View source for Talk:Swine influenza/Archive 1

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== Smithfield Farms from Virginia in Veracruz ==
It is not Smithfield Farms the one who has to say they are not the cause of the problem, OMS should confirm that.
Because in 1985, Smithfield Farms received what was, at the time, the most expensive fine in history – $12.6 million – for violating the US Clean Water Act at its pig facilities near the Pagan River in Smithfield, Virginia , but when NAFTA came into effect 1994, Smithfield Farms moved its harmful practices to Veracruz, Mexico so that it could evade the tougher US regulators. Reporter Jeff Teitz reported in 2006 on the conditions in Smithfield’s US facilities: 
" Pigs are artificially inseminated and injected with antibiotics to bear the sicknesses they have. They are fed and delivered of their piglets in cages so small they cannot turn around. The temperature inside hog houses is often hotter than ninety degrees. There is no sunlight, straw, fresh air or earth. The air, saturated almost to the point of precipitation with gases from shit and chemicals became lethal and pigs start dying."

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/12840743/porks_dirty_secret_the_nations_top_hog_producer_is_also_one_of_americas_worst_polluters

Consider what happens when such forms of massive pork production move to unregulated territory where Mexican authorities allow wealthy interests to do business without adequate oversight. What happen when a lagoon is near, filled with all that shit and flies transport their sicknesses to the people.

http://www.jornada.unam.mx/2009/04/28/index.php?section=opinion&article=020a1pol&partner=rss
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/12840743/porks_dirty_secret_the_nations_top_hog_producer_is_also_one_of_americas_worst_polluters

==Patient Zero==
The first evidence of swine flu transmission was reported in September 2008, in the US state of Texas, involving a young boy who worked with pigs, says Laurie Garrett, Council on Foreign Relations of USA.

http://www.cfr.org/publication/19245/global_health_crisis.html?breadcrumb=%2Fregion%2Frecent http://eyugoslavia.com/general/28/obama-swine-flu-outbreak-cause-for-concern-not-alarm-227029/ http://www.jornada.unam.mx/2009/04/28/index.php?section=mundo&article=029n1mun http://www.elsemanario.com.mx/news/news_display.php?story_id=19308  <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Lmgg170|Lmgg170]] ([[User talk:Lmgg170|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Lmgg170|contribs]]) 17:16, 29 April 2009 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

what is a swine flu baby  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/96.224.50.238|96.224.50.238]] ([[User talk:96.224.50.238|talk]]) 20:08, 29 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

==Expecting==
Expecting medical editors to remove these links:

:Sure John, I will. [[User:Jfdwolff|JFW]]&nbsp;|&nbsp;[[User_talk:Jfdwolff|<small>T@lk</small>]] 22:10, 11 December 2005 (UTC)

Folks, get ready for the Bird Flu Scare of 2008!  It is, afterall a big election year.  We can't screw up like we did in 1976.  That no good Jimmy Carter. --[[Donald Rumsfeld]]

:Carter was not prez in 1976.  He started 1-20-1977!  It was Ford ! [[User:Chivista|Chivista]] 14:42, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

==Why==
Why did people die from the vaccine? I came here looking for that, but it doesn't say.  I think it would be help 20  people died from the vaccine than died from the swine flu itself."   I do not see how the source supports this assertion.  As I understand the source, getting GBS is in no way synonymous with dying;  also, the link between the vaccine and GBS was never definitively drawn.   [[User:Relgif|Relgif]] ([[User talk:Relgif|talk]]) 13:56, 16 September 2008 (UTC)

:::I'll delete the claim. [[User:WAS 4.250|WAS 4.250]] ([[User talk:WAS 4.250|talk]]) 12:35, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

REPORT: Glendale, California. On Saturday, April 25th 2009 two stranded ducks were seen sitting at a bus stop (not a joke folks), appearing to be of the Mallard/or Geese type aquatic - having been downed during what may be a Mexican migration to the north. Please note, these may have been ill and were downed in a public municipal area just North East of Los Angeles. Please leave note here for epidemiologists researching H1N1 avian. Ducks were seen next to the Days Inn Glendale California - nearest aquatic duck area is likely Echo Park, Los Angeles. These two appear to have lost thier way, possible illness  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/99.52.210.18|99.52.210.18]] ([[User talk:99.52.210.18|talk]]) 09:19, 29 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Proposed move ==

Proposing a move to [[Swine influenza]] in line with other influenza article moves.

Appropriate terminology, and will allow article to focus on the disease caused by swine-endemic influenza viruses (not viruses, not just disease as it affects swine).

This seems uncontroversial to me. Anyone object?--[[User:ZayZayEM|ZayZayEM]] ([[User talk:ZayZayEM|talk]]) 07:15, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

:Go for it. [[User:WAS 4.250|WAS 4.250]] ([[User talk:WAS 4.250|talk]]) 09:48, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

== Cleanup ==

{{quote|"In swine, 3 influenza A virus subtypes (H1N1, H3N2, and H1N2) are circulating throughout the world. In the United States, the classic H1N1 subtype was exclusively prevalent among swine populations before 1998; however, since late August 1998, H3N2 subtypes have been isolated from pigs. Most H3N2 virus isolates are triple reassortants, containing genes from human (HA, NA, and PB1), swine (NS, NP, and M), and avian (PB2 and PA) lineages. [...] Present vaccination strategies for SIV control and prevention in swine farms typically include the use of 1 of several bivalent SIV vaccines commercially available in the United States. Of the 97 recent H3N2 isolates examined, only 41 isolates had strong serologic cross-reactions with antiserum to 3 commercial SIV vaccines. Since the protective ability of influenza vaccines depends primarily on the closeness of the match between the vaccine virus and the epidemic virus, the presence of nonreactive H3N2 SIV variants suggests that current commercial vaccines might not effectively protect pigs from infection with a majority of H3N2 viruses."[4]}}

I really just rest my case on this sole paragraph.
*random open quote
*overlinking
*weird [...]
*repeated info from last paragraph
*no direct links to topic in certain sentances
*poor prose and sentance structure
*etc.

Please can I get some cooperation in attempting to assist in actually editing these articles. I am not just drive-by tagging on these ones. Tagging however will assist in gaining further editorial assistance, and also I feel is an ethical disclaimer to poor students who may not know better and think wikipedia is grand all-the-time.--[[User:ZayZayEM|ZayZayEM]] ([[User talk:ZayZayEM|talk]]) 11:41, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

SIV most usually refers to Simian Immunodeficieny Virus, propose to eliminate the aside suggesting that Swine Influenza Virus is referred to as SIV  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/76.114.18.68|76.114.18.68]] ([[User talk:76.114.18.68|talk]]) 00:16, 28 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:SIV also refers to swine influenza virus;  you can find it used that way in medical abstracts on PubMed.  --[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 22:21, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Just a minor issue, but in the first paragraph the word "are" appears twice in a row by mistake (in "rarely are are able")  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/24.124.54.30|24.124.54.30]] ([[User talk:24.124.54.30|talk]]) 22:10, 28 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:Got it.  --[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 22:21, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

== H5N1 ==

Why is H5N1 discussed here. It is a strain of '''avian''' influenza.

Perhaps a short discussion on "other influenzaviruses in swine" might be pertinent to this page, but as this page is about those influenza particular adapted to swine (ratehr than other influenza that may be harboured in swine) a discussion on H5N1 is not appropriate right front and center.--[[User:ZayZayEM|ZayZayEM]] ([[User talk:ZayZayEM|talk]]) 06:45, 5 December 2008 (UTC)

H5N1 is discussed here because most readers are interested  the potential of the swine flu to infect humans, and H5N1 is particularly relevant to this.  Direct transmission of bird flu to humans is extremely rare; most bird flus that do infect humans go through pigs first.  That said, I agree that H5N1 shouldn't be the first thing in the article.  

One point of cleanup (which I can't do myself because the article is currently locked):

Health experts[who?] say pigs can carry human influenza viruses, which can combine (i.e. exchange homologous genome sub-units by genetic reassortment) with H5N1 ...

Should say "which can recombine".  Recombination is a specific term in biology which refers to the exchange of genetic material; "combine" doesn't mean the same thing in this context.  I would also omit "Health experts say", because pigs carrying human (as well as bird) influenza is a basic fact, whether health officials say it or not.  <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Levipes|Levipes]] ([[User talk:Levipes|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Levipes|contribs]]) 17:19, 26 April 2009 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

[[Reassortment]] is what [[influenza]] does;  [[recombination]] also can occur but in the case of the 2009 outbreak no technical source has mentioned recombination.  --[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 15:19, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

'''Swine flu''' is any influenza endemic in swine.  [[Influenza A virus subtype H1N1]] has separate clades (phylogenetically related groups) of strains endemic in humans (hence [[human influenza]]) and in pigs (hence [[swine influenza]]).  The 2009 outbreak of "swine flu" in humans is a [[zoonosis]].  --[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 15:19, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

==2009 Strain==
http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/04/23/swine.flu/?iref=mpstoryview  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/70.253.177.153|70.253.177.153]] ([[User talk:70.253.177.153|talk]]) 02:11, 24 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

The intro should discuss how this is spread compared to bird flu. &nbsp; Thx, [[User:Daniel.Cardenas|Daniel.Cardenas]] ([[User talk:Daniel.Cardenas|talk]]) 18:14, 24 April 2009 (UTC)

:This strain is far less deadly and not endemic in wild animals, but looks at the moment to be able to spread person to person. H5N1 has only spread person to person in a couple of isolated cases between family members or to a care giver. [[User:WAS 4.250|WAS 4.250]] ([[User talk:WAS 4.250|talk]]) 22:48, 24 April 2009 (UTC)


== 2009 Swine Flu outbreak ==

Just a hunch, perhaps, but I feel that this may merit a page of its own. [[User:Dockimble|Dockimble]] ([[User talk:Dockimble|talk]]) 07:50, 25 April 2009 (UTC)
*Split it off as soon as a strain name is provided. [[User:Resurr Section|Resurr Section]] ([[User talk:Resurr Section|talk]]) 08:12, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

== 2009 Swine Flu Outbreak in US and Mexico ==

It's not clear to me based on my reading of this entry that the US and Mexico H1N1 strains are in fact one and the same.  I don't want to dive in here and start making major changes to a page that I haven't worked on before, but I would recommend that this point be clarified.  For confirmation of this, see the CDC's investigation page, which confirms that isolates from the US and at least some of the Mexican patients contain the exact same subtype.  Thank you. [[User:Esbullin|Esbullin]] ([[User talk:Esbullin|talk]]) 12:28, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

:The high mortality rate among young adults is strong evidence that it is the same strain of H1N1 even among those whose strain has not been laboratory confirmed. [[User:WAS 4.250|WAS 4.250]] ([[User talk:WAS 4.250|talk]]) 20:04, 25 April 2009 (UTC)

\

== 20th case  ==
[http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-flu-emergency27-2009apr27,0,1491412.story]

The 20th case appearing in Ohio leads to a declartion of public health emergency.  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/164.107.182.65|164.107.182.65]] ([[User talk:164.107.182.65|talk]]) 19:10, 26 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

The outbreak most likely cannot be linked to hog feces and/or flies. The claim that flies were the vector was made by a local non-expert who may have been unaware that the respiratory ailment was in fact influenza. Influenza is transmitted by air or physical contact with nasal/oral secretions.  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/144.162.82.60|144.162.82.60]] ([[User talk:144.162.82.60|talk]]) 22:41, 27 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== This page is an embarassing mish-mash of half truths ==

Much of the information is about Bird Flu; much of the history is lifted from other pages, where it is provided with a context that it does not have here - indeed, this page reads as if it was intended to be a 'potted history of flu' or a duplicate of [[2009 H1N1 flu outbreak]]

It also lacks ANY detailed info about swine flu in swine; the logical starting point for the page.

Sorry to be so utterly negative - if I was qualified to do so, I'd rewrite it.  <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Heenan73|Heenan73]] ([[User talk:Heenan73|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Heenan73|contribs]]) 10:38, 26 April 2009 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Artificially Made? ==

“This strain of swine influenza that’s been cultured in a laboratory" is a quote from the video below.
I think that this might be something fairly importanted to note. Would this serve any use in the article?

Source: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20090424.wvswine_flu0424/VideoStory/International/?pid=RTGAM.20090424.wswine0424 (At roughly 35 seconds in)  <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Empusa22|Empusa22]] ([[User talk:Empusa22|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Empusa22|contribs]]) 11:31, 26 April 2009 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:I believe he's referencing the influenza they have ''collected'' for study in the lab, not that it is artificially made.  '''[[User:Malinaccier|Malinaccier]] ([[User talk:Malinaccier|talk]])''' 11:55, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

I have another source that says that the strange mix of so many strains comes from an accident in Austria :

Source: http://www.torontosun.com/news/canada/2009/02/27/8560781.html --[[User:Flightman777|Flightman777]] ([[User talk:Flightman777|talk]]) 10:47, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

The torontosun is discussing an avian flu, not the swine flu. The swine flu and avian flu are different. Please do not add things if you have limited knowledge of microbiology. [[User:ZgokE|ZgokE]] ([[User talk:ZgokE|talk]]) 21:06, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

:More evidences that it is made artificially are already contained in Wikipedia: [[1918_flu_pandemic#Spanish_flu_research]]. The simple questions are - why has there been interest in recreating the 1918 pandemic virus and why is it spreading right now as a new variant called swine flu after the very recent artificial recreation - [[User:Johninwiki|Johninwiki]] ([[User talk:Johninwiki|talk]]) 02:55, 29 April 2009 (UTC)
::It's not artifical, only a retard or somebody with a big ass hatred of the world creates a virus thye can't control, aka the US government.--[[User:Jakezing|Jakezing (Your King]] ([[User talk:Jakezing|talk]]) 03:49, 29 April 2009 (UTC)
:::There is a verinteresting recent article related to this published by the SUN: [http://www.torontosun.com/news/canada/2009/02/27/8560781.html Baxter: Product contained live bird flu virus]. Reading the news more closely reveals the following statement: "The contaminated product, a mix of H3N2 seasonal flu viruses and unlabelled H5N1 viruses". H3N2 is a type of "swine-flu". - [[User:Johninwiki|Johninwiki]] ([[User talk:Johninwiki|talk]]) 05:26, 29 April 2009 (UTC)

== Spanish Flu ==

The 1918 flu is discussed in this article, but it says it wasn't related to Swine Flu.  Why then put it in this article?  I don't have an account or else I would delete it myself.  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/99.185.60.226|99.185.60.226]] ([[User talk:99.185.60.226|talk]]) 20:08, 26 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:Good call. I removed the section.  Perhaps you would like to [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:UserLogin&type=signup create an account]? '''[[User:Malinaccier|Malinaccier]] ([[User talk:Malinaccier|talk]])''' 20:12, 26 April 2009 (UTC)

== Nice Sentence Fragment == lol.olo♥♥

:"The vaccine for the human seasonal flu does not protect against the Swine Flu, even if the virus strains are the same specific variety, as antigenically very different."
Who did that?  Does anyone bother to read their edits before committing them?  What were you thinking?  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/24.11.8.168|24.11.8.168]] ([[User talk:24.11.8.168|talk]]) 20:31, 26 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Swine flu in the United States present before outbreak in Mexico. ==

"From December 2005 through February 2009, a total of 12 human infections with swine influenza were reported from 10 states in the United States. Since March 2009, a number of confirmed human cases of a new strain of swine influenza A (H1N1) virus infection in the U.S. and internationally have been identified. An investigation into these cases is ongoing."

'''source:''' ''http://www.cdc.gov/swineflu/''  <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Veronica.fremont|Veronica.fremont]] ([[User talk:Veronica.fremont|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Veronica.fremont|contribs]]) 21:36, 26 April 2009 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

To the best of my recollection, SIV referred to Simian Immunodeficiency Virus, the primate version of HIV, not Swine Influenza Virus.  Please check your sources.  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/97.81.203.121|97.81.203.121]] ([[User talk:97.81.203.121|talk]]) 22:12, 26 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

:[[SIV]] is a disambiguation page, and SIV in fact is used for swine influenza virus, as well as other things.  --[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 02:51, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

== More Recent Info: April 26, 2009 ==

CDC has confirmed 20 cases. The New York cases have been confirmed, and another in Ohio (someone above mentioned it). I don't have an account or I would change it. Here is the link:
http://www.cdc.gov/swineflu/investigation.htm
Kind of hard to beat a government website as far as verifiability.  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/72.209.183.173|72.209.183.173]] ([[User talk:72.209.183.173|talk]]) 22:30, 26 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

In Asia, South America, Central America, and other parts of the world, it is not uncommon to see poultry and swine together.  This could explain why the swine show exposure to H5N1, but no active signs of infection.  There is a potential for cross species infection, but it is still counter productive for a virus to become virulent and rapidly lethal to the host species.  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/97.81.203.121|97.81.203.121]] ([[User talk:97.81.203.121|talk]]) 22:32, 26 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

For the 2009 outbreak, please add your contributions to these articles:
*[[2009 swine flu outbreak]]
*[[2009 swine flu outbreak in Mexico]]
*[[2009 swine flu outbreak in the United States]]
*[[2009 swine flu outbreak in Canada]]
*[[2009 swine flu outbreak in Spain]]

--[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 15:14, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

:See [[Human influenza]] for a model of how to develop this article.  --[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 17:34, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

== Lies, damned lies, statistics, etc... ==

I'm no epidemiologist, but...

"In 2005 it was discovered that H5N1 could be infecting up to half of the pig population in some areas of Indonesia, but without causing symptoms. Chairul Nidom, a virologist at Airlangga University's tropical disease center in Surabaya, East Java, conducted an independent research; he tested the blood of 10 apparently healthy pigs housed near poultry farms in West Java where avian flu had broken out, Nature reported. Five of the pig samples contained the H5N1 virus. The Indonesian government has since found similar results in the same region. Additional tests of 150 pigs outside the area were negative."

...doesn't make a helluva lot of sense, now does it?  I hope no one objects to my editing the paragraph to remove the inconsistent, sensationalist and inflammatory first sentence.  It could just as well read "...could be infecting up to 99 44/100th percent...," and be just as accurate, but still just as vague and misleading.  [[User:Terry Yager|Terry Yager]] ([[User talk:Terry Yager|talk]]) 03:36, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

== Wrong numbers? ==

In the article is said, that the Spanish flu pandemic killed some 50 million to 100 million people worldwide from 1918 to 1919.
Than it is said, that The Spanish flu pandemic of 1918, had a fatality rate of about 2.5%

This mean, that between 2 and 4 bilions of people was infected worldwide. I am not sure if by that time there were 4 bilion people altogether.

So, maybe the fatality rate is about 25% or the death toll is 5-10 milion?


[[User:Liophy|Liophy]] ([[User talk:Liophy|talk]]) 11:57, 27 April 2009 (UTC)[[User:Liophy|Liiophy]] ([[User talk:Liophy|talk]]) 12:55, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
:[[Spanish flu#Mortality]] says: ''The global mortality rate from the 1918/1919 pandemic is [...] estimated at 2.5 to 5% '''of the human population''', with 20% or more of the world population suffering from the disease to some extent.'' As the world population in 1918 was about 1.8 billion, those numbers roughly match the 50-100 million.
:The 7% swine flu deaths per infected persons are not a [[mortality rate]] but a [[case fatality]] rate, so the two percentages are totally incomparable. Strangely, the [[Case fatality]] article also says that Spanish flu has a case fatality of ">2.5%" when it should be up to 25% (5%/20%) according to the above numbers. Some expert please sort out this mess.--[[Special:Contributions/87.162.37.135|87.162.37.135]] ([[User talk:87.162.37.135|talk]]) 13:28, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

== Additional sources == 
I added a number of review articles from PubMed under the "Further reading" section, just fyi in case someone wants to read through them and add more information to the Wikipdia article. ---[[User:Kilbad|kilbad]] ([[User talk:Kilbad|talk]]) 14:24, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

==ManBirdPig==

ManBirdPig is becoming an unofficial, slang term for Swine flu, any thoughts on creating a redirect from "ManBirdPig" to "Swine Influenza"? [[Special:Contributions/67.17.144.95|67.17.144.95]] ([[User talk:67.17.144.95|talk]]) 15:33, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

:It is a [[neologism]].  If it persists, then it belongs on Wikipedia (and Wiktionary).  --[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 15:42, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

:: There is also a debate between Manbirdpig and Bacon lung in slang circles.  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/99.192.27.119|99.192.27.119]] ([[User talk:99.192.27.119|talk]]) 23:31, 29 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

==Symptoms and signs of Swine Flu==
I attempted to change the symptoms and signs, but when I finished the article was locked.  Here is some more direct information that the CNN article was quoting: Symptoms of swine flu are "similar to the regular human flu and include fever, cough, sore throat, body aches, headache, chills and fatigue. Some people have reported diarrhea and vomiting associated with swine flu." <ref>{{cite|url=http://www.cdc.gov/swineflu/swineflu_you.htm|title=Swine Flu and You|publisher=[[CDC]]|date=2009-04-26|accessdate=2009-04-26}}</ref>[[User:Cenic8|Cenic8]] ([[User talk:Cenic8|talk]]) 16:59, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

:Added, thank you. [[User:TimVickers|Tim Vickers]] ([[User talk:TimVickers|talk]]) 17:05, 27 April 2009 (UTC)
::Just in case, here is the link I was citing again: http://www.cdc.gov/swineflu/swineflu_you.htm [[User:Cenic8|Cenic8]] ([[User talk:Cenic8|talk]]) 17:17, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

:::This source is specific to the strain circulating in the [[2009 swine flu outbreak]] in humans, and may not apply to all zoonotic swine flu in humans.  Also, remember this article is about influenza endemic in swine:  what are the signs and symptoms in them?  --[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 17:25, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

::::I find it odd that vomiting and diarrhea are associated with "normal flu". Normal flu is all about the fever and aches.  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/71.207.132.162|71.207.132.162]] ([[User talk:71.207.132.162|talk]]) 11:14, 28 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Page protected April 2009 ==

Tim Vickers has fully protected the article, and is actively editing it.  Once he is finished editing, I hope he will remove the protection or lower it to semi protection (so logged in contributors can edit it).  --[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 17:04, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

:I don't think I fully protected it. My computer displays semi-protection. Could you try editing it again and seeing if you still have a problem? [[User:TimVickers|Tim Vickers]] ([[User talk:TimVickers|talk]]) 17:06, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

::Tim, I checked the log and you did semi-protect it.  Also, I can edit, and someone else just did?  --[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 17:10, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

:::Good! :) [[User:TimVickers|Tim Vickers]] ([[User talk:TimVickers|talk]]) 17:11, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

It is not clear the 'Treatment' section is correct. It may in fact be completely in correct and giving misleading information regarding Tamiflu, please see following extract from and article on Bloomberg "WHO Said to Raise Flu Alert to Unprecedented Level" as of April 27 2009 11:36 
"In the meantime, the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention recommends that patients take GlaxoSmithKline Plc’s Relenza, or an unspecified anti-viral drug combination, rather than Roche Holding AG’s Tamiflu, Martin Meltzer, a senior health economist at the CDC, said at a meeting on flu vaccines in Cannes, France. Most seasonal flu variants of H1N1 circulating globally are resistant to Tamiflu."  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/68.195.215.122|68.195.215.122]] ([[User talk:68.195.215.122|talk]]) 19:02, 27 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

:This article [http://www.cdc.gov/swineflu/recommendations.htm (link)] looks very reliable on this question. I'll check the article against this. [[User:TimVickers|Tim Vickers]] ([[User talk:TimVickers|talk]]) 19:09, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

::Looks like what is on the CDC website agrees with this article but not that press story. I'll stick with what the CDC say on the matter. [[User:TimVickers|Tim Vickers]] ([[User talk:TimVickers|talk]]) 19:14, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

== Spread overview ==

Maybe is this a interesting site to link to: http://www.h1n1-influenza.info/ --[[User:JMartijnB|JMartijnB]] ([[User talk:JMartijnB|talk]]) 19:19, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

== Revive ==
Another site offered by PBS with interesting discussion to topic:  http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/sciencenow/3318/02.html

== Congratulations ==
I'm impressed with the quality of the article that developed so quickly into a solid article. Great job, editors of Wikipedia! --[[Special:Contributions/24.12.249.201|24.12.249.201]] ([[User talk:24.12.249.201|talk]])  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|undated]] comment added 20:18, 27 April 2009 (UTC).</span><!--Template:Undated--> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Confirmed countries with Swine ==
This site has a list of confirmed countries who have swine: http://www.cygy.com/2009/04/swine-flu-is-now-global-epidemic_27.html  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/70.68.139.248|70.68.139.248]] ([[User talk:70.68.139.248|talk]]) 20:46, 27 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

Suggest a good image to use on the page - found some on <ref>http://www.medical-artist.com/swine-flu-virus-H1N1-influenza-image.html</ref> but don't know if there is space with all the other information!  [[User:Tim10fifty|Tim10fifty]] ([[User talk:Tim10fifty|talk]]) 23:12, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

:That is content for [[2009 swine flu outbreak]].  --[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 00:57, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

== prevention ==

In the prevention section it should be mentioned that when researchers want to give a person a virus they apply it to certain membranes inside the nose. 
When  a person contracts a virus it is from acquiring it on their hands and then picking their nose and thus applying it to the mucus membranes.   While we seem to be unable to point out the role of picking out nose in contracting this and other diseases we seem to be perfectly comfortable in describing all sorts of other body functions that some find uncomfortable like erectile disfunction or vagina etc.  I find this curious.   In the light of the serious nature of this disease  I think it should be mentioned.  
[[User:Arydberg|Arydberg]] ([[User talk:Arydberg|talk]]) 23:59, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

== 1918 Pandemic ==

The [[1918 flu pandemic]] wasn't swine flu according to the main article on that pandemic, which sites this source [http://www.influenzareport.com/ir/ai.htm].  Another source that says it wasn't swine flu is here [http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1894129,00.html].  The section was apparently removed, then put back in just to provide some background information, and is now back to being presented as if the pandemic was swine flu.  Its placement in sections titled "Epidemiology" and "Outbreaks in Humans" implies that it is an outbreak of swine flu.  I don't know if any discussion on that pandemic is needed in this article, but even if it should be mentioned somewhere, it shouldn't be in a section on outbreaks of ''swine'' flu. [[User:Calathan|Calathan]] ([[User talk:Calathan|talk]]) 00:08, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

:That pandemic is the source of the oldest known samples of H1N1; who knows what the history of H1N1 was before then?  But Calathan is correct that the pandemic was not an outbreak of swine flu (as we now define swine flu).  I have deleted the section about the pandemic, reducing it to a sentence in the section lead.  --[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 00:56, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

== Human image is incorrect ==

{{tlc|editsemiprotected}}
The image of the human is backward and should be flipped horizontally so that the stomach is on the man's *right* side of his body (from his perspective).

[[File:Red information icon with gradient background.svg|20px|link=|alt=]] '''Not done:'''<!-- Template:ESp --> Three problems. First, the text would be reversed, so another entire image would be required. Second, the left lung is obviously correct and would be incorrect if mirrored. Finally, the stomach matches the position found in the drawings on the [[stomach]] article. [[User:Celestra|Celestra]] ([[User talk:Celestra|talk]]) 02:35, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

== diarrhea is NOT a symptom ==

The diarrhea that these spring breakers have is freaking travelers diarrhea - e. coli.  It's possible to have 2 infections at once people... come on.  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/99.22.220.61|99.22.220.61]] ([[User talk:99.22.220.61|talk]]) 05:13, 28 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== attack root cause of swine flu  ==
{{hat|Discussion unrelated to article}}
it would be better for world community to completely ban the pig and and the products which are
making use of pig fat in their prepration .i suggest to every country to compeletly ban the products of other countries where from these piggy items come .
for my country people ,india ,it is better to be in war like situation to fight against it. that would be good for all of us.
if only one victim of the said disease may enter our state then whole state's life may be at risk
.And our health care dept should be very vigilent about it.  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/202.141.137.168|202.141.137.168]] ([[User talk:202.141.137.168|talk]]) 05:38, 28 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
{{hab}}

== Madagascar ports ==
{{hat|Bad joke}}
According to AP, Madagascar has already made the decision to close their ports, to prevent infection coming inside their borders. I feel that this needs to be covered as it shows the speed at which of the virus is spreading, and its importance in international politics but can't edit the article without an account.

Source: http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqR2gTYP8shLcqCPFkreBzGo_Oi26xnQD97R6JAG0 [[Special:Contributions/207.255.76.92|207.255.76.92]] ([[User talk:207.255.76.92|talk]]) 07:11, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
:Isnt that a joke about the game Pandemic? If you dont infect Madagascar, you cannot win that game. [[User:RonUSMC|RonUSMC]] ([[User talk:RonUSMC|talk]]) 10:09, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
::It is a joke. Archiving. [[User:TimVickers|Tim Vickers]] ([[User talk:TimVickers|talk]]) 16:23, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
{{hab}}

==What exactly are the results of this?==
I am having the hardest time finding out exactly what this disease does. The article talks about how to spot it, its symptoms, but does not touch on mortality rates, etc. There is no mention at the CDC site or the Influenza main article either. Am I just reading it wrong? Do symptoms just mean what happens to you until you die? If so, why not expand with a timeline or something about how long to recover, die, lose a vital organ? [[User:RonUSMC|RonUSMC]] ([[User talk:RonUSMC|talk]]) 10:06, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

Swine influenza (also swine flu) refers to influenza caused by any virus of the family Orthomyxoviridae, that is endemic to pig...

The word "that" should be changed to "which."  <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Nossond|Nossond]] ([[User talk:Nossond|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Nossond|contribs]]) 11:07, 28 April 2009 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

:I have revised the lead, I hope resolving all these issues.  --[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 16:37, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

== Climate change influence ==

I am sure the bad atmosphere (contamination) in Mexico has influence in the appearing of the swine influenza. --[[Special:Contributions/147.84.132.44|147.84.132.44]] ([[User talk:147.84.132.44|talk]]) 12:37, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

:I am confused. You propose that this be added to the article? I might buy that air pollution could weaken the immune system of the potential host but would doubt it actually strengthens the virus itself. I would also believe this to be the case for any viral infection. (Note: I am no expert in the field, merely a critical thinker.) -- [[User:Wguynes|Wguynes]] ([[User talk:Wguynes|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Wguynes|contribs]]) 13:02, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
Climate change and air-pollution in Mexico City are different things.  Carbon dioxide is not directly harmful to animals. [[User:Daniel.Cardenas|Daniel.Cardenas]] ([[User talk:Daniel.Cardenas|talk]]) 03:15, 29 April 2009 (UTC)

== wiki page ==

This appears to be a wiki page [http://www.cdc.gov/swineflu/?s_cid=swineflu_001 here].  Isn't that cool? [[Special:Contributions/128.231.77.40|128.231.77.40]] ([[User talk:128.231.77.40|talk]]) 14:13, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

== WARNING: Google Map could be wrong and misleading ==

In external links there is one for a 'Google Map' H1N1 Swine Flu, who is posted by ''' Henry Niman''' who is well known for '''exagerated and false claims''' in previous epidemics.  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/193.175.8.13|193.175.8.13]] ([[User talk:193.175.8.13|talk]]) 14:20, 28 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== RS dump by Kilbad ==

The following sources are a data dump provided by [[User:Kilbad|Kilbad]] on the article;  they are moved here because they are not strictly further reading but rather possible sources that have not yet been used.  --[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 14:36, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

* {{cite journal |author=Van Reeth K |title=Avian and swine influenza viruses: our current understanding of the zoonotic risk |journal=Vet. Res. |volume=38 |issue=2 |pages=243–60 |year=2007 |pmid=17257572 |doi=10.1051/vetres:2006062 |url=}}

* {{cite journal |author=Hampson AW, Mackenzie JS |title=The influenza viruses |journal=Med. J. Aust. |volume=185 |issue=10 Suppl |pages=S39–43 |year=2006 |month=November |pmid=17115950 |doi= |url=http://www.mja.com.au/public/issues/185_10_201106/ham10884_fm.html}}

* {{cite journal |author=Lipatov AS, Govorkova EA, Webby RJ, ''et al.'' |title=Influenza: emergence and control |journal=J. Virol. |volume=78 |issue=17 |pages=8951–9 |year=2004 |month=September |pmid=15308692 |pmc=506949 |doi=10.1128/JVI.78.17.8951-8959.2004 |url=}}

* {{cite journal |author=Reid AH, Taubenberger JK |title=The origin of the 1918 pandemic influenza virus: a continuing enigma |journal=J. Gen. Virol. |volume=84 |issue=Pt 9 |pages=2285–92 |year=2003 |month=September |pmid=12917448 |doi= |url=http://vir.sgmjournals.org/cgi/pmidlookup?view=long&pmid=12917448}}

* {{cite journal |author=Taubenberger JK, Reid AH, Janczewski TA, Fanning TG |title=Integrating historical, clinical and molecular genetic data in order to explain the origin and virulence of the 1918 Spanish influenza virus |journal=Philos. Trans. R. Soc. Lond., B, Biol. Sci. |volume=356 |issue=1416 |pages=1829–39 |year=2001 |month=December |pmid=11779381 |pmc=1088558 |doi=10.1098/rstb.2001.1020 |url=}}

* {{cite journal |author=Alexander DJ |title=Ecological aspects of influenza A viruses in animals and their relationship to human influenza: a review |journal=J R Soc Med |volume=75 |issue=10 |pages=799–811 |year=1982 |month=October |pmid=6752410 |pmc=1438138 |doi= |url=}}

* {{cite journal |author=Winkler WG |title=Influenza in animals: its possible public health significance |journal=J. Wildl. Dis. |volume=6 |issue=4 |pages=239–42; discussion 247–8 |year=1970 |month=October |pmid=16512120 |doi= |url=http://www.jwildlifedis.org/cgi/pmidlookup?view=long&pmid=16512120}}

* {{cite journal |author=de Jong JC, Smith DJ, Lapedes AS, ''et al.'' |title=Antigenic and genetic evolution of swine influenza A (H3N2) viruses in Europe |journal=J. Virol. |volume=81 |issue=8 |pages=4315–22 |year=2007 |month=April |pmid=17287258 |pmc=1866135 |doi=10.1128/JVI.02458-06 |url=}}

* {{cite journal |author=Taubenberger JK, Morens DM |title=The pathology of influenza virus infections |journal=Annu Rev Pathol |volume=3 |issue= |pages=499–522 |year=2008 |pmid=18039138 |pmc=2504709 |doi=10.1146/annurev.pathmechdis.3.121806.154316 |url=}}

* {{cite book |last=Fineberg |first=Harvey V. |coauthors=Richard E. Neustadt |title=The Swine Flu Affair |publisher=U.S. Department of Health, Education, and Welfare |date=1978 |url=http://www.iom.edu/swinefluaffair}}

== Swine Flu - Vitamin D - Weather ==


Swine flu is most common in the winter and spring months (see http://healthandsurvival.com/2009/04/25/swine-flu-symptoms-how-to-protect-yourself/).  In this matter it is similar to other strains of influenza, which can easily be beaten by vitamin D supplementation (see http://www.healthy.net/scr/news.asp?Id=8826 and http://www.lewrockwell.com/miller/miller27.html).  There are no studies specifically related to swine flu and Vitamin D.[[Special:Contributions/190.232.104.79|190.232.104.79]] ([[User talk:190.232.104.79|talk]]) 14:42, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

:How many errors here? Neither link nor the original paper they refer to claims that flu "can easily be beaten by vitamin D". Both links simply refer to a paper hypothesizing that vitamin D deficiency might contribute to late winter flu susceptibility. This is an interesting hypothesis and one might infer that, if correct, taking extra vitamin D during the winter might reduce one's chance of getting the flu. However, the paper does not claim that vitamin D can "beat" the flu if you have it. One, if not both, of the links are typical vax-quack sites that will will uncritically repeat any piece of evidence that supports their propaganda mission. [[User:Alteripse|alteripse]] ([[User talk:Alteripse|talk]]) 17:51, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

== Drug resistance ==

The 2009 outbreak of swine influenza has been documented to be resistant to the adamantane antiviral medications: amantadine and rimantadine. 
Source: CDC website - recommendations

:Yes, already covered in the first sentence of the treatment section. [[User:TimVickers|Tim Vickers]] ([[User talk:TimVickers|talk]]) 16:25, 28 April 2009 (UTC)


== Peru rejects swine flu in five cases after analysis ==

In this moment there are not suspects of swine flu in [[Peru]], and the suspect peruvian woman came from Cancun, Mexico was not swine flu. Update the map.

Read Reuters article from 1 hour ago: [http://lta.reuters.com/article/domesticNews/idLTASIE53R18420090428]
--[[User:EdwinJs|EdwinJs]] ([[User talk:EdwinJs|talk]]) 16:53, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

:This kind of information is being gathered on Wikipedia [[Template talk:2009 swine flu outbreak table|here]].  --[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 18:04, 28 April 2009 (UTC)


== Good article for referencing? ===
This a good one? http://www.cygy.com/2009/04/swine-flu-is-now-global-epidemic_27.html [[Special:Contributions/70.68.139.248|70.68.139.248]] ([[User talk:70.68.139.248|talk]]) 19:13, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
:It is a blog, so probably not. Try referencing the BBC article he got his facts from. [[User:Edison|Edison]] ([[User talk:Edison|talk]]) 19:38, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

== Cleanup ==

The article contains a big cleanup header but no specific talk page discussion here... can we remove it? Seems more like a disclaimer, which are discouraged. --[[User:Stevenfruitsmaak|Steven Fruitsmaak]] <small>([[User_talk:Stevenfruitsmaak|Reply]])</small> 19:50, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

:A bit out of date now, I've removed it. [[User:TimVickers|Tim Vickers]] ([[User talk:TimVickers|talk]]) 19:53, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

There has been many confirmed cases. Where I live in South Carolina there are two confirmed cases and a school in Newberry, South Carolina has been closed because of the outbreak.  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/98.71.183.113|98.71.183.113]] ([[User talk:98.71.183.113|talk]]) 22:03, 28 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

Copied South Carolina info to [[Talk:2009 swine flu outbreak in the United States]].  --[[User:Una Smith|Una Smith]] ([[User talk:Una Smith|talk]]) 22:19, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

== Swine Flu  Userbox ==

Use this template to put the userbox on your page<nowiki>{{Tl:User Swine Flu}}</nowiki><br />
{{Template:User Swine Flu}}
[[User:Drew R. Smith|Drew R. Smith]] ([[User talk:Drew R. Smith|talk]]) 22:24, 28 April 2009 (UTC)

== Background section  ==

the reference linked after the mention of a 1977 re-emergance is invalid - the only reference to 1977 in the linked article is yet another link from that article to another.  do we actually have a decent reference, linking swine flu to the spanish flu of 1918 that we can put in this section at all?  if not, why is there any reference to spanish flu at all except as a "see also" section?  [[User:Whitehatnetizen|Whitehatnetizen]] ([[User talk:Whitehatnetizen|talk]]) 11:48, 29 April 2009 (UTC)