Wikipedia talk:Templates for discussion

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WikiProject Deletion
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WikiProject Templates
This page is within the scope of WikiProject Templates, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Templates on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.

Loading time affected by transclusion of subpages[edit]

The transclusion of subpages has been affecting the project page about templates under discussion. Attempting to change the layout of the page would affect the bot operated by Anomie. Also, any layout may affect anyone's easy access to any discussion about a template. What is the easiest, if not the best, solution to resolve the slow loading? What layout would be loading-convenient without affecting access to discussions? BTW, the WP:redirects for discussion page also suffers from slow loading times and bot operation's hindering to allow changes. Its own matter was discussed there. --George Ho (talk) 19:09, 1 April 2017 (UTC)

Notice of Request for comment[edit]

I have started a formal Request for comment that may affect Wikipedia:Templates for discussion. It is at Wikipedia talk:Deletion process#RfC on holding RfCs within XfDs. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 22:55, 29 May 2017 (UTC)

Unused templates, archivability, and simpler alternatives to deletion[edit]

Just sharing some thoughts occasioned by the recent spate of nominations of templates with the sole rationale for deletion that they are unused. I understand that we want to keep things tidy and discard any tools that we don't use anymore (although the concept of "polluting the template namespace" will probably need to be explained to me). The tidying up however comes at a price. Templates that get deleted as "unused" often enough have transclusions in old revisions of pages. Deleting the templates results in the loss of their content from these revisions. I know that such concerns for digital rot shouldn't have great weight, but if we add the fact that getting a template deleted takes up community time, then on the overall I'm beginning to think that the whole exercise might not be quite worth the effort.

Couldn't the benefit of tidiness be achieved via a simpler process? What if the template is simply taken out of any previous categories, placed into a dedicated category for unused templates, and somehow (any suggestions how?) excluded from the search results? That way it would effectively be taken out of the way, without disrupting the readability of old article revisions and without requiring community effort. And if anyone decides to use this template again, they'll be able to simply reverse these steps. That way the deletion (and deletion discussions) of unused templates could stay focused on only those templates whose use can be seen as harmful. – Uanfala 01:39, 13 June 2017 (UTC)

Uanfala, I assume you're talking about things like this, where someone goes "oh noes, I can't see the distances!" However, you need to think about it this way - there is a reason those templates became unused, replaced, or removed entirely. Many of the templates I see at TFD never had transclusions, because they never reached a point where they could (or should) be used. What differentiates a crap template that never got used from a formerly-used template that everyone decided could be deprecated? Keeping unneeded and unused templates simply because they "might" be useful later on down the road is akin to my grandmother, who kept every newspaper she ever read from the 50s until the day she died; all it does is create a pile of crap that someone else has to sift through down the line.
Don't get me wrong, I can appreciate where you're coming from, but I simply see no good reason to have a dumping ground of thousands of unused templates. Also, remember that you can ask an admin what a template might have done in a past life. Primefac (talk) 12:06, 13 June 2017 (UTC)
Also, as another thought, keeping the history is more about attribution than an actual 100%-accurate historical record. Primefac (talk) 12:08, 13 June 2017 (UTC)
I agree with your assumption that the vast majority of unused templates aren't ever going to be needed. And we already have a dumping ground for such templates: after all when deleted, templates don't just disappear, do they? The crux of my proposal is simply to have an alternative dumping ground where templates would be easier to dispatch to, and easier to recover from. – Uanfala 12:22, 24 June 2017 (UTC)
Uanfala, it's not so much about having an easily-accessible dumping ground. To paraphrase MusikAnimal, it's less about physical disk space and more about clutter. If there are a dozen unused-but-not-deleted templates that have a similar name to a can't-quite-remember-the-name-of-it thirteenth template that I actually want to use, I have to wade through them all until I find the right one. If the 12 were deleted at TFD, then there is only one template, and it's easier for people to navigate.
You're welcome, of course, to propose some new dumping-ground namespace, and maybe that idea will get traction (it takes up the same disk space whether deleted or active, right?). Of course, admins are always willing and capable of restoring and/or userfying pages upon request, and the WP:Incubator was abandoned for a reason. For what it's worth, I'm not opposed to not-deleting unused templates, I just don't think they should be cluttering the Template space. Primefac (talk) 14:25, 24 June 2017 (UTC)

Can someone explain to me how a template is determined to be "unused"? Are clicks on a template's links being recorded somewhere? I saw a film director's navigation template posted as "unused" and cannot tell how this determination was made. (Or even if this determination is applicable to decide that a template should never be had going forward.) Erik (talk | contrib) (ping me) 18:38, 20 June 2017 (UTC)

@Erik: "Unused" means "no transclusions", which is recorded in Special:Whatlinkshere. Pppery 18:42, 20 June 2017 (UTC)
Thanks! Reviewing the case I was concerned about, it does appear that the template was unused at the articles it linked to (for some reason), but that was fixed by Frietjes, so the template is now being used. Seems like there should be a kind of WP:BEFORE step to ensure usage before assuming it has to be deleted. Erik (talk | contrib) (ping me) 18:55, 20 June 2017 (UTC)

Several template redirects are discussed at RfD[edit]

Comments are welcome in the RfD discussion for several redirects to CC licensing templates at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2017 July 4#Template:Cc-by-sa, where one of the questions is what to do with existing transclusions. – Uanfala 10:07, 4 July 2017 (UTC)