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November 21

Car 'hood' and cold weather.

Good Morning. I have a megane convertible, in which the window drops down an inch before the door opens, and goes back up once closed. In below freezing weather, the window doesn't drop down, but the door still opens. It doesn't close though, until whatever inside the door is frozen has defrosted, so I can't drive until this happens. My question is would one of those big hood type things (that I assume are used to keep the windscreen ice free) actually help here? Thanks in advance. (talk) 09:59, 21 November 2015 (UTC)

It may not be anything frozen, just the coefficient of thermal expansion, applied to the material in the door and door frame. In that case, keeping it warmer would be one option, as in a garage. Or a mechanic might be able to find whatever component has an improper clearance and adjust it so it can accommodate the natural expansion and contraction due to the weather. (I will resist the temptation to suggest you buy a better car.) StuRat (talk) 10:33, 21 November 2015 (UTC)
The MINI Cooper (both convertible and hardtop) does the same thing - the window is 'frameless' and lowers a half inch or so to clear the seal that runs along the roof line. In the MINI, at least, the problem isn't with the cold per-se - it's with moisture on the outside of the glass freezing and making the window stick. The MINI (and evidently in the Megane), there is enough flexibility in the system that the door will open with the window fully shut - it's designed to allow that so you can get into the car when the battery is dead (so you can pop the bonnet catch and charge the battery). But when you try to shut the door, the glass hits the sill of the roof. I've heard of cases where people didn't notice the problem and slammed the car door hard, shattering the glass - so this is definitely not a good thing!
I'm not sure what our OP means by "those big hood type things" - if we're talking about the slot that runs along the base of the windscreen - or a 'hood scoop' then no, on most cars those are generally air intakes. I'm not aware of any mechanisms that would help this on any car I've ever seen - apart from the heater ducts on the inside of the car. Running the heater on "defrost" while driving the car should help - but if the car has been parked for hours and thereby become frozen, then you can only resort to scraping any surface ice off of the window before attempting to open (and more especially, close) the door.
If (as StuRat suggests) it's not ice build-up, and just some component that's locking up in the cold - then I strongly suggest a trip to your Renault dealership. Probably there is some component of the window mechanism that isn't adequately greased, or perhaps there is some adjustment that has not been correctly made. You may have to take the car there in cold weather and have them park it outside and have their techs look at it first thing in the morning so they can replicate the problem. Use the dealership and not some other repair place - you need people who are experts in that specific vehicle and who have access to the manufacturers service bulletins.
If all else fails, you might consider getting one of those car covers to cover your car while it's parked...that will prevent moisture buildup...and if you have a cloth-top convertible that has to be parked outside, it'll considerably improve the life of the roof - even in summer.
SteveBaker (talk) 13:09, 21 November 2015 (UTC)
I assumed that by "one of those big hood type things" the OP was referring to "one of those car covers to cover your car while it's parked". Deor (talk) 16:25, 21 November 2015 (UTC)
You mean like this? --Jayron32 18:50, 21 November 2015 (UTC)
OP here, and thanks for replies. Yes, like that, but I've only seen ones that cover the top half of the car. The manual refers to not closing the door when frozen, so not a mechanical fault with this car (although rather a design fault with this make, at least for people who buy them where the winter can be below freezing.)
So will one of these covers keep the car 'warmer'? Will it help at all? (talk) 22:17, 21 November 2015 (UTC)
Well, it does indeed helps to stop frost forming on the windscreen (which is why I use one when necessary), so probably yes.
When the car is parked under a clear sky, it's radiating heat, but is getting very little radiated back fron the sky, which is a bunch of air mostly below zero C underneath a bunch of space not much more than zero K – this is why frost can form on the windscreen even when the ambient temperature is above zero C. The cover however remains at ground-level ambient, so is radiating a little heat back at the car. (This is also why one may find that the side windows facing a building don't frost up when the other side facing the open does.) There's probably also a minor element of reducing convection and retaining some residual heat from the slowly cooling engine. {The poster formerly known as} (talk) 22:58, 21 November 2015 (UTC)
I wonder if glowplugs can be installed in a door. StuRat (talk) 19:22, 22 November 2015 (UTC)

November 23

Metal loops sticking out of walls

Recently, walking past a building in London, I noticed that it had small metal loops or rings sticking out of the exterior wall at regular intervals at about head height. They had little plastic tags on them, which recorded the dates on which they were inspected. You can sort of see them in this Streetview image: I also noticed similar rings on another building nearby, but those did not have the tags. Does anyone know what these are, and what they do? --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 10:50, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

It's difficult to be sure from the photo, but these are probably for attaching PPE lanyards/ropes and Safety harnesses to allow personnel to work on the outside of the building. Such attachments (in the UK, and presumably elsewhere) have to be regularly inspected to ensure they will still bear the required force without pulling out of the walls, and may not be used if the last inspection tag has passed its expiry date. In our office we have some on the inside load-bearing wall pillars, to allow personnel to attach and then climb out of the windows for whatever reason necessary. {The poster formerly known as} (talk) 15:05, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
I thought about the possibility that they might be for hanging ropes etc on, but these are at head height, so seems unlikely to be for hanging anything *down* from. Suppose there is something else at the top of the building (I couldn't see any on the wall, but it might be on the roof or something), would they also need something like this near the ground, say for stabilisation? --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 15:26, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
Lower braces for scaffolding maybe? --Jayron32 15:46, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
There weren't remnants of blood and traces of human flesh on the walls and ground, were there? -- Jack of Oz [pleasantries] 17:57, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
Agree with Jayron, most likely fixings for scaffold. See here [[1]]--Ykraps (talk) 20:06, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
Okay that looks like that's it, thanks both! --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 20:49, 23 November 2015 (UTC)


While handling a time-zone problem at WP:VPT, I randomly picked Australia/Currie as my time zone temporarily. How did Currie, population 750, become the namesake of its own tz database area? Nothing at Australia/Currie explains anything; King Island (Tasmania) and Currie, Tasmania don't mention anything about the island changing time zones or jurisdictions, and Daylight saving time in Australia and Time in Australia only mention Currie in a list, rather than explaining why King Island would have had its own time zone or its own daylight saving time rules, separate from those of the rest of the state — especially given that the state's small size and the "mainland's" proximity to King Island would make it particularly odd for the island not to be on the same time as Circular Head. Nyttend (talk) 21:11, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

Just a thought, but the locals might actually want to differentiate themselves from the larger group, and this is a token way of doing so. StuRat (talk) 21:36, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
See this document, from the Australian Bureau of Meteorology. King Island (unlike the rest of Tasmania) did not use Daylight Saving Time between 1967 and 1971, hence the separate time zone. Tevildo (talk) 22:39, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
This is also a useful source for the history of time zones in Australia. Tevildo (talk) 22:41, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
(edit conflict) Hmm, no, I don't think the locals have anything to do with it - this is about the authors of the Tz database. The database attempts to define every area of the globe which has ever had a different time to neighbouring areas (where ever is defined as at least since 1970). According to this history of time zones in Australia, King Island did not adopt daylight savings at the same time as the rest of Tasmania, although this history implies it now has. - Cucumber Mike (talk) 22:45, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
According to Page 29 of Cucumber Mike's second document (excellent find, incidentally), "the main amendment [to the bill introducing DST to Tasmania] being that King Island was to be excluded from the scheme because its economy was more closely tied to the mainland". Tevildo (talk) 22:50, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
Which mainland did that refer to? From King I's perspective, I'd have thought Tasmania was the mainland. -- Jack of Oz [pleasantries] 23:07, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
Presumably the larger landmass to its north. --Jayron32 04:52, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

November 24

Unaccomplished parents

Is there a term for a parent who has had a mediocre life/career and as a result of his/her shortcomings wants their offspring to fulfill the lifestyle they wished they themselves accomplished? Contrib raati (talk) 09:45, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

Are you talking about living vicariously, or are you talking about working to create a better life for your children? ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 10:54, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
I suppose its vicarious after looking up the definition. That might be the word I was looking for. Can you think of any synonyms of the word vicarious but pertaining specifically to parent-to-offspring vicariousness, especially for altruistic reasons? (note english is not my first language) Contrib raati (talk) 10:59, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
Trying "to live out their dreams through their children"[2] or "living through their children", although that has very negative connotations or consequences,[3] not altruistic. Stage mothers are likely suspects. Clarityfiend (talk) 11:16, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
The behavior our OP describes is what 'normal' parents do. I suppose you could split parents into three hypothetical groups:
  1. Those who wish their children will do better than they did.
  2. Those who wish their children will do worse than they did.
  3. Those who don't care.
Category (3) parents come with a bunch of names like 'deadbeat', category (2) must be very rare - and if we do have a name for them, it's going to be considered to be some kind of mental illness or something. It follows that we don't really have a special name for category (1) because those are considered to be the 'normal' parents - who are in the vast majority. However, what we're looking for here are parents in category (1) who are relatively low achievers...but since the sky is the limit for great achievements, nearly everyone can find shortcomings in themselves that they'd like their children to overcome. Even very high achievers strive to make this happen.
SteveBaker (talk) 13:34, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
Ah but what if I don't care if my kids do better or worse than me as long as they are happy at what they are doing? CambridgeBayWeather, Uqaqtuq (talk), Sunasuttuq 13:46, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
Then that is just a different definition of "better" MChesterMC (talk) 14:39, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

Let's say, as an example, a parent always wanted to be a doctor, but was unable to accomplish this goal. This parent decides to ensure their offspring ends up as a doctor in order to live out their failed accomplishment through their child even though the child is completely uninterested in healthcare. Is there no specific name/term more specified than 'vicariousness? Contrib raati (talk) 15:30, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

I don't think there's any single specific word for the parenting situation, though there are common phrases. This [4] news article calls it "chasing lost dreams", but also uses "vicarious". "Living vicariously through [their] children" has lots of usage. See also perhaps Wish fulfillment. SemanticMantis (talk) 16:20, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

November 25

Low-performing schools

I remember there was a term for schools with extremely low pass rates or had a more-or-less useless curriculum. Can somebody remind me what this term is please? Contrib raati (talk) 15:38, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

In the UK, such schools are put into "Special measures", which has become a more generic term (euphemism?) for "failure" in official contexts. Tevildo (talk) 15:54, 25 November 2015 (UTC)
Thats not the word I was looking for. Contrib raati (talk) 16:18, 25 November 2015 (UTC)
At the higher education level, there are Diploma mills - with high pass rates (if you pay), but a useless curriculum (if any). --Stephan Schulz (talk) 16:34, 25 November 2015 (UTC)
Could it be sink school? No article, but presumably named with reference to sink estates. Googling sink school gives some British newspaper articles discussing them. Hassocks5489 (Floreat Hova!) 18:55, 25 November 2015 (UTC)
“We class schools, you see, into four grades: Leading School, First-rate School, Good School, and School. Frankly," said Mr Levy, "School is pretty bad...” ― Evelyn Waugh, Decline and Fall. Modern terminology in the UK is not much different. Dbfirs 20:42, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

How would the Turkish military "warn" a Russian fighter plane?

See2015 Russian Sukhoi Su-24 shootdown.How did Turkey issue "multiple warnings" to the Russian aircraft crew? Do enemy fighter planes and ground stations have a common frequency for talking in combat situations? Like the pilots or their ground controllers having a frequency (perhaps a scrambled channel) for talking to their own side and a different or a "universal" frequency for talking to the enemy like they would talk to a neutral airport? Would the "universal" receiver cut in even if they were talking to their home base? Do enemy pilots ever "trash talk" each other, or beg for mercy, or gloat when their missile hits the enemy, assuming they understand each other's speech? Edison (talk) 19:14, 25 November 2015 (UTC)

This story says the signal was in English on 243.0 MHz, the Military Air Distress channel. For friend-to-friend communications you would expect encrypted communications on milcom channels - in theatre that would often be satcom instead. -- Finlay McWalterTalk 20:05, 25 November 2015 (UTC)
And in general there are plenty of things you can do besides using radio. Fly in front of them and do maneuvers to get the pilot's attention. Flash lights at the pilot. If the prospective target is a military plane, it will generally detect and warn the pilot if something locks targeting radar on the plane. Now, which of these techniques are used obviously depends on circumstances and rules of engagement. -- (talk) 20:52, 25 November 2015 (UTC)
Yea, flying in front might be problematic both because they couldn't catch up with and pass those planes, and because they might then be targeted. That method works better with a slower, passenger plane. StuRat (talk) 21:26, 25 November 2015 (UTC)
In the link above the Turk supposedly speaking English is mostly unintelligible to me, a native speaker of English.It sounded like a bunch of barked mispronounced syllables Edison (talk) 02:19, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
  • The audio is quite clear, " are approaching Turkish airspace, change your heading..." I find it quite odd that a native speaker of English would feign the inability to comprehend this. Perhaps a better place for this discussion would be an internet forum? I see no request here for a referenced source. μηδείς (talk) 02:55, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
    • It is highly accented and low in intelligibility, particularly the first 7 seconds. How would a Russian with a weak grasp of English understand this utterance by a Turk with a weak grasp of English? Edison (talk) 03:11, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
The Turk's English was perfectly fine. I didn't know the codes, but the "you are approaching Turkish airspace, change your heading" was perfectly clear. Given American English is the standard for international communication, maybe the Russian was simply not up to snuff? I have no point to make or dog in this fight, but to claim the Turk's message was garbled in the essential moment is simply false. I will not comment further, since I consider this a matter of fsct, not a POV I want to argue. μηδείς (talk) 04:49, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
Sounds like Edison's version got garbled along the way somehow, but if you can hear it clearly, that must be what was broadcast, unless somebody later went to the trouble of cleaning it up. StuRat (talk) 07:53, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
I would agree with Edison. I cannot make out the first 5 seconds at all. I can get some words from the next 2 seconds. Then " are approaching Turkish airspace, change your heading..." is reasonably clear, but with very unusual rhythm (as if read line by line by someone who does not know the language), and the rest is again very hard to understand (my guess is "to south"). How this would sound in the cockpit of a jet aircraft is another question again, although pilots should be used to the environmental noise. --Stephan Schulz (talk) 11:09, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
To me the first part sounds like a some numbers possibly with a letter or something else then something radar station then speaking something. That said I only listened after I'd read the discussion so can't rule being influenced by that for the radar station bit. Of course this is only 1 time of the allegedly 10 times or more the message was repeated. Looking a bit more, I find someone gave an explanation of what was said, one thought that comes to mind is that beyond having experience dealing with noise, one would assume military pilots (well any properly trained pilot) would also have some experience with what to expect from radio messages and the message sounds like it's mostly fairly standard and common even if it was read in a weird way.

Note that if you read the discussion there's some suggestion, supported by our article International distress frequency, that the 243 Mhz frequency is a NATO emergency frequency. However it's also suggested that it would be normal for aircraft operating in the vicinity of NATO areas to monitor the frequency even if they wouldn't use it themselves.

In any case, the intelligibility question could be a red herring as AFAIK the current Russian claim is not that they received a message but didn't know what was being said, but instead that they didn't receive any. (Although there's some suggestion in the discussion that Russia only denied receiving any warnings from the aircraft which shot them down, which could be true as the message in question was from a radar station.) Of course they also claim they never crossed into Turkish airspace even for those 17 seconds.

Nil Einne (talk) 17:28, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

And emergency aviation frequencies are supposed to only be used for emergencies, so any competent pilot should know to pay attention if someone is broadcasting on them. -- (talk) 05:09, 26 November 2015 (UTC)

November 26

Man At Arms - Armor question

The character of Man-At-Arms in the He-Man universe has a rather enlarged armor piece that covers his neck and extends out from his chest a ways. Is this patterned on an actual piece of armor? It's sort of a gorget, I suppose, but larger than those that I've seen. You can see some pics here. Thanks, Dismas|(talk) 16:20, 26 November 2015 (UTC)

In the pics it looks like the idea is to deflect upward sword blows away from the face. Note that in the real world, head armor was used, too, but that would make a character look rather ominous, so fictional treatments often skip that, at least for the "good guys". StuRat (talk) 16:40, 26 November 2015 (UTC)
Looks to me like a bevor, although instead of being a separate piece of armor, it's fashioned as part of the cuirass. Deor (talk) 16:49, 26 November 2015 (UTC)

Thank you both! Dismas|(talk) 14:26, 27 November 2015 (UTC)


November 27

How do I delete my Wikipedia account?

Had to create an account on Wikipedia a few days ago just to move or rename a page. I guess that has finally been done and now I want to delete my account. how do I do this? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Charlie22557 (talkcontribs) 03:02, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Well, Wikipedia accounts cannot actually be deleted; the software doesn't allow it. You could either simply walk away and leave the account alone, or, if you are certain you do not want to ever edit again, you can use the process described at Wikipedia:Courtesy vanishing. Howicus (Did I mess up?) 03:07, 27 November 2015 (UTC)
Agreed. The only downside to keeping the account is that nobody else can create an account named "Charlie22557", but that doesn't seem to be likely to be a problem. StuRat (talk) 04:38, 27 November 2015 (UTC)
Why don't you just keep using the account? Your privacy is better protected than if you use an IP address. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 11:45, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Early Christian festival

Do we have any evidence of what festivals (if any) were celebrated by the Jewish Christians of New Testament times? --TammyMoet (talk) 17:54, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Think this is going to be an impossible question to answer. The festivals where a carry-over from the pre Christian era. The Christian's just adopted them as their own. --Aspro (talk) 18:04, 27 November 2015 (UTC)
In particular, Communion aka Eucharist was a scaled-down version of the Passover Seder, which is what the Last Supper was. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 18:16, 27 November 2015 (UTC)
Exactly, Just because one became a follower of the teaching of the prophet Jesus, did not mean one abandoned long practised festivals that was ingrained into society, culture and daily life.--Aspro (talk) 18:21, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

November 28

Gay cruises for certain communities

I was unable to post this question on the WikiVoyage tourist desk because I had to ask about places, but want to know something about an actual means of travel.

Some cruise lines, such as Atlantis Events, offer international cruises exclusively for gay men. I thought taking a cruise in the near future would be nice, except that there are many different varieties of gay men, some of whom view other types as undesirable. Bears, who I identify with despite not being one, are often one of those "other types."

Do any lines break cruises down by specific types? Theskinnytypist (talk) 09:02, 28 November 2015 (UTC)