Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Latter Day Saint movement

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Nomination of Letter to a CES Director for deletion[edit]

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Letter to a CES Director is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Letter to a CES Director until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article.— Preceding unsigned comment added by Eustress (talkcontribs)

Finding constancy in naming of "Apostle" position[edit]

I have opened a discussion at List of members of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles (LDS Church) in order to find some constancy in naming. Before I accidentally impose my personal view, it would nice to have a real consensus of proper naming of "Apostle". Any input would be nice.--- ARTEST4ECHO(Talk)

Inclusion criteria for LDS leaders[edit]

I just created a discussion of the inclusion criteria for LDS leaders at Wikipedia talk:Notability (people). I hope that link works.

Carol F. McConkie[edit]

There is a discussion a Article for deletion on the inclusion of the article on Carol F. McConkie at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Carol F. McConkie (2nd nomination).

Nomination of Hugo E. Martinez for deletion[edit]

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Hugo E. Martinez is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Hugo E. Martinez (2nd nomination) until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article.

Nomination of List of law clerks of the Supreme Court of the United States from BYU for deletion[edit]

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article List of law clerks of the Supreme Court of the United States from BYU is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of law clerks of the Supreme Court of the United States from BYU (2nd nomination) until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article.

Nomination of Joseph Bishop for deletion[edit]

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Joseph Bishop is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Joseph Bishop until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article.

TfD on Template:Latter Day Saint biography[edit]

People may be interested in This TfD on Template:Latter Day Saint biography and subtemplates Galobtter (pingó mió) 19:03, 21 May 2018 (UTC)

Use of templates[edit]

Over the last few weeks, Broter initiated good faith efforts to begin including the information currently found in many LDS Church-related templates directly into articles. Primary reasons expressed for this significant change include that it's not only more typical of use across WP, but also from the view that all the extra space being taken for an additional template file is unnecessary. I have concerns about these changes due to the extensive use of templates in a number of articles and the impact it would have. As a couple of examples, the articles potentially impacted include the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles (LDS Church), or listings such as the church's presidents, apostles, or temples. These use templates extensively, to provide efficiency of updates, along with ease of the listings and related updates. Based on a recent update to the temple status page by Jgstokes regarding temples closed for renovation, I tried the following as a test example. With the recent closing of the Oakland California Temple for renovation, if the template is updated to show "Closed for Renovation" it does not show up on the main article page. It does however show that status on the temple listing page I referred to above. The flip side is that if the main article page is updated where the infobox is now embedded in the article, those changes are not reflected on the temple listing. I have no idea what this does to the portal-related issues that Broter has worked so hard on, which seems to be why the changes were initially started, but it creates inconsistency across a number of issues - and would require people to know/remember to update for the same issues in multiple ways. I don't know how much traffic this page will get, but since it seems to warrant some discussion or awareness, I thought I'd note it here for comment and some consensus-building discussion. ChristensenMJ (talk) 16:44, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

Look at the infobox for Bryan D. Brown. The standard in wikipedia is to have the infobox within the article space. The User:ARTEST4ECHO who created this infobox-system for the LDS movement did it all wrong.--Broter (talk) 16:52, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

Thank you. Yes, that may be the case, as a standard or guideline, but that does not address the issues it creates that I tried to give an example of above. ChristensenMJ (talk) 17:01, 22 May 2018 (UTC)

My two cents on this matter: The templates do well to share an extensive amount of information in a concise and orderly way. If the information on the templates for such articles is pulled out into the main articles, there is greater likelihood for redundancies, and that, as observed above, some informational items may appear where they shouldn't and may not show up when they should. There has been a very good discussion about these templates in the past, and while I appreciate the efforts of all concerned in trying to regulate the flow of such information, unless the intent is to eventually replace all templates with in-article information (which would be a task of gargantuan proportions that would likely prove overwhelming for all concerned, especially those directly involved in such efforts), then the information that can be more easily presented in the template should not be duplicated in those articles. I am assuming good faith on the part of all concerned in this matter, but I am with ChristensenMJ on this one. --Jgstokes (talk) 03:09, 23 May 2018 (UTC)

The topic hasn't generated much discussion. At the same time, while it's been noted that including the infobox in the article may typically be a standard WP approach, there have been no explanations or solutions provided to address the number of other challenges that the recent changes create. In the absence of those solutions, I am inclined to change those articles where such changes have been made back, but felt it appropriate to note that again here before doing so, in order to provide further discussion, or arrival at consensus driven by outcomes, rather than preferences or typical guidelines. ChristensenMJ (talk) 19:41, 29 May 2018 (UTC)

WikiProject collaboration notice from the Portals WikiProject[edit]

The reason I am contacting you is because there are one or more portals that fall under this subject, and the Portals WikiProject is currently undertaking a major drive to automate portals that may affect them.

Portals are being redesigned.

The new design features are being applied to existing portals.

At present, we are gearing up for a maintenance pass of portals in which the introduction section will be upgraded to no longer need a subpage. In place of static copied and pasted excerpts will be self-updating excerpts displayed through selective transclusion, using the template {{Transclude lead excerpt}}.

The discussion about this can be found here.

Maintainers of specific portals are encouraged to sign up as project members here, noting the portals they maintain, so that those portals are skipped by the maintenance pass. Currently, we are interested in upgrading neglected and abandoned portals. There will be opportunity for maintained portals to opt-in later, or the portal maintainers can handle upgrading (the portals they maintain) personally at any time.

Background[edit]

On April 8th, 2018, an RfC ("Request for comment") proposal was made to eliminate all portals and the portal namespace. On April 17th, the Portals WikiProject was rebooted to handle the revitalization of the portal system. On May 12th, the RfC was closed with the result to keep portals, by a margin of about 2 to 1 in favor of keeping portals.

There's an article in the current edition of the Signpost interviewing project members about the RfC and the Portals WikiProject.

Since the reboot, the Portals WikiProject has been busy building tools and components to upgrade portals.

So far, 84 editors have joined.

If you would like to keep abreast of what is happening with portals, see the newsletter archive.

If you have any questions about what is happening with portals or the Portals WikiProject, please post them on the WikiProject's talk page.

Thank you.    — The Transhumanist   10:58, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

Ichthus June 2018 is out now![edit]

* Read this Ichthus in full * Get Ichthus delivered to your Talkpage * – Lionel(talk) 04:04, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Víctor Afrânio Asconavieta da Silva[edit]

Another editor has nominated Víctor Afrânio Asconavieta da Silva, an Area Seventy in Brazil, for nomination. Your comments at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Víctor Afrânio Asconavieta da Silva would be welcome. Eastmain (talkcontribs) 06:41, 21 June 2018 (UTC)

Ichthus July 2018 is out now![edit]

* Read this Ichthus in full * Get Ichthus delivered to your Talkpage * – Lionel(talk) 08:06, 4 July 2018 (UTC)

Latter Day Saint martyrs[edit]

IMO, this entire page has issues.

It staples together at least 3 or 4 groups that don't belong together.

  • Pre succession crisis members who died including a *large* group from the Haun's Mill Massacre that should probably be flattened in some how
  • Leaders of various smaller groups (Strang and two of the recent Fundamentalist groups
  • Missionaries, in some cases that weren't even killed because of their faith
  • Helmuth Hübener who definitely didn't die because he was LDS.
  • a few others.

In addition, the pre succession crisis entries should not only be linked to the pre-succession name of the church, the displayed name should be that as well.

In short, I'd prefer that some source actually use the term Martyr before it is on this list.Naraht (talk) 14:25, 1 August 2018 (UTC)

I agree that the list seems too inclusive. For sources on Mormon martyrs, the Encyclopedia of Mormonism lists a few from the scriptures and Joseph Smith and Hyrum Smith. A search on BYU studies comes up with a few things as well. Rachel Helps (BYU) (talk) 15:47, 1 August 2018 (UTC)
I'd feel uncomfortable with a wikipedia list in that regard that included both Abinadi and Joseph Smith. And Parley P. Pratt is also doubtful to me, I really don't expect that if another Latter Day Saint had been standing next to Pratt that Hector would have gone after them, but I'm still willing to consider him on the list.Naraht (talk) 17:31, 1 August 2018 (UTC)
  • I know there were two missionaries killed in Peru, who were non-Americans (either Peruvians or from other Spanish-speaking South American countries, their mission president Juan Angel Alvoradejo was a Mexican), in 1990. I am surprised they are not on the list. I found the source. Here is an Ensign article on it [1]. They were in the Lima Peru East Mission, and from Arequipa Peru and Trujillo Peru. I will try adding them to the list.John Pack Lambert (talk) 13:58, 11 August 2018 (UTC)
  • I once read an article that mentioned there may have been some Tahitian or surrounding islands members of the LDS Church executed by colonial autorities in about 1852. I don't remember where I came arcoss the mention for sure, and it didn't give any names.John Pack Lambert (talk) 13:58, 11 August 2018 (UTC)
  • Oops, I take that back, the Peru missionaries are on there. I added Goerge P. Canova, however I am not sure he belongs. As a county comissionaer and branch president he was both a prominent citizen and known as a Mormon, but I do not know how the evidence adds up, or if a murderer was ever identified. One might also want to consult Patrick Q. Mason's work on anti-Mormon feelings in the south in the late 19th-century. I believe there were a few more missionaries killed. I believe in one case a missionary vanished while traveling alone and was presumed dead, but no body was ever found.John Pack Lambert (talk) 14:09, 11 August 2018 (UTC)

I think we need a deltion sorting page for this topic.[edit]

I was trying to create one, but then realized I had no idea how to. Which is one reason why it is so hard to monitor deletion discussions.John Pack Lambert (talk) 22:42, 11 August 2018 (UTC)

Claudio R. M. Costa[edit]

Another editor has nominated the article on Claudio R. M. Costa, a general authority seventy, for deletion. Your comments would be welcome at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Claudio R. M. Costa.John Pack Lambert (talk) 22:54, 11 August 2018 (UTC)

Mary Ellen W. Smoot[edit]

The Wikipedia article on Mary Ellen W. Smoot who was relief society general president is up for deletion. Your comments at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Mary Ellen W. Smoot would be appreciated.John Pack Lambert (talk) 22:57, 11 August 2018 (UTC)

Patricia P. Pinegar[edit]

The Wikipedia article on Patricia P. Pinegar who was primary general president is under discussion for deletion. Your comments at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Patricia P. Pinegar would be appreciated.John Pack Lambert (talk) 23:01, 11 August 2018 (UTC)


Women in Red November 2018[edit]

In November 2018, Women in Red is focusing on Religion.--Ipigott (talk) 12:19, 2 November 2018 (UTC)