Talk:List of Naruto antagonists

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Madara, again

"His plans foiled once again, he returned to Konoha in secret, training Itachi Uchiha and later assisted him in slaughtering all of the remaining Uchiha except for Sasuke Uchiha". Is there a source for this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.233.246.88 (talk) 07:53, 4 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Madara

how come it says that madara did attack the village with the nine-tails?

it has not been comfirmed if it is true. so why is that put on there?

Huh? That's unusually verbalized, but I'll try to give a satisfactional answer... Itachi stated in chapter 385 that Madara tamed and controlled the Kyuubi, in the same chapter, Sasuke revealed that the secret message in the Nakano shrine about the Sharingan's ultimate purpose was to controll the Kyuubi, and so we can only assume that that is what Madara did... But while still on the subject of Madara, I'd like to change the statement of him being immortal on the grounds that no such statement was made in the original raw version of the manga, only in the fanmade translation. 217.208.24.113 (talk) 14:35, 20 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Is it a case of a completely fanmade concept, or is "immortal" not the most accurate of words? ~Snapper T o 18:50, 20 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

In chapter 385, Itachi calls Madara a 不滅の男 (fumetsu no otoko). Fumetsu means immortal, undying, or indestructible. JadziaLover (talk) 21:16, 20 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Then, aside from perhaps changing it to "Itachi states that Madara is an immortal", the article is fine. ~Snapper T o 21:50, 20 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Speaking (or rather typing, whatever) of Madara, I'd like to know where it was stated that Madara returned "at only a fraction of his former strength". Sounds like OR to me... 217.208.24.113 (talk) 12:58, 28 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

People assumed that from Hisshouburaiken's translation: "Madara is a pathetic shell of his former self". It's worth noting that none of the other translators said this. He was called a loser or failure but never stated to be weaker. Is it just me, but whenever there's a translation issue, it always seems to be Hisshou? The Tobi/Madara fiasco in chapter 364, "invincible" when there's no mention, and now this pathetic shell stuff. He adds or omits words at his convenience I think. Wikiuser6 (talk) 16:46, 28 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

No, he just doesn't translate very literally and he tries to translate as quickly as he can. This causes a number of misinterpretations and mistakes by both him and his readers. He usually is quite quick to correct them if he sees fit, though.

Two other examples of his misinterpretations would be him saying the Four-tails uses many different elemental fusions, while it really said the Yonbi uses a new element called Yōton (Melting Element). He also said Madara was considered the strongest shinobi, while it should have been the Senju clan that was called the strongest

No matter what, HisshouBuraiKen is still a very good translator. Just one that prefers easy readability over being literal and speed over accuracy. JadziaLover (talk) 23:46, 28 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Is "a fraction of his former strength" incorrect then? ~Snapper T o 23:55, 28 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Itachi says 「今のマダラは負け犬だ…」, which literally means "The present Madara is a loser". Even more literally, it would be "The Madara of today is a defeated dog". 負け犬 is a common expression for "loser," or "underdog" and is most commenly used to refer to the person who is most likely to lose a competition. In this case, the competition between Madara and Itachi, over who will reach the true height of the Uchiha's power.

Personally, I don't think it really says anything about Madara's strength, but more about Madara's state of mind and how Itachi thinks himself superior over Madara.

So yes, "a fraction of his former self" would be incorrect, in my eyes. JadziaLover (talk) 00:28, 29 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Why is the a link to Tobi under Madara's entry? This hasn't been confirmed. Even if Tobi says he is Madara, it doesn't mean that its true. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.197.252.253 (talk) 23:07, 29 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

What was the new eye technique that Itachi mentions Madara acquired after taking his brother's eyes?

______________________________

There really needs to be emphasis in Madara's section that he had the Permanent Mangekyo Sharingan, the Kyuubi at his disposal and a Space/Time jutsu greater than the Fourth's, yet he still lost against the Shodai Hokage. AS it stands, it just glosses over the facts. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.36.16.94 (talk) 01:09, 29 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Chapter 399 says Madara did have control over the Kyuubi, but that was during the battle with the First Hokage. The attack that began the series (where the Kyuubi was sealed inside Naruto) was just a "natural" disaster, or so Madara says... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 142.26.133.248 (talk) 15:04, 9 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

And at the same time, Jiraiya and Itachi would have us believe that Madara actually did summon it 16 years before. So it's impossible to know who to believe. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.99.169.251 (talk) 16:29, 9 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Madara said his brother willingly gave him his eyes, and that he did everything he did in order to protect the Uchiha, not out of personal lust for power. He only went psycho when the Uchiha turned against him and sided with the Hokage. That kinda makes him an antihero, like Itachi, instead of a villain, doesn't it?

Yeah Madara's really looking a lot more protagonistic, but we cannot forget he's after the main character (Naruto's) life, making him an antagonist (still), regardless of reasoning. Honestly, he's the villain in the current storyline but the hero in the past storylines. I motion his article be moved into the List of minor Naruto characters where it's more appropriate. AnimeNikkaJamal (talk) 00:24, 10 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

It seems more like he's trying to sound innocent so as to be appealing to Sasuke. The fact that he contradicts two other characters in regards to the demon fox's attack on Konoha attests to that. Regardless, he's still a textbook example of an antagonist (founder of Akatsuki, opposed First Hokage, keeping Naruto from Sasuke, etc.) ~Snapper T o 02:44, 10 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Naming

Wouldn't a better name for this page be "Minor (or Lesser) enemies in Naruto"? --Pentasyllabic 22:35, 23 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Even better would be List of minor enemies in Naruto. --maru (talk) contribs 15:44, 14 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Oboro, Mubi, and Kagari

Are these villians really "minor"? I mean these three were important in the Chuunin Exam as the carriers of the scroll that Team 7 absolutely needed to pass the second exam.

The Wretched

Even though these three are important to Team 7's passage through the Forest of Death, they are not at the level of Orochimaru and other major villains. Blademaster313 23:08, 23 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

well yeah but if you look at it,most of these minor villians don't make a reapperence,however these three reapper in the Land Of Tea anime filler arc,so that means they have alittle more importence then most of these villians. also ,with that filler they have had a bit more importence then zabuza,because they have been impotent in two arcs,zabuza was only importent in one

btw:i'm wondering what happened to these three's info, one day they had like the age and rank and stuff then the next day it didn't even have pic of their battle outfits. Allen Walker 11:35, 18 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Zabuza had a profound influence on several major characters. He's one of the most significant villians in the entire series. Oboro, Mubi, and Kagari are entirely minor. The fact that they appear for a pair of arcs is entirely irrelevant - they do not contribute anything highly important to the plot. Sephiroth BCR ^(Converse) 16:44, 18 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

yeah i guess your right.......athough i wish they were major characters,Oboro is one of my fav characters for the whole seris,but i digress. anyway,i guess your right so i'll just drop it.Allen Walker 11:50, 18 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Um they make at least 2 appearences as well as appear in one of the video games! (clash of ninja 2) Aburame66745 02:27, 8 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Gato...h whatever

it says he looks like Fred Tatasciore, his voice actor. I can't find a picture of Fred Tatasciore to save my life right now, can anyone verify this claim?

I can. Just Yahoo image search "Fred Tatasciore" (keep the quotes). Yahoo was the only place I could find an image, and, yes, they look very much alike. Dagron12345 22:20, 19 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Akahoshi

You say Naruto kills Akahoshi in battle, but if you listen to the anime, Tsunade says that Akahoshi and his henchmen receive punishment by the village.....so lets change the little mistake please^^

First Rain Genin team

Do these guys really count as enemies? They just happened to be examines in the Chunin Exam that were in the wrong place at the wrong time. If you think about it, their opponent, Gaara, was the more villanous at the time. In theory, these would be good guys. Well, more like neutral, but still not villains. We could just slip these three onto the Unsorted Characters section of the Characters page. You Can't See Me! 04:47, 19 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

That section is a necessaey evil and nothing more. We don't need to be expanding it. Those Genin were allied against a main character, so they become villians. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 06:42, 19 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Regarding Midare, it seems loosely possible his name is taken from samidare (五月雨), which means "early summer rain". It would fit within the theme of his teammates' names, but of course it's purely conjecture, thus my bringing it up here. Anyone else have thoughts on this? SlackerEmeritus 11:46, 10 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Not villains, but antagonists.

Mist servant vs. Haze clone

Is there any real advantage that one of these jutsus has over the other?

Naruto movie 3

Can someone find pictures of Ishidate, Kongou and Karenbana? My screenshot program wont work for the life of me. EDIT: Thanks very much. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Irothtin (talk • contribs) 22:28, 1 May 2007 (UTC).[reply]

Doto Kazahana

I saw the end part there is no way he is alive first he had his mouthn open in shock mnost have fallen 100 feet down and had blood in his chest.

And the moya Brothers?

The Moya Brothers! the ninjas of La Aldea Oculta Del Humo

Uh... one, speak English. Two, what's your point? // DecaimientoPoético 02:40, 3 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

BabelFish tells me he's asking where the ninja from the Village Hidden in the Smoke are. ~Snapper T o 02:47, 3 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Transfer Haku and Zabuza

Could we please transfer Haku and Zabuza to a different article? As far as I see, these two are NOT minor characters. I was actually quite surprised to see them on this page. These two characters did a lot at the start of the story, and have put a major impact in the plot. Their appearances in the series are still affecting the entire series even after their deaths. Haku even showed Naruto what it truly means to be a ninja. Naruto will never forget that. These two are definately way more important than all these other villains who only appeared in fillers. What do you guys think? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.181.58.44 (talk) 02:49, August 20, 2007 (UTC)

Which is why "minor" is no longer part of this article's name. ~Snapper T o 02:54, 20 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Shouldnt the water dragon technique go to the water techniques in recurring jutsu, because kakashi and 2nd hokage also use this(while kakashi uses it many times in the movie).

~Tintor2 14:27, 8 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

You are welcome to move it there. My knowledge of anime-only uses is limited, so I moved jutsu to whatever manga character used them. ~Snapper T o 21:28, 8 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Fair use image removal

Fair use images have repeatedly been removed from this article for violating our policies on the use of fair use images found at Wikipedia:Non-free content criteria #3(a) and #8, and Foundation:Resolution:Licensing policy. Removals of this type have been occurring all across the project. A sample of such efforts may be found at User:Durin/Fair_Use_Overuse#Complete. This type of removal has been debated many times in the past, with the result that the images have been removed and ultimately remained removed. Please see User:Durin/Fair_use_overuse_explanation#Prior_debates for some example debates.

If you still feel motivated to dispute our policy and wish to engage in discussion with specific regards to the use of such images on this and closely related articles, please centralize discussion at Talk:List of Akatsuki members. --Durin 12:55, 27 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Demon Brothers technique

I thought that the chain technique they used was called "Shared Instinct Assassination Jutsu" I saw it somewhere in one of my books about Naruto- Kakashi The Mirror Ninja 02:23, 11 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Haku

It's off wiki, but I have a little request. Does anyone from Wikipedia have any good citations on Haku's gender? There are people who consider Haku male, and others who consider Haku female. The topic turned into a heated debate on the Narutopedia because people were throwing around speculation saying it was fact, and not focusing on the issue. If anyone here has some good references, it would be helpful. ^_^ It could also help for citing the Wikipedia article and avoid harsh debates like the one we have from happening here to. Dantman (talk) 03:33, 7 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, scratch my comment. I finally found Talk:Haku (Naruto), talkpages are hard to find when they're part of redirects. All the merging made it hard to track down. Dantman (talk) 11:10, 7 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

And they refer to Haku as a "he", and Haku even says he's a guy. Jazz Band Member (talk) 13:11, 6 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Haku is a guy. Case closed.

Zabuza Momochi Alive?

Under the References and the box with the choices like Sasuke, Naruto and Akatsuki it says: But is found alive in later manga

Im assuming it means Zabuza but its known that hes dead so who is alive thats thought to be dead? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.46.140.237 (talk) 18:40, 21 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Zabuza was still in the ground when Suigetsu went to retrieve his sword from the on top of his grave. --Pottski (talk) 23:16, 23 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Zabuza and Haku have been seen alive in a recent episode from the year of 2008. It was a short clip, probably five to ten seconds long... Animine (talk) 22:09, 4 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Zaku

During his flashback when he faught Shino, after he met Orochimaru Zaku getts attacked by a bunch of Waterfall ninja, so could he be from the waterfall village? Scorpio777 (talk) 05:00, 26 December 2007 (UTC)Scorpio666[reply]

Not very plausible. 217.208.24.113 (talk) 14:38, 20 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Databook footnotes

The databook footnotes are broken, attempting to link to #Sources. –Gunslinger47 03:39, 28 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Name of Kimimaro

Kimimaro is from the Kaguya clan, but he is never called kimimaro kaguya, while the 2nd databook simply calls him Kimimaro. Tintor2 11:56, 4 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

It's obvious to me that there is a reason why Kimimaro isn't called Kimimaro Kaguya. Either Kaguya never was his surname, or he discarded it for some reason. No matter what, using Kaguya as his surname would be original research. JadziaLover (talk) 14:19, 4 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Another proof why we cant use it is the poll from chapter 245; while all characters have their surnames, Kimimaro doesnt have a surname(he ranked 18).Tintor2 14:32, 4 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Haku & Zabuza

Didn't Haku and zabuza both have their own pages before? Maybe it's a good idea to put them on this page, but i'm just trying to make sure i haven't entirely lost my mind. Ichliebezuko (talk) 14:29, 14 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, I think you're right. I'm almost positive they both had thier own page. Why did they get moved here? Plus, what happened to the pictures of them? A pyrate's life for me... (talk) 17:03, 23 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

If I am not very much misteken they were merged because they did not meet WP:FICT guidlines. --67.68.154.54 (talk) 05:07, 29 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia may not have rights to thier pictures. Animine (talk) 22:09, 4 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

major and minor villians

this is just a suggestion, so please don't bomb me with wiki rules, but do you guys think it's possible to split this article into major and minor villians like the major and minor characters list?--Sanji_1990 (talk) 17:56, 2 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Who would be a minor villain? ~Snapper T o 19:30, 2 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

People from the naruto movies, filler arcs, some ovas, maybe gato or something. Like I siad, it's a suggestion, so i haven't really thought it out.--Sanji_1990 (talk) 20:21, 2 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

All of the "minor characters" have some impact on the plot (some far more than others), which is that basic cut off point for whether or not someone is listed. Filler characters generally do not meet this goal, and movies are a separate continuity. Movie characters can be covered in the respective movie article, as tends to be the norm. If you feel there is a villain who greatly adds to the story that is not listed, just add them to this article. ~Snapper T o 20:45, 2 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

all right--Sanji_1990 (talk) 01:08, 3 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Is Hidan Really Dead?

From what i have heared Hidan was cut to bits By Shikimaru Nara and then buried. My Question is why didn't the Akatsuki Dig up the body? Hidan Is inmortal, but if his limbs get seperated they need to be put back together to heal. Whats the point of Inmortality if you can still is a way for you to die??? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Itachi4312 (talk • contribs) 01:49, 27 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

This really isn't the appropriate place to be asking, but whatever. Hidan was buried in a location that only Nara clan members can reach, hence why he hasn't been dug up. That's really the only way you can get rid of an immortal character in a work of fiction without de-immortalizing them. ~Snapper T o 03:55, 27 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

If Akatsuki tries to dig him up, they will go to war with the entire leaf village, and he's alive, but not able to move. . —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.232.242.232 (talk) 06:31, 3 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Sound Four or Five?

Since there are five members (Kimmimaro, Kidomaru, Tayuya, Jirobo, and Sakon/Ukon) should it be called the Sound Five? There were originally only 4 (Kimmimaro came in later, though Sakon did make a reference to him while fighting Sasuke, "Even Kimmimaro woulda been better than this.") but still... Noodle2D23 (talk) 18:58, 26 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I would say use sound four since they that is the name that they were called during most of the series and is the most common name for the group. I believe that a breif mention that they were once called the Sound Five when Kummimaro was a member would be sufficient. --76.66.184.175 (talk) 01:21, 1 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

What about Yoroi Akadou?

Why can't Yoroi or even Misumi be put on Wikipedia? Give me some feedback. —Preceding unsigned comment added by K1o1g12 (talk • contribs) 00:18, 6 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Madara again, again

The article also says that Madara created Akatsuki, assumed the alias of Tobi and then attacked Konoha with the demon fox. It was never said that he assumed the alias of Tobi after he created Akatsuki, only that he "hid in its shadows". Without a legitimate source i dont think this point is valid at all. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.221.217.4 (talk) 09:37, 9 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

He calls himself Tobi, therefore alias. The others know his as Tobi, therefore alias. Simple. — Trust not the Penguin (T | C) 09:46, 9 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Sasuke as a Villain?

It's stupid to have him in the villain section when all he really wanted was revenge for his clan. Sasuke didn't do anything wrong when he went to Orochimaru for training. He didn't really betray everyone because he was just doing what he had to do and Orochimaru had him messed up from the cursed seal. Sasuke is still a protagonist. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.154.162.97 (talk) 05:07, 11 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Half complaint/agreement, he might as well be the protagonist with all the freaking attention he's getting. Damn. Ok, that's out of my system. Unfortunately we don't have a category for "emo rogue" at the moment, so villain has to do. He ain't exactly been good about cooperating, after all. — Trust not the Penguin (T | C) 05:44, 11 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Snake is what is categorized as a "villain". Sasuke is merely a member of Snake. ~Snapper T o 18:28, 11 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Right, please elaborate how Snake has been villainous. Have they pillaged a village? killed or harmed anyone? Its an organization formed by Sasuke for the sole purpose of tracking and defeating Itachi. If anything they've been helpful to the Naruto world, defeating an Akatsuki member and freeing prisoners of Orochimaru. They are far from being a villains organization. Unless you can provide proof they've something to deserve that category. 134.121.250.173 (talk) 04:42, 17 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Sasuke is a criminal, technically speaking. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.232.242.232 (talk) 06:32, 3 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

By the same token Haku isn't a villain, as he avoided killing others and only tried to please Zabuza. He still worked against the protagonists and did things of questionable nature. This list is the most convenient place for Haku and Snake to be, so here is where they are. ~Snapper T o 23:19, 17 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

There are many gray areas... Animine (talk) 22:09, 4 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

perhaps this article would be better labelled "List of Naruto Antagonists". that would get rid of the villainous aspect and aptly describe both sasuke and haku. --24.214.236.85 (talk) 14:21, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Well now that all the antagonistic characters with the exception of our one villainous GA are covered, I could go for something like that. Sasuke9031 (talk) 18:54, 5 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Orochimaru in Akatsuki

I moved Orochimaru's entry from Other to Akatsuki, seeing that the rest of the former Akatsuki members are there. focoma (talk) 06:56, 4 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Orochimaru is a former member of Akatsuki in the whole series, in the normal series timeline he is sound ninja so I decided to revert it. Mentioning he was part of Akatsuki is enough.--Tintor2 (talk) 19:14, 4 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Itachi Main article

I believe there was a main article for Itachi. I wonder why it was removed. He is one of the main characters, not just a villain. As of latest chapters, It's been confirmed. He should have a main article. --Fotte (talk) 07:13, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

We've been over this I don't know how many times. Itachi was merged because he failed WP:FICT. If you can find a way to refute all the previous arguments and satisfy WP:FICT, then by all means. Not very likely, but you never know. Sasuke9031 (talk) 07:27, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Here is my draft of reception if you would like to help. User talk:Tintor2/ draft# Reception.--Tintor2 (talk) 16:23, 6 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I guess that Itachi may get his article since in that draft I could get more things of reception. However, it needs conception information, just see a GA article Aang that has more or less the same reception as Itachi but it has more conception.--Tintor2 (talk) 16:54, 9 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Update

Latest chapter, Madara informs Sasuke that he, in fact, did not summon the Kyuubi to attack Konoha, and that it was a "natural disaster". I'm not really good with editing, so someone should change that. --74.167.170.215 (talk) 17:00, 9 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Minor Error in Zetsu

"The black half speaks in Katakana in the Japanese manga and is voiced by Michael Sorich in the English anime, while the white speaks Kanji and Kana and is voiced by Brian Beacock. Both sides are voiced by Nobuo Tobita in the Japanese anime, with the black half being given a much deeper voice than the white."

should be revised to ..

"In the Japanese manga the black sides speaks Katakana ,while the white speaks Kanji and Kana, In the English Anime the black half is voiced by Michael Sorich in the English anime, while the white is voiced by Brian Beacock. Both sides are voiced by Nobuo Tobita in the Japanese anime, with the black half being given a much deeper voice than the white.--"76.104.223.234 (talk) 23:09, 9 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Itachi's Mangekyou Transfer

There were essentially three main translations of the chapter where Madara tells Sasuke that Itachi gave his Mangekyou to him. In Itachi's section here, it says that Itachi gave Sasuke all of his techniques. However, that translation was the odd one out, for the other two said things along the lines of... "the power of his own eyes" and "his own eye power." Point is, it's still unknown whether Sasuke has all three techniques or just Amaterasu. Just as it's unknown as to whether Sasuke can only activate this Mangekyou when he sees Madara's own sharingan. Thought I'd share that, since I can't edit. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.99.169.251 (talk) 03:44, 10 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]