Talk:Closed-eye hallucination

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Second person

I don't think an encyclopedia should be written in the second person, a rewrite should be done to at least correct that. I would do it, but it will probably be erased, so someone else should do it.

what

what is the cause of "CEV perception level 1: visual noise"? Tentative candidates are:

cortically generated
autofluorescence in visual organs
red blood cells visible somehow
light through eyelids

As far as I can tell It is most likely heat related noise which excites the Photoreceptor cells in the retina. since the temperature in the eye is quite high 37C and the eye is closed the signal to noise level drops to zero and one is able to experience the noise alone. Heat related noise or "Dark current" is quite visible digital camcorders when they have a high gain "ISO" and shoot video in a dark room. Astronomers experience heat related noise in their CCD cameras as well. Their solution to the problem is to chill the CCD using liquid nitrogen at −196 °C,aza (talk) 13:54, 14 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Poor Article

This article really needs a clean up. It reads like somebody copy and pasted a bunch of text from erowid.org. The article should have names, descriptions of the hallucinations, causes. It should read like an encyclopedia entry. It is also factually incorrect. I have personally taught several hundred people how to reach the so-called "level 4" in a single meditation session -- with no drugs.

As I'm not qualified to fix it myself, I'm putting the cleanup template up. 216.99.209.252 09:20, 31 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I agree that this article is lacking credibility. The statements made in the article can not be attributed to erowid. There are major contradictions between the article and information available at erowid. Since erowid does provide information on the effects different substances I placed an external link. There are things that I personally feel is not correct based on my own experiences. I will try to find legitimate references before making changes. 65.43.32.36 08:16, 8 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I would be interested to know more about the causes of these hallucinations, as I experience them mildly in abscence of drug use.68.253.32.54 09:37, 21 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

As noted this seems innaccurate: I achieve level 4 without even meditating these days (however, it was meditation that caused my first level 4 experience) I'm not sure my level 4 experience could even be described as mild, they're highly vivid, and solid object-based, although they rarely include full surroundings. At the time of my first such experience the only significantly psychoactive chemical I had ever ingested was caffeine. There seems to be a generally overestimation of the difficulty of achieving these levels in this article (well, either that or I have a much easier time than normal) I won't edit it myself unless I can find a citation one way or the other on that issue. -Kingreaper 16:19, 6 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

It would appear the most of the information here was copy-pasted from "Experience festival" [1] 216.114.64.6 (talk) 21:55, 7 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

references and visualization

I have added the first citation and a reference to "Jurij Moskvitin, Essay on the origin of thought". I have also added a few "simulations" of CEV as animated gifs. Since the experience of CEV, might be highly individual I would like a little feedback form you.

I have also been bold and added a reference to heat related noise in "CEV perception level 1: visual noise"? aza (talk) 14:05, 14 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I would like to see some references on this and am particularly interested in the level 1 phenomenon, as both the animation and the description are qualitatively similar to my personal experience of visual snow. Both articles could benefit from references on this phenomenon. --tijmz (talk) 19:32, 29 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Note

Image burn-in -> Afterimage? There's an article for afterimage but not for "image burn-in" and comparing the two it seems that they are the same thing.

`

Closed Eye Hallucination Or Not?

If I apply intense pressure to my eyes, over a long periods of time, I can have level 3 CEHs. Such as tricolor pyramids and stars. I am pretty sure that everyone has this ability. The only thing is that it is so much pressure that the pain is nearly unbearable. Should this be added? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.39.16.71 (talk) 10:17, 4 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Those are phosphenes, dude. (Really though you should not need pressure to the point of pain to get them. Just give your eyes a good hard rub for a few seconds.)Treharne (talk) 08:17, 1 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

When I apply pressure to my eyes I eventually end up seeing a tunnel of light that I accelerate through, and eventually it dissolves into a firework:esque display with a multitude of colors and shapes. When I simply close my eyes and focus on the "noise" I start seeing random shapes, grids and if I'm concentrated enough various photorealistic images lasting a fraction of a second pop up. These images or scenes are of seemingly random things, like when I tried it just now I saw a girl in a dress crossing a road and after that a couple of bright flashes of light that eventually "morphed" into a fractal-looking spiral that flew around. Now, these things are surely CEV's and I remain fully concious, in an awake, non-dreaming state. I wonder if any experienced psychedelic user could describe the kind of visuals you see when under the influence of let's say LSD. Are those more vivid than these or? I'm really curious. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.70.211.86 (talk) 02:20, 5 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Phosphenes

It seems to me that the phenomena described here clearly are a form of phosphene, despite the strong statement to the contrary. Phosphenes are not defined as being caused by mechanical stimulation, any quasi-visual experience that arises from any sort of non-photic input into the visual system is a phosphene. As the phosphene entry rightly says "Phosphenes can be directly induced by mechanical, electrical, or magnetic stimulation of the retina or visual cortex as well as by random firing of cells in the visual system."

I am going to change the statement that they are not phosphenes, but really this entry should be merged with Phosphene. (By an editor who knows how.)Treharne (talk) 08:17, 1 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Level 4

I have never taken drugs in my life, yet I'm able to reach level 4 easily. Is this a sign of mental illness? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.40.230.65 (talk) 03:52, 8 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

No. You might be experiencing hypnagogic hallucinations, say -- periods of hallucination when you're essentially just between wake and sleep -- that are not uncommon at all. Happening often and in combination with other symptoms, they can be indicative of narcolepsy, but lots of people experience them at some point, and I think they're also pretty common with general sleep deprivation. 76.105.26.172 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 20:35, 11 August 2009 (UTC).[reply]