User talk:Richerman/Archive 1

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Re: Richard Towneley

Thanks for your input, I do not want to enter an edit war "Some of this came from the website which is the sort of site that would be considered reasonably reliable." I wrote that stuff, so thanks. I think my main complaint about your input is that it relies mainly on websites which do not themselves give any references, is a particular example and I have already explained on the discussion page why the claim about the rainfall measurements being in support of lime hushing has no foundation.

Apart from that I am happy with the current state of the first para and the early life section. The later life and achievements section certainly needs editing as it is all over the place in terms of a time line. I do not have time to make any further changes tonight but one thing I will remove is the claim that the books from his library were donated to Corpus Christi College, Cambridge. I have a copy of his will and nothing left Towneley until 1814 when some of the books were sold and so odd ones ended up in Cambridge. I see that you have no reference for this.

I hope to find time to rewrite the rainfall measurement part later this week in a way that you will be happy with JoshuaRaw (talk) 22:10, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

Hmm, I can't remember where that bit about the books came from now - but if it's not referenced it should go. As I said, you obviously know a lot more about the subject than I do so I'm glad you're taking an interest. I certainly wouldn't want to be putting out anything that isn't true and I don't claim to be any kind of historian. I just find out what I can and put it in while trying not to copy it word for word. Of course, it's easy to misinterpret something when you're doing that. I only recently found out about the part those northern scientists played and thought it was a shame that they had fallen into obscurity and was trying to redress the balance a little by starting an article on RT. However, I'm quite happy for someone who knows more about him to take up the challenge. There's nothing like a bit of wrong information to get people fired up is there? Happy editing - I'll be interested to read your contributions. Oh, and sorry if I seemed to be damning your other work with faint praise. It was some time since i last read it and when I looked again it's got more references than you can shake a stick at!Richerman (talk) 22:58, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

WPGM New Monthly Newsletter

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Kersal Moor

Hello there Richerman, and thank you ever so much for the contact.

The Kersal Moor article was brought to my attention via your decision to join us at the Greater Manchester WikiProject. I had never heard of the place before reading through, and enjoyed broadening my knowledge of the area.

It seems in my efforts to standardise some of the content, and add a few of the more fancy features (such as the categories and infobox), I made a silly change with regards to SSSI and SBI and confused the two with each other.... thus I fully apologise! Hope you can forgive me?? If you can, feel free to contact me anytime should you want to. Crompton Moor is a small article I wrote some time ago which may interest you also. Thanks again for the contact, Jza84 01:14, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Hi jza. Well I suppose I can forgive you just this once you naughty boy! Thanks for the work you did on my article with the infobox etc. I really seem to have got the wikibug now and have contributed an article on Drinkwater Park and a bit about Prestwich Forest park which points to it on the Prestwich page. I've also started obsessively correcting other articles, putting in internal links where they were missing and added citations. Is there a cure for this malady? Perhaps it starts with "My names Nick and I'm a wikipedian". A month ago I didn't know about any of this stuff!
I saw an article on Agecroft Hall recently that is under the Category "Buildings in Virgina". As it was moved there from Agecroft in Salford would it be reasonable to put it under a Salford category too? If so which one? Thanks for the kind words, I enjoyed the Crompton Moor page. Richerman 11:46, 10 October 2007 (UTC)
Yes Wikipedia is incredibly addictive and the scope for contribution is truely huge. I beleive however it is the very greatest webspace avaliable to world at this time! With regards to the Agecroft Hall article, I would be tempted to add it to the History of Salford caregory given its circumstances.
I hope you enjoy Wikipedia and decide to stay. If you take an interest in local geography and adding citation - WP:UKCITIES are useful guidelines on writing about settled areas, Template:Infobox UK place is an excellent tool for presenting infomation about places, and WP:CITET is a helpful page on properly stucturing source material. I have around two years editting experience so if you're struggling with anything, again, do feel free to give me a shout. Jza84 14:10, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Oh, I think I'm hooked now so you won't get rid of me that easily! I've just done some editing and adding information on the Heaton Park page but feel it needs some more work. After a walk round the Park with the dog today I've decided to restructure the article and add a lot more information and photo's. I just hope I don't upset the original author too much.Richerman 01:23, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

It's OK - Be Bold!! We're all encouraged to make big steps in moving articles forwards. If we weren't, nothing much would get completed! Furthermore there is no original author or owner of articles, they're open to everyone. Sometimes you'll make a change that another doesn't like or vice-versa, but that's what the talk pages are there for to work it out.
Don't feel restricted to editting your own user page before rolling out changes either. You could use a notepad page (yours is here), or go straight to the main article space. WP:GA are guidelines on obtaining awards for articles, whilst WP:MOS is the style-guide, or "do's and don'ts" for other details and formatting. Jza84 12:26, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for that, I've taken your advice and gone for the bold approach - how does it look? I've found the help files really difficult to use on wikipedia. For instance, when I've uploaded a file without remembering to put the licence tag on it I really can't work out how to add it later. Reading all the bits I can on it just seems to take me round in a circle about licensing without actually saying how you apply the tag. Also, is there a way to search just the help pages with the WP prefix, as the help contents is very limited? Richerman 12:10, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

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As you rightfully requested!

Yes check.svg
Hello, Richerman/Archive 1, and welcome to Wikiproject Greater Manchester! Thank you for your generous offer to help contribute. I'm sure your input will be much appreciated. I hope you enjoy contributing here and being a Greater Manchester Project Wikipedian!

As a project we aim to have all our articles comply with the various editing policies and guidelines. If you are contributing to an article, it is good practice to ensure that it's properly referenced with reliable sources, otherwise any contentious content may be removed by another editor. A good starting point for articles about settlements in Greater Manchester is the WP:UKCITIES guideline.

If you have any questions, feel free to discuss anything on the project talk page, or to leave a message on my own talk page. Please remember to sign all your comments, and be bold with your ideas. Again, welcome, and happy editing!

I know you're already a member, but thanks to your suggestion we developed the above welcoming template for all our future new-members of the Greater Manchester WikiProject. Hope this is what you had in mind???? Looks like you're getting into the swing of things now, and finding out just how much work there is to be done! -- Jza84 · (talk) 23:36, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

Yes that's exactly the sort of thing, although I'd prefer a bit more text. Maybe I should work on a longer welcome message myself. If you're going to complain you have to be prepared to do the work to put things right. The logo's really good. I hope you've caught up on your sleep now. Richerman 14:20, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Glad you like it! If you do think of some other ideas to put in, please feel free to raise them at the Project talk page so a wider user audience can discuss the changes.
On the topic of policies, they are quite hard to find - though there are literally thousands of policies and guidelines; you'll never get through them all. WP:MOS is quite a helpful place to start. Is there a specific policy your after? I might be able to help, -- Jza84 · (talk) 22:47, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

Of course, I would submit any suggestions for a consensus view. I'm not looking for any policies at the moment, I usually come across them by accident and just wondered if I was missing an easy way of searching. It seems a bit strange that there isn't a way of doing a simple search for say "Image Placement" (just as an example - I know where that one is now). This is why I thought a few pointers on the welcome message would be useful, or maybe it could point to a "cheat sheet" for things like image placement, "citation needed" templates and stuff like that. Richerman 23:42, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

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Does this help? -- Jza84 · (talk) 11:31, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

Oh ok, so it was there all the time - Doh!!! I had seen it but not checked it out properly. Perhaps if it could get a mention in the welcome message even numpties like me would read it. I'll go and fall on my sword now............ Richerman 12:18, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

No it's OK! Don't worry about it! I really admire your ethusiasm, and it is great you're seeking the policies at such an early stage. If you want to put something together for the welcome template which incorporates some of these, I'd certainly support this! Any other questions, please feel free to ask. -- Jza84 · (talk) 12:52, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
I will leave you in peace soon I promise! Just thought I ought to mention that WP:UKCITIES is one of the best guidelines (as opposed to policies) for helping obtain world-class standard articles about British settlements. It's got some great tips on layout, content, and style guides, and has been applied to Manchester, Stretford and Shaw and Crompton to help them along.
Thought I'd best let you know about this one as it's not posted all too well. Good luck with Prestwich and Broughton! -- Jza84 · (talk) 23:47, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
Hi! Thanks for the message! I loved the proposed text for the welcome template! It made alot of sense to make these changes. I was just about to write my repsonse about this! Do you want me to upload this to the welcome template??
On the matter of distance, there's no convention as such; as you're probably aware WP:UKCITIES asks for distances to county towns and principal settlements within districts in the lead section (which is of course difficult for Greater Manchester so the city centre is used, and then typically, Oldham, Bolton, Wigan or the main borough settlement). Probably the most comprehensive (and free!) source for distance calculation is GENUK&I's distance gazetteer, which also gives you the direction!
I've always understood that distances to specific landmarks, particularly a church, could have cultural bias; i.e. does one use an Anglican or Catholic church? Is the cathedral or town hall the main landmark? If we use a war memorial or statue, which memorial/statue is more important? Do all readers know where these landmarks are? It was always the approach (even way before I joined Wikipedia) that a neutral "town/city centre" term was used for settlements, as is used by the very best of articles to which we aspire towards. Does that help at all? -- Jza84 · (talk) 11:34, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Well, yes and no! The Genuki gazeteer sounds very useful but I'm still not sure where the centre of Manchester or Salford are. Is it Piccadilly for Manchester? and Salford doesn't seem to have one at all - where did you take them from - or did you just use genuki? And yes, please put the text on if you're happy with it. Richerman 11:42, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

I just noticed your question on User:Jza84's talk page and though I would let you know that Manchester Cathedral is the official centre of Manchester on maps, at least that is how I have always understood it. and-rewtalk 02:48, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

WPGM Newsletter - November 2007

Rudget Contributions 17:20, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Sunny Lowry

Hi, I've reverted your good faith edit to this article because you jumped to a wrong conclusion based on the Dover Museum article. Wolffe did indeed choose 3 women to train to attempt the crossing but Lowry was the only one of the three who managed it. She was the 3rd woman to cross the channel, the previous 2 were American, she was the first British woman to do it. I specifically worded it this way to make it clear. Thanks for trying to improve the article though. ---- WebHamster 15:59, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

LOL, not following you heheheh, just bored checking my watchlist before I go for lunch :) ---- WebHamster 16:00, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

I just added her to the Longsight page, give me two mins and I'll put that one right before you get there Richerman 16:04, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

Nah, lunch and a long nap first :). I was going to have a go at the Longsight article once I'd finished the Levenshulme and Belle Vue Zoo rewrites, but so much history and so little time. I've had the return the books I was using for research of Belle Vue and I've purchased from Amazon some replacements which I'm waiting to arrive. Longsight train station had quite an impact early on in Belle Vue's history due to its proximity to the Redgate Lane entrance to the Gardens so I may be able to add a bit to that section. ---- WebHamster 20:55, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

Kersal edits

Not quite the entire history section, but most of it.

He does have a point if some of his content's still being used, since he doesn't show up in the article's history and Kersal flats was deleted. A quick glance through the deleted article doesn't show much resemblence, and while I vaguely recall an edit summary on Kersal mentioning a merge somewhere along the line, I didn't pay much attention to it. You'd be in more of a position to know, having written most of the article; I've only had it on my watchlist to stamp out reincarnations of Kersal Massive back when that article was still protected from re-creation. —Cryptic 03:12, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

What happened was he wrote the Kersal Flats article, I put a merge tag on it and he contacted me to say he wanted to keep it seperate and would develop it so I removed the tag to give him chance to sort it out. He did nothing with it for a month or so and then someone else put a merge tag on it. In the meantime someone copied over a chunk of text (not me) and part referenced it. I then objected to the merge as there were no references in the Kersal Flats article and so a delete tag was was put on by someone else and it was deleted with his agreement very quickly. He does have a point I suppose as the proper process wasn't followed but a lot of the stuff he deleted in the Kersal article was added by me anyway and some of his text was copied from other websites. I see he's had another go at it so I've removed a bit more unreferenced stuff and left a message for him on the talk page. What I can't work out is why when he does an large edit the text changes don't show up in the history? And as for that Kersal Massive stuff, what an embarrassment - talk about 15 minutes of fame! Richerman (talk) 18:21, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

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December Newsletter, Issue III

Delivered on December 3rd, 2007 by Rudget. If you do not wish to receive the newsletter, please add two *'s by your username on the Project Mainpage.

Kersal Moor

Hello again!

I've just revisted Kersal Moor (the article!) and found it in a very good shape. I think if we got some of those citations cleaned up with a citation template or two, we could take that article for a Peer Review and probably secure Good article status for it! What do you reckon? -- Jza84 · (talk) 00:48, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

Wow! That's a big jump from the start class-rating it has now although I did think that was a bit mean - although it's not really for me to comment as I'm somewhat biased. Looks like I'll have to do some homework on the citation template - although I think I would do them differently now anyway. Richerman (talk) 00:58, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

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Please note that it is an agreed wikipedia convention that bird species' names are fully capitalised Jimfbleak (talk) 17:06, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

OK, I'll go through and check, thanks for helping anyway. I understand the lion point, and chough wouldn't normally be capped in an non-biology article. Jimfbleak (talk) 17:50, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
Sorry for brusque nature of first comment, I hadn't realised what a mess it was in, tidied up a bit now. "resident" means that it doesn't migrate, I'll fix it Jimfbleak (talk) 18:03, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

Image copyright problem with Image:Public Art Heaton Park.jpg

Image Copyright problem

Thank you for uploading Image:Public Art Heaton Park.jpg. However, it currently is missing information on its copyright status. Wikipedia takes copyright very seriously. It may be deleted soon, unless we can determine the license and the source of the image. If you know this information, then you can add a copyright tag to the image description page.

If you have any questions, please feel free to ask them at the media copyright questions page. Thanks again for your cooperation. NOTE: once you correct this, please remove the tag from the image's page. STBotI (talk) 19:20, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

January Newsletter, Issue IV

Delivered on January 5th, 2008 by Jza84. If you do not wish to receive the newsletter, please add two *'s by your username on the Project Mainpage.

Belle Vue Question

Thanks hjuk (talk) 23:58, 5 January 2008 (UTC)

Working Class Movement Library photo

Thanks for adding it. It's a great pic of the building. I work there. MichaelW (talk) 20:44, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

You're welcome, I recently started work at Salford University so it was no trouble to nip out at lunchtime and take the photo, other than dodging the traffic on the A6 to get a good shot - how we suffer for our art! I took one of the Salford Museum and Art Gallery while I was there too. One day I might get to take one when it's not got a load of cars parked outside. Richerman (talk) 09:56, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

Pendlebury, St John

Hello there Richerman! This was added to yesterday, (along with a few others), and remembered this was your neck of the woods (as they say) and thought you might want to include it on a few pages??? Hope it helps! -- Jza84 · (talk) 15:45, 8 February 2008 (UTC)

Oh, this is a simillar one too! Hope that helps! -- Jza84 · (talk) 15:50, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
Hello again,
I've continued hunting for photographs and found this photograph of the Irwell. It's certainly taken from Salford, but I was hoping to clarify with you which part. Do you think this is from Lower Broughton looking towards Manchester? If so, it might be a good addition to the Broughton article. -- Jza84 · (talk) 11:57, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
I'm not quite sure if it's Lower Broughton or further downstream. I was just looking at it on the River Irwell page and trying to place it. I'll have to have a wander around at lunchtime to see if I can get a better idea of the location as I'm working nearby at Salford University now. Lovely colours in the sky though. BTW I got hold of a copy of The Dark River: The Irwell by Cyril Bracegirdle so I'll be adding to the River Irwell article when I get some time. One thing it says in there is that the Irwell was the first river in the world to be polluted by industrial effluent, which is an interesting point to note. Richerman (talk) 12:17, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
Well spotted! Actually I'm a post-grad from Salford so I shouldn've known that myself! There's loads of free shots of the University at Flickr with a proper licence. Some of Maxwell building and others. I think that one should go anyway, copyright or no copyright!
Come to think of it, I think the location of that photograph might just be Wallness near the University. Looks about right to me. I agree it's a lovely shot. I'm hoping to work on a few more articles soon, particularly Rochdale, Middleton and Salford. I know that though images aren't considered as a tier for featured article status, most people find them incredibly helpful. I think good photographs always help an article along. -- Jza84 · (talk) 13:47, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
Quite right about the images. Salford (article) looks better already! Oh, and thought I'd let you know too that I had to make this ridiculous edit the other day! -- Jza84 · (talk) 16:28, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
Well I suppose it's a bit confusing as it's in the City of Salford. Richerman (talk) 17:12, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

Gallery on River Irwell

I've undone your last revision that removed the gallery.

The code in the gallery section was wrong, but is now right :-)

Mayalld (talk) 15:28, 19 February 2008 (UTC)


Just a note that I've greatly expanded the Salford article in the last week or so and thought you might want to take a look when you get a moment to point me in the right direction. I've also started an interesting and related project at User:Jza84/Sandbox2!

Nice work on the River Irwell by the way! A possible joint GAC with Kersal Moor sometime soon??? -- Jza84 · (talk) 02:00, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

Hello, and thanks for the contact.
The changes I've made are broadly shown by this diff. Some of the stuff is admitted unsourced (but lifted from amature websites with the intention of checking it against some books). I also added the racecourse stuff, but this was lifted directly from the Greater Manchester article; I presumed it would be fairly accurate, but you seem to be aware of other information.
I would like to add more about Kersal Moor in the geography section, and possibly a little more on the River Irwell. The industrial revolution section is still thin (though better than before) simply because I only have one book to hand; it is in this book that states it was "likely" that Salford didn't endure as a mill town because Bolton and Oldham were so dominant at the time.
I also need much more on the Salford Docks. I suppose now, at this stage, I need to obtain a book or two about Salford (print is always a better source than the net, I believe!). I was wondering, do you know of, or can you recommend any in particular that are particularly comprehensive? -- Jza84 · (talk) 15:38, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
They look great!... My books on Salford didn't arrive today, although I did get my hands on something about Greater Manchester's rail network and a book about Victorian Rochdale. Thanks again for the images! I'm hoping to give Salford a major push as soon as the books arrive. It would be great to get it to GA. -- Jza84 · (talk) 14:43, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Geograph images

Good job uploading the geograph images! Take a look at Image:Market Square Wigan.jpg and see what I did - using the geograph template with the image number and author as parameters: {{geograph|42972|Stephen McKay}}. This is so very easy to do, makes the job much easier for you uploading images, ensures proper linkage with the original image on geograph, and chooses the correct licence - cc-by-sa-2.0

b.t.w. You might be better off loading these images directly onto as that's where most people load the geograph images. That way they can be references by any wikimedia project, not just the English Wikipedia.

Any questions, just ask. --TimTay (talk) 14:49, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

Greater Manchester

Tireless Contributor Barnstar.gif The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
This barnstar is awarded for your efforts in helping Greater Manchester to achieve good article status. A great collaborative effort from some of the members of the Greater Manchester WikiProject. Joshiichat 15:47, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

No dramas. I suggest that the current list is added in its entirety on to the Greater Manchester page then as the current one does no t list all the people on the Manchester list in their relevent borough (Archangel1 (talk) 12:50, 10 August 2008 (UTC)).

March Newsletter, Issue V

Delivered on March 8th, 2008 by Jza84. If you do not wish to receive the newsletter, please add two *'s by your username on the Project Mainpage.


Updated DYK query On 16 March, 2008, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Shambles Square, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Great to see Manchester hitting the mainpage! --Espresso Addict (talk) 03:46, 16 March 2008 (UTC)


Updated DYK query On 21 March, 2008, Did you know? was updated with facts from the articles Traditional Easter games and customs, egg rolling, egg tapping, and egg tossing, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.
Updated DYK query On 21 March, 2008, Did you know? was updated with facts from the articles egg hunt, and egg dance, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Maxim(talk) 12:02, 21 March 2008 (UTC)


The text below was posted on my page. IMO it belongs here instead: you were the trigger. `'Míkka>t 17:12, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Happy Easter my friend. Thanks for the nice thought of adding these festive articles! ♦Blofeld of SPECTRE♦ $1,000,000? 16:55, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Re: Tandle Hill

Hi Richerman! Thanks for the contact.

I rarely edit that particular article, but have meant to do for a while (as well as improve Chadderton, Royton and other parts of Oldham borough). I'll have a look again in the book I have to see what else I can find and add it to that page. I didn't see anything about Beech trees from memory though. --Jza84 |  Talk  22:49, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

Bloody hell! Looks like they've updated that site since I last visited! Looks quite good. It's a local authority sponsored site (or was), so it's not too bad. I'll double check the book(s) I have. I don't have anything Royton-specific to hand though. --Jza84 |  Talk  23:02, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

Peterloo Massacre

Do you think the "Witness account" section is appropriate? Otolemur crassicaudatus (talk) 23:40, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

Hmmm, if there was consensus, I did not notice it. Otolemur crassicaudatus (talk) 23:44, 3 April 2008 (UTC)
Generally eye witness accounts should be avoided since it looks like reportage. Otolemur crassicaudatus (talk) 23:53, 3 April 2008 (UTC)
Where does it say that? Richerman (talk) 23:56, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

Salford contingent

A quick question. Does your book by Frow say how large the Salford contingent was for Peterloo? It would be great if we could add it in the new table. :) --Jza84 |  Talk  19:12, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

WP:GM Newsletter

Delivered on April 9th, 2008 by Polishname. If you do not wish to receive the newsletter, please add two *s by your username on the Project Mainpage.


Updated DYK query On 10 April, 2008, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Peterloo Massacre, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

--Bobet 16:49, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

4/22 DYK

Updated DYK query On 22 April, 2008, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Denshaw, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

--Bedford 02:10, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

The Reunion

Yes I done that myself. I recorded the programme using Audacity (available from while listening the BBC Listen Again feature. Audacity can save it as an mp3, which I was then able to upload to mediafire. I got these instructions from a friend so not my own creation :) Hope that helps! SeveroTC 15:29, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

River Irwell

I think the pictures in the Gallery look great, but galleries do tend to come in for some stick come review time.[1]. Have you considered linking to the images to Wikimedia Commons with the {{Commons}} tag instead? --Malleus Fatuorum (talk) 21:34, 25 April 2008 (UTC)

I've copied 4 of the 5 images in the Gallery to WikiCommons, and added the {{Commons}} tag to the article, but the last picture - confluence of the Mersey and Irwell - has no copyright statement, so it would get removed for lack of one. Did it come from Not having access to the all-powerful delete button I can't delete the copies on wikipedia, but all you have to do is tag them for deletion and an administrator will come along and do it. --Malleus Fatuorum (talk) 19:03, 26 April 2008 (UTC)
I'll try and sort something out for the article...... have to dig out my books as the valley has quite a complex geology along it's length. As for the Manchester Marls, they constantly cause debate amongst local geologists so can understand your pains ! Phil aka Geotek (talk) 20:25, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
That would be great, thanks. Richerman (talk) 22:46, 28 April 2008 (UTC)
Just a quick note to say that I've not forgotten about the Irwell geology, I've started a new job and that has kept me busy but I will get round to is asap .. Phil aka Geotek (talk) 00:16, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Warning removal

For your information, (talk) has blanked his/her talk page, removing your vandalism warning.--Ainlina (talk) 15:57, 29 April 2008 (UTC)

Pendle witch trials

Thanks for taking an interest in the Pendle witch trials. It's an article I came across by chance, and like many others it seemed neglected and unloved, so I decided to see what I could do to improve it. Two heads are always going to be better than one though, so whatever improvements you can make, feel free. --Malleus Fatuorum (talk) 00:22, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

Ah, I thought it was one you'd written, I thought it didn't look much like your writing style. In that case I'll be more ruthless with it tomorrow if I get time. Richerman (talk) 00:31, 30 April 2008 (UTC)
Hey, not too ruthless, I hope. ;-) Most of what it looks like today I probably did write. --Malleus Fatuorum (talk) 01:12, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

Peer review

Glad you found my peer review of Kersal Moor and hope it is helpful. I archived it as it had had no replies in two weeks. If you find the peer review helpful, please consider reviewing an article at WP:PR, particularly one with no responses yet at Wikipedia:Peer review/backlog. Yours, Ruhrfisch ><>°° 13:22, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

Greater Manchester WikiProject Newsletter

Delivered on May 1, 2008 by Basketball110. If you do not wish to receive the newsletter, please add two *s by your username on the Project Mainpage.

June Newsletter, Issue VIII

Delivered on June 12, 2008 by Polishname. If you do not wish to receive the newsletter, please add two *s by your username on the Project Mainpage.

Isle of Wight Festival 1970

What about the talk page? I see nothing from you there. And as for Wally, I guess you had to be there or at any other UK festival for the next three years or so. This can all be sourced otherwise than from my own fading memory, and will be. --Rodhullandemu 15:20, 17 June 2008 (UTC)

OK, thanks, I see you've updated the talk page. I'll try to work on it if I have time. --Rodhullandemu 15:36, 17 June 2008 (UTC)

Holkham Hall

No problem; the reason I snapped is because you - you f$%kr - edit conflicted me and lost me about 10 minutes of my life. Anyway, can you step back from the review for a while and let it take its course, and if it it gets to FAR/C then voice up then again. Work in progress until then. Talk to you later. Ceoil (talk) 00:37, 19 June 2008 (UTC)

I wouldn't go name calling Richerman, though I can understand you are frustrated; but bear in mind that FAR is one of the most heated rooms on the site, and that there are genuine strong arguments against littering article with inline cites vs having a robust references section. Unfortunately, these editors have been in this situation before, and its understandable that they would react against such a, well, kick in the teeth, given the hard work that went into the article in the first place. Whatever, I'll let you know when the article is ready again for comment (though my own view is that its grand now!). Bty; yeah the edit conflict thing drives me nuts - espically when you try and back page and you get that goddamn "page has expired msg". Hrmp. Ceoil sláinte 20:27, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
Had typed you a big incitful and long reply, but was in one of my first minutes of the new firefox brouser and hit close window instead of close tab, and...Feck. However, the gist was that Giano's block record is a disgrace to the blocking admins, and pay no heed to it. He is one of the top content editors; and so ye clashed on FAR, but so what. Matters not. Ceoil sláinte 00:33, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

Are you any good with images and Fair use? I added this [2] but templates are telling me its not going to last very long unless I explain myself! EEk! Ceoil sláinte 21:06, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

Thanks; havn't had a bot msg yet about the pic so it seems grand. I'm keen to close this out, so I'd appreciate if you give it a look over and let me know on my talk where you think remaining cites should be added. Don't go overboard though; I'm only human, and everything I've looked at so far has stood up, so excessive citation is not needed. Hopefully this can be resolved before going to FAR/C, and we can all go home. Ceoil sláinte 14:27, 21 June 2008 (UTC)
Havn't read Heaton Park yet, but from a two minute scan:
  • Format the refs - they are most raw urls, and need authors, publication and retrieval dates etc
  • Delink simple terms
  • Merge shot paragraphs and sections.
I've watchlisted it, and will come back later with more subtantioan suggestions. Ceoil sláinte 01:32, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
If you are going to tidy the refs, please, please please don't use the cite php template. It adds so much html, and really makes a confusing mess when trying to edit. Ceoil sláinte 01:49, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
I asked last night that the FAR be closed. I wasn't able to meet all you cite requests because I'm relying on web sources only; but since everything checked out so far, I think the article is fine. What do you think? Ceoil sláinte 13:36, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
He - "Reet good job" - the manc accent never fails to amuse me..."You get aut for nought these days" is up there with "ah they do though don't they though"! Anyway, by cite.php I mean the citation template which takes up so much room and makes editing surrounding text so difficult. eg [3]. Ceoil sláinte 14:07, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
I'm a big fan of regional aceents and think that they revel tns about the mind set of the people. So i find "sorted, mate" and all that Ibiza uncovered/Oasis stuff depressing, and I hated they way many of my friends changed their accent when the went to college. I speak like this; no aplolgies. Ceoil sláinte 14:46, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
It pains me to swear on you talk page, but you are the first to mention to me that prick "Terry Christian" in years, and loaded magazine and sky1 hve done more damage that you would think. Yeah, that kind of "lads" and "tits out" mentality has depreciated regional accents. To be honest I see The League of Gentlemen as more pro than anti-locialism. Ceoil sláinte 15:29, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
Re Oasis, Be Here Now (album) is basic a hatchet job. Its such a funny story and even the band themselves thinks its rubbish. Ha. As an Irishman I am a 'pool (and celtic) supporter 100%; may manchester and edinborough rot. ;) Ceoil sláinte 15:42, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
Thats grand Richerman; I accept your surrender! Talk later. Ceoil sláinte 16:03, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
No, just a tactical retreat - till the next time me bonny lad. Richerman (talk) 16:06, 27 June 2008 (UTC)

License tagging for Image:The Cupola room.jpg

Thanks for uploading Image:The Cupola room.jpg. You don't seem to have indicated the license status of the image. Wikipedia uses a set of image copyright tags to indicate this information; to add a tag to the image, select the appropriate tag from this list, click on this link, then click "Edit this page" and add the tag to the image's description. If there doesn't seem to be a suitable tag, the image is probably not appropriate for use on Wikipedia.

For help in choosing the correct tag, or for any other questions, leave a message on Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. Thank you for your cooperation. --ImageTaggingBot (talk) 23:14, 22 June 2008 (UTC)

You now have rollback


Just a note that I've granted you rights to the Wikipedia:Rollback feature. I'm confident you will use this dangerous weapon wisely. My only surprise is that you didn't have this already. :D --Jza84 |  Talk  16:12, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Well from my last few visits to the university (once or twice in the last few years), the Irwell around the crescent, towards Peel Park (<- now why does that go to Braford?? :P), was looking in pretty good shape - the siting of the cormorant doesn't surprise me one bit! --Jza84 |  Talk  01:45, 3 July 2008 (UTC)

Your comment at Talk:Black_Death/Archive_2#Yersinia_pestis_as_cause

You stated "If he has published work on the subject it should be included in the article - end of story". I disagree. We include QUALITY sources only. Cohn is talking way out of his area of expertise and, not being an expert on the topic he is being cited on, should not be included. We don't just include ANY conspiracy theory either. Cohn lacks any meaningful qualification to make his statements, hence he isn't a quality source. In fact, a lot of his statements have been disproven by quality sources, such as peer-reviewed journals -and a lot of this is already mentioned in the text. When Y.pestis DNA is amplified from samples of the time, the suggestion that it was "first cultured" in Hongkong in the 19th century is meaningless -especially since actual bacteria CULTURE by man was only invented at that time, but is completely irrelevant to the question of previous epidemics. Y.pestis clearly was there at the time, any claim it was not is either a testimony of ignorance or a lie, and either one should not be spread by Wikipedia. -- (talk) 11:05, 16 July 2008 (UTC)


Hi! Just a note that I've been moving some of your images off Wikipedia and on to WikiCommons. Just on the off chance you aren't sure, they'll still function the same as before, but have the benefit of better categorisation and being able to be used on other sister sites, like WikiQuotes and WikiBooks as well as the non-English versions of Wikipedia. There's still about fifty of your flicks still outstanding on Wikipedia. Hope that explains why you might find some were "deleted" from here (they will have the same name at commons and will still display here as normal). :) --Jza84 |  Talk  13:13, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

No problem. I might pick up where I left off later this week. Your flicks have beefed up the Salford and Bury categories nicely. :) --Jza84 |  Talk  13:27, 23 July 2008 (UTC)
That's weird. That image the bot's removing is still around here. I'll restore it. --Jza84 |  Talk  13:45, 23 July 2008 (UTC)
Ahhhh, the transfer process has removed a full stop, causing the bot to think it's gone. My bad, I'll fix it. --Jza84 |  Talk  13:47, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

Re: Vandalism warning

No problem, I'll keep my eye on things. If you spot new distruption (and I miss it), feel free to give me a nudge and I'll turn on the electric fence - so to speak. :) --Jza84 |  Talk  12:19, 25 July 2008 (UTC)

Philips Park, Bury

I just started this article, I thought you might be interested given the amount of work you've done on Kersal Moor :) Parrot of Doom (talk) 15:27, 28 July 2008 (UTC)

I wasn't quite sure which town it comes under - so I went for the borough council, the Clayton article is similarly confusing. Think of it as being like Radcliffe, Greater Manchester. Maybe if someone could clarify things, it could be moved later on. The place is surprisingly difficult to find information on, not even Google Books or the Times Archive is helpful. Looks like another trip to the library is in order. Parrot of Doom (talk) 00:34, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

By the way, I was in the library today and found some info on Drinkwater Park, I thought you might like it so I sneakily took some pics - - IIRC the book is "isbn 90 288 5471 1 / CIP". The pics may move down the page if I add more, but they won't go far. Let me know when you have them and I'll delete. Parrot of Doom (talk) 16:31, 29 July 2008 (UTC)
Click the 'all sizes' button on each image, it'll let you download them at full resolution if you right-click and copy on maximum size. Parrot of Doom (talk) 23:19, 31 July 2008 (UTC)

Trafford Park

I really do want to thank you for your help with Trafford Park. I'm not in the Giano school; I don't believe that any one editor can write a GA, never mind an FA, so I'm grateful for all the help I can get. The GM project's strength, I think, is that we're all trying to help all our articles, and long may that continue. --Malleus Fatuorum (talk) 01:11, 2 August 2008 (UTC)

Thank God for that - hopefully there's only one person in Giani's school! I only went for a look to see how it was getting on, now it's 2.15am and I should have been in bed two hours ago. Glad to help anyway - it's a really interesting article. I think we all get a bit repetitive when we write things on our own but it's much easier to see it in something someone else has written. Richerman (talk) 01:19, 2 August 2008 (UTC)

Re: Another vandal account

Hello there! I've given them a final warning and watchlisted their talk page. Rationale being that because they'd only had a level 2 warning, its difficult to decide whether to shoot to stun, or shoot to kill so to speak. I hope that's agreeable - I won't hesitate to block if there's another cycle. I doubt they'll reform, but apparently "we admins" have to be candid about biting. :S --Jza84 |  Talk  23:16, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

River Irwell

Globe-barnstar2.png The Geography Barnstar
For your hard work on River Irwell, have a nice shiny thing :) Parrot of Doom (talk) 18:11, 2 December 2008 (UTC)

A well-deserved barnstar for getting that smelly old river to GA. :-) --Malleus Fatuorum 19:29, 7 December 2008 (UTC)
Thank you - I got by with (more than) a little help from my friends. And it's not so smelly now - although I still wouldn't want to swim in it! Richerman (talk) 21:08, 7 December 2008 (UTC)

Annoyingly, it looks as though this image will have to be deleted - the author likely died after 1938 or thereabouts. It was highlighted in the FAC review for Radcliffe. I will keep my eye open for other pollution images. In the meanwhile, this image would be a good substitute and since the author is unknown almost certainly copyright expired. Parrot of Doom (talk) 22:20, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, I've swapped it. I think that one shows the state of the river a bit better anyway. Richerman (talk) 22:44, 14 December 2008 (UTC)
I'd really like to find one that shows cocaine needles and turds floating in the river, along with dead fish, sulphuric acid, and various murdered Victorian women, but I've had no luck so far... Parrot of Doom (talk) 22:47, 14 December 2008 (UTC)
Now there's an idea - if we could just build a time machine, maybe we could make a collage. Mind you the sulphuric acid may be hard to capture on film. Richerman (talk) 22:53, 14 December 2008 (UTC)
Here's something you may be interested in - a PDF from The Times, I found it looking for something else completely. It's from the Times archive, let me know when you've done with it and I'll delete it. Parrot of Doom (talk) 23:16, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
PS - your talk page is humungous! Stick some of it in an archive! Parrot of Doom (talk) 23:17, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

I bet...

...if not already, that you will be sick to death of wind power and turbines and the whole malarkey by the end of that FA!! --Jza84 |  Talk  01:50, 20 December 2008 (UTC)

I've attempted a rewrite of the paragraph with 4(!) citation. Cold you take a look and see if any meaning is lost? I think a litte repetition is removed, and if you're happy with it, I can tell Matisse his issue has been addressed. Nev1 (talk) 17:34, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

Gulf stream

I believe all the issues have been addressed now. See what you think. Thegreatdr (talk) 16:52, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

That's ok. We all have different learning curves on here. I've only thrown two articles up for reassessment. Both failed because the GA criteria changed markedly in 2006, and there were few, if any, inline references in those articles. Like most articles on here, Gulf Stream has been worked on by a number of people over the years. Indeed, the first person who put it up for GA had no recollection of doing so, since it was two years ago. I don't think there's such a thing as original editor on here. It's probably best to check the article history, see who did the most extensive edits, then post a message on their talk page. Then if they don't respond, put it up for GAR (or whatever they're abbreviating it as these days.) I have 1800 articles on my watchlist, so I missed your comments on the Gulf Stream talk page. Either way, the matter has been resolved, so whichever route you want to take is fine by wikipedia, other than deletion. =) Thegreatdr (talk) 23:06, 8 January 2009 (UTC)

A man after my own heart

"It's nothing to do with personal taste it's just trivial crap". Couldn't have put it better or more succinctly myself. :-) --Malleus Fatuorum 00:30, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

I wasn't sure if "crap" was the best word to use in the circumstances....... Richerman (talk) 13:32, 13 January 2009 (UTC)


Hello there!

Hope you're not still sore from Scout Moor Wind Farm! I'm hoping to do a bit of an improvement drive for Salford and as I know you've been doing bits and pieces to Kersal Moor and Broughton, I was kinda hoping to get you onboard! It'll be a challenge to get this upto a decent standard, but I'm hoping it could be something of a Peterloo type improvement drive! --Jza84 |  Talk  23:17, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

I'm sorry to hear that. I'm sure you have your priorities right then. Once you feel ready it would be great to work with you on the Salford article. I've been doing bits and pieces but its gonna need a team to make any real progress. Hope everything get's sorted and you're ok. --Jza84 |  Talk  22:09, 18 January 2009 (UTC)

broughton suspension bridge

Thought you may find this interesting. Parrot of Doom (talk) 18:45, 15 April 2009 (UTC)

Fair Ellen

Hi there. I've seen this a few times, I think its also on the Project Gutenburg (sp?) website. I would probably put it on the Radcliffe Tower page.

Did you get my email with the details of the person to contact for the Edwin Waugh grave? Parrot of Doom (talk) 16:08, 23 April 2009 (UTC)

Oops, I didn't notice the tower had its own page - good idea. I've not checked my emails at home since I got back from my hols - I'll have a look tonight, thanks. I also found something about Francis Townley's ghost - he was the commander of the Pretenders "Manchester Regiment" who was hung, decapitated, disembowelled and then given to his friends to be privately interred. They didn't mess about in those days! Richerman (talk) 16:17, 23 April 2009 (UTC)
Ok no problem. Do give them a call, my mate went to a little bit of trouble to get the details so it would be nice to see a result :) He read your Kersal Moor article and enjoyed it. He lives just opposite the church.
I created The Emma today, which may be of interest to you. Parrot of Doom (talk) 16:21, 23 April 2009 (UTC)