Talk:Dollar sign

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Other appearances of the symbol[edit]

A 1934 US $10 Note

No one seems to have mentioned anywhere the fact that the double-stroked $ appeared in a stylized fashion on the front of the old-style $10.00 bill. The numerals were arrayed atop of "S" scrollwork to make the double-stroked $.

Portuguese cifrão connection[edit]

There is an obvious connection between the dollar sign and the cifrão sign. There must be some kind of historical connection between the two that is disregarded in this article. Has anyone ever heard of this? It could be interesting to make some further research on this. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 23:54, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

abbreviation of pesos[edit]

The dollar sign is most likely an abbreviation of "PesoS", not "PeSo", as the article indicates. In Spanish, words are commonly abbreviated by using the first and the last letter(s). There is a definite study on the subject by Alvaro Moreno: El signo de pesos, cuál es su origen y qué representa?, published in Mexico City in 1965, which shows many sources for some forms of the dollar sign being used to denote the Mexican peso in the British colonies in North America. One or two strokes are used indiscriminantly. -Ralf

August 2011 edit[edit]

Back in August 2007, Asterion (since retired) introduced the reference to Arthur Nussbaum's A History of the Dollar to support the Pillars of Hercules theory, but offered no page citation. I have now looked at that book and found that Nussbaum actually believed the "Ps." theory, which as my past edits should show, is much, much better documented. On August 18, 2010, an editor using the IP address, reverted my previous edits alleging that the Pillars theory is the "most widely accepted" theory, but offered no new evidence. Most on-line sources that propose this theory as the more plausible one simply reflect the text offered here in the Wikipedia article since its beginning and are, therefore, not much more than echo of this article. I have left the latest text on this theory here under "alternative theories." Best, TriniMuñoz (talk) 06:38, 3 September 2011 (UTC)


This page was a redirect to Talk:Dollar, and there didn't seem to be a reason. So, I removed the redirect, and duplicated the text. I hope that was the right thing to do. Ingrid 03:20, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

Number of strokes[edit]

Whatsup with one and two strokes thru S? So the $ symbol in for non-US dollar and double stroked S is for US dollar? Can someone explain? -pedro

As far as the dollar sign goes, it is merely a stylistic choice or popular fashion that decides what symbol one may write. With computers, most but not all fonts will produce a single-stroked sign. I did find a few fonts that do give a double-stroked symbol for the same key (Shift+4). (talk) 04:51, 28 May 2008 (UTC)

There are better explanations based in medieval Iberian manuscripts about the origin of the dollar sign. I will look into this and get back here. But everything here is folk-etymology. Evertype 18:05, 2005 Mar 15 (UTC)

There are images about from a source that i think may be entitled 'Key of Solomon the King (Clavicula Salomonis)', that features a symbol very similar to the dollar sign($), this book is from the middle ages, this could be a link it, i either saw this symbol here or some other book, but i rememebr it being called different. Not mentioned in article but should be if confirmed.Book M 10:18, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Jpmo22 19:19, 27 August 2007 (UTC) Pedro, the Dollar Sign ($) and Cifrão (\mathrm{S}\!\!\!\Vert ) are differents simbols, US Dollar uses Dollar Sign and Brazilian currency use Cifrão. Please don't get confused about that, many people think they are the same but they are not.

But you're wrong, the dollar sign is sometimes written with two strokes, although less now than it used to be. The article itself alludes to this in several of the explanations for how the sign came about (talk) 22:12, 13 June 2008 (UTC)
Jpmo22 is wrong. If you are talking about US or Canadian dollars, the single-stroke dollar sign ($) and the double-stroke dollar-sign (\mathrm{S}\!\!\!\Vert ) mean the same thing and are used interchangeably. Just look at the page - you can see in the photo of the plaque about the first typeset dollar sign that the plaque uses the two-stroke version. I think the two-stroke version was much more common when I was a kid. But now the single-stroke version is on every computer keyboard, and it is easier to design a single-stroke version to use in a computer font. I suspect that that is the reason that the one-stroke version is common now. If you search with Google for images of "dollar sign", there are many with two strokes, especially among older images. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 08:01, 11 March 2009 (UTC)


From yen:

The yen was originally written as the same way as the Chinese Yuan (圓 pinyin yuan2). Modern Japanese writings use a character (円) which is different from the one used in simplified Chinese (元). The Latinized symbol for the Yen however, is identical to the one for the Yuan, although the PRC tends to use one crossbar instead of two.
Yen literally means a "round object" in Japanese, as the Yuan in Chinese.

In the article:

In China, base unit of the official currency Renminbi is called "Yuan" (元 or 圆 , with a symbol ¥). The "yuan" is, in fact, a colloquial form of the word "dollar". Spanish dollars were widely circulated in China in the late 19th century. When China adopted its the first national currency in 1914, the base unit was called "Yuan" , which means "dollar". A "yuan" at that time was a coin containing exactly the same amount of silver as a Spanish dollar.

--Error 23:56, 19 Jun 2005 (UTC)

The word 元 or 圆 literally means "round" does not mean it is the origin of the name. Coins minted by the Chinese were round, but they were not called 圆 , they were 錢 。 圓 , or its proper name 銀圓, refers to Spanish silver dollars which were counted, in contrary to 銀兩 (silver tales) which were weighted. In 1866 the silver coins minted in Hong Kong were called in Chinese 壹圓 , in English "One Dollar". The "Yuan" 元 or 圆 is just another translation of the "Dollar" . Not sure about Japanese Yen but it is possible that the word has the same heritage. 17:32, 15 November 2005 (UTC)

created a new page for the dollar sign languages[edit]

created a new page for the dollar sign languages, like the other languages. There are many uses for the sign that don't have anything to do with the dollar.


In China, base unit of the official currency Renminbi is called "Yuan" (元 or 圆 , with a symbol ¥). The "yuan" is, in fact, a colloquial form of the word "dollar". Spanish dollars were widely circulated in China in the late 19th century. When China adopted its the first national currency in 1914, the base unit was called "Yuan" , which means "dollar". A "yuan" at that time was a coin containing exactly the same amount of silver as a Spanish dollar.

Who the hell comes up with this crap? The word "yuan" (元) predates any Spanish influence by several hundred years. Like, say, the Yuan Dynasty? Hell, the use of coins in China is BC-era by itself. You expect me to believe the Chinese waited a couple of thousand years to name them?

Yuan/元 is a measure word for small round things among a host of other meanings. Coins, being small round things, invariably got enumerated with yuan/元. Further, claiming that this is the colloquialism is utter nonsense. The colloquialism for money's measure word (the primary unit, not the "dime" or "penny" equivalents) is kuai/块. So the article has managed to get everything--absolutely everything--wrong on this point.

Needless to say it's getting deleted. --MTR (严加华) 05:20, 12 August 2005 (UTC)

Not really. The word "yuan", like any Chinese word, has multiple meanings. The word "元" was not created for the meaning of dollar, it was just adopted for that purpose. Although it is true that the word "圓" means round object, that is not origin or the reason why it is used to called the currency now being used.
After the Ming Dynasty, the Chinese have been using a dual currency system. For large amounts, the unit was silver tales (銀兩). The Chinese did not have the habit of minting gold or silver into coins like the Europeans. The silver was rather minted into bars and measured by weight. 兩 means "tale" is a weight unit. While the currency for smaller trades was copper coins minted by the royal government, and the unit was by enumeration rather than weight. But one single coin is counted as one "chin" "錢"。 Coins stringed together (that's the purpose of the hole in Chinese coins) is called a 吊 or string. "圓" was NOT the unit for counting the indigenous coins minted locally by the Chinese. At the same time, trades with the foreign nations were carried out using Spanish dollars, silver coins which were called 銀圓 , (probably because they are round) and they were enumerated, counted as "銀圓" 。
The use of 元 or 圓 as a unit of currency in China did not happen until 1866, when the Hong Kong government at that time started minted silver coins carrying the same amount of silver as the Spanish dollars and called them "Hong Kong One Dollar" 香港壹圓. It was also the first time when the word "圓" or "元" was used as unit of currency, that took the meaning of the word "yuan" or 圓 out from its original meaning of the Spanish dollar. But the character "yuan" "圓" or "元" still means, exactly, "dollar".
In China, the first basic national currency adopted in 1914 was a silver coin equivalent to a Spanish dollar, that was also called "壹圓" or "one yuan". Nicknamed "袁大頭" , this unit was supposed to be the national unit for currency, but it never totally replaced silver tales for book-keeping purposes. It was 1934 when the Nationalist government passed laws to abandon use of "tales" as the unit of currency, and all accounting must be done with yuan.

I think the original article had it correct. It is just there're more history on the word 圓 and currencies in China than you are aware of. 23:25, 14 November 2005 (UTC)

the table[edit]

I changed around the table. Really, only the code of it. I couldn't get the padding thing to work correctly. Could someone correct it? I hope whoever it may concern enjoys the reworking. It's easier to deal with now. -- D. F. Schmidt (talk) 07:58, 28 August 2005 (UTC)

the town of Dollar?[edit]

Is there any relationship between the town of Dollar, Scotland and the currency?

The town of Dollar nestles at the foot of the Ochil Hills is central Scotland and is famous for its school "Dollar Academy" which was inagruated in 1818AD by a wealthy merchant (John McNabb).

The town is also known for 15th century Castle Campbell that sits at the top of the Dollar glen between two 'burns': the burn of care and the burn of sorrow which are known for waterfalls and huge slab like rock vennels. The castle was known as the "castle of gloom" before an act of parliment in 1489, approved by James IV.

Nope, as a proud Scot I am very sorry to report that that is unlikely. As a (kind-of) Swedish-speaker, it has become my understanding that "dollar" came from "riksdaler", but I have just looked at the Eng Wiki article, and I see that there is a more plausible explanation: Swedish riksdaler: "The daler, like the dollar, was named after the German thaler."
I have no idea of the etymology of Dollar, Scotland, but I would hazard a guess that it is from either Pictish or Scottish Gaelic.--Mais oui! 19:16, 3 December 2005 (UTC)
That's absolutely correct. The terms "dollar," "daler," and other similar currency terms having European etymologies come from the German thaler. This term, in turn, comes from the name of a Bohemian town, now in the Czech Republic, Jáchymov, known in German as Joachimsthal. The ore mined in the town was made into coins, the Joachimsthaler, subsequently shortened to thaler. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 18:12, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

Signo pesos[edit]

In most Spanish-speaking countries, the symbol is known as signo pesos o signo peso (Peso sign), and not as signo dólar (Dollar sign). Considering also that the sign is in fact the Peso sign and was copied for the US Dollar, I don't think that the article should treat countries like Argentina, Cuba, México or Uruguay as countries that use the Dollar sign.

You’re completely right, but we’re talking about English, not Spanish. I know there are English speakers in Central America as well expats in Mexico and Argentina, but I doubt whether even someone from England, or another non-dollar-using country would look at that and say “that's a peso sign.” While I know $ is used for almost every peso currency, I understand peso sign to mean . —Wiki Wikardo 19:50, 25 February 2007 (UTC)
Peso sign redirects here. --ChoChoPK (球球PK) (talk | contrib) 01:34, 26 February 2007 (UTC)
As maybe it should, unless it redirects to Philippine peso, but should the article treat peso sign as a phrase that’s often/ever used to describe that symbol in the English-speaking world? —Wiki Wikardo 18:34, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

British Dollars[edit]

In pre-decimal coinage, 10 shillings was known as a 'dollar' in slang and 5 shillings was sometimes known as 'half a dollar'. It should be noted that Australian, New Zealand, Jamacan and possible other commonwealth dollars were created from their local 10 shilling denomination. All they did was than create a 'cent' as one hundreth of ten shillings (dollar). Britain decimalised making twenty shillings (sovereign) the main unit instead of ten shillings (dollar) and creating 'new pence' as a hundreth of twenty shillings (pound)

As a kid in the UK I remeber the 'half-a-crown' piece being called in slang 'half a dollar'. Post WW11 a pound was worth 4 US dollars, thus a dollar was worth 5 shillings and the 2s6d piece ('half-a-crown') was 'half- a - dollar'

There were coins actually officially named dollars.

I quote from

'In 1797, owing to a desperate shortage of silver coins, the Bank of England issues altered foreign coins from its reserves. Half a million pounds worth of Spanish dollars issued by King Charles IV were over-stamped with a small engraving of George III. The re-issued coins, with a value of 4 shillings and 9 pence, attracted ridicule. "Two Kings' heads and not worth a crown" was one witticism. (A 'crown' in this context meant 5 shillings, "half-a-crown", sometimes colloquially known as "half-a-dollar", being a common coin before decimalisation in 1971). A cruder, description was "the head of a fool stamped on the neck of an ass". The issue failed because over-stamping was also applied unofficially to the plentiful supplies of light or base Spanish dollars.

A few years later a more successful issue of dollars was made by the Bank of England. In 1804 Matthew Boulton, the business partner of the steam engine pioneer James Watt, was employed to erase completely the existing design on full-weight Spanish coins and stamp them as Bank of England Five Shilling Dollars. '

These may be worth incorporating in some way.

Dollar Slang[edit]

Have added "cheese" and "cheddar" to the list of slang words for dollar. "Cheese" is used in Jay-Z's "Big Pimpin," "Cheddar" can be found at

Alright, fair enough. I have added this to the list of sources in the article.Weather rain.pngSoothingR 07:21, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

Jay-Z does not say "spending cheese." Additionaly, most internet lyric data bases (searched through Google) show "spendin' G's" -GLewis, March 31


I completely agree with the merging of that section into this page. I'ts like having two articles for the same thing. 21:35, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

  • Merge I agree. --Macrowiz 20:22, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
  • Yep, merge. Uh-huh. Yep. --SausMeester 22:57, 26 March 2006 (UTC)
  • I disagree as other countries exist that use the dollar sign.
  • The section in "US Dollar" has more (or at least some) information that isn't in this page; it should all be merged into the "Dollar sign" page. Appropriate info could be left on the former page. And if it is such a big deal, rename this page to "US Dollar Sign." -GLewis, March 31
  • I would disagree with this being merged into the dollar article. The reason for this is because the dollar symbol is used for more than just money. One example would be that the $ serves as the command prompt in several different computer operating systems.
JesseG 20:52, 2 April 2006 (UTC)
I think some commenters misunderstood the proposal. I do not want to move this article into the U.S. Dollar article. I want to move some information from the U.S. Dollar article to here, and then have the U.S. Dollar article refer readers to this article for more information about the dollar symbol.


the article seemed to contain a fair amount of original research, and it didn't distinguish accepted origin theories from kookery. The image even combined the most likely origin (PS) with a clear "urban legend" aitiology (US). dab () 09:38, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

I think someone should mention those burlap sacks with dollar signs on them[edit]

Yep. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by (talk) 01:13, 2 January 2007 (UTC).

Two vertical lines[edit]

This article mentions reasons for why the dollar sign might have two vertical lines without even mentioning anywhere in the article that it is even sometimes written with two vertical lines. Never mind, it's already mentioned. --Brandon Dilbeck 00:46, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

First use of "$" sign on U.S. money?[edit]

Does anyone know if the U.S. Presidential $1 coin in 2007 is the first ever use of the dollar sign on United States money, coins or paper? This question is also on the Presidential $1 coin page, so if you know, please resolve this question there also. 14:40, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

UPDATE - I found a Coin World article from April 20, 2004 that says it has appeared on a U.S. coin. Quote below. 14:29, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
Another UPDATE - Apparently, the 2007 U.S. Presidential dollar coins use is the first appearance on a circulating U.S. coin issued by the federal government. See the second article excerpt below this first one. Any editors out there can use this article as a reference to revise the article if they want to. The second article was all about the history of the dollar sign, U.S. and internationally. 18:08, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

"Although the dollar sign does not appear on any current circulating U.S. coins and is rarely encountered on U.S. coins, the American Eagle platinum coins do feature the dollar sign." -- Coin World, April 20, 2004; by Michele Orzano, Coin World staff.

Page 18: "The term "dollar" has a German name and Spanish symbol, but few U.S. coins have ever carried the famous symbol (the exceptions are the American Eagle platinum bullion coins), until now. The $ sign's placement on the reverse of the Presidential dollar coins is the first on a circulating U.S. coin (or at least the first on a U.S. coin intended to circulate)."

Page 22, article continues: "Though no federally issued U.S. circulating coin depicted the symbol before the George Washington Presidential dollar, one circulating piece made in the United States does: Templeton Reid struck a pioneer gold $5 piece dated 1830 in [the state of] Georgia. The piece is expensive and rare, with a Red Book price of $240,000 in Extremely Fine condition. The denomination appears as $5 on both sides of the coin, with the $ and 5 widely separated. As noted, the [noncirculating] American Eagle platiunum bullion coins all bear the $ sign in the denominations on the reverse: $10, $25, $50, and $100." -- Coin World, April 16, 2007, "A sign of the times," by Jeff Starck, Coin World staff.

History again[edit]

Someone went back and changed the History section so that it misrepresents the source-- the BEP page cited specifically refers to the PesoS theory, but the text currently says the page advocates the US theory. I changed this once, and I'm not going to get into an edit war, but this is just wrong. The From 'US' section also gained an unjustified "This is the most likely theory" comment, which should probably also be removed. 01:41, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

origin of the symbol[edit]

The theory that has always attracted me is that the symbol is merely a cancelled "S" for "solidus", just as the pound is a cancelled "L" for "libra", the penny is a cancelled "c" for "centum", etc. Cancellation of the initial letter as a means of abbreviation has been around since the days of the scriptoria. If anyone could find a cancelled S predating the Pillars of Hercules, we could at least put that bit of folk-etymology to rest. 17:50, 4 June 2007 (UTC)(Robert Biddle, unregistered user)

The article is biased in a revisionist sense, as it calls the dollar sign its first lines as taken from "Mexicans". There is an interesting history to the use of the sign but nowhere is there any definite proof. The 1930 online reference is solely one person's opinion and nearly 200 years after the fact making it a reference that is improperly weighted as it sets the direction of the dollar sign as Mexican. Obviously the Mexican reference should be completely removed and Spain should be used only as the control and thus symbols were from Spain's treasury and Mexico has nothing geographically relating to the symbol. Rather the pillars of Hercules were mandated by the King of Spain himself and Mexico was just a forced labor mining operation of the crown at the time. If Mexican were to be interpreted with ethnic pride of the Mestizo sort, this is also wrong as the gabachos, or whatever word applies to the Spanish whites set policy with absolutely no regard to their colonies.

In summary, the reference biases in favor of only one theory and has a strong ethnic connotation that is misleading and incorrect. 100 year older references could as well be quoted, for example for the "U" imposed over the "S" theory. I personally believe (since this likely was a convergent evolution of the symbol) that it was readily adopted by the US for just that reason and do credit the Spanish coinage with making it look like a monetary symbol ... we all can have our theories but the article violates Wikipedia guidelines by presenting one contending theory as essentially fact.

Proper syntactical usage of the sign?[edit]

Shouldn't there be something in the article about proper syntactical usage of the dollar sign? (eg. before the numerical dollar value, etc.)

That is not universal. --Asteriontalk 21:31, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
Yes, can someone please add a section about different usages of the dollar sign. It seems like Americans prefer $..., but I grew up writing ...$, and I am confused about what is considered standard style in what languages/countries. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 02:43, 30 July 2008 (UTC)

This is in the article at the end of the section "Currencies that use the dollar or peso sign". Americans and Canadians always put the dollar sign before the number. There are other currencies that use the same symbol and I don't know about those currencies, but if you are talking about American or Canadian dollars, then any American or Canadian would tell you that it is correct to put the dollar sign before the number, and incorrect to put it after. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 08:23, 11 March 2009 (UTC)


I have worked my way down the article and tried to reference it as much as I could. I added the tag unreferencedsection for the alternative theories section, some of which deserve more historic credit than other. Ideally it would benefit from a complete overhaul and removal of unverifiable entries. Regards, --Asteriontalk 21:30, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Merger with Cifrão?[edit]

I think the Cifrão article could and should be adapted into the Dollar sign article. The only thing that separates the cifrão from the dollar sign is that the cifrão always had a double stroke. Which the dollar sign has in many of its variations. Furthermore, the cifrão article isn't very long and can easily be a paragraph in the dollar sign one.

The difference is confusing and only vaguely elaborated upon. Thoughts? SergioGeorgini 11:25, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

I understand what you mean. However, as the Cifrão is only one of the multiple theories on the origin of the dollar sign, I doubt it would be widely accepted by other wikipedians. I have nothing at all against the "Cifrão theory" (I even provided a valid reference to back it up, as I believe that any verifiable theory should be listed). Simply, I just do not think that merging Dollar sign to Cifrão would give a balanced picture. And viceversa, I believe Cifrão deserves its own article. The reason why I originally removed the merge-to tag was because the request was badly formed, in the sense that there was no explanation about it on any of the talk pages. Could you please clarify now if you want to merge Cifrão into Dollar sign or Dollar sign into Cifrão? The latter is definitely not going to happen. The former, I personally think is a bad idea, as Cifrão deserves a separate article. Regards, --Asteriontalk 17:20, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
I think the cifrão article should be merged into the dollar sign article. There isn't a separate article for the peso sign, is there? No, because it's the same symbol. I think that "the cifrão always has a double stroke whereas the dollar sign only has it in certain typefaces" isn't enough to make it a whole new symbol. SergioGeorgini 12:52, 31 August 2007 (UTC)
Jpmo22 21:38, 22 August 2007 (UTC) I really don't know how to discuss here, but I want to say that Cifrão and Dollar Sign are different symbols (or signs). Brazilian Real use Cifrão (\mathrm{S}\!\!\!\Vert) and American Dollar use $ (the Dollar Sign). So I cant see a good reason to merge this articles.
But they're not different. The dollar sign has a double stroke in many typefaces and for decades, the double stroke variation was by far the standard in the United States as well. It's like saying there's a difference between the "a" of Times New Roman and the "a" of Futura and that both should get a separate article. SergioGeorgini 12:48, 31 August 2007 (UTC)
But they are. They're different unicode formats. — LlywelynII 20:34, 24 February 2011 (UTC)
Whether they look like eachother and can be confused, is not relevant here. If the signs are created at different times for different purposes they should not be confused on WikiPedia. It would be much better to add a very small section about confusable sign: cifrão (some such) and insert a {{main|Cifrão}} at the start of it. That way the confusion is not propagated. Said: Rursus 09:08, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
They weren't created at different times and they don't simply "look like one another". It's the same sign. Again, the dollar sign can either have one or two strokes, it doesn't become a Cifrao when that second one is added. SergioGeorgini (talk) 18:02, 30 April 2008 (UTC)
Again, it's not the same sign. You may think the distinction is minute, but it's still a distinction. — LlywelynII 20:34, 24 February 2011 (UTC)
Oppose: the article doesn't need to be merged, it is fine in present state. (talk) 11:32, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
Because...?SergioGeorgini (talk) 18:02, 30 April 2008 (UTC)
"It is fine in its present state." ;) — LlywelynII 20:34, 24 February 2011 (UTC)

This is precisely what's wrong with Wikipedia. It clearly is the same symbol, with a shared history. They don't coincidentally look exactly the same, they are exactly the same with only a different word used. The dollar symbol in the US is exactly the same with the same history. Yet Llywelyn spams every opinion with "no it's not" without any reasoning, and that makes the issue settled?Promontoriumispromontorium (talk) 11:33, 8 August 2011 (UTC)


Is there any point in the theory that the dollar sign was formulated from a U and an S? It's little more than theory which is completely false. Moustan (talk) 19:02, 22 July 2008 (UTC)

Agree: should be erased or moved from the "origin theories" part.Tuqui (talk) 05:32, 18 December 2008 (UTC)

You're argument that it should be removed from origin theories is because it's an origin theory? Does that make any sense to you? Stating "which is completely false" is just an opinion. Hence why there are multiple origin theories listed in the first place. Promontoriumispromontorium (talk) 11:35, 8 August 2011 (UTC)

What about this thingie?[edit] -- I don't know much about this, but when I've seen it recently I thought - Hmm, that looks like the dollar sign... (That's a photo of US House of Representatives chamber, United States Capitol.)

It is a fasces backed by what I assume is a laurel leaf garland. Since the House Chamber started to be used only around 1807, the dollar sign predated this decorative choice.TriniMuñoz (talk) 04:06, 31 March 2009 (UTC)
Correct me if I'm wrong, but that means the symbol for the currency of United States of America is based on the fascist symbol (the same symbol which gave the name to what we now know and define as fascism)?? —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 23:30, 7 May 2009 (UTC)
If this was true, then fascism is alive and well in Cincinatti.Eregli bob (talk) 01:56, 18 September 2010 (UTC)
No it does not. You'll be glad to know that the association of the fasces with "fascism" only dates to the 1920s. The later term was coined in Italy and later applied to similar authoritarian movements of the early 20th century. Prior to that the fasces was a symbol of republicanism, but Mussolini ruined that for everyone. Besides, the fasces is not the inspiration for "$." TriniMuñoz (talk) 03:49, 12 June 2009 (UTC)
A minor point: the fasces were in continuous common use in the western world thousands of years prior to Mussolini and therefore escaped much of the stigma that the swastika suffered. Perhaps this effect is why the swastika doesn't bear much stigma in eastern Asia. Frotz (talk) 12:08, 12 June 2009 (UTC)
And why would it bear a stigma if it even does at all? The events that happened which caused the stigma had nothing to do with Asia (not just east btw). - M0rphzone (talk) 05:43, 9 May 2012 (UTC)
There are numerous instances of swastika flags being flown in the Middle-East, especially in the form of a red background with a white circle with the swastika inscribed. From the context that they are flown, it's clear that the notoriety of Nazism is being invoked. -- Frotz(talk) 05:01, 6 December 2013 (UTC)

sybolic value of $[edit]

I think it would be a good idea to have a section about the symbol beyond just a simple representation of currency. The dollar symbol specifically is strongly associated with capitalism as a philosophy even for countries that have different currency. This can be either a positive or negative association. One example that comes to mind are the dollar brand cigarettes in Atlas Shrugged. I think that book is the source of the U+S=$ theory, which might be good to cite possibly as a way to discount the theory. However, it does show that for a good number of people the symbol has expanded beyond a convenient shorthand for currency. The article should at least touch on this fact. (talk) 20:51, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Why does the $ precede the number[edit]

Has anybody any information on why the sign precedes the number? It doesn't make really sense from a syntactical point of view. When seen as a dimensional symbol it should be right behind the number (like "twenty volts" is 20V), however for some reason it precedes it. Polemon (talk) 19:14, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

In the original American colonies the British/Americans simply wrote money the same way they wrote the British pound...with the pound sign always in front of the amount.After independence the Americans kept to their British tradition — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 22:02, 13 July 2012 (UTC)

Potosi mint mark[edit]

Can we get a picture of the Potosi mint mark? Drutt (talk) 13:52, 7 November 2009 (UTC)

The Potosi mint mark is visible twice in the picture already included in the article: Potosi real. The text on the coin says: "Utra que unum [flower] [Potosi mark] [flower] 1768 [flower] [Potosi sign] [flower]." The picture's caption in the article brings this to the reader's attention. Perhaps someone might want to crop a close up from the picture, but just clicking on it should make it very visible. TriniMuñoz (talk) 19:36, 1 December 2009 (UTC)

origin - Tariq ibn Ziyad[edit]

At least in Brazil (where we use the two lines version of the sign), it is widely known/accepted that the origin of the symbol is from Tariq ibn Ziyad, and his conquest of Iberian Peninsula. He then ordered his servants to write a map on the coins, showing his path: curved like an S and through the Pillars of Hercules (that being the reason for two lines, not one). Here are some references (they were hard to find, since it's so widely known!):,,OI3326592-EI8402,00.html (in portuguese) —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 01:39, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

P.S.: Forgot to say, even being being wide known, most people would know it as something like: "some thing about a map, with a curvy path and then somehing to do with Pillars of Hercules being the two lines" (few people would actually know on the fly the name of the guy or more details (I just googled for "cifrão colunas de hércules origem" to find the reference where I found the man's name)). —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 01:45, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Should mention that urban legend at cifrao. — LlywelynII 20:39, 24 February 2011 (UTC)

Dollar/Peso sign[edit]

Why did they revert it back to "Dollar sign" only? the symbol is used for both currencies, the Dollar and the Peso, it was perfectly logical and neutral for this article to be named "Dollar/Peso sign", does anyone have a reason for removing (and ignoring) the word Peso form the title? Supaman89 (talk)

Because "dollar sign" is the name used in English. If you'd like to post at Wikipedia:Requested moves and the people there agree to the change, go for it. I doubt they will though. Recognizance (talk) 08:10, 28 January 2010 (UTC)

Dollar sign NEVER "originally" the peso sign[edit]

Edited out opening line, but will make a note here in case someone reverts the edit: The dollar sign was never "originally" the peso sign - it was originally the real de ocho sign. The slang for that coin was peso in Spanish and... dollar in English. It's always been the dollar sign in English, so the lede should explain it's used in both contexts without claiming one or the other has priority. — LlywelynII 20:38, 24 February 2011 (UTC)

atlas shrugged attention[edit]

"The book Atlas Shrugged by Ayn Rand includes a section where the main characters philosophize about the United States being the only nation to ever despise its own monogram because it had been used to denote wealth. Rand states that the country had been built by individuals who were seeking to enjoy the complete fruits of their labor instead of seeing it siphoned off to support big government and individuals who would rather take from the wealthy than work. Sadly, most of the premises of her book are already fact."

The above, in the "From US" section of the article, ends in opinion, not fact, and should be edited, I think. — Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 13:47, 7 January 2012 (UTC)


The abbreviation for "sestertius" was never HS. It was IIS. A sestertius consisted of 2,5 asses, two full and one half ass. "Half" is "semi" in Latin. Thus "sestertius" : "the half-third one" or "the third one is half" or abbreviated: IIS. (talk) 23:04, 14 November 2012 (UTC)

Relevance of the cinnabar symbol[edit]

This was not original research, but is an entry in a dictionary of occult symbols. The connection is that cinnabar is used in some spells having to do with money, particularly in Feng Shui. -- Frotz(talk) 05:20, 6 December 2013 (UTC)

Hi User:Frotz! Do you have the text from this source? Because before your edit the text of the section stated (my emphasis): "A symbol virtually identical to dollar sign has been used as an alchemic sigil for cinnabar dating at least as far back as the early eighteenth century, although this has not been proposed as an origin of the dollar sign." I don't have access to the text, but I find it odd it would say it "has not been proposed as an origin of the dollar sign" and now you say the "connection is that cinnabar is used in some spells having to do with money." This still sounds like original research. It sounds like you are making a connection from money spells → cinnabar symbol → dollar sign that is unsupported in the text cited or the literature. A Google Book Search of "cinnabar symbol" and "dollar sign" brings no pertinent hits. TuckerResearch (talk) 02:48, 7 December 2013 (UTC)
My thinking is like this: 1) Cinnabar is known to be used to represent wealth and money in magical contexts. 2) Sigils are tools used to symbolically represent thoughts, concepts, objects, and so on in magical contexts. 3) Years before the dollar sign publicly emerged, an identical symbol is listed as a a sigil for cinnabar in a book entitled "Lexicon Pharmaceutico-Chymicum" written by J.C.S. Sommerhoff in 1701. I can add that book to the citation for the "Dictionary of Sigils" Both can be found through Google Books. -- Frotz(talk) 06:59, 7 December 2013 (UTC)
You're not getting it. That's original research, which Wikipedia frowns upon. It isn't the book making the connection between the cinnabar symbol and the dollar sign, it's you, and that's a no-no. ("'A and B, therefore C' is acceptable only if a reliable source has published the same argument in relation to the topic of the article.") If you can find a book that makes that connection, cite that. But you can't just put your reasoned opinions into Wikipedia. TuckerResearch (talk) 18:18, 7 December 2013 (UTC)
Okay, I see. I'll comb through Sommerhoff book to see if I can find something useful. -- Frotz(talk) 22:27, 7 December 2013 (UTC)