Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Articles for creation

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WikiProject Articles for creation (Rated Project-class)
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Centralized discussion
Proposals: policy other Discussions Ideas

Note: inactive discussions, closed or not, should be archived.

Should categories and redirects be requested on the same page?[edit]

Currently Wikipedia:Articles for creation/Redirects is the submission page for both redirects and new categories. This latter role, which is only a minority of the requests to the page, seems odd:

  • Redirects and categories are quite different entities.
  • The title of the page does not indicate that this is the place for categories.
  • Redirects are relatively straightforward, and do not require much, if any discussion. In my experience category requests are often complex:
    • This is evidenced by the fact that category requests remain on the page for weeks, as reviewers are uncertain what to do with them.
    • Occasionally a proposal will suggest a "mid-level" category, the creation of which would necessitate re-organising a few articles. This feels out of the remit of a page which is mostly approving or declining simple requests.

I therefore propose that an Wikipedia:Articles for creation/Categories be created (this link currently redirects), a page specifically for Category requests. This page could get the discussion and specialised editor attention it needs, while Wikipedia:Articles for creation/Redirects would be clear to fulfil its primary role. --LukeSurl t c 17:22, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

The discussion below is a prime example of why Wikipedia:Articles for creation/Redirects is inadequate for discussion of new categories. --LukeSurl t c 16:15, 29 November 2015 (UTC)
I support this proposal in theory. (I know nothing about implementing it so I won't comment on that.) I have been working at Wikipedia:Articles for creation/Redirects and I have no idea what to do with the category requests that appear. Some have been sitting there for nearly two months now. Might it be helpful to codify a set of category reviewing instructions? /wia /tlk 15:38, 1 December 2015 (UTC)
Support: It does make sense to create a separate category request page as it reduces confusion for new IP editors and new users. Vincent60030 (talk) 12:18, 2 December 2015 (UTC)
Btw, we should really quickly create a category page as category requests are clogging up the page. =p Vincent60030 (talk) 08:51, 8 December 2015 (UTC)
  • I've bitten the bullet and cleared out the very old category requests. Weren't easy choices, I'm expecting a bunch of talk page messages tomorrow :( --LukeSurl t c 16:43, 11 December 2015 (UTC)
    @LukeSurl: Good job there! At least it clears out depressing stuff over there for now. ๐Ÿ‘ Like Vincent60030 (talk) 16:49, 11 December 2015 (UTC)
  • Support โ€“ It does seem rather counterintuitive that categories and redirects are requested on the same page whose title is Wikipedia:Articles for creation/Redirects. Also, huge thanks to LukeSurl for stepping up to the challenge of clearing out those really old category requests. Mz7 (talk) 01:47, 12 December 2015 (UTC)

Implementation[edit]

The discussion above seemed positive, so I guess we should think about how we'd implement this.
We'd need to do the following things:

Some of these things will need to be done near-simultaneously at a chosen switchover point.
Thoughts? --LukeSurl t c 20:06, 6 January 2016 (UTC)

I've created some draft front matter at User:Mz7/sandbox/AFC/C front matter for the new category page and User:Mz7/sandbox/AFC/R front matter for the new redirect page. Feel free to edit it as you see fit. Mz7 (talk) 20:55, 31 January 2016 (UTC)

G13 eligibility notices[edit]

Recently HasteurBot, in the service of notifying editors of G13 eligiblity, notified Ritchie333 on their talk page that an article that they created was going to become eligible for G13. The bot goes to the edit history and picks the page creator for determining to notify about the upcoming eligibility. Ritchie333 suggested that the bot instead parse the AFC submission templates and grab the user parameter and notify each unique submitter that the page is becoming eligible for G13.

I think this is a bad idea because

  1. Page creator is a matter of record and cannot be removed from the page (unlike AFC submission tempaltes)
  2. AFC volunteer reviewers could accidentally submit the page for review, but forget to take themselves out of the submitter column thereby adding a great many false positive notifications for volunteers who only clerked a request (and thereby generating a great many more complaints).

Therefore I put the question: Should the G13 eligibility process be changed to consider AFC submssion templates instead of just the page creator when determining who to notify about soon to be eligible pages

Hasteur (talk) 17:09, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

Support[edit]

Oppose[edit]

  1. For the reasons stated above. Hasteur (talk) 17:09, 5 January 2016 (UTC)
  2. Sorry, I just saw this. Notifying the new users who create these drafts is a good idea, because they may not be familiar with Wikipedia's operations and policies. However, others who edit these drafts has the choice of having them on their watchlists, so what would end up to be thousands of notifications are likely not needed. Also, I believe that the HasteurBot already has an optional "notice to interested editors" function.โ€”Anne Delong (talk) 14:36, 1 February 2016 (UTC)

Missing WikiProject banner[edit]

We were told that {{WikiProject U.S. Roads}} had to be moved to that name a year and a half ago so that the AfC scripts could pick up our banner template for inclusion, yet the script still does not have the banner as an option. Can someone finally add it? The list is at User:Theo's Little Bot/afchwikiproject.js. (Also, it might be prudent to see if the list needs to be updated since it's been nearly two years since it was last edited, and it may be even more prudent to move the list out of a single user's JavaScript pages so that it can be edited as needed.) Imzadi 1979 โ†’ 21:34, 11 January 2016 (UTC)

I strongly agree with your last two points; an admin should move the list to a subpage under Wikipedia:WikiProject Articles for Creation. That way, we can update the list whenever it's necessary, instead of requesting edits. APerson (talk!) 00:40, 12 January 2016 (UTC)
You would like it moved to Wikipedia:WikiProject Articles for Creation/afchwikiproject.js? I'm not sure what the "h" in afchwikiproject is for though. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 01:43, 12 January 2016 (UTC)
I think it's supposed to stand for Articles For Creation Helper. afch-wikiproject-list.js might be better, by the way. APerson (talk!) 01:52, 12 January 2016 (UTC)
These javascripts must remain protected so that only admins (Or perhaps template editors can edit them). But being out of date is a problem, sometimes I have noted that the project I want is no there. I suspect if someone moves the script, whatever calls it will not find it. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 22:38, 20 January 2016 (UTC)

Discussion at Teahouse talk[edit]

AFC contributors may be interested in this discussion at Teahouse talk. --LukeSurl t c 12:56, 12 January 2016 (UTC)

Talk page archive in G13 eligible AfC submissions[edit]

Would someone please edit Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Articles for creation/2013 5 so that it no longer appears in Category:G13 eligible AfC submissions. Thanks, JMHamo (talk) 20:05, 14 January 2016 (UTC)

@JMHamo: I think I fixed the problem by un-transcluding any of the transclusions of the AFC submission template. We'll see if that makes it work better. Hasteur (talk) 00:23, 15 January 2016 (UTC)

I'm back[edit]

Hey guys. I don't know if you guys remember me, but I was very active around these parts back in 2013. I'm coming back now after a pretty decent retirement as a 15th birthday gift to Wikipedia (and because the WordPad article is a trainwreck). I'm not sure how active I'll be, but I'm here and I may go back to reviewing articles again like the old days. It looks like a decent amount has changed since I left ({{ping}} is a thing now, which is nice) so bear with me if I accidentally do things the "old way" for a little while. Thanks, Nathan2055talk - contribs 01:44, 16 January 2016 (UTC)

Nice to have you back, mate! FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 02:03, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
@Nathan2055: It's nice to meet you! I look forward to working alongside you. /wiae โ˜… /tlk 02:06, 16 January 2016 (UTC)
Welcome back Nathan2055, it's good to have an experienced "old hand" back on board. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 20:43, 18 January 2016 (UTC)

We have a bit of a mess that needs attention[edit]

An editor has been unilaterally moving other editors' userspace drafts into draftspace and then adding AFC submission templates. Please see User talk:Ricky81682#Adding AFC submission templates to drafts that you did not create. This has been going on for at least 5 months as I received a G13 warning from Hasteurbot today about one of my drafts that I never even intended to submit to AFC. (It's several years old but nowhere near even an acceptable stub yet, I'm in no hurry.) Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 20:40, 18 January 2016 (UTC)

I agree, Roger, I find that quite unacceptable on a number of points. The guidelines at WikiProject Abandoned Drafts state:
  1. Only move article drafts that have not been edited for a considerable period of time. They can be moved into the article namespace if they are worthy of publication, into the draft namespace or to your userspace if you intend to adopt them.
  2. Do not take drafts from active users. If the draft has been stale for an exceptional amount of time, however, feel free to leave a note on their talk page asking if they plan on finishing the draft.
Nowhere does it state to submit them for acceptance at AfC, and the clear implication is that by moving them into draft space, the mover intends to "adopt" the draft and get it to a point where it will be accepted. What on earth is the point of reducing a backlog at that WikiProject simply to create one at AfC? Voceditenore (talk) 19:36, 20 January 2016 (UTC)
A couple things
  1. I apologize for your first notice being one of HasteurBot's "stale notices"
  2. I concur that abandonded userspace drafts where it is clear the user isn't going to come back should be transfered to the Draft namespace. (2 years no edits by the user at all). I'm not sure if the draft should be enrolled in the AfC process or if the draft should be moved without the template.
  3. I am reminded of the unilateral behavior of another long standing admin who thought it would be a good idea to summarily start deleting pages with respect to the AfC.
For these resasons, I strongly suggest that Ricky71682 undo as many of these as he can and work proactively with each editor's draft he's absconded with otherwise there might be cause for sanctions for willfully abusing established procedures. Hasteur (talk) 22:43, 20 January 2016 (UTC)
Ok, fine I shouldn't have done that. I don't see the great point as I'd instead have taken the pages to MFD where I'm certain they'd be deleted the same way. I haven't taken a draft from a single "active" user. If the user dumps the draft into draftspace, it shouldn't just stay there forever as long as the first person who put it there is actively editing. If they wanted that, they should keep it in their userspace. Draftspace isn't exempt from WP:WEBHOST and other concerns. Your logic (A) literally adds a mountain of extra nonsense to deal with and (B) drafts are regularly taken to MFD based on the inactivity of the draft, not on the inactivity of the editor so there's zero support for that. I also haven't deleted the articles myself but if need be, I'll restore them all and take them to MFD. I'll let people decide how useful this is. To clarify and make this explicit, I'm only taking about articles that were already in draftspace without an AFC banner tag. Articles that I moved to draftspace because it was formerly in an inactive user's userspace and then I added the AFC submission banner aren't an issue. If people want to argue that's wrong, then you'll have to take it further with me. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 23:16, 20 January 2016 (UTC)
Ricky81682 I had a hand in creating the Draft namespace, so I tell you with great authority there was no mandate for any form of Stale Deletion. If they're being deleted at MFD for only because stale, those MFDs are wrong. If they're being MFDed for Valid Reason + Stale then it's in order. Frankly your doubling down on the indefensable position only reinforces my comparison. Hasteur (talk) 03:54, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
Well then, I guess you should take discussions like Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Draft:JTa Comics for review. If you think that draftspace = free reign to create whatever, for whatever, no one else has heard that. Feel free to oppose the deletions here, here and plenty of others as well. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 05:03, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
Is anyone checking the moves for drafts that belong to active users? Graeme Bartlett (talk) 01:01, 21 January 2016 (UTC)

Explanation[edit]

Ok there are two, really three, separate issues going on here.

  1. First, there are some users who created and placed things in draftspace with no AFC tag. They sit stagnant for a long time. I made a bot request and had User:MusikBot/StaleDrafts/Report created. Some of those old pages (at least one year of inactivity) I took to MFD. Roger isn't the first editor to come yelling and screaming that just because he dumped a page in draftspace years ago, it shouldn't be subject to deletion because he is still editing. As everyone has pointed out before, then he can userify the thing because people are going to presume that you dumped it there because you dumped it there and if no one touches it, it's fair game to consider for deletion. Draftspace isn't just a dumping ground for drafts for all eternity which even in userspace would be subject to deletion. Otherwise, I suggest the people above move to bar MFD from deleting drafts or create some policy exception.
  2. Second, for some of those drafts, rather than take it to MFD right away for whatever reason, I place the draft under the AFC submission banner and then if it wasn't edited for another six months, it would be tagged as G13, the editor notified about it and then if still no action, then deleted. So, now as stated above, I'm restoring these articles, noting that I had found the article at least six months ago and it has not been edited for a minimum of the 18 months from when I found then one year inactive plus six months further inactive plus whatever time it's been deleted, it's going to go through a week at MFD again because god knows why people are offended but they are.
  3. Third, none of those moves are for active users. I know this because I have done it twice on accident and immediately reversed the whole thing. These are all pulled from Category:Stale userspace drafts which is down to 41k now (from a high over 46.5k). Those moves were done after having taken plausible drafts to MFD, everyone votes that it should go to draftspace and then puts it in draftspace under the AFC banner. Rather than waste time at MFD, I'd prefer doing what I've done with say Milton Kohn or Order of the Sons of America, e.g., find a good potential article that was dormant for four years, move it to draftspace as an adoption (rather than moving it to my userspace then routing it back with an AFC banner), tagging the original author so he would be notified as well, notifying the original editor, cleaning up the article and publishing it. There's at least a few others where others editors as part of the AFC process have cleaned up and/or published the article following up.

If these actions are so highly offensive to the AFC project, then this project is cutting off its nose to spite its face and need to move to have Abandoned drafts project and MFD and whatever else they want to scream about changed immediately. As noted above, I will restore and full MFD with item 2 here which was wrong but I doubt anyone will find a single one of these things useful. Each one of those pages were seen by multiple editors including at least one admin who found not a single one useful. Clearing out the junk here is entirely a thankless task. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 05:03, 21 January 2016 (UTC)

Pinging @Dodger67, Voceditenore, Hasteur, Floquenbeam, and Graeme Bartlett: to see if there's anything else I've done that's so offensive. I also note that not a single action here involved my use of my tools so I'm not sure what's the admin offense I'm supposed to have committed. Feel free to yell at me as an editor but I never even G13 deleted an article I moved as I thought that would be best for more eyes to review. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 05:09, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
I'm a fan of no deadlines as much as the next editor, but if it's evident that stuff has been clearly abandoned in the Draft namespace, it strikes me as fairly reasonable to send it off to MfD if the editor is inactive or otherwise doesn't move it to their userspace. Drafts are meant to be works in progress. If some other deletion procedure makes better sense, I think a discussion and a possible RfC at WP:Drafts is in order. I can't say I support moving stuff to AfC with hope for potential improvements, but I get where Ricky81682 is coming from with that. I mean, WP:Drafts reads, An article created in draftspace does not belong to the editor who created it, and any other registered user can decide that it is done and can be published. Editors then should have the discretion to add the AfC submission banner to things in the Draft space, though they should monitor and respond to feedback if that is the case. I, JethroBT drop me a line 09:06, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
I can accept that criticism. I am adding a lot of pages and not always doing the work on improving them which isn't fair at all. The alternative to dealing with the backlog is to focus solely on removing the junk userspace drafts, leaving the workable/semi-quality pages in userspace I guess. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 09:16, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
Changing the goalposts? Here are the things you must commit to:
  1. You commit to not moving any more Userspace Drafts to the Draft namespace. Multiple RFCs related to Drafts, Abandoned Drafts, and Userspace have consistently affirmed that Userspace drafts are not to be deleted short of the bright line causes (BLP, CV, blatant WP:NOTWEBHOST (ex: ranting at other editors, clearly not a article), unreformable ADVERT, etc).
  2. You commit to not abusing policy by submitting for AFC review (or AFC draft) any draft that has never had a AFC submission banner on it. Ideally the user who created the draft, or one who has extensively worked on improving the draft for promotion to articlespace should be the one that submits it.
  3. You commit to not abusing procedure by simply nominating for MFD because "stale". Draft namespace is the incubator for articles that weren't quite ready for mainspace and therefore aren't 100% notability ready. The MFD is supposed to be used for hopelessly unredeemable pages that are clearly never going to work.
If you can commit to doing these things, then we can start unwinding your giant mess of work. Also you should have known better when digging into a space you clearly aren't as familiar with. Hasteur (talk) 13:09, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
I don't have to do anything. Take your demands to AN if you want. Better yet, have the guts to actually take it to ARBCOM rather than snide insinuations. As I stated before, I never once used a tool here. Going in reverse, you're in a one man island with (3). There's no policy that supports that, those pages are regularly discussed and deleted at MFD. If you're serious about it, take the whole lot to DRV, change MFD or whatever but I'm still going to get rid of old drafts here. If you want to oppose them all, go join in and become a new MFD regular, we could use more eyes there. As to (2), I don't see it as an abuse of policy. Given that there's already a script for moving these pages used by numerous editors, it's expressly in WP:STALE policy after one year's inactivity and that this is something that's been done by numerous editors by many years, I'm not listening to your nonsense. As for (1), you are clearly and intentionally mixing up userspace deletion parameters, draftspace parameters and the actions for active and inactive users, none of which present whatever picture you have of AFC. I've been involved in enough of the disputes to know the exact lines of each one. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 21:19, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
This is getting a bit confrontational here. We should not have to use Arbcom. But we should gain a consensus about what we want, and then ask Ricky81682 to follow it. I think we can turn Hasteur's demands into clear statements of policy or practice that we expect all to follow. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 22:42, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
Well, it seems like the policy changes are needed elsewhere not here necessarily. The concern is creating a WP:Local consensus that is not in line with the larger one. The best place is probably to change WP:STALEDRAFT policy as that affects multiple projects and is actually quite vague. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 07:20, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
If anything those old pages should have been MFD'ed, not sent to AFC. Once sent to MFD, the user would have had the opportunity to decide to let it lapse or fix up and send to AFC. Sir Joseph (talk) 04:58, 8 February 2016 (UTC)
Which they now have been and have since been deleted again. I think a few remain at MFD though but they'll looking towards deletion. Even then, I personally would restore any of them if asked to. There's been suggestions for a proposed deletion of drafts of sort, similar to mainspace ones. Perhaps if we allowed for a proposed deletion of any draft that hadn't been edited in six months (with one year or more of lack of editing from the user if in userspace) with a delay of another month, we could almost eliminate the G13 AFC set-up as redundant. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 05:23, 8 February 2016 (UTC)
Yeah, there should be some sort of auto-system in place, in a utopia that would auto-tag and then delete after a certain time period. There's no reason to keep a page for more than a year with no movement. Sir Joseph (talk) 05:34, 8 February 2016 (UTC)

In regards to the spamming IP[edit]

There's been a rather persistent IP who has been spamming personal attacks in this discussion over the past 24 hours. I grabbed all the relevant info and made a post on ANI. --Nathan2055talk - contribs 05:56, 21 January 2016 (UTC)

Again, I'll say WP:RBI and perhaps a 3-day protection should do it. He'll move on. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 06:01, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
Yeah, a semiprotect would probably deal with it. Since we have the help desk there's almost no reason an anon should be posting on here anyway. --Nathan2055talk - contribs 06:03, 21 January 2016 (UTC)

I'm probably the last admin who should do it but I semi-protected this for 3 days. That should be the end of the disruption for now. If people want it extended, they should go to WP:RFPP and ask someone else. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 21:11, 21 January 2016 (UTC)

Templates and comments[edit]

I'm finding that many draft submitters see only the decline template and are unaware of or do not immediately discover the reviewers' comments. As the templates are generic, many of us add helpful comments. I've also discovered that some users find the template messages to be brusk and off-putting. I've been experimenting with using the general category for declines, which then places the reviewer comment in the template, and the response has been very positive from some users. Since the template is sent to the user's talk page, but the comment is not, I would like to suggest:

  1. include the reviewer's comment on the user talk page
  2. or, find a way to embed the reviewer's comment at the top of the template so the user is sure to see it

Comments? thoughts? (Yes, I'm aware that the change may not be technically easy, although I know little about templates.) LaMona (talk) 15:57, 19 January 2016 (UTC)

  • I vehemently support the idea to "include the reviewer's comment on the user talk page". FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 16:45, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
  • Support: putting the comments on the user talk page is a good idea. I try to write a comment on every draft reviewed (they're often boilerplate-ish, but hopefully they are at least moderately helpful). To be honest, I don't think authors look at them very frequently if they're stuck on the draft page itself. /wiae /tlk 16:57, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
  • Comment - I can see a few different ways to implement this in the helper script. I think what you all want is for the comment to appear in the same box as the reason like this, right? (We could also use {{AFC notification|comment}} as a separate box, which looks like this.) APerson (talk!) 18:01, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
    • Thanks for these examples. Am I correct that the second one looks like what users get when we comment via the yellow "Comment" option in the script? And that they don't get that with any of the decline options? I much prefer the first one. I might even like to see the reviewer's comment before the canned message, but I'd like to hear what others think about that. LaMona (talk) 15:23, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
      Yes, the second one is what goes on the author's talk page when the "Notify submitter" option is checked as you add a comment with the script. For what it's worth, I prefer the first one, too; I'll start trying to implement this soon. APerson (talk!) 17:47, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
  • Reviewers should consider only commenting and not declining when they find a draft that they feel isn't quite ready. I know that people submit far too early sometimes, but it gets ridiculous when one has to scroll past three or four pink boxes only to find a pretty decent article that might as well have been posted directly in main space, but where the author has clearly given up after too many scripted and templated decline messages. Human interaction is better than templates. --Hegvald (talk) 16:11, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
Hegvald, I'm not sure what you are suggesting here. If a draft isn't ready, just commenting leaves it in the AfC space and so it will be reviewed by other AFC'rs. There is a value to getting drafts marked as reviewed so they don't get re-reviewed unnecessarily. I think what you are concerned about is reviewers being overly picky. I will say that there are times when I both want to move a draft to mainspace but also give the editor a heads up about some editing that still needs to be done. But since comments on the draft are not carried over to mainspace, what I end up doing is accepting the draft then leaving a note on the user's talk page, since they probably do not know to look at the article talk page. It's awkward, and I wish that comments went to the user page, but then we'd have to duplicate them on the draft page. LaMona (talk) 17:47, 22 January 2016 (UTC)

Request to use AFCH from WMF staff member[edit]

Hi. I'm a WMF product manager investigating workflows (though this is my private account). I'd like to see how AFCH works. I don't have the required 500 edits, but do have good knowledge of policies and procedures generally, and I probably won't be saving any of my reviews. Please let me know if you can accommodate this request. Thanks. Jmatazzoni 01:32, 21 January 2016 (UTC) โ€” Preceding unsigned comment added by Jmatazzoni (talk โ€ข contribs)

If you are part of WMF think you can have access, but if you follow the procedure you will not get a chance to "save" or "not save". But why doesn't your user have (WMF) on it? Graeme Bartlett (talk) 09:16, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
"Hi. I'm a WMF product manager investigating workflows" - in which case, per this policy, please log into your WMF account which must specifically end "(WMF)", and re-request. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 12:04, 21 January 2016 (UTC)

Draftify gadget[edit]

In light of the discussion above, is User:Mr. Stradivarius/gadgets/Draftify in line with what AFC wants then? It moves userspace pages to draftspace and tags them with the AFC submission banner but it does notify them at the time of the move. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 08:37, 21 January 2016 (UTC)

Can it verify that the user of the userspace has been inactive for 2 years or more? Graeme Bartlett (talk) 10:10, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
Why two years? Is there a policy for that? A discussion about WP:STALEDRAFT seems inclined to go for one year before WP:STALEDRAFT supports a move to draftspace. I believe it's also used for editors who expressly ask for their pages to be moved to draftspace (sometimes to get more views) so a verification doesn't make sense. Plus it's a bit complicated since pages often have bots or other editors come in to fix templates or other changes but not the substance of the article. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 21:29, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
Please check if I understand the effect of the templates correctly. The AFC submission banner does not notify the page creator, it does not place the draft in the queue to be reviewed, it does start the G13 clock. The AFC submit banner does not notify the page creator, it does place the draft into the queue to be reviewed, it does start the G13 clock. A review would normally take place anytime from a few minutes to about two weeks after submitting. The G13 clock is reset to zero by any non-bot edit to the draft. Once a draft has been submitted for review the "registered" submitter is the only user who will receive review notifications and G13 warnings, thus the submitter actually takes responsibility for the draft. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 11:53, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
It does notify the page creator with the move. However the original submitter is then tagged with the notice in AFC. I'll use an example. User:Lucinda Ryan/Ivy Paige was created in June 2010. In January 2016, I used the script which then moved the page to draftspace, tagged it under AFC with the Lucinda as the creator and placed a notice on her page. It does not put it as review, just as not under submission. It's the same as above, I'm not flooding the submission queue, I am however adding to the G13 queue down in six months. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 21:22, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
I don't think there is a problem with the script, but the problems arise from inappropriate use. The pages should only be moved to the draft space from a non-afc submission if they are indeed abandoned and the mover wants to take some responsibility for improvement. Otherwise intereste people should be notified to see if anyone is interested improving the drafts. It is just as useless having an unsubmitted afc page in draft space as it is in userspace if no one knows about it. The whole purpose is to generate articles. If the page is hopeless or useless then MFD is appropriate. If the page is barely acceptable then it could go to an article and see how it survives. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 22:19, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
Do you want to propose a restriction on the gadget? I vaguely recall people being brought to ANI or other places if they are misusing other scripts (Twinkle is a common one) so it's possible to do the same here. However, I think we need to actually harmonize the views of what AFC allows for with what's going on elsewhere. And the method for that isn't simply a WP:Local consensus built on this project alone and demands that other policies conform to what is determined here. The first step is for a discussion at WT:UP about WP:STALEDRAFT policy; honestly that's the easiest thing to work out and change. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 00:11, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
The main problem is the tagging for AFC project, if the tagger does not intend to take responsibility for the draft. We can certainly discuss AFC tagging here. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 22:15, 22 January 2016 (UTC)

โ”Œโ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”˜ Should we be draftifying new, viable, userpage drafts? I asked for this script to be created for that purpose. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 00:48, 23 January 2016 (UTC)

If the creator want them to be made a draft, then yes. If the creator adds the AFC project tag, then yes. If it is in userspace that does not belong to any user then perhaps move to the correct user, or draft space. Another case is from article to draft, where someone asks for an undelete, but it is not ready to be an article, but has some potential. Or perhaps instead of deletion of something by a COI editor it can be draftified, with a compulsory AFC process. โ€” Preceding unsigned comment added by Graeme Bartlett (talk โ€ข contribs) 02:35, 2016 January 23
  • We do draftifying old viable userspace drafts. New ones and ones with active users I disagree with. An active user should not have to edit their own pages every six months to avoid G13 issues. That's their pages for as long as they remain here. If they fall into WP:STALE timeline (the editor stops for at least a year), I think it's fair if someone else takes the draft and draftify it for the project. There's enough very good quality pages that are five/six/seven years old that's it not worth chasing down the new stuff. I'd say at least tag them with userspace draft and the relevant month so we can find them later. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 03:46, 23 January 2016 (UTC)
I understand. I wanted this script mainly for this scenario: The draft is at the userpage and about a notable person or company. The user is that person or company owner. They are looking to build a profile at the userpage and keep it there forever. No/few/bad refs. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 04:15, 23 January 2016 (UTC)
You want that moved to draftspace? The script would do that and even include a username warning and the like option. Otherwise, WP:MFD is always an option and there are time the voting supported putting it in draftspace anyways. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 02:14, 24 January 2016 (UTC)
Ricky81682, yes. And why MfD? Isn't it best to move it to draft. Then, the clock starts ticking. The user sees it in an undesirable place, i.e. not at userpage where it is a profile and not in mainspace. The user is prompted to move it forward. If he doesn't it ends up evaluated when stale to be either speedy tagged or moved to the mainspace. Is that not the best plan for it? Anna Frodesiak (talk) 04:09, 24 January 2016 (UTC)
{A} See above. It seems like there's a number of views about timelines for drafts and who is authorized to add drafts to AFC. Just a movement but no AFC will leave it with no prompt. (B) MFD will delete it in a week; we aren't waiting on six months. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 04:41, 24 January 2016 (UTC)
Hi Ricky81682. Ah okay, I will let everyone else decide and then follow the new way. :) I'm happy with whatever happens. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 04:58, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

Fresh eyes[edit]

Please, please do a review of this draft in this state. It is somewhat urgent. I would like to know if I was unreasonable in mainspacing it. Do not hesitate to tell me I was wrong. Tell me anything you can. What percentage of reviewers would have mainspaced or declined it? Would you have declined it? Why? Would you have approved it? Why? Many thanks. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 12:53, 21 January 2016 (UTC)

I don't see why Viriditas would do that without a valid rationale. It's a perfectly notable topic with ample referencing and encyclopaedic value. It could do with a bit of cleaning up and formatting improvements, but nothing that would prevent me from accepting it. AfC isn't page curation - if it meets the criteria (notability, npov, etc) and is decent (no copyvios, etc), it's accepted. There seems to be a redirect issue as well, although I'm unaware as to who's responsible. Cannabis dispensaries are different to Medical marijuana dispensaries (although some fulfill both roles). This draft is actually trying to provide a world-view on the topic and as such needs to be moved back into mainspace, and the redirects fixed. Hope this helps. Best, FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 14:34, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
Update: an uninvolved admin opened an AfD here to try and get consensus as to whether the article should be deleted or not. --Nathan2055talk - contribs 18:39, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
@FoCuSandLeArN: I strongly disagree with your assessment. I have reviewed the article, including all 28 sources. There isn't a single source that discusses the actual topic of cannabis dispensariesโ€”they either discuss aspects of the topic or none at at all. That's not how we write articles on Wikipedia. Further, half of the article is unsourced, while the other half either misuses sources or uses them poorly. There is a huge difference between a notable topic (this is one of them) and writing a cited article about the subject (this is not one). It seems that people are easily fooled and misled by the appearance of sources and the appearance of content, but aren't willing to actually look at the article and see what's there. To write an article about the subject of a cannabis dispensary, you have to use reliable secondary sources about the general subject. There are none used here. Viriditas (talk) 20:28, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
Why don't you make your points at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Cannabis dispensary? There is also nothing to stop you improving the article and its sourcing, if you believe there is a problem there โ€” Martin (MSGJ ยท talk) 20:36, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
I already did, and I don't need you to nanny me. Viriditas (talk) 20:39, 21 January 2016 (UTC)
  • And I've !voted to "Speedy close and incubate" due to an inappropriate nomination that is interfering with this discussion.  AfD is for decisions needing admin tools.  AfD is not binding over editorial disputes, just as the closing administrator is not bound to mediate any subsequent editorial consequences of an AfD close that did not use admin tools.  Unscintillating (talk) 21:48, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
Thank you, FoCuSandLeArN. Your feedback is appreciated. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 00:44, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
@Viriditas: That is precisely my point. We review articles, we do not copy edit them significantly, although we might be inclinded to do so with promising drafts on occasion. I would have reviewed this article and accepted it, then tagging it for copy edit and referencing issues appropriately. Nobody here can possibly deny dispensaries are a notable topic for a stand-alone article. In any case, what you did is inappropriate. If you believe a mainspace article is unsuited for Wikipedia, then submit it for deletion discussion. Do not override a reviewer's judgement and draftify an article due to your own personal concerns about the way it's written, which by the way are not valid deletion rationales. There is no policy availing your course of action. Dissenting with a fellow reviewer is perfectly fine, but let them know via talk page, not by undoing their work. An apology is in order. FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 14:23, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
I don't agree as I already explained up above. Articles should never be created just because the subject is notable, they should be created because the source is reliable and supports it. That was not the case and the earlier reviewer noted this. If you think an article should be created simply because the topic is notable, then we have a major disconnect with AfC and the policies and guidelines. Viriditas (talk) 18:48, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
  • As far as I know, moving an article to draftspace is accepted practice as per WP:BOLD.  If there is more to this, please cite from reference material.  Unscintillating (talk) 21:48, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
  • It is common courtesy to let a fellow reviewer know about apparent mistakes, not trampling over perfectly acceptable moves to mainspace. Be aware that this isn't merely a draftspace issue - this is an AfC issue. FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 21:59, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
Wow. I rejected the article when it looked like this. To me this looks like an AfC success story -- editor made significant changes, and article went to main space. Since then, lots of others folks have worked on it, which is one of the reasons to move an even imperfect article to main space. I don't think it should have been moved back to draft. In response to FoCuS, I actually do make significant edits on many AfC articles, but that's my choice -- I agree that isn't anything that AfC'rs are required to do. I just find it more satisfying than hitting "decline." LaMona (talk) 20:15, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
I agree with you, LaMona. Some of us choose to adopt articles, if you will. I am just pointing to the fact Anna Frodesiak didn't do anything wrong. FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 22:02, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
As far as I can tell, there have been no significant edits, only significant deletions by other editors. There has been no "success" per se โ€” the article still lacks a significant reliable secondary source about the subject. The only reason there has been any attention paid to this article at all, is because I moved it back to draft space. In that case, perhaps there should be a new process that codifies a "return to draft". Viriditas (talk) 20:32, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
There are ample sources available on dispensaries, as a perfunctory search would show you (about 80 thousand results right off the bat, both online and in print). If you were familiar with AfD, you'd know a lack of sources in-article is not a valid decline rationale - verifiability and notability concerns are (nominating criteria B and C), which in this case are not present. As I noted before, the subject counts with extensive coverage in independent and reliable sources (all of this has been discussed in the AfD discussion). You were "bold" and made a mess, and you were called to answer for that mess. Now you're pretending someone should magically solve all the article's issues or it should be deleted otherwise. Are you aware of the absurdity behind all this? Do you have a cannabis phobia? Let it go. The article will grow on Wikipedia; let it run its course. Cheers, FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 21:59, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
I disagree, and I find your comments uninformed. I have written extensively about cannabis in the last decade on Wikipedia, and I know quite a bit about the subject and the sources used to write and create articles about it. If words have meaning, and I hope you agree that they do, then my contributions on this subject reflect the opposite of a "phobia". More to the point, the original draft of the cannabis dispensary article did not contain any reliable secondary sources about the subject. That is required to write an article. Instead, it contained unreliable sources, primary sources about state policies, and links to websites that didn't support the content. Your appeal to 80 thousand websites you found by Googling misses the entire point by a mile and ignores everything I've written in this thread. At least one user has come to his senses and has realized that while we certainly don't have an article about cannnabis dispensaries, it might be salvaged by writing about cannabis dispensaries in the US instead; as a result, the scope has been successfully changed to reflect what the sources actually say and the original research has been deleted. This is called article development and I suggest you look into it. It is not "absurd" as you claim. Viriditas (talk) 22:16, 22 January 2016 (UTC)
Look, I don't want to start a controversy here. I know you meant well. I believe, however, that those issues are mainspace concerns. That's why we have NPP, and a myriad other cleanup endeavours. We seem to disagree on the quality threshold for acceptance, and that's OK. We can work on that; that's what we do at AfC. We indeed have acquired a sort of sixth sense about potential articles, that's why I was so harsh before. We see many such drafts that are abandoned by inexperienced editors, so when I see such a setback, it really gets me going. We know how submissions such as this one can improve once in mainspace - we've seen it hundreds of times. I certainly look forward to improving this article, as I have a few Cannabis-related articles on my to-do list as well. State policies, etc are topics which definitely need to be touched on, we just need quality sources to do that. I look forward to doing the research. Best, FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 22:45, 22 January 2016 (UTC)

โ”Œโ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”€โ”˜ The AfD at this point is all but certainly a keep, which resolves the issue of mainspace worthiness and notability. The naming issue has been opened as an RfC over here. Once all this is finally resolved, we really need to hammer out a policy on whether it's okay to draftify already approved mainspace articles and, if so, what situations it would be okay to do that in. --Nathan2055talk - contribs 00:17, 23 January 2016 (UTC)

Precisely. FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 00:35, 23 January 2016 (UTC)
Well, we do have "Articles are incubated as a result of...iv) a bold move from article space..."
Anna Frodesiak (talk) 00:54, 23 January 2016 (UTC)
I think what Nathan2055 means is what happens when a user moves back an article that was accepted at AfC, to draftspace. FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 01:27, 23 January 2016 (UTC)
All I see here is that this is just another version of an editorial decision, just like any other editorial decision.  Unscintillating (talk) 02:11, 23 January 2016 (UTC)
Well, we like to cover all our bases so that we have no problems in the future. We're having one other discussion right now about moving drafts, which you can see above. FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 02:15, 23 January 2016 (UTC)
If "...I think what Nathan2055 means..." was for me, then: Yes, but that article's history could have been draft --> article. Then someone comes along and draftifies it again. That bit of guildeline or whatever actually gives permission to send an AfC-approved draft back to draft from whence it came. Am I reading that right? Anna Frodesiak (talk) 04:04, 23 January 2016 (UTC)
I'm not entirely sure what you are saying, but no one has shown me that an "AfC reviewer" has any special status other than "editor".  So one editor (you) makes an edit, and another editor (Viriditas) reverses the edit.  Time for discussion.  Since there is no value in rushing the article to mainspace, an editor has expressed a concern, and in this case the article creator now would have preferred that the article be in his user space (as per Wikipedia talk:Articles for deletion/Cannabis dispensary); it wouldn't have hurt to leave the article back in its protected space in draftspace for a few more days while development continued.  I still don't see a problem.  Unscintillating (talk) 05:03, 23 January 2016 (UTC)
Hi Unscintillating. What I was saying above is that there is a guideline that allows moving back to draft space. That's all I was saying. I have no comment on if that is a good or bad thing.
As for the cannibis thing, yes, maybe I should have left it in draft space. The problem with the move back to draft space was not with me. I had no objections per se. It was the author, a newcomer. He was furious. He felt his work had be destroyed. Anna Frodesiak (talk) 04:14, 24 January 2016 (UTC)
From a distance, I think your good-faith decision to move the page to mainspace is fine.  A bold move is one of the ways to find out that someone doesn't agree with an editorial decision.  Next, I don't see that the reversing editor (Viriditas) did each of the steps needed to return an article to draftspace.  Has anyone shown him how he could technically do it better?  From a distance, I think that the move is within accepted practice.  The authority to do so does not come directly from incubation option #4, but from the fundamental principle that all editors have the authority to edit without getting permission.  The reversing editor reasonably started a discussion on the talk page (see a version of Talk:Cannabis_dispensaries_in_the_United_States in the Section #Not_ready_for_mainspace), and WP:BRD (Bold, Revert, Discuss) is accepted practice.
The guideline proposal that seems to be in the air is, "Moves out of draftspace by AfC reviewers shall be a one-way move to mainspace."  Why should one editor's edit restrict an article's location to mainspace, even if another editor thinks that the decision needs broader community consensus?  See WP:CREEP
From my viewpoint, a more relevant point is that we (including non-AfC draftspace) could use a more formal process to be available when decisions about draftspace articles need a group decision.  Neither MfD nor AfD work for this purpose.  Unscintillating (talk) 16:20, 24 January 2016 (UTC)
I agree with you here. Keep in mind AfC is a special little place too. Face-smile.svg FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 18:16, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

Need further assistance[edit]

Our submitted article about our company was not approved. I am looking for assistance to help me get it approved. Below is the info so far. We are new to Wikipedia so any help would be greatly appreciated.

We did read the COI info. And to clarify the article was written by the publicist of our company I posted it under my account. Secondly, to again clarify, we looked at some competitors that have published pages to see what specific information was included and then we did the same. Who would know more about a successful company then the person who built it? The references used is info published by other sources to verify what was stated. I am looking for help to get the article posted. Thank you. โ€” Preceding unsigned comment added by WRC3 (talk โ€ข contribs)

For reference you are talking about Draft:HighVolMusic. We need independent reliable sources that talk about the company. The entire history section is completely without sources and the only sources are about the awards that the artists in the label won. That may show that the artists or the albums could have an article but we need evidence that the record label itself is separately important. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 00:10, 25 January 2016 (UTC)
@WRC3: To put a finer point on it: what you think you know doesn't matter. That's original research and not allowed. We need to base our encyclopedic content on what journalists have said about your company. While it's totally understandable that you based your entry around other pages that's not a reasonable argument here because most of the stuff you find on Wikipedia is utter crap. We're working everyday to fix those eyesores. Rather than have your PR person write the article you should have found a Wikipedian to help you, instead. Chris Troutman (talk) 12:10, 31 January 2016 (UTC)
@Chris troutman: Thanks for the additional points Chris. We've rewritten the article since this post and resubmitted. wondering if you might have read it now? also finding resources that are still around when we first started the company has been challenging. We did find one and added it in the history. Where do I find Wikipedians/ We found a company they wanted $2000 to write the article.
@WRC3: I've declined the draft and left comments. To boil it down, I need to see sources like Revolver or The Wall Street Journal talking about your company. The sources you cited don't impress and you've misused sources, too. While a source like this is reliable (San Diego Reader) it's only a mere mention of the label. If journalists aren't talking about the label then I really have to question your company's notability.
As for finding Wikipedians, you can always try our reward board where you might find help for free. Websites like Upwork have Wikipedians for hire but of course you need to stay clear of hiring undisclosed paid-editors. Chris Troutman (talk) 13:03, 31 January 2016 (UTC)
@Chris troutman: Chris thanks for the feedback. We will continue to locate sources to validate the notability. I have 2 questions: 1) What specifically does "talking about" mean? What kind of information/validation is being looked for to warrant an approval or be a worthy source? 2) The sources you list are print sources Revolver/Wall Street are these the only sources that is deemed reliable or valid? Many outlets speak about our company that may not be "print" sources however they are very viable in our line of business i.e. Bravewords,Blabbermouth,Hard Rock Daddy and various others. I am trying narrow down what it is exactly would get our article approved. I do understand the COI issue, "what I think I know" about our company may not matter to Wiki, does indeed matter and has relevance to our growth as an independent label over the years.; Many labels at our level haven't even come close to what Chavis Records/HighVolMusic has accomplished. However I'm beginning to understand the end game here and want our article to be notable with reliable sources to backup what has been written. Thank you. โ€” Preceding unsigned comment added by WRC3 (talk โ€ข contribs)
@WRC3: I'm not into metal so I don't have a positive impression about those sources. We have a similar problem with mixed martial arts articles; big-time outlets like ESPN don't provide much coverage but a lot of reportage comes out of websites like mixedmartialarts.com which isn't widely considered a reliable source. WikiProject MMA polices this stuff. For your niche interest, you might inquire with WikiProject Music. They might have editors that have a better idea of which sources are acceptable in your world. For most of what I work on I stick to journalism and academic press.
The point I was trying to make is that the cited source should be addressing Chavis Records/HighVolMusic as a subject. If the source only says "artist X signed with HighVolMusic" it provides a fact but doesn't speak to your company's notability as much as it addresses the artist and their notability. You need to find sources that discuss the company, not just the musicians that are signed to the label to make a claim of notability along the lines of general notability. It doesn't matter how many fighters are signed with Don King. He has to have media talking about him as a promoter in order for him to be notable.
I notice, for example, the article about Megaforce Records is pathetic. Yes, they signed Metallica but notability is not inherited. That article is essentially unsourced and it ought to be deleted. Meanwhile, the article about Avalanche Recordings has at least a couple sources which themselves have Wikipedia articles. This again is where the Wikipedian comes in. You're trying to climb up the hill of notability in the draft namespace while a Wikipedian could just create this article in the main namespace and it would still be unsatisfactory but it would be published for your SEO needs until it gets deleted. I encourage you to find better sources. Chris Troutman (talk) 16:38, 31 January 2016 (UTC)
@Chris troutman: Thanks Chris. This is the kind of answer/info I was looking for, this helps alot.

Redirect request requires admin attention[edit]

Wikipedia:Articles_for_creation/Redirects#Redirect_request:_Feels_good_man is a now quite old request for a redirect on a salted page. Could an admin please have a look at that and accept or refuse as they see fit. Cheers, --LukeSurl t c 16:24, 25 January 2016 (UTC)

I accepted it, can't think of a reason not to. I was involved (but not involved) with a related AfD discussion about 6 months ago. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 16:31, 25 January 2016 (UTC)
Face-smile.svg Thank you--LukeSurl t c 16:34, 25 January 2016 (UTC)
Huh, if the AfD got closed as a redirect to List of Internet phenomena, how come this article exists? --LukeSurl t c 16:39, 25 January 2016 (UTC)
As Facebook says, "it's complicated". It was recreated with a different title (lower case f), nominated for DYK, then moved to the current title via a history merge. It seems some celebrities picked up on the meme since the AfD. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont) 08:31, 26 January 2016 (UTC)

Pre-production starts for Wikipedia and Wikimedia Commons tutorial videos[edit]

We are excited that pre-production has started for a series of motivational and educational videos that will introduce Wikipedia and some of its sister projects to new contributors.

Over the past several years, many videos have been produced to train new contributors. This series will feature VisualEditor and the new citation tool called Citoid. Additionally, the series will include an introduction to the Wikimedia Commons repository of freely-licensed media.

The video series and associated materials will help students and instructors who participate in the Wikipedia Education Program. The series is also designed to assist the professional staff and volunteers of galleries, libraries, archives, and museums (GLAMs) with understanding how their content gains exposure on Wikimedia sites, and how to document or upload their content for direct viewing on Wikipedia and its sister projects.

The video content will be available in segments that can be viewed, translated, or updated individually.

There are currently volunteer translators for Arabic, Armenian, Czech, German, Greek, Odia, and Spanish. Additional volunteers with high proficiency translation skills are welcome to sign up on the talk page.

We are currently seeking feedback on the outline for the scripts, as well as suggestions for an attractive name for the series. Please leave any comments on this talk page!

Regards,

Pineโœ‰

Series director and screenwriter

Notes[edit]

This series is funded by an individual engagement grant from the Wikimedia Foundation. A big thanks to the community, the IEG Committee, and WMF for their support.

Draftification[edit]

There's a relevant RfC going on at Wikipedia_talk:Drafts#Clarification_over_main-space_to_draft-space_moves. Just a heads-up. Best, FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 15:06, 31 January 2016 (UTC)

Category:G13 eligible AfC submissions[edit]

Why do we have Category:G13 eligible AfC submissions? Would it be possible for a bot to automatically tag it for CSDG13 after 6 months, by patrolling that category? Anarchyte (work | talk) 09:09, 1 February 2016 (UTC)

People want it reviewed by hand before people decide on whether to extend it or send to G13 formerly. Ricky81682 (talk) 09:35, 1 February 2016 (UTC)
Anarchyte, there is a bot such as the one you describe, operated by Hasteur, but it waits a while before tagging to give interested editors a chance to look over the drafts. It takes time to look for references and remove promotional text, and once nominated the drafts are often deleted within minutes.โ€”Anne Delong (talk) 14:22, 1 February 2016 (UTC)
Few points:
  1. Previously the bot did a null edit so that the AFC submission header will show the "This draft has not been edited for 6 months and is eligible for G13", give the warning notice to the page creator, and put the page into it's store of "Pages that the author has currently been warned about". 30 days after the warning, the bot can take up the cause of the page again to see if the page is still eligible for G13. If so it would perform the procedural G13 nomination.
  2. Now that the bot does the warning edit at 5 months unedited, it goes over the list in the database 30 days later to see if the page has become eligible for G13.
  3. While it's preferred that the bot run the nominations (to remove any possibility of unfairness by obeying the rules), any editor who sees that the page is free to nominate for G13, it just makes the deleting admin's jobs harder when trying to determine if the page truly meets all the requirements, or if a user is not obeying the rules with respect to nominations.
Going back to "not here" again. Hasteur (talk) 17:00, 1 February 2016 (UTC)

Disambig option for wizard[edit]

In the wizard it gives an option if you want to propose a new redirect for review but there is no option for proposing a new disambig page.

Could that be added? For example I wanted to make DDDA for Dublin Docklands Development Authority and Dodecanedioic acid but was not sure which to use. 184.145.18.50 (talk) 18:46, 5 February 2016 (UTC)

Why would you want/need to use a wizard to create a simple redirect? Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 14:46, 6 February 2016 (UTC)
The easiest way to propose a disambiguation page is to make a new draft with the wizard, format it like a typical disambiguation page, add {{Disambiguation}} to the page, and submit it for review just like a regular draft. /wiae /tlk 16:32, 6 February 2016 (UTC)
Quite frankly if an editor is experienced enough to understand the purpose of a disambiguation page, they should also be sufficiently competent to create one without needing AFC to hold their hand through the process. AFC exists to help newbies, when experienced editors submit drafts all they do is waste time and add to backlogs. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 09:02, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

Cleanup bot[edit]

Would anyone object to a bot that automatically cleans up new submissions using the same regular expressions that AFCH uses? We haven't had a cleanup bot since ArticlesForCreationBot (talk ยท contribs) went down in 2013 and I feel like it would make readability of new submissions easier. --Nathan2055talk - contribs 19:12, 6 February 2016 (UTC)

Sounds like a good idea! FoCuS contribs; talk to me! 13:45, 7 February 2016 (UTC)
Would the bot be triggered by the "submit" template, so that cleanup runs as adraft is submitted? Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 15:17, 7 February 2016 (UTC)
I wasn't around for the previous version -- can you give a couple of words on what the bot would do? thanks, LaMona (talk) 23:25, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

Artist bio[edit]

Dear Sirs:

How come after I insert my Aritst BIO here on the page. I save the page and then it disappears and is lost. What happened to all of my text and BIO?

Email: sunsettwilightbaran@yahoo.com

Thank you,

Baran โ€” Preceding unsigned comment added by Baran USA (talk โ€ข contribs) 08:56, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

Because based on your user name it appears that you are creating a page for yourself, so it has been deleted. If you are not the subject of the article, then your username is causing confusion. Your username should be a name you have chosen to represent yourself, not the same of the subject of the article you are creating. However, if you are indeed the Baran USA that is the subject of the article, then you should know that you should not create an article for yourself. See conflict of interest and autobiography for the relevant policies. LaMona (talk) 23:30, 7 February 2016 (UTC)