Don't review a page if you are not sure what to do. Just leave it for another reviewer.
  • Remember that quality is quintessential to good patrolling. Take your time to patrol each article, there is no rush. Use the message feature and offer basic advice.

The reviewer right does not change your status or how you can edit articles. If you no longer want this user right, you may ask any administrator to remove it for you at any time. In case of abuse or persistent inaccuracy of reviewing, the right can be revoked at any time by an administrator. Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 12:08, 24 November 2016 (UTC)

New Page Review - newsletter (November 2016)[edit]

Hello Quiddity (WMF),
Wikipedia New page reviewer.svg
Breaking the back of the backlog
We now have 425 New Page Reviewers! Most of you requested the user right to be able to do something about the huge backlog. Now it's time for action.
Mid July to 01 Oct 2016

If each reviewer does only 10 reviews a day over five days, the backlog will be down to zero and the daily input can then be processed by each reviewer doing only 2 or 3 reviews a day - that's about 5 minutes work!
Let's get that over and done with in time to relax for the holidays.

Second set of eyes

Not only are New Page Reviewers the guardians of quality of new articles, they are also in a position to ensure that pages are being correctly tagged for deletion and maintenance and that new authors are not being bitten. This is an important feature of your work. Read about it at the new Monitoring the system section in the tutorial.

Getting the tools we need - 2016 WMF Wishlist Survey: Please vote

With some tweaks to their look, and some additional features, Page Curation and New Pages Feed could easily be the best tools for patrollers and reviewers. We've listed most of what what we need at the 2016 WMF Wishlist Survey. Voting starts on 28 November - please turn out to make our bid the Foundation's top priority. Please help also by improving or commenting on our Wishlist entry at the Community Wishlist Survey. Many other important user suggestions are listed at at Page Curation.

Originally sent to all New Page Reviewers 26 November 2016. This message sent manually. Discuss this newsletter here. If you wish to opt-out of future mailings, please remove yourself from the mailing list. Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 02:55, 7 December 2016 (UTC)).

BBC 12-hour Editathon - large influx of new pages & drafts expected[edit]

New Page Reviewers are asked to be especially on the look out 08:00-20:00 UTC (that's local London time - check your USA and AUS times) on Thursday 8 December for new pages. The BBC together with Wikimedia UK is holding a large 12-hour editathon. Many new articles and drafts are expected. See BBC 100 Women 2016: How to join our edit-a-thon. Follow also on #100womenwiki, and please, don't bite the newbies :) (user:Kudpung for NPR. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 23:55, 7 December 2016 (UTC))

New Page Review - newsletter #2[edit]

Hello Quiddity (WMF),
Wikipedia New page reviewer.svg
Please help reduce the New Page backlog

This is our second request. The backlog is still growing. Your help is needed now - just a few minutes each day.

Getting the tools we need


Sent to all New Page Reviewers. Discuss this newsletter here. If you wish to opt-out of future mailings, please remove yourself from the mailing list MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 06:55, 11 December 2016 (UTC) .

Test announcement[edit]

James Forrester (Product Manager, Editing department, Wikimedia Foundation) 19:23, 14 December 2016 (UTC)

Tech News: 2016-51[edit]

20:22, 19 December 2016 (UTC)

Merry Merry[edit]

500px-Xmas tree animated.gif Season's Greetings, Quiddity (WMF)!
At this wonderful time of year, I would like to give season’s greetings to all the fellow Wikipedians I have interacted with in the past! May you have a wonderful holiday season! MarnetteD|Talk 19:10, 20 December 2016 (UTC)
Candy stick icon.png

New Page Review - newsletter No.2[edit]

Hello Quiddity (WMF),
Wikipedia New page reviewer.svg
A HUGE backlog

We now have 425 New Page Reviewers!
Most of us requested the user right at PERM, expressing a wish to be able to do something about the huge backlog, but the chart on the right does not demonstrate any changes to the pre-user-right levels of October.

Hitting 17,000 soon

The backlog is still steadily growing at a rate of 150 a day or 4,650 a month. Only 20 reviews a day by each reviewer over the next few days would bring the backlog down to a managable level and the daily input can then be processed by each reviewer doing only 2 or 3 reviews a day - that's about 5 minutes work!
It didn't work in time to relax for the Xmas/New Year holidays. Let's see if we can achieve our goal before Easter, otherwise by Thanksgiving it will be closer to 70,000.

Second set of eyes

Remember that we are the only guardians of quality of new articles, we alone have to ensure that pages are being correctly tagged by non-Reviewer patrollers and that new authors are not being bitten.


This is even more important and extra vigilance is required considering Orangemoody, and

  1. this very recent case of paid advertising by a Reviewer resulting in a community ban.
  2. this case in January of paid advertising by a Reviewer, also resulting in a community ban.
  3. This Reviewer is indefinitely blocked for sockpuppetry.

Coordinator election[edit]

Kudpung is stepping down after 6 years as unofficial coordinator of New Page Patrolling/Reviewing. There is enough work for two people and two coords are now required. Details are at NPR Coordinators; nominate someone or nominate yourself. Date for the actual suffrage will be published later.

Discuss this newsletter here. If you wish to opt-out of future mailings, please remove yourself from the mailing list MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 06:11, 5 February 2017 (UTC)

New Page Review-Patrolling: Coordinator elections[edit]

Your last chance to nominate yourself or any New Page Reviewer, See Wikipedia talk:New pages patrol/Coordination. Elections begin Monday 20 February 23:59 UTC. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 08:17, 19 February 2017 (UTC)

New Page Review - newsletter No.3[edit]

Hello Quiddity (WMF),
Wikipedia New page reviewer.svg

Voting for coordinators has now begun HERE and will continue through/to 23:59 UTC Monday 06 March. Please be sure to vote. Any registered, confirmed editor can vote. Nominations are now closed.

Still a MASSIVE backlog

We now have 425 New Page Reviewers but despite numerous appeals for help, the backlog has NOT been significantly reduced.
If you asked for the New Page Reviewer right, please consider investing a bit of time - every little helps preventing spam and trash entering the mainspace and Google when the 'NO_INDEX' tags expire.

Discuss this newsletter here. If you wish to opt-out of future mailings, please remove yourself from the mailing list. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 15:35, 21 February 2017 (UTC)

New Page Review - Newsletter No.4[edit]

Hello Quiddity (WMF),
Wikipedia New page reviewer.svg

Since rolling out the right in November, just 6 months ago, we now have 425 reviewers, but the backlog is still mysteriously growing fast. If every reviewer did just 55 reviews, the 22,000 backlog would be gone, in a flash, schwoop, just like that!

But do remember: Rather than speed, quality and depth of patrolling and the use of correct CSD criteria are essential to good reviewing. Do not over-tag. Make use of the message feature to let the creator know about your maintenance tags. See the tutorial again HERE. Get help HERE.

Stay up to date with recent new page developments and have your say, read THIS PAGE.

If you wish to opt-out of future mailings, go here. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 15:43, 21 May 2017 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Flow-enabled[edit]

Ambox warning blue.svgTemplate:Flow-enabled has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Ten Pound Hammer(What did I screw up now?) 04:55, 21 June 2017 (UTC)