Talk:Gohan

/Archive 1

"Gold" or "Golden" Fighter?

Both terms are present in the article. Which is correct? Paul Haymon 06:18, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

I specifically remember "Gold Fighter", not "Golden Fighter". --Majinvegeta 23:40, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Aye. I believe it was "Gold Fighter" as well.--$UIT 00:58, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

In that case I will change all instances of "Golden" to "Gold". Thanks. Paul Haymon 01:14, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

Gohan age edit war.

Ok this little edit war situation about Gohan’s age during the Cell saga is really nerveraking. First off via the manga old and newly revised, and the Daizenshuu, (no Funimation versions are used to edit Dragon Ball articles) Gohan is 4 at the beginning of DBZ, between the beginning of DBZ and the beginning of the Android saga is roughly 2 years which makes him 6 to 6 1/2 years old at the beginning of that saga. Now from three years later he is 9 repeat 9 years old. Now because of the Room of Spirit and Time there is a big debate on if he considered a year old. Figuratively speaking yes but since only one day actually past Gohan in the manga considered 9 but since the anime which has been given actual dated timeline via Daizenshuu gave Gohan a birthday during the 10 day wait before the Cell Games. Gohan via the anime is 10 when he defeats Cell. With that now it is time to let you see how wrong some of you are in your conquest to change Gohan from 9 (10) to 10 (11), do the math. Manga and Japanese original dialoged anime Gohan at the beginning of the Buu saga is 16 years old. Repeat 16 years old. Now as the manga goes 9 years + 7 years = 16 years old. So as the manga goes it does not even consider Gohan's time in the RoSat part of his age. Japanese original dialog anime which was given dates via Daizenshuu which I will reshow you will show Gohan was not 11 years when he fought and defeated Cell.

• 757 A.D. May, Son Gohan was born (actual date is never show but is between the 16th and the 26th of May. (The 10 days before the Cell games and Toei studios gave Gohan his birthday sometime between these days)
• 767 A.D. May 26th, the Cell games begins and Cell’s defeat (in the original DB manga it was the 17th of May) roughly 10 years later.
• 774 A.D. April 7th, the beginning of the Buu saga (Gohan's first day of high school) Look at the date. Not even a full 7 years yet so the still makes Gohan 16 years old
• 774 A.D. May 8th, the defeat of Majin Buu. Since the date Buu was defeated still is not a complete 7 year from Gohan birthday as well as the defeat of Cell Gohan is still 16 years old.

Funimation messed up because even in the Great Saiyaman saga and the Budokai Tenkaichi games (A Funimation project game) they even state Gohan was 16 years old so how can a 10 year old or a 11 year old Gohan be 16 years old 7 years later? He can't, he would be 17 or 18 years old which he clearly is not by not just the manga and japanese original anime but even Funimation. So stop editing the mistakes Funimation made. Sorry for the long statement but it is getting really painstaking editing when someone always editing Gohan’s age. Heat P 02:18, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

I agree with you, Gohan is 9 (10 if you include the year in RoSaT). I have noticed this edit war, I just stupidly ignored it. --Majinvegeta 02:23, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

Mystic Gohan vs Super Saiyan

I would like to discuss the Mystic Gohan form with my two issues: 1)The rumour that if Gohan turns Super Saiyan at his Mystic form, the Earth will explode. First of all, I don't know which idiot put that on the article as it is found nowhere in the Anime or Manga, or even stated by Toriyama. Second of all, that statement alone iss a stupid rumor invented by dorks such as yourself (whoever you are) as far as 1998, as a means to explain why Gohan looked normal, instead of use Super Saiyan, while others were(and its variations). Please don't put this as fact. People are trying to read.

2)"When Gohan is told to go Super Saiyan, he releases so much power it even amazes Elder Kai" Blah, blah, blah. May I also add that since Gohan was 10 (11 in the anime), he was able to transform into a Super Saiyan instanteously, meaning what you wrote was garbage. So I have done the favour of editing it (including that Super Saiyan blow up the Earth dribble). Also, if Gohan was the strongest unfused warrior in the manga, 1) Why didn't Toriyama himself say so, instead of get your sources from the Daizenshuu? 2) Why didn't he instead fight Kid Buu instead of Goku? (Not necessairly saying Kid Buu is Buu's mightiest form but you get my point), and 3) How can he be the strongest if he's stopped fighting for 10 years, while Goku was training continuously? By then coomon sense must prevail that even if he was the strongest unfused character by the time Kid Buu was defeated, he would be weaker as he stopped training, while Goku kept improving, and even then Uub was still able to rival him. Therefore I keep editing "Gohan is the strongest unfused character in the series". Also count DBGT (lLord's know why they even made that series). He can't possibly be the strongest character in the series, since he gets his butt kicked half the time! That title goes to Super Saiyan 4 Gogeta (which is basically a serious movie fusion of Goku and Vegeta adapted to be an unorginal version of Vegetto, with the "popular" Super Saiyan 4 form. Don't my word for it. go to this[1] for more information on Mystic Gohan/Super Saiyan controversy. However don't expect it to explain why Gohan didn't use the Mystic form rather his Super Saiyan form. My guess is the the staff who created DBGT (which doesn't include Toriyama) were being ignorant and negelectful and foolish, and left many subjects out and made up its own stories based on the anime and manga without even referring to it, thus its many inconsistencies. Uglyguy2006

If it doesn't state it at/in an official source, then it can't be added. Wikipedia is not a fan site, it is intended to exclusively state official information, not "rumors" and speculation. And the "rumor" of the earth Blowing up if he turned Super Saiyan is just that, a rumor, which in the mighty-ness of Wikipedia rules, that equates as speculation, therefor is not allowed in the article. And Kid Buu is not the strongest form of Buu, Buu with Gohan absorbed is. And there is nothing that states if Gohan stopped training in the years after Kid Buu's appearance; but I agree, there is nothing to say that he did train. I agree with UglyGuy about the GT staff being neglectful. There are several (actually more then several) other flaws in GT that I can easily point out, however, this is not the place or the time. --MajinVegeta 22:06, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

...And another thing I must point out, Gohan IS the strongest "single" Character at the end of the Buu Saga, as stated by the Daizenshuus. I've had to change that for the billionth time, he is not "one of the strongest", he IS the strongest. Both Toriyama and the Daizenshuus stated it, and Toei messed it up in the Anime by implying that Goku was. --MajinVegeta 22:19, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Let me answer these questions or responed to some of the comments by Ugly2006. For the first parts of you statement I agree with. putting all that rumors and speculation in the article is wrong and violates Wiki-policy. However it is time to hit the comments and questions you asked. First off I will start with Gohan's age---read the above section again. It is 9(manga) 10(anime) please don't try to bring that up again like that to show you want to use Funimation editing. If you feel he was 10(11) bring it up in the above section, not to sneak it in in anonther discussion. Next the statement about Gohan the strongest unfused character. Well unfused can actually mean two things. The first is what most people see it as. Gohan as a single character is on par with fused character. For instants he surpassed SSJ3 Gotenks who was basically even with Buu and Gohan excuse my language, Tore off in Buu's ass until Buu absorbed Gotenks and Buu was off in Gohan's ass. Now it can also mean that Gohan is the only mega-strong character to never fuse which is the way you are going. So with that it is possible for Goku and Vegeta to surpass Gohan later as they have and have fused before still leaving Gohan with the title the strongest unfused character. Kind of far fech but it's a possiblity. Hope you and others are getting what I am saying. Why Toriyama did not say that himself? You got to do some reseach. Akira Toriyama did in fact say that himself in his own words. It was in a interview with Shonen Jump(Japan version) and it was stated by him. Also Daizenshuu books are mainly done by his staff but has his final approval before they got published as it has is name on every last book. Plus he does do some work in the Daizenshuus. So it turn it is another way to say he did say that as he was the final approval for the book publishing. Why Gohan did not fight Buu. Really simple. The Japanese public had in Goku as the main fighteing character for DB period but many times Toriyama wanted Gohan to take the spotlight but with Goku popularity so high he continued with him. After Cells defeat A.T. tried to put Gohan as the main fighter and created Goten as a new start for Goku's look but Goten's likeness to his dad did not help and the public wanted Goku back so he got brought back. As the Buu saga neared its end A.T. was going to use Gohan to defeat Buu but again popularity set in and Shonen Jump sales during that time was going down so Gohan was killed, and Goku defeated Buu. That is the main reason why Goku beat Buu, also that is not specualtion, that is fact. Look it up. And one other thing this saying about Akira Toriyama did not work on GT is WRONG A.T. decided to end DB but since its popularity was so high Toei ask him to do another which he say no more mangas but gave rights to do another anime series to Toei. Then he was asked he can come up with so idea for the show with he agreed to do and as most people may not know it was Akira Toriyama that gave DB GT its name. Yes Akira Toriyama gave Dragon Ball Grand Tour its name. As well as character designs for new characters like Gill, Gave most of the main and big supporting DB cast their clothing designs. Also yes at the beginning of GT they had some nice size plotholes like Pilaf, Gohan, and many other but there are just as many in DBZ from the original DB but since most Americans had came up with DBZ first you feel it is the complete truth when its not but thats for another time. Now Gohan again. Yes GT throws out Gohan's mystic ability for the popular SSJ forms. Why? As we said before we don't know and may never know. But it was last said by Rou Dai Kaioshin that Gohan had to power up like a Super Saiyan, not to transform into one. It never said that Gohan lost his SSJ power or that it was power different from the SSJ forms. Meaning Gohan has two different powers and can chose to use either one unlike SSJ forms that are different stages of the same form which is the same power multiplied. Remember U.Gohan's powers are his normal powers maxed out do to his hidden potential that grew with him in power and unleashed. So if you think about it (this is opinion now) if you had the ability to transform in to a powerful being but found out later that you normal power now suppass your tranformed powers by 10 folds would you use the transformed state or you normal powers? That can be taking into account about Gohan as AT may have wanted it. That all.Heat P 09:31, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

You have REALLY done all your reaseach Heat! All of that you just posted was what I read too about Toriyama. He persistently wanted Gohan (his fav character) as the main character, but everybody wanted Goku to stay the main character, so he created Goten, but everybody still wanted Goku. But since Gohan was his fav character, he made him the strongest single character. And I had a shonen Jump Interview with Toriyama that stated some of those things. Can't remember where it went though. --MajinVegeta 15:04, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

I'd like to thank you for clearing that up with me. heat and Majin Vegeta. I'd also like to add I didn't say that Toriyama had no involvement in GT and i'm aware that he in fact contributed to many of the designs. I thank you two for answering my dilemma. It inspires me to research further on the works of Akira Toriyama. P.S. Do note my often impolite tone is due to the frustration of people editing articles which are highly dubious. Of course some of you are guilty of that yourselves. Once again I must add I didn't say Kid Buu is the strongest form but in this article it doesn't matter. I'm really glad you cleared that up. I also goofed on Gohan's age in the manga and remembered the animes instead and I would also like to find out when Toriyama made this interview. If I wrote that Toriyama didn't take part in GT, it was by accident. And my name is UGLYGUY2006! Uglguy2006

Furthermore, I'd like to point out that I happen to rely on the manga as well thank you very much, not the anime contrary to belief. My argumeant wasn't based on the anime at all, rather the manga which is why I started this conversation. My primary point was that someone typed that if Gohan turned Super Saiyan while using his Mystic power-up the Earth will explode. My answer was that this is pure rumor and even after I started this discussion, suprise, suprise, someone goes and types it on again. I thank the person who removed it. Old Kai said for Gohan to do "that Super Saiyan thing" and Gohan achieved his Mystic power-up. Now I don't know what that means to you but to me it means his Mystic power-up as termed is his Super Saiyan fom (or at least implied). Also, even before it was finished, Gohan after waiting for more than 20 hours said his time was up, and when told it wasn't yet time, he powered up in anger. Usually when Saiyans get angry, they turn Super Saiyan. Another point is that DBGT for some unknown reason had Gohan use his Super Saiyan form even though he has the Mystic power-up. I admit that Toriyama played a part in in GT as the creator of the manga that inspired it, but even he would have him use his latent strength against enemies who are getting stronger than before which is one reason why I dislike DBGT. Also, I thank Heat P again for revealing information on Gohan being Akira Toriyama's favorite character. I also learnt that this is part of the reason why Toriyama created Goten. However, fans in Japan wanted Goku, even if Gohan released his full potential which proved his power to be greater than even Goku's. However in the end because of the fans, Goku defeated Majin Buu, instead of Gohan. Although this theory may sound far-fetched, this could be the signs similar to a retro active continuity. When the writer intends for something like say, Gohan defeating Buu then something else happenning contradicting it. In fact, Toriyama could have ended the story twice before he actually did, such as the Cell Saga when Gohan actually was the strongest warrior. Even if Gohan was the strongest unfused character by the time of Kid Buu's defeat, it should be noted that he became a scholar. I'm not entirely sur if hefound the time to train or if he was interested at all but Goku kept improving even in the peacetime. This is my l;ast point on this so if Heat P or MajinVegeta or anyone would like to reply, please do. I'd actually appreciate it. Uglyguy2006

Well, even the term "Mystic" Gohan is a fan term, there is not official Japanese or original English name for him after he has his hidden power released. And I always thought that ultimate Gohan ("mystic") WAS his Super Saiyan form. After Gohan has his power released, Old Kai tells him to attempt to transform into a Super Saiyan, but when Gohan tries to, no transformation actually happens. He stays his regular form (with slight differences) however, it's not enough to be considered a transformation. And GT facts are completely irrelevent as they: 1) aren't consistent with the base facts in DBZ, and 2) Were not Toriyama's work. (non-canon). (I'm MajinVegeta by the way, I changed my name). --VorangorTheDemon 00:26, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

Thank you Vorangor. This discussion is over. Let's not talk of this again. Think of it as my birthday present. Uglyguy2006 13:15 21 June 2007

Pictures

Even though this has nothing to do with this talk except the fact that it is about Mystic Gohan but could we please get a picture of Mystic Gohan on the Gohan page please.The K.O. King30 July 2007

I separated this talk from the previous one. I agree with you, I definintely think that a picture of him in his ultimate form is needed.--VorangorTheDemon 18:28, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Thankyou for agreeing with me. I tried to get a picture on there but apparently I can't do it.The K.O. King

I agree a picture of Gohan's Mystic form is needed (so put it up already).____MysticGohan 06:51, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Special Attacks

I deleted Energy Shield from the special attacks list. I did so for three reasons. A) I don't think it counts as one of Gohan's "special attacks" because it's a defensive move used to save people, not attack. B) It's seen in filler only. And C) It's only seen once and is a kind of freak occurence. He is shown no control over this move. If we list this then we should list what he did to Raditz early on in the series Evil Saiyan Stomache Head-Butt Blast Attack.____MysticGohan 06:50, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Wow, you're right. I guess we should go ahead and delete all the Solar Flare attacks on other pages b/c they're just defensive. Let's get rid of Master Roshi's Bankoku Bikkuri Sho attack, he only uses that one once, right? Hey while we're at it, let's completely ignore the Garlic Junior saga altogether, b/c it's not like it was actual made by Akira Toriyama. I mean, it's not like it directly correlates to a movie (Dead Zone), unlike the other movies that exist in their own continuity. Oh wait, a second, IT DOES. And I'm surprised you don't seem to think that a perfectly formed sphere of energy that Gohan actually TALKS ABOUT ("If I drop the shield, blah blah blah") is something he has no control over. Do me a favor and use LOGIC next time you decide to be a dick.TomUsedToBeRob 16:30, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Oh thank Jesus you've shown me the light. A protective sphere of energy is obviously an attack, and i'm an illogical dick. I guess I just needed someone to clearly point it out. Thank you. Go ahead and give yourself a pat on the back champ, you've earned it. But if this paricular example of ki manipulation comes from a movie it ain't the dead zone. True he does make a blue ki blast that pushes garlic into the dead zone, but that's just an uncontrolled, and it is uncontrolled he doesn't even rember who saved them, blast. I'm glad you mentioned him talking about it, if it wasn't for that i'd still be some confused jackass. And for the record I was, and still am, just trying to help.____MysticGohan 08:58, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

Looks like I have to play mommy. Check this out TomUsedToBeRob: DICK Also the section name should be "techniques", not "special attacks", therefore anything that he does that has to do with fighting has a liberty of being there. But anyway, On the subject, The list should be removed including the detailed descriptions of his transformations, it falls under WP:CRUFT. That's why we removed it from Goku's page. It's all cruft. --VorangorTheDemon 17:57, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

Cruft indeed, well if you guys want to remove it let's do it up. :) thanks mommy!_____MysticGohan 18:55, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

After reading more, I see that the article's status would improve if we limited the cruft. What's Vorangor by the way? MajinVegeta I know, but Vorangor... not so much. BTW sorry if I pulled an egg earlier.____MysticGohan 19:21, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

Let's just think logically here for a second. I wasn't joking or being stupid when I referenced both the Solar Flare and Bankoku Bikkuri Sho attacks. Neither one is an offensive attack yet they're referenced under special attacks/techniques under Tien, Krillin, Cell and Master Roshi's page. You can't police this page putting only what you want to, it needs to contain as much information as possible b/c that's what people come here looking for. Like it or not, defensive techniques are still relavent, regardless of how often they're used. In reference to your criticism of my Dead Zone reference, I was speaking of how the Garlic Junior saga completes the Dead Zone movie, not of how Gohan blast Garlic Junior with his energy in that movie (that's not the energy shield I was referring to). We need to be responsible with how we work pages with information like this. Just because you're doubtful of the relevance of a particularly piece of information doesn't mean you should dismiss it as erroneous. I agree with what was said earlier, let's add another section entitled techniques or something of the like to allow for the largest amount of information possible.TomUsedToBeRob 19:33, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

Also, I have yet to see any Mystic Gohan pictures posted yet. For that matter, I don't recall seeing any Great Saiyamen pictures or even adult Gohan pictures for that matter. We need to reflect Gohan's growth on this page with pictures.TomUsedToBeRob 19:33, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

I think there's a simple comprimise here. I want to delete the information to emulate the Goku page (it's one or two levels higher on the scale), and you think we should keep it. We could easily list his "techniques" with little or no in depth descritpion, say taking out he does this and he moves his hands like this. Or I could go through and delete all the techiques from the Dragonball realm characters and put in one article. I'm for either. MysticGohan 19:50, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

Dragonball Special Techniques

Well in any case I started a page called Dragonball Special Techniques (I say "started" but it's a sentence long, and not a particularly good sentence at that) anywho I think we should make this page with the in depth crap and then put a link to it when we finish. I don't know anything about doing a new page and the name is up for debate, so it's more of "help wanted" deal right now. MysticGohan 20:40, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

I'm already thinking List of Dragonball Special Techniques makes more sense. MysticGohan 20:52, 11 August 2007 (UTC)