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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by J. Ponder (talk | contribs) at 00:49, 20 June 2007 (→Hugger or Snugger fans: signing post). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Technical Information

There should be some more additional technical information about a Ceiling Fan, for Example:-

1. How the ceiling fan works? 2. What is the function of Armature and Capacitor in a Fan? 3. What is the difference between a capacitor fan and a non-capacior fan? 4. Why a capacitor is necessary for a capacitor type fan? 5. How a non-capacitor fan works without a capacitor?

Mujeeb Ahmed, Karachi-Pakistan.

Page Blanking

This talk page has been blanked since the article has been completely rewritten.

Piercetheorganist 12:13, 7 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

  • Talk pages should not be blanked, they should be archived WP:archive. Wikipedia is an organization that thrives on debate and discussion, the disscussion helps people evaluate what has happened with an article and what needs to be worked on. So even if the article has been completely rewritten, the content in the talk page should remain. If you feel that a question is no longer valid you may add to the record of the discussion explaining why its no longer valid. Pretty much the only time when things get deleted from talk is if they contain personal attacks, or if the are blatant vandalism. Idioma 00:21, 19 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Citations need tag

Thank you for taking the time to edit the ceiling fan article.

Upon careful review, it is evident that all statements are properly sourced using The Fan Book (ISBN 0-8359-1855-6).

The tag you added has been removed. Thank you for your interest.

Piercetheorganist 01:05, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

  • The section I marked has a lack of inline citations. I marked the entire section because it has no inline citations. Without inline citations it is not possible to tell where information came from. Yes there is a references section at the bottom, but unfortunately it is not possible to tell which information came from that resource unless inline citation is used WP:REF. I will go through the article and mark the article with "[citation needed]" at specific points that need citation so you can get a clearer idea of what is needed. I see you have put a lot of good work into this article. Idioma 00:21, 19 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
    • And once again, I removed them. All the data you cited comes from the source listed--The Fan Book. One resource was used (it happens to be the only book ever written solely about ceiling fans); it is cited at the bottom of the article; and so there is no need to add an in-line citation at the end of every sentence. There is no confusion to be had--all the data comes from one source. If multiple sources were listed, then it would make sense to add citation tags. But that's not the case. If you won't be able to sleep soundly until there are useless idiotic tags in place, feel free to add a tag to the sole source at the end of every sentence in that section. Piercetheorganist 03:30, 19 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
    • Also, your edit wherein you "cleaned up" the language was actually not helpful. The capitalization, punctuation, spelling, grammar, and other mechanics is all technical detail which belongs as-written. And yes, it all comes from the wonderful cited source. Besides, I've got rank on you here--I restore/repair ceiling fans for a living, in addition to the fact that I'm a collector and very well-versed in ceiling fan history. One edit in particular comes to mind, "removing POV" from the picture caption under the Casablanca Delta. Describing a 4-blade GE-vent fan as "generic" is completely accurate and is not a POV statement. That style, which is defined by its long-expired patents, was used nearly unilaterally in all mass-produced contractor/builder ceiling fans in the 1980s. It not being a debate of any nature, there is no POV to be had. The dictionary definition of "generic" completely and unquestionably applies to that defined style. Thanks. Piercetheorganist 03:30, 19 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
There is no rank in wikipedia. This is collective editing; anyone can edit wikipedia. Please read WP:REF especially the part about inline citations. Since you are an expert in this you must be especially careful to use inline citations to guard against original research WP:OR. Cleaning up language can include cleaning up style, which is a useful edit. I cannot assume that there is only one source in this article because in order for an article to meet WP:NOTABILITY standards, an article should have multiple independent sources. As people edit this article (it belongs to the collective wikipedia community who are free to edit it) there will be other sources added. Since wikipedia can be edit by anyone, in order for wikipedia to have credibility using the correct inline method of citing sources is essential. People are free to look at any claim in an article and add [citation needed] unless it already has inline citation. I certainly appreciate the contributions you have made to this article. Idioma 04:01, 19 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Well, I will be happy to add inline citations to the source, useless as it is. As far as other sources go, there aren't any. "The Fan Book" is the one and only book written solely about ceiling fans; and there are no other books in the Library of Congress database which even have a section on ceiling fan history, evolution, or anything like that. Unfortunately, it's kind of a specialized subject area. So, everything in this article came from The Fan Book, and is verified by common knowledge (or, more accurately, knowledge that's common in the ceiling fan community). Having said that, IF you or anyone else can find another source, PLEASE list it here. I've searched high and low, and even gone so far as to contact PR reps at Emerson, Hunter, and Casablanca, and there is apparently no further information available (other than companies' personal history, which is relevant to an article about that company but is not relevant to ceiling fans in general). Thanks Piercetheorganist 00:02, 20 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I'm a bit confused by this statement "The capitalization, punctuation, spelling, grammar, and other mechanics is all technical detail which belongs as-written. And yes, it all comes from the wonderful cited source." It seems to say that the grammar and spelling came directly from another source. Please clarify. Idioma 04:17, 19 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, the grammar/mechanical structure came from an external source (the cited source). For example, you changed "The Diehl Electric Fan" to the Diehl electric fan. It is incorrect the way you've re-written it (so, once again, I reverted that change). Diehl was a brand; they made many electric fans; but that first model was named "The Diehl Electric Fan", capitalized in that way. This comes from the cited source. Since it is a proper model name, it must be formatted in the accurate way. Thanks. Piercetheorganist 00:02, 20 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for the clarification. Idioma 00:27, 20 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Hugger or Snugger fans

A section outlining the advantages and disadvantages of snugger fans would be appropriate. Idioma 00:54, 19 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

  • FYI, "Snugger" is a trademark; it's Emerson's name for their hugger-style fan. Personally, I disagree that a separate section needs to be added. Hugger fans are no different from any other ceiling fan in any way, except for the fact that they don't have a downrod--something which is entirely unrelated to the fan's operation. The motor, blades, etc. is no different. Refer to the section "Bases for Comparison", subsection "Height of the fan relative to the ceiling", for more info on huggers if you're interested. That section details their sole disadvantage; it is appropriate for it to be in that section since it is not a problem unique to huggers (though all huggers have it). The sole advantage of a hugger is that it saves space--something which is such blatantly obvious common sense that it doesn't belong in an encyclopedia article (any more than the statement "water is wet" belongs in the article on water). Basically my point is that huggers are no different from ordinary fans, and so don't deserve their own section any more than each decor-themed fan at Home Depot deserves its own section. Piercetheorganist 03:30, 19 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks, good info. There are fans that appear to be different from ordinary fans that are huggers, such as the Concept II among others, it could use a subsection in the style section. Idioma 04:10, 19 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
You're welcome. Minka Aire's "Concept II" model is no different from any ordinary hugger ceiling fan. Same motor, same blades, same mounting method. It deserves its own section no more than fans of different colors deserve their own section. Thanks. Piercetheorganist 00:02, 20 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Yes it does have the same type of motor, but from what I read, the blades are not flat, and it doesn't have a down tube. I think that a good number of people who buy fans would define style as visual rather than technical. While not all hugger fans are visually different they lack the down tube and some lack ceiling medallion. I believe that they are both visually and slightly functionally different, even they use the same motors. Idioma 00:49, 20 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]
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