User talk:Xenophrenic

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Notice to posters: Let's try to keep two-way conversations readable. If you post to my talk page, I will just reply here. If I posted recently to another talk page, including your talk page, then that means I have it on my watchlist and will just read responses there. I may also refactor discussions to your talk page for the same reason. Thanks. Xenophrenic (Talk)
  • Incivility: I reserve the right to remove uncivil or disruptive comments and/or threads from this talk page.
  • Spam: I also reserve the right to delete any bulk messages that I regard as spamming.

Helen Caldicott[edit]

I was just wondering where the February 20th came from in the reference you added. I don't see that date on the webpage and the retrieval date in any case would be today. Thanks in advance for your response. --Daffydavid (talk) 01:26, 16 July 2014 (UTC)

Hi, David. The Feb. 20 date isn't a retrieval date, which I didn't add. It's just one of several "page-updated" dates provided by tools (domain origin, website archiving, Google page cache indexing...) indicating the existance of that "advisory-council" information at that date. I was unfortunately unable to find the exact date the webpage was created, or the earliest date when Caldicott was added to the webpage. She has certainly been on their Advisory Council since before February 2014. Here's a 2012 video of her, for example, which describes her in the info-tab as a member of their Advisory Council. If you can find more specific information, please don't hesitate to add it. Regards, Xenophrenic (talk) 17:13, 16 July 2014 (UTC)

Ian Stevenson[edit]

Hi there, regarding this: indeed, I had misread the text. The article says that Huxley was known for the advocacy, not Stevenson. Sorry, thanks and cheers. - DVdm (talk) 13:00, 4 September 2014 (UTC)

No apologies necessary; and thanks for the attention to detail! Xenophrenic (talk) 17:02, 17 September 2014 (UTC)

Jane Fonda[edit]

Note that although footnote 48, the Plebe Summer ... Procedures, is a dead link, there's a valid archive available at Wayback confirming that "Good Night Jane Fonda" calls are expressly prohibited. While the military is often criticized for unnecessary paperwork, it seems unlikely that even they would trouble to so specifically prohibit something that had no significant history of occurring. 2600:1006:B10A:9AF1:5AD:4287:E314:1B02 (talk) 06:58, 7 November 2014 (UTC)

That's a very valid point, and is just one of several reasons I left the content in the article. Another reason is that although the source is "anonymous", Burke knows who the source is and apparently trusts it enough to repeat the story. BTW, thanks for the header edit. Regards, Xenophrenic (talk) 07:45, 7 November 2014 (UTC)

Have you tried WP:BLPN ?[edit]

The choice of WP:ANI was a reasonable one to report the IP, but the biographies of living persons noticeboard is probably a better place for issues about defamatory posts. However, I think that, in the specific case, the best option is semi-protection of the article, which I will request in a few minutes. Robert McClenon (talk) 03:33, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

By the way, I think that the editor in question has four edits, not six, because I think that the 'banana' vandal was someone else. However, that is not important. We need to prevent the insertion of questionable defamatory material. Robert McClenon (talk) 03:33, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

I trust[edit]

you now understand my consistent positions on BLPs even if sometimes it means "bad guys" don't get buckets of s*** piled into articles? Heck I even edited Kim Jong-un. Cheers. Collect (talk) 23:08, 20 February 2015 (UTC)

Salutations, Collect! You and I have recently been in agreement on several different BLP articles; it must surely be a sign of the end times. Do pigs now fly, and hath Hell frozen over as well?
You need not clarify your positions on BLPs with me. To the contrary, I have told you how I admire your generally conservative approach in upholding our BLP policies about disparagement of living people in our articles. The only inconsistency I've observed is that you do not appear to have the same regard for the living people who edit Wikipedia. I've raised this issue with you before regarding your piling of buckets of unsubstantiated s*** upon me here and here, yet you showed no willingness to rectify the situation. "No animus", indeed.
How is it, Collect, that you can be remarkably astute at carefully examining cited sources in a BLP and recognize "No, the sources do not say that", yet you can so carelessly assemble a collection of diffs and comments and wrongly conclude about an editor, "He seeks to make sure that people know how evil the Tea Party movement is, that it is racist, bigoted, homophobic etc."? You came here concerned that I not misunderstand your positions on BLPs; has it occurred to you that other editors may also be concerned that their positions not be misunderstood or mischaracterized? If you have (correctly) sensed a certain curtness and restrained congeniality in our interactions, please know that it is this inconsistency at the root of it. Eighteen months ago, I suggested that we address your misunderstanding and attempt to take advantage of an "opportunity for bridge rebuilding"; that never came to pass, but the offer doesn't come with an expiration date. Regards, Xenophrenic (talk) 18:42, 22 February 2015 (UTC)
On the TPm material - I saw patterns from some editors which I still do not feel in concord with Wikipedia policies - we shall simply disagree at times, but please note that I have never had any sort of "enemies list" at all. I note you point to a NYP section where one editor enters with ""a bunch of damn bullshit" as his commentary, which I found a tad more dismissive that any language I had ever used. Indeed, I found a few of your comments to be an inch less than civil, and a few of your positions which impacted living persons to fall outside the bounds of WP:BLP and I ask that you recognize I could reasonably so view some of your edits. Cheers. Collect (talk) 18:57, 22 February 2015 (UTC)
You speak of "some editors"; I can't really comment on them, nor of any "enemy lists" — my concern here was specifically about you and me in the situation I linked above. In short, you levelled seriously inaccurate charges about me back in 2013, then after you were shown that your comments about me were completely unsubstantiated — and in some cases completely opposite to reality — you chose to let the false statements stand unrectified. Granted, I may not have chosen the best venue in which to approach you about correcting your misstatements, as another editor's remarks already had you on the defensive, but I don't see that as justification since you mentioned me there first. You ask that I "recognize you could reasonably view some of my edits as outside the bounds of WP:BLP"? I've rechecked the edits you posted on your Talk page back in September 2013, as well as the couple edits you posted with your RfC/U entry, and no reasonable person could view any of those as violating our BLP policy. If you are thinking of some other edit of mine, perhaps you could remind me of it? Xenophrenic (talk) 20:40, 18 July 2015 (UTC)
[1] I think is the diff at issue? I regret the misunderstanding -- the IP however sure was showing a decided POV inconsonant with WP:BLP as I am sure you agree. Cheers. Collect (talk) 19:03, 22 February 2015 (UTC)
As that diff shows, it was the IP making the case "There are many media reports clearly showing that the Tea Partiers are racist", while I had to remind the IP editor that it was wrong to label TPers as racist. I reasonably and accurately observed that there was "significant enough reliably sourced information to explore the frequently heard allegations of a racist component", which we are required to do as editors when facing such voluminous reliable sources — as any reasonable editor would agree. Anyway, having one's motivations and actions mischaracterized is no fun, as I'm sure you can attest. Since your comments about me were made so long ago, I'll accept your "I regret the misunderstanding" and pretend you meant it to apply to all of the similar misstatements from that same episode — and we'll consider the matter done. Regards, Xenophrenic (talk) 20:40, 18 July 2015 (UTC)


You might look at Project for the New American Century moreover - I know we are apt at times to disagree, but I think you might find the discussions interesting. Collect (talk) 09:32, 2 March 2015 (UTC)

I took a look. I count myself lucky that I didn't jump into that mess right away, as reports, blocks and a lot of drama followed soon after. Rather happy I missed it. Xenophrenic (talk) 20:40, 18 July 2015 (UTC)

new essay[edit]

The ArbCom case against me is vexatious indeed - I shall not contend against those who taste blood. The main complaint even includes my essays - so I wrote one which I hope you will appreciate WP:Wikipedia and shipwrights. It would be fun to see how others react, indeed. Warm regards, Collect (talk) 04:25, 20 March 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for bringing that essay to my attention. Generally good overall, and an interesting read. I must admit I found myself taking your 'shipwrights' analogy further in my mind, imagining the roles and impact of various other unmentioned, but equally important, people involved in making the "craft which will sail straight and true on the oceans and rivers of the world". The foremen, tasked with keeping the shipwrights working together productively; the suppliers, from whom the shipwrights obtain their raw materials; the dock workers, who try to keep the shipyard uncluttered and free from debris, etc. I'm tempted to play with that in a sandbox somewhere. As for the ArbCom case(s), it appears one particular colleague had both of us in his sights. I'm fortunate that he was only shooting blanks when he took aim at me, and I was therefore never named as a party. Regards, Xenophrenic (talk) 20:40, 18 July 2015 (UTC)


"Spamming" am I? Whatever happened to WP:GOODFAITH? I merely notified you as, due to some prior non-responses, I was unsure how closely you watched the talk page. Deicas (talk) 17:39, 5 August 2015 (UTC)

Hi, Deicas! As I'm sure you are aware, I have the WCAMI article watch-listed. That means I will know when you make edits to that article, and when you leave comments on that article's Talk page. Were you also aware that every time you link my name in your comments (which you have sometimes done multiple times in the very same post), I get notification pings at the top of my screen? Were you also aware that your most recent post to the WCAMI page was an almost identical post to one you left earlier? So yes, "spamming". As for "whatever happened to WP:GOODFAITH?" - I don't understand the question. I never accused you of bad faith. Regards, Xenophrenic (talk) 17:48, 5 August 2015 (UTC)
Do I understand correctly that you assert that the accusation of "spamming" isn't an accusation of misconduct and, thus, and accusation of WP:GOODFAITH violation? Really? I note that you didn't not address your "prior non-responses" to edits on the talk page that caused me to engage in the disputed "spamming".
19:01, 5 August 2015 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Deicas (talkcontribs)
No; yes; incorrect. Regards, Xenophrenic (talk) 20:17, 5 August 2015 (UTC)


Did you get my email? I undeleted the page in question. Doug Weller (talk) 16:29, 9 August 2015 (UTC)

Got it, Doug! And I followed your directions. Thank you very much, and I apologize for the delay - been a hectic weekend. Xenophrenic (talk) 10:43, 10 August 2015 (UTC)
No problem, thanks for the heavy lifting although I am wondering if you intend to pursue it further. Doug Weller (talk) 11:05, 10 August 2015 (UTC)
Emailed you again a couple of days ago for more detail. Doug Weller (talk) 15:41, 17 August 2015 (UTC)
Blocked now, but still would be useful. Doug Weller (talk) 15:48, 17 August 2015 (UTC)