Talk:South Africa

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• Archive 1 (Start - 6 April 2005)

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• Archive 2 (6 April 2005 - 4 Jan 2006)

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• Archive 3 (4 Jan 2006 - 28 May 2006)

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• Archive 4 (to start)

Missing Information

About crime and the fall of apartheid. It is noted that many of the people have moved to gated communities; however, these communities are nearly exclusively White. There are a few non-gated White neighborhoods but they are far in few. Most are gated, and inside the gates the houses are gated as well with bars on windows and private security firms roaming the streets. I think this section should be expanded; furthermore, more then one million whites have left South Africa since the fall of apartheid because of the downright staggering rape, murder, and crime rates. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Volksgeist (talk • contribs)

The above statement is nonsense. I live here, there aint no "exclusively white" gated communities. There aren't even so many gated communites to start with. Please do not make sweeping statements about complete rubbish on here, Wikipedia is for facts. Scotteh 18:58, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

Please sign your comments and provide (a) your source (statistics) for this information; (b) the relevance of your white-black analysis. You are stereotyping, and without statistical evidence, this information cannot be added. -- Chris Lester ^talk 10:08, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

In any case, it is patently ridiculous to claim that "there are a few non-gated White neighbourhoods", implying that most white neighbourhoods are gated. I don't know what the situation may be in Jo'burg, but certainly in Cape Town the gated suburbs are few and far between (although admittedly increasing in number) and by far the majority of white people live in ordinary "open" suburbs. It may well be true about the gated houses, bars on windows, security firms, etc.; but the same could, after all, be said of Los Angeles. It's also misleading to ascribe emigration entirely to crime; although some whites certainly have emigrated because of crime, many others emigrated simply to follow better economic opportunities elsewhere or, in certain cases, because they have lingering racist objections to living in a country with a "black" government. - htonl 00:21, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

I don't know where in South Africa you grew up but an "ordinary" suburb is not one where houses are surrounded by huge walls and bars on windows. At least it wasn't before apartheid. And the situation in Los Angeles, well, similar demographics have caused the gated/bared communities as well. And the large majority of ex-South Africans I talk to have moved because of crime. It's simply too dangerous since the fall of apartheid. Murder, rape, happening constantly. Can't even stop a red lights at night... etc. Volksgeist 04:55, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

This is not about who you talk to, it's about what you can prove. Scotteh 19:03, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

The South African expatriate community is a strange one and not always the best source of information about South Africa. I've stopped at red lights, even in Hillbrow, supposedly the most dangerous place in South Africa. I've walked around at night, and gone into squatter camps — all things that should have gotten me killed. Yet, amazingly, they didn't. Páll ^{(Die pienk olifant)} 19:32, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

I'm originally from South Africa now live in the USA. Crime is horrible, hospitals are horrible, police are horrible, etc. Furthermore, qualified Whites are actually declined jobs even if they are more skilled because of the stupid empowerment act. I see no viable future for the Boers or English in SA unless something changes. I give the country 10-20 years before it turns into what happened to Zimbabwe. I don't know where you live in SA, PZFUN, but what you describe is radically different then what I've seen in the years following apartheid. Volksgeist 23:10, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

Please take no offence, but South Africa is a beautiful, wonderful country. Yet, as a free country and democracy, you are allowed to express your views, even if I think you're criminally full of shit. Páll ^{(Die pienk olifant)} 05:42, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Beautiful countries don't lead the world in all aspects of murder, rape, armed robbery and thievery. Beautiful countries don't throw people in jail to get raped because they got a speeding ticket. In beautiful countries you do not need to live in walled compounds with private security firms because of the crime problem. And finally, beautiful countries do not have a problem with "baby rape." South Africa will turn into a Zimbabwe once you bite the hand that feeds. Volksgeist 12:00, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

I can't argue with Volksgeist there... But calling us Boers and referring to English people as English is racist. If you want to refer to us, call us Afrikaans people, or whatever you find appropriate. Or if you use informal names to describe a race then do so on the same level with each race, not glorifying anyone with sophisticated referrences (whatever the spelling of that is). Scotteh 12:23, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Volksgeist, South Africa doesn't lead the world in murder. Serbitar 05:07, 20 Jun

Is this what South Africa is really like? I'm a white New Zealander and i'll be going to South Africa next year for a student exchange but i'm not so sure i want go now because lately i've heard alot of negative things about the racial tension, crime etc....Can someone please enlighten me i really want to know what the real South Africa is like. Many of the expat SA's in NZ go on about it been a rather dangerous place. Do you get like white schools and black schools? Arguss 9:43, 23 June 2006