|This is Refsworldlee's talk page, where you can send messages and comments to Refsworldlee.|
|Ref is taking a long wikibreak and will be back on Wikipedia intermittently, as the need arises, in the future. Good luck to everyone..|
- 1 Bowie
- 2 Bobby Driscoll - Bylot
- 3 AfD nomination of Nashville Homeless Power Project
- 4 Thanks for your help on the Martin Postle article
- 5 June Mathis
- 6 Mike Pike (referee)
- 7 Fay Kanin
- 8 John Leonard Orr
- 9 Mike Dean
- 10 Mike Dean
- 11 Dorothy Hale
- 12 David Allen Hulse
- 13 Contributions to football articles
- 14 FA Cup Final referees
- 15 Tom Kirkham & Fred Kirkham
- 16 Minor addition proposed to Menstrie Castle page
- 17 Just Noticed You're Back
- 18 Alexanders of Menstrie
- 19 Welcome back
- 20 A barnstar for you!
- 21 Welcome back
- 22 Twas great to hear from you
Bobby Driscoll - Bylot
Hello, I want to request a new rating of my article on Bobby Driscoll - up to a GA-rating. What is your opinion. - Can I dare it? - What is still missing, what too much? - Grammar etc.? Concerning the copyrights, I had problems with the images I had embedded and had to remove them, except the one in the info-box, which is apparently accepted now. Since you're probably busy with your editing-job, take your time. I'm not in a hurry. Thanks in advance. Regards - --Bylot (talk) 09:57, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
AfD nomination of Nashville Homeless Power Project
An article that you have been involved in editing, Nashville Homeless Power Project, has been listed for deletion. If you are interested in the deletion discussion, please participate by adding your comments at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Nashville Homeless Power Project. Thank you. Do you want to opt out of receiving this notice? Eastmain (talk) 18:49, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for your help on the Martin Postle article
I realize how there is so much for to do to make it better. I will work to identify source information to get more information. Right now all the info comes from the internet and article found there. It is me i think (talk) 14:47, 19 April 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for the upgrade on June Mathis. I hadn't intended to give her a rewrite but she kinda needed it. If you can make suggestions on how to move my other ladies up a grade, I'd appreciate it. I don't think more than one of two of my articles will ever be worth submitting for GA, but I'd like to at least get them to B-status. I still have more research materials to scour. EraserGirl (talk) 18:21, 19 April 2008 (UTC)
Mike Pike (referee)
Hey. I never knew that articles being assessed by the author was frowned upon... fair enough. And wouldn't it pass as start by "a particularly useful picture or graphic", depending on how a picture/graphic is defined as "particularly useful". Mattythewhite (talk) 18:36, 19 April 2008 (UTC)
- Ah, I'll keep putting articles up for assessment in mind for future articles. And the article is certainly in need of a good expansion and gets into start class by the skin of its teeth. Any good sources for refs you can think of? Mattythewhite (talk) 20:00, 19 April 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for the rethink on Fay, I couldn't see how she differed from my other articles of the same ilk. Dorothy on the other hand will always be a problem child. I was hoping I would get by because what was there was well represented. I am now sifting through all of Clare Boothe Luce's works with the hope that she may have mentioned Dorothy at length. I am not holding out much hope. EraserGirl (talk) 16:01, 20 April 2008 (UTC)
- Well, as I said on your talk page, I'm so unsure of how much more there is that I've dug my heels in! So good luck with it. Thanks for your post. Ref (chew)(do) 16:03, 20 April 2008 (UTC)
John Leonard Orr
Just for giggles, I cleaned up the citations on John Leonard Orr and I was wondering what is the preferred point where the citations should be sectioned into footnotes and bibliography? when it merely LOOKS unwieldy or has a certainly level of detail? EraserGirl (talk) 04:16, 23 April 2008 (UTC)
- Accidentally found another source today. This article is not on my TODO list, why do I keep playing with it?....I also found nice juicy section on Dorothy Hale in a Luce bio. Enough to give it some lovely texture. EraserGirl (talk) 22:50, 24 April 2008 (UTC)
where shall I start. 'harshly sent off' = npov, whether it's cited or not! numerous selective citations and references supporting Chelsea's view against a single card, selective reference to only a Chelsea appeal. 'being scored marginally after the declared added time had been played at the end of the first half' = weasel words. further, a single game in an article on the whole referee's career - and a not especially important one at the time, played in september - does not warrant a paragraph nearly as long as the ref's background.
wikipedia is a neutral source of facts. it is not for selective citation based bashing of a particular referee for fans of one team for a single match. this is an article on the refereee Mike Dean, not an opinion piece on his performance in any game.
i am very much aware that this game was contentious, and 'could' have changed the outcome of the league, but it is clearly opinion masked through selective citations in a game that for all other clubs in the football league was meaningless. if every ref had a paragraph like this in their article, each of their pages would be never ending gripes on games long past. this article should be a neutral, factual background piece about the ref, summing his whole - many game - career.
if you are able to point out exactly why this should be a special case, exactly why it is notable, and make a neutral, well balanced, short piece, and include all other similar incidents in the entire career of mike, and keep the page within wikipedia's length guidance, then by all means go for it!
- Ah, the IP Address of a blocked user (vandalism)! What a sticky end. Ref (chew)(do) 11:41, 19 March 2013 (UTC)
ok, if you want to play it this way.
Please refrain from making unconstructive edits to Wikipedia, as you did to Mike Dean (referee). Your edits appeared to constitute vandalism and have been reverted. If you would like to experiment, please use the sandbox. Thank you.126.96.36.199 (talk) 22:23, 25 April 2008 (UTC)
please read what I have said. It is not possible to have a detailed discussion of every refereeing decision in the career of a ref on their page. what you have added simply is not notable, as per WP:NOTE. you have picked out one game where one side has an aggrievance and posted it on a page noting the entire career of a referee - this is neither npov, or even fair. If you wish to discuss the article, with myself and other users, please use the talk page of the article and draw up a cogent arguement as to why what you have written should remain. If not will continue to revert this, and shall also analyse other edits you have made to the same topic for other such errors. 188.8.131.52 (talk) 22:28, 25 April 2008 (UTC)
David Allen Hulse
The work of you and others have successfully removed the speedy deletion box on my David Allen Hulse Article. Thank You. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tad Slamp (talk • contribs) 02:51, 3 June 2008 (UTC)
Contributions to football articles
Hi, I wanted to drop by and let you know how much I appreciate your contributions to many football related articles, and most especially those related to refereeing. Thank you, and keep editing! --ChaChaFut (talk) 05:56, 19 February 2009 (UTC)
Hi - User:184.108.40.206 has recently made numerous edits to the article on FA Cup Final referees, but his edit summaries contain words such as "Sorry, can't remember my source for Henry Pearce, so feel free to ignore it." or "Sorry, can't remember my sources for Arthur Holland, but don't ignore it: he was a VERY famous referee (European Nations Cup Final, etc etc". This user is actually the writer Cris Freddi - I have been in correspondence with him many times. He is clearly highly knowledgeable and presumably has access to a huge reference library, but I cannot persuade him to cite any references when he makes amendments.
I expect that some, possibly most, of the amendments he has made to the Cup Final referees page are correct, although I reverted them all because, in many cases, he broke the links to the referee's article, e.g. by altering C.W. Alcock to Charlie Alcock and William Rawson to W.S. Rawson.
If and when you have the time, could you look at the list of referees and Cris Freddi's alterations/edit summaries to see if any of his changes can be re-instated.
I must admit, I think that he is probably correct, but this contradicts so many sources. For example IFFHS  say "“Fred” Kirkham from Burslem officiated at 3 English Cup finals" (This presumably includes the replay in 1902) and the Spurs website says "Fred Kirkham had been a referee for 17 years and had officiated at the 1902 and 1906 FA Cup Finals".
On the other hand, the Sporting Chronicle  refers to the referee at the 1902 final as "T Kirkham" and "Match of the Millenium" (which gives full reports on 100 games involving Southampton FC) gives the referee of the 1902 Final as "T. Kirkham (Burslem)". This site  also gives the referee as "T. Kirkham".
Can you shed any light - I am minded to re-write the Fred Kirkham article and create one for Tom Kirkham but would appreciate someone else's opinion first. Thanks again. Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 08:33, 28 February 2009 (UTC)
Minor addition proposed to Menstrie Castle page
I've got a reference http://www.scottisharchitects.org.uk/building_full.php?id=411804 It's the entry for the 'Menstrie Place Housing Scheme with Menstrie Castle' in the Dictionary of Scottish Architects. It gives a few dates relative to the process of redevelopment. Any use ? Craig Omus (talk) 20:46, 4 March 2010 (UTC)
Just Noticed You're Back
Alexanders of Menstrie
You have perpetuated in this article the very common error that the Alexanders of Menstrie are descended from the Clan MacAlistair. This is highly unverifiable for they are in fact descended from the Clan Donald.
Stirling, Earl of (S, 1633 - dormant 1739)
Creation: let.pat. 14 Jun 1633
Dormant: 4 Dec 1739
Family name: Alexander ____________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Arms: Quarterly: 1st and 4th, per pale Argent and Sable a Chevron and in base a Crescent all counterchanged (Alexander); 2nd and 3rd, Or a Galley oars in action Sable sails furled flagged Gules between three Cross Crosslets of the last (Macdonald); over all on an Escutcheon Argent charged with a Saltire Gules, an Inescutcheon crowned Or charged with a Lion rampant within a Double Tressure flory counterflory Gules (Nova Scotia)
William Alexander (of Menstrie) Earl of Stirling would not have quartered his arms with Macdonald if he were a MacAlistair.
- Hi. First off, as I have consistently included in the article Menstrie Castle a hyperlink to a source which puts the Alexanders firmly in the lineage of the MacAlistairs, it is indeed verifiable (not at all "unverifiable" as you seem to think) - follow the hyperlink in the article for that verification. Secondly, the use of the pseudo-definitive words "in fact" by yourself when attempting to correct me/the article, and then accidentally omitting a named source by poor use of the referencing formatting in Wikipedia (I have changed your mistaken attempt at referencing to a standard hyperlink so we can all see what you are on about). And thirdly, please take a look at Cranntara.org, a notable website which promotes and preserves the culture and history of Scotland, and specifically the page at http://www.cranntara.org.uk/clanmac.htm#cmaca. This too denies your claim regarding "unverifiable" assertions. When you read on through this page, you will note their translation states "Alasdair is the Gaelic for Alexander". You should then realise that the truth is very close at hand.
- You could always fly in the face of my research today, and the sources supporting the current style of the article, and go ahead and make the changes to the article. Wikipedia is for everyone, and no-one owns an article, therefore no permission need be sought from anyone to make such an edit.
- However, based on what I know from my research into the Castle, and its previous landlords and tenants, and indeed based on what I have quoted to you today, I would feel obliged to revert any attempts by anyone to introduce weakly sourced edits into an article which, although difficult to provide sources for in the past, appears to have the correct information, soundly based on those "verifiable" sources currently available on the internet at this time, and also in print.
- I would strongly advise you to repeat the claims you have made to me today in the article talk page Talk:Menstrie Castle. That way, we could possibly get a broader discussion going among a variety of Wikipedia editors, rather than just you and I going "head-to-head", as it were.
- Unfortunately, regarding your final sentence in your message to me, this appears overly speculative ("William Alexander (of Menstrie) Earl of Stirling would not have quartered his arms with Macdonald if he were a MacAlistair"). Who are we as editors of an open source encyclopaedia to engage in what someone would or would not have done, when we have no factual knowledge in this instance? None of us currently living could possibly have been there to witness events (either in the 1630s or the 1730s)!
- From a personal standpoint, I am a little disappointed that your userpage appears to be completely unformed at this point, as it is nice to know something about the editors with which one is interacting, and indeed your usertalk page is certainly unsullied by any discernible talk, so it's not possible to get a taster from that angle either (and is also the reason I am replying to you here and not on your usertalk page). The important thing is that yours is a genuine Wikipedia account, and not one set up purely to achieve any kind of personal agenda or campaign (God forbid!). Ref (chew)(do) 16:03, 15 May 2011 (UTC)
A barnstar for you!
|The Good Article Barnstar|
|Thanks Refsworldlee for helping to promote West Highland White Terrier to Good Article status. Please accept this little sign of appreciation and goodwill from me, because you deserve it. Keep it up, and give someone a pat on the back today. Sp33dyphil "Ad astra" 01:24, 9 October 2011 (UTC)|
- Many thanks. Though recently I have not, and probably in the future will still not, invest as much time in the whole WP project as I used to, or as it deserves. Heigh ho.Ref (chew)(do) 18:19, 30 January 2013 (UTC)
- Just popping in from time to time. Still no signs of me coming back full-time, I'm afraid. But it's nice to hear from you, and I hope you and yours are well. Ref (chew)(do) 22:39, 21 February 2012 (UTC)
Twas great to hear from you
Your warm and informative message -- I had wondered/worried about you -- came in the midst of moving from house (after 37 years) to condo/flat. Not downsizing, but levelizing - no stairs, no snowshoveling. I agree, my intensity on WP is lower than before, but that's mainly because it has somewhat matured. I mostly do protective maintenance against vandals, and like you some drive-by editing when I spot bad grammar or facts. Anyway, I'm glad that you're apparently well and happy. Always delighted to hear from you. Bellagio99 (talk) 14:30, 2 February 2013 (UTC)