User talk:Geno: Difference between revisions

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Fine, you win. Even if the Board were to agree with me, the memory of how you people have acted will always sicken me. I only wish I could withdraw my previous work for the Wikipedia.

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+Fine, you win. Even if the Board were to agree with me, the memory of how you people have acted will always sicken me. I only wish I could withdraw my previous work for the Wikipedia.
-== Mediation ==
-Hello,<br />
-You requested the mediation cabal to help resolve your slight dispute at [[Talk:Linda Hamilton]]. I will be taking the case at [[Wikipedia:Mediation Cabal/Cases/2007-09-06 Linda Hamilton]]--<span style="font-family: Comic Sans MS; font-size: 10pt">[[User:Phoenix 15|Phoenix 15]]</span> 19:31, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
-== [[WP:IGNORE]] ==
-No offense, but please see [[WP:WIARM]]. ''"Ignore all rules" is not an invitation to use Wikipedia for purposes contrary to that of building a '''free''' encyclopedia.'' (emphasis mine) I'm sorry, but your repeated inclusion of this non-free image on [[Linda Hamilton]] is a violation of policy, which has been pointed out to you numerous times. [[User:Videmus Omnia|Videmus Omnia]] [[User talk:Videmus Omnia| <sup>Talk</sup> ]] 15:33, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
-: And I say that other Wikipedia policy supports me and that the picture makes sense. If you disagree, then get a Wikipedia dev in here for a ruling, so I can kick it up to ''his'' boss. I figure eventually we can get to Jimbo Wales and get a definitive answer.
-: I tried compromising for the sake of co-operation and you guys decided, "Okay, we won, we're done here!" Fine, but if you want to compromise the articles, you're going to have to do the work to get an answer from some higher-ups. -- [[User:Geno|Geno Z Heinlein]] 15:39, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
-::OK, I posted a request for an admin opinion [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Incidents#Linda_Hamilton here]. [[User:Videmus Omnia|Videmus Omnia]] [[User talk:Videmus Omnia| <sup>Talk</sup> ]] 16:07, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
-Wikipedia devs are merely people who help to write the software that Wikipedia and other sits run on.  They have no say over content.  Even if you meant admin, they can't let you violate the appropriate policies concerning fair use content.  And nobody here has a "boss".  [[User:Corvus cornix|Corvus cornix]] 16:24, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
-: (1) My gods, are you ''all'' barracks lawyers here? I want someone who can definitively rule that it is a complete violation of all common sense to disallow in-character pictures on an actor's page. I want that ruling from a high-enough level that you legal geniuses will stop reverting the pictures. I don't care if the person making the ruling is called dev, admin, hoo-hah, muckety-muck or grand high wizard.
-: (2) Everyone here reports to someone; or there's someone who controls their access; that's their boss. The guy who runs the Wikipedia, Jimbo Wales, could come in here and say, "No, of course I didn't mean that you can't show an actor acting. That would be silly!" That would resolve this, yes? We don't need to kick it up that far, of course, just enough to stop the reversions.
-: (3) Even assuming the anti-fair-use crowd is correct in their interpretation of the policies -- they're not, even according to pages they themselves have repeatedly pointed me to -- those policies didn't write themselves; someone wrote those policies and someone can re-write them. -- [[User:Geno|Geno Z Heinlein]] 23:23, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
-You want [[WP:DP|dispute resolution]], but people there are not '''''bosses'''''. An an admin, [[User:Butseriouslyfolks]], has already rejected your arguments at [[talk:Linda Hamilton]].   [[User:Corvus cornix|Corvus cornix]] 23:25, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
-== Linda Hamilton and 3rr ==
-Hello, I undid the image [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Linda_Hamilton&diff=157948980&oldid=157947157 here]. Please be aware of [[WP:3RR]]. Thanks. An admin already answered on the talk page. • <span style="font-variant:small-caps"><font color="#C00000">[[User talk:Lawrence Cohen|Lawrence Cohen]]</font></span> 23:15, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
-: How come all of you guys' rules and regulations end up with your picture up there, instead of the original image? -- [[User:Geno|Geno Z Heinlein]] 23:24, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
-::Because the original image was not fair use, either.  [[User:Corvus cornix|Corvus cornix]] 23:26, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
-== Fair use and living people ==
-Using a fair use image of a living person to solely illustrate what the individual looks like is '''forbidden''' by fair use law as well as [[Wikipedia:Non-free content]] policy. Read point #12 of [[Wikipedia:Non-free content#Unacceptable images|Unacceptable images]], which states plainly that "Pictures of people still alive, groups still active, and buildings still standing; provided that taking a new free picture as a replacement (which is almost always considered possible) would serve the same encyclopedic purpose as the non-free image." [[Wikipedia:Non-free content criteria]] states that if a free alternative can be procured, then a fair use version is forbidden from use.
-: I've written over and over again that a free image would NOT "serve the same encyclopedic purpose as the non-free image", because the free image won't show the actor ''acting''. Why is this a sticking point? Are you saying that a free image ''can'' show an actor acting, or are you saying that the policy verbiage trumps the quality of the page? By what standard is a picture of Linda Hamilton at a premiere (or whatever) a better picture than a picture of Linda Hamilton acting? Because, frankly, any standard that would support that position is NOT based on the quality of the article being the primary concern. If the anti-fair-use interpretation is the real policy here, then what's been done is a placement of the policy issues at a higher level than the quality of the articles.  -- [[User:Geno|Geno Z Heinlein]]
-Using a publicity photo of [[Linda Hamilton]] from the Terminator movies to illustrate the article on the '''actress''' is inappropriate application of fair use and non-free content. The only photo of Linda Hamilton that can be on that article is one of er taken by you or someone else and able to be uploaded to the Wikimedia Commons where they only accept [[public domain]], [[Creative Commons]] [[Creative Commons licenses|Attribution + ShareAlike (no No Derivative Works or Noncommercial)]], or under a [[GNU Free Documentation License]] such that all the projects that have or can have an article on Linda Hamilton can use the photo.
-'''Do not''' add the promotional photo back onto the article.—[[User:Ryulong|<font color="blue">Ryūlóng</font>]] ([[User talk:Ryulong|<font color="gold">竜龍</font>]]) 23:25, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
-: Excuse me, can I issue orders like that? Because I would really like to tell all you people putting some pseudo-legal over-verbal nonsense ahead of the common sense of showing an actor acting on their page, "'''You must''' put in-character images on every actor's page." Is that okay with you? -- [[User:Geno|Geno Z Heinlein]] 23:59, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
-::No, you cannot.  Admin [[User:Ryulong|Ryulong]] was politely letting you know that if you continue to add images to articles in violation of Wikipedia's policies, you will be blocked from editing. --'''<span style="background:Black;color:White">&nbsp;[[User:Bsf|<font color="White">But</font>]]|[[User talk:Bsf|<font color="White">seriously</font>]]|[[Special:Contributions/Butseriouslyfolks|<font color="White">folks</font>]]&nbsp;</span>''' 01:51, 15 September 2007 (UTC)
-::: Ummm, no he wasn't. There's absolutely nothing in Ryulong's statment that can be described by the word 'politely'.
-::: And what marks Ryulong as an admin? Are you an admin? What marks you as an admin? -- [[User:Geno|Geno Z Heinlein]] 02:11, 15 September 2007 (UTC)
-::::Others would have just thrown a [[Wikipedia:Template messages/User talk namespace|warning template]] on your page.  Administrators are listed [[Wikipedia:List of administrators|here]].  You will see that both Ryulong and I are on the list. --'''<span style="background:Black;color:White">&nbsp;[[User:Bsf|<font color="White">But</font>]]|[[User talk:Bsf|<font color="White">seriously</font>]]|[[Special:Contributions/Butseriouslyfolks|<font color="White">folks</font>]]&nbsp;</span>''' 02:52, 15 September 2007 (UTC)
-::::: If Adolf Hitler and Jack Valenti were the last two people on Earth, Adolf Hitler would be the best person on Earth; he still wouldn't be a good person. "Do not..." doesn't start a polite anything, it starts an order. -- [[User:Geno|Geno Z Heinlein]] 03:11, 15 September 2007 (UTC)
-OK then, here you go:
-{{{icon|[[Image:Stop hand nuvola.svg|left|40px]] }}}Please do not add copyrighted material to Wikipedia without permission from the copyright holder{{{{{subst|}}}#if:{{{1|}}}|, as you did to [[:{{{1}}}]]}}. For [[Wikipedia:Copyrights|legal reasons]], we cannot accept [[Wikipedia:Copyrights|copyrighted]] text or images borrowed from other web sites or printed material; such additions will be deleted. You may use external websites as a source of ''information'', but not as a source of ''sentences''. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously, and persistent violators '''will''' be [[Wikipedia:Blocking policy|blocked]] from editing. {{{{{subst|}}}#if:{{{2|}}}|{{{2}}}|}}<!-- Template:uw-copyright --> --'''<span style="background:Black;color:White">&nbsp;[[User:Bsf|<font color="White">But</font>]]|[[User talk:Bsf|<font color="White">seriously</font>]]|[[Special:Contributions/Butseriouslyfolks|<font color="White">folks</font>]]&nbsp;</span>''' 03:16, 15 September 2007 (UTC)
-: I got it, already. He was still rude. -- [[User:Geno|Geno Z Heinlein]] 03:21, 15 September 2007 (UTC)
-[[Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents#Linda Hamilton|Here is your request for an admin's response]]. [[User:Seicer| '''<span style="color: #B33C1A; font: Trebuchet MS; font-size: 10px;">Seicer</span>''']] <small>([[User talk:Seicer|talk]]) ([[Special:Contributions/Seicer|contribs]])</small> 03:37, 15 September 2007 (UTC)
-: Please see the Linda Hamilton Talk Page for why this still does not address the issue. -- [[User:Geno|Geno Z Heinlein]] 09:40, 15 September 2007 (UTC)
-::At that page you say "Is it your position that promoting free content is more important than article quality?" and the answer is replace "more" with "equally" and you will finally be getting it. Jimbo specifically stated that Wikipedia is now important/powerful/famous enough that we can ask for and get copy-left images of living people so we should because it is more important for the Wikimedia mission to in a few years time have free images rather than to immediately have a better article with a non-free image. After he said that and the Wikimedia board of directors backed him up on it, the current situation of deleting fair use images of living people came into being. The well reasoned careful balancing of as free as possible versus as good as possible is that the temporary lack of an image is to be used to encourage the donation of free (copy-left) images; producing in the end both most free and best content. The owners of images can relicense that image under GFDL. More and more are doing so in order to get the free publicity that comes from being in Wikipedia. Please read [http://searchengineland.com/070911-083723.php this] for insight. By the way, thanks for helping to improve this free encyclopedia; your enthusiasm is wonderful. I'm kinda getting burned out myself. [[User:WAS 4.250|WAS 4.250]] 22:43, 15 September 2007 (UTC)