Talk:Calvinism

re: help me understand

Calvinism teaches that God predestines people to heaven, and allows the rest to suffer the consequences of their sin. This is not the same as what you're describing, that is called double-predestination, which is a subclass of Calvinist thought (and the minority).

God brings about repentance in the elect by changing their will in such a way that they will turn to him, which no one would do otherwise. So those who are not predestined to heaven would never pray and ask for repentance because without God's changing of their will they would never desire that. So if someone prays and asks for forgiveness it means that their wills have been changed.

Also, your professor's caricature of TULIP is really inaccurate. Here is a bit more accurate presentation than the slanted view your professor gave you (it's really despicable that professors do this. I could give you a slanted picture of Arminian theology that makes it look bad too... but I'm not going to be deceptive about things).

T - Total Depravity, might be better understood as Total Inability. It means that there is no part of us that is not affected by the fall, and because of that none of us have the ability or desire to turn to God.

U - Unconditional Election means that God's choice of us as the Elect has nothing to do with anything we do, it is a choice of God that is free from conditioning by us.

L - Limited Atonement basically means that Jesus' death, although sufficient for all, is only effectual for the elect. This isn't really any different than the Arminian stance, which says that it is only effectual for the elect but just defines how the elect become the elect in a different way. If you believe that Jesus' death DID anything concrete rather than just purchasing the potential for something, then you believe in Limited Atonement

I - Irresistible Grace is better understood as Effectual Call, which basically means that God accomplishes that which he sets out to do. We always choose exactly what we desire... and never that which we do not desire. Those who are elect have had their wills changed in such that they desire to seek God, those who are left in their sins do that which they desire... namely rebel against God in favor of their own selfish desires.

P - Perseverance of the Saints means that God's grace is enough to change a person such that they will persist.

Your professor is presenting an inaccurate picture, which is a common underhanded tactic by Arminians who either don't know how to combat the doctrine... or don't care enough to present it accurately. If you're looking for a good resource you could check out "Why I'm not an Arminian" or "For Calvinism." Both are good, and inexpensive, resources for understanding what Calvinism actually teaches. They also have compainions that explain and defend the Arminian side (primarily by engaging in the same kind of inaccurate presentation that your professor did) called "Why I'm not a Calvinist" or "Against Calvinism" respectively.

ReformedArsenal (talk) 15:17, 15 February 2012 (UTC)

help me understand

Please help me understand something. Regarding Calvinism....am I right in stating that Calvinism believes that God has predestined certain people to Heaven and others to Hell? If so...does that mean if a person prays and ask for repentance in asking forgiveness of their sins, it doesn't matter because he/she is already predestined to Heaven or Hell? How can one know if they are one of the chosen ones predestined to Heaven? thank you CLysek1 (talk) 18:46, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

That doctrine is called "double predestination" -- see Predestination (Calvinism).

One of my theology professors summarized TULIP as
T = we're scum.
U = God chooses which scum goes to heaven and which to hell.
L = Jesus died only for the heaven-bound scum.
I = God doesn't give the heaven-bound scum a choice in the matter. (Which makes God sound like the Borg: Resistance is futile, you will be assimilated.)
P = nor does He allow its scumminess to interfere with the process.
Jhobson1 (talk) 13:09, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

Displayed image of the Good Shepherd - a graven image?

Would not the display of such an Ikon be at odds with the Calvinist prescription against the display of graven images and therefore inimical to the subject which it is being used to illustrate? If so it portrays a misleading impression of the article's subject matter.

Usury

"In this view, elements of Calvinism represented a revolt against the medieval condemnation of usury and, implicitly, of profit in general[citation needed]. Such a connection was advanced in influential works by R. H. Tawney (1880–1962) and by Max Weber (1864–1920)."

This is wrong when it comes to Weber. The Protestant Ethic and the Spirit of Capitalism does not mention usury when it comes to Calvinism at all. — Preceding unsigned comment added by GeneCallahan (talk • contribs) 22:56, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Huldrych Zwingli

Huldrych Zwingli and Ulrich Zwingli seem to be the same person, shouldn't his name be spelled consistently in the article? ZARguy (talk) 14:55, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

I agree, and I would argue that it should be Huldrych, not because I have any knowledge of how he spelled his name, but because that is the spelling of the wikipedia article about him. Sterrettc (talk) 00:12, 26 August 2011 (UTC)

Thanks! ZARguy (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 06:48, 24 October 2011 (UTC).