Talk:The Dark Knight: Difference between revisions
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{{GA nominee|05:45, 31 August 2008 (UTC)|page=1| subtopic=Theatre, film and drama|status=}} |
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# [[Talk:The Dark Knight (film)/Archive 1|June 2006 – Oct. 2006]] |
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# [[Talk:The Dark Knight (film)/Archive 2|Nov. 2006 – Feb. 2007]] |
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# [[Talk:The Dark Knight (film)/Archive 3|Feb. 2007 – June 2007]] |
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# [[Talk:The Dark Knight (film)/Archive 4|July 2007 – Oct. 2007]] |
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# [[Talk:The Dark Knight (film)/Archive 5|Nov. 2007 – Jan. 2008]] |
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# [[Talk:The Dark Knight (film)/Archive 6|Feb. 2008 – June 2008]] |
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# [[Talk:The Dark Knight (film)/Archive 7|July 2008, Part 1]] |
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# [[Talk:The Dark Knight (film)/Archive 8|July 2008, Part 2]] |
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# [[Talk:The Dark Knight (film)/Archive 9|July 2008, Part 3]] |
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== Anomie == |
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"...his [[anarchy|anarchic]] interpretation" should really be changed to "...his [[anomie|anomic]] interpretation." The Joker may be many things, but an anarchist is not one of them. |
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[[User:Allixpeeke|allixpeeke]] ([[User talk:Allixpeeke|talk]]) 04:17, 23 August 2008 (UTC) |
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:It's based on the source (i.e. it's what they say, hence the quote), and not based on one's personal interpretation of the character. [[User:Bignole|<small>'''<span style="background:Maroon;color:Gold"> BIGNOLE </span>'''</small>]] [[User talk:Bignole|<small>(Contact me)</small>]] 04:22, 23 August 2008 (UTC) |
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::Yes. It appears that anomie may be more technically correct, but for better or worse, the phrase in the film was "introduce a little anarchy", and so analyzing it as anomie, in the absence of a reliable source, is original research. [[User:Girolamo Savonarola|Girolamo Savonarola]] ([[User talk:Girolamo Savonarola|talk]]) 04:25, 23 August 2008 (UTC) |
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It is correct to call Him an anarchist and the reasons I have based this one is that in the film firsthand the Joker calls himself an "agent of chaos" and says to "introduce a little anarchy" that is what his agenda is. he also said "everything burns" so it would be accurate to say that this Joker's portrayal is of anarchy. another reason would be that he killed the Commissioner, A high ranking judge, assaulted a Police institute, disfigures a public servant and threatens a mayor. and the press sources would say that Ledger based his performance in an anarchile way. |
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[[User:Azrael1117|Azrael1117]] ([[User talk:Azrael1117|talk]]) 22:43, 3 September 2008 (UTC) |
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== Filming == |
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The article states that the movie "was filmed primarily in Chicago, as well as in several other locations in the United States, the United Kingdom, and Hong Kong." However, most of the outside scenes, as well as the view from offices' windows are clearly from Hong Kong, including the boats and essentially all skyscrapers. Indeed, the Gotham City skyline '''is''' the Hong Kong skyline. I suggest that the order that these locations appear on the article is changed to better reflect this (no, I'm not from Hong Kong, nor Chinese! :-) I just think that this would be a bit more fair). [[User:Winkler|Winkler]] ([[User talk:Winkler|talk]]) 03:55, 24 August 2008 (UTC) |
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:You might want to re-read the article - they filmed in HK for less than a week. IIRC, the next largest shoot after Chicago (maybe even longer perhaps) was at Pinewood Studios outside of London. [[User:Girolamo Savonarola|Girolamo Savonarola]] ([[User talk:Girolamo Savonarola|talk]]) 04:01, 24 August 2008 (UTC) |
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::Ok, that's right. It is just in the middle of the article. Indeed, HK appears so often in the movie that it is surprising that everything was shot in just 1 week! Anyway, the article is great. Congrats to everybody who helped to write it! --[[User:Winkler|Winkler]] ([[User talk:Winkler|talk]]) 10:26, 24 August 2008 (UTC) |
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:::I'm guessing that the vast majority of the HK interiors were probably filmed at Pinewood with Translight backdrops, so actually, they would only have been required to shoot the exterior shots during that week. [[User:Girolamo Savonarola|Girolamo Savonarola]] ([[User talk:Girolamo Savonarola|talk]]) 11:40, 24 August 2008 (UTC) |
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You may be mistaking the Chicago skyline for Hong Kong, or be unfamiliar with what Chicago looks like. Aside from that one sequence, the skyline you're seeing as Gotham's is Chicago's, as is nearly every Gotham street/city exterior. I've lived in Chicago for a good chunk of my life and, believe me, that's Chicago. Also, why is this listed for "films shot in Los Angeles", but not "films shot in Chicago"? As far as I know, aside from a pick-up or two, none of this was shot in L.A. Is this another case of mistaken urban identity? <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/207.69.137.11|207.69.137.11]] ([[User talk:207.69.137.11|talk]]) 06:15, 1 September 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
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:Well, it ''was'' shot in LA - the category doesn't specify that films must be predominantly filmed there. But a Films shot in Chicago category would be in order, it would appear. [[User:Girolamo Savonarola|Girolamo Savonarola]] ([[User talk:Girolamo Savonarola|talk]]) 06:32, 1 September 2008 (UTC) |
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== Critical Reception == |
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Does anyone else feel the critical reception section is a bit long-winded? Compared to most movie articles, it's incredibly long. The Metacritic, RT and IMDB ratings plus perhaps a FEW major critic's ratings would sufice. [[Special:Contributions/67.87.152.41|67.87.152.41]] ([[User talk:67.87.152.41|talk]]) 09:15, 24 August 2008 (UTC) |
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*Well, considering the hype buildup for the film itself, I say, althought there are a lot, that is actually a pretty accurate amount of reviews for a film of TDK's status. --<span style="color:orange">[[User:Harvey "Two-Face" Dent|Harvey "Two-Face" Dent]]</span> <font size="3">([[User talk:Harvey "Two-Face" Dent|Muhaha!!]])</font> 14:00, 24 August 2008 (UTC) |
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:This has been touched on before - it could probably be slimmed down a bit, most likely a few months from now after the hype has died down, in order to void unnecessary edit wars. [[User:Faithlessthewonderboy|<span style="color:blue">'''faithless'''</span>]] [[User talk:Faithlessthewonderboy|<small><span style="color:black">(<sup>'''speak'''</sup>)</span></small>]] 23:10, 24 August 2008 (UTC) |
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::The hype has certainly not died down. It's still all over the place, Joker impressions on youtube, it'll be "hyped" until next year! --<span style="color:orange">[[User:Harvey "Two-Face" Dent|Harvey "Two-Face" Dent]]</span> <font size="3">([[User talk:Harvey "Two-Face" Dent|Muhaha!!]])</font> 13:04, 25 August 2008 (UTC) |
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*Yes, I feel it is long-winded, it should be divided up a little bit.[[User:Bob farter|Bob farter]] ([[User talk:Bob farter|talk]]) 15:54, 2 September 2008 (UTC) |
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== casting == |
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It says "Gary Oldman as James Gordon: Lieutenant of the Gotham City Police Department and one of the few police officers who is not corrupt." Shoud n't it be "Gary Oldman as James Gordon: Lieutenant of the Gotham City Police Department and one of the few police officers who '''are''' not corrupt." <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/76.66.200.59|76.66.200.59]] ([[User talk:76.66.200.59|talk]]) 22:20, 1 September 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot--> |
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:The subject ("one") is singular, so no. [[User:Girolamo Savonarola|Girolamo Savonarola]] ([[User talk:Girolamo Savonarola|talk]]) 01:15, 2 September 2008 (UTC) |
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::No, IP is correct, I think. ''Are not corrupt'' modifies 'the few police officers', and thus is Gordon one in that group. [[User:ThuranX|ThuranX]] ([[User talk:ThuranX|talk]]) 04:16, 2 September 2008 (UTC) |
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:::"of the few police officers" is a participial phrase; simplified, the clause should be able to read without it - "one who is not corrupt". [[User:Girolamo Savonarola|Girolamo Savonarola]] ([[User talk:Girolamo Savonarola|talk]]) 06:01, 2 September 2008 (UTC) |
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::::IMHO, what IP meant was "Gordon is (one of the few (police officers who are not corrupt))", as opposed to Savonarola's "Gordon is ((one of the few police officers) who is not corrupt)" |
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::::The first meant that (1) the number of non-corrupt police officers is very small and, (2) Gordon is a member of that small group. Hence, Gordon is one of the few police officers who are not corrupt. |
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::::The second one, on the other hand, meant that (1) the number of police officers, corrupt or otherwise, is very small; Gotham City has a terribly small police force, (2) a fraction of the already few police force is non-corrupt, and (3) Gordon is a member of that fraction of the small police force. |
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::::Therefore, I believe, it should be "Gary Oldman as James Gordon: Lieutenant of the Gotham City Police Department and one of the few police officers who are not corrupt." |
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::::If this still drives everyone nuts, why not just rephrase it to "Gary Oldman as James Gordon: the non-corrupt Lieutenant of the Gotham City Police Department." After all, if you are the Lieutenant of the Gotham City Police Department, doesn't it follow that you are a police officer? [[User:Salamangkero|Salamangkero]] ([[User talk:Salamangkero|talk]]) 08:24, 2 September 2008 (UTC) |
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:::::Your interpretations are, in fact, reversed. The phrase "who is not corrupt" describes the 'few police'. Drop the Gordon is a lieutenant, and you have 'A few police officers who are not corrupt [went for ice cream].' (I hate fragments where a sentence should be) Otherwise we'd have 'Jim Gordon a lieutenant in the force, who is not corrupt', and the police officers part becomes irrelevant. The 'only a few aren't corrupt serves to more accurately describe Gordon's situation as the film opens, and his character. The only relevant question is 'does the phrase '[X] not corrupt' start with 'is' or 'are'; since it modifies the police, a plural noun, it should be 'are'. [[User:ThuranX|ThuranX]] ([[User talk:ThuranX|talk]]) 23:06, 3 September 2008 (UTC) |
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::::::(Shrug) I think the only thing this whole discussion demonstrates is that the sentence could be written better. [[User:Girolamo Savonarola|Girolamo Savonarola]] ([[User talk:Girolamo Savonarola|talk]]) 05:46, 4 September 2008 (UTC) |
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== Classifying the Joker as a terrorist == |
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It's logical to call the Joker in this film a terrorist instead of a criminal, anarchist or anomist. His actions in the film are the reason for this judgement, from assasinating public servants to threatening people on television, to destruction of public property and holding hundreds of people hostage in a sick game of life or death, also his message of claiming the city as his own at night in a sort of non-traditional coup de' tat. [[User:Azrael1117|Azrael1117]] ([[User talk:Azrael1117|talk]]) 22:48, 3 September 2008 (UTC) |
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:I disagree. He's a hyperviolent criminal, but not devoted to some overthrow of the government or the existing order. He states that chaos is a means to eliminate the bat, which he tells the mob he'll do so that the criminals can go back to running the city. Hardly terrorism, just organized crime. [[User:ThuranX|ThuranX]] ([[User talk:ThuranX|talk]]) 22:56, 3 September 2008 (UTC) |
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::The Joker isn't a terrorist because he is more in love with chaos than with having any sort of monetary or governmental power. No terrorist would let a DA put a gun to his head and flip a coin to see if he lives or dies. That isn't terrorism. It's anarchy. [[User:Wrad|Wrad]] ([[User talk:Wrad|talk]]) 23:07, 3 September 2008 (UTC) |
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== Harvey Dent is Dead. == |
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Can someone update this? It's been confirmed now. [http://www.superherohype.com/news/featuresnews.php?id=7641] {{unsigned|User:Da gr8 1}} |
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:I was just about to add that. but I'm guessing the argument could be made that "he's not the creative head etc" so would his words matter? Ahhh, the bottomless pit of endless circular questions which arise from comic book film fans... --[[User:Harish| Harish]] ([[User_talk:Harish|Talk]]) - 10:46, 4 September 2008 (UTC) |
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