Wikipedia:Village pump (technical): Difference between revisions

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::::I'm not sure, but the relative size of the <nowiki><noinclude></nowiki> section is small compared to the rest of the template. --&nbsp;<span style="border: 1px solid #666666;">[[User:Timc|<span style="background: #666666; color: #ffffff;">&nbsp;timc&nbsp;</span>]][[User_talk:Timc|<span style="background: #ffffff; color: #666666;">&nbsp;talk&nbsp;</span>]]</span>&nbsp; 13:04, 15 August 2006 (UTC)
::::I'm not sure, but the relative size of the <nowiki><noinclude></nowiki> section is small compared to the rest of the template. --&nbsp;<span style="border: 1px solid #666666;">[[User:Timc|<span style="background: #666666; color: #ffffff;">&nbsp;timc&nbsp;</span>]][[User_talk:Timc|<span style="background: #ffffff; color: #666666;">&nbsp;talk&nbsp;</span>]]</span>&nbsp; 13:04, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

:::::&lt;noinclude> sections are included in the pre-expand size. If the documentation is large or frequently changed, I'd recommend that you move it to a subpage. Then you can transclude it into both the &lt;noinclude> section and the talk page. It does indeed stop counting when an item puts it over the limit, this behaviour is intended to allow the bulk of a page to render correctly when there is a single large template present plus a number of small templates further down. The large template will be left out, but the small templates will still be included. -- [[User:Tim Starling|Tim Starling]] 21:18, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

== Fixing a table ==
== Fixing a table ==

Revision as of 21:18, 15 August 2006

 Policy Technical Proposals Idea lab WMF Miscellaneous 
The technical section of the village pump is used to discuss technical issues. Bugs and feature requests should be made at BugZilla since there is no guarantee developers will read this page.

Newcomers to the technical village pump are encouraged to read these guidelines prior to posting here. Questions about MediaWiki in general should be posted at the MediaWiki support desk.

Frequently Asked Questions: (also see Wikipedia:Technical FAQ)

  • Intermittent database lags can make new articles take some minutes to appear, and cause the watchlist, contributions, and page history/old views sometimes not show the very latest changes. This is an ongoing issue we are working on.
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Umm, where did all the images go

I've not been seeing wikipedia images for the last couple of evenings; and can find nowhere on wiki a status report which mentions this. a) are images down or what? b) what's with status reporting? Don't we think it's important? It isn't done well, imo. (though kudos to the people who keep wikipedia up; don't get me wrong.) --Tagishsimon (talk)

Are you using Firefox? It's surprisingly common for people to accidentally block the image server. Right-click one of the empty image boxes and UNCHECK "Block images from". --Brion 23:55, 18 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks Brion. That was indeed the problem. --Tagishsimon (talk)
How does that "accidentally" happen? — Omegatron 15:42, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
In the right-mouse-click context menu for images, "Save as" "Set image as wallpaper" "Block images from this server" and "Properties" are all next to each other. I've accidentally blocked images several time from a website, when trying to view the image properties such as size and image type (and there is no convenient keyboard method to do this that does not involve using the mouse to at least select the image). So, that is how that "accidentally" can happen. --Splarka (rant) 22:42, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Ah. I don't see that option; I guess Adblock removes it (the Adblock option is at the very end of the list where you can't click it by accident). — Omegatron 02:50, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Iframes are very powerful aspect of HTML. Is there any way of enabling them (if only on user pages)? Stephen B Streater 08:30, 26 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

It wouldn't necessarily make sense, because the inner frame would have the wikipedia icon and tabs and such too. Transclusion is an on-wiki feature that does roughly the same thing. You can use style="overflow:auto" if you want the scrollbars. --Interiot 08:43, 26 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
So how would I iframe this video using your technique? The HTML is:
<iframe src="" width="288" height="216" frameborder="0" marginheight="0" marginwidth="0" scrolling="no">
You do not appear to have iframe support.</iframe>
Stephen B Streater 09:26, 26 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I'm surprised it's not a FAQ question, but in general, it's not possible to include off-site images, sounds, or movies as part of a Wikipedia page. You can add a link that users click on to start an off-site video... --Interiot 10:13, 26 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
As I suspected. I think this is an unnecessary restriction, particularly for user pages. Stephen B Streater 17:00, 26 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
It is necessary to prevent abuse, including but not limited to attempts to exploit a certain browser's lack of security. --cesarb 17:48, 26 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
We could fix this with a white list of servers which could be iframed from. Stephen B Streater 18:29, 26 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
As long as we don't allow offsite images, we aren't going to allow offsite anything else, especially things that could cause exploits. You have yet to demonstrate a use for this. --Golbez 23:20, 26 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
No, there is no way and never will be. --Brion 02:14, 27 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Never is a long time. Stephen B Streater 09:34, 28 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I have a potential use for it. My interest is in video. One limitation at the moment is the cost and resources required to serve video. With an iframe, the video does not have to be served from the standard Wikipedia servers. Stephen B Streater 09:33, 28 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

That limitation does not seem to be that much of a problem currently, since the Wikimedia servers already serve several videos; see for instance commons:Category:Video. --cesarb 16:09, 28 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
So can you suggest an automated way to publish my videos onto the Wikipedia server? These are generally shot on my mobile phone; the editing and published is through my web browser (a bit like text is on Wikipedia) on my Mac at home and PCs at work and other computers in various locations. As I use a lot of different computers, editing over the web is a great benefit - I use FORscene for this. Stephen B Streater 16:19, 28 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
But, how would putting video on your user page help improve Wikipedia? Notinasnaid 07:45, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Not many years ago, web pages were devoid of graphics. When the first images appeared, these were not supported by typical browsers. Images were controversial because they took up a lot of server capacity and bandwidth. Just imagine today if every web browser had to install multiple incompatible image plug-ins to look at pictures. Wikipedia would use Ogg for pictures, and hardly anyone would be able to see them. In reality, WP would have almost no pictures and be much poorer for it.
Fast forward ten years and we are in the similar position with video. There are multiple incompatible video players and WP is worried about the server load if video is added to articles. But there are differences:
  • With Java applets, almost anyone can play video without having to install any software, suddenly making it accessible
  • With iframes, video can be served from anywhere, without putting any load on the Wikipedia servers
Wikipedia in the future will include a wide range of video, just like it now contains pictures. This could happen right now, but for the technical iframe restriction added in a completely different context. So adding iframes to my user page will help by opening people's eyes to the future. Removing the iframe restriction would make video immediately accessible. To put this in context, my personal videos have been watched over 8,000 times. This is a popular example. Stephen B Streater 08:17, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
But still, what about the user pages? How could putting your personal videos on your user page benefit Wikipedia? I'm struggling to understand how this can fit in with what user pages are for. Notinasnaid 10:12, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Some user pages are rather minimalist, but over the project their uses range widely. One use is to communicate information about the user to other editors. Trying things out away from article space out is often helpful too - for example using the built in wiki editing functions to develop an article to Wikipedia standards. Many editors have a sprinkling of useful links. Significantly, they can also be used for demonstrating to other Wikipedia editors the possibilities within Wikipedia. Editors can re-use something they like on a user page elsewhere in Wikipedia. This is where adding iframe videos comes in. It is not the content of the videos which is important (and videos need be no more personal than images), but the fact that videos can be edited over the web and published here. Stephen B Streater 12:08, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
If it were to be done, it wouldn't be with (explicit) iframes; it would be with the Image: syntax (whether it uses iframe or object or even embed to do so is immaterial). We already use animated gifs on some articles, so there's no opposition to the use of animation (the videos, however, are usually linked to via the Media: syntax). The main problem would be the sound; while the moving images are contained in a small square area of the screen, the sound isn't (imagine what would happen with a page with three different videos running at the same time). As for Java, it cannot be allowed for security reasons (the same reasons why JavaScript isn't allowed); and much less loading inline content from other sites (nobody wants to allow someone to be able to make one's computer load something like Last Measure or worse; MediaWiki's content filters only allows the use of "safe" file formats, but that restriction cannot be applied to foreign sites; any whitelist would contain only this wiki and Wikimedia Commons, both of which can already be acessed via the image syntax). On the other hand, adding a Java player to the site (not arbitrary Java code, but a fixed code carefully checked for security issues, which could be invoked by the Image: syntax when a video format is detected, and starting playing the video only when an action is made) could be an interesting project (but, since most people would already have to install Java, it wouldn't gain much over making them install a native video player with the appropriate codecs). --cesarb 19:41, 3 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thank you for this comprehensive answer. We can still bring Wikipedia into the 21st century:

  • iframes are a means to an end with the advantage that WP could have wiki-style editing of video today
  • Animated gifs are a help, but are hard to create and edit compared with videos - modern mobile phones come with video cameras these days
  • Sound is not a problem as the video wouldn't start playing until requested. There is also be a mute button for those in a quiet environment
  • Java is secure - that is its point. It should not be confused with JavaScript
  • A Java applet can only access the server it came from, so a white list of sites would avoid the issue of rogue sites being downloaded
  • Java applet code is a safe format
  • Almost everyone has Java installed these days
  • As Java itself is carefully checked for security issues, each player would not need to be

Stephen B Streater 10:07, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

We have plans to put a video player on the site, for things like Apollo program videos, so people don't have to download the videos to play them. I have yet to see a reason why you should be putting video from your camera phone on your user page, however. This has nothing to do with moving into the 21st century. It has to do with "why do you want to put video from your camera phone on your user page?" This isn't YouTube. — Omegatron 15:55, 6 August 2006 (UTC) Fixed link. --cesarb 17:10, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I'd like editors to be able to add videos directly to Wikpedia articles. I'd like people to be able to edit them like they can currently edit text - without needing to install software on their computers. As you point out, this isn't YouTube, it's an encyclopaedia which has unnecessarily poor video support. It has an arbitrary and restrictive requirement for platform specific plug-in installation and lack of cross platform editing functionaility, neither of which are necessary or desirable these days. Stephen B Streater 16:23, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Around 90% of video is now shot on mobile phones, and this figure is rising. It would be hardly surprising if video added to Wikipedia by its teams of editors was largely shot on mobile phones. Stephen B Streater 16:26, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Unfortunately, Omegatron's link was broken. I've now corrected it; take a look at m:Media plugin, where a lot of discussion on this issue has already been made (including some discussion on using Java at m:Talk:Video policy). --cesarb 17:10, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks. I've seen some of that before, but I'll refresh my knowledge. One reason for discussing it here is that it might be possible to sidestep all the discussion about video plug-ins, which are as odd an idea to me as image plug-ins would be, and just add video to Wikipedia. Stephen B Streater 17:32, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Any system for video on Wikipedia has to be easy to use for it to be of any real use. Or perhaps I should say, the easier it is to use, the more use will be made of it. Not just easy for the viewer but for the publisher too. Text definitely sets the benchmark. It is very easy to do, no special software download, you just open up your browser and everything is there. The closer video gets to this the better the system is IMO.

Practically nobody has ogg so practically nobody will watch any of the ogg format videos placed on Wikipedia - so there is no incentive for video to be placed on wikipedia. Java is as good as anyone will get for cross platform support so for video it is a good choice. In this day and age plugins are a waste of time, not only are they a hassle there is also a trust issue - i.e. is one downloading malicious software. mk 22:24, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I think this sums up the current issue pretty well. Video should be as easy as text to view and edit. Stephen B Streater 20:23, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Redlinked images shouldn't go to Special:Upload

This is annoying behaviour when you're trying to find the deletion logs. In particular, a link to the corresponding Commons: deletion log somewhere along the line would be very useful. pfctdayelise (translate?) 13:09, 2 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Agree that that is annoying. The vast majority of people clicking a red image link are probably more interested in the deletion history than uploading a replacemen image. What might work as a nice compromise is: if there is a wpDestFile parameter, it could display a new message at the top (eg MediaWiki:Noimagetext) which would show something like "This image does not exist, you can upload it below. See also the [{{fullurl:Special:Log|page={{urlencode:$1}}}} logs] for this page." by default (which would be easy to add a commons link too). So, go file it at bugzilla as a request ^_^. --Splarka (rant) 21:29, 2 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
There's a javascript fix (which also stops red links from editing and generates lists of red links) at User:Lupin/redlinks.js. Lupin|talk|popups 03:36, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

For some weeks now the article on the town of Edessa, Greece shows a strange message: "The database did not find the text of a page that it should have found, named "Edessa, Greece". etc. etc. In the page history you can see the version of 3 July, but it's impossible to save edits. What's wrong? Markussep 17:47, 4 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Problem has been solved. Markussep 17:49, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

My preferences not being saved

I am trying to change to the "16:12, 15 January 2001" date format, but it doesn't save. I click on the save button and get the "Your preferences have been saved." message, but when I go to a page and bypass my cache, the date format doesn't change. I then go back to Special:Preferences and see that the date format has been reset to "No preference." What's going on? --MC Snowy 18:37, 4 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I am able to change it to the ISO 8601 date fine, did you try that? (the last on the list). This may be related to a post above: #Date_format. --Splarka (rant) 01:34, 5 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Yes, I did try that. It seems to work, but I don't like that format. I like the "16:12, 15 January 2001" date format. --MC Snowy 15:12, 5 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Odd, I have mine set to 'no preference' and I always see that format (16:12, 15 January 2001) in history. What format do you see? --Splarka (rant)
I'm not talking about the history. I'm talking about Help:Preferences#Date format and m:Dynamic dates not working. For example on List of longest reigning Monarchs of the UK, the date format should change according to the preference. And that's the problem, the preference keeps resetting. It only stays if I choose the last format. --MC Snowy 17:45, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I can confirm the same issue. I have not tried other preferences, but my old date preference got switched back to No preference, and now when I select a new preference, it is not saved, although I get the standard Your preferences have been saved message. – Mipadi 18:58, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Me too. I would like [[2006-08-08]] to rend as "8 August 2006", but all I get is 2006-08-08. Changes to "My preferences" don't stick. It used to work as desired, but not for about three-four days. Mr Stephen 13:28, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I am having this same problem. I prefer "August 8, 2006" to "2006-08-08" and I cannot set this, or any of the other ones. Ryūlóng 05:48, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
This appears to be a known bug, according to the last statement (just before the "please sign") in the heading box at the top of this page. Furthermore, this is a cross-project problem; I've confirmed it for en:Wikiquote and meta as well. Can someone identify what the problem is, and when it will be fixed? I've found no specifics discussed here or at Meta. The closest thing I've found in Bugzilla is bug #6830, which, given the response, is being treated as a server configuration error. (I would hope that MediaWiki projects haven't encountered a project-wide configuration error based on a single variable being incorrectly set that hasn't been fixed for several days.) Any specifics would be appreciated. ~ Jeff Q (talk) 05:37, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
The problem appears to have been fixed within the past hour or so. Thanks, folks! ~ Jeff Q (talk) 17:49, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Jumping toolbar

I'm not quite sure what to call it. Those six links ([User name], my talk, my preferences, my watchlist, my contributions, and log out), I'll just call them the toolbar. Anyways, every so often, all of the links suddenly jump to the very left of the page when you try to click on them. It's not a singular computer problem, because I've seen this happen on three different computers. I've seen this question here before, but the only reply was the very ambiguous and unhelpful comment "Tell Microsoft about it." So, why does the toolbar jump to the left?--the ninth bright shiner talk 04:36, 5 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

The only thing I can say for certain about this is that it seems to be browser related. It may have to do with the way the browser handles style sheets. I was having the same problem but only with the IE 7 Beta version 2. I just upgraded to version 3 and the problem went away. Try checking for the latest version of your browser to see if that fixes the problem. Epolk 15:59, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I'm using IE as well, and I'm pretty sure it's the latest version...besides IE Beta v 2...which would be more likely to have problems, as it's a beta program.--the ninth bright shiner talk 03:23, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I had that problem when I had to use IE, but It's fine with firefox. Get a real browser.--Mac Lover Talk 16:09, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Dynamic page/section/list

Does anyone know how to create a dynamic page, or section or list?

Sometimes I have to maintain more than 1 page, of each contains the same information as another. It would be great if something like this can be done:

                 Article A
 ==See also==
                 Article B
 ==See also==  	 
{{dynamic link of Article A#See also}} 	 

Is it possible?--Wai Wai (talk) 08:01, 5 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

A current way to do that is to use templates, but tangentially related to this, there's also a DynamicPageList extension installed on Wikinews. Should it be brought here? Titoxd(?!?) 08:04, 5 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

--- I'm not sure, but it seems bad to do it by templates:

  1. It requires more skills to do so.
  2. it also costs more time to do so.
  3. There may be more name confusions and conflicts.
  4. It saves repetition of process or work after a centralized solution is done.
  5. A centralized solution makes it easy to create special pages, eg the links of dynamic page/section and so on.

A borrowing of the script is the best solution. I vote for it! --Wai Wai (talk) 08:23, 5 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Category redirects appear as category members?

Is this really correct and default behavior? It doesn't sound right that a category would have a redirect to itself as a member. In the case of the Category:Enzymes hierarchy, many subcategories are listed both by common name and by EC number - but the membership oddity creates the appearance that an EC number category, whose meaning is not immediately obvious, contains an explanatory article when in fact it only contains a redirect. Opabinia regalis 06:41, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

So I guess I'm the only one who thinks it's weird for a category to appear as a member of itself? Opabinia regalis 02:30, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Problem with text in SVG

I am using inkscape and when I upload images wich contein some text they are not correctly visualized in wikipedia (even if inkscape do it correctly): the text either is not visualized at all or is replaced by "black blocks" such as this. Can someone help me to find out what is the problem?--Pokipsy76 17:08, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

This has been asked before here; the problem is that inkscape is generating SVGs using the current draft of the next version of the SVG standard, instead of the current version. Neither rsvg (which Wikipedia uses) nor Firefox understand the new elements. --cesarb 21:05, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
My answer last time this question was asked: [1]. --cesarb 16:46, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Page Templates

Hi all-

i dont know if this has or has not been asked (and if it has, sorry!). also, sorry about this, but it has very little to do with wikipedia and more with mediawiki (but i have not found the answer yet).

in a mediawiki-driven wiki, is there a way to create a "new page" template, so that when a new page is created it is automatically populated with a basic framework?

thanks in advance. if you dont want to clutter this area up with a response, please post it to my talk page.

Jeremys779 20:54, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

You can do it easily, by making it voluntary: In MediaWiki:Newarticletext add a link like <span class="plainlinks">[{{fullurl:{{FULLPAGENAMEE}}|action=edit&preload=Template:Outline}} Preload outline]</span>, and then create the outline in Template:Outline. People clicking the link will be returned to the same nonexistant page with the template preloaded. You can add a whole menu of different styles if you want (probably by making subpages of Template:Outline, laziest/easiest method).
I don't know an easy way to force the issue, however. A javascript to add &preload to all links might work, but be messy. Possibly an extension could do it with minimal changes to MediaWiki. Or, you could make the message in MediaWiki:Newarticletext so annoying that people have no choice but to click the link to the preload (not advised ^_^). --Splarka (rant) 21:34, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
PS: you can also add a &editintro= to the url which will show a template above the edit form (where preload shows it inside the edit form textarea). --Splarka (rant) 21:43, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I think that this is done in Wiktionary (you can select a predefined format for a word type), so there must be a way. —Daniel (‽) 21:00, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
That is done via Wiktionary:MediaWiki:Noexactmatch, using <inputbox>. This still is voluntary, and doesn't show when someone clicks a red link (only shows when someone uses the search box). There are also ways to insert frameworks via MediaWiki:Edittools (also voluntary, as opposed to "automatically populated"). --Splarka (rant) 07:23, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

XML export format change

Is there anywhere that Sunday (6 August's) Special:Export XML change is documented?

I use XML widely and the format change has caused chaos. Especially now the Wikipedia is at odds with other Wikis (here is an example where Wikinfo is trying to import a Wikipedia page: - all the revisions are now there due to the XML change)

--Scotthatton 08:49, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

The only recent change I can see to it is revision 15959, which added an "experimental history paging API", and should not have changed anything on the output, except that you now do not get the full history by default. It's possible that your code was expecting to get only the top revision, without explicitly asking for it, and now that the code to get the history has been enabled again, it got confused by it; if so, your code is wrong (it should have asked explicitly for only the top revision). How are you using Special:Export? At least for me, it only returns either a single revision (when I ask for the top revision) or nothing (when I ask for the history); you must be doing something different. --cesarb 21:57, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I am using GetWiki 1.0 to retrieve the export page - as does WikInfo and many other sites. Coded this way, the Wikipedia Special:Export now has a different method than other Wikis. Surely this is bad news? --Scotthatton 07:59, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I downloaded the code and took a quick look at it (it's getwiki.php on that package). The import code is an ugly and brittle hack; instead of parsing the XML structure, it waits for an element (for instance "title"), outputs a prefix, waits for its end tag while outputting all the text, and outputs a suffix (and, in an even uglier hack, the prefix for "title" opens a comment on the output, while the prefix for "text" closes it, this way hiding everything in between). It also completely disregards the fact that XML is case-sensitive, and also completely disregards the fact that MediaWiki's schema uses a namespace (which means that, if Tim decided to change the XML to use a namespace prefix, all correctly implemented parsers would still parse it, and it would have changed exactly nothing in the XML structure, but this parser would break completely). It's doing almost the same thing as treating the XML as a text file and parsing it by hand with regexps.
Since the code is so brittle, it's no wonder it breaks; it's expecting exactly one revision, formatted in the XML in exactly the same way, while there's nothing on the schema which requires it to have only one revision, or even exactly that formatting. For performance reasons, the export code used to return only one revision; now that the code has added a limit of 200 revisions, the performance issue no longer exists, and it helpfully returns more than one revision. The broken way the getwiki code was implemented is completely unable to even notice there's more than one revision, and it happily outputs everything it finds, printing junk which was meant to be in a comment outside of one (since the comment was closed before the first revision text, by the ugly prefixing hack; in fact you can see the comment closing just before all the other revisions).
Personally, I'd throw that whole file (getwiki.php) in the recycle bin and rewrite it completely from scratch — in a way that respects the structure of the XML data, instead of blindly outputting stuff in reaction to each known tag. And I would make it request only one revision from Special:Export (there's a parameter to request only the top revision, use it!), instead of second-guessing how many it would return. --cesarb 14:40, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
For future reference, this has also been discussed at bugzilla:6946 (currently marked as INVALID). --cesarb 15:10, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Show/Hide colour on NavHead

Hi there. Does anyone have any idea how I might be able to make the Show/Hide text displays as white in the following code?.

Many thanks. --Mcginnly | Natter 11:38, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I do not use CSS, do you ? It seems that you have here a template = Template:Dynamic_navigation_box, or Template:Hidden, using a NavFrame class that is referred to in a script = javascript:toggleNavigationBar. Looks like that one is defined in the general script for user preferences = MediaWiki:Monobook.js, with no attributes. These objects have their page here in Wikipedia.
Maybe you could invoke another script with more parameters to play, but few people shall try your invention, unless you publish it (in one of your user subpages). Does that help ? -- DLL .. T 19:37, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
And see also the former section "Show/Hide bars" which tells you about divs. If you, as I do, ignore everything about div, ask for more help. -- DLL .. T 19:43, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Sorry but I'm non the wiser. I know what CSS stands for and that's about it. I need instructions as to how to change the colour.--Mcginnly | Natter 22:46, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
You could wrap the whole thing in <div class="charboxwhite"></div> but then *all* links would be white, so you'd have to use <div class="charboxblue"></div> for the content. Unfortunately the javascript doesn't seem to allow multiple classes (like class="NavHead charboxwhite") or wrapping just the header div in another div. See below for an example. Also, see MediaWiki:Common.css for all such available class colors. Note: these classes are for something else, but the only way to change link colors for this javascript-created element are to add anchor color changes to the global css, so they work for this example. --Splarka (rant) 07:38, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Image on Commons not appearing in Wikipedia

I am trying to upload the kalidas_smarak.jpg image on the article Kalidas. I tried to upload the image more than a week ago; however, the image still does not appear. How do I resolve this problem? Thanks!--Wikindian 14:21, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I can't find your image at the commons on the link you've given above or in the article - are you sure it hasn't been deleted due to lack of copyright info etc? or could you provide me with a link?--Mcginnly | Natter 15:00, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
File:Kalidas smarak.jpg
The Kalidas Smarak at Ramtek
Is this the image? Maybe it's a problem with server caching generating the thumbnail. --Aude (talk contribs) 15:24, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks, it shows up now. Wikindian 15:31, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Userboxes in Babel template

I am trying to use generic userboxes in the Babel template.

e.g. this is a sample code

This works fine.. however i am trying to understand how to use a generic userbox like this


can anyone help me do that.. this doesn't seem to work for the cases where the userbox code expects an argument with a |. In other words, I don't know how to pass an argument to the userbox inside the Babel template

--Rev.bayes 20:06, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Try {{Babel|header = Computing | programming-!4{{!}}MATLAB }}Mets501 (talk) 20:49, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Wikipedia keeps switching to underlining the Wiki links and I can't figure out how to turn it off. Any help? Thanks! Sparsefarce 20:31, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Yeah, it happens to everyone: it's unpreventable. When it happens, though, you can do a hard refresh to get rid of it temporarily; Mozilla/Safari: hold down Shift while clicking Reload (or press Ctrl-Shift-R), IE: press Ctrl-F5, Opera/Konqueror: press F5. —Mets501 (talk) 20:42, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I just click preferences, then click save, without changing any preferences. Michael Z. 2006-08-08 21:37 Z
It is preventable, just add a { text-decoration: underline; } to your personal css if it bugs you overly much. Also see the Frequently Asked Questions at the top of this page, this question gets asked twice a week. --Splarka (rant) 07:46, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
How the heck did that get to the wrong section. Damn mediawiki! Thanks Patrick. --Splarka (rant) 22:30, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I am trying to nominate for afd the second time

I used {{subst:AfDx|second}} and got to step two, but when I go to step three, it returns me to the old afd instead of allowing me to log the article. The article is Syrnia but I end up at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Syrnia even though I completed step two and have written up my own reason. Mattisse(talk) 21:03, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Must be OK, I got "Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Syrnia (second nomination)" -- DLL .. T 21:11, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
But I never logged it on the deletion log (the third step). You mean that it is logged anyway? Mattisse(talk) 21:14, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I saw the problem and completed it, putting it into the log. There are a few bad links left out there that don't go to the right place for the daily log. What did you click on to try step 3? Fan-1967 21:24, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I clicked on the usual arrow on the template placed on the article. (Just where I would if it were a first time nomination.) Mattisse(talk) 21:34, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
OK, I found it. The AFD template got fixed, but not the AFDx. I left a note to get it corrected. Fan-1967 21:38, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks! Probably what happened is that when I nominated it I did not know that it already had a nomination history. I changed the template once I was directed to the first nomination. Changing the template probably screwed things up. Mattisse(talk) 21:48, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Actually the template was already screwed up, and you probably got confused when it dropped you into the wrong page instead of the daily log. It's been fixed now, for the next person. Fan-1967 21:52, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Userbox Categories

How can I make every user that has Template:User Narnia on his page, in the category "Users who love Narnia" or something like that? Bornagain4 00:03, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

For every user who hasn't subst'ed the template you can add [[Category:INSERT CATEGORY NAME]] to Template:User NarniaMets501 (talk) 00:09, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thank u Bornagin4 00:13, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

What does it mean when an article's discussion page is a disambiguation page?

This is the case with Robert A Cunningham. So there is no way to have a discussion about the page. Mattisse(talk) 12:18, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thank you. Mattisse(talk) 12:30, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I encountered the case, it is easily generated and unseen. Just move an article and replace its original name with a disambiguation page. The discussion is stuck with one of the pages and a redirect created on the other.
To remove the template, you have to access the disamb link : click on the link following the words "redirected from" - or add &redirect=no to the address. Does that help ? -- DLL .. T 19:12, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

How to change the stub category on an article? - disease vs. marketing term

The article in question is Sisi syndrome. I know that I could just change it myself but that might be improper, given my objections to its being categorized as a disease given on the talk page. Is there a person/process that is in change of choosing what category a stub goes in? Mattisse(talk) 14:34, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I would say that, even if you're completely correct about it not being a real disease (personally, I don't consider AD/HD to be a real disease, or any other bundle of symptoms which can have many different causes), it still falls, technically, under the "disease" category, the same way that an article explaining a fraudulent fossil might still fall under paleontology or archeology. --Kaz 17:35, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
O.K. Thanks. Mattisse(talk) 17:45, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Pages Created, and Page Views?

I have two things I'm curious about, and I'm hoping there's a script for finding them out:

  • Is there a way to see a list of all articles I've created? It'd just be fun to see, but the user contributions page, unlike the watchlist, doesn't show the N flag for new pages.
  • Is there any way to see a list of page views for a given page? Essentailly, a tally of how often the page is loaded (by people using wikipedia, I know it'd exclude all the many users reading sites copying the wiki database), as you'd have in a log analyzer or page tracker. Again, this would be for fun, it'd be nice to see how much, if any, a given page I (or someone else) created has served the readers.

--Kaz 17:30, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

  • Special:Newpages now allows filtering by username.
  • The MediaWiki page hit counters aren't enabled on Wikimedia due to performance issues (as the pages have to be cached to deal with the traffic, several thousand hits per second). Best thing to do is compare the number of edits. There is nothing you can do personally to log the hits (as it should be, as this would violate privacy issues).
--Splarka (rant) 22:28, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Articles-I've-created is a resource-intensive query, and isn't available on-wiki (though Special:Newpages shows the last couple of days, per Splarka). However, I'm happy to run this query for anyone at any time if they ask on my talk page (example). --Interiot 03:42, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Date & Time format will not save

The problem is, my Date and Time Preferences will not save. I go in, check the format I want, save it, and when I check it afterwards it has changed back to 'No preference'. This has only been happening in the past several days. Be gentle - I am very computer challenged.

Michael David 20:46, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Everyone's having this problem. There's nothing we can do about it yet (check above for a few postings of this same problem). —Mets501 (talk) 20:48, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Should be fixed now -- Tim Starling 18:48, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Nominated article using Afdx - since article was deleted July 23

But old discussion shows up on afd log. Article is Anthony Ulwick. My nomination is Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Anthony Ulwick (second nomination). The one showing up on today's afd log is Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Anthony Ulwick. That is the problem. Mattisse(talk) 21:47, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Seeking techie input on Sidebar redesign

We are looking for PHP programmers, and techies who know their way around the guts of Wikipedia. We need your advice at Wikipedia:Village pump (proposals)#Sidebar redesign proposal. --Nexus Seven 03:23, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Global search and replace

Dear friends:

Is there a global search-and-replace function over several pages?


GeorgeLouis 03:56, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

No. Dragons flight 04:00, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
There's that bot that does some related job : but please check each page when using it. It's called AutoWikiBrowser. -- DLL .. T 19:14, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Emergency bot shutoff button

There is something wrong with the emergency bot shutoff button. It has different problems in different browsers. All of my browsers are the latest versions as is my operating system (Mac OS 10.4.7), which has all of the updates. (I have to use multiple browsers because they all have serious problems with one or more of the following problems: website compatibility, bugs, lack of features, ease of use and speed (both for loading web pages and large downloads from high-speed sites, a browser can be good at one but not the other). If they had an updated Internet Explorer browser for Macintosh with tabbed browsing, effective pop-up blocking and the ability to force pages to open in a new tab instead of a new window, or if they only made Firefox with good bookmark handling and greater compatibility, I would pay $150 for it, easily.)

In Firefox for Macintosh, the link to "Special:Blockip/bot name" that is supposed to be in the button extends far past its boundaries. I am unable to click on the "history" link at the top of the template page, it goes to the block page instead. It interferes with the links on the pages it is used on, too. The link extends far below the button as well. Another problem is that the "Administrators: Use this button if the bot is malfunctioning." text is partially inside the button. On my screen, the word "button" is mostly on the edge of the circle and the tips of the "t"s are inside of it. Finally, there is a lot of space between "Emergency bot shutoff button" and the circle.

In Netscape 7.2 for Macintosh, it is the same as Firefox, except that the block link does not extend as far up, so I am able to click on the history link at the top of the page.

In Safari 2.0.4, the button is much smaller than in Firefox, perhaps smaller than it is supposed to be. Like in Firefox, the block link extends far beyond the boundaries of the button. Also, the distance between "Emergency bot shutoff button" and the button is large for the size of the button. Finally, there is a huge distance between the button and the "Administrators: Use this button if the bot is malfunctioning." text.

In Internet Explorer for Macintosh 5.2.3, the button is very small, the link extends beyond the button's boundary's and there is a large distance between "Emergency bot shutoff button" and "Administrators: Use this button if the bot is malfunctioning." text. The distance is so large and the button so small that the block link only extend's halfway to the text on the bottom and the top. -- Kjkolb 04:51, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Wikipedia site only shows alt text only (no images) - Firefox

I have no problem on other sites, or when using IE on Wikipedia, but Firefox (my standard/pref'd browser) gives me only alt text, even when I set a user-agent spoofer to fake being IE.

If I click thru on alt text and then click on an image file's name, I can get to the image and display it, without changing user agent or anything. But nothing by alt txt in-line or elsewhere on the topic-article pages themselves.

ALSO, of course: No math formulas.

--Any ideas? Multiloquent 05:38, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Make sure you don't have images disabled. Try hitting F9 and reloading, or checking privacy settings. --NE2 05:54, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

> GOT IT. Thanks. Developer's toolbar by chrispederick defaults to block offsite img's.


IT'S NOT SO SIMPLE. It has been happening with MOZILLA 1.7.11 too, with images enabled. The trouble is, on first visiting an article, images are OK. The second time (ie., after viewing the article's history) all images just vanish. This began to happen only this week. --AVM 04:18, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Don't know which license to use for image

Needing a good portrait of the subject of a Wikipedia article, I e-mailed him personally with the request. He responded with a few high quality jpegs to use for this purpose. Now, I don't know which license tag to use for the images. Any help please? Thanks si»abhorreo»T 02:55, 5 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

He needs to state explicitly that he releases them under a free for any purpose license, including the creation of derivative works and commercial uses without further permission. Typically, on Wikipedia, this is the Gnu Free Documentation License, but images are permitted under the Creative Commons licenses as long as they are the kind that allow commercial use and derivation. This particular case is confused somewhat if you specifically asked for use on Wikipedia and he granted that without having been told about the terms required or licensing them himself. Probably, it is not good enough in that case, and another email exchanged would be better.
Once you have such an email, upload the images using whichever tag is appropriate to the free license used (probably simply {{GFDL}} or {{cc-by-sa}}, {{cc-by-sa-2.0}} etc), with an additional note regarding sourcing and licensing on the image page. Also, email a copy of his emails to the Foundation at permissions dot wikimedia dot org so that the Foundation has a piece of notpaper to wave around if it comes to it.
Unless the copyright owner has made this kind of copyright statement, then such a tag should not be used. The best that could be claimed is fair use in a relevant article. -Splash - tk 03:07, 5 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Well, he is a big enough star that all this talk of licensing and him forfeiting his rights and giving it away for free etc may very well scare him off. I know that if I was in his position and didn't know about this stuff, I would probably get nervous about doing something like this, worrying that it's something I might regret later. Is there any way for him to give (even more) explicit xpermission for it to be used on Wikipedia, which will let me use a tag like this Template:WithPermission? Thanks si»abhorreo»T 15:51, 6 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
No, I'm afraid we no longer accept images with permission to use only on Wikipedia, because it limits reuse. You could try asking him to release just one of the images under a free license, or just low-resolution versions of the images. If this doesn't work, I'm afraid you can't upload them. Deco 18:33, 6 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

This was bumped off of Village pump (technical) a while ago, but the matter has come back up, so I copy/pasted the above section from an old version of the page

OK, I got an e-mail in which the owner of the image explicitly releases it under a free license. When I tried to forward our e-mail exchange to "Foundation at permissions dot wikimedia dot org", however, I got an address does not exist error. Did I get the address wrong or has it changed or what? si»abhorreo»T 23:49, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Wikipedia:Requesting copyright permission and Wikipedia:Example requests for permission have another email address; try that one. --cesarb 02:35, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Bug in What Links Here?

Compare [2] with [3]. Seljuk Turks is a redirect to Seljuq dynasty. The page Seljuk Turk (singular) redirects to Seljuk Turks, thereby creating a double redirect. However, it doesn't show up at all in the list of links to Seljuq dynasty. What's going on here? Ardric47 00:42, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

As far as I know, double redirects do not show up on the Special:Whatlinkshere page. It's doing what it should as it shows the redirect. -- JLaTondre 00:53, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Actually, it's the triple redirects that do not show up. Look at the Whatlinkshere for Seljuk Turks and for Seljuq dynasty; the one for the redirect has more than 500 items, while the one for the article has less than that. It's not that it isn't showing for being a double redirect; a number of other articles aren't showing too (Eshrefoglu, for instance; in fact, the whole second page of Whatlinkshere results for the redirect). I've purged the redirect; it's possible that, when the job queue gets to it, the problem fixes itself. --cesarb 01:43, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
In fact, the article I just mentioned gets its link from a template; I've purged the template too, just in case. --cesarb 01:47, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Yes, double redirects definitely show up. I did null edits on three templates that linked to Seljuk Turks, but that didn't fix it, either. Why is the job queue so long right now? Ardric47 02:05, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

long table of contents

I am promoting a merger of a long list of articles to a single one. My current proposed solution is at User:GarrieIrons/Westfields in Australia. My first immediate problem is the Table of Contents is longer than one screen. I understand it can be floated, but can the TOC be "fiddled" to "roll-up" subsections until they are clicked on? There are geographical sections based on Australian states and cities. I would like to see 1. Promotional Activities 2. Common Franchises 3. New South Wales 4. etc

But if you click on 1, 2, or 3, it expand so you get 3. New South Wales 3.1 Bondi Junction 3.2 etc.

Any suggestions? Have I merged too many articles, or do I need to turn some elements from real section headings to "pretend" section headings just using bold text? Garrie 00:55, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

First, take all your "External links" sections and merge them into a single one at the end. Then, remove a lot of headings; in several places, for instance, the heading "Stores" can be turned into a sentence like "Stores in this mall include:". These subsections all are small enough to not need to be separate. You will end up with most of the malls having no subheadings, and the few ones which need subheadings with one or at most two. Now the TOC is no longer the problem; if the article is too long, split it by geographic region, with a separate main article for the "lead". Hope this helps. --cesarb 01:33, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I am aware that currently the page is a series of pages which each had sections, dumped onto a single page. I am still concerned that "just" having the states, and the locations within the state that have a Westfield, will result in quite a long TOC. Hopefully, floating it will help this problem.
I don't really want to strip the link to each store's entry on the external website down to a single external link, at the time of launching the merged page. Maybe later when the noise dies down....
However is it possible to have "rollover" style TOC? Garrie 22:38, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Finding and eliminating fair use galleries

We've decided that it's a good idea to get rid of fair use galleries, as they violate our core principles, but ... how do we find them other than trying to remember on our own where each of us saw them? One way I could think of is to use a <gallery>-type regex on a db dump, finding galleries with four or more images in them, and then checking the description pages on those images to see if they have any of the fair-use image templates on them. This won't be perfect, as some images don't have the exact templates, but rather, have a written out fair use rationale, but this could be a start. Might anyone be interested in pursuing this? I don't really have the technical ability to do it, but hopefully someone else does! --Cyde Weys 06:26, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Might it not be easier to check the usage of fair use images (by Whatlinkshere on templates in Category:Non-free_image_copyright_tags), making sure they are only used on one (or rarely two) pages? Any other usage (including galleries) could be eliminated. This does bring up another interesting problem: Are galleries on category pages (automatically generated) against the core principles? If so, __NOGALLERY__ might be needed on some categories. --Splarka (rant) 07:21, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Where'd the TOCs go?

Um... I'm not seeing any Tables of Contents anymore, even though my preferences still indicate I should see them. Am I the only one? - dcljr (talk) 08:20, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Nevermind, they're back. - dcljr (talk) 08:21, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Any way to remove underscoring of within-article hypertext?

The argument for underscoring is, I suppose, that newbies will more quickly figure that the hypertext is a link. As reader, however, I underscoring an unnecessary distraction. Thx. Thomasmeeks 15:28, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Either go to your perferences and click on the "misc" tab, then select "never" for the underlining links part. Or you can put this in your monobook.css:
a { text-decoration: none; }

If you don't want to bother with links at all, use:

/* IE-able */
a, {color: black; text-decoration: none;}
/* NON IE */
a, {color: inherit; text-decoration: none;}

GeorgeMoney (talk) 15:41, 11 August 2006 (UTC) Thx. Done. BW, Thomasmeeks 16:52, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Problem in fixing disambiguation link in userbox template

Hi, I was doing a bit of fixing of disambiguation links from Bucks Fizz, which can be either Bucks Fizz (band) or Bucks Fizz (cocktail). I found that the disambiguation page linked to User:Fizzerbear, who had this userbox template, saying "This user loves Bucks Fizz." After checking the context to see if the user loves the drink or the pop group (the template has "fan-3", and the user also loves ABBA and Kylie Minogue), I changed [[Bucks Fizz]] to [[Bucks Fizz (band)|Bucks Fizz]]. I pressed Preview, to see if it worked, and it actually appeared as "Bucks Fizz (band)". In other words, the piped link didn't work. I tried using the square brackets, but they were visible when I pressed preview. It seems that it should be possible for that template to allow a link to a favourite group without having to show the full Wikipedia title of the page. Any ideas? Thanks. AnnH 09:42, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

The trick is to use {{!}} instead of the pipe |. I have fixed the userpage. Kusma (討論) 09:52, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Many thanks. I must remember that for the future. AnnH 10:01, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I assume you tried something like {{User artist-3|Bucks Fizz (band)|Bucks Fizz}}, which calls the template with two parameters. You could do it like this: {{User artist-3|Bucks Fizz (band){{!}}Bucks Fizz}} (which is an ugly hack and should best be avoided if possible). The | is interpreted as a parameter separator in template calls, so it can't be used as part of the text for a parameter. MediaWiki software lacks an escape mechanism for terminal syntax symbols. A better way would be to change the template to have an additional parameter that takes the part "Bucks Fizz" of the call and add the pipe inside the template. --Ligulem 10:02, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

col and colgroup

Is there a way to define the {col} and {colgroup} attributes within a table using wiki markup? If so, how? I'd like to have all the numbers in one column aligned to the right but it is a pain to define the alignment in each cell. Help:Table is most useless when it comes to this question. Many thanks! -- Rune Welsh | ταλκ 10:45, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

What links here bug?

This shows no pages linking to the page [[Image:editcount.png]] (I'm not linking it here lest it eliminate this problem!) and there are no file links listed on the image page. However, it is linked to as [[:Image:editcount.png]] from Wikipedia:WikiProject edit counters. Is this a bug? Lupin|talk|popups 11:50, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

It's a known, ahem, "limitation" of the software. The workaround is {{notorphan}}. --cesarb 13:45, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Ah, thanks. Lupin|talk|popups 20:33, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Wikipedia sidebar redesign problems

We are redesigning the sidebar that appears on every page of Wikipedia. However, we've run into some implementation problems. The biggest one is that we can't put a new menu below the search box. We need capable php programmers and those knowledgeable about the MediaWiki software to figure out a way. Please join us at Wikipedia talk:Village pump (proposals)/Sidebar redesign. --Nexus Seven 11:54, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Date format and preference problem

I've built a mediawki 1.7.1 installation at work. Dates appear in whatever format I type them in (ISO, whatever), not what I have set in preferences. Also, the ISO date link as one unit (y/m/d all as one), not as m/d and year as on wikipedia. How can I fix this? Do I need a plugin or extension? Is this being caused by one or two issues? There should be a guide on "How to get mediawiki to work just like Wikipedia" somewhere-;) Rlevse 12:18, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

It was the same here on WP until a couple of days ago when Tim Starling fixed it. —Mets501 (talk) 12:45, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Yea, but I need it fixed on my mediawiki installation. How? Rlevse 13:20, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
FYI, Tim Starling told me the code is already in DateFormatter.php and all one has to do is set set $wgUseDynamicDates = true; in LocalSettings.php. Rlevse 11:49, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


How does one make a template, such as an infobox, a certain width? Bornagain4 15:41, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

It depends if the template uses a width parameter. See this : Template:Dynamic_navigation_box. Does that help ? -- DLL .. T 19:06, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Page history

When comparing two versions of a page on the page history, users (or at least me) have to click multiple times on the little dots on each version of the page. It would be nice if one did not have to do this every time one wants to compare another user's edits. Respectfully, Republitarian 17:27, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

There is an option to click on "Older edit" or "Newer edit" to see the diffs one at a time. Stephen B Streater 17:59, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
If you have a tabbed browser, you can also hold [ctrl] and click a bunch of those little (diff) links in a series to open them into new tabs. --Splarka (rant) 22:35, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Small table text

Is there any way of making all of the text in a table small, by putting just one tag around the table itself? Jim (Talk) 19:28, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

A table:
A table with a font-size:80% in the style:
A table with a font-size:80% in a wrapping div's style:
HTH. --Splarka (rant) 22:38, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks, Splarka. I get the feeling I should have figured this out for myself! Apologies for asking stupid questions... Jim (Talk) 10:13, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

CAT:CSD problem?

For some reason Vincent Mercer appears in CAT:CSD, yet the article isn't tagged for deletion. Am I missing something? What's up? --ZimZalaBim (talk) 21:43, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Ok, it has now disappeared, without any changes being made to the article. --ZimZalaBim (talk) 21:50, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
It was because a template transcluded into the article, which was briefly tagged as CSD. --cesarb 23:13, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Trying to make an infobox template

This is what I have:

the code is at User:Musaabdulrashid/sandbox, feel free to play with it.

Simon Fraser University Pipe Band

Established 1966
Location Burnaby, British Columbia
Competition Grade 1
Pipe Major Terry Lee
Drum Sergeant J. Reid Maxwell
Tartan Ancient Fraser
Notable Honours Winner, World Pipe Band Championships: 1995, 1996, 1999, 2001

But this is what I want:

????? Thanks--Musaabdulrashid 08:30, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I tried inserting <HR> tags, which didn't quite get the effect you were looking for, but repositioning them may help, I'll try again-

Userpage | Talk | contributions | sandbox | second sandbox | edit count


I am in this picture, here

My name is Mic, sometimes spelled Musaabdulrashid. I am basically a good person, though I am often at the wrong place at the wrong time. I like steering things and going places, so I will probably be attending either the United States Merchant Marine Academy, SUNY Maritime College, or California Maritime Academy next year. I play the bagpipes competitively in Grade 3, and that is where all my real knowledge is.


Musaabdulrashid's notable wikipedia moments

  • this log: When I tried to delete the article on my high school and failed miserably.
  • Wikipedia:WikiProject Pipe Bands The project I started to improve pipe band articles. I've written dozens of articles and created several templates, including an infobox (you can help!).
  • my 1000th edit

Recommended Pages

Old accounts

Pages created with old accounts

Here are some tasks awaiting attention:

Selected Picture


The layout design for these subpages is at Portal:Islam/Selected picture/Layout.

  1. Add a new Selected picture to the next available subpage.
  2. Update "max=" to new total for its {{Random portal component}} on the main page.

Selected pictures list

Portal:Islam/Selected picture/1

Sixty Dome Mosque
Sixty Dome Mosque
Credit: Bellayet

The Sixty Dome Mosque is a medieval mosque located in Bagerhat, Bangladesh, built by Muslim saint Khan Jahan Ali in mid 15th century. This unique masonry mosque with 81 domes (including 4 corner domes) is a UNESCO world heritage site.

Portal:Islam/Selected picture/2

Chechen separatist fighter praying during the First Chechen War
Chechen separatist fighter praying during the First Chechen War
Credit: Mikhail Evstafiev

Chechen separatist fighter praying during the First Chechen War

Portal:Islam/Selected picture/3

Tanzanians protesting the 2008-2009 Gaza bombardment
Tanzanians protesting the 2008-2009 Gaza bombardment
Credit: Muhammad Mahdi Karim

Tanzanians protesting the 2008-2009 Gaza bombardment

Portal:Islam/Selected picture/4

Sultan al-Atrash
Sultan al-Atrash
Credit: American Colony (Jerusalem) photo dept. (edited by Durova)

Sultan al-Atrash, (1891-1982) was a prominent Arab Druze leader, Syrian nationalist and Commander General of the Great Syrian Revolution (1925-1927).

Portal:Islam/Selected picture/5

Malcolm X
Malcolm X
Credit: Ed Ford (edited by Durova)

Malcolm X (born Malcolm Little; May 19, 1925 – February 21, 1965), also known as El-Hajj Malik El-Shabazz, was an African American Muslim minister, public speaker, and human rights activist.

Portal:Islam/Selected picture/6

Saddam Hussein
Saddam Hussein
Credit: US Department of Defense (edited by Jjron)

Saddam Hussein Abd al-Majid al-Tikriti (April 28, 1937 – December 30, 2006) was the President of Iraq from July 16, 1979 until April 9, 2003.

Portal:Islam/Selected picture/7

Mohammed Alim Khan, Emir of Bukhara, 1911
Mohammed Alim Khan, Emir of Bukhara, 1911
Credit: Sergei Mikhailovich Prokudin-Gorskii

An early colour photograph of the Emir of Bukhara, Mohammed Alim Khan, in 1911, taken by Sergei Mikhailovich Prokudin-Gorskii as part of his work to document the Russian Empire from 1909 to 1915. Alim Khan, a direct descendant of Genghis Khan, was the last emir of the Manghit dynasty. He reigned from 1911 to 1920, fleeing to Afghanistan when the Bolsheviks annexed Bukhara and proclaimed the Bukharan People's Republic.

Portal:Islam/Selected picture/8

Credit: Baba66

The Tughra (طغراء) of Mahmud II. A tughra is a Turkish paisley-like calligraphic seal or signature used at the beginning of sultans' decrees. These colorful emblems incorporated the ruler's name and title in intricate vegetal inscriptions designed by neshanis, or court calligraphers. Parallel to the European signet, tughras often appeared on coins and stamps of the Ottoman Empire.

Portal:Islam/Selected picture/9

Palestinian costume
Palestinian costume
Credit: American Colony (Jerusalem) Photo Depart.

A young woman from Ramallah, c. 1898-1914. Until the 1940s, women of Palestine wore elaborate handcrafted garments. The creation and maintenance of these items played a significant role in their lives. A knowledgeable observer could determine a woman's village of origin and social status from her clothing. The circular band near this woman's forehead is a ring of coins made from a portion of her dowry money, and indicates that she is unmarried.

Portal:Islam/Selected picture/10

Example of an ijazah, or diploma of competency in Arabic calligraphy
Example of an ijazah, or diploma of competency in Arabic calligraphy
Credit: 'Ali Ra'if Efendi, (edited by Durova)

Example of an ijazah, or diploma of competency in Arabic calligraphy

Portal:Islam/Selected picture/11

1905 Stereoscope. Original caption reads: The native mode of grinding coffee, Palestine.
1905 Stereoscope. Original caption reads: The native mode of grinding coffee, Palestine.
Credit: Meadville, Pa. : Keystone View Company (edited by Durova)

1905 Stereoscope. Original caption reads: The native mode of grinding coffee, Palestine.

Portal:Islam/Selected picture/12

Turkish trenches on the shores of the Dead Sea
Turkish trenches on the shores of the Dead Sea
Credit: American Colony Jerusalem (edited by Durova)

Turkish trenches on the shores of the Dead Sea, part of the Sinai and Palestine Campaign during the Middle Eastern theatre of World War I

Portal:Islam/Selected picture/13

Palestinian costume
Palestinian costume
Credit: American colony photographers (edited by Durova)

A Bedouin woman in Jerusalem, sometime between 1898 and 1914, dressed in Palestinian costume, the traditional clothing worn by Palestinians. Many of the handcrafted garments were richly embroidered and the creation and maintenance of these items played a significant role in the lives of the region's women. Until the 1940s, traditional Palestinian costumes reflected a woman's economic status, whether married or single, and the town or district of origin, and a knowledgeable observer could glean such information from the fabric, colors, cut, and embroidery motifs (or lack thereof) in a given woman's apparel.

Portal:Islam/Selected picture/14

Example of celebration of the month of Ramadan
Example of celebration of the month of Ramadan
Credit: Crescent is colourfully decorated and beautifully illuminated during Ramadan

Example of celebration of the month of Ramadan

Portal:Islam/Selected picture/15

Faisal Mosque
Faisal Mosque
Credit: Usmanmiski

The Faisal Mosque (Urdu: فیصل مسجد) is a mosque located in Islamabad, Pakistan. It is Located on the foothills of Margalla Hills in Islamabad, the mosque features a contemporary design consisting of eight sides of concrete shell and is inspired by a Bedouin tent, and is considered to be the city's main Landmark.


Feel free to add related featured pictures to the above list. Other pictures may be nominated here.

  1. Faisal Mosque
    Faisal Mosque
Credit: Usmanmiski

The Faisal Mosque (Urdu: فیصل مسجد) is a mosque located in Islamabad, Pakistan. Located on the foothills of Margalla Hills in Islamabad, the mosque features a contemporary design consisting of eight sides of concrete shell and is inspired by a Bedouin tent, and is considered to be the city's Landmark.

  1. Sixty Dome Mosque
    Sixty Dome Mosque
Credit: Bellayet

The Sixty Dome Mosque is a medieval mosque located in Bagerhat, Bangladesh, built by Muslim saint Khan Jahan Ali in mid 15th century. This unique masonry mosque with 81 domes (including 4 corner domes) is a UNESCO world heritage site.


Simon Fraser University Pipe Band
LocationBurnaby, British Columbia
Pipe majorTerry Lee
Drum sergeantJ. Reid Maxwell
TartanAncient Fraser
Notable honoursWinner, World Pipe Band Championships: 1995, 1996, 1999, 2001
Lynbarn 14:11, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Try using class="infobox bordered" instead of class="infobox". It probably isn't exactly what you want, but it should be a start (it adds borders between the table cells). When using bordered, you can control the borders with other classes (borderless, mergedtoprow and mergedrow). Unfortunately, I don't know where all this is documented; you might want to ask the one who added these classes to MediaWiki:Common.css, he might help you with that. --cesarb 16:35, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Ohhhh, awesom. This is very nice looking except that I have to shorten "Drum Sergeant" to "D. Sergeant" or else it would look like Reid was the drum and Ancient Fraser was the Sergeant tartan. I am going to go ahead and create this now and work out the kinks later. Thank you all--Musaabdulrashid 20:03, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Is there any section which explains the various tags within the XML dump file

I would like to publish the contents of wikipedia on my site. I am looking for a list of all the possible xml tags and their explanation. Any idea where I can locate that information. Thanks. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by (talkcontribs) 09:10, August 12, 2006 (UTC).

The list of the possible XML tags, and what is allowed within each of them, is on the XML Schema which can be found at --cesarb 16:47, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Promotional image tag

I want to upload a promotional image for a band. I've found the correct tag: {{promotional}} However, I can't figure out what to put for licensing. I've gone down the drop-down list numerous times, and none of them seem to correspond. Could anyone with a bit more experience uploading images help me out a bit? Thanks in advance! --NinjaCharlie 16:57, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

If you just type the tag into the box, then that shall suffice. You do not have to selected an item from the drop down box. (I also corrected the display of the template above. To talk about a template but not show it, you need to add tl| before the name, so the above would be {{tl|promotional}} and will display as above. It helps prevent confusion and since this page isn't being applied the Promotional copyright, it's also not correct to put it on here like that. No big deal though.) Be sure to include the source URL or whatever you found the image. MECUtalk 17:09, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Oops, sorry about that. Thank you for the help! --NinjaCharlie 17:13, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

search box focus

How would one go about making the focus of a Wikipedia site the search box every time? For example, if you opened the Main Page and you wanted a blinking cursor in the search box without any input from the user, how would you do that or where would be a good place to find out? Thanks.ndyguy 18:15, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

If you're using the monobook skin, press [alt]-f to put the cursor in the search box. There's no way to do it automatically. —Mets501 (talk) 18:36, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Bummer, but thanks for the info. ndyguy 18:44, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Add to Special:Mypage/monobook.js:
addOnloadHook(function() {document.getElementById('searchform').elements[0].focus(); return false;;});
--Splarka (rant) 20:25, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Awesome, works like a charm. Thank you. --ndyguy 20:32, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

next and previous page

Hi all,

at the dutch wikibooks we like to use the buttons "next page" and "previous page" in a book (see: : '← Vorige'). However this method is very stupid when the sequence of the pages is changed, or if a page is added or removed (the 'surrounding' pages have to be changed too).

Is there a way to 'calculate' the next and previous link automatically? My idea was to make for each book a page with a table of contents in a specific layout so the computer can read it. By placing a template the computer can look into the TOC-page and calculate the previous and next page. Is something like this possible, has anyone a link? You can answer in this page, or at nl:b:overleg gebruiker:MADe

Hmm, what could be done is to put it all in a 'table of contents' type template. This would require one base template (I chose Template:Pageflip to test) for the system and then one sub-template for each book (eg Template:Pageflip/Test book). Whenever you wanted to add/remove/rearrange pages, you need only edit the TOC subtemplate for that one book, which maintains a list of the next and previous page for each page (and must also contain the name of the book as the first parameter). The implementation is just one #switch which calls a next/for generating template, eg:
|Pageflip/Test book=Edit this template to add, remove, or rearrange pages.
|Test book/Table of Contents={{Pageflip|Test book||Forward}}
|Test book/Forward={{Pageflip|Test book|Table of Contents|Page 1}}
|Test book/Page 1={{Pageflip|Test book|Forward|Page 2}}
|Test book/Page 2={{Pageflip|Test book|Page 1|Index}}
|Test book/Index={{Pageflip|Test book|Page 2|}}
|#default=Note: This page is not listed in the [[Template:Pageflip/Test book|Page list template]]. Please add it.
And then it requires just one parameter-free template on each page of the book. See wikiasite:Scratchpad:Test book and view the source of the pages to see it in action. However, if you wanted a TOC in hujman readable format, it would need to be maintained (as it could not be easily generated from this list while keeping the list easy to edit), so there would be at least two pages needing editing with this method. Still, makes it easy to totally rearrange a book's pages with just two edits. Let me know if you need any help or more information/possibilities. --Splarka (rant) 05:05, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Ok, it works! See nl:b:Firefox for an example.

Wiki markup

Shouldn't we have a central guide to wiki markup?--Mac Lover Talk 23:13, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

There is a guide here, is that what you are looking for? Prodego talk 23:42, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
No, but I found a link to what I wanted. Thanks.--Mac Lover Talk 04:00, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Page history problems - can't view changes

I can't view the changes between different versions i.e. the "compare selected versions" in the history of pages. I was always able to until one day I fiddled around in my preferences and now whenever I want to view the differences between past pages, a file download window always appears asking to download a file named "index" of an unknown file type and when I open this file, with Internet Explorer some random text appears. What's wrong? How do I fix this? I tried going through my preferences and changing them back - but the problem is still there! Please help!! Tanzeel 23:41, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

You probably turned on "Use external diff by default" which is under the Editing section of your preferences. Turning it off should fix the problem. Let me know if it doesn't, happy editing! Prodego talk 23:45, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

How to escape indents?

Hi, how do I make sure a new paragraph starts at the leftmost point, past a picture that might keep it indented? Example: 118 WallyPower. If your browser window has the right width, the "Features" section title is indented (because its below a picture) while the accompanying hr-line is not. I'd like to move both elements a bit down, and I know there is a mediawiki command for that ("move an element as much down as needed so that it can stay leftmost"). Can anybody tell me its name?

Question 2: Can anybody pinpoint me to the complete mediawiki command set overview?

Thanks! :-) Peter S. 23:54, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Answer to the first question: use {{-}}.-gadfium 00:40, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
To the second question: see Wikipedia:Quick guide, or if you want a printed sheet, use Image:Cheatsheet-en.pdf.-gadfium 00:44, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Fantastic, thanks! :-) I'm actually looking for a guide that is very complete, ideally it should also include things like this template. Might I suggest we create one if there is none? Peter S. 00:51, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I suggest you go to Wikipedia:Help Project to suggest and participate in improvements to the help system. For useful templates, Wikipedia:Template is one starting point. Category:Wikipedia special effects templates is a different starting point, or Category:Wikipedia templates as a more general listing. Templates are different from the MediaWiki command set, because many will be specific to the English Wikipedia.-gadfium 01:09, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Comparing Articles

I comparing articles fine when I'm logged off. But when I try to compare articles when I'm logged in, Firefox opens up a prompt box that tells me to download index.php.  Demonblade  (talk)  09:52, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Is your alt key (or equivalent) stuck down somehow? Tap it a couple times, see if that makes it work? (though if it were stuck down, it would make all links try to download) --Interiot 10:10, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
See also the section "Page history problems - can't view changes" (scroll two sections up). --Ligulem 10:18, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Problem fix, in preferences just disable the external editing thing.  Demonblade  (talk)  11:43, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Trouble Staying Logged In

I'm having an awful time trying to figure out why I can't stay logged in. I thought it had a connection with some software on my computer, and it seemed to be OK yesterday, but now today, I can't stay logged in beyond navigating to another page.

Anyone have any idea

I have made sure to enable cookies

I have the same problem on both my wife's computer and mine

I have the same problem with Mozilla Firefox and IE

I DON'T have the problem at work

I have updated Java and Macromedia Flash

I thought that there was a conflict with Kodak Easyshare software, because disbling it seemed to work yesterday, but it doesn't help today. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by (talkcontribs) 12:24, August 13, 2006 (UTC).

Parsing a variable on os Special: page

Please see MediaWiki talk:Linkshere, regarding passing a variable in to this display. Thanks! — xaosflux Talk 16:17, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


How do I add a link to a category, as in [[Category:Living people]] without it categorizing the page and the link disappearing? AdamBiswanger1 20:24, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

[[:Category:Living people]] note the colon. Martin 20:31, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanx AdamBiswanger1 20:31, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

'Unreferenced' template

Please see Template talk:Unreferenced#Format problem for a format problem with this template which needs to be sorted. Thanks, MPF 23:32, 13 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

"Or" logic in templates

An infobox is being designed at Wikipedia:WikiProject Narnia/Sandbox/NarniaCharacterInfobox2. As will be made clearer when seeing the example template used on the talk page there, all five of the parameters under the "Family" category are optional. Supposing none of these are filled out, the long cell that groups them, that says "family," should not appear. However, neither User:Lsommerer, the template designer, nor I know how to fix it so that if neither "spouse" nor "parents" nor "children" nor "siblings" nor "otherFamily" are used, then the "Family" disappears. Thanks! --Fbv65edel / ☑t / ☛c || 01:49, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Concatenate them all together, and then check with a single #if: ? --Interiot 01:58, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Here are all the parserfunctions available: m:ParserFunctions. There's no easy way to do it. Perhaps create an if for each and if at the end it isn't there, then nothing, otherwise display. You may be able to use the swtich as well. MECUtalk 02:01, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks for your help. I'll take a look. --Fbv65edel / ☑t / ☛c || 02:19, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
What I described does in fact work... see User talk:Interiot/sandbox/or. {{#if: }} checks to see if its first argument is blank, so if you concatenate several parameters together, and they're still blank, then that means that none of the parameters were set. --Interiot 02:35, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks Interiot. That's what I was missing. The example was quite helpful. LloydSommerer 03:13, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

New template limits, Special:ExpandTemplates

The new template expansion limits, announced on wikitech-l and wikipedia-l, are now in effect on a trial basis. Keep an eye out for any broken articles. Note that there is some information to help track down problems in comments in the HTML source of the parser output. To help editors to substitute templates for literal text in problem articles, I've introduced a new special page: Special:ExpandTemplates. It works like adding subst: to all the templates, except you don't have to repeatedly save the page. -- Tim Starling 07:41, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Example [4]: Shows a test with inclusions of template:cite web, where the limit is reached at 267 example calls of cite web. The critical thing is the Pre-expand include size, which is now limited to 1MB (Look at the html source of the page and find the string "Pre-expand include size", which is included in a html comment). The html contains {{cite web}}<!-- WARNING: template omitted, pre-expand include size too large --> for calls that exceed the Pre-expand include size limit. --Ligulem 09:13, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I'm not sure where to discuss this, but I have noticed several pages that use "Template:Familytree" include that template a number of times, and when it gets to about 26 transclusions they aren't expanded any more. Here's an example: User:Timc/Sandbox. --  timc  talk   02:54, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Template:Familytree is large and ugly. You can either reduce its size, to allow you to fit more of them in the 1MB limit, or you can subst it into pages instead of including. -- Tim Starling 03:33, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Tim, how does the limit work with things bounded by <noinclude> tags (or everything not bounded by <onlyinclude> tags) on the template page? Do they add towards the limit or does only the info which is actually transcluded for evaluation counted? I'd assume they aren't included in the computation, but worth checking. Also, {{listadmins}} fails now, but lists the Pre-expand include size as 'only' 837703. I assume it stops counting at and doesn't include the item that puts it over the limit? --CBD 10:55, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I'm not sure, but the relative size of the <noinclude> section is small compared to the rest of the template. --  timc  talk   13:04, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
<noinclude> sections are included in the pre-expand size. If the documentation is large or frequently changed, I'd recommend that you move it to a subpage. Then you can transclude it into both the <noinclude> section and the talk page. It does indeed stop counting when an item puts it over the limit, this behaviour is intended to allow the bulk of a page to render correctly when there is a single large template present plus a number of small templates further down. The large template will be left out, but the small templates will still be included. -- Tim Starling 21:18, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Fixing a table

I've pretty much completed a table apart from one small bug, their is a white part in the top right corner i don't want to be there pretty much for aesthetic reasons, so could someone possibly take a look at the code and try and fix it, I can't see where the problem is User:Curswine/Sandbox/Regionalliga. --shanda 14:27, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I've fixed it, see this diff. —Mets501 (talk) 14:39, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks for that, but now the information in the 'goals' column can no longer be seen, anyway to get around that? --shanda 14:47, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Looks like you already fixed it? --Splarka (rant) 01:35, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

What happend to watermark image id="EnWpMpBook2"?

It dissappeared this weekend systemwide in all wikis. It's used on alternative mainpage designs here, but at ka: it was on the frontpage. Does someone know the reason? Would appreciate. - Alsandro · T · w:ka: Th · T 14:46, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Viewing Musical Notation

How do i view musical notation? I've asked lots of people that use wikipedia and they all have the same problem, instead of showing a sharp or flat symbol it just displays a square.. you can see an example on this Bebop article:

The problem is because the symbols are stored as the Unicode for those symbols (which is fine), and you might not have a font which knows how to display them. Get Code2000, return to the website and see if the problem is still there. —Daniel (‽) 16:05, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Or just get Firefox. —Mets501 (talk) 20:29, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Even Firefox won't do it if you don't have the fonts. But get it anyway. —Daniel (‽) 11:20, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Actually, you do have to get Firefox in this case, since that page isn't using {{unicode}}, and MSIE is unable to use any font other than the currently selected one (i.e. it won't use Code2000 without {{unicode}} to change the font). --cesarb 15:18, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Removing spaces either side of slash

Hope this is the right place for this question - please let me know if not...

When you're not logged in, "Sign in / create account" is shown in the top right of the screen. This is incorrectly punctuated - there shouldn't be a space either side of the slash. The same error can be seen in the title of the screen reached by clicking on the sign in link. How can this be corrected? Thanks for any suggestions! Jenny Wong 16:13, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Whether it's "correct" according to any particular standard, it is common practice to put spaces around the slash if more than one word is logically grouped on either side. For example, "apples/oranges", but "red apples / green apples". - dcljr (talk) 19:09, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Redirect not saving?

Hi. After conferring with the original author of the article Narcissistic damage (which I had tagged with {{subst:prod}} for being a definition), it was decided that the article should redirect to Narcissistic personality disorder. I edited Narcissistic damage to place the redirect, added an edit summary, and saved the article. However, upon my return to it, the original article appears. When I click "edit this page", however, the redirect shows up. Huh? Can someone take a look and tell me if this is a technical glitch or if I'm doing something incorrect? Thanks. --CPAScott 20:51, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Clear your cache. It should work then. Mozilla/Safari: hold down Shift while clicking Reload (or press Ctrl-Shift-R), IE: press Ctrl-F5, Opera/Konqueror: press F5. —Mets501 (talk) 20:54, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
(edit conflict) No, it's just your cache playing tricks on you. Try replacing "?action=edit" with "?action=purge" in the edit link you gave us above. Titoxd(?!?) 20:54, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
That does it. Thanks for the prompt response. --CPAScott 21:11, 14 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

ref footnotes disrupt line flow

Easy to fix in CSS: ¦ Reisio 02:07, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Nesting noinclude and includeonly

I'm trying to create a template that outputs noinclude tags when it is included (allowing the page using the template to show different content if it is viewed directly or included itself). Is there anyway to escape the nested noinclude tags so they work as expected? The documentation just says that straight nesting won't work (and it doesn't...I've tried it just in case), it doesn't give any clues as to whether there is a way to make it work. Yomanganitalk 09:01, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

The only way to do it (currently) is to place the template inclusion inside noinclude tags. On the middle page: <noinclude>{{yourtemplate}}</noinclude> (so the template doesn't show on the bottom page). Or, if you are just doing this for templates: {{#ifeq:{{NAMESPACE}}|Template|content}} (or other pre-determined tricks). --Splarka (rant) 11:14, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks, unfortunately the additional step of including the noinclude tags around the template is what I needed to avoid, but at least I know I'm not missing something. Yomanganitalk 11:19, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

For future reference it is possible:


Whatever you want to just appear in the original page and not in any pages it is included in


What could be easier? Yomanganitalk 16:55, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Well, you could reduce the amounts of includeonlys to break up the noincludes. Just use:
GeorgeMoney (talk) 17:19, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
That's what I did to begin with, but it leaves parts of the tag showing in the page. Yomanganitalk 17:25, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Special:Newimages now redundant?

Now that Special:Imagelist has been revamped, is Special:Newimages redundant? I notice that Imagelist now defaults to showing newest images by date, and it has a better look than Newimages. The only difference that is apparent is that Newimages shows previews and Imagelist doesn't yet - I'm sure the developers can add preview ability to Imagelist and then scrap Newimages altogether. 14:34, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Wonky edit links

Could someone check out Wikipedia:WikiProject Guitarists and see if they can duplicate this problem: At some point I created a new second-level heading after I clicked the "edit" link next to an existing second-level heading. Now, the edit links are all messed up. For example, if I click the edit link next to the "Departments" heading in the text, it takes me to edit the heading that is below that one. Any way to fix this? --Aguerriero (talk) 15:37, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Yeah, it's really messed up. I don't know what it is. —Mets501 (talk) 15:47, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Fixed now. diffMets501 (talk) 15:51, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Ahh, thank you sincerely. I knew it was going to be something like that. :) This is why I'm a writer, not a developer.... --Aguerriero (talk) 15:53, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Show/Hide not hiding on default

I have a div-Nav class pop-up on my user page but it's not hiding on default, as I'd like it to. How can I fix this, or could someone fix it for me? Thanks in advance. --User:Arual 16:11, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

Fixed on your user page. If you wrap it in two show hide div's then it hides by default —Mets501 (talk) 16:17, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

AFD transclusion

I'm trying to transclude the afd, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/9/11 Guilt, onto the Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Log/2006 August 15 page. The transclusion isn't showing up there. I suspect Wikipedia has a problem with the "/" in the article name, and that technically speaking "11/Guilt" is a subpage of "9" Can anyone please confirm that this is indeed the problem, or am I doing something wrong. If it's indeed not possible to transclude, I might just rename the afd page to "9-11 Guilt". --Aude (talk contribs) 16:36, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Fixed now. You didn't use the template {{subst:afd2|pg=9/11 Guilt|text=REASON FOR DELETION}} at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/9/11 Guilt. —Mets501 (talk) 16:42, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Okay. Thanks. --Aude (talk contribs) 16:44, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Added categories to a redirect's single-line wikicode

I've stumbled on a special case where it was needed to categorize a redirect page itself. (It was for a CD reissued under a different title). It works, but it seems undocumented on your help page. For the full details of the case and what I did, see:

→ SOLUTION: WP:ALBUMS#NEW.21_Categorizing_retitled_reissues

Even though it's a rare case, I think it should be documented somewhere on your help page that it can be done, and how and when. For instance, there are plenty of books or movies with previous or alternative titles: shouldn't their redirect pages be categorized too, so as to make the main previous titles be findable in categories lists too?

→ DEBATE: crossposted to Meta:Help talk:Redirect

-- 20:07, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

math symbols & pictures problem

Pix may be blocked - will recheck. Recent problem. I have RH9, Mozilla.

Math symbols in text, sometimes in LaTex etc often are distorted into what looks like random hashmarks or bird scratch. Many formulae can't be read because symbols in Greek, or special math symbols (like Intercept symbol, logical Not-, etc) are dropped. - I can read generic PDFs with same symbols etc.