Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Stub sorting

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Interpreter stubs[edit]

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2013_December_12#Category:Chinese_interpreter_stubs. The cat "Chinese interpreter stubs" was deleted, but none of the possible associated actions were taken. I tweaked the stub template but was reluctant to create the new cat. Do feel free to change it further. All the best: Rich Farmbrough00:20, 11 May 2014 (UTC).

Should struct-stub be a subtype of geo-stub?[edit]

Should the Category:Building and structure stubs be a subrtee of Category:Geography stubs?" I see inconsistancy here - for example, Category:Building and structure stubs is a subcat of Category:Geography stubs; on the other hand, Category:Alaska building and structure stubs isn't a subcat of Category:Alaska geography stubs; and upermged {{Chad-struct-stub}} doesn't feed into Category:Chad geography stubs. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 06:21, 31 December 2014 (UTC)

My thought would be that Buildings are not geography, maybe being a rural lad, but I think of geography as mountains, rivers, villages, coasts etc not buildings. However Category:Buildings and structures is a subcat of Category:places which is a subcat of Category:geography so maybe my feeling is wrong. Waacstats (talk) 21:15, 31 December 2014 (UTC)
Any other opinions here? Especially from other current stub sorters, such as Dawynn, Gug01, Redrose64, Grutness? עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 19:10, 23 March 2015 (UTC)
I've never considered Foo-struct-stub to be a child of Foo-geo-stub; I've always seen Foo-struct-stub and Foo-geo-stub as equally-ranked children of Foo-stub. --Redrose64 (talk) 19:43, 23 March 2015 (UTC)
I think this is a dilemma. On one hand, buildings and structures are part of the geography of Earth, but that definition is impractical in many, many cases. On the other hand, buildings weren't really there in the first place, so they can be equally ranked children of subject-stub. Both definitions makes sense, but the latter definition is more convenient. I think the latter should be used. Gug01 (talk) 20:57, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Struct-stubs have long been part of the geo-stub tree for a merely pragmatic reason - a lot of "amateur stub sorters" mark struct-stubs with a basic geo-stub tag. As such, it was more practical to have struct-stubs as part of the geo-stub hierarchy, especially in cases where there was not a separate struct-stub category for a particular country. I'd agree though that it doesn't always make sense for struct-stubs to be considered part of a region's geography, which does imply naturally occurring landforms (but then again, towns and villages are geo-stubs, which suggests otherwise). Personally, I'd take them out of the geo-stub tree, and have any upmerged national templates feeding into regional/continental struct-stub categories and general national categories (e.g., {{Fiji-struct-stub}} feeding into a Category:Fiji stubs and Category:Oceanian building and structure stubs) Grutness...wha? 00:43, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

I can think of the following reasins for inclusion:
  1. The top-level categories in the respective trees - Category:Building and structure stubs is a subcat of Category:Geography stubs; same is true about a few of the subcats and a single upmerged template (see User:Od Mishehu/struct)
  2. A building is (generally) part of a specfic location, which would be the most general definition of geography; and since we categorize parks and populated places as geography (both with permcats and with stub cats), buildings should be included
  3. Parks are tagged as geo-stub; if they have locations for playing sport games, they also frequently have sports-venue-stub tags (a subcat of struct-stub)
  4. Many structures are double-tagged with geo-stub tags
  5. In the US, NRHP categories are subcats og geo-stub; many of these are buildings and structures.
עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 04:04, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

Category:Main Belt asteroid stubs[edit]

This category has been well and truly overpopulated for too long (It had been just as big for a long time when I started my sabbatical from stub sorting about two/three years ago). I decided to have another look at it and notice that the majority of articles seem to have been turned into redirects, do we put stub tags on redirects or can we remove the tag from the redirect and therefore reduce the size of the category? My feeling is to remove them as redirects are not articles and therefore can't be stub articles, but am open to other suggestions. Waacstats (talk) 21:21, 31 December 2014 (UTC)

Redirects don't get stub tags, as a stub is defined as a short "article" and redirects aren't articles. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 16:20, 1 January 2015 (UTC)
I agree. And this looks like the sort of task that would be better automated... there are a lot of them! I'll see whether a bot can be put onto it. It still won't solve the problem of the category, but it will reduce it significantly. Grutness...wha? 00:48, 25 March 2015 (UTC)
I agree too. -- Magioladitis (talk) 19:23, 28 March 2015 (UTC)
@Waacstats and Od Mishehu: Symbol wait.svg BRFA filed GoingBatty (talk) 19:54, 28 March 2015 (UTC)
@Waacstats and Od Mishehu: Pictogram voting wait.svg Doing... GoingBatty (talk) 20:46, 28 March 2015 (UTC)
@Waacstats and Od Mishehu: Yes check.svgY Done, although it appears only 3% were redirects. Please let me know if I've missed any. GoingBatty (talk) 00:06, 29 March 2015 (UTC)

WikiProject X is live![edit]

WikiProject X icon.svg

Hello everyone!

You may have received a message from me earlier asking you to comment on my WikiProject X proposal. The good news is that WikiProject X is now live! In our first phase, we are focusing on research. At this time, we are looking for people to share their experiences with WikiProjects: good, bad, or neutral. We are also looking for WikiProjects that may be interested in trying out new tools and layouts that will make participating easier and projects easier to maintain. If you or your WikiProject are interested, check us out! Note that this is an opt-in program; no WikiProject will be required to change anything against its wishes. Please let me know if you have any questions. Thank you!

Note: To receive additional notifications about WikiProject X on this talk page, please add this page to Wikipedia:WikiProject X/Newsletter. Otherwise, this will be the last notification sent about WikiProject X.

Harej (talk) 16:57, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Small alteration required[edit]

The template {{Belgium-law-bio-stub}} displays the text "an Belgian" instead of "a Belgian". Could someone fix this please? Cheers YSSYguy (talk) 05:50, 24 January 2015 (UTC)

Yes check.svg Done --Redrose64 (talk) 12:10, 24 January 2015 (UTC)
@YSSYguy:It's very simple - simply look down the source of the template for the problematic phrase (note the double square bracket for the wikilink]] and fix it. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 13:57, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

Detecting stub templates with more than three categories[edit]

There's a discussion about possibly altering Module:Asbox to add pages to a tracking category if any stub templates on them add more than three categories. If you're interested, please comment at Template talk:Asbox#Unlimited categories. — Mr. Stradivarius ♪ talk ♪ 23:16, 3 February 2015 (UTC)

Stub sorting tool?[edit]

I read the "Tools" section and there is nothing that makes sorting stubs easier. --Mr. Guye (talk) 00:07, 7 February 2015 (UTC)

How long has this been broken?[edit]

Resolved: Was caused by a bug in the LUA page; bug was fixed and job queue has finished fixing the stubs. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 10:38, 4 March 2015 (UTC)

Anybody else notice that no articles have shown up in Category:Stubs in at least two weeks? I did some poking around and I can't figure out why it's broken but even after I fixed a hundred or so, there are at least 1,000 unsorted stubs lurking out there waiting to be sorted. Help? - Dravecky (talk) 10:23, 16 February 2015 (UTC)

@Codehydro: Could this be an Module:Asbox issue, or is it unrelated? — Mr. Stradivarius ♪ talk ♪ 11:54, 16 February 2015 (UTC)
I'd vaguely assumed that there was a hyperactive stub-sorter working in a different time zone from me, sorting them all immediately they appeared in the category. Does seem a bit unlikely now you mention it. PamD 15:56, 16 February 2015 (UTC)
They are being added to Category:All stub articles (which has 1,888,431 members), but not to Category:Stubs. PamD 16:02, 16 February 2015 (UTC)
I would investigate this - weird bugs in templates are something of a specialism of mine. Unfortunately, {{asbox}} was recently converted to Lua (see Module talk:Asbox), and its code is now impenetrable. I do not see anything above where the proposal to Lua-ise the template was mentioned, let alone discussed. We could revert the template to its pre-Lua version. --Redrose64 (talk) 20:17, 16 February 2015 (UTC)
(Sigh) "In Lua" is not the same as "impenetrable". You should really learn to code in it some time - I think you'd enjoy it. — Mr. Stradivarius ♪ talk ♪ 02:18, 17 February 2015 (UTC)
I went to Module:Asbox, and knowing that the category with the problem was Category:Stubs, and that it must be treated differently from other categories, I did a search for the word "stubs". I found it twice - once is in a comment, the other is in this construct:
			table.insert(stubCats.v, v == '' and not p.demo and pageDoc.exists and

'Stub message templates with documentation subpages' or not cat:match' stubs$' and {k = 'S', t = page.text} )

I know about regular expressions, specifically that $ - it's looking for the word "stubs" followed by a newline. The code here does not seem to be concerned with the decision whether or not to categorise an article; and the amendment made by Codehydro did not touch those four lines, and the word "stubs" is not found there either. --Redrose64 (talk) 14:35, 17 February 2015 (UTC)

Lua doesn't have standard regular expressions, which is probably what threw you off. To be able to fit inside tiny devices (think chips on toasters, etc.), the Lua developers decided not to implement the relatively heavy regular expression syntax, but instead created their own system of Lua "patterns", which are similar to regular expressions but also differ in a few important ways. In this case, the most important distinction is that Lua strings are always multiline, so "$" means the end of the string, not the end of a line. Codehydro also makes heavy use of Lua and/or logic here - for that, see Programming in Lua, which has a better explanation than I could hope to write. — Mr. Stradivarius ♪ talk ♪ 16:12, 17 February 2015 (UTC)
@Redrose64: I would also point out that I too thought the problem involved stubs and did the same search for the word 'stubs'. Nonetheless, our thinking that category:stubs recieved special treatment was flawed and ended up sending me on a wild goose chase, since the bug was triggered by |tempsort=no rather than the category's name. Blame the person who decided {{stub}} shouldn't be categorized... or me for my botched consolidation of Asbox/templatepage, not Lua :P (Of the hundred of templates I've tested, I don't remember seeing a single stub template other than {{stub}} that sets tempsort=no) —CodeHydro 19:28, 18 February 2015 (UTC)
  • This has now been patched. The bug came from the consolidation of Template:Asbox/templatepage (Asbox's helper template) into Module:Asbox. Basically, the helper included instructions, when |tempsort=no, not to place the category tag specified by |category= (but not category1 or category2). When the templates were separate, that instruction was ignored on articles simply because the helper was not transcluded on articles. However, the unintended consequence of consolidation is the presence of helper code without transclusion. In other words, while great care was taken to include instructions from both the main template and the helper in the consolidated module, the module was missing an instruction that was not present in either template because the instruction wasn't necessary when the templates were separate. (Yeah, I just spent hours trying to find something that was not present in the original templates -.-;) —CodeHydro 21:16, 16 February 2015 (UTC)
@Codehydro: Thanks for fixing it. Will the 1000+ articles which were tagged with {{stub}} while the template was broken be recategorised correctly into Category:Stubs automatically now? I see a few very recently tagged stubs have found their way into the category, but what about the previous lot? PamD 22:56, 16 February 2015 (UTC)
They'll work their way back into the category gradually as the job queue catches up. — Mr. Stradivarius ♪ talk ♪ 02:22, 17 February 2015 (UTC)
Thanks. PamD 17:12, 17 February 2015 (UTC)
Right now there are 289 articles in the category; this is after I stub-sorted 2 out of it. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 13:45, 18 February 2015 (UTC)
There are still just 410 stubs showing in the category but just shy of 1,300 using the {{stub}} template. - Dravecky (talk) 05:19, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────As long as the number of stubs in the category keeps going up, without the number of uses of the tag doing the same, I wouldn't worry about it. It went up from 289 to 410, while the uses of the stub tag stayed fairly stable. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 19:15, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

Bot proposal[edit]

I've proposed a bot to notify users who use vague stub templates that they should use more specific ones.  Liam987(talk) 01:31, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

What is stub sorting?[edit]

There's been a bit of discussion on an editor's talk page about whether adding {{stub}} to an article is "stub-sorting". I don't think it is, and an edit summary of "stub-sorting" can be confusing when looking at an article's history - I've suggested that they use "stub tagging" instead. But I see that there is no definition in WP:GLOSSARY for "stub sorting".

I propose adding a definition to that Glossary:

Stub sorting: Replacing the general {{stub}} template or any other stub template by a more specific template: eg changing from {{stub}} to {{tea-stub}}, or from {{bio-stub}} or {{Amfoot-bio-stub}} to {{Widereceiver-1950s-stub}}

Any thoughts? PamD 09:56, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Note: When 'PamD' asks about whether adding a stub tag to an article is considered "stub-sorting", consider the question as being general to *any* stub tag, not just to {{stub}} specifically. Personally, I've been tagging all my activity for this project as stub-sorting -- whether I'm refining the existing tags on an article, adding new tags to stub articles, or removing tags from articles that are no longer stubs. The question is whether these three activities should be labeled differently in the summary. Or does it all fall under the stub sorting umbrella? Dawynn (talk) 11:52, 23 March 2015 (UTC)
I never use "stub sorting" as it's vague. Instead, for the three cases given above, I would use more specific stub; add stub (which is admittedly also vague); and not a stub. --Redrose64 (talk) 12:21, 23 March 2015 (UTC)
If I'm adding the article's first stub tag, I use "stub tag added". I use "moved to more specific stub template" whether I'm moving from plain {{stub}} or from something generic like {{radio-stub}} to the more specific such as {{US-radio-show-stub}}. - Dravecky (talk) 14:15, 23 March 2015 (UTC)
I too have never used "stub sorting", for me it's simply "Added stub tag", "Updated stub tag" or "Removed stub tag". Fortdj33 (talk) 15:50, 23 March 2015 (UTC)
Stub sorting, in my opinion, would be adding any stub tag to an already tagged stub, which isn't redundant to any of the tags already present; along with removing any tags which are redundant to it. For example, adding a {{bridge-struct-stub}} to a stub which doesn't already have a bridge-related stub tag; or replacing a {{bridge-struct-stub}} and a {{NewYork-struct-stub}} with a {{NewYork-bridge-struct-stub}}. עוד מישהו Od Mishehu 19:06, 23 March 2015 (UTC)
The term is self-defining - and is widely accepted, so simply not using the term isn't going to make it go away. Simply adding a stub template to an untagged article isn't sorting a stub, it's tagging it. Stub sorting means sorting stubs (i.e., putting them in more specific stub categories, or changing existing templates to more specific ones, as in OM's example); adding a tag to an untagged article is stub tagging - simply adding {{stub}} does not sort a stub. Two different operations (but both covered by WP:WSS) Grutness...wha? 01:04, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

Metropolis of Lyon stubs[edit]

I've proposed Category:Metropolis of Lyon geography stubs for deletion as a way of generating discussion over at CFD although personally I'm 50:50 either way. The category was created out of process by User:Arteronyl to reflect the creation of the Metropolis of Lyon when it was carved out of Rhône département earlier this year. The general rule is that French départements have their own stub types, but MoL has a special status as a territorial collectivity. This means that it's effectively treated as a separate département but for instance it has retained its old département number which it now shares with Rhône (69). It's a real grey area - I can see arguments both ways. At present there's only one article in there. Best discussed over at CFD. Le Deluge (talk) 18:21, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

Bot to remove stub tags from redirects[edit]

A bot request, Wikipedia:Bots/Requests for approval/BattyBot 43, has been open related to removing stub tags from all redirects. Community input is welcome at the request. — xaosflux Talk 19:47, 28 March 2015 (UTC)

Category:Overpopulated stub categories[edit]

Category:Overpopulated stub categories, which is within the scope of this WikiProject, has been nominated for deletion. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the Categories for discussion page. Thank you. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 23:34, 29 March 2015 (UTC) ~

Nomination for deletion of Template:Eginyn[edit]

Ambox warning blue.svgTemplate:Eginyn has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. "Eginyn" means 'stub' in Welsh. -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 13:00, 2 April 2015 (UTC)

Yes, see cy:Nodyn:Eginyn. --Redrose64 (talk) 14:30, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
The template nominated for deletion resides on English Wikipedia, en:Template:Eginyn -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 14:43, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
I know it does. I was pointing out where the name came from. --Redrose64 (talk) 16:25, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
I was clarifying in case anyone was confused by the reply -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 16:30, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
This deletion discussion now occurs at Wikipedia:Redirects_for_discussion/Log/2015_April_1#Template:Eginyn; the template was rolled back to its previous state as a redirect to the Welsh Wikipedia, and the RFD reimplemented. -- 65.94.43.89 (talk) 05:38, 3 April 2015 (UTC)

Redundant stub tags[edit]

Please see this discussion regarding film stub tags. Thanks! Fortdj33 (talk) 18:55, 19 May 2015 (UTC)

Category:Hip hop song stubs[edit]

Is there a reason why this category isn't divided into subcategories by year, the way most (if not all) other song-related stub categories appear to be? The only subcats I see are Category:2000s hip hop single stubs and Category:2010s hip hop single stubs; what about songs released earlier than 2000? Erpert blah, blah, blah... 04:05, 22 May 2015 (UTC)

@Erpert: As far as I know, we don't divide stub categories by year. We do subdivide by decade, and this is determined not so much by a large quantity in the main category, but when a large quantity can be identified for a given decade. What you could do is file a request at WP:WSS/P for upmerged templates for particular decades, and if approved, add these to suitable articles, replacing the existing {{Hiphop-song-stub}}. Then if you find that one of these templates has been used in 60+ articles, you can then file a request at WP:WSS/P for the decade category. --Redrose64 (talk) 10:54, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
Oops, "decade" is what I meant to say. Erpert blah, blah, blah... 03:40, 23 May 2015 (UTC)

Software Bugs Stubs[edit]

Would you agree that creating a sub-category of or something would be helpful for stubs of, which is quite a lot? It would probably contain ~50, considering I've seen quite a few non-categorized stubs that should be in that category? KieranTribe (talk) 13:42, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Advice on creating subcategories[edit]

I run into this problem a lot and when I try to find the answer, I usually end up back here on WikiProject Stub sorting.

If there are already templates created that appear to be subcategories, what is the process to add those to the tree structure of a category page?

Example: On the category page Brazilian_building_and_structure_stubs, there are only two subcategories (in the Subcategory section), but just below that (under Pages in category "Brazilian building and structure stubs") are five templates which seem to me to be subcategories. Are they not? If they are, why are they not listed in the tree structure? And, more to the point, if there are articles which are already using {{Brazil-church-stub}} etc., will they automatically be moved up into the Subcategory section once …whatever needs to happen next… happens?

As I said, I run into this a lot and am more than happy to start cleaning this up when I see it. Please tell me that these templates do not still need to be vetted by the WikiProject stub process; they are already being used, so I assume they don’t need “approval”. I am not as keen to use my time filling out bureaucratic submission forms for others' approval as I am to just change a bit of code for category pages that have just gotten a bit messy but that have the new subcategories just sitting there, waiting to be used properly. This seems like it should be a very easy fix… I hope it is! —giso6150 (talk) 16:25, 12 June 2015 (UTC)

@Giso6150: These are what we call "upmerged" stub templates. In almost all cases it means that there are insufficient articles to justify a subcategory. To take your example {{Brazil-church-stub}}, pages bearing this template appear in Category:South American church stubs (which has 139 members) and also in Category:Brazilian building and structure stubs (which has 184 members). The template itself is used on 44 pages which is below the 60 we require for a dedicated category. If the stub template gets used on more than 60 articles, you can go to WP:WSS/P and submit a request to create the category as a S1 "Speedy creation". --Redrose64 (talk) 18:01, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
Thank you for taking the time to explain this, @Redrose64: I totally recognize the importance of this work and appreciate all the time and effort. —giso6150 (talk) 00:15, 13 June 2015 (UTC)

Category:Machine learning stubs[edit]

It doesn't appear to me that Category:Machine learning stubs was created through the proper stub creation process. Is that the case and if so what should be done? Shawn in Montreal (talk) 01:48, 20 June 2015 (UTC)

It's not even populated by a stub template - the sole member (Feature engineering) has the category included manually. Send it to WP:CFD. --Redrose64 (talk) 08:15, 20 June 2015 (UTC)
That's what I thought. But if we send it to Cfd, we're basically asking to delete rather than fix it, right? Shawn in Montreal (talk) 12:55, 20 June 2015 (UTC)
Yes, but what is there to fix? It's not as if it's a content cat that has been misnamed: Category:Machine learning also exists. --Redrose64 (talk) 13:18, 20 June 2015 (UTC)
Well, I've raised it at Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2015_June_20#Category:Machine_learning_stubs. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 16:30, 20 June 2015 (UTC)

Births by century[edit]

Three things:

  1. I have created Category:People stubs by century of birth with sub-cats for C17–C20. If this project rejects these, I will co-operate and speedily delete them under WP:G7.
  2.  For info, I have tagged several of the pre-existing cats for speedy renaming, mostly to insert hyphens e.g. "Fooian Bar 17th-century birth stubs". See WP:CFDS.
  3. The decade sub-sub-categories within Category:English cricket biography stubs should be "birth stubs" not "births stubs". Please would someone else tag and list them for speedy renaming? – Fayenatic London 13:26, 20 June 2015 (UTC)

Copyright Violation Detection - EranBot Project[edit]

A new copy-paste detection bot is now in general use on English Wikipedia. Come check it out at the EranBot reporting page. This bot utilizes the Turnitin software (ithenticate), unlike User:CorenSearchBot that relies on a web search API from Yahoo. It checks individual edits rather than just new articles. Please take 15 seconds to visit the EranBot reporting page and check a few of the flagged concerns. Comments welcome regarding potential improvements. These likely copyright violations can be searched by WikiProject categories. Use "control-f" to jump to your area of interest.--Lucas559 (talk) 22:47, 25 June 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Stub Contest[edit]

...will be run again in August. Signups are at Wikipedia:Stub Contest/Entries. Cheers, Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 22:04, 30 June 2015 (UTC)