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User talk:slakr

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Ludovic Lepic - Chaos.jpg slakr's life is currently frolicking with chaos, so his activity and response times to queries will be highly variable.
Leave a message and he will respond whenever he gets a chance— that is, assuming he gets a chance. Cheers =)
zOMG!!! I need urgent assistance!!!1!!banana?kiwi?



Nuvola apps important blue.svg Ideally, please use this link to post new messages at the bottom. If you can't find something you recently posted, I might have moved it down there or it could have been archived if you posted it over 7 days ago. Cheers :)

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Regarding slakr:

Regarding SineBot:

How do you decide whether an ip is a proxy[edit]

I really wonder, because sometimes obvious proxies tagged as "unlikely an open proxy". If you use free proxy detection tools on the internet, i must say that those tools do not always accurately detect proxies. Regards, 46.221.191.198 (talk) 13:34, 11 April 2017 (UTC)

As far as i can see, user slakr is not active nowadays. Maybe @Kuru: give me a feedback. Thanks. 46.221.172.155 (talk) 17:29, 11 April 2017 (UTC)
It's a mess, honestly. There are some open proxies which are obvious and easy to detect. There are closed proxies which self-identify, and those that do not. There are many that fluctuate; open ports are caught and closed by the owners, connected devices move IPs, etc. I'd say it's about 20% clearly-a-proxy and I block them, 20% clearly not a proxy, and about 60% gray. I try to be as transparent as possible on what I see. Kuru (talk) 18:09, 11 April 2017 (UTC)
Maybe this guide will provide useful information for the IP user. There is also some explanation here. What I can say is that ProcseeBot properly and accurately confirms (only) HTTP proxies. It does not detect the various other types. It is almost impossible to confirm that an IP is not an open proxy, and it is sometimes very difficult to confirm that an IP is an open proxy. At WP:OP we try to go beyond obviously, as obvious is not always correct. -- zzuuzz (talk) 18:24, 11 April 2017 (UTC)
@Zzuuzz:@Kuru:, why don't Wikipedia use proxy detection services like MaxMind and FraudLabs? I think they must be very successfull in detecting proxies, since many companies use them. 46.221.223.113 (talk) 21:11, 11 April 2017 (UTC)
In my own opinion, we generally require greater accuracy, and on a zero budget (plus someone needs to write the tools). We do use the Tor exit list (Extension:TorBlock), which is all accurate and freely available. -- zzuuzz (talk) 21:19, 11 April 2017 (UTC)
If you're talking about my bot, it actually verifies that the proxy is usable firsthand using one of various proxy connection methods. Other services suck as far as that goes and would result in either false positives, false negatives, and/or would put blocking into untrustworthy hands. Some proxies are ephemeral (e.g., those running on a user's home computer are prone to either them turning that computer off or IP reassignment). --slakrtalk / 01:16, 12 April 2017 (UTC)

@Zzuuzz:, why do you think that it should be on a "zero budget"? Unfortunately, the free proxy detection services/tools are not successfull enough and detecting proxies is crucial in dealing with vandalism and sockpuppetry. Why don't WP use more successfull services/tools like MaxMind, FraudLabs, etc.? What's wrong with that? 46.221.175.205 (talk) 08:10, 12 April 2017 (UTC)

Wikipedia is edited by volunteers. I don't know if anyone would want to afford the fees these services charge for data. I also want to point out that editing by proxy on the English Wikipedia is not actually forbidden, so once we know that an IP is a proxy it's not a case of automatically banning it. -- zzuuzz (talk) 08:20, 12 April 2017 (UTC)
I know editing by proxy is not forbidden. But it is forbidden when disruptive editors abuse proxies for sockpuppetry and vandalism. Since current proxy detection techniques on WP are not successfull enough to detect proxies, i wonder why don't Wikipedia use more excellent tools/services. Using more excellent tools/services will dramatically affect SPI cases. Is there an appropriate page to discuss it thoroughly? Also i wonder @JimboWales:'s opinion on this issue. 46.221.187.27 (talk) 15:55, 12 April 2017 (UTC)
If you can provide some examples of inadequate open-proxy detection (e.g., usable proxies and ports that have been missed yet are currently usable), I might be able to accommodate detecting them if/when I have free time. However, to respond to your concerns based on the examples given, services like MaxMind only provide guesses as to the likelihood of an ip being a proxy, while FraudLabs (like MaxMind) provides us no way of verifying them ourselves and no real insight into how long ago they were detected as proxies. These are little better than dns blacklists that would otherwise provide similarly vague information, but all of which make quick unblocking of the occasional user snagged in a dhcp pool or misconfigured server more difficult. As a general whole, while I can't speak for everyone here, I think the general consensus is that we're aware that we won't be able to ever catch all open proxies all the time. ProcseeBot itself, from its inception, was intended mainly to curb rampant and/or likely abuse—not all abuse. --slakrtalk / 04:19, 13 April 2017 (UTC)
I don't know if Slakr is aware of this (especially around page 10), but if the IP user want to pursue it further - to use services such as these (and I agree with Slakr on their usability), will require either funds or a strong negotiating position. In reality only the WMF Foundation could do this. meta:Community health initiative would be the thing to read up on. Personally, I think although we could always use more people who can check open proxies, we currently achieve a fairly good balance. -- zzuuzz (talk) 07:27, 13 April 2017 (UTC)

@Slakr:@Zzuuzz:, i think the proxy detection tools using by WP are also provide likelihood-i noticed that some ips tagged as "proxy" while some ips tagged as "likely proxy". My point is that, since those non-free services i have mentioned above are used by companies, i think they must be more successfull in detecting proxies. As for funding, as far as i remember, WP has donors from all over the world. Thus, i think WP will overcome that problem easily. As i said above, it will affect the spi cases dramatically. Would not it be nice? Btw, thank you for the info regarding WMF zzuuzz. So i should discuss it on WMF, instead of WP? 46.221.178.4 (talk) 20:25, 13 April 2017 (UTC)

Bots Newsletter, April 2017[edit]

Bots Newsletter, April 2017
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Greetings!

The BAG Newsletter is now the Bots Newsletter, per discussion. As such, we've subscribed all bot operators to the newsletter. You can subscribe/unsubscribe from future newsletters by adding/removing your name from this list.

Highlights for this newsletter include:

Arbcom

Magioladitis ARBCOM case has closed. The remedies of the case include:

  • Community encouraged to review common fixes
  • Community encouraged to review policy on cosmetic edits
  • Developers encouraged to improve AWB interface
  • Bot approvals group encouraged to carefully review BRFA scope
  • Reminders/Restrictions specific to Magioladitis
BRFAs

We currently have 27 open bot requests at Wikipedia:Bots/Requests for approval, and could use your help processing!

Discussions

There are multiple ongoing discussions surrounding bot-related matters. In particular:

New things

Several new things are around:

Wikimania

Wikimania 2017 is happening in Montreal, during 9–13 August. If you plan to attend, or give a talk, let us know!

Thank you! edited by:Headbomb 11:35, 12 April 2017 (UTC)


(You can unsubscribe from future newsletters by removing your name from this list.)

Suggest Talk user signature should be a default?[edit]

Sir or Madam:

I've been leaving occas. comments on Talk pages for years, and Sinebot just informed me I should be signing my entries. Which I will now do.

But I don't understand why a signature w/ the user's name isn't simply added by default. As it is, I presume thousands of users are failing, and having to be reminded, to add it. Am I missing something here?

[You're undoubtedly more than a tad busy; no reply needed …]

Best,

Jimlue (talk) 15:04, 14 April 2017 (UTC)

We don't really want people to rely on the bot, as it's not perfect and could go down. --slakrtalk / 23:30, 17 April 2017 (UTC)

Increased to rangeblock[edit]

I went ahead and hardblocked 31.52.138.0/24 for a year after looking at the long term usage here. They won't use that IP address block again anytime soon.
 — Berean Hunter (talk) 23:40, 17 April 2017 (UTC)

@Berean Hunter: I'd recommend notifying the ISP's abuse department (the range's whois lists [1] and [2] as abuse points of contact). I'm not fully versed in the LTA at hand, but in the past, I believe I've had favorable results with using that abuse link with that ISP (surprisingly, that formmail link actually elicited a response). Just be sure to link them to a few obvious, 100%-certain repeat instances and let them know the datestamps are in UTC. --slakrtalk / 00:26, 18 April 2017 (UTC)
I've never gone so far as filed any complaints although I can remember some that probably needed them. That block probably won't stop him from hopping but it will throttle one of his available channels. Cheers,
 — Berean Hunter (talk) 03:03, 18 April 2017 (UTC)

SineBot hewiki[edit]

Hi Slakr

he:User:Sokuya and myself are wondering if it is possible to migrate SineBot to also work on Hebrew Wikipedia?

Kotz (talk) 20:44, 19 April 2017 (UTC)

False positive?[edit]

As in here, I'm 100% positive I put in a signature, yet the Sinebot went and added it, even after I used 4 tildes.. Hmm. SnivyFan1995 = Gunnerfreak from Yohoho Puzzle Pirates 22:52, 20 April 2017 (UTC)