Talk:Gorani people

Macedonians or Serbs

So, who are Gorani, Macedonians or Serbs? Kosovo and Metohia is not province of Albania.

The Gorani are Macedonians.

...Gorani are just Gorani, Macedonians and Serbs are nothing more than Slav subdivisions anyhow. It's how they declare themselves in three countries, and how that's how they are. They are not ethnicly different from one another so it's hard to tell. Those in Macedonia may consider themselves Macedonian and those in Kosovo, probably Serbian if they wish. What you cannot have is Gorani saying they are Macedonian if they live in Serbia, or Serbian if they live in Macedonia, because if they were Macedonian when living in Serbia, you'd have Macedonians in Macedonia who are Orthodox, Macedonians in Macedonia who are Muslim, Macedonians in Serbia who are Muslim which means that the Orthodox Slavs of Serbia would also be Macedonian, hence a victory for Macedonian Nationalism as this way they could claim the whole of Serbia, or possibly you can have Gorani Serbs in Macedonia making Orthodox Slavs Serbs in Serbia, Muslim Slavs Serbian in Serbia, Muslim Slavs Serbian in Macedonia, thus Orthodox Slavs also Serbian in Macedonian bla bla bla...Ragusan 26.03.06

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Copied from de:Gorani via Babelfish:

Gorani is a Kurdish dialect and province Kermanschah and in the Hewraman mountains of a small group is spoken. This dialect is called sometimes also Hewrami and stands to Zazaki (D?m?li) very near. In this dialect there are the oldest literary documents of the Kurdish language. Many speakers of this dialect belong to the religious grouping Ehl e chop. There are very many religious documents in this dialect is written. Gorani became up to 19. Century used by many Kurds in Iran and Iraq more and more of the Sorani dialect displaces however later. Sorani became supposed by the sunnitischen influences more importantly and thus became this dialect also more strongly. One can see it also completely clear today that Gorani dialect predominantly from Ehl e chop Kurds spoken wird.[bearbeiten ] Writing works The most important writing works are: 874-Seitige Shîrîn u Xusrew from the year 1975 of Xanay Qûbadi (lived 1700-1759). It was published in Bagdad. 789-Seitiger Diwan in 19. Century of the poet Feqe Qadiri Hemewend. The Koran in Gorani in 19. Century of Haci Nuri Eli Ilahi (Nuri Eli Shah).

This is true, which might mean a disambiguation page. Refdoc 00:34, 18 Jul 2004 (UTC)

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What is more "neutral" in that version? I was not even aware of a debate or controversy, yet! Please do not simply revert but use the talk page if you find fault. Refdoc 22:29, 29 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Several things, but if I may ask first, where did you found the information that Gorani is English name of dialect of Serbian which Gorani speak and that Gorani is name for Kurds which speak Gorani dialect of Kurdish? Names for people and their language are rarely same in English. Nikola 21:12, 30 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Well they are often enough the same- German/German, French/French, Italian/Italian, WRT to Gorani (Gora mountains) => official British refugee documentation (of/for and about) You can argue about the correctness, but this does not alter the usage. It is probably the result of being the language of only a couple of 10.000 people and that the '-nski' is pretty much unpronouncable for many British people - at least Home Office officials etc , someone at some stage made it up this way and others accepted it without much questioning and now this is the use. The Kurds - ask Kurds from the Iranian border and if they know Hewramanis/Goranis they should confirm it to you. Google is probably not going to tell you much. Both names are in use: Gorani and Hewrami/Hewramani for all that is verifiable. The defining feature is probably the combination of dialect with being r a small religious minority - Ahl-e Haqq. You can argue whether this is sufficient to make it an ethnic group but that is proabably the same as with the Gora mountain people - defined by remoteness, odd dialect and religiously -> "othered" by their neighbours, ' eventually treated in a hostile manner and finally formed some sort of own identity. Refdoc 01:33, 31 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Date of conversion

The article states that these people converted to islam in the late 18th century. I think it's a bit late, the Ottoman Empire was already weak at that time. They conveted more probably during the 16th and 17th centuries.--Revas 23:53, 20 July 2005 (UTC)

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No. Gorani are known for converting to Islam very late. PANONIAN (talk) 16:33, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

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Gorani are Macedonians, Macedonians are Bulgarians

This is probably why a pro-Bulgarian movement has been organized. In the economic and political desperation in Kosovo or among the Kosovo refugees no one should blame them. Well, Serbia is right if it's not happy about the Gorani becoming Bulgarian. In my opinion however, the Gorani will not gain any efficient support from Bulgaria, first of all because of their Muslim faith. In spite of the legends told in Serbia, Bosnia and FYROM, I doubt that the Bulgarian authorities are so easily fooled. The regime of granting passports is tightening each time and the period of waiting for a 'yes' or 'no' now is over three years even for the Bulgarians from Caribrod and Bosilegrad, who are officially recognized by the Serbian state. Besides, Bulgaria has its own Muslims and needs no more of them. This is why the 'Return to Bulgaria' project is active in Ukraine, Moldova and Macedonia but not in Kosovo or among the Pomaks of Northern Greece. These disputes of who the Gorani are and who has the right on them are in vain and useless. It doesn't matter anymore, especially after 1999, when they fled Kosovo for good. Their overall number is insignificant and their future will depend on their individual choice. As far as I know, most Gorani who fled Kosovo have gone to Serbia proper. In two generations they will assimilate and become Serbs. If they go to FYROM: "Macedonians" or Albanians. If some among them convince the Bulgarian authorities and obtain Bulgarian passports: fine, they will go to Bulgaria or (most likely) will try Germany or Switzerland and become confectioners or café owners, until they obtain German or Swiss citizenship. The fourth group will go to Bosnia and become part of the new Bosniak nation (isn't it strange, with so many nations in such a small country (former SFRY), at least three of them never heard of before 1945!).
And a remark to the article: why doesn't it say anything about the Gorani in Albania? It is there where the "we are Bulgarians" voices are heard most often and listened to in Sofia. 85.11.148.71 08:28, 16 May 2006 (UTC)