Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Countering systemic bias

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WikiProject Countering systemic bias
WikiProject icon This page is supported by the Countering systemic bias WikiProject, which provides a central location to counter systemic bias on Wikipedia. Please participate by editing the article, and help us improve articles to good and 1.0 standards, or visit the wikiproject page for more details.

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Please read the associated WikiProject Page before posting here. If you notify the project, please be prepared to show how any potential bias could be resulting in a lack of balanced coverage, or some other omission, as described on the WikiProject Page.

Systemic bias in sports[edit]

Per WP:FOOTY only players for fully professional leagues are considered "automatically notable".

This appears to be biased in favour of Developed World and large countries.

All the best: Rich Farmbrough, 12:50, 22 August 2015 (UTC).

In passing, I'd draw attention to the practice in biographies of baseball players to identify players who were born outside the US, or whose ancestors were born outside the US and who are not white, in the lede.
George Herman "Babe" Ruth, Jr. was an American baseball player
Orlando Manuel "Peruchin" Cepeda Pennes is a Puerto Rican former Major League Baseball
David Américo Ortiz Arias, nicknamed "Big Papi", is a Dominican-American professional baseball player.
Luis Ernesto Aparicio Montiel, nicknamed "Little Louie", is a former Venezuelan professional baseball player
We appear to be scrupulous in identifying the ethnic background of Latino players, but far less so about players born in Holland (Wilhelmus Abraham Remmerswaal (born March 8, 1954) is a former relief pitcher in Major League Baseball). MarkBernstein (talk) 13:26, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

Mass killings[edit]

Currently, there is a appeal filed to unsalt and undelete the article Mass killings in capitalist regimes. Youknowwhatimsayin (talk) 05:43, 2 September 2015 (UTC)

RfC on MEDRS and Should we Reject Sources Based on their Country of Publication?[edit]

RfC regarding an amendment to MEDRS, specifically asking if we should or shouldn't allow high-quality sources to be rejected simply because of the country in which the research is published. Any interested editors are welcome to comment. LesVegas (talk) 00:44, 6 September 2015 (UTC)

How to handle currency conversions and/or equivalents of school grading systems[edit]

In many Wikipedia articles it's common to give equivalents of currencies from non-English speaking countries. They may be converted into U.S. dollars, Canadian dollars, UK pounds, Euros, South African rand, etc, and often the conversions come from reliable sources cited by those Wikipedia articles.

The question: When should these currencies be "converted"? Should there be an attempt to include more kinds of currencies other than the USD and/or UKP, or should the currency conversions not be stated to avoid systemic bias claims? Should the currency conversions only be included if reliable sources do so?

Also some published sources try to convert certain educational stages into certain countries into American or British educational stages (for example: Year 1 of Japanese senior high school converted to 10th grade (US) or Year 11 (UK)). Would including these conversions be systemic bias too? WhisperToMe (talk) 07:57, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

My thinking is that "Systemic bias" is more an attitude and approach than a cookie-cutter formula. I don't think the things you are discussing here even fall under the systemic bias rubric any more than Imperial/Metric conversions do. (Unless an editor had a "those other people's ways are stupid" attitude - that's bias) There is a place for technical terminology and sometimes conversion is impossible. When it can be done simply and elegantly (as with metric/imperial measurement) that's good, but where it can't, we should at least try to use wikilinks to point the reader who is unfamiliar with a concept - like, say, the value of the Yen. Montanabw(talk) 23:35, 12 September 2015 (UTC)
For currency, I don't know if there are specific guidelines on this, but currency is a bugbear; as comparative values change constantly. Reliable sources are key for converting values, I suspect, lest we fall into WP:OR. I suspect it's a case-by-case situation and really depends on why the conversion is needed. I've seen historical comparisons done within the same currency, but to compare two different currencies at current - changing - value is probably not doable in an article; I'd suggest just linking to the relevant currency and calling it good; the currency articles sometimes provide real rough guidelines for conversion. I did a pounds to dollars conversion once, for historical purposes, as the conversion could be solidified in time; and to get that little bit to pass FAC took several hours of my life that I shall never get back.. sigh. (see what I did at note (c) here: William_Robinson_Brown#International_purchases). Montanabw(talk) 23:35, 12 September 2015 (UTC)
Cool! That's a good note to have in the article. If the reliable sourced discussing the currency conversion date from the time when the transaction took place (for example "John Smith is currently making 2,400 yen per hour ($???USD per)") these sources may help. See Qian_Zhijun#History: I found sources converting Qian Zhijun's salary to U.S., British, and South African currencies. WhisperToMe (talk) 14:20, 13 September 2015 (UTC)
As for educational stages, my thinking is to just like to the stages articles, which, one would hope, contain international comparisons; or just note the typical age of the students. Conversions could get out of hand, as you also have Au/NZ, India, South Africa, etc... There's a line between helping the reader understand a concept and being so dumbed-down that it's condescending. Montanabw(talk) 23:35, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

War of 1812[edit]

I am not a member of this Wikiproject and perhaps this is not the place for this but I think that the members should take a look at this article.

Despite the fact that many historians advocate annexation of Canada as a primary war aim for the US as well as irrefutable evidence suggesting this, this article makes only a last-thought, to-the-side mention of this, and then only as a debated "possibly". This is only one of the issues of this article, some of which I have brought up in the talkpage, and I think you should look into them.

I believe this is a result of systemic bias as many if not most Wikipedia editors are from the US. This particular article is under the "protection" of several POV-pushers who suppress the countless complaining editors with fallacious, contemptious or otherwise invalid responses.

Regards, Green547 (talk) 17:57, 26 September 2015 (UTC)

I would suggest that before you wade into that quagmire (or anyone here), read this and [1] and note the author of the latter has his own WP article. No comments or endorsements from me as to content, just suggest awareness. Montanabw(talk) 05:00, 27 September 2015 (UTC)
thanks for that--I appreciate it. :) Rjensen (talk) 06:06, 27 September 2015 (UTC)