Talk:Buran, Ukraine

On 4 November 2023, it was proposed that this article be moved from Enhelsove to Buran, Ukraine. The result of the discussion was moved.

Requested move 4 November 2023[edit]

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. (closed by non-admin page mover) - 🔥𝑰𝒍𝒍𝒖𝒔𝒊𝒐𝒏 𝑭𝒍𝒂𝒎𝒆 (𝒕𝒂𝒍𝒌)🔥 22:04, 11 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Enhelsove → Buran, Ukraine – This settlement appears to be completely unknown in English. Searching "Enhelsove" or "Buran" (+ "Luhansk") on Google News or Google Books yields exactly zero results about the town. There aren't any websites about it in normal web results that aren't just data scrape websites. In other words, there is clearly no English WP:COMMONNAME. Hence, per WP:UAPLACE, we should use the official name of the town given to it by the Ukrainian government, with the national transliteration system. See consensus in similar discussions at Talk:Khrustalnyi and Talk:Bunhe for precedents. IMO, this example is even more clear-cut than those. HappyWith (talk) 20:11, 4 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I object applying UAPLACE to localities which have never held by Ukraine after they have been renamed. You can only rename something you control, otherwise the rename is just on paper and does not affect the locality in any way. Ymblanter (talk) 08:44, 5 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The UN tells us that standardized geographical names matter.[1] Wikipedia should follow the sources recommended in its own place naming guidelines, as I’ve outlined below. This argument about “paper” contradicts our guidelines that refer to reliable sources (digital or paper), and do not defer to violent, criminal occupying powers.

If you don’t like the consensus at UAPLACE as recorded, then propose a change there. —Michael Z. 16:34, 5 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

There is also precedent for the move in the consensuses at the talk pages linked in the nom. HappyWith (talk) 17:23, 5 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Support. This is a clear-cut application of the consensus at UAPLACE, and there is no consensus for any exception to be made. A settlement in Ukraine of little note is known globally primarily by the current data in Ukraine’s geographical database, which is reused by the UN’s, the BGN/PCGN and Geographic Names Search gives name Buran (variant names Engel’sovo, Enhelsove, Shakhta Imeni Engel’sa),[2] Google Maps,[3] Apple Maps,[4] etc. Reliable sources recommended in WP:WIAN are not referring to the Russian state’s data on occupied places in wartime Ukraine. —Michael Z. 16:15, 5 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Support per researched nomination and Michael Z. The settlement is unquestionably in Ukraine, therefore the main title header of its English Wikipedia entry should depict its Ukrainian name. —Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 07:02, 6 November 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.