Talk:Brian Jones Presents The Pipes of Pan at Joujouka

Note: See Talk:Brian Jones Presents The Pipes of Pan at Jajouka for recent discussion.

Note to anonymous US user

I have reverted your edit because you are pushng a point of view - if nothing else, justify your position. Though you assert (rightly) that F. Rynne clearly had nothing to do with Brian Jones or the album recorded by the latter (he would have been a child at the time, just like Bachir Attar), that is not the point. The point is that the musicians currently recording under the name "Master Musicians of Joujouka" are one of the two groups that came into being in the late 1970s (exact date unknown- maybe you can help) as a result of a split. The other group calls itself "Master Musicians of Jajouka". Both are legitimate heirs to the common heritage of the Master Musicians. Both are entitled to a listing on Wikipedia, on equal terms. Each group has its own page, which should reflect its specific history post-split. The Brian Jones album is the heritage of both groups, and therefore both deserve a link on that page. Jonur 17:00, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Re: recent article history

I have looked in for the first time today in a long time and saw the edits by the anonymous user mentioned by Jonur. I will be looking in at this page later today after reviewing my notes and articles, and will be trying to footnote and adjust both articles and the band articles for POV. I will review what has been going on at the time I finish my footnote work and comment then if needed. I started to say more but I'm not sure what all sorts of edits have been made by people in the past couple of weeks other than probably some contentious ones were probably made. Emerman 01:16, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Merge

The two albums are the same, different spellings being used for different releases. It doesn't matter which is merged with which, but a merge is needed. --Mel Etitis (Talk) 11:41, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

Moved here from my Talk page.]

This issue is quite contentious, with a long history of acrimony, mutual accusations of theft, violence, etc. in meatspace. The problem is that the "Master Musicians of J" broke into two factions around 1980 (not sure about the date). One faction continued with the original manager/promotor/guide, Mohamed Hamri, and the other went under the leadership of Bachir Attar. Suffice it to say that the Bachir Attar faction (distinguished by the use of the "Jajouka" spelling) seems to wish to deny the legitimacy (nay the existence) of the other faction (distinguished by the use of the "Joujouka" spelling). For example, the re-release of the Brian Jones album was the work of the Jajouka/Bachir Attar faction and removed all references to Hamri, including his original cover art. (I have heard comments that the tracks are slightly different too, but I'm not in a position to comment on that.) The issue of where the royalties from the re-issue are going is also in dispute.

It was decided to allow the two pages to split as the most pacific solution to the problem. You may disagree, of course. Jonur 09:33, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

I do disagree in fact. We should have one article that gives the facts and explains the disagreement; as things stand, we've been made part of the disagreement rather than reporting on it as an encyclopædia should. Moreover, anyone wanting to know about the album has to read two articles, with a great deal of overlap, in order to work out what's going on for herself; again, we should do that for the reader. --Mel Etitis (Talk) 10:21, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Mel. I am inclined to agree with you. I was not involved in the discussions over splitting the page, but objectively it is only one album, released on two different labels, with changes to sleeve notes and cover art reflecting disputes among the artists (or, rather, the artists' heirs, in many cases, who are themselves musicians). Jonur 10:00, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

Aside from a few items in the reading, and the external links, there was nothing in the shorter article that wasn't in the latter; I've merged and redirected. --Mel Etitis (Talk) 07:22, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

First World Music Album?

I am thinking that the statement about this being the "first world music album" is incorrect. Check out Bali: Music from the Morning of the World, recording by David Lewiston in 1966 and released in 1967. This predates Brian Jones' LP in both the recording date and release date. http://www.amazon.com/Bali-Music-Morning-Various-Artists/dp/B000083GHL

Given that "world music" is a virtually meaningless marketing term, hopelessly parochial and PoV, I'd like to see it disappear from the article altogether. --Mel Etitis (Talk) 07:20, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

led by pov?????

were they led by this guy abdelsam haj attar then, only see him refered to later articles. after the 74 split. i may be wrong but pov???? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 134.226.1.194 (talk) 01:45, 27 March 2007 (UTC).

double-redirect

{{editprotected}} This page is now a double-redirect. Please change the target to Brian Jones Presents the Pipes of Pan at Joujouka (or just remove the protection, since the dispute that gave rise to it was well over a year ago). --Russ (talk) 11:57, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Done. Cheers. --lifebaka (talk - contribs) 16:11, 24 July 2008 (UTC)