Talk:Chronic Lyme disease: Difference between revisions
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Sadly I lack knowledge to distinguish professionally looking quack page from proper medical page but https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fneur.2021.628045/full looks quite good - from abstract "B. burgdorferi was identified by PCR in several CNS tissues and by immunofluorescent staining in the spinal cord. These studies offer proof of the principle that persistent infection with the Lyme disease spirochete may have lingering consequences on the CNS." [[User:Mateusz Konieczny|Mateusz Konieczny]] ([[User talk:Mateusz Konieczny|talk]]) 11:39, 17 August 2021 (UTC) |
Sadly I lack knowledge to distinguish professionally looking quack page from proper medical page but https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fneur.2021.628045/full looks quite good - from abstract "B. burgdorferi was identified by PCR in several CNS tissues and by immunofluorescent staining in the spinal cord. These studies offer proof of the principle that persistent infection with the Lyme disease spirochete may have lingering consequences on the CNS." [[User:Mateusz Konieczny|Mateusz Konieczny]] ([[User talk:Mateusz Konieczny|talk]]) 11:39, 17 August 2021 (UTC) |
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: There are a number of reasons that this article should not be relied upon (see also [[WP:MEDRS]]). Case reports are low on the [https://thelogicofscience.com/2016/01/12/the-hierarchy-of-evidence-is-the-studys-design-robust/ hierarchy of evidence.] This is a case report funded and published by chronic Lyme advocates in [[Frontiers Media|Frontiers]] (a dubious publisher). The report claims that the woman had a history of Lyme disease and then had a dementia diagnosis. It claims that she had positive antibody testing for Lyme disease, was treated for Lyme disease, and later "Serum C6 ELISA was negative". A negative C6 ELISA [https://www.cdc.gov/lyme/diagnosistesting/index.html means] that the antibody testing is negative. The symptoms/history reported by the woman are inconsistent with [https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/27/8/20-4763_article neurologic Lyme disease.] Given her negative antibody testing and symptoms inconsistent with Lyme disease, it would be inappropriate to conclude that the woman had "chronic Lyme" or her dementia was caused by "chronic Lyme". The authors' other testing should be called into question because of lack of corroborating evidence. [[User:ScienceFlyer|ScienceFlyer]] ([[User talk:ScienceFlyer|talk]]) 17:13, 17 August 2021 (UTC) |
: There are a number of reasons that this article should not be relied upon (see also [[WP:MEDRS]]). Case reports are low on the [https://thelogicofscience.com/2016/01/12/the-hierarchy-of-evidence-is-the-studys-design-robust/ hierarchy of evidence.] This is a case report funded and published by chronic Lyme advocates in [[Frontiers Media|Frontiers]] (a dubious publisher). The report claims that the woman had a history of Lyme disease and then had a dementia diagnosis. It claims that she had positive antibody testing for Lyme disease, was treated for Lyme disease, and later "Serum C6 ELISA was negative". A negative C6 ELISA [https://www.cdc.gov/lyme/diagnosistesting/index.html means] that the antibody testing is negative. The symptoms/history reported by the woman are inconsistent with [https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/27/8/20-4763_article neurologic Lyme disease.] Given her negative antibody testing and symptoms inconsistent with Lyme disease, it would be inappropriate to conclude that the woman had "chronic Lyme" or her dementia was caused by "chronic Lyme". The authors' other testing should be called into question because of lack of corroborating evidence. [[User:ScienceFlyer|ScienceFlyer]] ([[User talk:ScienceFlyer|talk]]) 17:13, 17 August 2021 (UTC) |
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== Lines of separation == |
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I'm trying to understand what separates "Chronic Lyme Disease" from "post-treatment Lyme disease syndrome". The Lyme disease article mentions "People who have nonspecific, subjective symptoms such as fatigue, joint and muscle aches, or cognitive difficulties for more than six months after recommended treatment for Lyme disease are said to have post-treatment Lyme disease syndrome (PTLDS)." |
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That seems to overlap with the description of Chronic Lyme Disease "a broad array of illnesses or symptom complexes for which there is no reproducible or convincing scientific evidence of any relationship to Borrelia burgdorferi infection" to describe their condition and their beliefs about its cause." |
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Are there some tests for "evidence of any relationship to Borrelia burgdorferi infection" in the case of "post-treatment Lyme disease syndrome"? If so that should be mentioned somewhere in the article. |
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Edit warring
TheUndiscoveredWriter you need to stop edit-warring your bad change. Please discuss any change you want to make. Alexbrn (talk) 14:25, 22 April 2021 (UTC)
Possible source
Sadly I lack knowledge to distinguish professionally looking quack page from proper medical page but https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fneur.2021.628045/full looks quite good - from abstract "B. burgdorferi was identified by PCR in several CNS tissues and by immunofluorescent staining in the spinal cord. These studies offer proof of the principle that persistent infection with the Lyme disease spirochete may have lingering consequences on the CNS." Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 11:39, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
- There are a number of reasons that this article should not be relied upon (see also WP:MEDRS). Case reports are low on the hierarchy of evidence. This is a case report funded and published by chronic Lyme advocates in Frontiers (a dubious publisher). The report claims that the woman had a history of Lyme disease and then had a dementia diagnosis. It claims that she had positive antibody testing for Lyme disease, was treated for Lyme disease, and later "Serum C6 ELISA was negative". A negative C6 ELISA means that the antibody testing is negative. The symptoms/history reported by the woman are inconsistent with neurologic Lyme disease. Given her negative antibody testing and symptoms inconsistent with Lyme disease, it would be inappropriate to conclude that the woman had "chronic Lyme" or her dementia was caused by "chronic Lyme". The authors' other testing should be called into question because of lack of corroborating evidence. ScienceFlyer (talk) 17:13, 17 August 2021 (UTC)
Lines of separation
I'm trying to understand what separates "Chronic Lyme Disease" from "post-treatment Lyme disease syndrome". The Lyme disease article mentions "People who have nonspecific, subjective symptoms such as fatigue, joint and muscle aches, or cognitive difficulties for more than six months after recommended treatment for Lyme disease are said to have post-treatment Lyme disease syndrome (PTLDS)."
That seems to overlap with the description of Chronic Lyme Disease "a broad array of illnesses or symptom complexes for which there is no reproducible or convincing scientific evidence of any relationship to Borrelia burgdorferi infection" to describe their condition and their beliefs about its cause."
Are there some tests for "evidence of any relationship to Borrelia burgdorferi infection" in the case of "post-treatment Lyme disease syndrome"? If so that should be mentioned somewhere in the article.