Wikipedia:Deletion review/Log/2011 November 6

6 November 2011

Death Valley Driver Video Review

Death Valley Driver Video Review (talk|edit|history|logs|links|watch) (XfD|restore)

I did not understand why TParis (talk · contribs) closed Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Death Valley Driver Video Review (5th nomination) as no consensus instead of delete and discussed his closure with him here. He noted that he gave significant weight to the assertion that notability is inherited.

He wrote, "The keep !voters base their rationale on the presumption of notable. The delete !voters argue against the google sources but don't even address that the website has interviewed notable people which leaves the presumption of sources." and "It's not inherited. It's presumed to have it's own notability based on the interviews of notable people."

The assertion that the delete side did not address whether notability is inherited from the website's having interviewed people is incorrect:

1. Msquared3 (talk · contribs) wrote, "Also, I could be wrong, but I don't think conducting interviews with notable subjects is a criterion used by Wikipedia to determine if a subject is 'notable.'"
2. Suriel1981 (talk · contribs) wrote, "It's a case of notability not being inherited from celebrities interviewed by the site. After all, famous people do interviews all the time across the range of media."
3. I noted that the notability guideline WP:NWEB#No inherited notability states that association with notable people does not confer notability upon websites. I wrote, "DVDVR does not inherit notability from notable interviewees. The site itself has not received notice anywhere; thus, DVDVR is not notable."

After a relist, two editors (Neutrality and LibStar) were unswayed by the notability-is-inherited argument and implicitly rejected it by supporting deletion.

I base this DRV nomination on the reasoning that TParis gave too much weight to the assertion of a single editor, Dream Focus (talk · contribs), that notability was inherited from the interviewing of notable subjects.

Three editors explicitly rejected the notability-is-inherited argument, and two others did so implicitly. Had other editors supported Dream Focus' position that notability is inherited, TParis' argument that "there is a persumption of notability [based on inheritance]" might have merit. No one else—not even the other "keep" editors—supported this strand of reasoning. Overturn to delete. Goodvac (talk) 03:34, 6 November 2011 (UTC)

• Since I have been asked to comment, I declined a prod on this article as it had earlier survived AFD debates, proving that it was controversial to delete and would need a discussion to resolve this. I did not believe myself that it should be deleted, so I did not start an AFD. I even asked for the article to be retained in the debate. I think that the close as no consensus describes what is the true result of the debate. There is no clear conclusion to delete and neither to keep. Neither of the sides convinced the others that they were right. I still maintain that there are enough independent sources to show GNG satisfaction. WP:stick may apply here. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 04:01, 6 November 2011 (UTC)
• Endorse Looking through the discussion, I see both sides making reasonable arguments. Two of the early delete votes were relatively straight !votes without further discussion, one of which seemed to fundamentally misunderstand the notability criteria. There are 3 book sources that were raised by the keep side, and were never directly addressed by the delete supporters. I think net, the deletion side had stronger arguments, but not so much stronger as to overcome the numerical distribution of support. It is a close enough call that I think the discretion of the closer should be respected. I think a new AfD would be reasonable, particularly if the nominator addressed the viability of the book sources when it comes to notability. Monty₈₄₅ 04:18, 6 November 2011 (UTC)