Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Rivers

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WikiProject Rivers (Rated Project-class)
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Thanks. — Headbomb {ταλκκοντριβς – WP Physics} 09:37, 15 March, 2009 (UTC)

New article: Rio San Jose[edit]

Anyone want to help tune up this new article I made? Getting good data is hard. Dicklyon (talk) 19:09, 25 June 2018 (UTC)

If you are looking for data on a river, it is always worth looking to see if it has any flow measurement stats. There was some info from the USGS which allowed me to expand the article...Jokulhlaup (talk) 16:13, 10 July 2018 (UTC)
Thanks, I see that you did! Dicklyon (talk) 04:45, 14 July 2018 (UTC)

I also find quite a few river articles with no photos; so when I stop by a river, I take pictures, and later check to see if WP has pix. I added some to Rio Ojo Caliente, Dickey River, and Calawah River, which had none, and also added some to a few other rivers I visited this week. Dicklyon (talk) 04:45, 14 July 2018 (UTC)

Dolu River / river[edit]

I have come in NPP across an article which had a title in Bengali (but was in English). I moved it to Dolu river, it is about the river in Bangladesh. I then discovered that there is already an article Dolu River about a river in Romania. We had at some point conventions about capitalizing river, and it was country-specific. Could somebody please advise what would be better names for these articles? They are both listed at Dolu. Thank you.--Ymblanter (talk) 20:23, 14 July 2018 (UTC)

Merger discussion for Jordan River (disambiguation)[edit]


An article that you have been involved in editing—Jordan River (disambiguation)—has been proposed for merging with another article. If you are interested, please participate in the merger discussion. Thank you. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 10:04, 28 July 2018 (UTC)

Updated version of USGS Hydrological Unit Codes[edit]

I have been working on Water Resource Region articles for regions of the HUC watershed system, and while I notice that there is an updated version, I'm not sure how to access the updated hierarchy. It seems to require GIS and I don't yet have any familiarity with how to run a GIS program. The old version is available, but it seems like some changes were made at the Subbasin level (level 4 of the 6 levels) of the US Hydrological code. Does anyone here happen to know

  1. Anything about the changes made - are they just new levels of granularity, or did the levels exist before and they have been refined
  2. If there is any way to tie GNIS info back to HUC info - for example, is there a way to find the HUC info for Abbot Branch?

Also, any pointers to some resources to learn GIS would be welcome. -Furicorn (talk) 08:26, 13 August 2018 (UTC)

Yes to both of those, the new data added a level 10 and level 12, but it did also make changes at all levels, even level 2, the biggest change was moving the Lake Champlain watershed from the Mid-Atlantic to the Great Lakes region. It also made significant changes to HUCs along the borders, so that cross-border watersheds are properly represented instead of cutting off at the border. You can browse without GIS using the National Map,, you want the Watershed Boundary Dataset layer. If you do want to take the plunge into GIS, I recommend QGIS, which does have a active support community around it. Kmusser (talk) 13:17, 13 August 2018 (UTC)
@Kmusser: thanks for showing me the map! I'm definitely struggling to strip highway and city information off the map, but I'll keep at it. More importantly, it's still not clear to me how to use GNIS info for something like Abbot Branch to find the HUC. The "Abbot Branch" I'm interested in is a stream in Missouri, but if I search for "Abbot Branch" it shows me a point in Mississippi, and feature id 748552 shows me a point in Alabama. I'm feel at a dead end about how to connect that GNIS data to the National Map you linked. If you (or anyone) has any thoughts about how to proceed, I'd be grateful. -Furicorn (talk) 23:55, 13 August 2018 (UTC)
Also, is there an equivalent to this page of Boundary Descriptions and Names of Regions for the updated regions and subregions? I'm hoping we can put the most up to date information in the Water Resource Region tables. -Furicorn (talk) 07:33, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
In the National Map, if you enter "Abbott Branch, MO" in the search box (note the two t's), it should come up with the stream you want. In the layer list (accessible via one of the icons near the top), turn on the layer "Watershed Boundary Dataset" to see which HUC it's in. (The default setting is to adjust the HUC level as you zoom in and out.) The basemap gallery (also accessible via one of the icons near the top) has a couple of options that don't show roads and cities. I hope this helps! I don't know the answer to your question about the Boundary Descriptions and Names of Regions page, unfortunately. --TimK MSI (talk) 13:16, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
To add to that, I don't think there is a direct GNIS connection using the website, you'd just have search on the name. If you did go the GIS route, there is a GNIS variable for stream segments to connect the two database, but it isn't always populated, I usually still go by the name even when using the GIS layer, just watch the spelling. I do not know of an updated page listing out the whole hierarchy like the old USGS page, you could make one from the GIS layer, but it'd be a lot of work. Kmusser (talk) 15:53, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
Took another look at that map, definitely change the basemap, under the Basemap Gallery icon, for what you're doing I think you want the USGS Hydro Cached. And GNIS is in there, but GNIS streams are not turned on by default, in the Layer List expand the Geographic Names (GNIS), and then expand Physical Points and there you'll find Streams (Mouth) which needs to be turned on (and you can turn off the cities if you don't want them, they're "populated places" under Political Points). You might also want to turn on the National Hydrography Dataset which includes some smaller streams that aren't shown on that USGS Hydro basemap. Kmusser (talk) 16:08, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
Thanks, I was able to find Abbott Branch, turns out I was just misspelling it. The USGS Hydro Cached did do the trick, thanks for that recommendation. The only thing I'm struggling to find (which I'm not sure if anyone knows) is a narrative description of each region/subregion for the newest version of HUCs. -Furicorn (talk) 17:21, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
Stay tuned, I'm going to see if I can extract those out of GIS for you, because yes, the HUCs at every level do have an actual name as well and it doesn't look like those are available through the National Map. Kmusser (talk) 19:58, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
OK, versions after 2011 dropped most of the name fields, so I have both the 2011, which names the other levels, and 2016 for the 8 and 12 levels. I don't think there were any changes to the 2, 4, and 6 levels between those two - most of the new records that pop up in the 2016 version are Canada and Mexico additions. level8 2011 (includes levels 2, 4, 6) level12 2011 (includes level 10) level8 2016 level12 2016. For citation purposes these are all derived from GIS layers obtained through (not that I have any idea of the proper way to cite that). Kmusser (talk) 23:25, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
Thats a great excel sheet, thanks so much! I'm actually interested in which level 4 subregions shifted between level 2 regions, since I'm developing tables at level 4, so hopefully if I dig into what you shared, I can figure out the latest subregion assignments. I still don't have 100% of the information, but this seems like a start. The narrative I was talking about is actually a longform description of the unit, usually a couple sentences, but I would be really shocked if that narrative was available in the GIS data. Would it be hard on the level8 sheet to include data on area for each of levels (mostly care about levels 2 and 4 right now)? -Furicorn (talk)
I think the only change at level 4 is the Lake Champlain one I mentioned earlier, which is 0201 becoming 0415, but you'd have to compare the spreadsheet to that old USGS page to check for others. I don't think longform descriptions exist anywhere, I think those old ones were written specifically for that website. I'll see about adding in areas, that should be doable. Kmusser (talk) 18:26, 15 August 2018 (UTC)
Acres added to the level8 2011 file - I just put in the level 8 acres which are what is in the original data, you'll need to subtotal to get the level 2 and 4. Kmusser (talk) 19:28, 15 August 2018 (UTC)
Good to know about Lake Champlain, but I figured I'd have to do the analysis myself. Also thanks for adding area, I can convert to square miles, but just figure I'd ask if it's available just in case it's easily added. Bummer though if your intuition about the narrative descriptions turns out to be correct. -Furicorn (talk) 21:35, 15 August 2018 (UTC)

USGS Hydrological Unit Codes vs CEC Hydrological Levels[edit]

So I've continued filling out the missing subregions on Water Resource Region, and I've found the agency responsible for harmonizing hydrological basins between the members of NAFTA, the Commission for Environmental Cooperation (CEC). The CEC has a North American Environmental Atlas with a variety of base maps, and of particular interest here is the watershed map. It comes in 4 levels, with level 1 being the largest. I'm interested in maybe creating a list of CEC North American hydrological regions, but I'm having trouble finding statistics on any of the regions, and some of the level 4 unit names (esp for Mexico). I've found two sources on the Mexican hydrological region scheme here and here, but I'm having a hard time trying to eyeball matching regions. Any thoughts are welcome. -Furicorn (talk) 23:25, 15 September 2018 (UTC)

I think what's going on there with the Mexican regions is that Mexico updated their regions and the CEC has not yet updated theirs to match, buried in the metadata for the CEC it's sourcing Mexico to a 1993 data layer and the Mexican websites are citing 2015 data. Kmusser (talk) 20:41, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
@Kmusser: Ah, Im glad you're metadata kung-fu is stronger than mine. I was able to find the links I was looking at in part through the metadata, but I wasn't able to figure out that discrepancy. It makes a lot of sense though. -Furicorn (talk) 07:02, 18 September 2018 (UTC)