Talk:Master of Laws

The opening paragraphs are very US-centric. In England (and most Commonwealth/Commonlaw countries) the degree of LLM is not a professional qualification. In order to practise (note the UK English spelling) one generally completes another year of vocational study. The course names vary from country to country but generally contain the word Vocational. I think this page would benefit from an overhaul that makes explicit those elements that pertain to the US and then to other jurisdictions.

====================================================================================

"New York allows foreign lawyers to gain admission to the bar once they have completed their LL.M."

If the above statement is accurate, the article should at least be complemented with further information on the relevant provisions and their construction:

From Part 520 of its Court Rules, http://www.nybarexam.org/court.htm, it seems that (at best) NY State allows some foreign lawyers (in particular from Common Law jurisdictions) to sit the NY bar examination. Direct admission of foreigners to the bar seems restricted to exceptional cases for those holding high legal office.

Unfortunately, http://www.nybarexam.org/foreign.htm does not currently provide the required details.

The previous version, http://web.archive.org/web/20041012140842/www.nybarexam.org/foreign.htm, also contrary to the above line from the article, spelled out a requirement that the degree be a U.S. LL.M from study including courses in American Law.

"However, California's position has come under fire as of late regarding its unfair educational requirements for foreign lawyers and the four year requirement, especially when ABA law schools are becoming less and less credible than some foreign institutions."

-I think this needs some substantiation. ABA law schools are becoming less and less credible? According to whom? Top-tier employers in Botswana?

Qualifications of Foreign Trained Lawyers

"LL.M. degrees in the United States are often earned by foreigners who have previously obtained a foreign law degree abroad. U.S.-educated lawyers, before proceeding to obtain an LL.M., generally have a total of seven years of education: four as an undergraduate and three to obtain a J.D. Foreign lawyers (who may have been trained in undergraduate institutions, giving the traditional name for the basic law degree, the LL.B.) generally have a total of five years of education: four in their home country, and one in the United States as an LL.M. Although foreigners may obtain an LL.M. after fewer total years of academic training than their U.S. colleagues, it represents a greater degree of achievement in legal education."

My understanding and experience is that most european lawyers have five years of preparation: three at the bachelors level, and two at the masters level. The LL.M. offerred by US institutions is often a crediential required for foreign-trained lawyers who want access to the various state bars or who do work for US clients in their home countries and want to develop an understanding of US common law and various aspects of US commercial law.

However, the last part of this discussion gives me pause. Having studied law in Europe, I noticed marked differences in the course load, the quality of teaching, the intensity of the program, the age and maturity of the students in each program, and the different attitude of each region's students to their work. I would be prepared to state that a three-year legal education in the US is quite comparable to the five-year european course of study, if not actually superior.

I would correct the academic requirements for the foreign lawyers by listing the home country education period at "four to five years in their home country" and strike the last sentence suggesting that US trained lawyers are somehow underprepared.