Talk:List of genocides

Before writing a comment please read the comments below, and add yours in the most relevant section, or add a new section if nothing similar exists.193.145.230.3 (talk) 10:34, 3 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Various comments

Whis is 1943 Great Bengal Famine left out of this list? http://dublinsmickdotcom.wordpress.com/2013/05/28/vindictive-genocide-most-foul-1943-great-bengal-famine-kills-5-2-million-deliberate-starvation-of-a-gentle-race-rothschild-stooge-amartya-sen/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.197.114.232 (talk) 23:42, 29 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Why is the People's Republic of China left out of this list? 68.50.119.13 (talk) 00:48, 9 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The incidents under Communist China cannot fit into the definition of "geno"cide. They are more likely to be called ideocide. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 183.1.44.117 (talk) 00:45, 30 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I disagree, there is no need to separate genocide into smaller sections like ethni-cide, ideo-cide, race-cide, or other. Genocide should always include any and all intentional indiscriminate killings of a part of any group of people perceived as different for any given reason (race, religion, ideology, ethnicity, social status) by the perpetrators.193.145.230.3 (talk) 10:34, 3 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Mass killings under Communist regimes clearly shows that China committed serious atrocities. With estimates of a couple million to tens of millions 68.50.119.13 (talk) 00:51, 9 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

100,000,000 million on the max estimate for the colonization of America is absurdity. I checked the link and he states that the estimate is 2,000,000 to 15,000,000 maximum whereas he also notes it is doubtful because the estimates of Native Americans below those numbers. This article is being vandalized 68.50.119.13 (talk) 00:56, 9 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Also the bio part of the colonization part reads something like including disease, genocide has nothing to do with random spread of disease unless it was intentionally spread by a government i assume. For example, a biological weapon used by a government to kill people. This entire article is ridiculous 68.50.119.13 (talk) 00:58, 9 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

The biological warfare refers to intentional spread of deadly diseases to the natives of America, who were particularly prone to them because they had never been exposed to them previously. So, in this context the use of the expression "biological warfare" is correct.193.145.230.3 (talk) 10:34, 3 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Someone needs to actually check these links. 68.50.119.13 (talk) 00:59, 9 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Ukraine Famine a genocide, but the Irish and Bengal Famines not?

Why wouldn't the Bengal Famine (up to 4 million dead) and Irish Famine (1 million dead, 1 million displaced) not be considered due to purposeful mismanagement of the British? In the case of the Irish Famine the genocide question is already discussed in the relevant Wikipedia page: [1] 90.163.208.36 (talk) 22:41, 6 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

What about the Algerian War of Independence and the Vietnam War?

Could Algeria - France and Vietnam - USA wars be considered systematic and deliberate attempts at destruction of ethinicities? The Algerian War of Independence has an even higher casualty ratio than the Armenian Revolt, with the main distinctions being that (1) the Armenians failed, and the Algerians succeeded, and (2) that in one case the perpetrators are Muslims and in the other Christians. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.163.208.36 (talk) 22:21, 6 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Indonesia?

where is Indonesian genocide from 1965? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.146.225.66 (talk) 10:54, 25 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Valid point, that should be here. Is anyone sufficiently well-versed on the subject to add it? Exercisephys (talk) 20:24, 26 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Scope in regards to both intent and affect

If the litmus of this article is the provided CCPG definition of "acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial or religious group" there are several entries here which do not fit the definition of genocide. Those entries which do not define any national, ethnic, racial or religious group targeted for destruction in whole, or in part, include the Cultural Revolution, the killings of Mengitsu Mariam, the communist purges in Serbia from 1944-1945, the Katyn massacre, and the apparent original research statistic on Leopold's abuse of the Belgian Congo. Those entries which do not make clear the intention, or have credible claims of intention or affect, of antagonistic parties to affect this definition include the fringe Afrocentric concept of "Maafa", the Massacres in Khoshut Khanate, the political repression in East Timor, and the Samar Massacre. I'm going to either transfer or remove these entries if another interested editor can't find reliable sourcing to address these issues. GraniteSand (talk) 23:25, 27 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]

As no interested editors have had any input, I've removed the aforementioned sections. GraniteSand (talk) 00:57, 9 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Great Famine (Ireland)

Great Famine (Ireland) is considered genocide by some scholars. Jonpatterns (talk) 10:48, 3 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I believe this should be included. It would be the 3rd largest on the list. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.255.33.129 (talk) 01:34, 13 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Americas Genocide

Why is the genocide of the indigenous peoples of america excluded? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Diroisha (talk • contribs) 14:48, 7 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Someone removed it saying it was "too controversial". Doing some research it is has been admitted to by the Bureau of Indian Affairs, so it should be included according to my opinion. I'm just going to leave this scholarly article here http://academic.udayton.edu/race/06hrights/GeoRegions/NorthAmerica/UnitedStates02.htm so doubters can know the Bureau of Indian Affairs has admitted to it before it is put back on the list. Stidmatt (talk) 06:07, 5 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia is a wonderful educational tool but I strongly believe that it is being used by many for propaganda purposes and for propagating the American opinion over the world. A lot articles portrait this. I tried to put in certain factually correct articles on "Higher Education Accreditation in the United States" 99% of which were instantly removed. They played the game of 99% v/s 1% against me. Do think that Native Indian mass murders will be allowed inside Wikipedia???? No way. Just look at the way the response has been framed. It says "someone" removed it. Who is "someone"? You will never get your way out with "these" wiki-editors.

Information about this exists on Wikipedia (sparsely) and certainly should be incorporated here. Genocides_in_history#United_States, which also has some sources. --22:47, 27 December 2014 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.32.12.61 (talk)

China/Mao

45 million people in four years - shouldn't this be included? Zambelo; talk 22:52, 24 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

There was an entry but I removed it, and others, per the reasoning you can find in the preceding talk section titled Scope in regards to both intent and affect. The human catastrophe that accompanied Mao's tenure atop the Party is certainly notable but it doesn't really fit into the scope of this article as a genocide. There is another article, List of wars and anthropogenic disasters by death toll, which contains an entry on the Great Leap Forward and related disasters. GraniteSand (talk) 05:47, 25 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Ukrainian Famine-Genocide (Holodomor)....

according to http://www.unitedhumanrights.org/genocide/ukraine_famine.htm the death toll was around 10 million...not 2.5 million. 2.5 million were killed directly by the Soviet government, but 10 million died from the intentional starvation and famine of the Ukrainian people. They began by deporting the kurkuls, the most effective and productive farmers, causing a forced famine of millions of ethnic Ukrainians. Soviet brigades would go to the villages and take any hidden food from the people. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.73.92.138 (talk) 18:35, 29 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Second Congo War

The Second Congo War should be somewhere on this list. Can't find an estimate on the exact number of pygmies killed. They were hunted and cannibalized with the goal of extermination. "DR Congo pygmies 'exterminated'" (Tuesday, 6 July, 2004). http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/3869489.stm Colbert Sesanker (talk) 16:34, 4 May 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Other Genocides

What about the Mongol Empire genocide? maybe the largest in history. They killed more than 50 million people in China, Persia and many other countries. And what about the genocide of the folks living in Hispania (now Spain and Portugal) during the Moorish?

Link some articles on these Colbert Sesanker (talk) 21:06, 6 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

The Moorish conquest of Iberia can hardly be counted genocide, given the remarkable amount of religious tolerance exercised by the Moorish, rarely seen in history. However, the Christian re-conquest of Iberia could classify as genocide, precisely because of the forceful conversions, expulsions and massacres of Moors and Jews in Iberia.90.163.208.36 (talk) 22:46, 6 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Holocaust

The Holocaust - the mass murder of Jews under the German Nazi regime during the period 1941-5. More than 6 million European Jews, as well as members of other persecuted groups, were murdered at concentration camps such as Auschwitz.http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/holocaust?q=Holocaust

the Holocaust : the killing of millions of Jews and other people by the Nazis during World War II. http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/holocaust

The systematic destruction of European Jewry is completely different than events like the rape of German women at the end of World War II (largest rape in history at 2 millionhttp://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=106687768) or wartime civilian victims ex. Soviet citizens or the World War II losses in Estonia, estimated at around 25% of the population, were among the highest proportion in Europe (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estonia_in_World_War_II). So I will be removing the flagrantly broad and abused number of 17 million from the list. I will cite The War Against the Jews, Bantam, 1986.p. 403 for the systematic destruction of Jews and the mentioned death toll of 5.93 million.RudiLefkowitz (talk) 10:55, 4 October 2014 (UTC)[reply]

The term Holocaust and the official death toll

Yad Vashem What was the Holocaust? The Holocaust was the murder of approximately six million Jews by the Nazis and their collaborators.

How many Jews were murdered in the Holocaust? How do we know? Do we have their names? There is no precise figure for the number of Jews killed in the Holocaust. The figure commonly used is the six million quoted by Adolf Eichmann, a senior SS official. Most research confirms that the number of victims was between five and six million. Early calculations range from 5.1 million (Professor Raul Hilberg) to 5.95 million (Jacob Leschinsky). More recent research, by Professor Yisrael Gutman and Dr. Robert Rozett in the Encyclopedia of the Holocaust, estimates the Jewish losses at 5.59–5.86 million, and a study headed by Dr. Wolfgang Benz presents a range from 5.29 million to six million. (http://www.yadvashem.org/yv/en/holocaust/resource_center/faq.asp)

Oxford English Dictionary - Holocaust . The mass murder of Jews under the German Nazi regime during the period 1941-5.

Wikipedia Policy & Guidelines to illustrate the point

WP:BALASPS Balancing aspects: An article should not give undue weight to any aspects of the subject but should strive to treat each aspect with a weight appropriate to the weight of that aspect in the body of reliable sources on the subject. WP:NPOV - Neutral point of view, by selectively presenting one point of view from a source that actually includes two or more that conflict with each other. WP:CONTROVERSY - Controversial articles, by their very nature, require far greater care to achieve a neutral point of view. WP:RS/AC - Academic consensus- reliable sourcing that directly says that all or most scientists or scholars hold that view. WP:FRINGE -A Wikipedia article should not make a fringe theory appear more notable or more widely accepted than it is.

If all, or nearly all, high-quality sources agree with each other, it is appropriate to omit the information in the lower quality sources, per WP:GEVAL, or the rare minority source, per WP:DUE. RudiLefkowitz (talk) 11:15, 14 October 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Genocide Watch, a reliable source?

Found this list on the website of the "Genocide Watch", but I don't know how reliable is this source... Someone can say something about? http://www.genocidewatch.org/images/GenocidesandPoliticidessince1945withstagesin2008.pdf ClaudioUEC (talk) 20:54, 10 October 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Table

The columns in the table need reordering.

What about the Balkan war and the Israeli atrocities? Where are the facts about those "incidents"?Ogionite (talk) 07:53, 28 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]