Wikipedia:Australian Wikipedians' notice board

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3 June:

Australian aircraft carrier HMAS Melbourne (foreground) and the aircraft carrier USS Midway
To-Do edit | watch
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Here are some tasks you can do to help with WikiProject Australia:

Requests · Aboriginal Legal Service · ABSTUDY · Ariadne Australia · Awakenings disability arts festival · Drought Force · Electoral reform in Australia · Festival of the Dreaming · Fossils of Australia · Landforms of Australia · National Tidal Centre · OneAustralia · Property Council of Australia

Articles needing attention · Australian immigration detention facilities · Crime in Australia · Cycling Australia · Environment of Australia · Privacy in Australian law · Smooth Island (Tasmania) · Tourism in Australia

Images requested · Benjamin Benjamin · Cheryl Kernot · MV Pacific Adventurer · Poppy King · Rosemary Goldie · James Moore

Verification needed · Architecture of Australia · Australian performance poetry · Four'N Twenty meat pie · Hindmarsh Island Royal Commission · List of Australian political controversies · Outback · Paul Wild Observatory · Punk rock in Australia · Reg Ansett

Quality watch:

AfC submission[edit]

Draft:James Frederick Porter. Care to comment? Thanks, FoCuSandLeArN (talk) 23:53, 13 May 2015 (UTC)

  • really 6 sources, 5 different authors published between 1963 and 2010.. subject meets WP:N, WP:V and WP:RS so unless you think the creator has a WP:COI be WP:BOLD Gnangarra 01:17, 14 May 2015 (UTC)
  • The first is a bit of a point of view that may or not be more suitably merged to the river(s) articles, second accepted, but needs cleanup, and the third knocked back to look for suitable references. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 09:14, 16 May 2015 (UTC)

Notable actor?[edit]

Draft:Edward Howell (actor). FoCuSandLeArN (talk) 15:32, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

The Australian Dictionary of Biography is basically the source for Australian biography: it's a peer-reviewed acknowledgement of notability and anyone who has an entry is way over the bar of WP:GNG. However, it does need to actually link to his article. The Drover's Wife (talk) 15:35, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
I have declined this, due to lack of references. But anyone is free to add references and take it to mainspace. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 08:34, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
@Graeme Bartlett: - but it was referenced to the ADB. It wasn't well-cited according to Wikipedia standards, but it had an incredibly solid reference and a very strong claim to notability. I don't think that was helpful. The Drover's Wife (talk) 09:44, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
As I said, anyone is free to improve this or reverse my rejection and accept it. I did not reject this based on non-notability, just lacking enough references. At AFC this is much better than most contributions, but referencing is too poor to pass. BTW the URL is this: Two of the four references there may be suitable if anyone has access. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 12:27, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
I've added another reference, some categories and an infobox, Graeme, and I think it's ready for mainspace now (though it does need a copy edit), but I'm not sure how to publish it. Would you mind doing the honours, if you think it's ready? --Anthonyhcole (talk · contribs · email) 12:58, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for the improvements, I have published it. If you have not enabled the gadget and joined up with WP:AFC there is always the "move" button and edit to clean it up. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 21:42, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
Thanks Graeme. --Anthonyhcole (talk · contribs · email) 23:20, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
Poor reference formatting is not a valid reason for declining a draft. Hack (talk) 05:44, 25 May 2015 (UTC)

Request verification for paywalled news article[edit]

Does anyone have access to the paywalled section of The (Adelaide) Advertiser's news website, specifically this article? I want to verify this edit made to Hobart-class destroyer, because I think it is incorrect, or at least misinterpreted: a 3-year blowout on a defence project already 2+ years behind schedule should have more of the media screaming, and four years to fit out a ship launching this month is insanely excessive. If anyone could doublecheck the article, or even better, send me a copy of the text, I would greatly appreciate it. -- saberwyn 00:16, 22 May 2015 (UTC)

@Saberwyn: In my news database the article is titled "Getting up close with our first mega warship", but yes, it says "The Hobart is scheduled to be handed to the navy in March 2019, while delivery for the other two ships, Brisbane and Sydney, is yet to be finalised."[1] The Australian says "it will not be delivered until June 2017 at the earliest"[2] --99of9 (talk) 01:01, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
  1. ^ STARICK, P. (2015, May 21). Getting up close with our first mega warship. The Advertiser Retrieved from [2]
  2. ^ Sheridan, G. (2015, May 22). Warships cost blows out to $9bn. The Australian Retrieved from [3]
you can often bypass the individual masthead's paywalls by replacing the specific paper's url with "", ie Bizarre, isn't it. The-Pope (talk) 03:09, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
Or just google the story name. Tony (talk) 03:32, 22 May 2015 (UTC)
Thanks for the assistance, everyone. -- saberwyn 07:07, 22 May 2015 (UTC)

Advance Australia not-so-Fair[edit]

I note that Advance Australia Fair is rated as Start-Class, Mid-importance. Really? When I look at the article it seems better than that. If it is not C-Class in its current form, surely it would only take a bit of a push to get it over the line. I know that many of the members of this project are patriotic to our country. I haven't assessed the article myself because I'm not a member, and it's important to form a community view of an important Australian symbol. If you would like me to assess the article I can, but I haven't got time to improve it. Your thoughts, please. CaesarsPalaceDude (talk) 00:40, 23 May 2015 (UTC)

You are advocating a form of promotion which has no place in Wikipedia. My personal POV is that this colonially concocted doggerel--periodically cleansed and changed to suit current political correctness--is not a genuine national anthem and will inevitably be thrown out when Australia can find a simpler chauvinistic ditty for purposes of sporting triumph, etc. Bjenks (talk) 02:05, 29 May 2015 (UTC)
Trying to improve the quality of the article (and its assessment rating) is not the same as promoting the subject of the article. Of course editors must not let their patriotism affect the neutrality of their edits, but equally one's personal dislike of the subject ought not colour one's assessment of the article. Mitch Ames (talk) 02:51, 29 May 2015 (UTC)
@Bjenks: Have you ever read the letter that P D McCormick wrote to Robert Fuller in 1913 explaining why he wrote Advance Australia Fair? It's now in the manuscripts section of the National Library in Canberra and well worth a read. It will provide you with a better understanding of why the song is more patriotic than, say, The Star-Spangled Banner or God Save The Queen. Please note that "periodically cleansed" is incorrect. The words to Advance Australia Fair remain almost the same today as they did in 1879 with only minor changes; there has been no "cleansing". Remember, the national anthem is only an adaptation of AAF, not the song itself, and the only politically correct change for the anthem was to replace "sons" with "all". I'd like to see the article improved. There's a lot more to the story. --AussieLegend () 06:17, 29 May 2015 (UTC)
OK, I have nothing against the unexpurgated original song per se, being an ardent admirer of gallant Cook and the Union Jack. Its manipulation into a "national anthem" is another matter. For instance "For those who've come across the seas / We've boundless plains to share" is a patent embarrassment these days, whoever wrote it. As national anthems go, I love the real ones, like the Marsellaise and Hen Wlad Fy Nhadau, but have to smile also at some of the words of God save the Queen and The Star Spangled Banner. Because of such prejudices, I have to disqualify myself from editing Advance Australia Fair. Bjenks (talk) 14:25, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

Australian Flag FARC![edit]

The Flag of Australia has been a Featured Article since 26 January 2006 (Coincidence? I think not...) but is now FARC'd. Basically, it needs some work:

  1. The references need to be tidied up; web links need access dates and books need more details;
  2. Unreferenced sentences and paragraphs need references (or to be removed entirely);
  3. Some dated "as of 2005" type statements need to be re-checked or removed.
  4. Finally, once that is done, we need a copy editor to go over the article and remove some choppy prose, consolidate some one sentence paragraphs

I can post a more detailed work list. The article was brought up to scratch by a working bee a decade ago, and just needs some work. All the original contributors are dead, missing, uncontactable, or indef'd by ArbCom. Can we find some volunteers willing to stand up and help fix it up? Hawkeye7 (talk) 09:27, 23 May 2015 (UTC)

Aboriginal communities in Western Australia[edit]

Input from Australian editors is requested at Talk:Aboriginal communities in Western Australia#Lead section. Mitch Ames (talk) 13:23, 25 May 2015 (UTC)

Mass moving of place articles[edit]

Not sure if there was recent discussion about place names, but TT1245 is currently busy moving numerous Australian articles e.g. Cronulla, New South Wales --> Cronulla Dl2000 (talk) 03:32, 27 May 2015 (UTC)

Courtesy ping: @TT1245:. --99of9 (talk) 06:27, 27 May 2015 (UTC)
The moves are in line with Wikipedia:Naming conventions (geographic names)#Australia and cleans up a legacy issue. TT1245 should be thanked. -- Mattinbgn (talk) 03:25, 29 May 2015 (UTC)
The key word is may, not should. Particularly as TT1245 shows no interest in actually addressing the approximately ten million redirects he's creating, I'd rather he stop until he at least fixes the mess he's leaving behind him. The Drover's Wife (talk) 05:53, 29 May 2015 (UTC)
It is a matter of debate as to whether (a) the legacy issue needs change now (b) whether the average current editor of 2015 knows of the arguments and debates up to 7 and 8 years ago. I think it is quite onerous on the part of supporters of removing state names to (a) show the evidence and links to the older 7 and 8 year old debates and 'legacies', and alert current editors as to why stand alone unqualified place names actually help anyone, specially the reader who is both not australian, and also geographically challenged. User:JarrahTree 15:46, 29 May 2015 (UTC)
I think at the bare minimum he either needs to start addressing the thousands of redirect issues he's creating, or stop, or be blocked. This is questionably helpful at best, but if he won't clean up after himself it becomes clearly detrimental in my book. The Drover's Wife (talk) 01:52, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
I'm a convert on the issue of the disambiguation, but the editor does need to make sure they clean up afterwards; they are apparently very new, so perhaps someone who knows more about it than I do could explain exactly what needs to happen on the editor's talk page. Frickeg (talk) 03:00, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
Can someone explain to me (in small words) what the problem with the redirects is? I was under the impression that a bot came around and re-aimed any double redirects created by pagemoves (which appears to be the case for the few I've spotchecked). Or is there a completely different issue here? -- saberwyn 03:14, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
@Frickeg: He's already been pinged here and, when he made 72 more page moves without responding I left a message on his talk page.[1] He hasn't been back since. Maybe I scared him off. --AussieLegend () 12:54, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
  • I've never been thrilled about [suburb, state] format. So Cronulla is somewhere south of Cooma? Or perhaps in the Hunter region? For anyone but locals, "Cronulla, Sydney" would be so much more informative. Indeed, on odd occasions I've repiped such items in the main text to clarify. Tony (talk) 13:16, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
    • For what it's worth, I am adamantly opposed to this. The situation before we implemented this guideline was a ginormous clusterfuck, with articles using about fifteen possible means of disambiguation and it being impossible to reliably link a suburb or town article if you were seeking to do so without a thorough Google for places an article might be. I can live with people moving them to the exact suburb name if it doesn't need disambiguating, on the grounds they clean up their mess afterwards, but any disambiguation needs to stay at "Town, State" for very good reason. The Drover's Wife (talk) 13:24, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
      • I am adamantly opposed to using the old colonial state-names in titles and main text by formula. So it's Mosman, Melbourne, and Mosman, Sydney. What could be clearer? Tony (talk) 14:54, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
        • That's contrary to WP:NCPLACE#Australia which says Localities (other than suburbs) and places such as train stations, parks, etc., may be disambiguated, where necessary, by reference to city rather than state. --AussieLegend () 15:14, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
(after edit conflicts) There has been a long-standing convention that Australian town/locality placenames are qualified by the state name, to ease the fact that many town names are used by other things too - either another town or person that this town was named for, or an item or activity that is named after the town - railway station, football team, airport, brandname, event, mineral. It is much easier to manage inbound links and disambiguations if the "right" links are to the qualified name. This convention was weakened to "generally qualified", and a few people have made efforts at various times to pick places that have no other articles with the same name and moved them. for example, I was surprised to discover that "Minchinbury" is a place - that's not what I think of as the primary meaning for that brandname as I'm not from Western Sydney, and geologists probably have a different interpretation again. We should be aiming for "the principle of least surprise" for both readers and editors --Scott Davis Talk 13:39, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
Indeed. Another example that this user just moved en masse was Villawood, New South Wales - when Villawood Immigration Detention Centre is, if not the primary topic itself, at least as notable. These are the sorts of things that at least warrant individual move discussions. The Drover's Wife (talk) 14:08, 30 May 2015 (UTC)
  • mass moves are a pain as they not only break/create redirects for internal links they also break external linking for the people that reuse the content whether its another site or QRpedia project that last thing anyone should encounter is page being redirected after following a link. Additionally they destroy all metrics to for such connections resulting in false data which is then permanently understated as redirect links cant distinguish between what started as an outside link and what started as an internal link Gnangarra 14:14, 30 May 2015 (UTC)

South Coast railway line rename discussion[edit]

Hello there fellow Australian editors! There's been an issue recently over the naming of the South Coast / Illawarra railway line in New South Wales. I'm looking for appropriate people to give their opinion in a discussion of the issue. You can find the discussion here. PhilipTerryGraham ⡭ ₪ ·o' ⍦ ࿂ 00:19, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

South Coast railway line, New South Wales listed at Requested moves[edit]


A requested move discussion has been initiated for South Coast railway line, New South Wales to be moved to Illawarra railway line. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 22:47, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

Yellowdine, Western Australia listed at Requested moves[edit]


A requested move discussion has been initiated for Yellowdine, Western Australia to be moved to Yellowdine. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 22:48, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

Schtick (disc game) listed at Requested moves[edit]


A requested move discussion has been initiated for Schtick (disc game) to be moved to Schtick. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 23:16, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

RAM Magazine listed at Requested moves[edit]


A requested move discussion has been initiated for RAM Magazine to be moved to Rock Australia Magazine. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 23:18, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

Godfrey Hirst Pty Ltd listed at Requested moves[edit]


A requested move discussion has been initiated for Godfrey Hirst Pty Ltd to be moved to Godfrey Hirst Carpets. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 23:18, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

Donald Bradman listed at Requested moves[edit]


A requested move discussion has been initiated for Donald Bradman to be moved to Don Bradman. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 08:44, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

Oxley, Queensland needs help[edit]

Oxley, Queensland continues to be problematic, 10 months after an anonymous editor started making various, incorrect edits to the article. Despite the best attempts by others the IP-hopping editor, who is now tag-teaming with his registered account, continues to make some bad edits. I've requested semi-protection, but extra eyes on the article are needed. --AussieLegend () 11:58, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

I've watchlisted it. Tony (talk) 12:08, 29 May 2015 (UTC)

Talk:Frill-necked lizard[edit]

There is an RfC at Frill-necked lizard - do we call it "Frilled lizard", "Frill-necked lizard"...or something else. Come and add your opinion at Talk:Frill-necked_lizard#RFC:_article_title. cheers, Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:49, 31 May 2015 (UTC)

Wiki Loves Pride![edit]

You are invited to participate in Wiki Loves Pride!

  • What? Wiki Loves Pride, a campaign to document and photograph LGBT culture and history, including pride events
  • When? June 2015
  • How can you help?
    1.) Create or improve LGBT-related articles and showcase the results of your work here
    2.) Upload photographs or other media related to LGBT culture and history, including pride events, and add images to relevant Wikipedia articles; feel free to create a subpage with a gallery of your images (see examples from last year)
    3.) Contribute to an LGBT-related task force at another Wikimedia project (Wikidata, Wikimedia Commons, Wikivoyage, etc.)

Or, view or update the current list of Tasks. This campaign is supported by the Wikimedia LGBT+ User Group, an officially recognized affiliate of the Wikimedia Foundation. Visit the group's page at Meta-Wiki for more information, or follow Wikimedia LGBT+ on Facebook. Remember, Wiki Loves Pride is about creating and improving LGBT-related content at Wikimedia projects, and content should have a neutral point of view. One does not need to identify as LGBT or any other gender or sexual minority to participate. This campaign is about adding accurate, reliable information to Wikipedia, plain and simple, and all are welcome!

If you have any questions, please leave a message on the campaign's main talk page.

Thanks, and happy editing!

User:Another Believer and User:OR drohowa 02:45, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

Death of Tyler Cassidy in the news[edit]

The article Death of Tyler Cassidy is getting some scrutiny in the media, in particular Channel tens The Project is running a story on it tonight(2-Jun) somewhere between 18:30 and 19:30 can you please keep an eye out for it the usual characters on that and associated articles. Gnangarra 07:30, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

RFCs - Aboriginal communities in Western Australia[edit]

Editors are requested to comment at:

Mitch Ames (talk) 13:07, 2 June 2015 (UTC)