Wikipedia:Multilingual coordination: Difference between revisions

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Wiki encyclopedias have been started in other languages:

Arabic (Araby)
Catalan (Catalan)
Chinese (Hanyu)
Dutch (Nederlands)
German (Deutsch)
Esperanto
French (Français)
Hebrew (Ivrit)
Hungarian (Magyar)
Italian (Italiano)
Japanese (Nihongo)
Portuguese (Português)
Russian (Russkiy)
Spanish (Castellano)
Swedish (Svensk)

A certain amount of "critical mass" is necessary in order for a wiki to "take off". Without 5-10 people eagerly writing and arguing and playing with each other, it wouldn't be as much fun. So we encourage anyone who wants to build a wiki in their own language to also go out and announce/recruit for it. :-)

Here are some "international Wikipedia" policy questions. To a certain extent, these questions will resolve themselves, though.

How are the various Wikipedias going to be coordinated, if at all? Will we have several quite different articles in different languages? Will English be a lingua franca? See /Coordination to discuss.

What are some suggestions about what can be put on new language Wikipedia home pages? See /Homepages to discuss.

What are some suggestions about how to use "international Wikipedias" for purposes of Nupedia article translation projects? See /Nupedia Translation to discuss.

I have just noticed the fact that the top and bottom bars are in english. Can something be done about that?

Those lines come from a configuration file that the public can't access (I believe). Send translations to mailto:jasonr@bomis.com, and I will update them. Please see /TextToTranslate for a list of phrases that need translated

Anything else?

We would like to solicit your help.

On some of our International Wikipedia wikis, we have not yet translated the copyright warning into the target languages.

Here is the text of the warning:

Please notice that all contributions to Wikipedia are considered to be released under the GNU Free Documentation License. If you don't want your writing to be edited mercilessly and redistributed at will, then don't hit submit. You are also promising us that you wrote this yourself, or copied it from a public domain resource. DO NOT USE COPYRIGHTED WORK WITHOUT PERMISSION!

Here are the languages we need this in:

http://ar.wikipedia.com/ Arabic (Araby)

http://ca.wikipedia.com/ Catalan (Catalan)

http://zh.wikipedia.com/ Chinese (Hanyu)

http://de.wikipedia.com/ German (Deutsch)

http://nl.wikipedia.com/ Dutch (Nederlands)

http://eo.wikipedia.com/ Esperanto

http://fr.wikipedia.com/ French (Français)

http://he.wikipedia.com/ Hebrew (Ivrit)

http://hu.wikipedia.com/ Hungarian (Magyar)

http://it.wikipedia.com/ Italian (Italiano)

http://ja.wikipedia.com/ Japanese (Nihongo)

http://pt.wikipedia.com/ Portuguese (Português)

http://ru.wikipedia.com/ Russian (Russkiy)

http://es.wikipedia.com/ Spanish (Castellano)

http://sv.wikipedia.com/ Swedish (Svensk)]

Please, send translations of this very important text by e-mail to jasonr at bomis.com. Thanks! --LMS

/Talk

@@ Line 1: / Line 1: @@
 Wiki encyclopedias have been started in other languages:
-<b>[http://ca.wikipedia.com/ Catalan (Catalan)] -- [http://zh.wikipedia.com/ Chinese (Hanyu)] -- [http://de.wikipedia.com/ German (Deutsch)] -- [http://eo.wikipedia.com/ Esperanto] -- [http://fr.wikipedia.com/ French (Français)] -- [http://he.wikipedia.com/ Hebrew (Ivrit)] -- [http://it.wikipedia.com/ Italian (Italiano)] -- [http://ja.wikipedia.com/ Japanese (Nihongo)] -- [http://pt.wikipedia.com/ Portuguese (Português)] -- [http://ru.wikipedia.com/ Russian (Russkiy)] -- [http://es.wikipedia.com/ Spanish (Castellano)] -- [http://sv.wikipedia.com/ Swedish (Svensk)]</b>
-A certain amount of "critical mass" is necessary in order for a wiki to "take off". Without 5-10 people eagerly writing and arguing and playing with each other, it wouldn't be as much fun. So we encourage anyone who wants to build a wiki in their own language to also go out and announce/recruit for it. :-)
+<b>
-Here are some "international Wikipedia" policy questions. To a certain extent, these questions will resolve themselves, though.
-* How are the various Wikipedias going to be coordinated, if at all? Will we have several quite different articles in different languages? Will English be a ''lingua franca''? See /Coordination to discuss.
-* What are some suggestions about what can be put on new language Wikipedia home pages? See /Homepages to discuss.
-* What are some suggestions about how to use "international Wikipedias" for purposes of [[Nupedia]] article translation projects? See [[/Nupedia Translation]] to discuss.
-* I have just noticed the fact that the top and bottom bars are in english. Can something be done about that?
-: Those lines come from a configuration file that the public can't access (I believe). Send translations to mailto:jasonr@bomis.com, and I will update them. Please see /TextToTranslate for a list of phrases that need translated
-* Anything else?
-----
-'''Please suggest new language Wikipedias below!'''
+* [http://ar.wikipedia.com/ Arabic (Araby)]
-Dutch!
+* [http://ca.wikipedia.com/ Catalan (Catalan)]
-'''Hungarian !''' mailto:markongabor@hotmail.com
-----
+* [http://zh.wikipedia.com/ Chinese (Hanyu)]
-Might I suggest that the international Wikis be given a distinctive logo, or background color, or something else so that navigating among them becomes easier? Hopping back and forth is difficult (also the German homepage does not have a link to the English homepage). Finally, we may want to come up with some semi-automated process to create pages that refer back to the English versions. For example, until we have some Spanish contributors, I'd like be able to create pages such as ''Ahora no hay página española en este tema. Usted puede desear leer el artículo (link) en inglés. Si usted puede, ayudarnos traduciendo estos artículos.''; Perhaps we could just replace the "Describe the new page here" text? --[[Lee Daniel Crocker|LDC]]
-:I think it's just a matter of sending Toan or Jason an appropriate logo to upload, and also supplying them with the non-English text to use (and where it goes).
+* [http://nl.wikipedia.com/ Dutch (Nederlands)]
-----
-I think a way should be worked out to allow non-english characters in article names; otherwise it will become a thorny issue later. There are, of course, cases where the absence of an accent, tilde, or umlaut changes a meaning completely. Imagine the unintential hilarity of entries such as ''Cien anos de soledad.'' Also, it may eventually cause confusion over names, thought I can't think of any examples right offhand. And, as a courtesy, could we translate "edit text of this page," "RecentChanges," "HomePage," etc. to the appropriate language for each non-English branch?
-:This would be a good thing to bring up on [[feature requests]].
+* [http://de.wikipedia.com/ German (Deutsch)]
-For most ISO-8859-1 characters (most European languages), the only thing that is needed is to enable the <code>$NonEnglish</code> setting in the configuration file. (Some languages like Polish need other characters which would require a bit more work.) --CliffordAdams
+* [http://eo.wikipedia.com/ Esperanto]
-I made this change in the configuration files. I don't know if it is now working or not. Anybody? -- JasonR
+* [http://fr.wikipedia.com/ French (Français)]
+* [http://he.wikipedia.com/ Hebrew (Ivrit)]
+* [http://hu.wikipedia.com/ Hungarian (Magyar)]
-It will indeed now let me correctly title the '''Cómo se edita una página''' page, but the links to it don't show up right away (that's another problem already being worked on). Also, the URLs seem to have unprotected and untranslated non-ASCII characters in them (e.g. <code>http://es.wikipedia.com/wiki.cgi?Cómo_se_edita_una_página</code>), which is a bad idea in the long run. HTML4 recommends that they first be translated into UTF-8, then URL-encoded. It's probably OK to do it the way it is for now, and then do the fix automatically later (which is doable so long as we don't create any Wikis in languages outside of the ISO-8859-1 set). So for now Dr. Erdem is out of luck (can't do Turkish until we have this working correctly), but everyone else can create good content. -- LDC
+* [http://it.wikipedia.com/ Italian (Italiano)]
-----
-Also, the [[http://es.wikipedia.com/wiki.cgi?RecentChanges RecentChanges link at the Spanish branch]] does not update, or at least does not update within four hours.--KQ
-:Whoa, that's a problem. Guys??
-Toan: I just checked the [[http://es.wikipedia.com/wiki.cgi?RecentChanges RecentChanges link at the Spanish branch]] and tried to change something on it, it's fine now. I'm not sure why it didn't work before.
-:''It still doesn't work, sorry. :-) It doesn't keep track of minor edits. --KQ''
-:Apparently, minor edits are not supposed to go into the RecentChanges page. You mark them 'minor' because you don't want people to think that the page has been changed significantly enough to warrant another look. If you want it to be in RecentChanges, your best bet is not to mark it as a minor edit. --JasonR-
-:''No, that's not it exactly, though it made me realize what the problem was. Each language Wikipedia has its own preferences and sets its own cookies, independently of the others. I can see the minor edits now, after changing the Preferences from es.wikipedia.com.- -KQ.''
-----
-I just read that the Wikipedia config file has an option ($NONENGLISH) that allows the usage of special characters (umlauts, accented letters) in links. Do you think this could be activated for the International Wikipedias (last time I checked de.wikipedia, it didn't work, so I guess it is not activated yet...) --SoniC
+* [http://ja.wikipedia.com/ Japanese (Nihongo)]
-I just created the '''Kurt Gödel''' page (just a stub--sorry, my German isn't up to a full article) with no problem. The Spanish one works too, so KQ doesn't have to write a ''cien anos'' article :-) (For the non-Spanish speakers here who don't get the joke, KQ points out a good example of the importance of diacriticals. In most Spanish text they don't make much difference, and even native speakers frequently leave them out, but the "año/ano" distinction makes a difference: "Tengo 40 años" means "I am 40 years old"; "Tengo 40 anos" means "I have 40 anuses".) --[[Lee Daniel Crocker|LDC]]
+* [http://pt.wikipedia.com/ Portuguese (Português)]
-Hey, cool, it really seems to work now. Thanks, guys :-) --Sonic
-----
+* [http://ru.wikipedia.com/ Russian (Russkiy)]
-I may have spoken too soon. It appears that URLs in the form <code>".../wiki.cgi?Kurt_Gödel"</code> work fine, but URLs in the form <code>".../wiki/Kurt_Gödel"</code> do not (at least on my Father's Windows box I'm using now), and some links are the latter form. The latter form does work if encoded as <code>".../wiki/Kurt_G%F6del"</code> (Same results on the Spanish site). I'm not sure who's at fault here; well, that's not quite right. We're at fault for using illegal URLs, but the fact that we get away with it in some places and not others I don't know the reason for. At any rate, I suppose we need to do this right sooner than I expected. --[[Lee Daniel Crocker|LDC]]
-----
-As you might have seen on [[Wikipedia-L]], our man Jason (as in "Jason, Jason, he's our man, if he can't do it, nobody can!") is going to update the wiki software that runs all the Wikipedias (interesting how "Wikipedia" has, overnight, become the name of a type). I asked him to switch this setting on, or keep it switched on, and pay attention to this page... --[[LMS]]
-----
-<complaint>
-The links on the German Wikipedia still don't work:-(
-WojPob</complaint>
-----
-Everything seems to be working now!!!! WTG Jason! (or whoever fixed it!) --AstroNomer
+* [http://es.wikipedia.com/ Spanish (Castellano)]
-Also, the new wiki canonization is working in the spanish wikipedia (at least).
+* [http://sv.wikipedia.com/ Swedish (Svensk)]
-...Which resulted in "losing" pages with lowercase names; this needs to be resolved before doing it to the main Wikipedia. Also, the created links now use the ".../wiki.cgi?" URL form which seems to work with foreign characters, but the URLs themselves are still illegal, so this is only an interim solution. --[[Lee Daniel Crocker|LDC]]
+</b>
-What I would do (if I thought this would solve the problem...) would be to search for all pages, and just scan through them for all the pages (which are all SUBpages, right?) that begin with lower-case letters. Then just change them to uppercase letters. --[[LMS]]
-Aha, but the one link (which does lead to some text) on ru.wikipedia.com still does not show up as a link. And de.wikipedia.com links are still not working either! --[[LMS]]
-It's not just subpages, but every page with more than a one-word title where any words begin with lowercase. --LDC
+A certain amount of "critical mass" is necessary in order for a wiki to "take off". Without 5-10 people eagerly writing and arguing and playing with each other, it wouldn't be as much fun. So we encourage anyone who wants to build a wiki in their own language to also go out and announce/recruit for it. :-)
+Here are some "international Wikipedia" policy questions. To a certain extent, these questions will resolve themselves, though.
+* How are the various Wikipedias going to be coordinated, if at all? Will we have several quite different articles in different languages? Will English be a ''lingua franca''? See /Coordination to discuss.
+* What are some suggestions about what can be put on new language Wikipedia home pages? See /Homepages to discuss.
+* What are some suggestions about how to use "international Wikipedias" for purposes of [[Nupedia]] article translation projects? See [[/Nupedia Translation]] to discuss.
+* I have just noticed the fact that the top and bottom bars are in english. Can something be done about that?
+: Those lines come from a configuration file that the public can't access (I believe). Send translations to mailto:jasonr@bomis.com, and I will update them. Please see /TextToTranslate for a list of phrases that need translated
+* Anything else?
 ----
-It looks to me like the linking problem is fixed (I tested this on two of
-the wikis), and the new wikis are using the parentheses. Could you help us
-test this by going there and writing something (with parentheses)? --[[LMS]]
-----
 We would like to solicit your help.
 On some of our International Wikipedia wikis, we have not yet translated the copyright warning into the target languages.
 Here is the text of the warning:
 Please notice that all contributions to Wikipedia are considered to be released under the GNU Free Documentation License. If you don't want your writing to be edited mercilessly and redistributed at will, then don't hit submit. You are also promising us that you wrote this yourself, or copied it from a public domain resource. DO NOT USE COPYRIGHTED WORK WITHOUT PERMISSION!
 Here are the languages we need this in:
+:http://ar.wikipedia.com/ Arabic (Araby)
 :http://ca.wikipedia.com/ Catalan (Catalan)
 :http://zh.wikipedia.com/ Chinese (Hanyu)
 :http://de.wikipedia.com/ German (Deutsch)
+:http://nl.wikipedia.com/ Dutch (Nederlands)
 :http://eo.wikipedia.com/ Esperanto
 :http://fr.wikipedia.com/ French (Français)
 :http://he.wikipedia.com/ Hebrew (Ivrit)
+:http://hu.wikipedia.com/ Hungarian (Magyar)
 :http://it.wikipedia.com/ Italian (Italiano)
 :http://ja.wikipedia.com/ Japanese (Nihongo)
 :http://pt.wikipedia.com/ Portuguese (Português)
 :http://ru.wikipedia.com/ Russian (Russkiy)
 :http://es.wikipedia.com/ Spanish (Castellano)
 :http://sv.wikipedia.com/ Swedish (Svensk)]
-Please, send translations of this very important text to jasonr at bomis.com. Thanks! --[[LMS]]
-----
-I would send this directly to jasonr but it's been about 3 years since I spoke Spanish, so for me translating anything is a slow process, usually with idiosyncratic results. Anyway, here's my stab at a Spanish translation; if you'd like something hilarious, run it through babelfish to get the english version. :-)
+Please, send translations of this very important text by e-mail to jasonr at bomis.com. Thanks! --[[LMS]]
-:Note por favor que cada contribución que a wikipidia se considera publicada bajo las condiciones de "GNU Free Documentation License." Si Ud. no quiere que su escritura se
-edite sin misericordia y se distribuya a voluntad, ¡no presione
-"Save"!. Usted también nos asegura que escribió esto usted mismo, o lo copió de una fuente de dominio publico ("public domain"). ¡No USE TRABAJO REGISTRADO EN EL REGISTRO DE LA PROPIEDAD LITERARIA SIN PERMISO!
-And I am submitting this here in hopes that someone more fluent than I can make corrections before it goes on to jasonr. --KQ
 ----
-This would be the French version, but it needs a little work before it is of final quality.
+/Talk
-Attention : Tous articles envoyés à la Wikipedia, ils sont considérés comme publier sous les termes  de la «GNU Free Documentation License», une licence de documentation libre. Si vous ne vouliez pas vos écrits qui sont édités sans mercie et distributés à volonté, ne soumettez pas. Vous nous promettez aussi que vous-même avez écrit cet article ou que vous avez copié cet article d'une ressource sans copyright.  N'UTILISEZ PAS DE TRAVAUX AVEC COPYRIGHT SANS PERMISSION !