Talk:Algeria

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Former good articleAlgeria was one of the Geography and places good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.
Article milestones
DateProcessResult
November 30, 2006Good article reassessmentDelisted
May 22, 2012Good article nomineeNot listed
On this day...Facts from this article were featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the "On this day..." column on July 5, 2004, July 5, 2005, July 5, 2006, November 1, 2006, July 5, 2007, November 1, 2007, July 5, 2008, November 1, 2008, July 5, 2009, November 1, 2009, July 5, 2010, November 1, 2010, July 5, 2011, July 5, 2012, November 1, 2013, July 5, 2014, November 1, 2014, July 5, 2015, and November 1, 2015.
Current status: Delisted good article


Juba II as King of Numidia[edit]

the Louvre.

Amyntas in 26, Cilicia was given to King Tarcondimotus. When Augustus added Juba II’s kingdom of Numidia to the province of Africa in 25, he gave Juba Mauretania (Morocco) to rule instead. In Armenia, on the Aspects of Roman History 82BC-AD14: A Source-based Approach By Mark Everson Davies, Hilary Swain [1]

Encyclopedia of African History 3-Volume Set - Page 251 Kevin Shillington - 2013 - ?Preview - ?More editions Mauritania then, too, became involved in the civil wars of Rome, and the kingdom was annexed to Rome by Caesar Octavian in 33BCE and then reformulated as a client-kingdom in 25BCE with Juba II of Numidia as king. Juba, son of an ... [2]

[3] education in Italy. Octavian, the future emperor Augustus, befriended Juba when he was a young man and in 29 ».c. made him ruler of his father's former kingdom of Numidia, which had become a Roman province after the death of Juba I in 46

[4]

Herods Contemporaries In Britain And The West J Creighton - Herod and Augustus, 2008 - booksandjournals.brillonline.com … BCE the king of Mauretania died and for a few years this part of Africa was ruled directly by Rome, however in 25 BCE Augustus installed Juba II there as king, where he … Iconographically the coinage marks a radical shift between Juba I in Numidia and Juba II in Mauretania …

[5] New Masters for Africa S Raven - Rome in Africa, 2012 - taylorfrancis.com … True, King Bocchus of Mauretania was rewarded for his support in the Thapsus campaign by being given the western part of Numidia; but after his death in 33 BC his kingdom was ruled directly by the Romans, and then handed over in 25 BC to Juba II, the romanized …

[6] The Roman Maghreb K Amine, M Carlson - The Theatres of Morocco, Algeria and Tunisia, 2012 - Springer … 10 The Pre-Colonial Maghreb citizen, highly cultivated in the arts and natural history. The Emperor Augustus restored Juba II as king of Numidia between 29 BCE and 27 BCE and married him off to Cleopatra Selene, daughter of Cleopatra and Mark Anthony … Related articles

[7]

… of the largest cities of Roman North Africa. It also had a long and distinguished history, starting as a Punic colony; becoming a royal Numidian capital, perhaps from … TW Potter - cambridge.org … long and distinguished history, starting as a Punic colony; becoming a royal Numidian capital, perhaps from the second century BC, and most notably under the client king, Juba II (25 BC … is a fine theatre, built in Juba's reign; an unusual amphitheatre, perhaps Augustan in origin …

Doug Weller talk 13:53, 31 August 2018 (UTC)

The official name of Algeria[edit]

The official name of Algeria is written in French, which makes the article biased and misleading, as French is not an official nor a national language. This is actually again Wikipedia’s polices, so I will delete it. Thanks in advance Ziad adam (talk) 13:52, 8 December 2018 (UTC)

Nobody said or even suggested that French is an official language. However, as a lingua franca, it is used everywhere and by everyone, including the politicians. M.Bitton (talk) 00:31, 12 December 2018 (UTC)
Hi M.Bitton and Ziad adam, lingua franca means, as per that article, a language or dialect systematically used to make communication possible between people who do not share a native language or dialect, particularly when it is a third language that is distinct from both of the speakers' native languages. Excuse me, but when an Algerian Berber meets an Algerian Arab they speak Algerian Arabic not French. Adding French in the lead is a non sense. --Helmoony (talk) 23:00, 17 December 2018 (UTC)
Arabic is the official and main language of Algeria, with Tamazight as second official language. Unlike other Maghreb countries (Tunisia, Morocco, Mauritania), Algeria isn't even part of the Francophonie. It is only part of the Arab League. When an Algerian Berber and an Algerian Arab speak together, they speak Algerian Arabic, not French. So the French name should be removed. The name title is already too long, so the layout is not looking good - if someone wants know the French name, he can click on the French wiki article, very easy to find on the left bar. --2.243.104.167 (talk) 22:04, 21 February 2019 (UTC)
Arabic is the official and main language of Algeria, with Tamazight as second official language. Arabic is not the main language of Algeria,[1] it's an official language, just like Tamazight, and that's what it says in the Infobox. Incidentally, the two official languages have one thing in common, nobody speaks either of them at home or in the street.
Unlike other Maghreb countries (Tunisia, Morocco, Mauritania), Algeria isn't even part of the Francophonie. It is only part of the Arab League. The country with the second largest number of francophones after France has been shunning the Francophonie for political and ideological reasons.[2]
When an Algerian Berber and an Algerian Arab speak together, they speak Algerian Arabic, not French. They speak their mother tongue, the Algerian language, which is a mixture of many languages.[1]
The name title is already too long, so the layout is not looking good - if someone wants know the French name, he can click on the French wiki article, very easy to find on the left bar. The same could be said about the Arabic. Since neither of the two languages is a native language per se (with regard to the parameter of the Infobox), why are you concentrating on the French only? M.Bitton (talk) 00:02, 28 February 2019 (UTC)
Because French has no official status in Algeria. Algeria is no longer a French colony for more than a half century. French has just a short history of 200 years, while Arabic and Tamazight have a history for more than one thousand years. Algeria is an independent country. On the article of England we also don't see the name in Latin in the title, just because it was at some time a Roman colony.

Regarding the official languages, both Arabic and Tamazight are official and national languages. However, Tamazigh is not used in the administration, because it is not a single language, but a language group composed of multiple languages. Nevertheless, in addition to Arabic, I prefer that the name of Tamazight should be added, because it is a real language of Algeria, but not the name of a foreign language like French.

And regarding the use of French in some companies and public authorities - this does NOT make French a native language nor an official or national language. German companies also use English and several government offices in Germany also often use English, but that does not mean that English is a native language of Germany. --78.49.57.196 (talk) 03:03, 28 February 2019 (UTC)
"They speak their mother tongue, the Algerian language, which is a mixture of many languages." The correct name is not Algerian language, but Algerian Arabic with the language code arq (ISO 639-3), which can be both viewed as a variety of Arabic and as a single language. The situation is similar to Switzerland, where Swiss German is the spoken language and Standard German the written language. This linguistic phenomenom is called diglossia. Algerian Arabic is not a mixture of many languages, but a Semitic- and Afro-Asiatic-based language with Semitic grammar and sentence structure, an Arabic-based numeral system, Arabic-based pronouns and Arabic-based conjuctions. You can see the language family tree in every professional linguistic book. English has many foreign loanwords (even more than Algerian Arabic), i.a. from Latin, Norman and many other languages, but is still clearly a Germanic language, the same goes with Algerian Arabic, which is clearly an Arabic/Semitic language. But nevertheless, what only cares is the official language status. Arabic is the official language of the state of Algeria. In Switzerland, where a similar diglossic situation persists, the name of the Swiss German variety is also not written in the title. --78.49.57.196 (talk) 03:28, 28 February 2019 (UTC)
French has no official status in Algeria. Algeria is no longer a French colony for more than a half century. Nobody is suggesting otherwise. We're just acknowledging the fact that it's an integral part of the native language, the Algerian language.[1]
I prefer that the name of Tamazight should be added, because it is a real language of Algeria. Tamazight is an artificial language that nobody speaks. The only reason we haven't added it yet is because its standardization and transcription into one of the Latin, Tifinagh or Arabic alphabets is still being debated.
but not the name of a foreign language like French. Apart from being irrelevant, what is foreign and what isn't depends on which side of the fence you sit on. To the Berbers, Arabic is a foreign language.
German companies also use English and several government offices in Germany also often use English, but that does not mean that English is a native language of Germany. Does Angela Merkel address the German people in English? Does the German education minister (Anja Karliczek) struggle to express herself in German (the official language)? M.Bitton (talk) 00:16, 2 March 2019 (UTC)
The correct name is not Algerian language, but Algerian Arabic. The correct name is Algerian language,[1] which is a mixture of many languages, including, but not limited to Algerian Arabic, French and Berber. It's the mother tongue of Algerians.[1]
There's no such thing as Algerian language to begin with. Citing one paper that uses the whimsical construct "Algerian language" is not an evidence. As has been noted, the French is not official language in Algeria, it is not even mentioned in the country's Constitution. Brandmeistertalk 22:33, 5 March 2019 (UTC)
Regardless of how it's called, which is irrelevant to begin with, the language that Algerians use to communicate with one another happens to be a mix of at least 3 languages, with French being one of them. As has been noted: a) Nobody is suggesting that French is an official language. b) Being official doesn't even mean that the language is used by Algerians (nobody uses classical Arabic at home or in the street) or that the language even exists (Tamazight is an artificial language that nobody speaks). M.Bitton (talk) 00:07, 7 March 2019 (UTC)
Algerian Arabic is classified by linguists as an Arabic-Semitic variety, it is neither a pidgin nor a creole. And nevertheless, a colloquial "language mix" has nothing to do with the official state language. The official state languages are Arabic (Modern Standard Arabic) and Tamazight (not standardized yet). The official name of Algeria is derived from Arabic (Al-Jaza'ir = The islands), and has nothing to do with French. There is no single viable argument to add the French name to the article header. --93.133.155.9 (talk) 04:34, 14 March 2019 (UTC)
We're talking about the Algerian language.[1] So rather than repeat what had been addressed so far, I suggest you read the previous comments. The debatable etymology of the name is irrelevant. M.Bitton (talk) 23:04, 14 March 2019 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ a b c d e f Essayahi, Moulay Lahssan Baya; Kerras, Nassima (1 Jan 2016). "(PDF) A Sociolinguistic Study of the Algerian Language". SSRN Electronic Journal. doi:10.2139/ssrn.2822984. ISSN 1556-5068. Retrieved 27 Feb 2019.
  2. ^ Margaret A. Majumdar (2007). Postcoloniality: The French Dimension. Berghahn Books. p. 171. ISBN 978-1-84545-252-0.

December 2018[edit]

With regard to this revert:

Why there’s the French name? It is not longer an official language[8] The content that you removed doesn't say or even suggests that it is.

removed French from native name entry of the infobox, since French is not a native language[9] That depends on the narrowness of the interpretation of the parameter "native" (in the context of the infobox). By your standard, we should also remove the classical Arabic since it's not a native language either. Do you honestly think that's a good idea? M.Bitton (talk) 00:03, 19 December 2018 (UTC)

I didn't put classical Arabic, but Arabic was there before my edit as a native language of the country/nation. Can you explain to me why French should be considered as a nation language?
Yes, Arabic was there before your edit, and so was the French. What you seem to miss is that neither of those two languages is a "native" language per se, therefore, there is no valid reason to concentrate on the French only. Your question should be directed at whomever made that suggestion. M.Bitton (talk) 23:53, 27 December 2018 (UTC)

GDP figures no longer match source[edit]

There's been a GDP vandal frequenting articles. I think the vandal and perhaps well meaning editors have been changing these figures. I don't know what they should be now to match the source. If someone can fix this, great. If not I'll remove them if I remember. Doug Weller talk 15:04, 2 January 2019 (UTC)

@Doug Weller: I have fixed the GDP urls (the figures were slightly off). I have also fixed the population figure and added a RS. M.Bitton (talk) 00:12, 6 January 2019 (UTC)
@M.Bitton: that's much appreciated. This sort of vandalism can be extremely time-consuming. Doug Weller talk 16:31, 6 January 2019 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion[edit]

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 04:19, 6 January 2019 (UTC)